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  • HillCountryBevo
    HillCountryBevo

    Imagine your basis of hating Trump is because of mean tweets, January 6 and “hush money” trial all because liberal media is crooked. Fuck right off. This is my last post in this forum  dumb fucki

  • Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand
    Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand

    When you're a court, you just grab their asset, and they let you do it!

  • HillCountryBevo
    HillCountryBevo

    Bye bitch. Enjoy living in literal hell if your man Biden is re elected

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NSIAP... 

This thread is amazing! 

 

Stupid amnesty question.  So as a defendant you can request a trial by jury.  If cannon ends up as the judge, can Trump waive that right and the prosecution is stuck with her?  If Trump waves having a jury trial, can the prosecution then select a jury trial because Cannon is nuts.  

2 hours ago, chainsaw said:

 

 

don't threaten me with a good time.

11 minutes ago, Ted Lange said:

Stupid amnesty question.  So as a defendant you can request a trial by jury.  If cannon ends up as the judge, can Trump waive that right and the prosecution is stuck with her?  If Trump waves having a jury trial, can the prosecution then select a jury trial because Cannon is nuts.  

I think on the federal level, the prosecution must consent to a defendant's request for a jury trial.

3 minutes ago, dcbc said:

I think on the federal level, the prosecution must consent to a defendant's request for a jury trial.

What if they don’t want a jury trial.  Do they have to consent to a judge that’s in the bag?
 

2 hours ago, The Dog said:

 

It is an Easter egg.

Something isn't right here to me.  I've read the indictment and as fully encompassing as it seems to be, I don't think this is the end of the document stuff, but just part of it.  For one, Meadows, who helped orchestrate the original taking of the documents isn't mentioned in the indictment (unless I missed a page).  That seems like a big missing piece of this.  I'm beginning to wonder if there are actually 2 different grand juries working on 2 different parts of this.  We obviously know about the grand jury in Florida where the indictments are happening Tuesday, but we also know of another grand jury in DC.  It was long presumed that the case would be handled in DC, but as the lawyers here made clear for venue reasons and to prevent technicalities being open to appeal, this part of the indictment was made in Florida.  A couple of questions about this:

1.  The crimes outlined in the indictment all pretty much seem to have occurred in Florida, is this because of where it happened?  (I realize some of the evidence also points to happenings in New Jersey, but mostly Florida).  

2.  Is it possible to have an entirely separate case in DC about the original theft by taking?  Basically, different crimes, different jurisdiction?  I have no idea if this is even potentially a thing.  

So basically, might this not be the end of the document scandal, but rather the beginning?

I think everyone automatically assumes that since this indictment was done that the grand jury in DC must now be fully related to Jan. 6th, is it possible that there is more than one grand jury in DC, one for more of the documents, and one for Jan. 6th?

 

2 hours ago, tx 3 putt said:

IMG_4739.jpeg

This Tuesday deal can take place anywhere ?

 

1 hour ago, tx 3 putt said:

 

This fucker is doing it again. The National Guard better be in place, locked, loaded, and ready to mow these fuckers down if they try to storm the courthouse. 

These idiots aren't capable of learning. Not even from the massive league trouble their fellow idiots have dealt with over the last 2 years. 

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If anyone comes near Jack Smith’s kids, they better get shot in the fucking eyeball. 

2 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

This thread is both hilarious and educational for us non-lawyer types.

1 hour ago, Gil Bang said:

so, 5% of surly?

  • 46% of Surly are lawyers
  • 46% of Surly are doctors
  • 2% of Surly are both
  • 2% of Surly are pilots
  • 2% of Surly are engineers (1 member of Surly is a lawyer and an engineer, but the stats don't reflect it)
  • 2% of Surly are in the entertainment industry
  • 2% of Surly are math majors
8 minutes ago, Hermanator said:

This fucker is doing it again. The National Guard better be in place, locked, loaded, and ready to mow these fuckers down if they try to storm the courthouse. 

These idiots aren't capable of learning. Not even from the massive league trouble their fellow idiots have dealt with over the last 2 years. 

It appears to be fake, but there are people out there trying to stir shit up, most likely a lot of Russian bots, with the help of the Qanon idiots, and those that just want to see things burn and people die.

13 minutes ago, Hermanator said:

 

This fucker is doing it again. The National Guard better be in place, locked, loaded, and ready to mow these fuckers down if they try to storm the courthouse. 

These idiots aren't capable of learning. Not even from the massive league trouble their fellow idiots have dealt with over the last 2 years. 

I'm afraid they're bringing in Meal Team 6 to rescue the president. I hope the guard has an adequate supply of gravy to fend off the onslaught.

I Went Undercover With a Border Militia. Here's What I Saw. – Mother Jones

3 hours ago, Gil Bang said:

 

 

Sometimes I think there's something about being a really attractive woman that kills their brain cells. 

1 hour ago, Hermanator said:

 

This fucker is doing it again. The National Guard better be in place, locked, loaded, and ready to mow these fuckers down if they try to storm the courthouse. 

These idiots aren't capable of learning. Not even from the massive league trouble their fellow idiots have dealt with over the last 2 years. 

It'll be the US Marshals. They don't play. Ashli Babitt would get a lot of company in hell. 

29 minutes ago, Blotto said:

I'm afraid they're bringing in Meal Team 6 to rescue the president. I hope the guard has an adequate supply of gravy to fend off the onslaught.

I Went Undercover With a Border Militia. Here's What I Saw. – Mother Jones

Seal Team 4XL better hope there's no walking involved in their revolution.  Crawling was also not part of their basic training, for obvious reasons.  And at this point, why bother with camo?  It's not like nobody can spot them.  "See the fat ass struggling up the courthouse steps?"  "Wearing camo?"  "Yeah, that's him."  "Camo with red, white and blue flags, sir?"  Just all adds up, doesn't it?  "Hey, y'all don't forget the coolers, the ones with wheels.  We're going to need cold beverages and nobody wants to carry a cooler full of ice and Miller Light up those steps."    

3 hours ago, tx 3 putt said:

 

The thing that really kills me is these worthless un-American shitbag fucksticks really think they're patriots. 

1 hour ago, Hookah Horns said:

The thing that really kills me is these worthless un-American shitbag fucksticks really think they're patriots. 

It's the fact that they think they'd survive in a fight with the government, whether it be county, state, or feds, that gets me.

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7 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

 

There is an extraordinary thing called an Alford plea whereby the defendant is permitted to plead guilty while also claiming innocence, essentially admitting that the evidence would result in conviction.  They are very rarely accepted in federal courts, as I understand it.

Most times if a judge gets a whiff that the defendant is not actually guilty, or doesn't believe him or herself to be guilty, they will refuse to accept the plea.

Side track just because I recently watched it - there’s a documentary series on HBO called Paradise Lost about the “West Memphis Three”, who were three teenage boys convicted of brutally murdering some little boys in the woods behind a truck stop with no physical evidence, on the basis of a “confession” extracted from a retarded teenager after hours of interrogation and the fact that these were the metal kids in a backwards place during the satanism hysteria. They served something like 20 years before taking an Alford plea, which got one of them off of death row. Worth a rage watch, it is astonishing how fucking stupid we are.

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Just cannot get enough of this. 

GOP: Witch-hunt! Trump did nothing wrong! 
 

DJT: Look at this, look. These are secret documents. 
 

GOP: He could have packed them by accident! It’s not like he was showing everyone military secrets. 

DJT: The military did this. I shouldn’t show it to you. You know what, just don’t get too close.

GOP: He has the authority to declassify anything! 
 

DJT: I could have declassified this, but let me be clear—- I absolutely did not. 
 

GOP: You know what? GOP presidential candidates should be able to do crimes. Can we just agree on that? 

Americans are stupid.  And water is wet.  Individuals are smart and thoughtful, but as a whole, people in general are the absolute worst.  This shouldn't be news to any of you.  

Anyways, I was on a plane when the news came down.  Glad to see this orange piece of shit is finally suffering the consequences of his fucking actions.  Now if only his cult following would have the same shit happen to them.  I am so tired of awful people.  I had an incident Memorial Day weekend where my friend and I had stopped into a pub after a Broadway Show.  My firend started talking to the man beside her.  I completely ignored their conversation until he said something idiotic like, "Trump did a much better job on the border than Biden."  I mean, come the fuck on.  A fucking wall that would never work?  What an idiot.  

Anyway, happy Indictment weekend. As bad as Nixon and Reagan are, they never would have done what Trump did.  They, like all our Presidents, had a calling to serve the country, even if their idea of how to do that was absolutely horrific.  Trump only became President to serve himself. What a piece of shit.

Also, what I have seen coming out are two things.  Thursday, the GQP was all given talking points that Biden had accepted 2 $5M payments associated with Burisma (this is what MTG and BoBo were blathering about how they went to SCIF to see this memo).  That memo was a tip the FBI got when TRUMP was President, and that Bill Barr's FBI investigaged and could not corroborate.  So all the GQP blathering, including that asshat from Kentucky Comer is about this shit. I have a feeling they knew an indictment or some bad news was coming down becuase shit really ramped up Wednesday and Thursday.

Now, I am hearing Trumpworld saying he had a right to those records under the Presidential Records Act, so that is their new talking point.  L-o-fucking-l.  These people are so incredibly stupud, it is unreal.  

Their justification story will change a dozen times in the next week.  And his primary opponents will pounce in that.  And then they start blasting one another.  This is gonna be magnificent 

6 hours ago, Gil Bang said:

 

This chick fucking crushed it. That’s how you Fox News. 

 

6 hours ago, Ted Lange said:

Stupid amnesty question.  So as a defendant you can request a trial by jury.  If cannon ends up as the judge, can Trump waive that right and the prosecution is stuck with her?  If Trump waves having a jury trial, can the prosecution then select a jury trial because Cannon is nuts.  

Yes, he can elect trial before the court and there's nothing the government can do about it.

But, assuming Smith has the goods, which I think he does, Matthew Kaczmaryk and Clarence Thomas would have to convict, let alone Aileen Mercedes Cannon.  

He'd be much better off betting on a hung jury with a magat.

5 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:
  • 2% of Surly are engineers (1 member of Surly is a lawyer and an engineer, but the stats don't reflect it)
  •  

Actually, more than that.  At least BrickHorn and I are engineers and lawyers.  Couple of others running around. IIRC, Brick has an MSEE, even.  Respek.

5 hours ago, BamaATL said:

Something isn't right here to me.  I've read the indictment and as fully encompassing as it seems to be, I don't think this is the end of the document stuff, but just part of it.  For one, Meadows, who helped orchestrate the original taking of the documents isn't mentioned in the indictment (unless I missed a page).  That seems like a big missing piece of this.  I'm beginning to wonder if there are actually 2 different grand juries working on 2 different parts of this.  We obviously know about the grand jury in Florida where the indictments are happening Tuesday, but we also know of another grand jury in DC.  It was long presumed that the case would be handled in DC, but as the lawyers here made clear for venue reasons and to prevent technicalities being open to appeal, this part of the indictment was made in Florida.  A couple of questions about this:

1.  The crimes outlined in the indictment all pretty much seem to have occurred in Florida, is this because of where it happened?  (I realize some of the evidence also points to happenings in New Jersey, but mostly Florida).  

2.  Is it possible to have an entirely separate case in DC about the original theft by taking?  Basically, different crimes, different jurisdiction?  I have no idea if this is even potentially a thing.  

So basically, might this not be the end of the document scandal, but rather the beginning?

I think everyone automatically assumes that since this indictment was done that the grand jury in DC must now be fully related to Jan. 6th, is it possible that there is more than one grand jury in DC, one for more of the documents, and one for Jan. 6th?

 

Possible, yes.  I think this is it, though, for Trump and the documents.  

There's no "theft of documents" crime, per se.  18 USC 793 https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/793 does make it an offense to " copies, takes, makes, or obtains, or attempts to copy, take, make, or obtain" defense information.  But, I don't think they have solid evidence of knowledge and intent on the days surrounding January 20, 2021.

As we have seen with Biden and Pence, shit happens packing out, what makes it criminal is what happens later, when it's discovered.

So, although technically they could attempt to charge him with 793(b) for the initial taking, I think for evidentiary reasons (lack of) and policy reasons, they won't.

  • Popular Post

Ben Shapiro believes that Trump took these “because he sees things he likes and takes them.”

I need to be clear that I absolutely believe this, even as “he just liked them so he took them” is not a legal defense.
 

There is an order of operations to figuring out why and how DJT does things and you should always solve for the stupidest solution first. He’s not a complicated man and there’s nothing more below the surface. 

51 minutes ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

I don't get the Corvette reference.  

Biden found classified docs in his garage next to his vintage corvette and immediately turned them over to the government. So it’s “what about Biden.”

fascinating, shocking, not shocking, unbelievable, depressing  - lots.

I lost it at “this is just an excuse to cover for Biden and probably Obama too.” Of course they find a way to work Obama in here because why not?
 

This is one of the underrated funny parts of the C GOP reaction. An indictment doesn’t come down from Biden himself on high. Trump was indicted by a grand jury of citizens in notoriously Trump-hostile… Florida. Statistically at least half the grand jury likely either for him or is apolitical and had no real preconceived opinion.

He’s so fucked, but his hand picked judge is about to let him play his delay game. It’s going to take at least 2 years for this trial to happen, maybe 3 

 

16 hours ago, kevwun said:

I don't want to hear any more shit about Biden's garage.  Who the fuck stores boxes of anything like that in their bathrooms?

Reading material?  With his diet, dude has got to get board taking a growler

2 hours ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

Americans are stupid.  And water is wet.  Individuals are smart and thoughtful, but as a whole, people in general are the absolute worst.  This shouldn't be news to any of you.  

Anyways, I was on a plane when the news came down.  Glad to see this orange piece of shit is finally suffering the consequences of his fucking actions.  Now if only his cult following would have the same shit happen to them.  I am so tired of awful people.  I had an incident Memorial Day weekend where my friend and I had stopped into a pub after a Broadway Show.  My firend started talking to the man beside her.  I completely ignored their conversation until he said something idiotic like, "Trump did a much better job on the border than Biden."  I mean, come the fuck on.  A fucking wall that would never work?  What an idiot.  

Anyway, happy Indictment weekend. As bad as Nixon and Reagan are, they never would have done what Trump did.  They, like all our Presidents, had a calling to serve the country, even if their idea of how to do that was absolutely horrific.  Trump only became President to serve himself. What a piece of shit.

Couldn't even finish the ineffective wall. 

No president can really do much about the border until congress fixes immigration, which looks like it'll never happen. 

The jokes write themselves …..

 

10 minutes ago, gmr548 said:


This is one of the underrated funny parts of the C GOP reaction. An indictment doesn’t come down from Biden himself on high. Trump was indicted by a grand jury of citizens in notoriously Trump-hostile… Florida. Statistically at least half the grand jury likely either for him or is apolitical and had no real preconceived opinion.

I like how they act like it's impossible that Biden had nothing to do with Trump being charged. Probably because cheeto used the DOJ as his personal brute squad. Hey dumbfucks, only your presidents seem to have trouble understanding that Justice shouldn't be used to settle personal scores for POTUS. 

7 hours ago, dcbc said:

I think on the federal level, the prosecution must consent to a defendant's request for a jury trial.

Trump didn’t move his permanent residence from New York to Florida because he liked the weather. 

So here's an NYT article speculating some ways Cannon could gum up the works. https://www.textise.net/showText.aspx?strURL=https%3A//www.nytimes.com/2023/06/09/us/politics/trump-documents-judge-aileen-cannon.html#site-content

The article notes that the Clerk of SD Fla insists this was a random assignment.  Hmmm.

One thing is says is that the DC Circuit's attorney-client privilege rulings are not binding on the trial court, notably as pertains to Corcoran's notes, which clearly inform a lot of the indictment.

I don't see how that can possibly be.  The article says the DC Circuit's rulings only apply to what can be shown to a grand jury, not to a trial jury.  That don't make no sense.  Once the privilege is gone, it's gone.  There's not a/c privilege for some purposes and not others.

One notable contrast between the Special Master case and this criminal case.  The appointment of a Special Master was discretionaryand, although she was found to have abused her discretion, that still gives the judge some latitude.

There are very few decisions in a criminal case that are discretionary.  One exception is scheduling.  That's where this could go to shit.

7 hours ago, Ted Lange said:

Stupid amnesty question.  So as a defendant you can request a trial by jury.  If cannon ends up as the judge, can Trump waive that right and the prosecution is stuck with her?  If Trump waves having a jury trial, can the prosecution then select a jury trial because Cannon is nuts.  

DCBC is right.  To waive a jury trial and try it before the Court, the government must consent and the court must approve. https://www.law.cornell.edu/rules/frcrmp/rule_23

7 hours ago, Hermanator said:

 

This fucker is doing it again. The National Guard better be in place, locked, loaded, and ready to mow these fuckers down if they try to storm the courthouse. 

These idiots aren't capable of learning. Not even from the massive league trouble their fellow idiots have dealt with over the last 2 years. 

You think DeSantis is going to roll out the Florida National Guard to protect the courthouse? He’ll have a tough decision to make. He wants to win the nomination but he doesn’t want to piss off the MAGA base. He has to defend Trump publicly. I’m inclined to think he’ll gamble on chaos because he doesn’t have the guts to call out the troops. 

Cannon is going to smear feces all over this process. We know it. She knows it. Trump knows it. The goal has always been to get re-elected before prison so he can pardon himself or fire anyone, etc. 

2 hours ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

Also, what I have seen coming out are two things.  Thursday, the GQP was all given talking points that Biden had accepted 2 $5M payments associated with Burisma (this is what MTG and BoBo were blathering about how they went to SCIF to see this memo).  That memo was a tip the FBI got when TRUMP was President, and that Bill Barr's FBI investigaged and could not corroborate.  So all the GQP blathering, including that asshat from Kentucky Comer is about this shit. I have a feeling they knew an indictment or some bad news was coming down becuase shit really ramped up Wednesday and Thursday.

Now, I am hearing Trumpworld saying he had a right to those records under the Presidential Records Act, so that is their new talking point.  L-o-fucking-l.  These people are so incredibly stupud, it is unreal.  

Yep, that’s the official talking point. I heard Steve Gruber, a conservative radio host out of Michigan whom I’d never heard of before, peddling that crap during an interview on BBC radio yesterday. He was doing his best Jim Jordan impression, talking loud and fast and not letting the interviewer get a word in. 

1 hour ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

I don't get the Corvette reference.  

Joe Biden has a Corvette. Slam!

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