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Tennessee School Shooting

Beau Vine

By Beau Vine
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Said it in the other thread, Officer Rex Engelbert seems to be exactly what you want a cop to be. Calm, cool, collected under pressure. Clear orders, kept his wits. Complete bad ass. 

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My understanding is that the shooter was a trans man, not a trans woman. An "interesting wrinkle," I guess. 

From the media I've seen from the shooter's parents, it didn't sound like they were down with having a son (deadnaming, misgendering, etc). Not that that is in any way an excuse for going on a rampage, but it def didn't help the shooter's emotional state. 

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4 minutes ago, Helobious said:

Oh I know she expected to die. But you know they picture themselves dying in a hail of bullets after an intense firefight, not getting 360 no-scoped within seconds of meeting their first challenger.

I actually applaud Nashville PD for releasing this video that includes seeing the gunman go down. Hopefully that image sticks with some people who might be envisioning an end like you're describing. 

No, not heroic. Not out of a movie. You're looking out a window and next thing you know, you're dead.

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Helobious

Helobious 9480

Posted
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2 minutes ago, Etxhorn81 said:

We have a perverse society. Both parties. 
 

When the first talking point from the right is save the guns, there’s a problem that needs to be gutted to the core.  It’s a stain that we will never ever get rid of.  We have failed everyone as a society. 
 

Then, the left protects the fact that it’s a mentally ill person who doesn’t know where to go to the bathroom.  And the fact that this is celebrated is a stain on society.  There’s something mentally wrong with these people. 
 

She should never have been able to purchase a gun with her mental illness. 
 

it was a suicide mission going after Christian kids and Christian faculty.  There is no other way to justify it. It’s a hate crime, and an act of domestic terrorism. 

Her motive got released already? News to me. Also you know she was a former student at that school right?

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Nicole44

Nicole44 22092

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Not to get back to the latest school shooting where three 9 year olds were killed (heard some reports that one of the little girls was trying to pull a fire alarm to warn people and the little boy was shot and killed right alongside her):

a) seems like a lot of planning went into this. School maps, plans to take out another location and so forth…stock piling of weapons and ammo. A manifesto. While I personally think you have to have some sort of mental issues to be a mass shooter they sure do plan and a lot of effort goes into this. And for what? Die within 15 or so minutes? Make zero point? Kill children? I guess that’s where the mental issue comes into play. I’m just amazed that so much planning and effort goes into slaying innocent victims with these mass shooters…yet take no real effort to improve their own lives. 
 

b) Having met victims of true crime and their family members I’d say it’s less about the motive of the killer (though that is important) it’s why they weren’t stopped prior to the act. I hope their anger turns to advocacy (many people have found purpose in this.)

c) I don’t understand why people post in the CR and expect anything other than a certain opinion or response. They aren’t making two CRs. I get that certain topics can only be discussed there and not in the DT but outside of creating your own similar platform for conservative views if you believe differently from the vast majority of CR posters you’re likely not going to get a positive response from the vast majority of them. Especially if you aren’t willing to debate and take a few negative rep hits. Jmo.

It’s a shame that we can’t employ a common sense approach to protecting our students. It’s a shame we can’t all agree on this. But we don’t and so we wait for the next shooting. And this is the worst time of the year for them…school shootings between now and end of May. My heart breaks because as it stands off today I can’t do a damn thing about what happens in the next several weeks. Not a damn thing. 

 

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Nicole44

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Also, we talk a lot about mental illness and resources. I’d be curious to know how many of these mass shooters have had access to mental health resources (be it therapy or medication or both.) I can think of quite a few off the top of my head from fairly loving families who were seeing doctors and taking medication—-so then what? It does seem like regardless of motive that they are all mostly the same type of person. many of them appear to be somewhat intelligent (college educated in some cases.) I mean we can do the research on this but it just seems like they are angry and malcontent (insert reason(s) here) and just want to inflict maximum harm, damage and panic. There are so many prongs to this but as many people have said it’s not just one thing BUT their access to particular types of guns is the MAIN thing. I just follow true crime and anyone who knows me knows “why” is huge curiosity of mine but as I’ve already posted WHY is not as important as stopping this from happening over and over. I just wish we could get there…it just sucks. 9 year olds…

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YGIFS

YGIFS 19453

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The floor plan thing is so fucked up to me.  Most schools have long since removed them from their websites. Two things that frequently happen though are the shooter went to that same school and knew the layout OR whenever there’s a meeting about a capital project, the school unintentionally produces renderings of the school that reveal way too Much information to potential bad actors.  
 

she was always going to get in, locked doors be dammed.  There’s also, no politics, just another reality of Texas/southern states schools.  Open nature spaces inside the campus.  Places where kids gather to eat lunch, recess, play, garden, read, etc. out of doors.  And that’s a good thing.  Every single school in Our district has hundreds of linear feet of 10-12’ roofline where all you need to get on top in a position over dozens of kids is a folding ladder.  

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Nicole44

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Updates from CNN main page:

The shooter was under care for an "emotional disorder," Metro Nashville Police Chief John Drake said Tuesday.

"Law enforcement knew nothing about the treatment" 28-year-old Aubrey Hale was receiving, he added.

Hale's parents "felt that (Hale) should not own weapons" and were under the impression Hale had sold one weapon and "did not own any more," Drake said.

"As it turned out, (Hale) had been hiding several weapons within the house," Drake said.
———————

Police found writings with school shooter Audrey Hale’s body as well as in Hale’s car, according to Don Aaron, the Metro Nashville Police Department's public affairs director.

Both documents were different, and detectives from the city's homicide and intelligence bureaus are reviewing the writings, Aaron told CNN on Tuesday. 

In the writings, Hale mentioned a mall near the site of The Covenant School shooting as another possible target, according to the spokesperson. 

Aaron would not confirm if the location was the Mall at Green Hills, which is up the street from the school. 
——————

Same shit different day! So likely receiving therapy. Hiding things from parents. Manifesto with writings mentioning other targets. The mall? Maybe the malls in TN are packed but here not so much….

Anyway they all seem to be the same damn person over and over. Emotionally stunted. Inability to assimilate. For whatever reason. But lots of effort and planning went into this. Same for many of the last mass shootings.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 46352

Posted
Posted (edited)
34 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

She (sorry, still not clear on the direction of transition so don’t know what pronoun to use)

Born female, identified as male.

 

Quote

wasn’t mentally ill because she was trans, she was mentally ill because of how she was treated for being trans by those that knew. 

Or he was mentally ill because he was . . . mentally ill, perhaps having nothing to do with his gender identification or former mistreatment.  I think it's likely mistreatment/bias/etc. played into it, but that doesn't necessarily turn someone into a sociopath or psychopath.

The fact that "didn't know where to go to the bathroom" even got brought up tells you everything we need to know about that particular poster's opinion.  "Political" remains a silly bar to get under to post here.  Fuck surly rules.  Define "political".

Edited by jimmyjazz
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blacklab

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2 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Fuck surly rules.  Define "political".

opinions about democrats, republicans, libtards, conservatards, gun control, trans rights, laws that could prevent this, how the msm is reporting, what Tucker Carlson's opinion is, what they are saying on fox news

this thread is for news about the shooting

2 minutes ago, elguapo said:

Where did the @Sgt Hulk comment get moved to? I didn't get to neg that shit yet.

got deleted with all the other cr shit that belongs in cr

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jimmyjazz

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1 minute ago, blacklab said:

this thread is for news about the shooting

I'd say @Beau Vine is the one who gets to make that call.  You only get to police the thread after the fact, however you choose to do so.  I'm quite confident he didn't start the thread as a source for "news", exclusively.

But you knew that.

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Nicole44

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Still trying to confirm if two of the 9 year olds were trying to pull the fire alarm when they were executed. So far from everything I have read the shooter just went after the individuals the shooter encountered. 💔💙

4BD2325E-6FF3-4CBC-A41B-AB9E7EE272C8.jpegArticle that references El Arroyo sign below (wanted to include it lest anyone thought that wasn’t a real sign): https://www.kvue.com/article/news/education/schools/el-arroyo-nashville-victims-memorial-sign/269-2d1739a3-6829-43f3-a34a-8efe1bf57024

Edited by Nicole44
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YGIFS

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Hate to ask, but is that El arroyo sign real or photoshopped?  I can never tell with that kinda shit.  If it’s real, I’m gonna go take my own photo on the way home.  
 

they would be setting an interesting precedent.  Do they do that every other day from now on since it’s the new-ish normal?  And our shootings are becoming more and more of the variety that they’ll run out of letters before they’re done.  
 

god bless those police.  

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Nicole44

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10 minutes ago, YGIFS said:

Hate to ask, but is that El arroyo sign real or photoshopped?  I can never tell with that kinda shit.  If it’s real, I’m gonna go take my own photo on the way home.  
 

they would be setting an interesting precedent.  Do they do that every other day from now on since it’s the new-ish normal?  And our shootings are becoming more and more of the variety that they’ll run out of letters before they’re done.  
 

god bless those police.  

I updated my post to corroborate that the El Arroyo sign is real. See edit and link to story. I forgot to do that when I posted and then went back and edited my post. 
 

_______________
more news updates (former teammates of the shooter received messages from the shooter very close in time to the shooting): 

Averianna Patton said she saw the message that Hale planned to die by suicide and that Patton would see it on the news. In the messages Patton provided to NewsChannel 5, Hale told Patton she would see her again in another life. Hale told Patton about no longer wanting to live and the need to die.

https://www.newschannel5.com/news/she-checked-her-instagram-she-didnt-expect-a-message-from-the-covenant-school-shooter

The shooter went on to explain that all of this would make sense and that the shooter had left more than enough information behind to explain it. <Sigh. Yes it can all be explained asshole. Decided you wanted to die but needed to take three children with you. Fuck you.> 

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SurlyGator

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Posted
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This doesn't exactly qualify as news, but I'm sharing it anyway.  My daughter (15, no pics) plays school and club volleyball.  I just got an email from the club director that said one of the 9 year old victims had just completed their club's "Little Diggers" youth program.

It's dusty up in here all over again.

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NorthLoop

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27 minutes ago, ClubWhatever said:

I like how the one cop (handgun guy, not AR guy) kept pushing the other cop to go forward.  Not criticizing, because watching that made me realize just how scary that would be.  

My guess is that it's protocol to have the rifle guy go first in larger open areas like hallways and handgun guy goes in first in small spaces.

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jimmyjazz

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15 minutes ago, NorthLoop said:

My guess is that it's protocol to have the rifle guy go first in larger open areas like hallways and handgun guy goes in first in small spaces.

I'm pretty sure I heard one guy shout something like "rifle first".  Seems reasonable.

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jdhorn92

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Posted (edited)

One of the 9yo victims, her father was the Minister  for the Church  and had a posting at Park Cities (Dallas) Presbyterian just a few years prior.  I know we have more than a few members here on the Surl from Dallas.

Edited by jdhorn92
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statsman

statsman 5489

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4 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Is passing along the police report that the shooter legally bought 7 guns from 5 different gun stores (Tennessee coincidentally doesn't have red flag laws) news or politics? Would really hate to ruffle any feathers.

 

I vote news. The truth just isn’t always our friend, but we have to live with it. 

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tigol

tigol 2418

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I think any Uvalde police still in law enforcement should be required to attend a training event (observed by victims’ families) where they watch this video and explain what went right and wrong. 

They should be removed from the gene pool.
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Gil Bang

Gil Bang 26069

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4 hours ago, FirstTimeCaller said:

I actually applaud Nashville PD for releasing this video that includes seeing the gunman go down. Hopefully that image sticks with some people who might be envisioning an end like you're describing. 

No, not heroic. Not out of a movie. You're looking out a window and next thing you know, you're dead.

427d03e7-6943-49ad-aae5-6fc4353fcbbb_tex

 

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tigol

tigol 2418

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7 minutes ago, Hornstrader said:

If there was ever something like this going on anywhere near my family's part of town that is exactly how I would want the cops to react.

 

Those guys were calm, professional and wasted zero time in getting in the door and getting the job done.

Didn't save those kids that died.

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Hornstrader

Hornstrader 180

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1 minute ago, tigol said:

Didn't save those kids that died.

No but that was already done when they got there. If that shooter was given time to discover the part of the building where students and staff were locked down that would have presented a concentrated group of targets and the carnage could have been far worse.

By getting in the door with no hesitation and having the shooter down less than 5 minutes after they arrived was good work.

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Hornstrader

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8 minutes ago, tigol said:

That shooter legally bought guns prior to killing.  The blood is on the hands of those that make that possible.

I'm not disagreeing with you at all on that point. I was simply commenting on the reaction of law enforcement in this situation.

They did not wait. They did not dwell on the fact that they were moving down hallways lined with young children's lockers. They did not panic when they heard gunfire coming from above them. They rapidly but calmly advanced and eliminated the threat.

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DalTxHornFan

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3 minutes ago, Hornstrader said:

I'm not disagreeing with you at all on that point. I was simply commenting on the reaction of law enforcement in this situation.

They did not wait. They did not dwell on the fact that they were moving down hallways lined with young children's lockers. They did not panic when they heard gunfire coming from above them. They rapidly but calmly advanced and eliminated the threat.

Impressive response.  Fuck the criminal.

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