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2022 World Series Thread - Phillies v Astros

tx 3 putt

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Guadaloopy
Guadaloopy

One of my best friends was a Phillies fan.  I still remember how happy he was in 2008, and how envious I was.  He died in 2011 at age 39 from glioblastoma (fuck cancer).  His wife gave me one of his P

PenelopeWitherspoon
PenelopeWitherspoon

He was checked every fucking inning.  It was nothing, and you are an idiot since you are citing "Baseball Social Media."  Had it have been a real thing, MLB would have told everyone.  He used i

TexArcher
TexArcher

So if 4 of us fuck your mother, is she still fucked, or does it only count if it's 1 of us the whole time?

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rvm96

rvm96 1643

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15 minutes ago, Helobious said:

K-State never beats us anymore, that’s an easy bet the house on Texas game for you gambling degenerates. 
 

I would not bet the house on Philly winning the series. It’s a shame the Astros tainted yet another series with their cheating BS the first couple games, they were clearly the better squad and didn’t need extra help.

Too bad the Yankees can't taint a WS with their steroid use because they can't make it that far anymore 😂

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AnTiM

AnTiM 1669

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7 hours ago, Helobious said:

K-State never beats us anymore, that’s an easy bet the house on Texas game for you gambling degenerates. 
 

I would not bet the house on Philly winning the series. It’s a shame the Astros tainted yet another series with their cheating BS the first couple games, they were clearly the better squad and didn’t need extra help.

Imagine how not surprised I was to find that the prime definition of "helobious" is "swamp creature".

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Helobious

Helobious 9464

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Posted

Yeah that’s a stupid tweet and they’re rightfully getting dunked on in the replies. If I’m at bat with a one run lead you wouldn’t say I have a “chance to at least tie” the game. There’s no chance whatsoever the game will be tied while my team is batting that inning. The only possible outcome is a lead getting extended or staying the same. 

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Helobious

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Posted
2 minutes ago, ztejas said:

If I'm discussing business and say "we should at least break even on this deal" then am I saying that it is out of the realm of possibility that we wind up making money on the deal?

Jesus Christ guys. 

On a deal you can lose money, break even, or make money. If you’re batting while you have a lead you can’t lose the lead or “break even” during that at bat. It’s impossible. All you can do is keep your profit (the lead) or make even more money.

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Planet Houston

Planet Houston 4930

Posted
Posted (edited)
21 minutes ago, ztejas said:

It's plainly clear what he meant. Unfortunately many people in this country find reading difficult. 

"at least tie" meaning either tie, take the lead or extend the lead. 

It’s not plainly clear - “at least tie” intimates that the team that’s the subject of the sentence is losing. It could have been worded clearer but yes you’re correct.

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Guadaloopy

Guadaloopy 11013

Posted
Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

there's the ability to pay and willingness to pay.

I would prefer dropping $1000 on a new TV or just leaving it in the bank.

I dropped a G for a single RF pavilion seat to G2 in the 2017 WS.  After LASIK and my wife’s engagement ring, it remains the best money I ever spent.  
 

If you want to go and can afford to go, I highly recommend it.  You never know when you’ll have another chance at memories that stay with you forever.  

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Nice Guy Eddie

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Just now, Guadaloopy said:

I dropped a G for a single RF pavilion seat to G2 in the 2017 WS.  After LASIK and my wife’s engagement ring, it remains the best money I ever spent.  
 

If you want to go and can afford go, I highly recommend it.  You never know when you’ll have another chance at memories that stay with you forever.  

I hear you. I went to all 3 home games in '17, and many of the '19 and '21 games. Obviously the value of the buy ultimately is based on the results. Game 5 of '17 vs Game 7 of '19 have different memories to me. 

I would like to see the Astros win the WS in person but I wouldn't regret it if I wasn't there. In some ways, I would prefer to go to a crowded bar with 10 friends as opposed to going to the game with 1 or 3. I have fantastic memories of mid-90s Rockets playoff wins at bars. I have zero regret not being at the Summit.

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WBT

WBT 20662

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45 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

crazy that tickets look to be $1000 (with fees) for the upper deck Saturday night. I applaud people that can sell their tickets for that much but I can't go with that.

Also just as crazy that people are willing to sell for $1000 and give StubHub 15-25% of it.

Stubhub fees really are a bitch.  And with the onset of digital tickets they seem to have just completely killed the ticket broker business model.

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Wulaw Horn

Wulaw Horn 19151

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20 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I hear you. I went to all 3 home games in '17, and many of the '19 and '21 games. Obviously the value of the buy ultimately is based on the results. Game 5 of '17 vs Game 7 of '19 have different memories to me. 

I would like to see the Astros win the WS in person but I wouldn't regret it if I wasn't there. In some ways, I would prefer to go to a crowded bar with 10 friends as opposed to going to the game with 1 or 3. I have fantastic memories of mid-90s Rockets playoff wins at bars. I have zero regret not being at the Summit.

Dad had season tickets to the rockets game and we went to every playoff game and it was absolutely awesome. Totally. 
I have season tickets to the Astros and have never been to a World Series game. 
the difference is the old man could have gotten $250 for selling out tickets in the playoffs but I can get $1200 for selling mine. It’s just too much money for me to justify not selling. 
now, if my son liked baseball or if my dad wasn’t brain damaged I’m sure I’d have gone to at least 1 WS game for the memories. 
But, if this series goes 7 I will make enough selling WS tix to be able to by next seasons season tix. It’s too much for me to pass up. 

1 minute ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

And scamming people outside stadiums (and electronic tickets) killed the in-person buying. 

Absolutely this. 

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sidis

sidis 9832

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Posted

what a wild and wonderful game.  a bit of regression to the mean game with phils being one of the worst defensive teams in the league and the astros being one of the best and that not only playing out...but also deciding the game.  astros made a few insane defensive plays and phillies kicked a infield ground ball watching the runner from third instead of playing fundamental baseball.  nice to not be coming home down or playing strasberg and scherzer...but like i said, the phillies are not a collection of guys that are going to get in their own heads.  hopefully we see a continuation of the dominican dominance on the mound.

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sidis

sidis 9832

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i think the way the tweet could convey what it was trying to (the knife's edge tension throughout) a little better would be to say: despite the phillies never leading in the game, they only had one at bat in the entire game that wasn't capable of tying the game or taking the lead.

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Guadaloopy

Guadaloopy 11013

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Cross-post from Astros thread since some that don't venture in there might find this interesting:

6 minutes ago, Guadaloopy said:
  Reveal hidden contents

World Series Game 5 Weird & Wild: Justin Verlander’s win ends streak that made no sense

PHILADELPHIA, PA - NOVEMBER 03:  Justin Verlander #35 of the Houston Astros pitches during Game 5 of the 2022 World Series between the Houston Astros and the Philadelphia Phillies at Citizens Bank Park on Thursday, November 3, 2022 in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. (Photo by Mary DeCicco/MLB Photos via Getty Images)
By Jayson Stark
4h ago
5

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PHILADELPHIA — Hey, whaddaya know … we had a World Series game Thursday that wasn’t a blowout. It was Astros 3, Phillies 2. It was Weird. It was Wild. It was historic. It was fantastic. I just hope you weren’t distracted by any football games!

But even if you were, it’s still time for a Game 5 edition of the World Series Weird and Wild extravaganza.

1. He wins that first one — Justin time
It was just about all there on Justin Verlander’s first-ballot Hall of Fame bingo card:

• Two Cy Young Awards, soon to be the full trifecta.

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• The MVP and Rookie of the Year trophies.

• Seventeen seasons of relentless regular-season brilliance.

• And lots and lots of dominance in all those other rounds of the postseason.

But there was also this round. They call it the World Series. And if there’s one thing people in my line of work are exceptionally good at, it’s reminding Justin Verlander of that one thing he hadn’t done. By which, obviously, I mean …

Collecting a win in one freaking World Series game.

All right then. We can now check that final box before we point him toward Cooperstown. He beat the Phillies on Thursday night in Game 5 of the World Series. So you know that World Series hole on his Baseball Reference page? It has now officially disappeared. Finally. And let’s just say he noticed.

“Now,” he said after helping pitch the Astros to within one game of a World Series title, “I can say I got one.”


I have lots of thoughts about this. But first, never forget it’s the Weird and Wild column. So let’s take a few moments to reflect on the Weirdness and Wildness of Verlander needing 17 seasons, trips to five World Series, and nine total World Series starts to collect Win No. 1.

This makes no sense (part one)! Baseball is a strange and mysterious game, but it doesn’t get much more strange and mysterious than Verlander winning zero World Series games until his ninth start.

After all, 10 other pitchers in history have made at least as many World Series starts as he has. And you could argue that his career ranks with any of them. Except for one thing. …

Those 10 have combined for 62 World Series wins. And Justin Verlander had zero? That’s so bizarre.

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This makes no sense (part two)! Verlander’s first trip to the World Series was 16 years ago, with the 2006 Tigers. Since then, Jeremy Guthrie started and won a World Series game. Anthony Reyes started and won a World Series game. So did Colby Lewis, Derek Holland, Jeff Weaver and Ryan Vogelsong. No disrespect to them, but we have it on excellent authority that they’re not designing any Cy Young or MVP display cases in their man caves.

But they all won a World Series start before Justin Verlander? Baseball is so weird (and also wild).

This makes no sense (part three)! In a couple of weeks, Verlander will have to start clearing a space back home for his third Cy Young trophy. He’ll become only the 11th pitcher in history with three of them (or more).

So do you think any of the other 10 never got around to winning a game in a World Series? Of course not. They combined for 24 World Series wins. But Justin Verlander almost didn’t join them? Astounding.

This makes no sense (part four)! Maybe the most wacko part of this is that Verlander has been so good in all the other rounds of the Octoberfest that Thursday marked his 16th career postseason win. That’s the second-most of all time, behind only Andy Pettitte (19). You know how hard it is to win that many postseason baseball games but have none of them come in a World Series?

Well, just six pitchers in history have won at least a dozen postseason games: Pettitte, Verlander, John Smoltz (15), Tom Glavine (14), Clayton Kershaw (13) and Roger Clemens (12). Do you wonder if there’s any chance any of the other aces on that list never won a World Series game? Ha. You’re kidding, right?

They combined to win 17 of them. But Justin Verlander had none until Thursday night? Wow.

So nights like this take on special meaning, and not merely for Verlander himself — but also for so many people who care about him. I asked a few of those people about what this means for him and for his overall place among the greatest pitchers of modern times. It told me all I needed to know that they were as happy as he was.

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BRENT STROM (former Astros pitching coach): “First of all, I don’t think he needed a World Series win to validate who he is. There’s no question to me: He’s a first-ballot Hall of Famer. And being around him, I used to always kid him. I said I think he’s actually pitching in the wrong era. I view him as a pitcher who should have been pitching in the Koufax, (Mike) Marshall, (Bob) Gibson era, a throwback kind of guy.”

Strom mentioned the name of Jack Morris, a man who did many other things, but one unforgettable World Series win (Game 7, 1991) changed his entire career. So was Strom saying that this win Thursday had the potential to change the shape of Verlander’s career?

STROM: “That’s what I’m trying to make a point of. … For Morris, the 1-0 game when he beat Smoltz, I think solidified Morris, and obviously helped catapult him into the Hall of Fame. I don’t think Justin needed to win to do that. But it’s something now that’s off his back. And it’s something I’m sure he’s very, very proud of.”

WEIRD AND WILD: “It feels like it’s almost mathematically impossible for a pitcher as great as him to need nine tries to win a World Series game. I looked at the 10 other pitchers who have started this many World Series games, and those 10 guys have combined to win 62 of them. So what are the odds of Justin winning none until tonight?”

STROM: “Yeah, it’s like rolling the roulette wheel, and rolling the green nine times in a row. It’s just, there’s certain numbers that just boggle your mind.”


Justin Verlander stretches before Game 5. (John Geliebter / USA Today)
ASTROS PITCHER LANCE MCCULLERS JR.: “It’s definitely one of those things that, when you see it on the TV, you kind of do a double-take, and you’re surprised, because he’s had so much other postseason success. I mean, he’s won LCS MVPs. He’s pitched great games in the (Division Series) a number of times, great games in the (ALCS) a number of times, tons of wins in those rounds.

“So it’s not really anything more than, I think, a little bit of bad luck in those games — and maybe one or two games that kind of blew up on him. But tonight, he gets that narrative off his back.”

WEIRD AND WILD: “Where do you think he ranks among the greatest pitchers of his time?”

MCCULLERS: “I don’t think there’s anyone in this era of baseball that comes close to his level of greatness. I really don’t think so. I mean, you’ve seen what he’s done. Two Cy Youngs, and it will be three any second, and probably should have been at least four or five by now. Plus ALCS MVP, World Series champion, 3,000 strikeouts, and I think he’ll go until 300 wins probably.

“You know, Kershaw’s up there. Scherzer is up there, right? But I think when you look at the longevity of what Justin has been able to do — he won an MVP in 2012 and now he’s about to win a Cy Young in 2022? So I think we just kind of look at that.”

ASTROS CENTER FIELDER CHAS MCCORMICK ON MAKING THE INCREDIBLE NINTH-INNING CATCH THAT SAVED VERLANDER’S WIN: “I’m just trying to win him a World Series. So getting Verlander the win, I mean, he’s Justin Verlander. I grew up watching him, and now, playing behind him. He gave me a big hug after the game — BIG hug — and that was special because it’s Justin Verlander, man.”

So does that mean, we asked, that he’s a great hugger?

MCCORMICK: “No. It’s just him. He’s Justin Verlander!”

Yep. He sure is. But now he’s one more thing. He’s a World Series winner.


2. Lead Actor in a No-Hit Sequel
But there was a time, precisely two pitches into this game, when we weren’t so sure that for Justin Verlander, this was going to be The Night. That’s because here’s what Phillies leadoff man Kyle Schwarber did when Verlander’s 0-1 pitch started floating his way.


So what’s so Weird and Wild about that? Good question. Because Schwarber has mashed leadoff home runs before. In fact, this was his second of this postseason. And Verlander has served up leadoff postseason home runs before — two of them before this one, in fact. But here’s what made this leadoff homer different from all the others:

Game 4 Wednesday — Astros pitch a no-hitter!

Game 5 Thursday — Astros give up a home run to the first hitter they face!

So how often does that happen — a team hits a leadoff homer the game after it just got no-hit? I was starting to look up that very question … when the great Sarah Langs of MLB.com beat me to it. She found five other teams in history that have done this (regular season or postseason):

There was Bobby Bonds’ 1968 Giants. Bonds went deep on Sept. 19, 1968, a day after the Giants had been no-hit by Ray Washburn.

There was Bert Campaneris’ 1970 A’s. Campaneris fired a leadoff homer on the Fourth of July, one day after his team had been no-hit by Clyde Wright.

There was Darrin Jackson’s 1991 Padres. Jackson ended the no-hit drama fast on Sept. 12, the game after they’d been on the wrong end of a combined no-hitter by the Braves.

There was Ray Durham’s 2003 Giants. Durham bopped a leadoff homer on April 29, one game after the Giants had been no-hit by Kevin Millwood — in Philadelphia.

But here comes the truly Weird and Wild part. I’m not sure I can even believe the last time this happened. That was a leadoff home run by the Reds’ Brandon Phillips on Oct. 8, 2010. And what’s so Weird and Wild about that? Oh, only that … it was the game after the last postseason no-hitter … by the late, great Roy Halladay … in this same ballpark! Which would seem sooo crazy, except for one thing. It’s …

Baseball!


One night after the Phillies were no-hit, their first batter went yard. (John Geliebter / USA Today)
3. The kick is good
On Thursday night, the Weirdness and Wildness of this World Series veered off into a place it has never veered before. And that is to the land of multi-sport Weirdness and Wildness.

At 8:15 p.m. ET, the undefeated Philadelphia Eagles kicked off a game in Houston against the Texans. At 8:06 p.m. ET back in Pennsylvania, the baseball team from Philadelphia was kicking off a World Series game. And that, friends, is a thing that has never happened before.

Wait. What’s that you say? You’d heard it had happened before? Nope. Not this. Let’s fill you in.

Oh, we’ve seen World Series games and NFL games involving the same cities/metros take place on the same day before — seven times in fact. (The most recent: Oct. 23, 2011, when a St. Louis/Dallas multi-sport thing broke out.) But you know what we haven’t seen, at least in the last half-century or so?

We’ve never seen these two games happening when the same city had a World Series team and an undefeated NFL team. So how can I be so sure of that? I asked my friends from STATS Perform, of course.

They found five previous instances of a metropolitan area or city having an unbeaten football team at the same time its local baseball team was in the World Series. But this was the first instance of one of those undefeated football teams playing an NFL game at the same time a World Series was going on, involving two teams from the same area or city.

So what are all the instances (since 1969) of a World Series team and undefeated NFL team coming from the same city? Here goes:

• 1975 Cincinnati Bengals/Reds

• 1978 L.A. Rams/Dodgers

• 2004 New England Patriots/Red Sox

• 2007 New England Patriots/Red Sox

• 2018 L.A. Rams/Dodgers

• 2022 Philadelphia Eagles/Phillies

Now, just for the purpose of squeezing this research for all it’s worth, you should also know that:

A.) Only two of those NFL teams (2007 Pats, 2018 Rams) made it beyond 7-0 (the Eagles’ record heading into Thursday night).

B.) And three of those teams reached the Super Bowl (2004 and 2007 Pats, 2018 Rams).

C.) But only one (2004 Pats) won the Super Bowl.

So what does that tell us about the multi-sport Weirdness and Wildness of Thursday night? Well, only that we should subtitle it: The Clicker Dexterity Championship of the World.

4. Who’s not on first?
There are many reasons it sometimes feels weird and wild to think that despite their losses in Games 4 and 5, the Phillies are still two wins away from winning the World Series. But it’s hard to top this one:

They spent exactly one day in first place all season!

And it was on April 11!

That isn’t how the highway to the top of this sport used to be routed, obviously. Third-place teams like the Phillies never used to be permitted to drive up the on-ramp to the October freeway.

Nowadays, though, we’re living in a three-wild-card universe. And not only is this team — which spent one day in first place — playing in the World Series. It also didn’t even set the record for fewest days in first place by a team playing in the World Series.

Jack McKeon’s 2003 Marlins also spent just one day in first (March 30!) on the way to winning it all. So the Phillies have only tied them for this prestigious record. But why stop there?

Thanks to the great work of Baseball Reference’s fantastic Katie Sharp, we know there were five other teams in history that made it to a World Series even though they spent fewer than 10 days in first place. Here’s the whole leaderboard:

2022 Phillies 1
2003 Marlins 1*
2007 Rockies 3
2005 Astros 6
1964 Cardinals 6*
1951 Giants 6
2019 Nationals 8*

(*-won World Series)

(Source: Katie Sharp/Baseball Reference)

5. Party of Four
We invite you to keep on reading because (A) what else do you have to do that could possibly be more important? And (B) it’s time to unload that Weird and Wild Game 5 notebook!

LEADOFF FEVER — CATCH IT! More fun facts on Kyle Schwarber’s leadoff homer:

Mr. November update — No, shockingly, this was not the first leadoff homer in November history. This was actually No. 3. The first was hit by Curtis Granderson off Edinson Volquez in Game 5 of the 2015 World Series. The other was Dexter Fowler’s stunning leadoff shot against Corey Kluber to start off an electrifying Game 7 of the 2016 World Series.

A home run in powder blue — The Phillies wore their classic retro powder blue uniforms Thursday. So when Schwarber went deep, it was the first World Series home run by a Phillie stuck in a ’70s fashion statement since Joe Morgan and Garry Maddox homered in Baltimore in Game 1 of the 1983 World Series.

Make way for the champ — But here’s the coolest note of all. Schwarber led the National League in homers. So he just became the first home run champ ever to lead off any World Series game with a home run. You can look it up!

GOT CHANGE FOR A 50? Sorry, these Kyle Schwarbomb notes just keep on coming. With his two home runs in this World Series, Schwarber has now hit 51 homers this year, if you combine the regular season and postseason. So he joins a super-cool list of players who hit 50 or more in any calendar year for the Phillies:

58 — Ryan Howard, 2006
51 — Ryan Howard, 2008
51 — Kyle Schwarber, 2022
50 — Mike Schmidt, 1980

If you look carefully, you’ll note that somebody (namely, Howard or Schmidt) has done that every year (both of them) that the Phillies have won the World Series. (CAUTION: Past results are not a guarantee of future performance.)


Jeremy Peña hits a solo homer in the fourth inning. (John Geliebter / USA Today)
DON’T SELL HIM SHORT — Jeremy Peña is special. That’s more clear every day we watch him play on this stage. So you may have heard that on Thursday, he became the first rookie shortstop in history to hit a World Series home run. But don’t let that go whooshing by without stopping to appreciate it. We can help with that.

It isn’t as if Pena accomplished this feat because no rookie had ever played shortstop in a World Series before. In fact, according to Baseball Reference, he’s the 29th. So the list of guys who didn’t do that includes:

Derek Jeter …

Troy Tulowitzki …

Xander Bogaerts …

Dave Concepcion …

And even Miguel Cabrera, who really did play a little shortstop in the 2003 World Series.

But none of them did what Jeremy Peña did. And that, friends, is very cool.

IT’S A BRAND NEW DAY — Finally, we present this brilliant tidbit from the great Chris Kamka of NBC Sports Chicago, which sums up just how weird and wild these last couple of days of baseball have been.

Game 4: Four Astros pitchers combine on a no-hitter.

Game 5: First two Astros pitchers allow a hit to the first batter they face.

So how do we explain these things? How else? It’s …

Baseball!

Stark's "Weird and Wild" for Game 5.  IMHO the weirdest and wildest:

The last time that a team that just got no-hit had a leadoff homer in the next game was "a leadoff home run by the Reds’ Brandon Phillips on Oct. 8, 2010. And what’s so Weird and Wild about that? Oh, only that … it was the game after the last postseason no-hitter … by the late, great Roy Halladay … in this same ballpark! Which would seem sooo crazy, except for one thing. It’s … Baseball!"

 

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Huckleberry

Huckleberry 33090

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Guadaloopy said:

If you want to go and can afford to go, I highly recommend it.  You never know when you’ll have another chance at memories that stay with you forever.  

Went with this logic and just bought tickets for me and my son. That money would have eventually bled out over time on less important things like food and gas so fuck it.

Edited by Huckleberry
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UTexasFight

UTexasFight 9528

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

 

Also just as crazy that people are willing to sell for $1000 and give StubHub 15-25% of it.

Come again?

10% to sell.
Not great but it’s the buyer’s side that’s borderline usury. especially sucks now that sales taxes are built in

makes it come out to ~35% markup from the price listed.

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wood

wood 11260

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

And scamming people outside stadiums (and electronic tickets) killed the in-person buying. 

Yeah between the e-tickets and bulk-buying software (and hardware?) the brokers use to snap up big lots of tickets, the market is totally fucked. Add in the ticket transfer hassles we often see now, and it's getting a lot harder to attend sporting events. Not easier.

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Nice Guy Eddie

Nice Guy Eddie 13523

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, UTexasFight said:

Come again?

10% to sell.
Not great but it’s the buyer’s side that’s borderline usury. especially sucks now that sales taxes are built in

makes it come out to ~35% markup from the price listed.

They don’t even post their sales fee because it’s dynamic. I doubt many sell for a 10% fee.

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UTexasFight

UTexasFight 9528

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

They don’t even post their sales fee because it’s dynamic. I doubt many sell for a 10% fee.

I guess I don’t get it.

I just listed an SRO for $644.

it shows to buyers at $579.60 (10% less) which is what I’ll be getting.

(or maybe I’m the StubHub 10%er…. Doubtful.. I sell only a handful of tickets on there each year)

 

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