Depression, OCD, and whatever else ails you between the ears

[Message Board User 12389]

On 6/14/2022 at 7:25 AM, MissingInAction said:

Same here. I wonder if it's because our subconscious knows bad shit is on the way, and this is its way of getting us ready to deal with it. 

I don't know if it's just the media, or whatever, but it's just been one hit after another the past 5 years or so.

As a nation, we're stressed and this is coming out as bad, maladaptive behavior.  Look at everything that's been on the rise the last few years:

• Substance abuse
• Crime
• Traffic fatalities
• Assholes on airplanes
• Kids behavior in the classroom (talk to any public school teacher about what they've seen since the start of the 2021 school year)

It's not just you and it's not just a small segment of the population.

 

On 6/14/2022 at 7:25 AM, MissingInAction said:

Maybe it's time to disconnect and just read fantasy novels for a while.

This is honestly probably one of the best things one can do for their own mental health.  See that x at the top right hand corner of the screen?  Click on it more often than you have been and go out and do stuff rather than being very online. 

And most importantly, do your best to form true relationships and connections - one of the best (if not THE best) predictor of happiness is the quality of relationships we enjoy.  

It may seem like "duh" but happy people tend to have deep, meaningful, positive relationships (with family and/or friends) and unhappy people do not.

 

[Neonmoon 38127]

[Parliament 14121]

Posting this just because:

[Nicole44 22027]

So are antidepressants not really working or do they still work? I’ve read a couple of these articles the past two days so are they even effective here?

A Decisive Blow to the Serotonin Hypothesis of Depression

An exhaustive new review debunks the “chemical imbalance” theory of depression.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/side-effects/202207/decisive-blow-the-serotonin-hypothesis-depression?amp

[TwiceHorn 31240]

53 minutes ago, Nicole44 said:

So are antidepressants not really working or do they still work? I’ve read a couple of these articles the past two days so are they even effective here?

A Decisive Blow to the Serotonin Hypothesis of Depression

An exhaustive new review debunks the “chemical imbalance” theory of depression.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/side-effects/202207/decisive-blow-the-serotonin-hypothesis-depression?amp

I'm not sure medicine/psychiatry really knows how any psychoactive drug really works.  Almost certainly true of the previous generation of antidepressant drugs.  It's all theories, and some are better supported than others.

Just because a theory proves inapplicable doesn't mean the drugs aren't effective or can't be effective in some patients.

That said, I think SSRIs are over-prescribed without the benefit of "medication management" that can be crucial to achieving a good outcome for a patient, and typically involves flat-out trial and error.

[Caver60 395]

I'm pretty sure that my son (stepson) has for real OCD. I took him to a therapist last week and we are going again next week.

We noticed when he was younger (10-ish) that he would wash his hands compulsively. We would ask him about it, and he would say, "I just don't want to get anyone sick," or some variation of that. He would wash so frequently that his knuckles would bleed. It was wild, and I had all sorts of warning bells going off, but my wife would talk him down from it. Sometimes there were identifiable triggers, but other times there was nothing going on at home at least that could explain what set him off. We were newly married, and I didn't have standing to throw any weight around with the kids at that point.

He's 17 now. He is one helluva baseball player. All-District last season, incredible baseball and physical stats. I've often thought that baseball is where he goes to escape from his OCD. The physical activity drowns out the noise for him. He is being recruited by several colleges. Since the recruitment thing began, he has been having A LOT of trouble. He is not a social kid, he has trouble talking to girls. His "trouble" takes the form of what he calls "thoughts". He will see a teammate, and he will have a sexual thought about him. It's not one teammate, it could be any of them. And then he will fixate on that thought. He might have a sexual thought about one of the family dogs, or fucking a shrub. I try not to laugh, but sometimes it's tough. And then he insists that he likes girls, and asks over and over if he is gay.

When he fixates, it might look like he is simply zoned out (this can be for an hour at a time). It might look like compulsive hand washing. It also might look like coming to my wife or me to "confess" the thought, and to get some sort of reassurance from us. These are all attempts at self-soothing, in my opinion. They have been so frequent for the past 6-8 months that it is causing us a lot of stress and anxiety. He mentioned not too long ago that he also had thoughts of harming himself, but those thoughts only happened after he had a friend commit suicide during Covid isolation.

There's a concept called "sublimation" that I ran across recently. It's when a person diverts an impulse into a more socially acceptable activity. I think that he has always sublimated his OCD thoughts into baseball. But now, with the stress of college recruiting, baseball itself has become stressful. So there's nothing to sublimate those thoughts into. He will get up to bat against dudes throwing in the 70s and strike out repeatedly. After games, he'll say that he was having "thoughts" and that he couldn't concentrate. Sometimes the thoughts come so rapidly that he seems almost manic to me. It will sound like this, but with machine gun speed:

"I was thinking about what it would be like if I <performed a sexual act> on that guy"

"Son, does that seem like a real thought to you? Would you do that?"

"NO! I like girls. Do you think I like girls?"

"Yes, son, I know that you do. That was a trash thought, and you should let it go."

"I ruined my game. I ruined this whole summer."

"No son, you didn't. It was one game. Do better next time out and keep working hard."

"Are you sure you think I like girls? I do like girls."

And on and on. He and I have talked about it. He says that it's not so easy to let the "thoughts" go. That they seem so real at the time. When he first started having the same-sex thoughts, we would tell him some variation of, "Son, it doesn't matter if you are gay. We love you all the same and nothing can ever change that". But that was NOT the answer he was looking for. That answer only made it seem to him like we were confirming his thoughts. I've since come to believe that he's not likely gay at all, and that his heterosexuality is the reason for his fixation on those thoughts. It's like a logic trap that he's set up for himself/us.

His thoughts are out of control. I don't think that the therapist we are going to is going to be the answer, long term. And his mother is dead-set against meds (she will do it as a last resort). The therapist is a friend of mine, though, and I know that my son will like him. It was so hard to talk him into going to see someone at all, and my hope is that my therapist friend can at least get him more comfortable in a therapy setting so that he can do the work that needs to be done going forward, even if it's with another therapist/specialist.

Years ago I heard a sermon in church. It's come back to me lately, and it goes like this:

There was a boy who was looking forward to the 4th of July. His family went and bought a bunch of fireworks. The boy was so looking forward to setting them off that he couldn't wait, and went in the backyard and lit one. It went off in his hand, and burned his arm terribly. And so the boy would go into the clinic to have his burned arm treated every few days. They would debride the wounds, and it was excruciating.

So finally one day the boy went into the clinic and held his wounded arm behind his back, instead holding up his other hand and exclaiming, "Look! It's HEALED! We don't have to do this anymore!" The kind doctor pulled him aside and knelt next to the boy. He said, gently, "I know that it hurts. But you have to understand. In order to be healed, you have to hold your wounded arm up."

I told my son that story after our first trip to the therapist. I've been through therapy a few times, and I know how easy it is to hide things there. My hope is that he opens up and lets people help him. I suppose I'm holding my wounded arm up here for you all to see, too. I'm worried about him. I love him. There's times when I think he's probably my best friend. I couldn't be prouder of him, I don't give a shit if he's a great baseball player, if he's gay or straight or whatever. He's my son and I want him to find a way to deal with this torment before it leads him down some dark path (which it surely will at some point). 

I've read through a lot on here. I know that none of this holds a candle to what some of you have been through. Thanks for listening.

Edited July 22, 2022 by Caver60
misspelling

[Cheeseweasel 26437]

Sorry to hear that, @Caver60. I could have written many of the things you've written regarding my son. Similar activities, similar thoughts. Medication has helped and cognitive-behavioral therapy (CBT) has worked wonders.

But there are still days where it takes him 15 minutes to leave his room because the door didn't close correctly. Feel free to share if I can help.

[tigol 2383]

4 hours ago, Caver60 said:

I'm pretty sure that my son (stepson) has for real OCD. I took him to a therapist last week and we are going again next week.

We noticed when he was younger (10-ish) that he would wash his hands compulsively. We would ask him about it, and he would say, "I just don't want to get anyone sick," or some variation of that. He would wash so frequently that his knuckles would bleed. It was wild, and I had all sorts of warning bells going off, but my wife would talk him down from it. Sometimes there were identifiable triggers, but other times there was nothing going on at home at least that could explain what set him off. We were newly married, and I didn't have standing to throw any weight around with the kids at that point.

He's 17 now. He is one helluva baseball player. All-District last season, incredible baseball and physical stats. I've often thought that baseball is where he goes to escape from his OCD. The physical activity drowns out the noise for him. He is being recruited by several colleges. Since the recruitment thing began, he has been having A LOT of trouble. He is not a social kid, he has trouble talking to girls. His "trouble" takes the form of what he calls "thoughts". He will see a teammate, and he will have a sexual thought about him. It's not one teammate, it could be any of them. And then he will fixate on that thought. He might have a sexual thought about one of the family dogs, or fucking a shrub. I try not to laugh, but sometimes it's tough. And then he insists that he likes girls, and asks over and over if he is gay.

When he fixates, it might look like he is simply zoned out (this can be for an hour at a time). It might look like compulsive hand washing. It also might look like coming to my wife or me to "confess" the thought, and to get some sort of reassurance from us. These are all attempts at self-soothing, in my opinion. They have been so frequent for the past 6-8 months that it is causing us a lot of stress and anxiety. He mentioned not too long ago that he also had thoughts of harming himself, but those thoughts only happened after he had a friend commit suicide during Covid isolation.

There's a concept called "sublimation" that I ran across recently. It's when a person diverts an impulse into a more socially acceptable activity. I think that he has always sublimated his OCD thoughts into baseball. But now, with the stress of college recruiting, baseball itself has become stressful. So there's nothing to sublimate those thoughts into. He will get up to bat against dudes throwing in the 70s and strike out repeatedly. After games, he'll say that he was having "thoughts" and that he couldn't concentrate. Sometimes the thoughts come so rapidly that he seems almost manic to me. It will sound like this, but with machine gun speed:

"I was thinking about what it would be like if I <performed a sexual act> on that guy"

"Son, does that seem like a real thought to you? Would you do that?"

"NO! I like girls. Do you think I like girls?"

"Yes, son, I know that you do. That was a trash thought, and you should let it go."

"I ruined my game. I ruined this whole summer."

"No son, you didn't. It was one game. Do better next time out and keep working hard."

"Are you sure you think I like girls? I do like girls."

And on and on. He and I have talked about it. He says that it's not so easy to let the "thoughts" go. That they seem so real at the time. When he first started having the same-sex thoughts, we would tell him some variation of, "Son, it doesn't matter if you are gay. We love you all the same and nothing can ever change that". But that was NOT the answer he was looking for. That answer only made it seem to him like we were confirming his thoughts. I've since come to believe that he's not likely gay at all, and that his heterosexuality is the reason for his fixation on those thoughts. It's like a logic trap that he's set up for himself/us.

His thoughts are out of control. I don't think that the therapist we are going to is going to be the answer, long term. And his mother is dead-set against meds (she will do it as a last resort). The therapist is a friend of mine, though, and I know that my son will like him. It was so hard to talk him into going to see someone at all, and my hope is that my therapist friend can at least get him more comfortable in a therapy setting so that he can do the work that needs to be done going forward, even if it's with another therapist/specialist.

Years ago I heard a sermon in church. It's come back to me lately, and it goes like this:

There was a boy who was looking forward to the 4th of July. His family went and bought a bunch of fireworks. The boy was so looking forward to setting them off that he couldn't wait, and went in the backyard and lit one. It went off in his hand, and burned his arm terribly. And so the boy would go into the clinic to have his burned arm treated every few days. They would debride the wounds, and it was excruciating.

So finally one day the boy went into the clinic and held his wounded arm behind his back, instead holding up his other hand and exclaiming, "Look! It's HEALED! We don't have to do this anymore!" The kind doctor pulled him aside and knelt next to the boy. He said, gently, "I know that it hurts. But you have to understand. In order to be healed, you have to hold your wounded arm up."

I told my son that story after our first trip to the therapist. I've been through therapy a few times, and I know how easy it is to hide things there. My hope is that he opens up and lets people help him. I suppose I'm holding my wounded arm up here for you all to see, too. I'm worried about him. I love him. There's times when I think he's probably my best friend. I couldn't be prouder of him, I don't give a shit if he's a great baseball player, if he's gay or straight or whatever. He's my son and I want him to find a way to deal with this torment before it leads him down some dark path (which it surely will at some point). 

I've read through a lot on here. I know that none of this holds a candle to what some of you have been through. Thanks for listening.

You sound like an amazing Dad.  He is lucky to have you.  I'm so sorry he's going through this.

[TwiceHorn 31240]

1 minute ago, tigol said:

You sound like an amazing Dad.  He is lucky to have you.  I'm so sorry he's going through this.

Gagreed.

[tigol 2383]

15 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Gagreed.

There is NO WAY I could have gone to any of my parents with that information and have been greeted with Carver's level of understanding.

Mine did the best they could as parents, but they were NOT people to go to for that level of emotional support.

I told one that I was diagnosed with anxiety (finally) in my late 30's.  They said, "Well, we always knew you didn't have coping skills."  WTF?  If you saw it, why didn't you help me?  I don't think they knew how.

Carver is light years ahead in that department.

[TwiceHorn 31240]

10 minutes ago, tigol said:

There is NO WAY I could have gone to any of my parents with that information and have been greeted with Carver's level of understanding.

Mine did the best they could as parents, but they were NOT people to go to for that level of emotional support.

I told one that I was diagnosed with anxiety (finally) in my late 30's.  They said, "Well, we always knew you didn't have coping skills."  WTF?  If you saw it, why didn't you help me?  I don't think they knew how.

Carver is light years ahead in that department.

Yep, and it has to be incredibly frustrating because there probably are not easy answers.

It's good to hear that CBT has been effective for cheeseweasel's kid.

[Message Board User 12389]

23 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

I'm not sure medicine/psychiatry really knows how any psychoactive drug really works.  Almost certainly true of the previous generation of antidepressant drugs.  It's all theories, and some are better supported than others.

Just because a theory proves inapplicable doesn't mean the drugs aren't effective or can't be effective in some patients.

That said, I think SSRIs are over-prescribed without the benefit of "medication management" that can be crucial to achieving a good outcome for a patient, and typically involves flat-out trial and error.

Tom Cruise was right.

Just kidding...sort of.

In all seriousness, you are absolutely correct that we are way overmedicated as a society and so many of us (not everybody, obviously) want the quick and easy solution that a pill provides when faced with the slightest bit of discomfort.

 

 

[Mrs Whiggins 13049]

18 hours ago, Caver60 said:

I'm pretty sure that my son (stepson) has for real OCD. I took him to a therapist last week and we are going again next week.

I will echo what others are saying on here and vouch for CBT. One of my children has OCD and was diagnosed in elementary. We suspected something was going on and had to fight like crazy to go with the CBT route because medication was what insurance wanted, but it was the therapy that truly made the difference. The goal was to reach a point where day-to-day life could be lived. In some ways, it was a relief for our child to receive the diagnosis; it was something definable and something where the one part of the brain could begin to 'work' with the other side of the brain that was having the thoughts (and then the compulsions) to and I'm struggling for words here...'overpower?' them. Long and drawn out and emotional process of two steps forward and then one step back, but the gains eventually became more than the relapses. Middle school, no easy road for any one, was hell. Mean girls, mean boys, you know how it is. But, the early diagnosis and that hellscape of fifth through eighth grade put a substantial chip on our child's shoulder and that was a powerful motivator through high school. It provided a focus and eventually a confidence in using the strategies and coping skills to get through tough days.

Thank you for being there for him--he needs a lot of adults in his corner. It's okay to have bad days, the next day can be better and the next one and so on. It something one will always live with, but life can be livable with it--if that makes sense.

 

 

Way back there used to be few books and resources on the topic--The Boy Who Couldn't Stop Washing was one of the few but now there are quite a few others and if you have not done so, go down the rabbit hole if you need more ideas.

 

 

 

[tigol 2383]

 

[tigol 2383]

10 hours ago, Message Board User said:

Tom Cruise was right.

Just kidding...sort of.

In all seriousness, you are absolutely correct that we are way overmedicated as a society and so many of us (not everybody, obviously) want the quick and easy solution that a pill provides when faced with the slightest bit of discomfort.

 

 

https://www.npr.org/podcasts/381443482/two-guys-on-your-head

These docs had a good podcast on it.  They described the art of neurotransmitters and how SSRIs can be a sledge hammer when you need a violin bow.  They work for some, but not for all.  It is extremely frustrating.

[UpperWestside 6124]

I had a chance encounter recently at work. I never seat myself at work because I will just wait until it is my turn to seat a group. Anyhow in comes a man with his wife and daughter for breakfast. I am still getting my bearings, but he looked familiar. Once he said where they were from it clicked in my mind. It was Steven Furtick. Normally I am not in favor of megachurch pastors, but I have listened to several of his sermons on YouTube and I like that he does not dress flashy and just encourages people to come to church as they are.

 

I speak to him away from the table after they are done because I am sure his wife gets enough people stopping them randomly back home in Charlotte. They were here for his daughter’s five year trip. Each child gets a vacation every five years and since COVID messed hers up last year they brought her to the city to see three Broadway shows. We talked and found out we had a good deal in common. We’re both small town guys and he knew the school my family founded in his home state of South Carolina, which is Wofford College. 
 

He asked me what I was doing with life and I told him getting a masters so that I can be a therapist and work with kids and families, especially children with autism. I told him I worked with people who are hurting emotionally and that I just listen and do what I can to help them have a better day each time I see them. He said God has me right where I am supposed to be and I definitely agreed with that. Anyhow that was a blessing to get to speak with him. Told him if I ever go to Charlotte and it isn’t just to switch planes that I’ll come to a service. 
 

God puts you in a certain place for a certain reason and I am glad I am where I am right now. 

[TwiceHorn 31240]

On 7/23/2022 at 8:14 PM, tigol said:

https://www.npr.org/podcasts/381443482/two-guys-on-your-head

These docs had a good podcast on it.  They described the art of neurotransmitters and how SSRIs can be a sledge hammer when you need a violin bow.  They work for some, but not for all.  It is extremely frustrating.

Well executed CBT is a really wonderful thing and helps so many "illnesses."  I am quite sure there is a "medical" component to most illnesses, as well, but I don't think we have really zeroed in on what it is or how to treat it.  I think the study of brain scans, which is relatively new, is going to lead somewhere on all of it, eventually.

This lady is a leader in the field. https://irp.nih.gov/pi/nora-volkow

Edited July 30, 2022 by TwiceHorn

[UpperWestside 6124]

17 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Well executed CBT is a really wonderful thing and helps so many "illnesses."  I am quite sure there is a "medical" component to most illnesses, as well, but I don't think we have really zeroed in on what it is or how to treat it.  I think the study of brain scans, which is relatively new, is going to lead somewhere on all of it, eventually.

This lady is a leader in the field. https://irp.nih.gov/pi/nora-volkow

The most exciting thing about CBT combined with science and our understanding of the mind is that we get closer and closer to being able to figure out how we work and why. The work done now may not fully benefit any of us, but generations of folks way down the road will be thankful for the time spent on this right now.

[Lidig8r 1852]

On 7/23/2022 at 9:15 AM, Message Board User said:

Tom Cruise was right.

Just kidding...sort of.

In all seriousness, you are absolutely correct that we are way overmedicated as a society and so many of us (not everybody, obviously) want the quick and easy solution that a pill provides when faced with the slightest bit of discomfort.

 

 

We now know that  in some cases of depression, rTMS (repetitive transmagnetic cranial stimulation) is being utilized with success. So much so that many insurance benefit providers have approved this for treating depression ... and eating disorders. [I gave a horribad TEDx talk on rTMS about 4 years ago when I was still in a deep fog.]

Doctors are also turning to a ketamine regiment to treat severe depression and ... eating disorders. It too has shown promise and like rTMS, has been approved by some insurance companies.

Am embedding an article on rTMS.

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/tms-depression#who-is-it-for

[Lidig8r 1852]

Gentlemen...reach out, embrace the love, and strength that our children give to us ... even after they have been unfairly taken. And I hope, I pray, that together, we can help others to lead full and happy lives.

http://adadsjourneywitheatingdisorders.home.blog/2022/08/10/birthdays/

[MissingInAction 24805]

I have to say that working from home these past 2.5 years has been the best thing for me. 

At my agency the office politics are just such a soul sucking part of work. I don't go to work to make friends. I have plenty already. I know that affected my ability to move up and get the projects I wanted.

Since working from home I've been promoted twice, making more than ever, and I'm happy for the first time in decades.

[BearSchlong 8077]

I actually flew to Dallas today to work in our office - first time I've even had the option of an office since 2020.

I just needed a change of pace. And I'm taking a partner to lunch, and actually meeting the rest of my team in person this evening.

Most days though, I'm the only employee in a huge IT company that has 300K employees in 140 countries that is based in lil ol Beaumont TX.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

[OWLVIS 557]

Please forgive the messiness, rambling. 2.5 since the stroke I still dont have use of the right hand and I was a poor typist before the stroke and Im not in a good plave emotionally

 

I have tried so hard to get better, to do the work. But this hasnt happened in a vacume , the insanity of the pandemic, the econmic effect. The effect that had on what couldve shoulve been my support system. I am exausted mentally, emotionally, physically and finacially. Im old, Ive gotten fat and out of shape since the stroke, im broke and broken. Anger has been the only thing that Ive had to motivate me and I dont like the person that 24/7 life makes me

 

even if it gets better my life wont be good. I have no family, no prospects. Even though ive started back at work I hate what I do I was trying to exit from this profession, now im stuck at it til I die

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

Please forgive the messiness, rambling. 2.5 since the stroke I still dont have use of the right hand and I was a poor typist before the stroke and Im not in a good plave emotionally
 
I have tried so hard to get better, to do the work. But this hasnt happened in a vacume , the insanity of the pandemic, the econmic effect. The effect that had on what couldve shoulve been my support system. I am exausted mentally, emotionally, physically and finacially. Im old, Ive gotten fat and out of shape since the stroke, im broke and broken. Anger has been the only thing that Ive had to motivate me and I dont like the person that 24/7 life makes me
 
even if it gets better my life wont be good. I have no family, no prospects. Even though ive started back at work I hate what I do I was trying to exit from this profession, now im stuck at it til I die

Damn man. I am sorry to hear you are struggling and at such a low point. I don’t know what to say that would help, but I am wishing you the best.

[TwiceHorn 31240]

7 hours ago, Patricio Swayze said:

Damn man. I am sorry to hear you are struggling and at such a low point. I don’t know what to say that would help, but I am wishing you the best.

Same.

[OWLVIS 557]

13 hours ago, Patricio Swayze said:

Damn man. I am sorry to hear you are struggling and at such a low point. I don’t know what to say that would help, but I am wishing you the best.

Thank you

6 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Same.

Thanks

[Lidig8r 1852]

17 hours ago, OWLVIS said:

Please forgive the messiness, rambling. 2.5 since the stroke I still dont have use of the right hand and I was a poor typist before the stroke and Im not in a good plave emotionally

 

I have tried so hard to get better, to do the work. But this hasnt happened in a vacume , the insanity of the pandemic, the econmic effect. The effect that had on what couldve shoulve been my support system. I am exausted mentally, emotionally, physically and finacially. Im old, Ive gotten fat and out of shape since the stroke, im broke and broken. Anger has been the only thing that Ive had to motivate me and I dont like the person that 24/7 life makes me

 

even if it gets better my life wont be good. I have no family, no prospects. Even though ive started back at work I hate what I do I was trying to exit from this profession, now im stuck at it til I die

One of my heroes, Cicero is credited with saying, "Dum anima est, spes esse." Its rough translation is ... "While there is life, there is hope."

What does it tell you that you took the time to hop on here, knowing that it is a safe place and open up about your pain and despair? What does it tell you that you perhaps look upon this place as a small spark of life? That you are embraced on here with love?

When my daughter died 5 years ago, I knew, I KNEW, that my life was over. That the pain in my heart would never go away.  That I was shattered. Now, make no mistake, I will always have this huge hole in my soul that can never be filled. But, in my daughter's name, I am helping get young people in treatment every week. Helping parents in grief. I never expected at 63 years old to be doing this. But ... I believe I have no choice.

Perhaps with you, you can take that justifiable anger you have and start to redirect a small part of it somewhere. Maybe you can look at why you hate your current job, what you like about your job, take the positive things (if any), and direct them to a job in a different field.  Will it be easy? Of course not.

There is no doubt that you have an elephant of despair in front of you. And the only way you digest that elephant is one bite at a time.

I am connected with very good therapists. (And believe me, most therapists are quacks.) I can make some referrals if that would help.  If so, send me a DM.

Now, I don't know anything about your situation except what you shared. But, the important thing is... you shared. You shared in a safe place. You shared with this incredible, small band of brothers all of whom, on this particular thread, have faced some incredible demons. Maybe a step would be to keep posting on here. I can also connect you with some closed groups on the Book of Faces of men who are going through some incredibly difficult times.

Strength in the brotherhood. 

Steven

[Shoxthemonkey 1976]

Hang in there, buddy. As usual, @Lidig8r said all of the things that I would want to tell you but in a much more coherent fashion. We are all pulling for your recovery. I know it isn’t much but you are important to me and lots of others here. 

[Grade of D as in David 13253]

19 hours ago, OWLVIS said:

Please forgive the messiness, rambling. 2.5 since the stroke I still dont have use of the right hand and I was a poor typist before the stroke and Im not in a good plave emotionally

 

I have tried so hard to get better, to do the work. But this hasnt happened in a vacume , the insanity of the pandemic, the econmic effect. The effect that had on what couldve shoulve been my support system. I am exausted mentally, emotionally, physically and finacially. Im old, Ive gotten fat and out of shape since the stroke, im broke and broken. Anger has been the only thing that Ive had to motivate me and I dont like the person that 24/7 life makes me

 

even if it gets better my life wont be good. I have no family, no prospects. Even though ive started back at work I hate what I do I was trying to exit from this profession, now im stuck at it til I die

Not much to add to what has been said above, but we're pulling for you man. Try to find a good therapist, it's helpful sometimes just to talk to someone. 

[YGIFS 19449]

Shoot, thanks to cactusflinthead for pinging me.  Somehow blew right past this.  

Obviously, I'm very mentally diseased.  But got referred to this thread from another one where everybody seems to stay relatively anonymous.  gonna read through it all and will take me awhile.  In the interim though, if anybody in Austin (actually anywhere in Texas, I'm not specific to in person or tele-health) , knows of any therapist or counselor onboarding new patients right now....I could really use the hour.  I got a data dump from a couple therapists and my insurance company and only one of 10-15 are taking on new patients.  Nothing desperate but am wanting to just add talk therapy into my arsenal of shit I'm doing to get better.  appreciate any connectivity y'all can provide.  hook em

[Grade of D as in David 13253]

10 hours ago, YGIFS said:

Shoot, thanks to cactusflinthead for pinging me.  Somehow blew right past this.  

Obviously, I'm very mentally diseased.  But got referred to this thread from another one where everybody seems to stay relatively anonymous.  gonna read through it all and will take me awhile.  In the interim though, if anybody in Austin (actually anywhere in Texas, I'm not specific to in person or tele-health) , knows of any therapist or counselor onboarding new patients right now....I could really use the hour.  I got a data dump from a couple therapists and my insurance company and only one of 10-15 are taking on new patients.  Nothing desperate but am wanting to just add talk therapy into my arsenal of shit I'm doing to get better.  appreciate any connectivity y'all can provide.  hook em

I couldn't find any that took insurance when I started in January, but if you are ok paying cash I have a couple I can recommend.

[Lidig8r 1852]

On 8/18/2022 at 1:37 PM, YGIFS said:

Shoot, thanks to cactusflinthead for pinging me.  Somehow blew right past this.  

Obviously, I'm very mentally diseased.  But got referred to this thread from another one where everybody seems to stay relatively anonymous.  gonna read through it all and will take me awhile.  In the interim though, if anybody in Austin (actually anywhere in Texas, I'm not specific to in person or tele-health) , knows of any therapist or counselor onboarding new patients right now....I could really use the hour.  I got a data dump from a couple therapists and my insurance company and only one of 10-15 are taking on new patients.  Nothing desperate but am wanting to just add talk therapy into my arsenal of shit I'm doing to get better.  appreciate any connectivity y'all can provide.  hook em

Pm me if you'd like.  Or email steven@dunnlawfirm.net. I have a pretty extensive network.

I am also friends with a true "connector" who knows everyone.

I am pretty confident that depending on the circumstances and needs, we can make some pretty good recommendations.

And keep in mind, this is coming from a person who thinks many, many therapists are well ... less than what they believe. And transference and counter-transference are prevalent.  Here's a brief article on that:

https://www.verywellmind.com/transference-2671660

[UpperWestside 6124]

I haven’t checked in here this month, but I really enjoyed reading everything that has been shared. @OWLVIS Everyone here wants to see you push forward and live a life that brings you happiness and peace. I fully believe that is possible. People here are graciously reaching out to you and you will get the help you desire. Never, ever give up or give in to a way of thinking that harms you mentally.
 

Something a manager at work said yesterday was something I found to be poignant. He is in his late 60’s and chooses to still work because he loves what he does. We were discussing how he likes to teach people what to do and he said “I teach people to do something because I want them to do it BETTER than I do it. I really enjoy working with him and his humility is not fake. When you work for people who have this attitude of humility it is easy to say that I never feel like I am working. I wish everyone on this thread had this type of situation or perhaps something even better in your chosen profession. 

[Parliament 14121]

Bumping this thread so it doesn't get buried and any noob's don't miss it.  Kind thoughts to all of the posters here.  

[UpperWestside 6124]

I am going to mention this solely because this might be something that is good for y’all’s mental health. Today is my birthday and I worked. No big deal because it’s the middle of the week. I decided to actually tell a few co-workers it was my birthday which I normally do not do. What I did different was I gave some gifts to some folks I work with and I made salsa and some chicken fajitas for everyone to eat, including the kitchen staff. 
 

I wanted people at work to know they are valued and getting them something seemed to be a better way to spend my birthday. I got more than one “But it’s your birthday so why get us something?” I said that the opportunity to make someone’s day better when they aren’t expecting it was a gift all unto itself. I would love to do this every year going forward as a way to celebrate others and the positive impact they have upon myself and those they are around.

[TwiceHorn 31240]

8 minutes ago, UpperWestside said:

I am going to mention this solely because this might be something that is good for y’all’s mental health. Today is my birthday and I worked. No big deal because it’s the middle of the week. I decided to actually tell a few co-workers it was my birthday which I normally do not do. What I did different was I gave some gifts to some folks I work with and I made salsa and some chicken fajitas for everyone to eat, including the kitchen staff. 
 

I wanted people at work to know they are valued and getting them something seemed to be a better way to spend my birthday. I got more than one “But it’s your birthday so why get us something?” I said that the opportunity to make someone’s day better when they aren’t expecting it was a gift all unto itself. I would love to do this every year going forward as a way to celebrate others and the positive impact they have upon myself and those they are around.

Happy Birthday, friendo!

That is good stuff.  

[Parliament 14121]

40 minutes ago, UpperWestside said:

I am going to mention this solely because this might be something that is good for y’all’s mental health. Today is my birthday and I worked. No big deal because it’s the middle of the week. I decided to actually tell a few co-workers it was my birthday which I normally do not do. What I did different was I gave some gifts to some folks I work with and I made salsa and some chicken fajitas for everyone to eat, including the kitchen staff. 
 

I wanted people at work to know they are valued and getting them something seemed to be a better way to spend my birthday. I got more than one “But it’s your birthday so why get us something?” I said that the opportunity to make someone’s day better when they aren’t expecting it was a gift all unto itself. I would love to do this every year going forward as a way to celebrate others and the positive impact they have upon myself and those they are around.

I hope you get laid tonight.

[Cheeseweasel 26437]

Every night.

[Bozo_Casanova 26270]

20 hours ago, UpperWestside said:

I am going to mention this solely because this might be something that is good for y’all’s mental health. Today is my birthday and I worked. No big deal because it’s the middle of the week. I decided to actually tell a few co-workers it was my birthday which I normally do not do. What I did different was I gave some gifts to some folks I work with and I made salsa and some chicken fajitas for everyone to eat, including the kitchen staff. 
 

I wanted people at work to know they are valued and getting them something seemed to be a better way to spend my birthday. I got more than one “But it’s your birthday so why get us something?” I said that the opportunity to make someone’s day better when they aren’t expecting it was a gift all unto itself. I would love to do this every year going forward as a way to celebrate others and the positive impact they have upon myself and those they are around.

I usually get pretty bummed out on my birthday.
 

Last year I did one of those Facebook fundraisers with a goal of like $200 for Mobile Loaves and Fishes. People ended up giving like $1200. Most of it was from people I haven’t spoken to or seen in a decade or more.

I was very overwhelmed with gratitude and ended up crying about it, in a good way. 

[UpperWestside 6124]

20 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Happy Birthday, friendo!

That is good stuff.  

Thank you. It was a cool day and the people at work made the day fun. Opened a gift last night from my three year old niece. It was a picture my mom framed of the first time I met her in-person last January back in Texas. My mom, who I also do not ask for gifts from because having her as a mom is more than enough, had four pictures blown up and put on a canvas. One was a picture of the first time I stood up on a surfboard some years back in SoCal at Huntington Beach. Seeing those four pictures was pretty awesome.

[UpperWestside 6124]

1 hour ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

I usually get pretty bummed out on my birthday.
 

Last year I did one of those Facebook fundraisers with a goal of like $200 for Mobile Loaves and Fishes. People ended up giving like $1200. Most of it was from people I haven’t spoken to or seen in a decade or more.

I was very overwhelmed with gratitude and ended up crying about it, in a good way. 

Aww man this is a really good stuff! People can be so amazing when given the chance to do so. This is the type of thing we should talk about more often with others.

[Lidig8r 1852]

In keeping with the recent feel good interactions on this thread, I am amazed at events or circumstances that have a way of just coming to you in unexpected ways.

I have a good friend who lives about 15 houses away from me. He is an absolute madman, Harvard PhD, he invents AI which improves robotic brains. (I call him Miles Dyson and we have on numerous occasions, discussed the ethics and morality of non biological intelligence becoming self aware.)

His mom is Mitzi Perdue.  Mitzi is a very well known international advocate on human trafficking. Last month the Ukrainian government asked her to come to Ukraine to observe and report on the human and organ trafficking going on as a result of the war. She will be coming to Dallas after the first of the year.  She has also agreed to give a talk on Ukraine, human and organ trafficking.

And so, I got New Friends New Life (the largest organization in North Texas emphasizing  trafficking) to help co-host the event along with Mental Health America of Greater Dallas. It should be an incredible event and so look forward to helping organize this event.

Along with that event, we are talking with UTD about hosting a chess tournament at the same time. My friend [Miles Dyson] is very good at chess. And we are learning that chess can improve cognitive abilities and exercise the brain. UTD has one of the best collegiate chess teams in the US. So, we put this event on when the next world championship of chess is being played. At the same time, we get a number of mental health organizations to help co-sponsor this event and agree to set up tables with information for the thousands of UTD students.

So, what does this have to do with eating disorders? Very little other than ... I believe mental health organizations and foundations need to learn to collaborate, to share resources and to make themselves more available to the general public. That is so missing today.

In the meantime, treat yourself with courage and grace. Hug your children. Tell them you love them each day.

[40acredropout 2901]

Curious if anybody here has any experience with Ketamine for treating whatever ails you?

It's a longer story but I've struggled with depression/anxiety for as long as I can remember and in the last two years my mental health / outlook has really deteriorated.  Have tried meds, therapy, group therapy, a week long resort rehab/workshop, 12 step program, and most other things.  After all that, I'm still in a pretty bad place right now.  I don't know what else to do at this point so guess I'm going to throw a hail mary and see if any of the hype around Ketamine is for real.

[YChang 3430]

I couldn't find a gift this article option so hopefully no paywall for this. But a fantastic interactive opinion piece from a psychiatrist on how to treat depression:

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/09/27/opinion/how-to-treat-depression.html

[Helobious 9480]

6 hours ago, 40acredropout said:

Curious if anybody here has any experience with Ketamine for treating whatever ails you?

It's a longer story but I've struggled with depression/anxiety for as long as I can remember and in the last two years my mental health / outlook has really deteriorated.  Have tried meds, therapy, group therapy, a week long resort rehab/workshop, 12 step program, and most other things.  After all that, I'm still in a pretty bad place right now.  I don't know what else to do at this point so guess I'm going to throw a hail mary and see if any of the hype around Ketamine is for real.

They gave my cousin that after his open heart surgery. He started talking to himself, but he was saying he was having a conversation with a dead relative that he’d never met before. Then he started doing a peddling motion in the hospital bed with his legs, and he said he was on a bicycle flying through a cloud. His arms got all goosebumpy and he said he could feel the water vapor from the cloud all over his arms. 
 

That’s my only ever experience with ketamine. Didn’t exactly leave me wanting to try it for myself. /csb

[Lidig8r 1852]

22 hours ago, 40acredropout said:

Curious if anybody here has any experience with Ketamine for treating whatever ails you?

It's a longer story but I've struggled with depression/anxiety for as long as I can remember and in the last two years my mental health / outlook has really deteriorated.  Have tried meds, therapy, group therapy, a week long resort rehab/workshop, 12 step program, and most other things.  After all that, I'm still in a pretty bad place right now.  I don't know what else to do at this point so guess I'm going to throw a hail mary and see if any of the hype around Ketamine is for real.

I know that ketamine infusion treatment is being increasingly used to treat various mental health conditions. Ketamine infusion has been used with promising results to treat Depression and bi-polar conditions and those conditions secondary to eating disorders. So much so that if you have a very good insurance advocate, some health insurance providers may approve this treatment regiment. Its success rate (for short term symptoms can be has high as 60 - 70%.

I have had several clients with severe eating disorders with depression, anxiety and other co-occurring issues and each of them have reported some improvement when undergoing ketamine infusion as part of their treatment regiment.

Here is one website discussing it:

https://dallas-psychiatrist.com/ketamine-depression-treatment/

Here is another:

https://texasketaminespecialists.com/how-does-ketamine-work-dallas-plano-richardson-tx/

One of the most important things is to be sure that whoever you talk to about this treatment, they answer each and every question you have to your satisfaction.

[ROFL BOX 6647]

A partial list of my internal grievances (i.e. shit that is weighing me down & I need to release but just... can't - fully - let - go):

* Diesel truck needs a new engine - the fucker sounds like if you had an empty soup can with the open part facing up & were grinding the bottom part into a box of glass.  Probably bottom end related, i.e. crank or a thrown rod.  Ether way, diesels aren't cheap.  I was in a pinch when the engine went out & ended up overpaying for a 2007 XL version F-150 with no cruise control, manual windows / locks & 2 doors + the little 'winglet' non jump seat back doors.  Drove it to Colorado & back for Scout camp with my son (again, needed a truck PRONTO & this was a purchase completed the AM we left Drippin').  This thing is not a lot of fun to drive my 2 kids anywhere... 3 wide in the only seats available.

 * Had a shingle ------- > metal project that I invested a lot of hours (including physical onsite meetings) that I lost.  Would have paid nicely enough to complete the diesel repairs.  Lost that one - the customer was giving me buying signs all the way through, when I gave him a rough idea on the $$, he said that was good (complex projects where I have to detail a lot of stuff, I don't want to waste time on the nuts & bolts description until after I provide a rough $$).  Final $$ I came down a bit, gave away some "Oh, BTW... I need ______" things @ no cost, etc.  An irritation is I spent some $$ for a satellite measurement vs. a solid 4-1/2 hours climbing all around this roof to get a physical measurement & calculate all of that.  A poke in the eye (not a full on gouge, mind you) is that I didn't get the job & in addition to this added cost (above the usual time & fuel thing).  It's just salt on the wound.

* I have done a couple of repairs on my own for a few projects (not uncommon where it is a hassle to the customer if I'm gonna have someone else do the work & then add some $$ on top for my part) - my back has been giving me fits over it & all I get from the wife is "You should take a hot bath".

* I'm getting stuck in a spiral where in the evening, I get my brain clear - have a solid detail of what I need to do the next day, get a schedule worked up... & then one small thing the next day throws everything out of whack & I can't get the important shit handled because of the work that just popped up.

* I have a customer that wants a certain type of gutter (they saw it on a neighbor's house0 & the machine to make that profile is only operated by one company (not anyone I have ever worked with).  After extensive legwork to track this down & getting a price on it, the customer asked "So you're adding $$ on top of their price?"  Well of course I said yes... & added "Well, yeah... that's how I make money" (even though my add-on for this is prob. less than $ 120).  They seemed surprised that I would put in the effort & not expect even a little bit of compensation for my work performed.
 

* * Final kick in the nuts is our 8 year old Doberman, "Major Royal" has cancer.  He is coming up on 8 years old & apparently they are known for a 10 - 12 year span.  The $$ for a CT & then surgery will probably run close to $ 10k.  & My truck would need that amount for the repair.  But we have a great dog that was the 1st one the kids ever really knew.  & Even if everything WAS 100% successful (bone cancer most likely...( hell, look @ the results for human recovery... maybe a normal 2 th 4 more years anyhow.

So, yeah.  Things are going swell over here.

[UpperWestside 6124]

@ROFL BOX Thank you for sharing all of that, as hard as it can be to do so. I am sorry for what is happening with your job. I feel profoundly sad for what is happening with your dog as I am sure everyone else who read that is. I’d rather spend the day with my dog over a person 100 times out of a 100. We don’t deserve how nice they are to us.

[UpperWestside 6124]

I was at work today and a younger guy I work with out of nowhere thanked me for the messages I put in our group chat. A good chunk of the summer I would post stuff on Sundays when I would go to the beach where I would try to make everyone laugh a little that was working on those days. I always let everyone know they can talk to me if they feel like they can’t talk to anyone else. I have had folks take me up on that and I do the best I can to help them through what ails them. 
 

The young guy today asked me if I wanted to go skiing in January. I said that I am going to be gone on vacation and when I mentioned where it apparently motivated him to explore getting out and seeing more of the world. 
 

The point of saying all that is that your words have meaning to someone and often when you do not expect them to. A kind word could make a world of difference to someone who needs to hear it. 

[Lidig8r 1852]

So, Sunday October 30 was the 6th commemoration of my daughter being taken after fighting eating disorders for 7 years.

I thought... no, I knew that the day would be horrifically bad. But then ...

I am so blessed to have a son, and close friends who prop me up on the worst of days.

And, I have been given the ability to write somewhat coherently about thoughts and feelings. Even still ...

http://adadsjourneywitheatingdisorders.home.blog/2022/10/31/october-30-2016/