NFL 2023 Offseason

[Texzilla58 4735]

I agree if you have a true elite level NFL QB, who makes lesser players better, who can win games in tough situations. How many of those are in the league? At best 10. Daniel Jones at $40mil is not it. It’s a puzzle that has all kinds of different solutions which makes the off-season so interesting to watch. Which is correct? What gets you a ring.

Rams spent picks, players, and big money on Matt Stafford and got a Super Bowl. Broncos did same and got a declining Russell Wilson.

Lamar Jackson has painted himself into a box. Right now he costs 2 number 1’s. $$250 mil. Fully Guaranteed. And he’s been hurt last two years. And you have to revamp your entire offense to accommodate him. He’s offended by offers of generational wealth. Going to the owners meeting to make something happen. Right.

[Vic Mackey 47029]

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[Pam Cummings 9641]

Easy to tell someone to gamble on themselves when it's not your money.

[Vic Mackey 47029]

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[Vic Mackey 47029]

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[Vic Mackey 47029]

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[cmontexas 3271]

Its funny how Lamar Jackson has become a partisan topic. It was even featured on Fox News

Edited March 30, 2023 by cmontexas

[Brothahorn 10087]

2 minutes ago, cmontexas said:

Its funny how Lamar Jackson has become a partisan topic. It was even featured on Fox News

I would guess there is a lot of salt being thrown at Lamar and his family by the agents. The last thing they want is a guy free ranging. Other players might start getting funny ideas.

[Texzilla58 4735]

Its funny how Lamar Jackson has become a partisan topic. It was even featured on Fox News

It’s ridiculous that those supporting Lamar and saying this is a racist plot against Lamar when teams are lining up to draft a new crop of black QBs. No one will mention his declining stats, his injury history, the limited game. Just “give him what he wants!” “They owe him!” His stupidity and stubborness could see that he never plays another down.

[cmontexas 3271]

3 hours ago, Texzilla58 said:

It’s ridiculous that those supporting Lamar and saying this is a racist plot against Lamar when teams are lining up to draft a new crop of black QBs. No one will mention his declining stats, his injury history, the limited game. Just “give him what he wants!” “They owe him!” His stupidity and stubborness could see that he never plays another down.

Its funny though how you personally have posted on this thread at least 10 times about Lamar Jackson. Nobody said anything about racism either except you added that

Edited March 31, 2023 by cmontexas

[Texzilla58 4735]

You’re not reading the same tweets I’m seeing or watching the same shows.

[Vic Mackey 47029]

Its funny though how you personally have posted on this thread at least 10 times about Lamar Jackson. Nobody said anything about racism either except you added that

The tweet I posted insinuated racism is at play here as to why no team is pursuing Lamar. At least that's how I read it with the boycott line.

[Gene Parmesan 4006]

4 hours ago, Vic Mackey said:

The tweet I posted insinuated racism is at play here as to why no team is pursuing Lamar. At least that's how I read it with the boycott line.

There is a tweet that insinuates racism about every topic under the sun.  Is "The Infamous" a prominent twitter personality or just a nobody spouting off a useless opinion that is being echoed across multiple platforms in order to make this stand?  What shows/radio/news outlets/sports personalities are insinuating racism?  That's an honest question because I'm not plugged into anything outside of Texas.

[Texzilla58 4735]

It’s been a resurrection of the same complaints from the same folks who brought this up on Kaepernick. Owner collusion = racism. It’s a similar situation. A declining running QB wanting top dollar.

So Lamar is calling it a racist problem. As have a number of ex players like Dez Bryant, JJ Watt, and others. NFLN guests have called it that. Tom’s of writers. Just google it.

Watson, Dak, Mahomes, Kyler Murray, and Russell Wilson are all black on big money contracts doesnt blunt the commentary. The fact the Ravens offered him a $230m contract and large guarantee doesn’t matter. His crazy ass mother doesn’t matter.

The NFL has its faults but no organization has transferred more generational wealth to black men than it.

[Pam Cummings 9641]

I've seen literally nobody draw parallels between Jackson/Kaepernick. Pretty much every reasonable person can see that the dude is just being stubborn and hurting himself. Wow who knew that negotiating a contract worth hundreds of millions of dollars with only your mom to help could go poorly.

[Vic Mackey 47029]

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[Pam Cummings 9641]

That's a cute thought, except for the fact that players have negotiated without an agent before and received contracts....Laremy Tunsil out front and all....

[TonyTexas 10510]

Digging your heels in on your initial position is seldom a good negotiation tactic. 

[LTtxfan 49185]

Hahahaha 😂😂😂😂

[TonyTexas 10510]

Baltimore moving up from 22 to a position to take Richardson will cost them at least 1 of the 1st rounders they’d get by moving on from Jackson. At least they wouldn’t have to retool their offensive scheme. 

[LTtxfan 49185]

 

[Deej 76768]

22 hours ago, Texzilla58 said:

It’s ridiculous that those supporting Lamar and saying this is a racist plot against Lamar when teams are lining up to draft a new crop of black QBs. No one will mention his declining stats, his injury history, the limited game. Just “give him what he wants!” “They owe him!” His stupidity and stubborness could see that he never plays another down.

If you don't have Justin Tucker to bail him out for three points, why would you want him?

[Deej 76768]

5 hours ago, Pam Cummings said:

who knew that negotiating a contract worth hundreds of millions of dollars with only your mom to help could go poorly

Of only his mom was South Austin's mom.

[Brothahorn 10087]

4 hours ago, Pam Cummings said:

That's a cute thought, except for the fact that players have negotiated without an agent before and received contracts....Laremy Tunsil out front and all....

Fair point. But QB money is a lot different than LT money. Larry's career earnings are projected to be $93M by 2026. And QB's are the face of the league. I don't think it's owner collusion or any of that nonsense. But I do think that the agents don't want to see guys getting 9 figure-guaranteed contracts without them. 

[Vic Mackey 47029]

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[Nicole44 22059]

The Lamar stuff isn’t tragic. It’s stupidity. Yes he’s great. Yes he won an MVP. Yes he works hard. Blah blah blah…Get a fucking agent! He hasn’t won anything. The DW contact with the Browns (a shit organization) shouldn’t be the the standard or a reason to hold out on money that was offered and that was fair. According to the reports he was offered a contract that was more than fair. He wants guaranteed money and he hasn’t won shit. There are like two or three QBs in the league perhaps worth that. Outside of Mahomes? Get a fucking agent! Only two teams were interested in Brady when he left the Patriots. Two. He won TB a SB. And got them to the NFC championship in his second year. Lamar is playing checkers and can’t see the long game with endorsements and other things bc he doesn’t have a clue and those around him have no clue and honestly at the most important position in the NFL do you want someone that naive/clueless? 

[Texzilla58 4735]

He wants a fully guaranteed contract. He was offered a guarantee of around $160 mill. That’s not counting the additional $90 mil if it plays out. Only Watson and Kirk Cousins have fully guaranteed deals. Not Rodgers. Mahomes. Brady. Allen. Nobody else. He’s under the spell of his mama and their egos. He has missed out on big money in endorsements that a great agent brings to the party.

It’s sad how some of these players get manipulated by family and hangers on. Tyron Smith was a victim. His rookie year he was killing it and yet was very depressed. Finally the coaches and some players got him to open up. His parents were making him hand over his game checks and giving him an allowance of like $100. Jerry got him a good attorney and some counseling to get him extricated from the situation. Damn shame.

[Guest]

On 3/29/2023 at 2:03 PM, Pam Cummings said:

Easy to tell someone to gamble on themselves when it's not your money.

It's easy to demand someone else spend theirs on you too... and then want it guaranteed, despite past results.

Hell, if he just accepts the franchise tag, he will DOUBLE his NFL earnings in one year, but nah, fuck that.   Also, think about all of that cash he's saved by not having to pay an agent.

FAFO.  Bigtime.

Edited April 1, 2023 by slorch

[Patrick Bateman 3913]

12 hours ago, slorch said:

It's easy to demand someone else spend theirs on you too... and then want it guaranteed, despite past results.

Hell, if he just accepts the franchise tag, he will DOUBLE his NFL earnings in one year, but nah, fuck that.   Also, think about all of that cash he's saved by not having to pay an agent.

FAFO.  Bigtime.

He probably feels he's had a better career and his worth more than guys like Daniel Jones and Derek Carr, respectively, and wants to be compensated accordingly.  Personally, I think he's sort of fucked by the system.  On the open market, he doesn't have a big issue getting 45m+ AAV with somewhere around 200m guaranteed but teams don't want to give up 2 first rounders for the right to pay him that.  He'll probably end up slinking back to sign his franchise deal and then hit the market next year, but that was probably always the intended solution....

 

[Texzilla58 4735]

If he had an agent he would have had all that explained to him. He would have seen the deal the Ravens had on the table for him was a great one for the circumstances they are in. No one wants to deal with this stubborness or his crazy ads mama.

[Burt Macklin 19023]

On 4/1/2023 at 11:12 PM, Patrick Bateman said:

He probably feels he's had a better career and his worth more than guys like Daniel Jones and Derek Carr, respectively, and wants to be compensated accordingly.  Personally, I think he's sort of fucked by the system.  On the open market, he doesn't have a big issue getting 45m+ AAV with somewhere around 200m guaranteed but teams don't want to give up 2 first rounders for the right to pay him that.  He'll probably end up slinking back to sign his franchise deal and then hit the market next year, but that was probably always the intended solution....

 

No other union gets slaughtered like the NFLPA. Agreeing to two years of the franchise tag was so stupid. If an NFL team drafts you in the first round, they can keep you for 7 years before you get any chance to hit the open market. That’s absurd in a league with such short careers. 

[BurntOrange&White 39931]

On 3/30/2023 at 6:25 PM, Brothahorn said:

I would guess there is a lot of salt being thrown at Lamar and his family by the agents. The last thing they want is a guy free ranging. Other players might start getting funny ideas.

Unfortunately I think not having a legit agent has severely hurt him in this process. 

[BurntOrange&White 39931]

Lets be real....he should have taken that deal.

 

 

Since then, Schefter has clarified what the deal was.

“Here’s the deal. This is something that Chris Mortensen and I reported in September. Nothing new,” Schefter said. “We saw the contract back then and it was reviewed and the contract included $133 million guaranteed at signing. Fully guaranteed. Then, essentially, there were injury guarantees that brought it up to $175 million guaranteed for injury. That’s real. It was $168 million—there was another $7 million that is accounted for at a later date that makes it $175 million in guaranteed salary. Then, we mention this springing guarantee of basically $25 million. It would’ve raised it from $175 million to $200 million if he was on the roster on the fifth day of the 2026 league year. So, three years from now, if he’s on the roster, he gets another 25 [million dollars guaranteed].”

Schefter goes on to explain why it is essentially $175 million guaranteed.

“Essentially, for that $175 million not to kick in, Baltimore would’ve had to release him now and take a cap hit of $70 million. They’re not doing that.”

NFL Network’s Ian Rapoport was also on air on Tuesday and shared what he’s heard.

“We had heard that the Ravens offered him a fully guaranteed deal. I’d heard that it was a shorter deal,” Rapoport said. “It seems to be, not 100-percent guaranteed but it seems to be what Lamar Jackson is indicating that he got a three-year deal for $133 million fully guaranteed from the Ravens.”

He also shared different methods in which the Ravens have attempted to sign Jackson.

“The Ravens have tried every different way to get this contract done. Long, short, a lot of guarantees, not as much guarantees but high APY,” Rapoport said. “It simply has not happened. So Lamar Jackson is showing us, ‘Here’s what I turned down.’”

Edited April 3, 2023 by BurntOrange&White

[Brothahorn 10087]

He definitely should have taken the deal. I thought so, way back at the beginning of this season.

I'm just not convinced an agent could have gotten him to take it, either. If someone has an over flated sense of value, they rarely listen to anyone or take sound advice. Because they will always find a yes man to tell them what they want to hear.

He played himself.

[BurntOrange&White 39931]

2 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

He definitely should have taken the deal. I thought so, way back at the beginning of this season.

I'm just not convinced an agent could have gotten him to take it, either. If someone has an over flated sense of value, they rarely listen to anyone or take sound advice. Because they will always find a yes man to tell them what they want to hear.

He played himself.

Yeah I agree with that....but just having someone telling you that it's probably the best you can get and you SHOULD take it is better than having a room full of people only saying what you want them to say.

[Vic Mackey 47029]

That is why you can't feel sorry for Lamar. Ravens offered him a good deal. Who cares about the Deshaun deal. That was the Browns being the Browns. That isn't the market. Lamar hasn't finished a season since 2020. He's won one playoff game his whole career, which matches Daniel Jones and Baker Mayfield. Does he really think teams are going to be lining up to hand him a huge fully guaranteed contract? Yeah, not happening Lamar. Especially not now with the giving up 2 draft picks comes into play. 

[Vic Mackey 47029]

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[LTtxfan 49185]

14 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

.

 

 

I like this future pic of Aaron Rodgers...

[Texzilla58 4735]

Don’t think Ol’ Mr Happy Trees was as strange as Aaron Rodgers, searching for his spirit animal in a black room while chugging ayahuasca and eating his star child girlfriend’s moon cheese.

[Texzilla58 4735]

He definitely should have taken the deal. I thought so, way back at the beginning of this season.

I'm just not convinced an agent could have gotten him to take it, either. If someone has an over flated sense of value, they rarely listen to anyone or take sound advice. Because they will always find a yes man to tell them what they want to hear.

He played himself.

This is the cause of Lamar’s troubles. Having mama as his “manager”. She is a complete idiot. Does not understand basic contract language. It’s sad to watch. Ravens offered him a killer contract based on the market and these two dug in their heels. If the NFLPA is advising him to do this as a means to try to get guaranteed deals to be a common thing they should be held accountable as well. The owners will lock their ass out again and the rank and file will stand against the QBs sucking even more money from them.

[LTtxfan 49185]

6 hours ago, Vic Mackey said:

That is why you can't feel sorry for Lamar. Ravens offered him a good deal. Who cares about the Deshaun deal. That was the Browns being the Browns. That isn't the market. Lamar hasn't finished a season since 2020. He's won one playoff game his whole career, which matches Daniel Jones and Baker Mayfield. Does he really think teams are going to be lining up to hand him a huge fully guaranteed contract? Yeah, not happening Lamar. Especially not now with the giving up 2 draft picks comes into play. 

Some talk that more interest from other teams will start immediately after the draft -- a lot of teams don't want to give up their 2023 1st Rd picks.

I agree that Lamar needs to back off all the guaranteed money or else he'll have to either sit out 2023 or play another year for the Ravens... 

[Texzilla58 4735]

So far he has refused to sign his tag. If he doesn’t sign by July 15 it can get really ugly.

I have sat in negotiations with idiots where the opposing side pushed their position so hard, and it was so unpalatable, and their position a hard line, that we simply shut our laptops and ended further discussion and spiked the deal because we just didn’t trust them. So we told them to fuck themselves.

I think the Ravens are there. If he would sign his franchise tag a team could then negotiate a trade with the Ravens with a lower price. His stubborness is costing him a trade but he’s too stupid to understand that.

[Vic Mackey 47029]

So far he has refused to sign his tag. If he doesn’t sign by July 15 it can get really ugly.

I have sat in negotiations with idiots where the opposing side pushed their position so hard, and it was so unpalatable, and their position a hard line, that we simply shut our laptops and ended further discussion and spiked the deal because we just didn’t trust them. So we told them to fuck themselves.

I think the Ravens are there. If he would sign his franchise tag a team could then negotiate a trade with the Ravens with a lower price. His stubborness is costing him a trade but he’s too stupid to understand that.

Seems like it's a pride thing at this point. He doesn't want to be the one who caves in at this point.

I wonder how this changes the Ravens draft strategy. They have Huntley behind Lamar. I doubt he's a long term answer but not sure how they feel about him. Do they trade up to try and get someone this year? The qb draft class is kind of meh.

[Texzilla58 4735]

The Ravens are bringing in Anthony Richardson for a workout/meeting. That’s how they’re dealing with Lamar. That’s a sweet shot across the bow. Lamar we’re bringing in the guy in the draft that most resembles you but might be a better athlete.

I think Lamar and mama have allowed their ego to paint themselves into such a corner that they cannot lose face and take a lesser deal than they demand. Even if it’s generational wealth beyond what any of us can dream. He’ll sit out before going back. It’s ugly to watch but he’s like that 5 year old that won’t eat one spoon of black eyed peas and will sit staring at it for hours.

[Murfdogg21 4412]

When Leveon Bell refused to sign the Pittsburgh franchise tag and sat out a year, the question was not resolved that if the Steelers kept the tag on him again and Bell signed, would he get paid based on a Year 1 of tag (since he never signed or played under the first tag) or would it jump to the much higher $$$ Year 2 tag value. 
 

If Lamar sits this year, he rejects the ~$45M. If the Ravens tag him again in 2024, if it is ruled as the first tag he played under, he’ll get the average of the top 5 QBs (probably in the $45-50m range). If it is ruled to be his second year, he gets a 20% bump so ~$60M. Ravens would probably pay it either way but it’s a $15m issue for Lamar and for the Ravens’ cap space. Completely fucks up their plans to compete in 2023 so this is stupid. The Ravens would cut to the chase and offer him thr $105 for two years today. They already offered him $133m fully guaranteed for 3, in addition to the longer deal that came out to like $175m guaranteed. Lamar’s mom is an idiot. 

[Had Enough 2081]

Not the same position but after Leveon returned he was nothing like the player before he sat. Lamar can’t afford to lose any twitch by sitting a year. I suppose he could come back stronger mentally prepared, but that seems unlikely. Kinda unreal someone could sit out a year during their prime.

Not a Ravens fan at all but liked him. Now, I hope he falls on his face.

[Juicy 727]

You would hope seeing how the hardball played out for Leveon that Lamar would hold out as long as possible but at the end he will need to take whatever is left on the table to  not sit out the year. 

Le'veon absolutely ruined his career and value missing that year. One of the dumber moves a player has made in regards to their financial well being 

 

Back to back years of 1900+ yards. to 1100 yards to 400 yards. Went from playing for 1 team to playing for 5 in 4 years, just horrible. 

Edited April 5, 2023 by Juicy

[Murfdogg21 4412]

1 hour ago, Juicy said:

You would hope seeing how the hardball played out for Leveon that Lamar would hold out as long as possible but at the end he will need to take whatever is left on the table to  not sit out the year. 

Le'veon absolutely ruined his career and value missing that year. One of the dumber moves a player has made in regards to their financial well being 

Le’veon made $4m his first 4 years, $12 million in 2017; then rejected both a two year offer for $30m and the franchise tag (one year at $16m). He ended up collecting only $28m from 2019-2021 from the Jets, Chiefs, Ravens, and Bucs. Playing 2018 for $16m probably wouldn’t have decreased the $28m he earned later. Truly dumb decision. 

[Ignatius 4017]

He’s ultimately going to sign the tag, play next year, and then insist on his 100% guarantee next year in an environment when Burrow and Herbert get them just like Trevor Lawrence will when he’s eligible. The Ravens won’t be the first to blink but San Diego might and Cincinnati absolutely will…

Edited April 5, 2023 by Ignatius

[Brothahorn 10087]

3 hours ago, Murfdogg21 said:

Le’veon made $4m his first 4 years, $12 million in 2017; then rejected both a two year offer for $30m and the franchise tag (one year at $16m). He ended up collecting only $28m from 2019-2021 from the Jets, Chiefs, Ravens, and Bucs. Playing 2018 for $16m probably wouldn’t have decreased the $28m he earned later. Truly dumb decision. 

And he had an agent 🙂