2023 Houston Astros Thread

[Hank Chinaski 6310]

1 minute ago, HtownHorn said:

It's fucking ridiculous Crane with all the money he is printing decided to roll with this team.

He actively decided to not have cohesive front office leadership and pretended to be a GM this past offseason.

Every signing he made has been a fucking disaster in 2023 and the club will be worse off for them in future seasons as well. We’d be better off if he actually spent no money at all.

When this team fizzles out in the wild card round and then we wonder why we aren’t extending Tucker or why we aren’t in on useful FAs in the off-season, it’ll be fun to remember that we’ve already spent that money - over $30 million - on 2 replacement-level players when Crane was playing GM.

[Mitch Hedberg 2090]

Keep the faith. Can’t win 100 if you don’t lose 62. Right on track. 

[Mo Horn 8807]

9 minutes ago, HtownHorn said:

This team is completely dependent on 2 bats to carry 7 other players. Hopefully Bregman and Altuve can somehow make it 4 carrying 5.

It's fucking ridiculous Crane with all the money he is printing decided to roll with this team.

Dubon, Meyers, Maldonado fucking suck. Their careers have proven they fucking suck. Abreu's last season was a great indicator that he was done.

8 hits with 2 EBs against the shitty Milwaukee pitchers is embarrassing. 

I really don't get the knock on Dubon. I got blasted earlier this year for hyping him. He came into today leading the team in average. Yes he's young and maybe will be a bust in the long run, but right now I'd take him over a ton of other players. 

[Rockethorn1978 6061]

This is why you can’t assume the same team will show up and do the same thing it did last year. Always be looking to improve the team and keep the window open with being married to certain guys forever. 
 

it’s actually quite impressive how fast this offense disappears for 20 innings 

[David Dennison 18652]

2 minutes ago, Hank Chinaski said:

He actively decided to not have cohesive front office leadership and pretended to be a GM this past offseason.

Every signing he made has been a fucking disaster in 2023 and the club will be worse off for them in future seasons as well. We’d be better off if he actually spent no money at all.

When this team fizzles out in the wild card round and then we wonder why we aren’t extending Tucker or why we aren’t in on useful FAs in the off-season, it’ll be fun to remember that we’ve already spent that money - over $30 million - on 2 replacement-level players when Crane was playing GM.

What makes you think Tucker wants to be extended?

[tx 3 putt 76314]

All the bats looked good on Monday. Day off tomorrow then a 17 game grinder. 
 

12–5 

 

 

1 minute ago, David Dennison said:

What makes you think Tucker wants to be extended?

he’d be leaving money on the table 

Edited May 24, 2023 by tx 3 putt

[Mitch Hedberg 2090]

The good news is with the pitch clock I only wasted 2 hours of my day instead of 3+. 

[Hank Chinaski 6310]

4 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

What makes you think Tucker wants to be extended?

The point is that money was spent stupidly because someone decided he didn’t need a GM, and that will affect how future money is allocated. 

Edited May 24, 2023 by Hank Chinaski

[Scraps 13540]

Well thats some bat AIDS these past 2 games

[David Dennison 18652]

2 minutes ago, Hank Chinaski said:

The point is that money was spent stupidly because someone decided he didn’t need a GM, and that will affect how future money is allocated. 

Do you really think that has any effect on what Kyle Tucker wants to do?

Edited May 24, 2023 by David Dennison

[UTexasFight 9376]

2 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Do you really think that has any effect on what Kyle Tucker wants to do?

He for sure won’t want to play for a guy that took two months to push him in front of Abreu in the order 

[David Dennison 18652]

Y'all understand that Kyle Tucker is probably going to get a ten year deal, right?

Edited May 24, 2023 by David Dennison

[perfectchaos007 6596]

I assume that AAA assignment Brantley had with Sugar Land set his recovery back 6 months. Could use his bat this year. Oh well

[Hank Chinaski 6310]

3 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Do you really think that has any effect on what Kyle Tucker wants to do?

It has an effect on payroll for the next two years, which has an effect on how money will be allocated, which has an effect on what you can offer to players, be it Kyle Tucker or whoever else could potentially be signed to fill out a better roster. I don’t purport to know what he or anybody else “wants to do,” but it’s a pretty good bet that what they want to do is sign the best contract they can.

[uoftorange 1386]

16 minutes ago, Hank Chinaski said:

The point is that money was spent stupidly because someone decided he didn’t need a GM, and that will affect how future money is allocated. 

Jesus man, this is a beating of a continuous take, especially for a fan of a team that's been to 4 WS in 6 years.  That's simply not what happened.  Crane did not decide he didn't need a GM, he decided that his current GM had run his course.  He either had to get rid of Click OR extend him, there was no in between.  So if he wanted a new GM, (which he clearly did, and so did a larger percentage of all of us) either he actively shopped and interviewed a GM during the season, during the WS run, which would have been utterly idiotic, or he did what he did and worked to find the right guy for the long term.  And in between business can't just stop.  Crane has said over and over again that he felt rushed when he hired Click, a guy that none of us really loved, and some of us downright loathed.  

And if he didn't have a GM that didn't mean that nothing could happen in the meantime.  Including using the 2 Assistant GMs to help out.  There was literally nothing wrong with the Abreu deal given what we knew at the time.  Go back and look at the 90% of people on this board who thought it was a good deal, save maybe it was a year too long.  The Montero deal was a massive overpay at the time, and maybe you let the guy walk, but it wasn't a huge deal in the scheme of what relievers got.  We could all argue against it, because relievers are cyclical (see one Maton, Phil) but it wasn't technically a horrible deal, again in the scheme of reliever pay this off season.  Brantley deal was hopeful, but it wasn't horrific or team cap altering.  

But my biggest issue with all of this is simple:  Every single one of the guys any of us wanted is shitting the bed horribly.  And don't any of you say Yuli, there was maybe 5% of people that know a thing about baseball on this board that thought we should re-sign him.  He spent some money, but not team hampering money.  

Edited May 24, 2023 by uoftorange

[David Dennison 18652]

8 minutes ago, Hank Chinaski said:

It has an effect on payroll for the next two years, which has an effect on how money will be allocated, which has an effect on what you can offer to players, be it Kyle Tucker or whoever else could potentially be signed to fill out a better roster. I don’t purport to know what he or anybody else “wants to do,” but it’s a pretty good bet that what they want to do is sign the best contract they can.

Do you think Kyle Tucker is interested in signing any extension within the next two years?

Edited May 24, 2023 by David Dennison

[Hank Chinaski 6310]

2 minutes ago, uoftorange said:

Jesus man, this is a beating of a continuous take, especially for a fan of a team that's been two 4 WS in 6 years.  That's simply not what happened.  Crane did not decide he didn't need a GM, he decided that his current GM had run his course.  He either had to get rid of Click OR extend him, there was no in between.  So if he wanted a new GM, (which he clearly did, and so did a larger percentage of all of us) either he actively shopped and interviewed a GM during the season, during the WS run, which would have been utterly idiotic, or he did what he did and worked to find the right guy for the long term.  And in between business can't just stop.  Crane has said over and over again that he felt rushed when he hired Click, a guy that none of us really loved, and some of us downright loathed.  

And if he didn't have a GM that didn't mean that nothing could happen in the meantime.  Including using the 2 Assistant GMs to help out.  There was literally nothing wrong with the Abreu deal given what we knew at the time.  Go back and look at the 90% of people on this board who thought it was a good deal, save maybe it was a year too long.  The Montero deal was a massive overpay at the time, and maybe you let the guy walk, but it wasn't a huge deal in the scheme of what relievers got.  We could all argue against it, because relievers are cyclical (see one Maton, Phil) but it wasn't technically a horrible deal, again in the scheme of reliever pay this off season.  Brantley deal was hopeful, but it wasn't horrific or team cap altering.  

But my biggest issue with all of this is simple:  Every single one of the guys any of us wanted is shitting the bed horribly.  And don't any of you say Yuli, there was maybe 5% of people that know a thing about baseball on this board that thought we should re-sign him.  He spent some money, but not team hampering money.  

The bottom line is he parted ways with a GM without a plan to replace him.

The Abreu deal appeared to be an overpay (and yes, a year too long) even before we knew he was finished as a productive player. Everyone thought the Montero deal was an overpay at the time. Brantley was injured. These were bad signings that may have been avoidable if he had had a plan for the off-season.

[tx 3 putt 76314]

Post game show is unloading on bagwell 😂😂😂

[Hank Chinaski 6310]

3 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Do you think Kyle Tucker is interested in signing any extension within the next two years?

Again, I think Kyle Tucker or any other player is interested in signing the best contract he can. Now, I assume what you’re actually asking is whether I really think the next 2 years of sunk cost on Abreu and Montero have a meaningful impact on what the Astros would be willing to offer him on a possible extension. To that, I have no idea, but I think the fact that that money is already spent doesn’t help.

[Make em eat Taco Bell 1549]

aggregate series score:  12-12

[uoftorange 1386]

12 minutes ago, Hank Chinaski said:

The bottom line is he parted ways with a GM without a plan to replace him.

The Abreu deal appeared to be an overpay (and yes, a year too long) even before we knew he was finished as a productive player. Everyone thought the Montero deal was an overpay at the time. Brantley was injured. These were bad signings that may have been avoidable if he had had a plan for the off-season.

Again, incorrect.  He parted ways with the GM without a plan you liked.  He had a plan to promote some guys to AGM, and be a stop gap between taking his time and finding the right guy.  And it was the right guy.  I just don't see what he could have done differently.  Most teams that fire a GM don't make the playoffs and therefore have a few months.  We, luckily because we have the best sports owner in Houston history, didn't have that option.  Complaining about him firing and taking a reasonable time to find a new one is basically shaking your fist at the sky.

At the time yes, but in retrospect the Montero deal was under/or at worst at market.  Brantley was injured, it was a one year flyer that would be covered by insurance if he didn't play.  There was no salary cap constraint on the Brantley deal.  

[David Dennison 18652]

16 minutes ago, Hank Chinaski said:

Again, I think Kyle Tucker or any other player is interested in signing the best contract he can. Now, I assume what you’re actually asking is whether I really think the next 2 years of sunk cost on Abreu and Montero have a meaningful impact on what the Astros would be willing to offer him on a possible extension. To that, I have no idea, but I think the fact that that money is already spent doesn’t help.

Good news! That money won't be spent if Kyle Tucker becomes a FA. 

Edited May 24, 2023 by David Dennison

[HtownHorn 14468]

40 minutes ago, perfectchaos007 said:

I assume that AAA assignment Brantley had with Sugar Land set his recovery back 6 months. Could use his bat this year. Oh well

That's a big assumption that he'd even be as good as he was last year when he became a slap hitter, with limited defensive ability and a negative runner. There were bargain basement level vets that could have been signed but they zeroed in on two guys with obvious red flags.

[tx 3 putt 76314]

This 17 game stretch is huge. Have to get the bats going. The pitching has been more than good enough 

[perfectchaos007 6596]

3 minutes ago, HtownHorn said:

That's a big assumption that he'd even be as good as he was last year when he became a slap hitter, with limited defensive ability and a negative runner. There were bargain basement level vets that could have been signed but they zeroed in on two guys with obvious red flags.

Yuli Gurriel is batting .263 with 3 HRs this year

Abreu is batting .222 with 0 HRs 

 

what moron is responsible for this first baseman trade?

 

 

[HtownHorn 14468]

Yuli wasn't the answer either.

In fact, it's amazing how successful the Astros have been since Crane bought the team when the average production from 1st base has been 98 OPS+ and 1.16 oWAR per season.

[tx 3 putt 76314]

Roster make up and locker room fit can be as important as war 

[Rimbo 25773]

[tx 3 putt 76314]

1 minute ago, Rimbo said:

we’re about to go 13-4, and shock the the fan base

[tx 3 putt 76314]

Hmm ….

Worrying sign: the last time the Astros were shut out in back-to-back games was September 22-23, 2022 and then the Astros won the World Series like six weeks later

[Snake Diggity 4614]

1 hour ago, David Dennison said:

Good news! That money won't be spent if Kyle Tucker becomes a FA. 

Will you be satisfied if Tucker walks but Altuve, Framber, Brown, and Bryan Abreu are all extended by 2025?

I would rather have 4 addl seasons of aging Altuve, 2 more of prime Framber, 2 more of prime Brown, and 2 more of prime Abreu than 5 seasons of prime Tucker and 5 seasons of aging Tucker.

Edited May 24, 2023 by Snake Diggity

[Wulaw Horn 18973]

2 hours ago, HtownHorn said:

Devenski - 9.00 era in 3 IP

Harris - 4.50 era in 4 IP

James - 10.80 era in 1.2 IP

Osuna - 3.86 era in 2.1 IP

Peacock - 3.00 in 3 IP

Pressly - 3.86 in 3 IP

Rondon - 0 in 1 IP

Smith - 5.40 in 3.1 IP

The bullpen was a fucking disaster in that series and tied with Verlander for the biggest reason the Astros lost it.

Cool. You said the bullpen sucked that year. It didn't.  They didn't have a good world series. That was a problem in winning the world series. We were talking about how talented that team was overall. There was nothing wrong with that bullpen all year.  

[Wulaw Horn 18973]

2 minutes ago, Snake Diggity said:

Will you be satisfied if Tucker walks but Altuve, Framber, Brown, and Bryan Abreu are all extended by 2025?

Can we just extend Yordan again until like 2032?

[uoftorange 1386]

4 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

Cool. You said the bullpen sucked that year. It didn't.  They didn't have a good world series. That was a problem in winning the world series. We were talking about how talented that team was overall. There was nothing wrong with that bullpen all year.  

When the "best team that didn't win the WS" thing was going on a few weeks ago, I kept seeing that the Astros that year were "soft".  I don't understand that at all.  We sucked as a BP in the WS, but the team was absolute killers all year long pretty much top to bottom.  I didn't think there was a single soft thing about it

[Wulaw Horn 18973]

6 minutes ago, uoftorange said:

When the "best team that didn't win the WS" thing was going on a few weeks ago, I kept seeing that the Astros that year were "soft".  I don't understand that at all.  We sucked as a BP in the WS, but the team was absolute killers all year long pretty much top to bottom.  I didn't think there was a single soft thing about it

Yep.  Anyone with anything bad to say about that team is full of shit. It was a great offense. Great starting pitching. Great bullpen.  Great managing. There was no kind of fatal flaw waiting to break out at the wrong time and jump up and grab us.  Baseball happened to us that year- that's all.  Anything else is bullshit after the fact revisionism.

[Hank Chinaski 6310]

40 minutes ago, uoftorange said:

When the "best team that didn't win the WS" thing was going on a few weeks ago, I kept seeing that the Astros that year were "soft".  I don't understand that at all.  We sucked as a BP in the WS, but the team was absolute killers all year long pretty much top to bottom.  I didn't think there was a single soft thing about it

Yeah that’s narrative BS. There is not a single reason for anyone to believe that team was “soft.”

[HtownHorn 14468]

1 hour ago, Wulaw Horn said:

Cool. You said the bullpen sucked that year. It didn't.  They didn't have a good world series. That was a problem in winning the world series. We were talking about how talented that team was overall. There was nothing wrong with that bullpen all year.  

Except they blew ass when the team needed them the most. If 2019 had the 2023 bullpen, they would have won in 5 games.

Edited May 24, 2023 by HtownHorn

[UTexasFight 9376]

Fuck off days

[HtownHorn 14468]

1 hour ago, Snake Diggity said:

Will you be satisfied if Tucker walks but Altuve, Framber, Brown, and Bryan Abreu are all extended by 2025?

I would rather have 4 addl seasons of aging Altuve, 2 more of prime Framber, 2 more of prime Brown, and 2 more of prime Abreu than 5 seasons of prime Tucker and 5 seasons of aging Tucker.

You should have the money to sign Tucker once you let Bregman walk. Though the Astros have plenty of OF prospects in Gilbert, Barber, Melton, and Clifford.

[tx 3 putt 76314]

9 minutes ago, UTexasFight said:

Fuck off days

this one will be brutal 

[UTPhil2006 3790]

24 minutes ago, UTexasFight said:

Fuck off days

930am Texas baseball 

[Gut Wagon 8052]

4 hours ago, Hank Chinaski said:

He actively decided to not have cohesive front office leadership and pretended to be a GM this past offseason.

Every signing he made has been a fucking disaster in 2023 and the club will be worse off for them in future seasons as well. We’d be better off if he actually spent no money at all.

When this team fizzles out in the wild card round and then we wonder why we aren’t extending Tucker or why we aren’t in on useful FAs in the off-season, it’ll be fun to remember that we’ve already spent that money - over $30 million - on 2 replacement-level players when Crane was playing GM.

 

Not saying you're wrong, mind you. 

[Wulaw Horn 18973]

1 hour ago, HtownHorn said:

Except they blew ass when the team needed them the most. If 2019 had the 2023 bullpen, they would have won in 5 games.

The 2019 bullpen was just fine in the regular season just like 2023. 2023 could implode again like 2019. 2019 was a small sample size problem at the worst time. 
if you meant to say if 2019 was perfect like 2022 was then yeah. 

Edited May 25, 2023 by Wulaw Horn

[David Dennison 18652]

1 hour ago, HtownHorn said:

You should have the money to sign Tucker once you let Bregman walk. Though the Astros have plenty of OF prospects in Gilbert, Barber, Melton, and Clifford.

I think the issue with Tucker will be length of contract.

[Dnaguy 11770]

1 hour ago, David Dennison said:

I think the issue with Tucker will be length of contract.

[tx 3 putt 76314]

Yuli needs to ease up on these 4 hit games. Too soon !!

[WBT 20415]

14 hours ago, UTexasFight said:

He for sure won’t want to play for a guy that took two months to push him in front of Abreu in the order 

*some of the time, depending on how many lefties the other team has in the bullpen

[WBT 20415]

13 hours ago, Wulaw Horn said:

Can we just extend Yordan again until like 2032?

A big guy with bad knees and hands?

[Wulaw Horn 18973]

We had some fun with this one doing over unders on wins, lineup meltdowns, scoreboard watching, and other silly stuff plus all your stats and analysis from the last week. And UNDER an hour! 
 

Spotify:

 

Apple:

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/breathing-orange-fire-a-houston-astros-podcast/id1683955456?i=1000614422826
 

amazon

https://music.amazon.com/podcasts/852d9661-0b82-43da-8ae9-955d001c400b/episodes/d6626d83-01e3-4bec-a6bf-3662853a91ea/breathing-orange-fire-a-houston-astros-podcast-episode-6-over-under?ref=dm_sh_TfAlssFLgAyhhXDPR2VCpm9gb

[tx 3 putt 76314]

🥺🥺🥺🥺