Joe Biden 2023: The Dark Brandon Rises

[Js1 85095]

No, it’s still 67 to convict. Removal is a consequence of a conviction. Trump was technically not convicted, just impeached. 

You can’t just make things up for your fantasy. A GOP senate would likely stall Biden’s agenda regardless of how many votes there are to convict. They don’t need to tout a non conviction to stall his agenda 

Edited September 12, 2023 by Js1

[hobbes2702 12799]

12 hours ago, Fastbreak said:

After thinking about it, I am admitting defeat. Biden basically has to keep it together for another 14 months. He is the only hope right now. Maybe we should go with a different VP however. Maybe Buttigieg?

Maybe you should shut the fuck up

[Js1 85095]

1 minute ago, cactusflinthead said:

Y'all keep overlooking the number one driver for voters today. You don't vote for someone. You vote against someone. Women are pissed off. Look at what is happening in Wisconsin. They just elected a progressive woman to their Supremes and the Rs are so livid that they want to impeach her. That's going to go over like a fart in church. The burbs are trending away from the Rs in those swing states. 

Look, even Bern is behind Joe pushing the wagon. Michael Moore too now?

Yeah, I like my chances with Joe.

 

Dems remain motivated and continue to win the persuasion. Haven’t slowed down. Abortion isn’t going away and the GOP continues to try it pass draconian measures against abortion.  

[YGIFS 19449]

I'm saying it gives them the political cover to appear to be fighting for MAGA nation while shedding Trump and rebuilding the brand.  They need some hollow wins in order to do that unless Trump conveniently dies in the next few years.  Which is still possible, obviously.  But if the rigor of 2024, between 4 trials, grifting, primary stops, and just being a generally obese 77 year old piece of shit doesn't kill him.  I could see him living to be 90 just 'cause.  This is their hole card.  They'll find a way to fuck it up, but the Democrats will find a way to fuck it up too.  

[hobbes2702 12799]

19 minutes ago, YGIFS said:

Consider another possibility.  Trump can't win in 2024 against even the most hobbled version of Biden.  They know Biden won't be removed from office, even if by some miracle they corral enough House votes for impeachment...it dies in the Trial by Senate. 

Biden wins in 2024, but Republicans by throwing red meat to a few key districts in the House, maintain their slim margin.  And like it or not Democrats on this forum, Class I favors the GOP this time around.  Not by much, but probably something like a 52-48/51-49 margin.  The idea is to let Trump burn himself down, keep the House and simple geographic chronography to take the Senate.  A year into Biden's second term, take out Joe's legs with an Impeachment and Senatorial Conviction.  Hobble the Democrats for 3 years while the Republican Party refashions itself as Donald Trump likely fades into a prison cell, a grave, or a long term care facility.  

It's a longshot, but it's about their only shot left.  Really bad news is a lotta people are gonna die along the way.  

 

[cactusflinthead 27594]

They have a big bag of nothing 

[hobbes2702 12799]

2 minutes ago, cactusflinthead said:

They have a big bag of nothing 

So it’s really still supposed to be about Burisma? We are back to this? That’s all they have?

”you couldn’t afford the houses the Biden’s have on a senators salary!”. Yea guy that’s how money works.

[Snake Diggity 4614]

45 minutes ago, MC Fresh Breath said:

https://apnews.com/article/hunter-biden-congress-oversight-republicans-impeachment-57c5b1b40d19ede4ecf7fde08c027cee

McCarthy clearly has seen enough evidence that he is confident we will see President Kamala Harris take office sometime next year.

[henrygandorf 29174]

26 minutes ago, YGIFS said:

Consider another possibility.  Trump can't win in 2024 against even the most hobbled version of Biden.  They know Biden won't be removed from office, even if by some miracle they corral enough House votes for impeachment...it dies in the Trial by Senate. 

uh...

 

19 minutes ago, Js1 said:

McCarthy didn’t even put an inquiry for a vote because he doesn’t have 218 for that. He just rolled the various committee inquiries into a full House impeachment inquiry 

yeah. 

11 days ago he said any impeachment inquiry would go to the floor for a vote.  he doesn't have the votes.  the circus clowns are cashing in their chits.

[henrygandorf 29174]

11 minutes ago, YGIFS said:

I'm saying it gives them the political cover to appear to be fighting for MAGA nation while shedding Trump and rebuilding the brand. 

they don't care about trump.  they need trump's voters.  they're fucked until he dies and then they're still fucked but maybe 10-15% not as fucked.  those people will never vote again.

[YGIFS 19449]

Agreed.  Why I said, "fighting for MAGA nation while shedding Trump."  They need a portion of them going forward.  Keeping them engaged is going be a tightwire act, but one they need to perform.  There's no maths without a chunk of that 25mm that only came out of the woodwork because of the Drogin/Cambridge/Bannon playbook.  

[atomheartbevo 89409]

20 minutes ago, henrygandorf said:

they don't care about trump.  they need trump's voters.  they're fucked until he dies and then they're still fucked but maybe 10-15% not as fucked.  those people will never vote again.

18 minutes ago, YGIFS said:

Agreed.  Why I said, "fighting for MAGA nation while shedding Trump."  They need a portion of them going forward.  Keeping them engaged is going be a tightwire act, but one they need to perform.  There's no maths without a chunk of that 25mm that only came out of the woodwork because of the Drogin/Cambridge/Bannon playbook.  

And given how many didn't bother showing up prior to 2016 for whatever reason, and then only showed up in 2016, and more that didn't vote in 2016 but that Trump got out in 2020, that's a decent chunk of people that the GQP needs in 2024 and 2026. If Trump is not on that ticket, they are fucked.

And plenty of MAGA will either stay home or maybe even show up and vote against any Republican that they think didn't properly fellate support Trump.

 

 

Edited September 12, 2023 by atomheartbevo

[Js1 85095]

 

 

[atomheartbevo 89409]

11 minutes ago, henrygandorf said:

11 days ago he said any impeachment inquiry would go to the floor for a vote.  he doesn't have the votes.  the circus clowns are cashing in their chits.

If I had to guess, somebody told him he would be challenged very soon for the Speaker's chair if he didn't do something.

Went back on his word that there would be a floor vote, and is going to do this instead, which as per the info above, the inquiries are invalid without a floor vote.

And whoever is trying to force his hand is going to be furious (probably didn't realize that the inquiry would be invalid without a floor vote) and probably challenge him for the Speakership anyways.

I'm guessing the Freedom Caucus is pressuring him.

[HenryJames 65887]

 

[DixonHur 11171]

15 minutes ago, Js1 said:

 

 

There's always a Tweet

[NAVY 6738]

Like Kevin is soooo honorable. He would never do something hypocritical 

please 

[wildcat09 29226]

This is almost impossibly stupid and is going to backfire on them spectacularly. They really have run every single halfway decent political strategist out of the party.

[cactusflinthead 27594]

 

[Js1 85095]

13 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

This is almost impossibly stupid and is going to backfire on them spectacularly. They really have run every single halfway decent political strategist out of the party.

Between Trump and Gaetz/MTG and the rest of the Freedumb Cuntcus, Kevin had to do it or he’d be out of his speakership by Friday 

[wildcat09 29226]

Just now, Js1 said:

Between Trump and Gaetz/MTG and the rest of the Freedumb Cuntcus, Kevin had to do it or he’d be out of his speakership by Friday 

Yeah, this is Trump pulling the strings. It’s just that it’s incredibly stupid and is going to hurt them all and Biden will come out of it looking better.

[henrygandorf 29174]

 

[babysdaddy 2718]

[henrygandorf 29174]

21 minutes ago, babysdaddy said:

 

not running for reelection would also risk undoing his greatest achievement - which would be stopping donald trump.

that article makes it seem like we're not sure who the gop candidate will be.  hard to trust opinion pieces like that.

[hornmpa96 2598]

1 hour ago, wildcat09 said:

Yeah, this is Trump pulling the strings. It’s just that it’s incredibly stupid and is going to hurt them all and Biden will come out of it looking better.

Of course it’s Trump - He really is the idoit in charge of the Republican Party. Everything he touches turns to shit. McCarthy goes along to keep his speakership for a few more months. 

[Js1 85095]

6 minutes ago, henrygandorf said:

not running for reelection would also risk undoing his greatest achievement - which would be stopping donald trump.

that article makes it seem like we're not sure who the gop candidate will be.  hard to trust opinion pieces like that.

Opinions are like assholes - everyone has one. Again, no serious challenger has emerged or even wants to take on Biden. 

[YGIFS 19449]

26 minutes ago, babysdaddy said:

 

There was a great character actor named Sam Shepard.  Sadly, he passed a few years ago but left behind a wonderful tapestry of meaty roles.  I followed his career because, despite our age difference, we had similar childhoods not too far from another in the Chicagoland area.  And he often passed, as I do, as a Native Texan.  

One such role was that of Major General, William Garrison, in a fantastic and moving film called "Black Hawk Down."  Shepard only has a few scenes in the overall movie, but in each scene...you can feel his desire to eradicate the evil in Somalia with every ounce of his being.  From motivational speeches, to tactical planning, to real time intel, to being completely lost as to what to do that he just starts mopping up blood in the infirmary.  MG Garrison was the same way in real life.  Helps that Shepard and Joe Biden kinda look alike in real life, stinks that Sam won't be around to play Joe in the inevitable biopic.  

Point is Garrison pinned his ears back, took care of his people, and relentlessly pursued the end of his enemy.  He accepted blame for the failures, but eventually got his man-Aidid.  And when Aidid was gone, Garrison retired the very next day.  Biden is not the ideal President, and certainly not the ideal candidate.  But he is here to doggedly run down Trump again and again and again.  And only when Trump has lost again, or is imprisoned, or is hopefully dead can Joe rest.  The nation can finally take a breath that we much deserve.  Until that day, however, Joe stands the watch much like MG Garrison.  And we will do all we can to drive Trump and his backwards fucking movement into the fucking ground.  Joe's greatest achievement is yet to come.  And that's saying something since he's also quietly defeating Russia with our Freshmen B-team equipment.  

I would honestly not be surprised to learn that when Trump dies or goes to jail, Biden collapses the very next day.  I will too, out of gratitude.  Of all the sentries standing all the posts in all the world.  I pray to Christ himself that Trump never has anything to do with any of them ever again.  May he forgive those of you who enabled him in the first place.  

[jimmyjazz 45546]

"self-gelding" is the phrase of the year.  Damn.

[StassneyHorn 6536]

CPI tomorrow. Bright and early. Core expected to drop. Expected to see increases in yoy however cause none of you rollerblade for your commute to work.

[ohchaucer 1443]

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/13/us/politics/trump-gop-biden-impeachment.html?unlocked_article_code=CYQjcjvJ9P-xsWOwU7XFvWYF7xaJ0D8xX_VsmwyeTU6Db3a_XDbIrXD4FFpIRSlDmXrAbtfpl-U_RE23SGOZNTObZvz4rAHZRbc84y3pmyGP_L73YpfLy4E1PvhM0PqlF6Z-L0RQUNbOyAQTJ6GAL0ODwoQ_QAVctkQ4n8K-tX1iFGF6I3AKYpdEhfpgle7gccBzozttIS3_7n8zHIX6nmysuTwsbRySpelHybPlFWad_3da6TQs9z84JVefuQI2nREGuII6JuGcKZBGfxqIto27eehEjslcrJ_jJZFs2P_Vqq7OesBb4aA29snM-0t5X0XKbJSuGdF81mp8SUMs_DwP6t2GK9i1iQ&smid=url-share

Dinner with MTG Sunday. McCarthy announcement Tuesday. Clowns.

[Biff Tannen 45491]

8 hours ago, StassneyHorn said:

CPI tomorrow. Bright and early. Core expected to drop. Expected to see increases in yoy however cause none of you rollerblade for your commute to work.

+3.7

[GreenspointTexas 9559]

10 hours ago, YGIFS said:

There was a great character actor named Sam Shepard.  Sadly, he passed a few years ago but left behind a wonderful tapestry of meaty roles.  I followed his career because, despite our age difference, we had similar childhoods not too far from another in the Chicagoland area.  And he often passed, as I do, as a Native Texan.  

One such role was that of Major General, William Garrison, in a fantastic and moving film called "Black Hawk Down."  Shepard only has a few scenes in the overall movie, but in each scene...you can feel his desire to eradicate the evil in Somalia with every ounce of his being.  From motivational speeches, to tactical planning, to real time intel, to being completely lost as to what to do that he just starts mopping up blood in the infirmary.  MG Garrison was the same way in real life.  Helps that Shepard and Joe Biden kinda look alike in real life, stinks that Sam won't be around to play Joe in the inevitable biopic.  

Point is Garrison pinned his ears back, took care of his people, and relentlessly pursued the end of his enemy.  He accepted blame for the failures, but eventually got his man-Aidid.  And when Aidid was gone, Garrison retired the very next day.  Biden is not the ideal President, and certainly not the ideal candidate.  But he is here to doggedly run down Trump again and again and again.  And only when Trump has lost again, or is imprisoned, or is hopefully dead can Joe rest.  The nation can finally take a breath that we much deserve.  Until that day, however, Joe stands the watch much like MG Garrison.  And we will do all we can to drive Trump and his backwards fucking movement into the fucking ground.  Joe's greatest achievement is yet to come.  And that's saying something since he's also quietly defeating Russia with our Freshmen B-team equipment.  

I would honestly not be surprised to learn that when Trump dies or goes to jail, Biden collapses the very next day.  I will too, out of gratitude.  Of all the sentries standing all the posts in all the world.  I pray to Christ himself that Trump never has anything to do with any of them ever again.  May he forgive those of you who enabled him in the first place.  

And Garrison was a grad of UT RGV as well

/csb

[YGIFS 19449]

that is a csb.  One of my uncles went there at the same time (both born in '44).  I doubt he knew Garrison (it was a decently large school even back then).  My uncle even served in the U.S. Army around the same time as Garrison, although he was enlisted (didn't graduate Pan Am) and got out before Vietnam truly escalated.  Thanks for the reminder, I'm gonna write something up to send him about Garrison and their connection.  He's having some health issues and loves historical anecdotes like this.  Pos rep. 

  

Edited September 13, 2023 by YGIFS

[Js1 85095]

1 hour ago, Biff Tannen said:

+3.7

Core down to 4.3 (-0.4 from last month)

Headline is up 0.5 bc of gas and housing 

Edited September 13, 2023 by Js1

[atomheartbevo 89409]

14 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

If I had to guess, somebody told him he would be challenged very soon for the Speaker's chair if he didn't do something.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/brianbushard/2023/09/12/far-right-gaetz-slams-mccarthy-over-baby-step-biden-impeachment-probe/?sh=48b47c0f1e4c

Quote

Rep. Matt Gaetz (R-Fla.), a far-right GOP firebrand, criticized an effort by House Speaker Kevin McCarthy (R-Calif.) to launch impeachment inquiries into President Joe Biden over the president’s ties to his son’s foreign business endeavors, arguing the House should move to impeachment sooner, as Gaetz threatens to call for McCarthy to be ousted.

Quote

In a speech in the House on Tuesday, Gaetz called McCarthy’s decision to order three House committees to open an impeachment inquiry a “baby step following weeks of pressure from House conservatives to do more.”

Gaetz, one of a group of far-right Republicans who held up a House vote for McCarthy’s speakership in January, argued on Tuesday that the House “must move faster,” adding that an impeachment vote would allow “the American people get to see who’s fighting for them and who’s willing to tolerate more corruption and business as usual.”

 

https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/13/politics/mccarthy-motion-to-vacate-vote-to-oust-speaker/index.html

Quote

To win over critics and secure the gavel, McCarthy and his allies made a series of concessions to conservatives. One major concession was to restore the ability of any one member to offer what’s known as a motion to vacate the speaker’s chair – a move that can trigger a House floor vote to oust the speaker. 

Firebrand Rep. Matt Gaetz, a Florida Republican, has so far been the most vocal in floating the possibility of using a motion to vacate against McCarthy. 

Quote

On Tuesday, Gaetz outlined a series of demands, including calling for passage of individual spending bills and not a short-term stopgap measure to fund the government, as he threatened a push to remove the speaker. “Do these things or face a motion to vacate the chair,” he said in a speech on the House floor. 

Later, Gaetz warned that there could be constant votes to oust the speaker. “We are going to have them regularly,” he told reporters, suggesting it could happen daily. “If we have to begin every single day in Congress with the prayer, the pledge and the motion to vacate then so be it,” he said.

 

[atomheartbevo 89409]

Marjorie and Matt are fighting over who said impeachment first or something 

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2023/09/marjorie-taylor-greene-matt-gaetz-joe-biden-impeachment

Quote

Earlier today, House Speaker Kevin McCarthy announced that Republicans will move forward with an official impeachment inquiry into Joe Biden, despite the embarrassing fact that, as House Freedom Caucus member Ken Buck told MSNBC on Sunday, they haven’t uncovered a single piece of evidence “linking President Biden to a high crime or misdemeanor.” Also deeply embarrassing? The tantrum Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene is now having over not getting the credit she thinks she deserves for calling to impeach Biden first.

Greene—who commemorated 9/11 one day earlier by calling the president’s policies “traitorous” and suggesting states should secede—was apparently triggered by a post from Congressman Matt Gaetz, who wrote, “When @SpeakerMcCarthy makes his announcement in moments, remember that as I pushed him for weeks, [Fox News host Brian Kilmeade] said I was: ‘Speaking into the wind’ on impeachment. Turns out, the wind may be listening!”

 

[Degenerate Gardner 4081]

10 hours ago, YGIFS said:

There was a great character actor named Sam Shepard.  Sadly, he passed a few years ago but left behind a wonderful tapestry of meaty roles.  I followed his career because, despite our age difference, we had similar childhoods not too far from another in the Chicagoland area.  And he often passed, as I do, as a Native Texan.  

One such role was that of Major General, William Garrison, in a fantastic and moving film called "Black Hawk Down."  Shepard only has a few scenes in the overall movie, but in each scene...you can feel his desire to eradicate the evil in Somalia with every ounce of his being.  From motivational speeches, to tactical planning, to real time intel, to being completely lost as to what to do that he just starts mopping up blood in the infirmary.  MG Garrison was the same way in real life.  Helps that Shepard and Joe Biden kinda look alike in real life, stinks that Sam won't be around to play Joe in the inevitable biopic.  

Point is Garrison pinned his ears back, took care of his people, and relentlessly pursued the end of his enemy.  He accepted blame for the failures, but eventually got his man-Aidid.  And when Aidid was gone, Garrison retired the very next day.  Biden is not the ideal President, and certainly not the ideal candidate.  But he is here to doggedly run down Trump again and again and again.  And only when Trump has lost again, or is imprisoned, or is hopefully dead can Joe rest.  The nation can finally take a breath that we much deserve.  Until that day, however, Joe stands the watch much like MG Garrison.  And we will do all we can to drive Trump and his backwards fucking movement into the fucking ground.  Joe's greatest achievement is yet to come.  And that's saying something since he's also quietly defeating Russia with our Freshmen B-team equipment.  

I would honestly not be surprised to learn that when Trump dies or goes to jail, Biden collapses the very next day.  I will too, out of gratitude.  Of all the sentries standing all the posts in all the world.  I pray to Christ himself that Trump never has anything to do with any of them ever again.  May he forgive those of you who enabled him in the first place.  

Shepard was so much more than a character actor too. Author, director, prolific playwright, and perhaps his finest achievement was banging Jessica Lange for many years. I can totally understand why Kong was so hung up on her.

[MC Fresh Breath 4074]

11 hours ago, YGIFS said:

There was a great character actor named Sam Shepard.  Sadly, he passed a few years ago but left behind a wonderful tapestry of meaty roles.  I followed his career because, despite our age difference, we had similar childhoods not too far from another in the Chicagoland area.  And he often passed, as I do, as a Native Texan.  

One such role was that of Major General, William Garrison, in a fantastic and moving film called "Black Hawk Down."  Shepard only has a few scenes in the overall movie, but in each scene...you can feel his desire to eradicate the evil in Somalia with every ounce of his being.  From motivational speeches, to tactical planning, to real time intel, to being completely lost as to what to do that he just starts mopping up blood in the infirmary.  MG Garrison was the same way in real life.  Helps that Shepard and Joe Biden kinda look alike in real life, stinks that Sam won't be around to play Joe in the inevitable biopic.  

Point is Garrison pinned his ears back, took care of his people, and relentlessly pursued the end of his enemy.  He accepted blame for the failures, but eventually got his man-Aidid.  And when Aidid was gone, Garrison retired the very next day.  Biden is not the ideal President, and certainly not the ideal candidate.  But he is here to doggedly run down Trump again and again and again.  And only when Trump has lost again, or is imprisoned, or is hopefully dead can Joe rest.  The nation can finally take a breath that we much deserve.  Until that day, however, Joe stands the watch much like MG Garrison.  And we will do all we can to drive Trump and his backwards fucking movement into the fucking ground.  Joe's greatest achievement is yet to come.  And that's saying something since he's also quietly defeating Russia with our Freshmen B-team equipment.  

I would honestly not be surprised to learn that when Trump dies or goes to jail, Biden collapses the very next day.  I will too, out of gratitude.  Of all the sentries standing all the posts in all the world.  I pray to Christ himself that Trump never has anything to do with any of them ever again.  May he forgive those of you who enabled him in the first place.  

Its funny you mention Sammy, I was thinking about him the other day.  Of course, only those of us who knew him could call him Sammy without getting punched in the nose.  He was not exactly a push over.  One time he and I were having lunch at The Muse, which I'm pretty sure is closed these days but only due to Jack Nicholson being stingy with his tips.  Anyway, a little known fact about Sammy is he was really crazy for a good tomato bisque.  Also, he truly loathed the Lakers.  Now, The Muse didn't have tomato bisque on the menu, but they would run to the nearest 7-eleven and buy a can of Campbell's and trick ol Sammy into enjoying his meal.

Well this particular day Kobe walks into the place and everyone but Sammy loses their marbles and starts fumbling.  The waiter messes up and says "here's your campbell's sir, err, I mean."  Well, too late.  Sammy storms into the kitchen, finds the Campbell's can, and then storms back to the table, fuming.  I tried to calm him down and offer him some of my eggplant parmesan, which seemed to be helping.  Well, then a chorus of laughter erupts at Kobe's table and Sammy's face just reddened, like you know he did in the movies.  He stands up, lobs the soup can towards Kobe's table.  Luckily he missed Kobe or things could have got really ugly.  Then Sammy started screaming "I GOT THE RIGHT STUFF!  YOU AIN"T GOT IT, YOU CANNED SOUP SLURPER!"  Kobe just stared and shook his head, went back to eating.   

The waiter and owner and chef all came out to apologize, and after a foot massage Sammy calmed down.  So maybe instead of you know Trump dies so Biden dies like you theorize it just could be some angry but harmless can throwing, followed by some hollering of nonsense and the right foot massage to calm everyone back down.

[jimmyjazz 45546]

25 minutes ago, Degenerate Gardner said:

Shepard was so much more than a character actor too. Author, director, prolific playwright, and perhaps his finest achievement was banging Jessica Lange for many years. 

No doubt.

[jimmyjazz 45546]

38 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Marjorie and Matt are fighting over who said impeachment first or something 

Greene—who commemorated 9/11 one day earlier by calling the president’s policies “traitorous” and suggesting states should secede

['stache 21764]

It's like some people forget that a large swath of voters in 2016 cared more about Hillary using the wrong email server to plan a wedding than Trump mocking disabled people, being a racist, showing off his lack of intelligence on anything of importance, and admitting to groping women because he's a celebrity. And in 2020 he still was within reach after two impeachments and four more years of racism and saluting literal dictators. I have no idea why anyone would have any confidence that some nonsense a year from now won't persuade those same idiots that Hunter Biden doing coke or calling his dad too much is worse than trying to overthrow the government and being twice impeached (among literally dozens of other scandals and continued lack of intelligence). It's gonna happen. I have to believe that Biden will win, but it will be close, and I would not be remotely surprised if a guy in jail wins the presidency and causes the end of the current USA. If he wins we will face a true constitutional crises and I'm not sure this government can withstand that final straw. 

Edited September 13, 2023 by 'stache

[LCHorn 2585]

I don't want to start a new thread for this but for those who might have an opinion--I was reading the AOC thread and imagining a Biden-AOC ticket with Harris promised a move to SoS (so she's still in a good position, maybe better to run in 2028).

Would you think this combo more electable in 2024 than Biden-Harris?

The Nate Silver way of looking at it might be "does AOC shore up leftist/young/hispanic in key states sufficient for any loss of the African American vote that might be more tied to Harris?" (if that exists, I'm a little skeptical that she's seen as part of that group by at least African American elites). 

[Brisketexan 104560]

that is a csb.  One of my uncles went there at the same time (both born in '44).  I doubt he knew Garrison (it was a decently large school even back then).  My uncle even served in the U.S. Army around the same time as Garrison, although he was enlisted (didn't graduate Pan Am) and got out before Vietnam truly escalated.  Thanks for the reminder, I'm gonna write something up to send him about Garrison and their connection.  He's having some health issues and loves historical anecdotes like this.  Pos rep. 
  

I’ll be damned. My mom went to Pan Am, also born in 44.

[Skipper 6103]

10 hours ago, LCHorn said:

I don't want to start a new thread for this but for those who might have an opinion--I was reading the AOC thread and imagining a Biden-AOC ticket with Harris promised a move to SoS (so she's still in a good position, maybe better to run in 2028).

Would you think this combo more electable in 2024 than Biden-Harris?

The Nate Silver way of looking at it might be "does AOC shore up leftist/young/hispanic in key states sufficient for any loss of the African American vote that might be more tied to Harris?" (if that exists, I'm a little skeptical that she's seen as part of that group by at least African American elites). 

No.  I think in that scenario you risk losing a bunch of the anti-Trump moderates that elected Biden.  They may just throw their hands up and not vote all together with the thought of a extreme progressive like AOC becoming president if Biden dies or becomes incapacitated.  Absolutely terrible idea IMO.  Any voting "leftist" is going to vote Biden regardless of the ticket.   As for Kamala - I don't recall ever seeing a less visible VP.  I didn't think she was necessarily one of the stronger contenders in the D field back last primary season but I didn't have a negative opinion of her.  But instead of bolstering her status over the past 3 years they have minimized it.   I feel like D strategy across the board has been extremely lazy heading into this cycle.  They should have either made a strong effort to enhance Kamala's status through whatever means possible or have a clear replacement ready to go that would minimize any backlash.  Like 'stache said, there are a lot of chickens being counted on the D side with an extremely old President and tenuous, at best, economy.  If either his health declines or the economy goes into the shitter, both real possibilities, there has the potential to be a big fucking problem. Not like the stakes are high or anything given what another Trump term would mean for democracy.

[StassneyHorn 6536]

Next person that suggests VP shakeups is getting negged super-hard

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, StassneyHorn said:

Next person that suggests VP shakeups is getting negged super-hard

What if Biden offers the VP to Trump? Seems like a no-brainer and an electoral landslide as you'd get all the Trump voters and the Biden voters.

[Skipper 6103]

4 minutes ago, StassneyHorn said:

Next person that suggests VP shakeups is getting negged super-hard

My issue with the D's isn't that they need to do a shakeup.  But they sure as hell needed to do everything they can to make Kamala visible and presidential the last 3 years given Biden's age.  Seriously - can you recall a less visible VP in any recent administration?  I can't.  I don't get it.  

[Snake Diggity 4614]

50 minutes ago, Skipper said:

No.  I think in that scenario you risk losing a bunch of the anti-Trump moderates that elected Biden.  They may just throw their hands up and not vote all together with the thought of an extreme progressive like AOC becoming president if Biden dies or becomes incapacitated.  Absolutely terrible idea IMO.  Any voting "leftist" is going to vote Biden regardless of the ticket.   As for Kamala - I don't recall ever seeing a less visible VP.  I didn't think she was necessarily one of the stronger contenders in the D field back last primary season but I didn't have a negative opinion of her.  But instead of bolstering her status over the past 3 years they have minimized it.   I feel like D strategy across the board has been extremely lazy heading into this cycle.  They should have either made a strong effort to enhance Kamala's status through whatever means possible or have a clear replacement ready to go that would minimize any backlash.  Like 'stache said, there are a lot of chickens being counted on the D side with an extremely old President and tenuous, at best, economy.  If either his health declines or the economy goes into the shitter, both real possibilities, there has the potential to be a big fucking problem. Not like the stakes are high or anything given what another Trump term would mean for democracy.

“Tenuous at best” lol

GMAFB on multiple points here.  First, you don’t change the ticket, especially when you are heading into a rematch.  Second, it’s pretty telling that you consider the best characterization of the economy as “tenuous”.  Biden is old as fuck but he’s kicked ass all over.  Harris lacks “likability” but she’s done nothing to warrant a change.

Unless Biden dies in the next 15 months, he’s very likely to be re-elected, with Harris as his VP.

[UnivTex34 1763]

5 minutes ago, FirstTimeCaller said:

What if Biden offers the VP to Trump? Seems like a no-brainer and an electoral landslide as you'd get all the Trump voters and the Biden voters.

I know this is a joke, but that is the quickest way to a Kennedy style end for Biden. He might not make it an hour after the election.

[StassneyHorn 6536]

Kamala Harris is the most effectual VP this country has ever had.