It's time we talked about pickup trucks

[956 Worldwide 34746]

5 minutes ago, Bateshorn said:

At the Porsche driving experience, they  have two completely different skid pads to simulate over and understeer.  I mastered the oversteer pretty quickly: my Mom's car that I learned to drive on was an 80s caprice that would lose the rear everytime you braked in wet weather so I was pretty used to it. 

The Understeer was harder to understand and master, even though all my cars are FWD.  The instructor said it's because it's harder to put a passenger car into understeer under normal driving conditions.  You have to really push the car to edge of it's performance envelope to make it happen. It's part of the reason it's standard on almost all cars: better grip and normal driving handling characteristics. 

I don’t know that I’ve ever felt understeer. 
 

I learned to drive on a 90s Roadmaster sedan, then later (as mentioned) had a 98 Dakota R/T with the 360. So yeah, I didn’t blink an eye when the Crown Vic’s rear end started to step out but some of the younger folks had never felt that, done a donut, etc. 

[Bateshorn 9928]

2 minutes ago, TXLNGHRN10 said:

I don't understand how this is even a topic
I have a home, a bbq pit and a camper I tow every now and then. I don't see how owning a camry fits in with my outdoor, home improvement lifestyle. 

How much mulch can you fit in the trunk? What about the shitty roads I drive on to go fishing or hunting. Hell the shitty roads around Austin will fuck up a car's suspension as it is. 
If you don't want to own a truck, then don't. Ride your bike or drive your prius or tesla for you 1% and don't worry about it. 

I don't think anyone is questioning your ownership of a truck. It's the guy that's never put anything in the back of the thing other than a suit case that is the target. 

 

[Bateshorn 9928]

1 minute ago, 956 Worldwide said:

I don’t know that I’ve ever felt understeer. 
 

I learned to drive on a 90s Roadmaster sedan, then later (as mentioned) had a 98 Dakota R/T with the 360. So yeah, I didn’t blink an eye when the Crown Vic’s rear end started to step out but some of the younger folks had never felt that, done a donut, etc. 

It's incredibly un-nerving.  You are turning and the car just....doesn't turn. It plows forward even though the front wheels are literally pointing to the right or left. The solution is to loosen/lighten your grip on the wheel, let it spin back towards center and straighten the tires, re-establish grip, then re engage your turn. 

[Samson's Wig 3194]

3 minutes ago, Your Mom said:

You’re obsession with peoples shoe choice is odd.  How about people who wear athletic shoes but aren’t engaging in sports?  Or wearing Jordans but don’t play basketball? Hiking shoes when not on a nature trail?   Boots with a heel out on your ranch but not on an actual horse with feet in stirrups?   How about women wearing yoga pants while not practicing yoga?

I don’t wear cowboy boots these days but I get the appeal.  They look nice and are comfortable and easy to put on.  Who cares?

Also drive a truck because I needed one 17 years ago and the one I bought then still runs great and has been paid off since 2010.  Next car will be an EV but not until I absolutely have to buy one.  

No obsession here, it was a spinoff from the discussion of where urban giant pickup culture comes from.  My supposition was that it stems from the same mindset that causes urban computer jockeys to wear cowboy boots.  I couldn't care less what people wear on their feet, but find it interesting to think about how we got where we are culturally.  There is no doubt a correlation, at least, between urban boot wearers and urban pickup drivers.   Everyone should do whatever the fuck they want. I own boots and drive a truck, so this isn't intended as mud slinging.

[Celery Man 20991]

Playing a fuck ton of Gran Turismo 3 (and later 4) was actually really useful for understanding a lot of driving dynamics. The first time I ever experienced the rear end sliding out in a RW drive car I was more thrown for a loop trying to remember how I knew what to do than thrown for a loop trying to figure out what to do. Gran Turismo.

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4976]

17 minutes ago, TXLNGHRN10 said:

I don't understand how this is even a topic
I have a home, a bbq pit and a camper I tow every now and then. I don't see how owning a camry fits in with my outdoor, home improvement lifestyle. 

How much mulch can you fit in the trunk? What about the shitty roads I drive on to go fishing or hunting. Hell the shitty roads around Austin will fuck up a car's suspension as it is. 
If you don't want to own a truck, then don't. Ride your bike or drive your prius or tesla for you 1% and don't worry about it. 

Are you a gypsy?

[Samson's Wig 3194]

6 minutes ago, Celery Man said:

Playing a fuck ton of Gran Turismo 3 (and later 4) was actually really useful for understanding a lot of driving dynamics. The first time I ever experienced the rear end sliding out in a RW drive car I was more thrown for a loop trying to remember how I knew what to do than thrown for a loop trying to figure out what to do. Gran Turismo.

Did you hear that, Dad‽‽‽?‽‽‽?‽‽‽  Video games rule, man!

[Bateshorn 9928]

Just now, Samson's Wig said:

Did you hear that, Dad‽‽‽?‽‽‽?‽‽‽  Video games rule, man!

[gyroprotagonist 2594]

1 hour ago, Bateshorn said:

A

As a manlet, every time I see one of you lumbering giants try to fold yourself into a tight space, I have to fight the urge to say "How's that being tall working out for you now?"

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, gyroprotagonist said:

Do you find it funny the way I drive my auto-mo-bile?

[SHOOTER12 8819]

55 minutes ago, Your Mom said:

Don’t flatter yourself.  

CORvette nimrod, and quit wasting time taking pictures of your financed vehicle.

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4976]

You shouldn't speak to your mother like that.

[fattyflattie 4638]

1 hour ago, 956 Worldwide said:

I’ve yet to hear persuasive argument as to why occupant safety should take so much precedence over the safety of people you may hit.

Because outside of living in an urban area, you might go 6 weeks without seeing a pedestrian crossing a street?  

[fattyflattie 4638]

1 hour ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Retractable steps are nice, but spendy. Guy probably rolled his ankle getting out of it. 

Looks like he’s (she’s) got retractable on there. 

[BabaYaga 15304]

1 minute ago, fattyflattie said:

Because outside of living in an urban area, you might go 6 weeks without seeing a pedestrian crossing a street?  

That, and you can control the interior safety systems of the vehicle you choose to purchase a hell of lot easier than pedestrians.  What does that even look like?  Most pedestrians and other accidents are caused by driver inattentiveness, ie. cell phones than most anything else.  Either way, getting hit any moving block of steel is going to wreck you.  If you chose to drive a tiny car, you have to factor that in that you are sharing the road with much larger cars.  

[BabaYaga 15304]

33 minutes ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

Are you a gypsy?

[Bateshorn 9928]

7 minutes ago, fattyflattie said:

Because outside of living in an urban area, you might go 6 weeks without seeing a pedestrian crossing a street?  

Sadly, most of us us live in urban areas. 

[Celery Man 20991]

10 minutes ago, fattyflattie said:

Because outside of living in an urban area, you might go 6 weeks without seeing a pedestrian crossing a street?  

that's why you keep killing them

[956 Worldwide 34746]

22 minutes ago, fattyflattie said:

Because outside of living in an urban area, you might go 6 weeks without seeing a pedestrian crossing a street?  

I’ll bet even money you have at least once in your life bitched about how kids don’t play outside with their friends anymore. 

[956 Worldwide 34746]

17 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

That, and you can control the interior safety systems of the vehicle you choose to purchase a hell of lot easier than pedestrians.  What does that even look like?  Most pedestrians and other accidents are caused by driver inattentiveness, ie. cell phones than most anything else.  Either way, getting hit any moving block of steel is going to wreck you.  If you chose to drive a tiny car, you have to factor that in that you are sharing the road with much larger cars.  

Vehicles you can see out of? Vehicles where a 10 year old’s head is above the hood and can be seen in the rear view? Vehicles where you bounce/slide off the hood instead of getting bounced off the pavement? 

 

[wildcat09 29365]

[fattyflattie 4638]

8 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

I’ll bet even money you have at least once in your life bitched about how kids don’t play outside with their friends anymore. 

My kids do, neighborhood kids everywhere.  Even with all the pickups around.  I’ve yet to sit in a truck I can’t see out the front of. 

[Brothahorn 10087]

The problem I have with the domestic minitruck is it costs as much as a full size truck. I looked at the GMC when it first came. Sheeeeit. It made more sense to just stick to a full size crew cab.

Also, we've a Chevy family before I was born. And never had any lemons. I personally switched to Dodge in 2000. And again no lemons. Sometimes I think the domestics get a bad rap because of bad owners.

[wildcat09 29365]

Lol, exquisite timing.

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

The problem I have with the domestic minitruck is it costs as much as a full size truck. I looked at the GMC when it first came. Sheeeeit. It made more sense to just stick to a full size crew cab.

Also, we've a Chevy family before I was born. And never had any lemons. I personally switched to Dodge in 2000. And again no lemons. Sometimes I think the domestics get a bad rap because of bad owners.

I honestly haven’t looked, but are there any full size trucks that start $27k new like that Toyota I posted? It’s of course the absolute base model, but $27k is fairly cheap these days, especially for a truck.

[956 Worldwide 34746]

9 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

I’ve never sat in a car with any blind spot, I also don’t believe in stats that show trucks and large SUVs are more dangerous than cars. My kids are playing outside all the time but they only cross the street on foot every six weeks. 

[956 Worldwide 34746]

8 minutes ago, fattyflattie said:

My kids do, neighborhood kids everywhere.  Even with all the pickups around.  I’ve yet to sit in a truck I can’t see out the front of. 

So they’re outside all the time playing with their friends and, per your post above, only cross the street once every six weeks? Do they just wave across the yard? 
 

You have to work really hard to post this kind of dumbass contradictory shit. 

Edited January 24, 2023 by 956 Worldwide

[BabaYaga 15304]

17 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Vehicles you can see out of? Vehicles where a 10 year old’s head is above the hood and can be seen in the rear view? Vehicles where you bounce/slide off the hood instead of getting bounced off the pavement? 

 

There are vehicles you can't see out of?

Vehicles that bounce you off of?  Have fun catapulting into the air and THEN getting bounced into the pavement.

 

[BabaYaga 15304]

6 minutes ago, Patricio Swayze said:

but $27k is fairly cheap these days, especially for a truck.

That a base, introductory model probably not on the lot that gets you in the front door.  

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

That a base, introductory model probably not on the lot that gets you in the front door.  

Just get creative. Go through their fleet services. Order 10 and cancel 9. Haha.

[Brothahorn 10087]

I honestly haven’t looked, but are there any full size trucks that start $27k new like that Toyota I posted? It’s of course the absolute base model, but $27k is fairly cheap these days, especially for a truck.

IIRC, when I was looking a few years back, the base work truck model was close to that price or within a few grand of it. I thought about going that route but knew I would just end up adding shit to it.

[UnivTex34 1763]

13 minutes ago, Patricio Swayze said:

I honestly haven’t looked, but are there any full size trucks that start $27k new like that Toyota I posted? It’s of course the absolute base model, but $27k is fairly cheap these days, especially for a truck.

F150 base fleet, like you have posted, and like BabaYaga posted are impossible to find/buy for non-fleet buyers is $33k. So yeah pretty damn close.

Edited January 24, 2023 by UnivTex34

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

Hmm interesting. Price difference is about value of adding 4wd.

I still would never buy a Ford truck over a Toyota truck.

[SHOOTER12 8819]

22 hours ago, YGIFS said:

I would think Americans use the bed more than the towing capabilities.  I mean yeah, I guess when we tow...we tow a lot but it's more rare, no?  I dunno, I think I only towed shit with my full-size a half dozen times in 8 years but I used the bed probably 40 outta 50 weeks a year.  And probably over-filled it a dozen times per year.  I didn't realize that about the Hilux, I always assumed it was emissions or finances or where to build it.  My neighbor is a radiologist and got a pretty nice short-box F-150 with all the fixins.  Obviously as a doctor he doesn't haul anything but firewood, but he said he needed it to tow a boat.  And I thought, "You're the asshole who talked me into that boat sharing club with you at that marina!"  But he liked boating so much, be bought one and uses the new truck to tow it.  But our HOA doesn't allow boat parking so he parks it at his medical practice which of course is suing him even though he groundleases his portion.  A truly American story.  

Shit, just tell 'em it's going to Mexico and suddenly that Hilux can tow 3 minivans at a time so long as the last one says, "In  Tow" on the back window.  If a fucking '97 Bonneville can do it, a Hilux can!  

Lol, if the caravan is going to Mexico the sign probably says "een toe".

Have seen a bunch of those on US-59.

[UnivTex34 1763]

3 minutes ago, Patricio Swayze said:

Hmm interesting. Price difference is about value of adding 4wd.

I still would never buy a Ford truck over a Toyota truck.

I had more issues with my 2nd gen Taco than I have had with my 16 F150 that has more miles

I loved that truck, but the bulletproofness is oversold by Toyota geeks.(and the Toyota tax is 10 times worse than the Apple tax in tech). I've never had an issue with a Ford product.

Edited January 24, 2023 by UnivTex34

[956 Worldwide 34746]

5 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

There are vehicles you can't see out of?

Vehicles that bounce you off of?  Have fun catapulting into the air and THEN getting bounced into the pavement.

 

You have to work super hard to argue with both physics and raw data. But I never underestimate surly. 
 

Car collisions are far more likely to cause leg injuries, truck strikes far more likely to cause fatal head and neck injuries. Blind spots exist. Geometry can’t be argued with, it’s literally “proofs.” 
 

https://eu.freep.com/story/money/cars/2018/06/28/suvs-killing-americas-pedestrians/646139002/

https://towardsdatascience.com/suvs-are-killing-people-de6ce08bac3d 

 

  

 

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

I had more issues with my 2nd gen Taco than I have had with my 16 F150 that has more miles
I loved that truck, but the bulletproofness is oversold by Toyota geeks. I've never had an issue with a Ford product.

At this point it is largely anecdotal, but my experience has been the opposite. Between two Tacomas and one 4runner I have about 400,000 miles without a single engine issue. Not even a replaced spark plug.

I never owned a Ford truck (or any other make), but I did have an explorer. What a piece of shit. Fucker went through water pumps like they were going out of style.

/end thread Jack.

[otisdog 365]

17 hours ago, fattyflattie said:

 95%+ of the 911’s and vettes around town never get tracked.  That’s more offensive, imo. 

If you are serious about tracking your car, and good enough to go fast, you've got to put a rollbar and harness in to protect you from serious crash. This definitely compromises the usability of said vehicle. Putting or not putting crap into the bed of your truck has no effect on your comfort in the cab.

[locodos 5389]

1 hour ago, TXLNGHRN10 said:

I don't understand how this is even a topic
I have a home, a bbq pit and a camper I tow every now and then. I don't see how owning a camry fits in with my outdoor, home improvement lifestyle. 

How much mulch can you fit in the trunk? What about the shitty roads I drive on to go fishing or hunting. Hell the shitty roads around Austin will fuck up a car's suspension as it is. 
If you don't want to own a truck, then don't. Ride your bike or drive your prius or tesla for you 1% and don't worry about it. 

Wait, You tow your home?

You're going to be shocked to find out that you can have more than one vehicle.   In your case you need a Canyonero. 90+% do not.   I'm not even close to suggesting people shouldn't buy or drive what they want, but the vast vast majority of folks buy trucks as a lifestyle statement.  But you can't put a Yeti / Salt Life stickers on a Camry.

When I buy a truck, I keep them for 10+ years, use them sparingly to tow boats, haul stuff etc and that's about it.  I have fewer than 6k miles per year on my current truck.  My other cars are just better in every other way.  

I'll get flamed for this but in the vast majority of DOMESTIC chores a minivan does everything a pickup truck will do but better.  I just don't want to own one.

[SHOOTER12 8819]

7 hours ago, Armybrat said:

#2 son’s work truck and his ‘59 “hobby”

 

Sweet 

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4976]

18 minutes ago, locodos said:

Wait, You tow your home?

You're going to be shocked to find out that you can have more than one vehicle.   In your case you need a Canyonero. 90+% do not.   I'm not even close to suggesting people shouldn't buy or drive what they want, but the vast vast majority of folks buy trucks as a lifestyle statement.  But you can't put a Yeti / Salt Life stickers on a Camry.

When I buy a truck, I keep them for 10+ years, use them sparingly to tow boats, haul stuff etc and that's about it.  I have fewer than 6k miles per year on my current truck.  My other cars are just better in every other way.  

I'll get flamed for this but in the vast majority of DOMESTIC chores a minivan does everything a pickup truck will do but better.  I just don't want to own one.

He never denied being a gypsy.

[SHOOTER12 8819]

6 hours ago, RPM said:

Then you should quit your job, go through training and become a cop so you can arrest them. Until that happens, follow the law and move right.

I don't get the fascination with the left lane. I drive around 10 over, sometimes more. But when I pass someone, I move right until I have to pass another car. My rule is pass me all you want. Just don't slow down and block things up.

I look at it this way, let them all pass. It's always great to have multiple front doors to soak up the lasers and radar while I comfortably ride in between them hauling ass, so there's no problem pulling over and letting another blocker go ahead. 

[TXLNGHRN10 341]

1 hour ago, locodos said:

Wait, You tow your home?

You're going to be shocked to find out that you can have more than one vehicle.   In your case you need a Canyonero. 90+% do not.   I'm not even close to suggesting people shouldn't buy or drive what they want, but the vast vast majority of folks buy trucks as a lifestyle statement.  But you can't put a Yeti / Salt Life stickers on a Camry.

When I buy a truck, I keep them for 10+ years, use them sparingly to tow boats, haul stuff etc and that's about it.  I have fewer than 6k miles per year on my current truck.  My other cars are just better in every other way.  

I'll get flamed for this but in the vast majority of DOMESTIC chores a minivan does everything a pickup truck will do but better.  I just don't want to own one.

Forgive me for not being more clear. I should've worded having a house differently.  I mean if times get hard though, I can live in my camper and therefor tow my home. 

I've seen many a minivan at the Home Depot loaded to the ceiling with mulch and soil. Loaded down til it's resting on the bump stops.  I'll keep my F150 

[Pato del Muerto 52556]

I also like being able to drive to the landscaping place and have them drop 3 buckets of mulch/dirt from the front end loader into my truck bed, and off I go. 

[HamsterHookah 112]

5 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

I also like being able to drive to the landscaping place and have them drop 3 buckets of mulch/dirt from the front end loader into my truck bed, and off I go. 

Did this with a sod last spring, just had the forklift put it in the bed and off you go.

[HamsterHookah 112]

2 hours ago, wildcat09 said:

Have both an Escalade and F-150 and can confirm. In my experience there is no practical implication, however.

[BabaYaga 15304]

2 hours ago, 956 Worldwide said:

But I never underestimate surly. 

Indeed.  Articles that in their own text cite primarily driver distractions, pedestrians in dense urban areas, speed of the vehicle, often under the influence of alcohol, and higher sales of SUVs as the leading cause of higher incidents of accidents with SUVs.

And the surly solution?  A ban on SUVs/trucks?  Vehicle designs that all but outlaw any type of an extended front end?  A complete overhaul of every truck and SUV on the current market?

Seems on par for Surly.  

[BabaYaga 15304]

3 minutes ago, HamsterHookah said:

Did this with a sod last spring, just had the forklift put it in the bed and off you go.

Did that with a ton of flagstone..  Moving it by hand to the backyard by hand.  Not as much fun.  

[Deej 76885]

I miss having a pickup, but if I need to haul a bed-load of something, I just go rent one from U-Haul for the day for $20. I come out way ahead. 

Now, if I needed to do that regularly, I'd buy a truck. 

 

[Celery Man 20991]

2 hours ago, locodos said:

 

I'll get flamed for this but in the vast majority of DOMESTIC chores a minivan does everything a pickup truck will do but better.  I just don't want to own one.