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Shit goin' down in the Chess world. Cheating.

Parliament

By Parliament
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Magnus Carlsen resigns after two moves against Hans Niemann in the Julius Baer Generation Cup today :

https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxriG-487pCD9C9c0nrzFXE1SPeJnEks7P

Chess world is starting to turn on him.  Top comment in one of the largest chess forums, which is typically very pro-Magnus, is "Magnus is acting like a little bitch."

 

Edited by axiom of foundation
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bmbmd

bmbmd 1027

Posted
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On 9/13/2022 at 8:20 AM, RamjetFDO said:
On 9/12/2022 at 11:34 AM, atomheartbevo said:
This was in St. Louis?  Was hoping it was in Bangkok, in a show with everything but Yul Brynner..

Bangkok? Oriental setting. Where the city don't know what the city is getting.

Makes a hard man humble.

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0xdeadbeef

0xdeadbeef 1645

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1 hour ago, Humble Beast said:

 

What the fuck does "...I am limited in what I can say without explicit permission from Niemann..." mean?   

Is he asking Niemann for permission to defame him more than what he already has?   Fuck that Noise. 

Carlsen need to put up or shut up. Either he has something real, or he doesn't.  And it needs be be a bit more concrete than 'He wasn't tense when he was out playing me'.

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1 hour ago, 0xdeadbeef said:

What the fuck does "...I am limited in what I can say without explicit permission from Niemann..." mean?   

Is he asking Niemann for permission to defame him more than what he already has?   Fuck that Noise. 

Carlsen need to put up or shut up. Either he has something real, or he doesn't.  And it needs be be a bit more concrete than 'He wasn't tense when he was out playing me'.

 

2 hours ago, Samson's Wig said:

So he has zero proof but just didn't like getting beat by this particular kid, and is blaming the tournament overseers for his loss.   Sounds a lot like our whinier fans over on the football board.

 

36 minutes ago, The Ace of Aces said:

He need to present evidence - he is crying wolf until then. He’s had ample opportunity and always sidesteps it. 

It's funny how different the reactions are on various forums.  Some of the big chess forums are acting like Magnus delivered a devastating blow to Hans with this statement.  Sounds to me like he has nothing more than suspicion.  If he didn't want to play him because he suspected he was a cheater, then why did he decide to enter the tournament and quit only after losing?  None of this would have come up if Magnus won.  But he lost and he can't deal with it.  

Here is an interesting write up on the situation by Jacob Aagaard, who is a Scottish GM and former trainer of Hans:

https://forum.killerchesstraining.com/t/paranoia-and-insanity-by-jacob-aagaard/856

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Samson's Wig

Samson's Wig 3190

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9 minutes ago, axiom of foundation said:

 

 

It's funny how different the reactions are on various forums.  Some of the big chess forums are acting like Magnus delivered a devastating blow to Hans with this statement.  Sounds to me like he has nothing more than suspicion.  If he didn't want to play him because he suspected he was a cheater, then why did he decide to enter the tournament and quit only after losing?  None of this would have come up if Magnus won.  But he lost and he can't deal with it.  

Here is an interesting write up on the situation by Jacob Aagaard, who is a Scottish GM and former trainer of Hans:

https://forum.killerchesstraining.com/t/paranoia-and-insanity-by-jacob-aagaard/856

Chess fanatics are like fans of any other sport.  They will blindly defend their favorite team or player.  

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used2b

used2b 249

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So let me understand how cheating would work in the way he has been accused:

Someone would be inputting Carlson's moves into an AI chess game and then that someone sends a signal to Neimanns' butthole with morse code telling him which piece to move and where?

 

 

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Mole

Mole 4330

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On 9/26/2022 at 8:06 PM, axiom of foundation said:

If he didn't want to play him because he suspected he was a cheater, then why did he decide to enter the tournament and quit only after losing?  

 

My understanding is that Hans was a late addition to the St. Louis event after someone else pulled out.

That latest Hikaru video is a beating to watch, but it brings up some interesting points. Assuming that data is legit, it’s pretty compelling. At least the parts I could stay awake for. I’m leaning more and more towards Stockfish anal implants.

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Zeus

Zeus 6012

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10 minutes ago, trauma babe said:

Apologies if I missed this bring mentioned in this thread, but Niemann is an admitted online cheater, isn't he? 

Hans cheated a lot online and got banned.

Then he had a sudden meteoric rise, then gave an interview after some wins where he wasn't giving 2700 level analysis AT ALL. Very suspicious. 

Also statistically it's been basically proven he's cheating over the board somehow, or he suddenly got way better and knows how to make perfect (sometimes unnatural) moves. Probably anal beads that someone is sending him moves though vibrations - why everyone is making jokes about beads.

 

 

 

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Guest

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13 minutes ago, Mole said:

My understanding is that Hans was a late addition to the St. Louis event after someone else pulled out.

That latest Hikaru video is a beating to watch, but it brings up some interesting points. Assuming that data is legit, it’s pretty compelling. At least the parts I could stay awake for. I’m leaning more and more towards Stockfish anal implants.

He was a late addition, but Magnus knew going in he would have to play him.  He only quits the tournament after he loses.  
 

Can anyone point to the part of the Hikaru video that specially shows the 100% stockfish correlation?  There has been tons of analysis of Neiman’s games recently, and pretty much all of the highlighted suspicious games have been debunked.  

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Mole

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19 minutes ago, axiom of foundation said:

Can anyone point to the part of the Hikaru video that specially shows the 100% stockfish correlation?  There has been tons of analysis of Neiman’s games recently, and pretty much all of the highlighted suspicious games have been debunked.  

Right after the part where Hikaru repeats himself 4 times in rapid succession.

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The analysis from Yosha Iglesias that Hikaru references is based on some engine correlation metric from Chessbase.  Chessbase claims that it shouldn’t be used for cheating detection and that centipawn loss is a better tool. Here are 10 games she gives from Hans that she claims have high engine correlation:
 

Game # of Moves Accuracy Centipawn loss I/M/B vs
1 36 94% 16 2/0/0 GM
2 22 91% 26 2/1/0 GM*
3 27 95% 21 0/0/0 FM
4 28 96% 11 0/0/0 IM
5 28 96% 10 0/0/0 IM
6 31 96% 15 0/0/0 IM
7 34 95% 12 0/0/0 IM
8 38 98% 5 0/0/0 IM*
9 45 94% 19 1/0/0 GM
10 37 95% 11 3/1/0 GM


You can view the games here:

https://lichess.org/study/ffYRNE1u

These are classical games (both sides have hours to play) played by a high rated GM against lower rated opposition.  Nothing about these games are suspicious considering they were selected out of a few hundred games played under those circumstances.  This past week I played a 3 minute blitz game with a 16 centipawn loss game at 93% accuracy according to lichess.  That can happen because of the level of opposition and I play a lot of blitz games. 
 
In short, very poor analysis by Yosha and Hikaru using improper methods. 

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