Texas Basketball 2023-24

[Hermanator 7124]

12 minutes ago, Steamboat1874 said:

You mean the P5 coach that took us within a whisker of the Final Four last year...?

Name 1 top 2 seed that would be wary of playing us. 

Then describe in detail exactly what matchup nightmares we present to those teams to make that statement true. 

This team has finally played 2 solid back to back games in conference after playing a complete garbage level non conference schedule. So for the first time all season they actually looked competent against quality competition 2 games in a row. 

That's a function of poor coaching. This team isn't so devoid of talent and experience at the CBB level that they should be so inconsistent in their execution. If I were you I'd let the next 3 weeks play out before going to suck RT off over the first good stretch of 2 games he's coached HIS team to play. 

Last season was a Beard team built by Beard and prepared by Beard. RT just kept the wheels on long enough to make an elite 8 run. This season is HIS team. 

 

Edited March 4 by Hermanator

[jimmyjazz 46001]

15 minutes ago, Hermanator said:

Last season was a Beard team built by Beard and prepared by Beard. RT just kept the wheels on long enough to make an elite 8 run. This season is HIS team. 

Don't take this the wrong way, I'm not at all insinuating that 2024 Texas is as good as 2023 Texas, but at this point in the season last year, the 'horns were only 3 games ahead of this current bunch (22-7 vs 19-10, 11-5 vs 8-8 conference).  Better for sure, but it's not like the wheels have completely fallen off.

[Hermanator 7124]

41 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Don't take this the wrong way, I'm not at all insinuating that 2024 Texas is as good as 2023 Texas, but at this point in the season last year, the 'horns were only 3 games ahead of this current bunch (22-7 vs 19-10, 11-5 vs 8-8 conference).  Better for sure, but it's not like the wheels have completely fallen off.

3 games is a pretty big difference, especially given the difference in conference record. 

But it's also why I said wait the next 3 weeks. The next month overall will determine whether Terry was a success or failure this season. If this 2 game streak is truly a gelling of the team and they make another run to the elite 8 or better then it's a success. If they fall short of that it's a step back from the previous season and a failure. The degree to which it's a failure depends on how bad the result ends up being. A sweet 16 run is a small failure compared to where they were a year ago, and losing out then getting bounced in the first round is a huge failure. 

 

[ztejas 43524]

19 hours ago, Hermanator said:

and will have one of the worst P5 coaches in the tournament. 

I'm curious what Terry has done since taking over last season that makes him one of the worst coaches in a potential tournament field. 

Other than get mercilessly shit talked on here for no discernible reason. 

These guys would be lucky to be 9-7 in the B12 this season so far and they're sitting at 8-8, 27 in NET and 26 in kenpom.

When did the realistic expectation for Texas basketball year-over-year become top 15 every season, contending for the conference and making the 2nd weekend?

Y'all realize the guy before Beard won 0 fucking tourney games in six seasons.

[ztejas 43524]

7 minutes ago, Hermanator said:

If they fall short of that it's a step back from the previous season and a failure.

Good God. Do you even remotely understand how much better the roster was last season?

[Hookem2147 21345]

A month and a half ago, we discussed how 3-15 was on the table and realistic as a final record in conference play.

[ztejas 43524]

.

Edited March 4 by ztejas

[Js1 85450]

1 minute ago, Hookem2147 said:

A month and a half ago, we discussed how 3-15 was on the table and realistic as a final record in conference play.

Sounds like us 

[jimmyjazz 46001]

A Sweet 16 run would not be a "small failure".  It would actually in some way suggest that RT has earned more time.  I also think the trigger finger should be twitchy, because in my heart I don't believe he's the guy, but if he makes it to the second weekend then I'm comfortable saying he's earned 2024-2025.  (I seriously doubt he could do anything to get fired this spring at this point, regardless.)

[ztejas 43524]

1 minute ago, jimmyjazz said:

It would actually in some way suggest that RT has earned more time.

It would actually be a massive success. 

Texas hasn't made b2b sweet sixteens in 20 years.

Some of y'all act like we're Kansas or some shit.

[LTtxfan 49324]

Gonna be fun to discuss predictions for how far this Texas team should advance once the NCAA brackets come out.

Might be a fun poll...  😋

[Js1 85450]

12 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

A Sweet 16 run would not be a "small failure".  It would actually in some way suggest that RT has earned more time.  I also think the trigger finger should be twitchy, because in my heart I don't believe he's the guy, but if he makes it to the second weekend then I'm comfortable saying he's earned 2024-2025.  (I seriously doubt he could do anything to get fired this spring at this point, regardless.)

on the court, at least 

[closetohumping 17455]

2 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

A Sweet 16 run would not be a "small failure".  It would actually in some way suggest that RT has earned more time.  I also think the trigger finger should be twitchy, because in my heart I don't believe he's the guy, but if he makes it to the second weekend then I'm comfortable saying he's earned 2024-2025.  (I seriously doubt he could do anything to get fired this spring at this point, regardless.)

Yea I mean I’d be cool with that this year

[HookEm 2467]

Quote

they make another run to the elite 8 or better then it's a success. If they fall short of that it's a step back from the previous season and a failure. 

I've read some stupid shit on this board, but this takes the cake.  In our history, Texas has never made the Elite 8 in back to back years.  Ever.  But if RT doesn't make it this year, the season is a failure?  Lololol.  Do you even stop to think before you spout this crap?

Given our losses, just making the tournament this year is a small success, especially given how brutal the Big 12 is this year.  

Also I get that Beard deserves credit for "building" the roster last year and developing the players in the offseason. But RT didn't exactly "inherit" the team.  He and the rest of the staff were right there in the middle of it all, from recruiting, to conditioning, to player development.  

[Js1 85450]

If this teams wins a fucking game in the tournament, it will be basically a successful season.  Not trying to lower expectations, but god damn, remember that drought from 2015 to 2022?  First round loss, first round loss, no tournament, first round loss, no tournament, COVID, first round loss. 

Just basically matching Saint Beard's first season is good with me. 

Currently: 19-10 (8-8)
Most likely finish to regular season: 20-11 (9-9) - but hey, beat Baylor and we could finish..... 21-10 (10-8)

Beard's first season: 21-10 (10-8) + first round loss in Big 12 tournament + 1-1 March Madness record (22-12 record)

Edited March 4 by Js1

[Hermanator 7124]

13 minutes ago, HookEm said:

I've read some stupid shit on this board, but this takes the cake.  In our history, Texas has never made the Elite 8 in back to back years.  Ever.  But if RT doesn't make it this year, the season is a failure?  Lololol.  Do you even stop to think before you spout this crap?

Given our losses, just making the tournament this year is a small success, especially given how brutal the Big 12 is this year.  

Also I get that Beard deserves credit for "building" the roster last year and developing the players in the offseason. But RT didn't exactly "inherit" the team.  He and the rest of the staff were right there in the middle of it all, from recruiting, to conditioning, to player development.  

It absolutely would. That scenario would constitute regression from the program's mark of success from the previous year so by definition would constitute failure. Would the season be considered a total failure in that scenario? Of course not. That's why I delineated degrees of failure. A small failure to perform up to the mark the program set 12 months ago wouldn't be cause for alarm or reason to fire the coach. 

If Sark and the football team go 9-3 in their first SEC season and miss the playoffs it would also be a small degree of failure since it does not reach the level of productivity established for the program 12 months prior. Now if they go 6-6 then it would be total failure. 

As far as your comparison to the history of Texas basketball, that is completely invalid now due to the seismic shift and how the sport operates. The portal and basically unregulated NIL of the current era is significant for the richest athletic department in the country. With those parameters and this university's resources there is zero excuse for either of the men's money sports to be inexperienced or lacking in talent in any season. Texas basketball should never, under these parameters and rules, be in a position where it is a bubble team. Expectations need to be adjusted for this. 

[jimmyjazz 46001]

2 minutes ago, Hermanator said:

It absolutely would. That scenario would constitute regression from the program's mark of success from the previous year so by definition would constitute failure.

By your "logic", UCONN's season will be a failure if they don't win the title.

How old are, 12?

[Hermanator 7124]

12 minutes ago, Js1 said:

If this teams wins a fucking game in the tournament, it will be basically a successful season.  Not trying to lower expectations, but god damn, remember that drought from 2015 to 2022?  First round loss, first round loss, no tournament, first round loss, no tournament, COVID, first round loss. 

Just basically matching Saint Beard's first season is good with me. 

Currently: 19-10 (8-8)
Most likely finish to regular season: 20-11 (9-9) - but hey, beat Baylor and we could finish..... 21-10 (10-8)

Beard's first season: 21-10 (10-8) + first round loss in Big 12 tournament + 1-1 March Madness record (22-12 record)

My counter to this is that Rodney Terry's complete shitting of the bed in recruiting and below average success in portal recruiting combined with mediocre coaching performance is what has this program in the position to be a low at large bid seed. If he had performed his job properly the way Sarkisian does with the football team they would not be in this position right now. Therefore, failure to at least match last season's production and standard fall at his feet since he has total control of the program. 

[Hermanator 7124]

12 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

By your "logic", UCONN's season will be a failure if they don't win the title.

How old are, 12?

It would be a failure since their expectation is what they've accomplished recently. Hurley would be the first to tell you this I'm sure. 

You people seem to be getting hung up on the word failure and putting a connotation that doesn't belong there. Your at best rudimentary understanding of the word failure apparently has you believing a failure can only be catastrophic. That black and white misunderstanding is what seems very juvenile in nature. 

Edited March 4 by Hermanator

[HookEm 2467]

SMH.  So much wrong in these posts.  Not even gonna try.

[Gut Wagon 8084]

1 hour ago, LTtxfan said:

Gonna be fun to discuss predictions for how far this Texas team should advance once the NCAA brackets come out.

Might be a fun poll...  😋

I'll start with hoping we play really well tonight (win or lose) before venturing such guesses. 

[Braff Zacklin 13636]

The "standard" for Texas hoops should be an NCAA tournament bid and winning the first round. I say standard instead of expectation because shit happens. Injuries, horrible officiating, bad shooting, poor matchup and the mere nature of a best-of-1 tournament means nothing is given and therefore shouldn't be expected.

So if this year's team somehow manages to reach the Sweet 16, it would be an unqualified success.

[MotownHorn 1770]

3 hours ago, Hermanator said:

 

Last season was a Beard team built by Beard and prepared by Beard. RT just kept the wheels on long enough to make an elite 8 run. This season is HIS team. 

 

Who was the Associate Head Coach on that team and Saint Chris Beard's right hand man? I forget.

[HtownHorn 14755]

3 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

Don't take this the wrong way, I'm not at all insinuating that 2024 Texas is as good as 2023 Texas, but at this point in the season last year, the 'horns were only 3 games ahead of this current bunch (22-7 vs 19-10, 11-5 vs 8-8 conference).  Better for sure, but it's not like the wheels have completely fallen off.

Not to mention the Big 12 is a much better conference this season with the additions, even God's gift is 2-6 on the road.

[HtownHorn 14755]

2 hours ago, ztejas said:

Good God. Do you even remotely understand how much better the roster was last season?

He's comapring it to the wrong roster anyway. He should be comparing it to Beard's 1st season at Texas, when all those 1st year portal players went 6-7 after Janurary.

[Js1 85450]

3 minutes ago, HtownHorn said:

Not to mention the Big 12 is a much better conference this season with the additions, even God's gift is 2-6 on the road.

Yeah, Texas has 4 Big 12 road wins in conference.  And not easy places either - Lubbock, FW, Norman, Cincinnati.  Sure, we got blown out in Lawrence and Houston (who hasn't yet) and Provo and lost a close one in Morgantown.  But God's Gift 2-6 in conference road games?  That's awful. 

[HtownHorn 14755]

Really the only unexcusable conference loss is UCF.

[closetohumping 17455]

2 minutes ago, HtownHorn said:

Really the only unexcusable conference loss is UCF.

Wva?

[Hookem2147 21345]

2 minutes ago, HtownHorn said:

Really the only unexcusable conference loss is UCF.

If we won that game, we are ranked today and looking at potentially a top 5 conference finish. 

Margins are razor thin in this league. Just the way it is.

[Js1 85450]

3 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

Wva?

Those fucking inbred fucks only get up for Texas and KU apparently. 

[MotownHorn 1770]

2 minutes ago, Js1 said:

Those fucking inbred fucks only get up for Texas and KU apparently. 

They truly think that WV and Texas are rivals. Upside down Longhorns flags flying all over that shitty Motown. The students do Horns Down 24/7/365.

I think it's hilarious that they've spent a decade+ convincing themselves that we're rivals and now we will never play them ever again.

[LTtxfan 49324]

37 minutes ago, Gut Wagon said:

I'll start with hoping we play really well tonight (win or lose) before venturing such guesses. 

Depends on match-up, but winning in the 1st Rd of this year's NCAA tournament is likely the best result to expect with this year's up/down crazy team.   

Look at how little they win 2 in-a-row...

 

Also...  Glad RT is taking the ball out of Hunter's hands a lot more often.  He's an off-ball guard -- sucks at point guard.  

[HtownHorn 14755]

6 minutes ago, LTtxfan said:

Look at how little they win 2 in-a-row...

There have been like 4 teams in Big 12 that have won more than 2 in a row during conference play.

[jimmyjazz 46001]

1 hour ago, Hermanator said:

It would be a failure since their expectation is what they've accomplished recently. Hurley would be the first to tell you this I'm sure. 

You people seem to be getting hung up on the word failure and putting a connotation that doesn't belong there. Your at best rudimentary understanding of the word failure apparently has you believing a failure can only be catastrophic. That black and white misunderstanding is what seems very juvenile in nature. 

Gibberish.

[HookEm 2467]

The standard is also different for football and basketball.  We are a true blue-blood in football.  We might be up or down any given year, but we are without question one of the 7-8 best programs in the history of the sport.  We should expect to make the new playoffs every year, and win a title once every 15-20 years.

In basketball, we have potential to be a great program, but we have never lived up to it.  Barnes was (and is) a very good coach, but only got us to one Final Four and two Elite 8s. Shaka was the hottest coach in the country when we hired him and he sucked ass.  Now he left and is having more success at freaking Marquette.  Chris Beard was building something good, but who knows if he would have reached the mountain top.  Even if he hadn't bit and choked his way out of Austin, he has a volatile temper and has a hard time holding on to talented players.

Ultimately, Texas basketball has more in common with Aggy football than with UT football.  We recruit well and hire previously successful coaches. We get glimmers of success, but just never pull it all together for a sustained period.  It sucks, but it is true.  Expecting more from RT than was delivered by Penders, Barnes, Shaka and Beard is weird.

[Js1 85450]

37 minutes ago, HookEm said:

The standard is also different for football and basketball.  We are a true blue-blood in football.  We might be up or down any given year, but we are without question one of the 7-8 best programs in the history of the sport.  We should expect to make the new playoffs every year, and win a title once every 15-20 years.

In basketball, we have potential to be a great program, but we have never lived up to it.  Barnes was (and is) a very good coach, but only got us to one Final Four and two Elite 8s. Shaka was the hottest coach in the country when we hired him and he sucked ass.  Now he left and is having more success at freaking Marquette.  Chris Beard was building something good, but who knows if he would have reached the mountain top.  Even if he hadn't bit and choked his way out of Austin, he has a volatile temper and has a hard time holding on to talented players.

Ultimately, Texas basketball has more in common with Aggy football than with UT football.  We recruit well and hire previously successful coaches. We get glimmers of success, but just never pull it all together for a sustained period.  It sucks, but it is true.  Expecting more from RT than was delivered by Penders, Barnes, Shaka and Beard is weird.

We don't have the basketball history either when it comes to recruits and transfers.  We can throw around NIL all we want, but Baylor and KU (within our conference) have title winning coaches. When we go to the SEC, you have Kentucky + programs with more sustained basketball success/coaches like Tennessee, Arkansas, UF, plus still second fiddle in our own state to Sampson and Drew. 

If I am a recruit with no ties to UT, all things being equal (money), I'd still probably look at UH, Baylor, UK, Tennessee, Arkansas before Texas.   Not to mention if Duke, UNC, Kansas, Arizona, etc. come calling. 

Edited March 4 by Js1

[Rickylovesweed 14534]

The only time Texas has made B2B sweet 16s was the Barnes run from 01-03 where we did it 3 times in a row. Other than that, we've never made B2B Sweet 16s. Somehow @Hermanatorthinks it would be a failure if this team made a sweet 16 this year. 

Please just stop talking. 

[closetohumping 17455]

52 minutes ago, HookEm said:

The standard is also different for football and basketball.  We are a true blue-blood in football.  We might be up or down any given year, but we are without question one of the 7-8 best programs in the history of the sport.  We should expect to make the new playoffs every year, and win a title once every 15-20 years.

In basketball, we have potential to be a great program, but we have never lived up to it.  Barnes was (and is) a very good coach, but only got us to one Final Four and two Elite 8s. Shaka was the hottest coach in the country when we hired him and he sucked ass.  Now he left and is having more success at freaking Marquette.  Chris Beard was building something good, but who knows if he would have reached the mountain top.  Even if he hadn't bit and choked his way out of Austin, he has a volatile temper and has a hard time holding on to talented players.

Ultimately, Texas basketball has more in common with Aggy football than with UT football.  We recruit well and hire previously successful coaches. We get glimmers of success, but just never pull it all together for a sustained period.  It sucks, but it is true.  Expecting more from RT than was delivered by Penders, Barnes, Shaka and Beard is weird.

In some ways RT had out delivered the latter two

[Rickylovesweed 14534]

If RT made a Sweet 16 this year, I would be fully in the group of "give him a few years." 

I don't think people realize how difficult it is to make the 2nd weekend in B2B years. Very few programs accomplish that consistently and we certainly haven't done that from a historical perspective. 

It's obviously far from a given that we will make a Sweet 16 but it's insane that anybody would consider a Sweet 16 this year a "small failure." An elite 8 and Sweet 16 in B2B years would be one of the best runs in our history and one of the best runs for 80% of college basketball programs. Jesus. 

Edited March 4 by Rickylovesweed

[LTtxfan 49324]

It's kinda funny that with Disu, Mitchell, Hunter, Cunningham and Weaver all returning there seemed to be a lot of early season talk about how this team would be at least a "Sweet 16" team especially when Abmas & Shedrick were added...

Hmmm...  now not so much.  Why is that? 

Obviously missing a true penetrating ball handling point guard is one reason.  What else??

[shadow_operative 15932]

1 hour ago, HtownHorn said:

Not to mention the Big 12 is a much better conference this season with the additions, even God's gift is 2-6 on the road.

the big xii was more highly rated last year than it is this year, plus last year you had to play everyone twice. 

last year:

 

this year:

 

laat year every team in the league was in the top 63 of kenpom, with 7 teams from the league being in the top 29. last year’s league was the toughest league i’ve ever seen in the kenpom era, in any conference.

Edited March 4 by shadow_operative

[shadow_operative 15932]

1 hour ago, HtownHorn said:

He's comapring it to the wrong roster anyway. He should be comparing it to Beard's 1st season at Texas, when all those 1st year portal players went 6-7 after Janurary.

Beard basically had to play with 5-6 guys for the entire second half of that year, none of whom were even all conference talents. disu is a top ~15 player nationally, abmas top ~25. if we’re comparing what did beard did with that team to what RT is doing with this one then it’s Beard >>> RT.

 

 

[closetohumping 17455]

17 minutes ago, LTtxfan said:

It's kinda funny that with Disu, Mitchell, Hunter, Cunningham and Weaver all returning there seemed to be a lot of early season talk about how this team would be at least a "Sweet 16" team especially when Abmas & Shedrick were added...

Hmmm...  now not so much.  Why is that? 

Obviously missing a true penetrating ball handling point guard is one reason.  What else??

Didn’t know weaver was on the team last year and if Cunningham is one of the names to rattle off to build a case against RT well then maybe we didn’t have that much coming back?

 

to answer your question, idk, preseason enthusiasm isn’t exactly rare.  We were all head over heels for Beards first year and even that team didn’t make it to the second weekend

[shadow_operative 15932]

we returned a lot of guys from the elite 8 run and then we brought in a good transfer class headlined by one of the all time leading scorers in the history of the sport. there are good reasons that everyone from pollsters, to the computers, to the coaches in the league, to our fan base saw this team as a top ~15 team heading into the year. the question is not “why was that the case?”, the question is why haven’t we lived up to expectations. 

some answers: abmas isn’t as good as we thought he’d be, mitchell has barely improved, tyrese hunter is disappearing before our eyes like a person from a time travel movie, shedrick is always hurt, and oh yeah, we have a subpar coaching staff this year whose team has no identity and mercurial as hell.

Edited March 4 by shadow_operative

[ztejas 43524]

40 minutes ago, LTtxfan said:

It's kinda funny that with Disu, Mitchell, Hunter, Cunningham and Weaver all returning there seemed to be a lot of early season talk about how this team would be at least a "Sweet 16" team especially when Abmas & Shedrick were added...

Hmmm...  now not so much.  Why is that? 

Obviously missing a true penetrating ball handling point guard is one reason.  What else??

I assumed Hunter and Mitchell would both be better. Neither of them developed much at all.

I also thought guys like Horton and Shedrick would be better. 

It happens.

(Season isn't over yet, btw)

[jimmyjazz 46001]

We only lost over 62% of our scoring from last year, but yeah, same same.

[LTtxfan 49324]

12 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

we returned a lot of guys from the elite 8 run and then we brought in a good transfer class headlined by one of the all time leading scorers in the history of the sport. there are good reasons that everyone from pollsters, to the computers, to the coaches in the league, to our fan base saw this team as a top ~15 team heading into the year. the question is not “why was that the case?”, the question is why haven’t we lived up to expectations. 

some answers: abmas isn’t as good as we thought he’d be, mitchell has barely improved, tyrese hunter is disappearing before our eyes like a person from a time travel movie, shedrick is always hurt, and oh yeah, we have a subpar coaching staff this year whose team has no identity and mercurial as hell.

Matches a lot of what I have seen.  Team defense is finally getting better.  Without Disu, this is a poorly coached/developed offense.  A better point guard would probably help this team a lot.

But I just don't have confidence in what RT is drawing up and running on offense. If Disu has an off night, or gets in foul trouble, this team really struggles.  

[Rholl 218]

2 hours ago, MotownHorn said:

They truly think that WV and Texas are rivals. Upside down Longhorns flags flying all over that shitty Motown. The students do Horns Down 24/7/365.

I think it's hilarious that they've spent a decade+ convincing themselves that we're rivals and now we will never play them ever again.

They will still Horns down…. it will just be against UofH now!   

[ClubWhatever 12154]

46 minutes ago, LTtxfan said:

It's kinda funny that with Disu, Mitchell, Hunter, Cunningham and Weaver all returning there seemed to be a lot of early season talk about how this team would be at least a "Sweet 16" team especially when Abmas & Shedrick were added...

Hmmm...  now not so much.  Why is that? 

Obviously missing a true penetrating ball handling point guard is one reason.  What else??

If we had that (true PG) then maybe we could have another thing we don't have, which is a reliable wing scorer.   And if we're getting greedy, give me a rebounding and defensive specialist (a "good" Shedrick) who can steal minutes without enabling the other team to go on runs because we become offensively inept.

[ztejas 43524]

8 minutes ago, LTtxfan said:

A point guard would probably help this team a lot.

FIFY.