24-25 Fantasy League (seeking additional members)

[ztejas 43,741]

@shadow_operative Caurso sucks quit reaching. 

Also I think next season whoever gets 1st pick/Jokic needs to take a penalty somewhere else. He's too good. We should at least discuss it. 

Edited November 13, 2023 by ztejas

[shadow_operative 15,932]

4 minutes ago, ztejas said:

@shadow_operative Caurso sucks quit reaching. 

 

[ztejas 43,741]

2 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

 

He's a decent stream but he probably had the best game he's going to have all year in the interim between me dropping him and you picking him up 😆

[shadow_operative 15,932]

43 minutes ago, ztejas said:

He's a decent stream but he probably had the best game he's going to have all year in the interim between me dropping him and you picking him up 😆

well the one category i really suck at is steals, and he seems to be getting a decent amount of them when he isn’t injuring himself, so i figured it was worth a shot. 

[ztejas 43,741]

1 minute ago, shadow_operative said:

well the one category i really suck at is steals, and he seems to be getting a decent amount of them when he isn’t injuring himself, so i figured it was worth a shot. 

No yeah he's a nice steals stream. 

Just let me know where I can send the check after you took Jokic 1st and strung some horseshit keepers together. 

[Dutchrudder 11,159]

Who is Rick James?  I think I was down 4-8 going into this last game, and was able to tie it by a hair with a nearly full roster!  

Nearly stole the win with 3PM, but just fell short. Maxey having the game of his life did help quite a bit. Wish I had drafted him in the 6th instead of the 5th round for keepers...  Stupid triple double category is gonna cost me a point every week  

[shadow_operative 15,932]

Rick James is my buddy Timmy. i need to get him to post here. 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

i had 5 out of a possible 14 guys play last night. i have three going tonight. the schedule this year sucks. 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

yo i’m losing points but winning assists every week, someone please come take cade cunningham from me. looking for a F/C but am open to any offers. 

[ztejas 43,741]

I'll give you Giddey for him. 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

36 minutes ago, ztejas said:

I'll give you Giddey for him. 

i honestly went to your team page to send you an offer, saw giddey, got excited for half a second, and then remembered that he went all 7th heaven on that sophomore. such is life.

[ztejas 43,741]

Well he's also been terrible this season. Just one more thing I fucked up in the draft. 

[Dutchrudder 11,159]

Can I get some clarification on the keeper rules?  I haven't seen anything definitive on here. A few things that need to be addressed in any keeper league: 

• Number of keepers per team (only 2?)
• Round penalty per keeper based on draft position (I believe it was 1 round up this year)
• Keeper rights are transferred with a player through trade. Also with waiver wire?
• What round is the cutoff for keepers? (typically the 3rd and higher cannot be kept, although in a 10 team league this should probably be 4th)
• Is there a limit to the number of years a keeper can be kept? (typically 2-3 years is the limit, but you guys are using keepers made from an 8 team draft, so your keepers this year are way more valuable than normal)
• If two keepers are kept from the same round, what happens? (typically the second keeper must move up a draft round)
• Where do UDFAs start as keepers?

[shadow_operative 15,932]

7 hours ago, Dutchrudder said:

Can I get some clarification on the keeper rules?  I haven't seen anything definitive on here. A few things that need to be addressed in any keeper league: 

• Number of keepers per team (only 2?)
• Round penalty per keeper based on draft position (I believe it was 1 round up this year)
• Keeper rights are transferred with a player through trade. Also with waiver wire?
• What round is the cutoff for keepers? (typically the 3rd and higher cannot be kept, although in a 10 team league this should probably be 4th)
• Is there a limit to the number of years a keeper can be kept? (typically 2-3 years is the limit, but you guys are using keepers made from an 8 team draft, so your keepers this year are way more valuable than normal)
• If two keepers are kept from the same round, what happens? (typically the second keeper must move up a draft round)
• Where do UDFAs start as keepers?

1)yes

2)correct

3)yes

4)first two rounds cannot be kept

5)no limit

6)never happened before, we’ve always just done one keeper per round 

7)iirc UDFA go in round 10 or 11

 

all if these topics are up for debate each year as well. this league did not used to be a keeper league, but we changed it maybe 4-5 years ago. i preferred when it wasn’t a keeper league and still do. and that’s coming from a guy who has chet holmgren in round 15. so if there’s any changes you think should be made, please voice them. i’m definitely down to tweak some things, if not get rid of keepers altogether at some point.

[shadow_operative 15,932]

sunday- no games 

monday- two games 

tuesday- two games

wednesday- 11 games

thursday- two games 

 

seriously, wtf is up with this schedule? it’s going to make fantasy matchups particularly frustrating this year.

[Capn81 388]

sunday- no games 
monday- two games 
tuesday- two games
wednesday- 11 games
thursday- two games 
 
seriously, wtf is up with this schedule? it’s going to make fantasy matchups particularly frustrating this year.

Yep. This type of stuff can be a killer.

[ztejas 43,741]

On 11/12/2023 at 11:06 PM, ztejas said:

Also I think next season whoever gets 1st pick/Jokic needs to take a penalty somewhere else. He's too good. We should at least discuss it. 

This was never discussed but it needs to be addressed before next year. We can always circle back later.

These are the top players by player rating this season that accounts for our 12 cat. This is fucking stupid:

He's as valuable as the 2nd and 7th player combined right now. He has 8 of the 20 triple doubles in the league this season.

Lou had him last season and finished 18 wins clear of me in 2nd place. Granted it was slightly less of an issue in an 8 team league.

My proposal would be whoever gets the #1 pick the next couple seasons loses a round on each of their keepers or something similar. Not like a hugely punitive balance but there has to be some sort of tradeoff. 

Edited December 5, 2023 by ztejas

[Capn81 388]

We had the same issue with Westbrook when he was a triple-double machine. Whichever team had him, usually ran away with things it seemed.

[Dutchrudder 11,159]

Maybe dump the Triple Double stat, since it's kinda pointless?  11 stat categories wouldn't be a problem. I'm in another league that doesn't use Double Doubles or Triple Doubles. 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

jokic isn’t actually worth the no.2 and no.7 players combined, he just leads the league in TD by a lot and that one stat pumps up his PR. the last time i checked, and this was a few weeks ago before caruso was getting more than 15-18 mpg, i was looking at the PR and Alex Caruso was like 8 spots ahead of cade cunningham because of steals which are also heavily weighted. it’s the same with sb in baseball. anyone who gets “rare” stats gets pumped way up in PR.

that said jokic is better than all of your sorry ass players and it’s my turn to have him and you all can suck it.

[shadow_operative 15,932]

just went and checked, caruso is still 8 spots ahead of cunningham.  that’s not overall on the PR; that’s just for SG eligible players. who would you rather have?

 

 

 

according to the PR caruso is easily ahead of cunningham because of his superior blocks and steals. this is why you don’t use the PR as your argument for dominance. 

Edited December 6, 2023 by shadow_operative

[Baboontyme 2,836]

trade him to Jr, he'll go for it, his team sucks. Hell I will trade you for him. Getting some shooters back on the court (and Duren) is going to help him. re Cade @shadow_operative

[shadow_operative 15,932]

gonna bring this up again: we should do away with keepers. my team is currently in first and has nurkic and chet as keepers in something like rounds 12 and 14. if i keep them, that’s stupid value, and i don’t mean that in no nice way. that’s dumb. otoh, and this has happened almost every year since we started having keepers, i could get to a point where im out in front with 6-7 weeks to go, so i just go to the bottom 2-3 teams and offer them one of my keepers + a couple droppable bench scrubs for three top 35 players from his team, completely changing the face of my lineup as we head to the playoffs. everyone who is in this position has done/will continue to do this.

why? because why would the shitty team say no to the offer? they give up what is in reality nothing and they get a top 15-30 player in round 12-14 for next year in return. this is why i don’t like keepers.

and yeah, we could do all sorts of debates about continuing with keepers but changing the rules, but to that idea i say this:

keepers are dumb. every single time that a league of mine, in any sport, has gone to keepers, i have ended up getting insane value for my keepers, and i hate that. it’s cheap, and easy, and stupid. it’s like pulling out the bumpers on the bowling lane. who, besides small children who are incapable of succeeding otherwise, wants to play like that? i hate, hate, hate keepers, and we should do away with them. if not, then whatevs, i’ll just keep drafting top 20 players at pick 110 every year. but this league was more fun before we started doing keepers (an idea from players who aren’t even in this league anymore) resulting in a fire sale at the end of every single season. 

 

[ztejas 43,741]

On 12/6/2023 at 12:00 AM, Dutchrudder said:

Maybe dump the Triple Double stat, since it's kinda pointless?  11 stat categories wouldn't be a problem. I'm in another league that doesn't use Double Doubles or Triple Doubles. 

I'd be fine with dumping both of them. They're arbitrary cats not reflective of actual production. It would solve the Jokic issue.

10 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

gonna bring this up again: we should do away with keepers. my team is currently in first and has nurkic and chet as keepers in something like rounds 12 and 14. if i keep them, that’s stupid value, and i don’t mean that in no nice way. that’s dumb. otoh, and this has happened almost every year since we started having keepers, i could get to a point where im out in front with 6-7 weeks to go, so i just go to the bottom 2-3 teams and offer them one of my keepers + a couple droppable bench scrubs for three top 35 players from his team, completely changing the face of my lineup as we head to the playoffs. everyone who is in this position has done/will continue to do this.

why? because why would the shitty team say no to the offer? they give up what is in reality nothing and they get a top 15-30 player in round 12-14 for next year in return. this is why i don’t like keepers.

and yeah, we could do all sorts of debates about continuing with keepers but changing the rules, but to that idea i say this:

keepers are dumb. every single time that a league of mine, in any sport, has gone to keepers, i have ended up getting insane value for my keepers, and i hate that. it’s cheap, and easy, and stupid. it’s like pulling out the bumpers on the bowling lane. who, besides small children who are incapable of succeeding otherwise, wants to play like that? i hate, hate, hate keepers, and we should do away with them. if not, then whatevs, i’ll just keep drafting top 20 players at pick 110 every year. but this league was more fun before we started doing keepers (an idea from players who aren’t even in this league anymore) resulting in a fire sale at the end of every single season. 

 

I'm not passionate one way or another re: keepers. 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

14 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

otoh, and this has happened almost every year since we started having keepers, i could get to a point where im out in front with 6-7 weeks to go, so i just go to the bottom 2-3 teams and offer them one of my keepers + a couple droppable bench scrubs for three top 35 players from his team, completely changing the face of my lineup as we head to the playoffs. everyone who is in this position has done/will continue to do this.

this is the main reason i am passionate about keepers.

[ztejas 43,741]

Does anyone else think it's fucking stupid that I have to claim someone off waivers and won't get them back until TOMORROW who I dropped YESTERDAY.

[Dutchrudder 11,159]

Yeah I think waivers should be 24 hours or less when a player is dropped. The nature of NBA scheduling means streaming players could be advantageous some weeks depending on matchups and number of games.  

I would also recommend waivers for all Free Agents right after the draft, and letting the order be reverse of the draft. Last pick gets first waiver, which might help a team or two early on.  

Not a big fan of keepers, it's too much advantage to overcome. As Derka mentioned, people will start punting on this season once they lose hope only to shoot for better keepers next year. It will throw things out of whack and could result in some really lopsided BS. I prefer people to be engaged and competitive for the current season. 

 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

On 12/6/2023 at 12:30 AM, shadow_operative said:

jokic isn’t actually worth the no.2 and no.7 players combined, he just leads the league in TD by a lot and that one stat pumps up his PR.

jokic has only one TD since the 6th and as such his seemingly astronomical value has come back down to earth on the PR.

 

 

i think we can call off the “punish whoever has jokic” crusade.

[ztejas 43,741]

Dude he's at a 45 for the season. Doncic is in 2nd at 30.6. GMAB. 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

25 minutes ago, ztejas said:

Dude he's at a 45 for the season. Doncic is in 2nd at 30.6. GMAB. 

again, that’s only because he gets more TDs than anyone else and that stat is heavily weighted. the PR rating is not an accurate refection of player value. jokic is pretty much the same player as giannis, luka, and embiid but with more TDs, and the same player as AD but with fewer injuries. fantasy wise anyway.

[shadow_operative 15,932]

also penalizing a team for having the best player is a dumb idea and nobody is going to go for it so this is a moo point anyway.

[shadow_operative 15,932]

Ja is a 5th round keeper for next year, but i’ve already got my keepers, so if you’re interested, shoot me an offer.

[shadow_operative 15,932]

i also have harden as a fourth round keeper, although i am considering keeping him. 

[ztejas 43,741]

On 12/25/2023 at 6:38 PM, shadow_operative said:

again, that’s only because he gets more TDs than anyone else and that stat is heavily weighted. the PR rating is not an accurate refection of player value. jokic is pretty much the same player as giannis, luka, and embiid but with more TDs, and the same player as AD but with fewer injuries. fantasy wise anyway.

It's literally a close to perfect reflection of who moves the columns the most in the league that you're playing. 

I like how you're saying "yeah the only cat he dominates is TDs" like he doesn't destroy that cat to where it becomes ridiculous because TDs are valued the same as points or dimes or offensive boards. 

Jokic is OP and needs to be nerfed. 

Also not sure why you're against keepers - your keepers are the only thing keeping you in the mix for #1 with me. 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

1 hour ago, ztejas said:

Also not sure why you're against keepers - your keepers are the only thing keeping you in the mix for #1 with me. 

i get chet holmgren in round 15 next year. i can get harden in the third, ja in the 5th, middleton in the 8th, kessler in the 14th, and so on. and that’s just my team. and again, as has happened every single season since we started doing keepers, if your team looks like a threat to my team then i’ll just trade one of those guys above to a shitty team for two players who are both better than the guy im trading away. you still don’t get why i don’t like keepers?

 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

what happens with keepers:

 

if denny’s super slam doesn’t think that he has a chance to win the league then i’ll just trade him holmgren (in round 15), john collins, and jordan clarkson for KD, JJJ, Brunson, Wemby, and Jalen Brown 5-6 weeks before the playoffs and i’ll beat all of y’all 11-1-0.

again- that’s fun to you? that’s what you want? 

[ztejas 43,741]

On 1/4/2024 at 10:17 PM, shadow_operative said:

what happens with keepers:

 

if denny’s super slam doesn’t think that he has a chance to win the league then i’ll just trade him holmgren (in round 15), john collins, and jordan clarkson for KD, JJJ, Brunson, Wemby, and Jalen Brown 5-6 weeks before the playoffs and i’ll beat all of y’all 11-1-0.

again- that’s fun to you? that’s what you want? 

I honestly don't know what the fuck you're talking about and why you think everyone is going to be willing to hand you their best players at the end of the season for some slightly better keepers. 

Everyone should have good keepers - that's why it's a keeper league. Go ahead and trade some of your best ones away at the end of the year to chase a title. I mean I personally wouldn't give away that Chet one but whatever you need to do. 

The point is that it's long term and you hold on to assets and theoretically it keeps people invested year over year. At the end of the day drafting and playing the FA/wire is going to create the best teams every season. Which is why the first pick getting Jokic is stupid. The keeper shit is mainly noise - if you've been in the league 2-3 years and still have shit keepers that's on you. 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

jimmy butler, ja morant, zach lavine, cade cunningham…any other guards from my team feel like missing a couple months/the entire season? jesus christ. 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

something is going on where i can’t propose trades or add players. it keeps telling me that my roster is full and that i need to drop a player, even when the trade is for the same amount of players. as far as adding goes, i go to drop a player and it just won’t let me.

im trying to add dennis smith jr right now and this is what i’m getting:

 

 

this is some bullshit.

[shadow_operative 15,932]

alright it seems to be fixed now.  it that was weird.

[ztejas 43,741]

Damn Derk you needed that triple doub tonight. You sweating yet?

[shadow_operative 15,932]

[ztejas 43,741]

I mean fuck - ja'boy up...

You still got the games lead on me league-wise either way haha. 

[ztejas 43,741]

Also you know I love you and I hope you're doing as well as you can. This is just friendly competition. 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

[ztejas 43,741]

On 1/19/2024 at 9:07 PM, ztejas said:

Damn Derk you needed that triple doub tonight. You sweating yet?

Karma is a bitch...

[ztejas 43,741]

https://clip.cafe/pirates-of-the-caribbean-the-curse-of-the-black-pearl-2003/jack-sparrow-s1/t/1/

[ztejas 43,741]

Highlight of the season @Dutchrudder

 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

this fucking shmuck paul reed…

[shadow_operative 15,932]

there was talk last year about implementing a trade deadline somewhere around the first week after the All-Star break. Are we abiding by that rule this year?