Texas Basketball 2023-24

[CTC2 2797]

1 hour ago, Rickylovesweed said:

I put it at under 5% chance both Hunter and Mitchell return. 

Hunter in particular, he's not worth any type of NIL money when you can get a better guard in the portal. 

 

Yes, I think that Mitchell is in a tough position. If he feels like he needs another year he almost can’t risk spending it with this staff given the questions about his development. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

how many good players is a great coach worth? realistically, if RT and chris beard were coaches in the same league, let’s say the big xii- how enormous of a roster advantage would RT have to own to have a better season than chris beard? w/l record, kenpom, NET rating, postseason results, performance in relation to expectations, etc? 

i’ve talked about this a few times this year, but it continues to amaze me how huge the disconnect is among 99% of fans, specifically that they can all see how impactful one great player can be, yet they consistently fail to understand how much more important having a great coach is. chris beard is worth five max abmases. a great coach will make chicken salad out of chicken shit, while a mediocre-bad coach will mismanage and ruin the potential of an otherwise pretty good roster. we’ve seen this on both sides for as long as anyone can remember. and yet at still the majority of fans place more weight on a single player than they ever do the HC.

why don’t people understand this: your head coach is so, so, SO much more important than any one, or two, or even three players in 99.9% of cases. yet when the team loses a disu, or an isaiah taylor, or a cam ridley it’s like, “shit, that’s a really big deal!” but then when you replace a top ~5 coach with a guy who shouldn’t even be a HC at this level people are like, “now hold on, let’s not jump to any conclusions, let’s just wait and see what he can do.” why is that?

i mean whenever this job has opened up in the past, not a single person has said, “let’s go hire (anyone even remotely close to RT as a coach).” it’s like, “let’s get jay wright, or billy donovan, or Coach Cal!” for some reason the pedigree of the HC matters when we need one, but then once we hire a guy who is proven to not be able to do this job, suddenly we throw his CV out the window and just assume/predict the best. well, i say “we” when i really mean “a whole bunch of y’all”. i understand the importance of a coach; i do not understand why so many other sports fans don’t.

[HookEm 2467]

I think most of us realize how important the coach is. That is why it was so devastating when Beard fucked up. It was literally my worst moment as a sports fan. I have said many times that we are never going to get a coach better than him again. He was the perfect coach in the perfect situation.

And in a vacuum, not a single one of us would have hired RT. If he was still at UTEP when the job came open he wouldn’t get a single phone call. Everyone acknowledges this.

But that wasn’t the situation. There was no way we weren’t hiring him after the job he did last year. You can debate how much he was responsible for our success, but he was getting the job. And he is going to be in the job for at least 2-3 more years. Maybe longer.

I don’t think many people are blind to who RT is. He isn’t a top-10 coach. Or a top-25 coach. But he might be a top-10 recruiter. And we might have a top-10 staff. And he has the resources of the 1,000 pound gorilla of college athletics in a time when we can flex all of our power.

So I doubt we are going to suck much more than we do this year even with his flaws. And the season isn’t over yet. The team could very well make a run.

[closetojumping 62741]

Surly's Law of Basketball Discussions: The longer a topic is discussed in a thread, the probability of the thread devolving into lamentations about losing Chris Beard to his own stupid fucking idiotic weak shit as a grown man approaches 1.

Derka, shut the fuck up for a few pages about losing Beard and the what ifs. Jesus Tittyfucking Christ.

10 hours ago, Rickylovesweed said:

I put it at under 5% chance both Hunter and Mitchell return. 

Hunter in particular, he's not worth any type of NIL money when you can get a better guard in the portal. 

 

You don't need to attempt to be a cap manager for Texas NIL when it comes to men's basketball. If Hunter comes back (if Texas wants him back), he gets NIL. If Texas wants a guard in the portal, there's competitive NIL money. 

10 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

i have never/will never understand this reaction. every time someone projects a player or team to be awesome nobody ever has a problem with it. yet every single time that someone says that a player or team won’t be good/as good as everyone else wants them to be, we get this, “wow you’re so miserable and pessimistic!” response. 

you wanna ask if we’re going to do stuff all over again? i might ask if this is going to be a repeat of 2016-17 when my take that we were in for a rough year was met with fiery opposition in the board, with vehement insistence that there was no way to possibly project what the season/team would look like. before that season started, when people said that shaka’s second team could be even better than his first team that finished 3rd in the big xii (dead serious i remember you being one of these people) nobody cared. nobody called it outrageous, even though it really was an outrageously optimistic statement. but when i said that we wouldn’t be that good, suddenly people had a big issue and i got this type of reaction. it’s been this way every single time i’ve taken this position on any player or team from this university to this day, and to this day i don’t understand it, at all.

you people take an objectively rational take and, because it’s “pessimistic” (more reasonable people might call it “realistic”) you act as if it’s just totally unfounded and baseless, that only a miserable, cynical person could possibly come to this conclusion. it’s ridiculous.

we’re losing the bulk of our production from what is already a mediocre team, the players who are returning are either young, unproven, mediocre-bad, or all of the above, and our head coach has irrefutably proven himself to be out of his depth at his position. do not act like this take is some overly negative, cynical view of things. it’s based firmly in reality. for christs sake, shaka smart is a much better HC than rodney terry, and you’re seriously gonna sit here and act like there’s no reason to be down on our prospects going forward? stop it.

I know you aren't stupid, so I assume you're being purposely obtuse with this post.

NIL and the portal make references to a prior era irrelevant. 

I assume, based on the current data regarding the roster and zero faith in Rodney Terry, that next year will indeed be worse. That considered, in spite of the walls of text you're posting to attest otherwise, we do not know that definitively at this point in time. Terry has one of the best NIL arsenals anywhere and he gets to recruit in the portal to Texas and Austin. It is both fruitless and nonsensical for anyone to be speaking with certainty about next season until the portal for the next season is closed. 

[HookEm 2467]

[Fud 9552]

16 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

If Hunter comes back (if Texas wants him back),

I think this part was his point

He's not a championship level winning player as a starter

[HookEm 2467]

He was a starter last year and we were a Brock over the back call from making the Final Four.  If we got there (in Houston), all bets are off. We probably would have been favored to win the whole thing.

And the year before that he was a freshman starter on an Iowa State Sweet 16 team.

Hunter has his flaws, but he absolutely could be the starter on a great team if he has the right pieces around him.  Abmas isn't a perfect fit.  And when we go small, Weaver isn't either.  But Tre Johnson might be a really good fit at SG/SF.  And maybe Weaver will get there with another year.

[closetohumping 17443]

3 hours ago, HookEm said:

I think most of us realize how important the coach is. That is why it was so devastating when Beard fucked up. It was literally my worst moment as a sports fan. I have said many times that we are never going to get a coach better than him again. He was the perfect coach in the perfect situation.

And in a vacuum, not a single one of us would have hired RT. If he was still at UTEP when the job came open he wouldn’t get a single phone call. Everyone acknowledges this.

But that wasn’t the situation. There was no way we weren’t hiring him after the job he did last year. You can debate how much he was responsible for our success, but he was getting the job. And he is going to be in the job for at least 2-3 more years. Maybe longer.

I don’t think many people are blind to who RT is. He isn’t a top-10 coach. Or a top-25 coach. But he might be a top-10 recruiter. And we might have a top-10 staff. And he has the resources of the 1,000 pound gorilla of college athletics in a time when we can flex all of our power.

So I doubt we are going to suck much more than we do this year even with his flaws. And the season isn’t over yet. The team could very well make a run.

Beard would've been perfect for here.  I'm not sure he's a top fiver like a lot of people in this thread are claiming.

[dcar00 14218]

6 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

Beard would've been perfect for here.  I'm not sure he's a top fiver like a lot of people in this thread are claiming.

That's the issue.  He wasn't a top fiver yet but he had a real good chance to be based on the data and we have pretty good data on what Terry is or has a chance to be.

Maybe Tre Johnson will be that good and Terry can change the trajectory.  He's by no means a bad coach but he seems about meh.  seems like there are 30 or so coaches out there with his type of HC resume.  He probably isn't going to X and O anyone but he could Jimmy and Joe them.  Guy V Lewis comes to mind.

He's got them on the cusp of the tourney which is what required as a baseline at Texas.

[closetohumping 17443]

Just now, dcar00 said:

That's the issue.  He wasn't a top fiver yet but he had a real good chance to be based on the data and we have pretty good data on what Terry is or has a chance to be.

Maybe Tre Johnson will be that good and Terry can change the trajectory.  He's by no means a bad coach but he seems about meh.  seems like there are 30 or so coaches out there with his type of HC resume.  He probably isn't going to X and O anyone but he could Jimmy and Joe them.  Guy V Lewis comes to mind.

He's got them on the cusp of the tourney which is what required as a baseline at Texas.

Yes. I’m not sure Rodney is a top fifty coach but at the moment we were painted into a corner. No he wasn’t my first choice. 
 

Guy recruited some crazy players.  Absurd athletes. I hope Rodney can get on that level. I have my doubts but I’m willing to see how this plays out rather than screaming at people on the other side of the fence

[TommysTinyTowels 787]

FYI In the Statesman today:

Ithiel Horton is quietly garnering more playing time

Terry continues to tweak his rotation, with reserve guard Ithiel Horton seeing five more minutes than starter Chendall Weaver. Horton, a graduate transfer from Central Florida, has averaged 23 minutes a game over the past three games and has drawn praise from Terry for his rebounding and defensive work. He also made a pair of 3-pointers, the first time he’s sunk more than one from long distance since exploding for 20 points against his former UCF teammates Jan. 17.

They said it: “I thought Ithiel came in and played well. He hit those two threes and guarded really hard, and that kind of kept Chendall off the court. I think we can play a lot of different ways; sometimes, you’ve got to mix it up a little bit and go with different guys.” — Texas coach Rodney Terry

[HtownHorn 14695]

12 hours ago, CTC2 said:

Yes, I agree. RT certainly could put together a good roster via the portal. Guy at Tech did it this year. 
But, you also have to acknowledge some real and practical headwinds to him doing so.  

The problem wasn't he who he got in the portal it was bringing back both Hunter and Mitchell instead of trying to replace them both in the portal. Frankly, turning over your roster every year in the portal seems like a bad idea. You need to start getting some continuity with the 2-4 year HS kids. I would personally stay away from the high athletic low skill 5-stars. I also think that Tre Johnson and Cam Scott are better than any guard currently on our team. So, we will see.

[shadow_operative 15932]

2 hours ago, closetohumping said:

I’m not sure Rodney is a top fifty coach

i’m quite certain he’s not. there’s a reason he was an assistant after 27 years of d-1 coaching. he went 126-108 (62-58) at fresno state before making a lateral move to UTEP. he was 37-48 (19-33) at UTEP before making a downward move to an assistant coach under Beard, which is where he still would be/should be if beard weren’t such an idiot. how is this even a conversation.

if our football team went an hired a guy who’d spent 2/3 of his nearly three decade career as an assistant with a career HC record ~.500 at mountain west and CUSA schools the fan base would lose their minds. when the team then didn’t perform well/up to its potential the fan base would be pulling its collective hair out pressuring CDC to fire the chump and hire Westlake’s HC who they’re all certain is a better HC. our basketball fans? nah. “hey let’s give him some time! gee, i wonder where he ranks among the national HC landscape? maybe he’s going to put it together! he does have that one good recruit coming in!”

[HtownHorn 14695]

1 hour ago, TommysTinyTowels said:

FYI In the Statesman today:

Ithiel Horton is quietly garnering more playing time

Terry continues to tweak his rotation, with reserve guard Ithiel Horton seeing five more minutes than starter Chendall Weaver. Horton, a graduate transfer from Central Florida, has averaged 23 minutes a game over the past three games and has drawn praise from Terry for his rebounding and defensive work. He also made a pair of 3-pointers, the first time he’s sunk more than one from long distance since exploding for 20 points against his former UCF teammates Jan. 17.

They said it: “I thought Ithiel came in and played well. He hit those two threes and guarded really hard, and that kind of kept Chendall off the court. I think we can play a lot of different ways; sometimes, you’ve got to mix it up a little bit and go with different guys.” — Texas coach Rodney Terry

Weaver and Horton should be playing in leiu of Hunter, especially when Hunter is bringing nothing offensively to the table.

[shadow_operative 15932]

1 hour ago, TommysTinyTowels said:

Ithiel Horton is quietly garnering more playing time

 

[HookEm 2467]

I like Weaver better than Horton by a huge margin, but if we are going to advance in the tourney we will need Horton. I have to believe he is better than he has played for us this year.  And nobody could hit anything on Monday, so I didn't really have a problem with him getting minutes.  I just thought they should have come the expense of Hunter.

Last 5 games:  

• Hunter - 32.4 min, 35.4 FG%, 26.7 3P%, 8.2 PTS, 4.0 REB, 4.6 AST, 1.6 STL
• Weaver - 25.0 min, 58.3 FG%, 0.0 3P%, 8.0 PTS 5.0 REB, 1.6 AST, 0.2 STL
• Horton - 16.4 min, 26.7 FG%, 25.0 3P%, 2.6 PTS, 1.4 REB, 0.4 AST, 0.2 STL  - Dude is just playing BAD.

Overall, with the exception of Horton, I like the fact that RT seems to know who his best players are, and tends to keep them on the court.  Abmas absolutely has to stay on the floor, and he is averaging 37  mpg in conference.  Disu... if he isn't in foul trouble (big if), should also be getting 30+ min.  Mitchell has been getting 32 mpg in conference and he is critical, being really the only guy on the team who rebounds consistently well.  The delta in quality between the starters and the bench is just massive.  

[HtownHorn 14695]

2 hours ago, closetohumping said:

Yes. I’m not sure Rodney is a top fifty coach but at the moment we were painted into a corner. No he wasn’t my first choice. 
 

Guy recruited some crazy players.  Absurd athletes. I hope Rodney can get on that level. I have my doubts but I’m willing to see how this plays out rather than screaming at people on the other side of the fence

You know who also wasn't a Top 50 coach last year, fucking Danny Hurley. He had a very Rodney Terry type coaching career until he had a team talented enough to make a run. We have seen what Terry can do when he has a talented roster. This team for a lot of reasons is just not that talented.

[closetohumping 17443]

8 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

i’m quite certain he’s not. there’s a reason he was an assistant after 27 years of d-1 coaching. he went 126-108 (62-58) at fresno state before making a lateral move to UTEP. he was 37-48 (19-33) at UTEP before making a downward move to an assistant coach under Beard, which is where he still would be/should be if beard weren’t such an idiot. how is this even a conversation.

if our football team went an hired a guy who’d spent 2/3 of his nearly three decade career as an assistant with a career HC record ~.500 at mountain west and CUSA schools the fan base would lose their minds. when the team then didn’t perform well/up to its potential the fan base would be pulling its collective hair out pressuring CDC to fire the chump and hire Westlake’s HC who they’re all certain is a better HC. our basketball fans? nah. “hey let’s give him some time! gee, i wonder where he ranks among the national HC landscape? maybe he’s going to put it together! he does have that one good recruit coming in!”

Michigan football is about 90x more prestigious than we are and they promoted Moore.  I dont necessarily agree with it but it puts our situation in perspective 

 

 

getting portal or high school talent doesn’t seem to be an issue with Rodney or our last five coaches

2 minutes ago, HtownHorn said:

You know who also wasn't a Top 50 coach last year, fucking Danny Hurley. He had a very Rodney Terry type coaching career until he had a team talented enough to make a run. We have seen what Terry can do when he has a talented roster. This team for a lot of reasons is just not that talented.

Choir preaching.  We just won the conference tourney and were a couple of questionable calls from making the final four.  When was the last time we did that?  Doesn’t matter if it was Chris’s players as some have pointed out that “we didn’t have nba talent”.  Rodney did a good job last year.  My preference was for an open coaching search but I get why we hired him. Now let’s see what happens ina. Year or two 

[shadow_operative 15932]

12 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

Michigan football is about 90x more prestigious than we are and they promoted Moore.

beaides the fact that i think he’s a terrible hire, he’s 38 years old with no HC experience. in other words he’s not an analog for RT who has already proven himself to be a mediocre HC at a level below the one he’s currently at.

[HookEm 2467]

I was looking at historic Massey rankings today. I realize they aren't perfect, but they are at least objective, free and easy to access.  Anyway, I pulled the final Massey ranking each year going back to the start of the Barnes era.  Here they are with the years ranked best to worst.

Barnes

• 2006 – 5
• 2003 – 6
• 2008 – 8
• 2011 – 9 
• 2004 – 11
• 2000 – 12
• 2010 – 20 
• 2009 – 21
• 2001 – 22
• 2007 – 23
• 2012 – 27 
• 2005 – 27
• 2015 – 28 
• 2002 – 29
• 2014 – 34 
• 1999 – 49
• 2013 – 86 
• 1998 – 95 

Shaka

• 2021 – 18 
• 2019 – 25 
• 2018 – 31 
• 2016 – 32 
• 2020 – 39 
• 2017 – 62 

Beard

• 2023 – 7   (Partial Year)
• 2022 – 20 

Terry

• 2023 – 7   (Partial Year)
• 2024 – 25 

Some takeaways.... We are currently 25th.  The median season rank since 1998 is 25.  The average season is 28.6.  So this terrible season from Terry is actually slightly better than our average for the last 26 years - at least from a computer ranking perspective.

Also Terry's first full year really isn't that far off Beard's first year and is considerably better than Barnes' first couple of years.  I realize they all started in different places, but it isn't like any of them fielded a top-10 team their first year.

I appreciate that we all have higher expectations for this program than what we have averaged, but I still thought it was interesting to have a historical reference.  And to be clear, I'm not using this to say that RT is an awesome coach.

[closetohumping 17443]

1 hour ago, shadow_operative said:

beaides the fact that i think he’s a terrible hire, he’s 38 years old with no HC experience. in other words he’s not an analog for RT who has already proven himself to be a mediocre HC at a level below the one he’s currently at.

Name the last time Fresno was good at basketball?

[shadow_operative 15932]

18 minutes ago, MotownHorn said:

Not clear what Derka thinks of RT. Need another 500 to 600 paragraphs or so to help me understand.

yeah just like everyone needs 500 more of your whiny fucking posts about every single thing that i say or do. jesus christ dude, at least im talking about the subject at hand. ever since your, “i do my best to avoid derka” post you’ve ratcheted your obsession up like never before. you have literally neg repped 80% of my posts since then and you call me out like this on a daily basis. you are pathetic.

everyone here wishes you would stop posting about me and calling me out every. single. goddam. day. you are pathetically obsessed with me. stop it.

Edited February 21 by shadow_operative

[realgreggym 835]

Mo, keep up the good work.😁

[HookEm 2467]

16 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

Name the last time Fresno was good at basketball?

Back in 2016, Terry had Fresno at 25-10, they won their conference tourney and they made it to the NCAA tourney.

Fresno has only made the tourney three times in the last 40 years.  Once in seven years by Terry and twice in seven years by Jerry Tarkanian.  Even a Hall of Fame coach like Tark couldn't get them into the tourney without landing them on probation.  

[shadow_operative 15932]

3 minutes ago, HookEm said:

Back in 2016, Terry had Fresno at 25-10, they won their conference tourney and they made it to the NCAA tourney.

Fresno has only made the tourney three times in the last 40 years.  Once in seven years by Terry and twice in seven years by Jerry Tarkanian.  Even a Hall of Fame coach like Tark couldn't get them into the tourney without landing them on probation.  

they made the tourney (as a 14 seed) but i wouldn’t call them “good”. they beat one team inside the kenpom top 115, and they were actually better the next two seasons.

 

[HookEm 2467]

Out of curiosity, what did the Tark years look like?

[closetohumping 17443]

33 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

they made the tourney (as a 14 seed) but i wouldn’t call them “good”. they beat one team inside the kenpom top 115, and they were actually better the next two seasons.

 

And he was the hc for those two years as well?  So they showed improvement?  Look I’m not and have never said this guy is bill self but “sucking at Fresno st and utep” doesn’t mean as much when just about everyone else has sucked there

[Rickylovesweed 14403]

6 hours ago, Fud said:

I think this part was his point

He's not a championship level winning player as a starter

yeah, I probably should have framed it more in the context of scholarships versus NIL. I think it's at a point where Texas could probably find two better guards in the portal than Hunter. 

It's not so much about a "salary cap" more than Texas can find better players. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

34 minutes ago, HookEm said:

Out of curiosity, what did the Tark years look like?

 

unfortunately it doesn’t go back any further. i’d love to have seen rafer alston’s team and numbers.

Edited February 21 by shadow_operative

[closetohumping 17443]

5 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

 

unfortunately it doesn’t go back any further. i’d love to have seen rafer alston’s team and numbers.

Looks like rafer averaged 11/7 while under sark.  Played with three other nba dudes.  Finished 21-13

 

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/fresno-state/men/1998.html

[jimmyjazz 45970]

Chris Beard hasn't coached Texas in over 14 months.  He hasn't been employed by Texas for over 13 months.

We're still talking about him.

[TommysTinyTowels 787]

4 hours ago, closetohumping said:

“sucking at Fresno st and utep” doesn’t mean as much when just about everyone else has sucked there

About par at Fresno, only worse coach at UTEP was the interim coach.

[shadow_operative 15932]

the ga t that other coaches done much better doesn’t say anything positive about RT, yet i’ve seen this argument countless times here.

He Who Shall Not Be Named went to UALR and in his first year there he won more than anyone else had ever won there before; then he went to TTU and pretty much immediately took that program further than it had ever been- twice; then he came to Texas and within ~17 months of being hired had Texas at no.1 in kenpom for the first time ever; now he’s at ole miss and he’s once again winning at a level that the coaches who came before him couldn’t reach. that’s what really good coaches do.  

[shadow_operative 15932]

btw- we signed our absolute dream signing HC- an alumnus who pretty much immediately turned the program into a national power where it projected to remain for years going forward- only to then lose him almost as quickly as he showed up due to a domestic violence arrest, after which he immediately was hired to be the HC of one of our new conference rivals.

the idea that we’re just supposed to act like he doesn’t exist and never talk about him again is insane. gatekeeping what people are allowed to talk about is lame enough as it is, but to constantly whine that people are still talking about that guy is a totally nonsensical exercise in futility. we’re gonna talk about him. a lot. come to grips with it.

[HookEm 2467]

You conveniently forgot his time at UNLV in his bio. He was winless there. WINLESS!!!

[closetojumping 62741]

13 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

btw- we signed our absolute dream signing HC- an alumnus who pretty much immediately turned the program into a national power where it projected to remain for years going forward- only to then lose him almost as quickly as he showed up due to a domestic violence arrest, after which he immediately was hired to be the HC of one of our new conference rivals.

the idea that we’re just supposed to act like he doesn’t exist and never talk about him again is insane. gatekeeping what people are allowed to talk about is lame enough as it is, but to constantly whine that people are still talking about that guy is a totally nonsensical exercise in futility. we’re gonna talk about him. a lot. come to grips with it.

No one is really gatekeeping. You're still here, bawling and lamenting about Chris Beard, in a thread about the current season for Texas. You've turned this thread into the Bataan Death March of season threads. I'm sure you do the same shit in the next season thread, and then you'll be moaning when people react to it. 

Lose the Cassandra Complex. Outside of a tiny fraction of absolute idiots, we all didn't want Rodney Terry hired, we all eventually came to realize that it was an inevitability that he'd be hired, and we are all totally unsurprised that the aftermath has been lackluster and looks to decline further. We all hope the next guy will be better while realizing that the best shot we had for seeing titles in basketball at Texas got into some sort of biting pushfight with the psycho he idiotically allowed to live with him is now coaching elsewhere. Nothing you are bemoaning or bawling about repeatedly on this thread is creative, original, new or on topic. 

Go soil yourself about Beard on the Beard thread. Go play a victim over there and call the fuckheads who can't help but bait you meanies. We are fucking tired of it here, it isn't someone else's fault, it's on you, get a fucking grip.

[Fud 9552]

One of the basketball guys I follow, Sam Vecenie who does college and nba and draft for the athletic, is an Ohio State guy and posted the candidates he'd be interested in. Texas and Ohio State are similar basketball schools, so I thought the list would be an interesting list (outside of one name) to monitor for the post 2024-2025 season when we might be looking for a coach

Greg Mcdermott

Lamont Paris

Sean Miller

Dusty May

Mick Cronin

Shaka Smart

Niko Nedved

Going into the season, I thought Jerome Tang was a potential Texas guy, but he's not having a great season

[HtownHorn 14695]

Ohio State hiring Shaka Smart would be a total Bjorked move.

[Pancho 44856]

10 minutes ago, Fud said:

One of the basketball guys I follow, Sam Vecenie who does college and nba and draft for the athletic, is an Ohio State guy and posted the candidates he'd be interested in. Texas and Ohio State are similar basketball schools, so I thought the list would be an interesting list (outside of one name) to monitor for the post 2024-2025 season when we might be looking for a coach

Greg Mcdermott

Lamont Paris

Sean Miller

Dusty May

Mick Cronin

Shaka Smart

Niko Nedved

Going into the season, I thought Jerome Tang was a potential Texas guy, but he's not having a great season

While we have a better winning percentage, they have a much better (and deeper) history. Ohio State is above us in terms of basketball prestige. I don’t know that Texas is similar to Ohio State, but it would depend on context. 

[Fud 9552]

2 minutes ago, Pancho said:

While we have a better winning percentage, they have a much better (and deeper) history. Ohio State is above us in terms of basketball prestige. I don’t know that Texas is similar to Ohio State, but it would depend on context. 

ok

[Braff Zacklin 13616]

Just now, Pancho said:

While we have a better winning percentage, they have a much better (and deeper) history. Ohio State is above us in terms of basketball prestige. I don’t know that Texas is similar to Ohio State, but it would depend on context. 

Oh, yeah, well, Durant should've been No.1 over old-man Oden!!

 

(I agree with you, btw, and would also rate Ohio State higher in hoops "prestige." Texas just hasn't done much.)

[Js1 85372]

26 minutes ago, Fud said:

One of the basketball guys I follow, Sam Vecenie who does college and nba and draft for the athletic, is an Ohio State guy and posted the candidates he'd be interested in. Texas and Ohio State are similar basketball schools, so I thought the list would be an interesting list (outside of one name) to monitor for the post 2024-2025 season when we might be looking for a coach

Greg Mcdermott

Lamont Paris

Sean Miller

Dusty May

Mick Cronin

Shaka Smart

Niko Nedved

Going into the season, I thought Jerome Tang was a potential Texas guy, but he's not having a great season

Sean Miller or Mick Cronin - sign me up.

Sadly, we passed over someone like Tommy Lloyd for RT (for obvious reasons) and he just got locked up to 2029 with a raise and heading into the Big 12 next year.  We had our shot and didn't take it. 

[Pancho 44856]

Someone on the aggie board insinuated McCasland was a soft yes for Tech as he was waiting to see what we were going to do. When we hired RT, he made tech official. Of course they also insinuated had Texas hired Calipari that Drew was going to Kentucky then McCasland to Baylor. 

It’s also the Aggie board.

My point being—I like what I’m seeing out of McCasland at tech right now.

[jimmyjazz 45970]

I looked into McDermott after Creighton dog-stomped UConn the other day.  Not a mind-blowing record, but a pretty steady 0.670 type of guy.  Who knows what he could do with the resources in Austin?

One problem might be the suspension he took for a racially insensitive comment he made in the locker room after a loss.

[closetojumping 62741]

52 minutes ago, Pancho said:

While we have a better winning percentage, they have a much better (and deeper) history. Ohio State is above us in terms of basketball prestige. I don’t know that Texas is similar to Ohio State, but it would depend on context. 

This is classroom correct and real world wrong. The assertion that Ohio State is going to get to look at a different list of coaching candidates for prestige and history reasons is absurd. The point being made was correct, Texas and OSU match-up relatively evenly when it comes to reach at this point for basketball coaches, recruits, coverage, etc. 

Ohio State is probably the best analog for Texas when it comes to basketball. They both have high functioning NIL programs for hoops. They both have massive brands. They both are football schools. They both can recruit well nationally at the HS and portal levels. They both have lagging performance in basketball compared to where they should be, compared to their arch rivals, and compared to numerous programs with far less resources. 

[TommysTinyTowels 787]

29 minutes ago, Pancho said:

My point being—I like what I’m seeing out of McCasland at tech right now.

McCasland's long-term career record justified his move to a better position. RT's long-term career record justified him being a fine assistant somewhere.

Empirical evidence might be able to guide you to potential outcomes....

[ztejas 43466]

On 2/21/2024 at 9:35 AM, HookEm said:

He was a starter last year and we were a Brock over the back call from making the Final Four.

This is rather disingenuous. That team was great despite Hunter - not because he was a starter. Carr had one of the best guard seasons in school history and Rice was as good as any player Texas has ever brought off the bench. 

[ztejas 43466]

Also y'all are welcome to take the non-existent coaching search, 2025 Texas basketball and Chris Beard shit to a different thread.

Or maybe I'll start a 2nd 2024 thread with blackjack and hookers where we can actually discuss the current season.

[HookEm 2467]

You have to hand it to Texas Tech, they have a decent hit rate with hoops coaches over the last 30+ years.  And when they miss, they seem to move on from it quickly.

• Bob Knight - Great hire. Made them relevant and won 20+ games every year
• Pat Knight - Bad hire, but fired after 3 years
• Billy Gillispie - Great hire. Could have been one of the best coaches in the Big 12. But that alcohol tho
• Tubby Smith - Good hire. Previous NCoY winner. Won Big12 CoY. But on tail end of his career
• Chris Beard - Great hire. Stole him from UNLV. 
• Mark Adams - Bad hire (who still got them to the Sweet 16), but they moved on quickly
• Grant McCasland - Seems like a great hire

[Pancho 44856]

45 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

This is classroom correct and real world wrong. The assertion that Ohio State is going to get to look at a different list of coaching candidates for prestige and history reasons is absurd. The point being made was correct, Texas and OSU match-up relatively evenly when it comes to reach at this point for basketball coaches, recruits, coverage, etc. 

Ohio State is probably the best analog for Texas when it comes to basketball. They both have high functioning NIL programs for hoops. They both have massive brands. They both are football schools. They both can recruit well nationally at the HS and portal levels. They both have lagging performance in basketball compared to where they should be, compared to their arch rivals, and compared to numerous programs with far less resources. 

 

It wasn’t asserting that Texas and Ohio State were going to get a different list of coaching candidates. It was just informing that Ohio State has a deeper history than Texas in basketball. They have a 1 NC, 4 NC runner ups, 11 FFs, and 15 EEs. We have more recent history and a better winning percentage. That’s all I was saying, which is why I ended the post saying it depends on context. 

Your 2nd paragraph is correct, and I would even say Florida is this group as well even with their 2 NCs. 

And I’ll take it a step further—Texas is probably above those 2 today because of resources and recruiting territory.