NFL Black Monday Thread/Coaching Carousel

[Brothahorn 10085]

3 hours ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

Matt Nagy, Doug Pederson, Brad Childress, and Marty Morhinweg were all OCs under Andy Reid and none had play calling duties yet they all became HCs with nary a mention of their lack of play calling duties under Reid.
 

 

Fair point. There has to but more to it than just race though. He has been passed over by way too many teams. And, if what someone posted above about the Chiefs not wanting him if Reid left that's saying something. Hard to believe some gang rumors from college are what's holding him back.

 

But now we get a chance to see just how good he is. Washington has a young, talented QB and a decent receiver. With that Defense, they can sneak into the playoffs. 

 

This kind of reminds me of the Sherm Lewis situation,

[Texzilla58 4716]

Just check the Bieniemy past baggage file, and watch several videos of him in detailed conversations.   It's not hard to see why NFL teams won't hire the guy to lead their teams. 
He's not cut out to be a successful NFL Head Coach.
 

I agree with this. Bienemy is a totally media made manufactured HC candidate. His adherents skip over his negatives especially his past DV issues.

I do think playcalling is overrated for a HC. Hire good coordinators to call plays. I want my HC managing the game and the team.

[closetohumping 17386]

3 hours ago, Texzilla58 said:

I agree with this. Bienemy is a totally media made manufactured HC candidate. His adherents skip over his negatives especially his past DV issues.

I do think playcalling is overrated for a HC. Hire good coordinators to call plays. I want my HC managing the game and the team.

Honestly I don’t want a hc who is a great play caller.  Organizational skills is more important.    
 

I don’t really understand the bienemy deal but racism is probably not the first thing I’d point to.  It’s not too late at 53.   I think fangio was like 62  when denver gave him his job

[Slacks 6791]

When was Bienemy's DV stuff?

 

[Texzilla58 4716]

In todays environment it doesn’t really matter. And yes the league is full of hypocrisy about lowlifes, women beaters, thugs, gangsters. But they look at players different than head coaches.

I find it weird that after 16 interviews he hasn’t gotten a gig. Playcalling is easy to deflect. I don’t know what his issue is.

[Vertigo 20265]

13 minutes ago, Texzilla58 said:

In todays environment it doesn’t really matter. And yes the league is full of hypocrisy about lowlifes, women beaters, thugs, gangsters. But they look at players different than head coaches.

I find it weird that after 16 interviews he hasn’t gotten a gig. Playcalling is easy to deflect. I don’t know what his issue is.

He has also been rumored to be a bit of a loose cannon/hothead in the facilities. That is coming from 5th hand information, so take it for what it is worth. 

[TexasTroll 454]

2 hours ago, Vertigo said:

He has also been rumored to be a bit of a loose cannon/hothead in the facilities. That is coming from 5th hand information, so take it for what it is worth. 

I heard from a 5th cousin on my mothers side  it’s worth about tree fity

[Slacks 6791]

On 2/17/2023 at 3:51 PM, Texzilla58 said:

Bienemy should go coach college for a few years. Can he be a head coach? Adam Gase, Nathaniel Hackett, and Joe Judge were picked by teams he interviewed with. He has interviewed 16 times for 15 teams. I can’t believe anyone could interview wise than any of those three.

Going to a shitbird team like the skins has high risk. Rivera could be fired. Has no QB. Crazy shitbag owner.

Look at it this way, being black is clearly not the only reason, but it is on the list. I go through it regularly. I interview a lot and have had a lot of success, but there aren't a lot of people who look like me that do what I do, so I have to impress everyone in the room more than other people interviewing do, because no matter how good I may be, there will always be questions about whether I will fit the culture, will the people who don't look like me accept being led by me, will my peers feel 'threatened' by me, etc. I usually get an offer to start lower in the org and work my way up, followed by some BS excuse later when I've pulled magic out of my ass... I finally got to the point where I know some people who know some people and can advocate.

Yes, if EB were white, he would have had a chance to be a HC by now. Look at the league of shitty coaches and cheaters that get jobs every year. EB doesn't even get a chance to fail... And it's not because of some shit he did over 30 years ago, or he wouldnt be an OC.

He clearly interviews poorly AND he doesn't fit the personal culture of the owners by sight or any other affiliation.

Edited February 19, 2023 by Slacks
Bad swypes

[Slacks 6791]

23 hours ago, Vertigo said:

He has also been rumored to be a bit of a loose cannon/hothead in the facilities. That is coming from 5th hand information, so take it for what it is worth. 

Bill O'Brien

Urban Myer

Rex Ryan

Anybody in the 80s and 90s

 

 

[Sawbonz 27392]

2 hours ago, Slacks said:

Look at it this way, being black is clearly not the only reason, but it is on the list. I go through it regularly. I interview a lot and have had a lot of success, but there aren't a lot of people who look like me that do what I do, so I have to impress everyone in the room more than other people interviewing do, because no matter how good I may be, there will always be questions about whether I will fit the culture, will the people who don't look like me accept being led by me, will my peers feel 'threatened' by me, etc. I usually get an offer to start lower in the org and work my way up, followed by some BS excuse later when I've pulled magic out of my ass... I finally got to the point where I know some people who know some people and can advocate.

Yes, if EB were white, he would have had a chance to be a HC by now. Look at the league of shitty coaches and cheaters that get jobs every year. EB doesn't even get a chance to fail... And it's not because of some shit he did over 30 years ago, or he wouldnt be an OC.

He clearly interviews poorly AND he doesn't fit the personal culture of the owners by sight or any other affiliation.

Username checks out 

[cmontexas 3248]

Instead of focusing our attention soley on Bienemy, lets raise awareness of and promote other rising black NFL assistants with potential to become head coaches.

Ejiro Evero- did a nice job with Denver D last year

Aaron Glenn- Lions DC

Kelvin Sheppard- Lions lb coach was a smart player and is a great speaker

Aden Durde- Cowboys DL coach reverse Ted Lasso

Teryl Austin- Steelers DC

[PilotsError 2281]

He speaks so well!

[JOSEYWALES66 1790]

2 hours ago, cmontexas said:

Instead of focusing our attention soley on Bienemy, lets raise awareness of and promote other rising black NFL assistants with potential to become head coaches.

Ejiro Evero- did a nice job with Denver D last year

Aaron Glenn- Lions DC

Kelvin Sheppard- Lions lb coach was a smart player and is a great speaker

Aden Durde- Cowboys DL coach reverse Ted Lasso

Teryl Austin- Steelers DC

Wasn’t Teryl Austin the one that Brown was thinking about hiring at one time for DC? 

[Slacks 6791]

3 hours ago, cmontexas said:

Instead of focusing our attention soley on Bienemy, lets raise awareness of and promote other rising black NFL assistants with potential to become head coaches.

Ejiro Evero- did a nice job with Denver D last year

Aaron Glenn- Lions DC

Kelvin Sheppard- Lions lb coach was a smart player and is a great speaker

Aden Durde- Cowboys DL coach reverse Ted Lasso

Teryl Austin- Steelers DC

I'm guessing Aaron will get a job in 2024 and will probably take Sheppard as DC.

[TonyTexas 10481]

21 minutes ago, Slacks said:

I'm guessing Aaron will get a job in 2024 and will probably take Sheppard as DC.

Why is Glenn a hot coach?  Detroit’s defense has been awful in the two years he’s been DC?

[927 E. 41st 1124]

Sorry Slacks, but I'm going to disagree with you, slightly. If he is a bad interview, he may never get a HC job and it's really nothing more than that. It's not reasonable to expect to ever be the face of a billion dollar operation if you can't make it through an interview with the people who will be your bosses. 

A couple of side stories, one of my buddies asked me to meet a woman that was interviewing for a job where I worked. Foreign language skills were such a plus that you would almost be a shoe-in if you were a half decent speaker. She knew French. So I meet her for lunch and I'm giving out some pointers that the interviewer will likely be looking for as well as what I know about the job and the company. At one point I ask a question about how she was preparing for the interview, she responds with "Oh, I don't want to be over prepared". I tried to be as helpful as I could, maybe I should have said what I was thinking. "I DON"T KNOW WHAT OVER PREPARED IS!" But I didn't and I doubt it would have helped. She wasn't over prepared. All I heard back was that she didn't get the job.

 A while back, a guy comes in to interview with us where I work. No suit, wrinkled shirt, unshaven, missing some documents that he was supposed to bring. Still had an attitude, something like -I'm so qualified/deserving that NOTHING else matters and I'm a shoe-in. Claims that his suits/documents were in his car that got flooded down in Houston (reasonable, since the flooding was recent). Still no reason you couldn't shave, iron your shirt and drop the attitude. I can't remember what the starting pay was, but it pays $200- $300K by year three, live anywhere you want, 12-18 days off a month, pretty sweet deal. Yeah, he didn't make it either despite the company being desperate to fill the position. 

Probably too Freudian, but if you aren't willing to do everything within your power to show well in an interview, deep down you don't want the job or doubt your abilities and it's best for everyone involved that you don't get hired.

[Deej 76524]

Maybe he just needs a translator in his interviews?

 

 

 

 

Edited February 20, 2023 by Deej

[Slacks 6791]

2 hours ago, TonyTexas said:

Why is Glenn a hot coach?  Detroit’s defense has been awful in the two years he’s been DC?

Their talent has been non existent for how long 

I guess it's because he knows defense and can get players to play? I know he's relatable.

[Slacks 6791]

31 minutes ago, 927 E. 41st said:

Sorry Slacks, but I'm going to disagree with you, slightly. If he is a bad interview, he may never get a HC job and it's really nothing more than that. It's not reasonable to expect to ever be the face of a billion dollar operation if you can't make it through an interview with the people who will be your bosses. 

A couple of side stories, one of my buddies asked me to meet a woman that was interviewing for a job where I worked. Foreign language skills were such a plus that you would almost be a shoe-in if you were a half decent speaker. She knew French. So I meet her for lunch and I'm giving out some pointers that the interviewer will likely be looking for as well as what I know about the job and the company. At one point I ask a question about how she was preparing for the interview, she responds with "Oh, I don't want to be over prepared". I tried to be as helpful as I could, maybe I should have said what I was thinking. "I DON"T KNOW WHAT OVER PREPARED IS!" But I didn't and I doubt it would have helped. She wasn't over prepared. All I heard back was that she didn't get the job.

 A while back, a guy comes in to interview with us where I work. No suit, wrinkled shirt, unshaven, missing some documents that he was supposed to bring. Still had an attitude, something like -I'm so qualified/deserving that NOTHING else matters and I'm a shoe-in. Claims that his suits/documents were in his car that got flooded down in Houston (reasonable, since the flooding was recent). Still no reason you couldn't shave, iron your shirt and drop the attitude. I can't remember what the starting pay was, but it pays $200- $300K by year three, live anywhere you want, 12-18 days off a month, pretty sweet deal. Yeah, he didn't make it either despite the company being desperate to fill the position. 

Probably too Freudian, but if you aren't willing to do everything within your power to show well in an interview, deep down you don't want the job or doubt your abilities and it's best for everyone involved that you don't get hired.

So... He's a coordinator, maybe a position coach?

What if he can oach his ass off and win championships?

Owner: "Nah, this other guy can get us 9 wins a season and really good press conference."

There are a bunch of Coordinators that keep getting HC jobs. They suck at words and football. I mean, Frank Reich has done dick (that Eagles SB win was Pedereon, right?)  He doesn't sound like a super genius maybe he is. His entire checking career has sucked ass, other than one magical year, but he keeps getting jobs.

Eric Bienemy has to be a REALLY BAD interview. He must be showing up unprepared with wrinkled pants and have no access to a mentor to talk to for years.

There's something else going on. I don't question that. So he has two (or more) strikes.

 

I think we all agree, it's not about coaching offense. It's something else, and we can't rule out the obvious.

[927 E. 41st 1124]

59 minutes ago, Slacks said:

Eric Bienemy has to be a REALLY BAD interview.

You just have to be worse than one other option every time.

[Sawbonz 27392]

4 minutes ago, 927 E. 41st said:

You just have to be worse than one other option every time.

Josh fucking McDaniels. Bienemy could literally shit himself during the interview and be a better option than that guy

 

 

[Had Enough 2056]

Frank Reich is 40-33-1 with 2 10 win seasons out of 5 for a franchise with an odd owner that also lost their franchise QB for a premature retirement. He had prior experience with the Colts and won as many Super Bowls as OC as EB prior to this year. And his was won with Nick Foles.

There are lots of odd hires, but Reich is down the list of those. I’m not overly inclined to hire a Pats assistant, but those guys get looks because of the desire to get some of that Patriots magic. The Bill Walsh coaching tree has seemingly lived forever. That tree flowed through the Packers and still lives today.

EB has been a RBs coach and non-play calling OC for his career. Based on what I can tell, Mike Kafka and Nagy were the QB coach for many of the years he was OC. That type of experience really doesn’t scream head coach. So you really better come off pretty damn well in an interview.

Nagys failure as a head coach and with largely only Andy Reid to vouch for EB are drawbacks. Id assume that Reid is not exactly hands off in game planning and play development so yeah you have to question the true impact of EB.

I’d agree with Texzilla in that organizational skills/game management type stuff is more important than offensive and defensive play calling for a head guy. Yet owners/GMs still hit up OCs/DCs to be that guy.

If EB wants to be head coach, then OC with play calling duties was the next step. I don’t see any mention of him developing Mahomes so there really are quite a few big questions about what he brings to the table. Hes only coached for two NFL teams. His only position that he coached is perhaps the least technical position. Then his OC role is a bit of an unknown as to his impact.

[Texzilla58 4716]

Instead of focusing our attention soley on Bienemy, lets raise awareness of and promote other rising black NFL assistants with potential to become head coaches.
Ejiro Evero- did a nice job with Denver D last year
Aaron Glenn- Lions DC
Kelvin Sheppard- Lions lb coach was a smart player and is a great speaker
Aden Durde- Cowboys DL coach reverse Ted Lasso
Teryl Austin- Steelers DC

I really expected Leslee Frasier and Raheem Morris to get HC gigs this season. And Steve Wilks should have got Carolina. His players got behind him after they fired Ruhle.

[Slacks 6791]

6 hours ago, Had Enough said:

Frank Reich is 40-33-1 with 2 10 win seasons out of 5 for a franchise with an odd owner that also lost their franchise QB for a premature retirement. He had prior experience with the Colts and won as many Super Bowls as OC as EB prior to this year. And his was won with Nick Foles.

There are lots of odd hires, but Reich is down the list of those. I’m not overly inclined to hire a Pats assistant, but those guys get looks because of the desire to get some of that Patriots magic. The Bill Walsh coaching tree has seemingly lived forever. That tree flowed through the Packers and still lives today.

EB has been a RBs coach and non-play calling OC for his career. Based on what I can tell, Mike Kafka and Nagy were the QB coach for many of the years he was OC. That type of experience really doesn’t scream head coach. So you really better come off pretty damn well in an interview.

Nagys failure as a head coach and with largely only Andy Reid to vouch for EB are drawbacks. Id assume that Reid is not exactly hands off in game planning and play development so yeah you have to question the true impact of EB.

I’d agree with Texzilla in that organizational skills/game management type stuff is more important than offensive and defensive play calling for a head guy. Yet owners/GMs still hit up OCs/DCs to be that guy.

If EB wants to be head coach, then OC with play calling duties was the next step. I don’t see any mention of him developing Mahomes so there really are quite a few big questions about what he brings to the table. Hes only coached for two NFL teams. His only position that he coached is perhaps the least technical position. Then his OC role is a bit of an unknown as to his impact.

Frank Reich was good with a generational QB and a shitty division. I do think he can coach, but he hasn't really proven anything that says he should be given a job after failing.  The Eagles SB was Pederson's offense just like EB got his SBs with Reid. Foles was great during that playoff run.

But I think we're making the same point from different angles. If Frank Reich were Andy Reid's OC, he'd have a job and nobody would care that he wasn't the primary playcaller.

Ive never met Bienemy. Maybe he's not 'well spoken'. Maybe he can't coach offense. I suppose we'll find out when he's coaching Taylor Heinecke and whatever scrap heap QB they can come up with this year.

 

[Vertigo 20265]

7 hours ago, Texzilla58 said:

I really expected Leslee Frasier and Raheem Morris to get HC gigs this season. And Steve Wilks should have got Carolina. His players got behind him after they fired Ruhle.

Leslie Frazier is 21-32 as a Head Coach

Raheem Morris is 17-31 as a Head Coach

What screams to you that a team will be eager to hire them again? At some point, a record needs to stand on it's own regardless of circumstance. 

[Brothahorn 10085]

For the last two seasons EB was on a one year contract. Almost like they were trying to make him leave. I understand not standing in his way if a better job comes along. But damn if he was as valuable as Reid claims, wouldn't he want to keep EB around for as long as possible? Is there some kind of time limit on how long a guy can be an OC? Seems Reid is saying one thing while his actions say something totally different? Maybe some weird shit was happening behind the scenes.

And now Matt Nagy is coming back to be OC. Of course, after they fulfill their Rooney obligations. Leaving was definitely the right and only decision to make.

[closetohumping 17386]

5 hours ago, Brothahorn said:

For the last two seasons EB was on a one year contract. Almost like they were trying to make him leave. I understand not standing in his way if a better job comes along. But damn if he was as valuable as Reid claims, wouldn't he want to keep EB around for as long as possible? Is there some kind of time limit on how long a guy can be an OC? Seems Reid is saying one thing while his actions say something totally different? Maybe some weird shit was happening behind the scenes.

And now Matt Nagy is coming back to be OC. Of course, after they fulfill their Rooney obligations. Leaving was definitely the right and only decision to make.

Matt Nagy is rumored to be Andy’s successor.  What does that say about what they think of Eric?

[Pam Cummings 9560]

Andy Reid isn't retiring any time soon.

[Had Enough 2056]

I’m not saying Nagys great, but check out his resume. He was 34-31 as a head coach. The Bears won 3 fewer games after he was gone. He was quality control coach then QB coach then OC. All with Reid. I’d expect that transition to OC from QB coach. That’s a somewhat natural progression to then head coach. I don’t know that he ever called plays though.

He’s pretty loyal to Reid and vice versa. He returned as QB coach this past year so the natural progression was for him to return to the OC job once EB left. And honestly that stint with the Bears has some justification to say he’s worth a shot again as a head coach.

In the last 15 years, the Bears have been to the playoffs 3 times - twice under Nagy. They’ve only won the division twice - 1 under Nagy. He led them to their 2nd best record in the last 20 years.

They haven’t had a reliable QB in who knows how long. Outside of the Ditka years, they aren’t well run. Before he arrived, they hadn’t won the division in 20 years. Nothing about the org says long-term success.

Nagy probably gets another shot and people will shit themselves. I’ll just have a hard time finding issue with a guy with a record above .500 getting a second chance.

[Catdaddyhorn 3444]

11 hours ago, Slacks said:

Frank Reich was good with a generational QB and a shitty division. I do think he can coach, but he hasn't really proven anything that says he should be given a job after failing.  The Eagles SB was Pederson's offense just like EB got his SBs with Reid. Foles was great during that playoff run.

But I think we're making the same point from different angles. If Frank Reich were Andy Reid's OC, he'd have a job and nobody would care that he wasn't the primary playcaller.

Ive never met Bienemy. Maybe he's not 'well spoken'. Maybe he can't coach offense. I suppose we'll find out when he's coaching Taylor Heinecke and whatever scrap heap QB they can come up with this year.

 

Again none of Andy Reid's other OCs have ever had playcalling duties yet the issue literally never came up when they were interviewing for jobs.  This shit really isn't that hard guys. 

[Catdaddyhorn 3444]

10 hours ago, Vertigo said:

Leslie Frazier is 21-32 as a Head Coach

Raheem Morris is 17-31 as a Head Coach

What screams to you that a team will be eager to hire them again? At some point, a record needs to stand on it's own regardless of circumstance. 

Probably the same thing that makes Josh McDaniels a hot commodity every year he's ever becen an assistant.  I mean he took a promising Broncos job and quickly traded away their 2 best players to draft Tim Tebow. Then he backed up that genius decision making to take a Raiders team coming off of a playoff year and promptly started them off 2-7 after trading for one of the best two or three WRs in the game.  

[Had Enough 2056]

Again none of Andy Reid's other OCs have ever had playcalling duties yet the issue literally never came up when they were interviewing for jobs.  This shit really isn't that hard guys. 

Look at their resumes. There’s probably multiple reasons EB doesn’t have a head job.

I’ve read on this very site that RB coaches are not your best coaches. That is what EB has coached. And then he stepped into an OC role for a team led by Reid that won 33 games the prior 3 years. Probably has nothing to do with EB, but Adrian Peterson got 2100 two years after BE left. He was the “assistant head coach offense” for 1 year. The Vikings went 6-10 and then he was gone.

Pederson and Nagy both coached in more, different roles. Both were QB coaches - probably a more significant role than RB coach.

I didn’t really know the full backgrounds of these dudes but looked up the last two years hires for head coaches. EBs resume from how it looks on paper is the weakest.

Hell, I don’t remember any of the others even having RB coach on their resume. That simply is not the path to head coach. You’ve got some with scouting, some with QC work, some coaching multiple positions

If he’s a sorry interview, the resume and experience aren’t enough to get the job. He hasn’t called plays, he hasn’t developed anyone as best as I can tell, he hasn’t installed his offense, he hasn’t shown thru experience to develop in other key areas.

[Texzilla58 4716]

There was discussion about EB today on the radio. Shady McCoy believes he will fail in DC.

EB is not an active OC. Reid runs the offensive meetings. He’s a glorified RB coach which has little to do with the rest of the offense. The big knock on him also is from players; he just rides them and dogcusses them constantly. I think we’ll see him sink or swim.

[Slacks 6791]

On 2/20/2023 at 5:55 PM, Had Enough said:

I’m not saying Nagys great, but check out his resume. He was 34-31 as a head coach. The Bears won 3 fewer games after he was gone. He was quality control coach then QB coach then OC. All with Reid. I’d expect that transition to OC from QB coach. That’s a somewhat natural progression to then head coach. I don’t know that he ever called plays though.

He’s pretty loyal to Reid and vice versa. He returned as QB coach this past year so the natural progression was for him to return to the OC job once EB left. And honestly that stint with the Bears has some justification to say he’s worth a shot again as a head coach.

In the last 15 years, the Bears have been to the playoffs 3 times - twice under Nagy. They’ve only won the division twice - 1 under Nagy. He led them to their 2nd best record in the last 20 years.

They haven’t had a reliable QB in who knows how long. Outside of the Ditka years, they aren’t well run. Before he arrived, they hadn’t won the division in 20 years. Nothing about the org says long-term success.

Nagy probably gets another shot and people will shit themselves. I’ll just have a hard time finding issue with a guy with a record above .500 getting a second chance.

Haven't won the division in 20 years, but they made it to the Superbowl with Rex Grossman.  Lovie Smith is an offensive guru.

[Slacks 6791]

53 minutes ago, Texzilla58 said:

There was discussion about EB today on the radio. Shady McCoy believes he will fail in DC.

EB is not an active OC. Reid runs the offensive meetings. He’s a glorified RB coach which has little to do with the rest of the offense. The big knock on him also is from players; he just rides them and dogcusses them constantly. I think we’ll see him sink or swim.

Hmmm... I know a guy that knows some guys... I should enquire.

[Had Enough 2056]

Haven't won the division in 20 years, but they made it to the Superbowl with Rex Grossman.  Lovie Smith is an offensive guru.

Yeah Lovie did a very good job. He was the last to lead them to the division title. They were probably more stagnant than necessarily needing to move on.

And when I say not well run, I’m referring to the front office as I’m not sure they did a great job for Lovie. As you said Grossman.

[closetohumping 17386]

Is Reid actually not recommending EB? Maybe he says nice things in public but behind the scenes who knows…..