will we ever stop requiring a college degree in order to work the majority of good jobs?

[Fudge Nuggets 19,190]

6 hours ago, HamsterHookah said:

we jibe with the mission and vision in 2023 so I'll just leave it at that

Translated:  He's a fucking dickhead.

[CHIEF 5,089]

5 minutes ago, Fudge Nuggets said:

No shit.  I'm in full ass panic mode if UTD is $40k a year.

https://www.collegetuitioncompare.com/edu/228787/the-university-of-texas-at-dallas/tuition/

This shows a little over $132k. Does not include a vehicle, gas, or other activities. 

CHIEF

[Celery Man 20,959]

$132k millionaires

[DalTxHornFan 3,101]

8 hours ago, South Austin said:

I'll take out a second mortgage before I let my kid go aggy.

FWIW, my aggy 2-percenter is in formation to be a Dominican nun.  No procreation anticpated!

Edited February 2, 2023 by DalTxHornFan

[gmr548 16,580]

One of my friends at work went to Oregon and loved it.
That said, Baylor is one of the few schools on the list that I'll actually pay for and allow that is a bad deal on paper (low ROI, high cost for average education), just for the cultural reasons. YMMV

This is Grade A shitposting. Just wonderful trolling. Bravo.

[Js1 85,346]

8 minutes ago, gmr548 said:

This is Grade A shitposting. Just wonderful trolling. Bravo.

Right. No one who is a serious person wants to send their kid to one of the 2 dumps on the Brazos 

[MrBig 5,398]

Large corporations requiring degrees for managerial work is creating a huge ceiling for people with tons of experience but no degree.

I worked for a regional company later bought out by a big corporation. Pre-takeover, each branch was semi-autonomous and had the discretion to hire/fire workers based on production and need. I used to train guys up to be my #2s before they would go off to manage their own branches in the region.

Post-takeover, we cant do shit without running exempt hires up the corporate ladder. Guys who would be my solid Hank Hill assistant manager hires are now stuck being hourly team leads since they have no fucking degree. There is no progression up the ladder and people are leaving.

The corporation wants a minimum of a bachelor degree to be an exempt employee. They would rather hire some inexperienced kids with online degrees from Western Governor’s University or University of Phoenix grads over my proven performers who have been on my team for years. It wasn't like this before. 

[TwiceHorn 31,483]

55 minutes ago, Fudge Nuggets said:

No shit.  I'm in full ass panic mode if UTD is $40k a year.

School of Engineering, on-campus dorm and meals is estimated at about $35k.  Tad higher if off-campus.

I'm not super-familiar with that area of town, but it strikes me as relatively new, without a lot of cheap houses or older apartments around.  And, as I have seen from UT, the local cost of real estate has a big influence on dorm costs.

[rage-a-holic 4,401]

43 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

School of Engineering, on-campus dorm and meals is estimated at about $35k.  Tad higher if off-campus.

I'm not super-familiar with that area of town, but it strikes me as relatively new, without a lot of cheap houses or older apartments around.  And, as I have seen from UT, the local cost of real estate has a big influence on dorm costs.

lol, it's Richardson, about 1 mile from the house I grew up in. Definitely not new.

[Fudge Nuggets 19,190]

My favorite post in the thread is when brisket told the story of filling up several whiteboards with algebra and called it advanced math. That was cute. 

[Slacks 6,821]

It's a way to keep the socioeconomic hierarchy intact.

Going to a university is a generational amplification of the opportunity to generate income... And for some reason, it seems our society rather keep people from getting there easily, as if it's a zero sum game.

[williemackgarza 1,826]

Wife works for the state of texas in a field that requires degrees.
They accept those online tv ad bullshit college degrees.
Kinda defeats the purpose.

[Brothahorn 10,087]

True story, I always thought lawyers were some of the smartest people in the world. Because they actually memorized the law. Afrer getting to know a few I realized they just look shit up or have someone do it for them.

[Celery Man 20,959]

2 hours ago, Slacks said:

It's a way to keep the socioeconomic hierarchy intact.

Going to a university is a generational amplification of the opportunity to generate income... And for some reason, it seems our society rather keep people from getting there easily, as if it's a zero sum game.

it is apparently easy and cheap to attain and is useful for employers who are incompetent recruiters

[Brothahorn 10,087]

Large corporations requiring degrees for managerial work is creating a huge ceiling for people with tons of experience but no degree.
I worked for a regional company later bought out by a big corporation. Pre-takeover, each branch was semi-autonomous and had the discretion to hire/fire workers based on production and need. I used to train guys up to be my #2s before they would go off to manage their own branches in the region.
Post-takeover, we cant do shit without running exempt hires up the corporate ladder. Guys who would be my solid Hank Hill assistant manager hires are now stuck being hourly team leads since they have no fucking degree. There is no progression up the ladder and people are leaving.
The corporation wants a minimum of a bachelor degree to be an exempt employee. They would rather hire some inexperienced kids with online degrees from Western Governor’s University or University of Phoenix grads over my proven performers who have been on my team for years. It wasn't like this before. 

Sad to see good people wasted. In certain industries, nothing beats real world experience. Large corporations need to get out of that mindset. I wouldn't trade my guys for a top Ivy leaguer.

[RDCanecutter 26,446]

17 hours ago, SHOOTER12 said:

But can can they use punctuation and capitalization where needed? If not, screw them and give them a shovel.  The world needs ditch diggers too.

Hits home as I was using a shovel not even an hour ago.

[Slacks 6,821]

6 hours ago, Celery Man said:

it is apparently easy and cheap to attain and is useful for employers who are incompetent recruiters

Easy, yes.

Cheap? Not at all.

[Brisketexan 105,147]

10 hours ago, Fudge Nuggets said:

My favorite post in the thread is when brisket told the story of filling up several whiteboards with algebra and called it advanced math. That was cute. 

Well, in my defense, I'm a lawyer, so anything beyond "pay me 40%/$500 an hour" is advanced math to us.

[TwiceHorn 31,483]

22 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Surely you know this, but while Baylor positions itself as a Christian school with mission statements and vision etc., it is possibly, in reality, more depraved than UT.

I heard stories from Baylor that would make SAEs and KAs and even Phi Delts blush.  And I think it's the previously sheltered kids that are at the heart of it.  See Porterhouse, above.  Don't bet that your "good kids" are going to stay that way at Baylor any more than UT or anywhere else.

Haha you negged me over this?  Perhaps it was the "good kids," which was not intended to disparage your kids.  There are plenty of good kids that stay good kids, with or without intoxicants or premarital sex, at every university, including UT.  But if you want them to stay good kids within some narrow definition of that, possibly whatever "vision" Baylor is selling, I honestly don't think Baylor is your huckleberry.  Maybe Bob Jones U.

The rape scandal at BU didn't happen within the narrow sphere of the athletic department and football team.  It's a reflection of aspects of the broader culture there.

Edited February 2, 2023 by TwiceHorn

[TwiceHorn 31,483]

19 hours ago, rage-a-holic said:

lol, it's Richardson, about 1 mile from the house I grew up in. Definitely not new.

Anything north of Campbell is north Jesus Oklahoma to me.

[Bateshorn 9,927]

All I know was in the 90s I flew home from Bates specifically for the Baylor game n Austin because the Baylor girls that came down were such sluts once they got out of Waco. True to form, I absolutely disrespected somebody’s daughter on Friday night. And Richard Walton came in and won the fucking game. 

[fattyflattie 4,639]

12 minutes ago, Bateshorn said:

Baylor girls that came down were such sluts once they got out of Waco. True to form, I absolutely disrespected somebody’s daughter on Friday night

This man tells the truth.  

[Celery Man 20,959]

[HamsterHookah 112]

1 hour ago, TwiceHorn said:

Haha you negged me over this?  Perhaps it was the "good kids," which was not intended to disparage your kids.  There are plenty of good kids that stay good kids, with or without intoxicants or premarital sex, at every university, including UT.  But if you want them to stay good kids within some narrow definition of that, possibly whatever "vision" Baylor is selling, I honestly don't think Baylor is your huckleberry.  Maybe Bob Jones U.

The rape scandal at BU didn't happen within the narrow sphere of the athletic department and football team.  It's a reflection of aspects of the broader culture there.

Sorry! Mea Culpa! I thought it was funny and meant to do the laughing guy emoji rep. I've amended that. Fat fingered the response in a hurry.

[Nivek 16,933]

21 hours ago, MrBig said:

Large corporations requiring degrees for managerial work is creating a huge ceiling for people with tons of experience but no degree.

I worked for a regional company later bought out by a big corporation. Pre-takeover, each branch was semi-autonomous and had the discretion to hire/fire workers based on production and need. I used to train guys up to be my #2s before they would go off to manage their own branches in the region.

Post-takeover, we cant do shit without running exempt hires up the corporate ladder. Guys who would be my solid Hank Hill assistant manager hires are now stuck being hourly team leads since they have no fucking degree. There is no progression up the ladder and people are leaving.

The corporation wants a minimum of a bachelor degree to be an exempt employee. They would rather hire some inexperienced kids with online degrees from Western Governor’s University or University of Phoenix grads over my proven performers who have been on my team for years. It wasn't like this before. 

Um, many companies do not promote from within regardless of your degree status, and much of that is due to HR.

[HornOnTheBayou 8,930]

On 2/1/2023 at 12:28 PM, HamsterHookah said:

One of my friends at work went to Oregon and loved it.

That said, Baylor is one of the few schools on the list that I'll actually pay for and allow that is a bad deal on paper (low ROI, high cost for average education), just for the cultural reasons. YMMV

I'll give Hamster the benefit of the doubt and assume he was not talking about the culture of gang rape. He was probably talking about the culture of cat torture.

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4,976]

Well, I mean, the cat would probably torture you for fun if it could.

Also, isn't gang rape a form of torturing a pussy?

[F250 28,777]

15 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Haha you negged me over this?  Perhaps it was the "good kids," which was not intended to disparage your kids.  There are plenty of good kids that stay good kids, with or without intoxicants or premarital sex, at every university, including UT.  But if you want them to stay good kids within some narrow definition of that, possibly whatever "vision" Baylor is selling, I honestly don't think Baylor is your huckleberry.  Maybe Bob Jones U.

The rape scandal at BU didn't happen within the narrow sphere of the athletic department and football team.  It's a reflection of aspects of the broader culture there.

I knew several people from hschool that went to Baylor, they were church kids but certainly not good kids. Years ago, I worked with a guy that graduated from Baylor. When I found out I expressed surprise because he wasn't the Baylor type. He said he grew up SBC and it was the only college his parents would pay for him to attend.

His description of his time at Baylor was "I hated it, hated it!" His major beef with Baylor was the grotesque hypocrisy.

[Celery Man 20,959]

 

[HRSchenker 2,268]

On 2/1/2023 at 1:31 PM, Js1 said:

Between AP exams and some credit by exams in the summer, I think i knocked out all my liberal arts math requirements, half my foreign language, US History, Economics and US government.  It was like 18-21 credit hours before I even started my freshman year. 

I bombed the AP exams on purpose and instead did dual credit. Ended up working in my favor as it got me into grad school a year ahead of schedule. 

[HamsterHookah 112]

28 minutes ago, Celery Man said:

 

Forever a classic bit that will make me laugh. RIP Norm.

[Jkwellborn 6,702]

Well, I mean, the cat would probably torture you for fun if it could.
Also, isn't gang rape a form of torturing a pussy?

LSU thread is that way. ———>

[MissingInAction 25,082]

On 2/2/2023 at 8:41 AM, williemackgarza said:

Wife works for the state of texas in a field that requires degrees.
They accept those online tv ad bullshit college degrees.
Kinda defeats the purpose.

Back when I was working at the office one of the known dipshits of our department started bragging that he was about to graduate from college.

I was like cool, UT, ACC targeted learning, etc.

Nope, U of Phoenix.

I was not able to control my laughter and neither was anyone else in hearing distance.

I swear that fake degree made him worse because it gave him undeserved confidence in his abilities.

[Guest]

On 2/2/2023 at 6:03 PM, HamsterHookah said:

Sorry! Mea Culpa! I thought it was funny and meant to do the laughing guy emoji rep. I've amended that. Fat fingered the response in a hurry.

If I am reading on my ipad, I have done this more than once by mistake.  Then it's it's like, "Oh shit, that was funny.  Didn't mean to neg that post!!!"

[Nice Guy Eddie 13,512]

On 2/1/2023 at 8:29 PM, MrBig said:

Large corporations requiring degrees for managerial work is creating a huge ceiling for people with tons of experience but no degree.

I worked for a regional company later bought out by a big corporation. Pre-takeover, each branch was semi-autonomous and had the discretion to hire/fire workers based on production and need. I used to train guys up to be my #2s before they would go off to manage their own branches in the region.

Post-takeover, we cant do shit without running exempt hires up the corporate ladder. Guys who would be my solid Hank Hill assistant manager hires are now stuck being hourly team leads since they have no fucking degree. There is no progression up the ladder and people are leaving.

The corporation wants a minimum of a bachelor degree to be an exempt employee. They would rather hire some inexperienced kids with online degrees from Western Governor’s University or University of Phoenix grads over my proven performers who have been on my team for years. It wasn't like this before. 

I work for a healthcare system that requires degrees to move into certain corp levels. Bachelors to get into a team lead, and a masters to be a director. I’m sure there are exceptions but very few. I feel for the employees that are going after a bachelors after 35. That can be a huge ordeal depending on your hours. Getting a check-the-box masters degree is relatively easy and doesn’t have to break the bank.

Im 50+ and Im unsure when I last worked with someone under 25. My last few employers usually expected 5-10 years experience to be hired in. Or they were brought in via a masters program.

[WBT 20,579]

On 2/2/2023 at 5:35 AM, Fudge Nuggets said:

My favorite post in the thread is when brisket told the story of filling up several whiteboards with algebra and called it advanced math. That was cute. 

I liked how he easily synthesized the knowledge of experts in their field and dazzled them with his conciseness.  Brevity, thy name is Brisket!

And all without tearing his hear [sic] out!

[Frank Drebin 5,638]

2 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I work for a healthcare system that requires degrees to move into certain corp levels. Bachelors to get into a team lead, and a masters to be a director. I’m sure there are exceptions but very few. I feel for the employees that are going after a bachelors after 35. That can be a huge ordeal depending on your hours. Getting a check-the-box masters degree is relatively easy and doesn’t have to break the bank.

Im 50+ and Im unsure when I last worked with someone under 25. My last few employers usually expected 5-10 years experience to be hired in. Or they were brought in via a masters program.

I have a few healthcare clients.  They are all the most in your face about credentials, whether it be in their email signatures or Linkedin profiles.  They will put in MBA, JD, or any other certification they might have in every communication.  It is strange.

[HamsterHookah 112]

People will monetize any gaps and inefficiencies in markets:

More than 2,800 people may be working as nurses under false pretenses after allegedly buying a fake diploma for between $10,000 and $15,000 from a massive Florida-based scheme recently busted by federal investigators. State and federal authorities are now working to track down the alleged fraudulent nurses, and in some cases, immediately annulling their licenses.

Last week, the Department of Justice announced charges against 25 people in five states connected to the alleged scheme. The investigation, code-named Operation Nightingale, found evidence that the 25 defendants worked to sell more than 7,600 fake diplomas, along with transcripts, between 2016 and 2021, making over $100 million in the process. The fraudulent diplomas and transcripts were allegedly issued from three accredited Florida-based nursing schools: Siena College and Sacred Heart International Institute in Broward County and Palm Beach School of Nursing in Palm Beach County.

https://arstechnica.com/science/2023/02/2800-fake-nurses-lurk-in-the-us-states-are-working-to-track-them-down/

Edited February 6, 2023 by HamsterHookah

[Brisketexan 105,147]

2 hours ago, WBT said:

I liked how he easily synthesized the knowledge of experts in their field and dazzled them with his conciseness.  Brevity, thy name is Brisket!

I'm sorry, sir - I only provide "baffle them with bullshit" services.  If you want "dazzle them with conciseness," you're going to have to pull forward to the next window.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13,512]

4 hours ago, Frank Drebin said:

I have a few healthcare clients.  They are all the most in your face about credentials, whether it be in their email signatures or Linkedin profiles.  They will put in MBA, JD, or any other certification they might have in every communication.  It is strange.

Agree. In my experience at my healthcare employer is that it's a dept by dept thing. Some depts demand you list your degrees even on presentation intro slides.  Nice Guy Eddie, MBA.  

Luckily my dept and our VP doesn't follow that example even though I would guess that at least half the dept has a masters with a few PhDs sprinkled in.

[HamsterHookah 112]

Not sure which of the higher education concern threads this goes on, but very long and very interesting read from the New Yorker on the the death of the English major:

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2023/03/06/the-end-of-the-english-major

Quote

During the past decade, the study of English and history at the collegiate level has fallen by a full third. Humanities enrollment in the United States has declined over all by seventeen per cent, Townsend found. What’s going on? The trend mirrors a global one; four-fifths of countries in the Organization for Economic Coöperation reported falling humanities enrollments in the past decade. But that brings little comfort to American scholars, who have begun to wonder what it might mean to graduate a college generation with less education in the human past than any that has come before.

 

Edited March 2, 2023 by HamsterHookah

[animaltobacco11 107]

I definitely get that value of a degree has been diminished over the last, what, 20 years. And there are definitely value considerations and calculations to have before just getting any Tom, Dick, and Harry degree for exorbitant amount of money at Regional-For-Profit University online. 

But can we all agree that this might be an overcorrection (from NYT, linked below)

Quote

A decade later, Americans’ feelings about higher education have turned sharply negative. The percentage of young adults who said that a college degree is very important fell to 41 percent from 74 percent. Only about a third of Americans now say they have a lot of confidence in higher education. Among young Americans in Generation Z, 45 percent say that a high school diploma is all you need today to “ensure financial security.” And in contrast to the college-focused parents of a decade ago, now almost half of American parents say they’d prefer that their children not enroll in a four-year college.

I don't know if these kids are thinking they can just set up a a camera and halo light, do the Gen-Z shake, and influence their way to riches, but when the average college graduate can't buy a house or save for retirement, how is a HS diploma all you need to ensure financial security?

Quote

 

With those odds, it is not a surprise that young Americans, especially, are eager to believe that they will be able to thrive in the job market without having to worry about college. Remember that 45 percent of Generation Z respondents this year told pollsters that they believe that a high school diploma will be enough to ensure financial security.

The reality, though, is that in the decade ahead, opportunities for those without a postsecondary credential are projected to shrink even further. It is true that there are still some well-paying jobs that don’t require a degree — plumbers make a median of almost $60,000 a year, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics — but the B.L.S. predicts that fewer than 10,000 new plumbing jobs will be created in the United States between now and 2031. The fastest-growing jobs available to those with only a high school diploma, meanwhile, are mostly low-wage service jobs: home health aides (924,000 new jobs by 2031), food-service workers and waiters (570,000 new jobs), restaurant cooks (419,000 new jobs) and warehouse workers (358,000 new jobs). None of these jobs have a median salary above $31,000 a year.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/05/magazine/college-worth-price.html

[Samson's Wig 3,192]

On 3/1/2023 at 10:34 PM, HamsterHookah said:

Not sure which of the higher education concern threads this goes on, but very long and very interesting read from the New Yorker on the the death of the English major:

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2023/03/06/the-end-of-the-english-major

 

The lack of history education from grade school up through universities will not end well.

I hope that, even if they drop majors, universities will still require a decent amount of liberal arts classes so that the engineers we pump out at least have some semblance of humanity (if only second-hand knowledge) and understand who and what they're designing things for.

[animaltobacco11 107]

23 minutes ago, Samson's Wig said:

The lack of history education from grade school up through universities will not end well.

I hope that, even if they drop majors, universities will still require a decent amount of liberal arts classes so that the engineers we pump out at least have some semblance of humanity (if only second-hand knowledge) and understand who and what they're designing things for.

History and Geography knowledge in today's kids, from an anecdotal perspective, is woeful.  

[Fudge Nuggets 19,190]

32 minutes ago, Samson's Wig said:

The lack of history education from grade school up through universities will not end well.

I hope that, even if they drop majors, universities will still require a decent amount of liberal arts classes so that the engineers we pump out at least have some semblance of humanity (if only second-hand knowledge) and understand who and what they're designing things for.

Fuck you, I've got plenty of God damn humanity.  Asshole.

[Samson's Wig 3,192]

Just now, Fudge Nuggets said:

Fuck you, I've got plenty of God damn humanity.  Asshole.

[UpperWestside 6,167]

I have had this conversation with a lot of folks who do not have college degrees and I think that we are at a point where many of the graybeards are leaving the workforce this opening up things for younger people to get in positions where they can make hiring decisions that are not tied to what college you graduated from, but whether or not you can actually do the job.

I believe that by the end of this decade we will see a wholesale change in how companies hire and promote because the bottom line is still making money. If some guy that never set foot on a college campus has the ability to do the work and do it better than someone with a degree (And likely a 100k worth of debt hanging around their neck for no good reason), you take the person that will perform better. I am all for degrees becoming way less meaningful in the hiring process if not phased out altogether by as many companies as possible.

Edited September 7, 2023 by UpperWestside

[MissingInAction 25,082]

My BIL, who is a certifiable idiot, got his BA at aggy a few years ago. This dumbass falls for ransomware on the reg.

So there's that.

[BabaYaga 15,299]

On 2/6/2023 at 11:48 AM, HamsterHookah said:

People will monetize any gaps and inefficiencies in markets:

More than 2,800 people may be working as nurses under false pretenses after allegedly buying a fake diploma for between $10,000 and $15,000 from a massive Florida-based scheme recently busted by federal investigators. State and federal authorities are now working to track down the alleged fraudulent nurses, and in some cases, immediately annulling their licenses.

Last week, the Department of Justice announced charges against 25 people in five states connected to the alleged scheme. The investigation, code-named Operation Nightingale, found evidence that the 25 defendants worked to sell more than 7,600 fake diplomas, along with transcripts, between 2016 and 2021, making over $100 million in the process. The fraudulent diplomas and transcripts were allegedly issued from three accredited Florida-based nursing schools: Siena College and Sacred Heart International Institute in Broward County and Palm Beach School of Nursing in Palm Beach County.

https://arstechnica.com/science/2023/02/2800-fake-nurses-lurk-in-the-us-states-are-working-to-track-them-down/

I've seen this show!

[Jkwellborn 6,702]

I've seen this show!

Been watching that for the first time. I like it.

I've seen this show!

Been watching that for the first time. I like it.