Avatar: The Way of Water

[crash_davis 23114]

I remember after the original that people were depressed after watching the movie, not because of the story line but because the 3D experience so was real that they thought it was a legit world that they wanted to live in and couldn't. I also remember Cameron criticizing the "3D" movies which came before stating they were basically shit 3D. I'm expecting this movie to be like the original, that the 3D is done so well that you are immersed in that world and will have the best fucking movie experience you will ever have.

[Brandywine 1316]

Agree with UpperWestside and DanRydell.

Visually it's stunning with Incredible and beautiful images. My wife kept wondering how in the world it was created. And, the last 30 minutes were intense and exciting and wrapped it up pretty well. But - it was Looooooonnnnnnngggggg. Got to the theater at 2:30, started at 3, saw some trailers - mostly upcoming action movies - and then the movie and left a little after 6:30 with the credits going. I would make sure you take your potty break before it starts. And even though I saw the first one and now this one, the story is still confusing to me. I think Cameron made it that way for people to watch it more than once to try and understand it. I did the 3D and glad I did but I thought it worked without them.

[Brandywine 1316]

 I do love James Horner's music to Avatar. I miss his incredible talent.

[Steamboat1874 4075]

I will say the first one was ok but everything I have seen about this one looks like a cartoon.

Are there any actual people in this ?

[CooterBrown 18022]

Just got out of the theater.

This was a lot better than the first. It is basically Avatar moves the family to the beach.

Of course the beach blues are Māori because it’s easy. They even do the haka tongue thing.

This is the first movie that makes me believe that a 100% CGI movie could work. This one is almost there. There are humans and real sets in maybe 10% of the scenes. The effects are flawless except for one underwater chase scene where it looks poorly rendered and lacks detail. It could be that scene is made for 3D and I saw it in 2D.

The 3:20 running time moves quickly. It never felt tedious. However, there are 30-45 minutes, that do not advance the plot and exist only to show off the FX, that could’ve easily been cut.

The only thing worse than hunting whales is hunting pacifist talking whales.

Aussies are assholes.

Spider is a regarded punk ass bitch.

Movie kids continue to suck, human or Na’vi. I did kinda like the emo hippie girl who can do nature magic because fuck you.

Once you realize Sully looks exactly like Mel Gibson in Braveheart, you can’t get past it.

[CooterBrown 18022]

The first cut of Avatar 3 is 9 hours.

https://movieweb.com/avatar-3-currently-clocks-in-at-9-hours-james-cameron-to-complete-all-the-visual-effects-before-cutting/

[atomheartbevo 89771]

2 hours ago, CooterBrown said:

The first cut of Avatar 3 is 9 hours.

https://movieweb.com/avatar-3-currently-clocks-in-at-9-hours-james-cameron-to-complete-all-the-visual-effects-before-cutting/

Disney: Hey, uh, James, instead of 5 or 6 movies, let’s just do three movies.

Cameron: Three movies?  Say no more.  I’m working on the third movie, but need a little extra time for reshoots and to get the special effects just right, and it’ll cost a little more, but I promise will only make three movies.

Disney: Thanks.

 

[Sam Lin 3560]

23 hours ago, CooterBrown said:

Once you realize Sully looks exactly like Mel Gibson in Braveheart, you can’t get past it.

So true, I was trying to place it and you finally nailed it.

 

Thought the movie was solid. Haven't ever seriously watched the first to compare. Plot just seems like a recycle of the first, different people and settings, and I'm having a hard time seeing how the next 3 will be any different.

Visually, aurally beautiful. Will be reading some technical articles on whatever development Cameron pushed for the underwater scenes, he has always been technologically driven and has the budget to fund development that then goes on to benefit those who follow.

A few wtf plot points, most of the characters were very generic, but who cares. Some very well done allegory in a few scenes. He's still a master.

 

 

 

[GreenspointTexas 9662]

9 hours ago, Sam Lin said:

So true, I was trying to place it and you finally nailed it.

 

Thought the movie was solid. Haven't ever seriously watched the first to compare. Plot just seems like a recycle of the first, different people and settings, and I'm having a hard time seeing how the next 3 will be any different.

Visually, aurally beautiful. Will be reading some technical articles on whatever development Cameron pushed for the underwater scenes, he has always been technologically driven and has the budget to fund development that then goes on to benefit those who follow.

A few wtf plot points, most of the characters were very generic, but who cares. Some very well done allegory in a few scenes. He's still a master.

 

 

 

Every person ive talked to that has seen it has loved it. Including a former film major who is a tough critic on most movies. He texted me after leaving the theater “ never underestimate James Cameron.”

 

Outside of Maverick, this is looking like THE must see in theaters movie of the past 15 years. Cant wait

[RomaVicta 29961]

On 12/14/2022 at 8:17 AM, C-Man said:

I groaned when I heard they were mining for something called "Unobtanium" in the first one and kept groaning for the next 3 hours. There's not a chance in the world I see this second installment. I'll watch Terminator 2 instead.

Exactly. 

It's interesting that his two best films, IMHO, are sequels. T2 and Aliens are brilliant. Aliens as a Viet Nam allegory makes it both an outstanding action movie and even thoughtful. 

He's got great skills. He made a very good movie about the Titanic even though we all know the ending. In that movie, he follows through on the fate of the passengers and crew. Usually, we'd see the captain disappear into the bridge and assume his fate; Cameron shows the windows shattering and the cold ocean flooding in. The noble aristocrats order their brandy to bravely face their fate; the horror of the creeping water and imminent drowning is accurately portrayed. The water creeping up and past the porthole where Jack is handcuffed is similarly and simply compelling. 

Cameron is skilled at all of the aspects of filmmaking from the most advanced to the most basic. His characters, on the other hand, are hit and miss. Aliens is packed with good characters. Titanic's are serviceable but really brought to life by acting rather than writing. Never forget that the massive profits were driven by girls 11-14 seeing the movie over and over and over. That tells you what you need to know about the subtlety of his human story.

I write too long. Movie making is complex with unpredictable results. Competence is not easy to attain. Excellence is very rare. I criticize elements of Cameron's work, but I profoundly envy his ability. Critical skills are common. Creative skills are rare. You must have firm control of both to have a shot at making a good film.

 

[UpperWestside 6184]

4 hours ago, GreenspointTexas said:

Every person ive talked to that has seen it has loved it. Including a former film major who is a tough critic on most movies. He texted me after leaving the theater “ never underestimate James Cameron.”

 

Outside of Maverick, this is looking like THE must see in theaters movie of the past 15 years. Cant wait

Such a cool movie. If I were Cameron I would get to work on creating a VR game for Avatar to more fully monetize all the people that would buy it. I would definitely get a VR headset if a game with just the water part of the world of Pandora was made.

Maverick was also a really good movie.

[greenman 64]

My family had a blast watching it in IMAX 3D. We’re going to book Dolby Cinema 3D next to see how it compares but highly recommend. 

[atomheartbevo 89771]

3 hours ago, UpperWestside said:

Such a cool movie. If I were Cameron I would get to work on creating a VR game for Avatar to more fully monetize all the people that would buy it. I would definitely get a VR headset if a game with just the water part of the world of Pandora was made.

He would make even more money from the furries if he did a full VR experience.

[LonghornSean 4018]

Saw it in standard 2D and enjoyed it. Definitely too long, as most blockbuster movies are nowadays, but really liked the parts when they arrived and were getting assimilated with the ocean clan. And the action set piece in the beginning of the third act was fucking great.

Will see again at Bob Bullock over the holidays at some point.

On the negative side, not enough new ground story-wise, hard to tell apart, much less know the names of, Jake's kids (the boys especially). And I said before, too long.

Spoiler

Did I miss the explanation of how Quaritch's kid exists, who the mother is, etc? Got the part about why he had to stay (no cryo-sleep for infants).

Also Spider seems to be quite a flip-flopper, betraying both sides.

 

[futureman 22517]

Spoiler

continuing from post above, what about kitty’s (was that her name?) dad?  did she have a dad or is she supposed to be some kind of Christ-figure?

 

[LonghornSean 4018]

8 hours ago, futureman said:

  Hide contents

continuing from post above, what about kitty’s (was that her name?) dad?  did she have a dad or is she supposed to be some kind of Christ-figure?

 

Spoiler

I think it’s Kiri. And yes, that’s the impression I got. Some kind of immaculate conception (Eywa?).

Pretty weird regardless that a  corpse gestated and gave birth and it’s mentioned as if it’s nothing special.

 

Edited December 20, 2022 by LonghornSean

[LonghornSean 4018]

On 12/16/2022 at 5:25 PM, Brandywine said:

 I do love James Horner's music to Avatar. I miss his incredible talent.

I agree, that was one area where this movie was clearly inferior to the original.

None of the new score stood out to me at all and I didn’t feel like they utilized James Horner’s existing themes enough.

[Brandywine 1316]

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/smartless/id1521578868?i=1000589723416

Loved this. Pretty funny and a great interview with James Cameron and his films, especially his approach over the years with technology that led him to creating Avatar.  

Edited December 22, 2022 by Brandywine

[TonyTexas 10520]

48 minutes ago, Brandywine said:

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/smartless/id1521578868?i=1000589723416

Loved this. Pretty funny and a great interview with James Cameron and his films, especially his approach over the years with technology that led him to creating Avatar.  

Love Smartless. Bateman, Arnett and Hayes have great chemistry. They are really funny together. And have terrific guests. 

[Hook1997 5397]

On 12/16/2022 at 5:56 PM, Steamboat1874 said:

I will say the first one was ok but everything I have seen about this one looks like a cartoon.

Are there any actual people in this ?

It was good but not great, to me it definitely looked more cartoon like then the first which with the updated tech was surprising.  
 

Spoiler

How they are going to make two more 3-4 hour long movies and keep going with the same story of a battle between these two is kinda mind boggling.  The next one will make a lot less money than this one I bet. 

 

Edited December 24, 2022 by Hook1997

[Brandywine 1316]

On 12/18/2022 at 4:25 PM, atomheartbevo said:

He would make even more money from the furries if he did a full VR experience.

You know it’s only a matter of time and probably sooner than we think. This is the kind of movie that would work beautifully and he’s the director to make it happen. 

Edited December 24, 2022 by Brandywine

[Js1 85472]

Massive meh

[TexArcher 38000]

Just saw it.  The visuals and action sequences are spectacular.  Sure, the plot is generic and some of the dialogue is pretty cringe-worthy.  But you knew you weren't going to see The Godfather, right?  As a popcorn flick, it's pretty great.

[Js1 85472]

31 minutes ago, TexArcher said:

Just saw it.  The visuals and action sequences are spectacular.  Sure, the plot is generic and some of the dialogue is pretty cringe-worthy.  But you knew you weren't going to see The Godfather, right?  As a popcorn flick, it's pretty great.

It was indeed a “whole bag of popcorn” flick, as in, I need to eat it to stay awake bc of that plot. 

Visually it was stunning. Good camerawork too. The bioluminescence all over Pandora, the underwater scenes with the whales, all of it. So good, so great in 3D

I didn’t care for any of the characters except the outcast whale 

[RomaVicta 29961]

Sounds like a snoozer. No thanks. 

[futureman 22517]

20 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Sounds like a snoozer. No thanks. 

did you enjoy the first one?  I know it’s not a great movie but it’s definitely enjoyable, in a way that most movies are not. 

[RomaVicta 29961]

2 minutes ago, futureman said:

did you enjoy the first one?  I know it’s not a great movie but it’s definitely enjoyable, in a way that most movies are not. 

I was getting pretty tired of it before it ended. I don't know if I'm stealing this observation from someone else or it's mine to begin with, but the movie was more like an amusement park ride than an actual movie. After our first float through the natural world on that planet, that charm wasn't enough to hold me.

I do like to catch movies that are wildly popular and at least somewhat different from the mainstream. I saw the Stars Wars movies for that reason. A was glad to see Avatar for that reason, but I didn't think much of the movie. I miss the days when I could go to almost any movie and enjoy it. But once you've been through the basic stories a hundred times, you look for something fresher. I'm sure I'd love Avatar if I'd been newer to movies. 

 

[juan pantages 124]

grand theft avatar, but less believable

shit was corny, dialog abysmal, storyline/plot moronic.

 

[LonghornSean 4018]

Doing quite well at the box office, although I still kinda doubt the last two sequels (4 and 5) end up getting made.

 

[Guest]

On 12/16/2022 at 3:07 PM, crash_davis said:

I remember after the original that people were depressed after watching the movie, not because of the story line but because the 3D experience so was real that they thought it was a legit world that they wanted to live in and couldn't. I also remember Cameron criticizing the "3D" movies which came before stating they were basically shit 3D. I'm expecting this movie to be like the original, that the 3D is done so well that you are immersed in that world and will have the best fucking movie experience you will ever have.

It was nothing like any 3D experience I hadn’t had before. Very pedestrian. The movie was AWFUL. 

[atomheartbevo 89771]

6 hours ago, LonghornSean said:

Doing quite well at the box office, although I still kinda doubt the last two sequels (4 and 5) end up getting made.

Good thing that Camera accidentally made a 9-hour cut of the third sequel.....

[WhatTheBuck 28795]

9 hours ago, LonghornSean said:

Doing quite well at the box office, although I still kinda doubt the last two sequels (4 and 5) end up getting made.

 

$950 Million is a “major milestone?” $500 Million I could see. $750 Million, sure. $1 Billion, now that’s what I’d call a major milestone. Is $950 Million that much more major a milestone than $900 Million or $925 Million? Will $975 Million be an even more major milestone than $950 Million? Couldn’t every additional $1 Million in revenue on the way to grossing $1 Billion be seen as a “major milestone?”

Seems kind of arbitrary. $1 Billion will be a major milestone. $950 Million is just close but not quite there yet.

[956 Worldwide 34743]

I would be more likely to pay to watch a 3D fake nature documentary of Pandora in 3D  as opposed to the actual movie. Actually, I could see that as being awesome, I usually enjoy the world building more than the story in these movies (and post-apocalyptic movies). 

[UpperWestside 6184]

On 12/28/2022 at 1:58 AM, 956 Worldwide said:

I would be more likely to pay to watch a 3D fake nature documentary of Pandora in 3D  as opposed to the actual movie. Actually, I could see that as being awesome, I usually enjoy the world building more than the story in these movies (and post-apocalyptic movies). 

The movie itself is awesome, but yes this is another way they could monetize this. A VR world to explore combined with other things like a Pandora nature documentary would be pretty successful. I am excited to see where this technology takes movies and 3D worlds in general. This is a long way from being amazed as a child playing Super Mario for the first time.

[LonghornSean 4018]

‘Avatar 3‘ Will Introduce Some Evil Fire Na’vi, Hints James Cameron: ‘I Want to Show the Na’vi From Another Angle’

In James Cameron’s “Avatar” and “Avatar: The Way of Water,” moviegoers are introduced to two different Na’vi clans, the forest-dwelling Omaticaya and the water-dwelling Metkayina. Both tribes are peaceful and only resort to violence when their land is seized upon by humans. However, audiences might soon find out that not all Na’vi are good Na’vi. James Cameron told France’s “20 Minutes” (via Total Film) that the next installment, the still-untitled “Avatar 3,” will introduce a third clan of Pandora that shows off the Na’vi’s darker side.

Cameron said “Avatar 3” will explore “different cultures from those I have already shown. The fire will be represented by the ‘Ash People.’ I want to show the Na’vi from another angle because, so far, I have only shown their good sides.”

“In the early films, there are very negative human examples and very positive Na’vi examples,” the director continued. “In ‘Avatar 3,’ we will do the opposite. We will also explore new worlds, while continuing the story of the main characters. I can say that the last parts will be the best. The others were an introduction, a way to set the table before serving the meal.”

While the first two “Avatar” movies centered on conflicts between Na’vi tribes and humans, it appears the third movie will find Na’vi facing off against Na’vi for the first time in the franchise. Perhaps the fire tribe will turn against Jake Sully due to the destruction his presence on Pandora has caused thus far.

Cameron has already finished production on “Avatar 3,” which is scheduled to hit theaters on Dec. 20, 2024. Should the filmmaker extend the franchise all the way to “Avatar 5,” then the Na’vi will come to Earth. Producer Jon Landau revealed as much before “The Way of Water” opened in theaters.

“Well, it’s funny,” Landau told Gizmodo. “I wasn’t going to talk about it, but I’ve now subsequently heard that Jim has talked about it a little bit. In [‘Avatar 5’] there is a section of the story where we go to Earth. And we go to it to open people’s eyes, open Neytiri’s eyes, to what exists on Earth.”

“Earth is not just represented by the RDA [the franchise’s evil organization known as the Resources Development Administration],” he said. “Just like you’re defined by the choices you make in life, not all humans are bad. Not all Na’vi are good. And that’s the case here on Earth. And we want to expose Neytiri to that.”

“Avatar: The Way of Water” is now playing in theaters nationwide.

https://variety.com/2023/film/news/avatar-3-fire-navi-james-cameron-pandora-civil-war-1235477758/

[MAUFRAIS 6631]

Nice to see Mr. Peepers getting back to work in Hollywood.

[Wally Pryor 5261]

On 12/16/2022 at 2:27 PM, DanRydell said:

It dragged a bit at times but it looks spectacular and I had a good time at the theater. The last 30 minutes or so is one of the best action/war set pieces in recent memory.

Here. My kids dragged me to it. I'm glad they did. That was some incredible action work at the end. 

[AUS-97HORN 11813]

I honestly cant fathom the folks raving about this movie on this thread.

the CGI was fantastic, but otherwise the entire fucking movie's plot/ pace were god fucking awful

 

It should have been titled Avatar 2: The kids dont listen and keep fucking up, over and over, and over

All I could think of the whole time was how much it reminded me of the 2nd season of the walking dead where they told Carl to stay in the fucking house. and he did everything BUT stay in the fucking house, getting into trouble over and over.

I give it a C- and thats being generous because the CGI was so good. 

 

[UpperWestside 6184]

3 hours ago, Wally Pryor said:

Here. My kids dragged me to it. I'm glad they did. That was some incredible action work at the end. 

That whole action sequence was just intense and incredible to watch. I never cease to be amazed at the good things human beings can do. I wanted to go see it again, but the holidays were so busy that it was hard to carve out three hours for it again. It’s definitely a go see in the theatre type movie.

[bolverk 29705]

3 minutes ago, UpperWestside said:

That whole action sequence was just intense and incredible to watch. I never cease to be amazed at the good things human beings can do. I wanted to go see it again, but the holidays were so busy that it was hard to carve out three hours for it again. It’s definitely a go see in the theatre type movie.

Admittedly, I only saw it in 2D with my daughter but was too distracted by one thought to really get into the final fight scene:

Spoiler

Where the heck were all the supposed new found family and friends during all that? Sure, the space whale came up and did some damage, but did everyone else just peel off only to leave it to ma & pa plus the kids to kill off all the baddies? That question really bugged me there at the end.

 

[Js1 85472]

8 hours ago, AUS-97HORN said:

I honestly cant fathom the folks raving about this movie on this thread.

the CGI was fantastic, but otherwise the entire fucking movie's plot/ pace were god fucking awful

 

It should have been titled Avatar 2: The kids dont listen and keep fucking up, over and over, and over

All I could think of the whole time was how much it reminded me of the 2nd season of the walking dead where they told Carl to stay in the fucking house. and he did everything BUT stay in the fucking house, getting into trouble over and over.

I give it a C- and thats being generous because the CGI was so good. 

 

[Hank_Hill 18893]

Meh, I dug it. Probably helps that I’ve been snorkeling/scuba diving every 2-3 days since June and kayaked with humpbacks 2 days before seeing it, but still.

Edited January 9, 2023 by Hank_Hill

[Buzzrock 14936]

Finally took the family. It’s too long, to the point where it feels like they are just showing off, but WOW it’s amazing. The combat scenes are spectacular and this version of 3D is so much better than everything that’s come before it. It’s like being on one of those rides at Universal. Definitely worth seeing in 3D in the theater.

Yea it’s the same good guys and bad guys and plot, but it’s epic. What I wouldn’t give for an Aliens movie with that technology.

[Buzzrock 14936]

I honestly cant fathom the folks raving about this movie on this thread.
the CGI was fantastic, but otherwise the entire fucking movie's plot/ pace were god fucking awful
 
It should have been titled Avatar 2: The kids dont listen and keep fucking up, over and over, and over
All I could think of the whole time was how much it reminded me of the 2nd season of the walking dead where they told Carl to stay in the fucking house. and he did everything BUT stay in the fucking house, getting into trouble over and over.
I give it a C- and thats being generous because the CGI was so good. 
 

Do you have kids?

[ATXhorn17 1626]

IMO, they could’ve trimmed the first ~30 min of the movie and just started with the family fleeing to the island village… That said, my wife falls asleep  during 99% of movies and was engaged for the full 3.5 hrs.

The last action set piece with the whale belly flop was truly spectacular and worth the price of admission. 

[Buzzrock 14936]

It could have been trimmed for sure but the early firefight in the jungle is awesome.

[MoJames 8244]

Took the 7 and 9 year old. Enjoyed it. Great popcorn flick with fantastic visuals.

Spoiler

The most glaring issue with the story for me was the absolute vanishing act of the water people in the final confrontation. We have an epic back and forth and then all of the sudden it's Military boys vs OG Jungle avatar clan. Was odd.

 

[mdmost 43014]

We saw it last weekend and really enjoyed it. Visually stunning. The making of is pretty interesting as the underwater action is largely done underwater with stunt people or the actors with some sort of breathing apparatus that barely covers their noses. One thing I could do without, the constant need for the kids to call each other "bro" or "cousin". Looking forward to the 3rd one where he makes the Na'vi have some evil tribes. He's really going through the different facets of indigenous people. So I guess the Fire people will be like Comanches or Apaches. 

['stache 21827]

Wife is making us watch this for Mother’s Day. Halfway through this nightmare. I won’t complain to her but this is one of the stupidest things I’ve ever watched. The characters, plots, everything is so cheesy it has to be intentional. I’d rather watch an Attenborough documentary for the visuals, of real natural wonders. These soldiers, my god, it’s like Mel Brooks mocking the genre but I guess it’s real? Make it stop!

Edited May 14, 2023 by 'stache

[Parliament 14280]

delete

Edited May 14, 2023 by Parliament