Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty

[jimmyjazz 45546]

40 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Remain prolix!" I"m pretty sure prolix is a good thing.

prolix >>> prolapsed

[Radical Larry 28528]

 

[Horn Dog 9671]

1 minute ago, Radical Larry said:

 

I really like this idea of compounding interest accumulation while appral is pending.  Gives a negative incentive for bullshit delays and appeals.  I wish they could find a way to apply this concept to his criminal cases.

[Fudge Nuggets 19146]

18 minutes ago, Horn Dog said:

I really like this idea of compounding interest accumulation while appral is pending.  Gives a negative incentive for bullshit delays and appeals.  I wish they could find a way to apply this concept to his criminal cases.

When found guilty, add the number of days he roamed free to his sentence. 

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20342]

I swear to God when this motherfucker dies I'm inviting every one of you to the Black Sheep Lodge on Lamar for a night of drinking on me. 

[YGIFS 19449]

Well then you better be totes cool with me doing blow off the bartop and fisting chicks and slapping dicks.  

[Underdog 28446]

43 minutes ago, YGIFS said:

Well then you better be totes cool with me doing blow off the bartop and fisting chicks and slapping dicks.  

Sword fight!!! 

[Francisco 2.0 32318]

https://trumpdebtcounter.com

 

 

[Rimbo 25773]

9 hours ago, Underdog said:

Sword fight!!! 

underrated movie and RIP John Ritter

Edited February 25 by Rimbo

[tx 3 putt 76315]

11 hours ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

I swear to God when this motherfucker dies I'm inviting every one of you to the Black Sheep Lodge on Lamar for a night of drinking on me. 

sounds like something the austin serial killer would do

Edited February 25 by tx 3 putt

[tx 3 putt 76315]

[Rimbo 25773]

1 minute ago, tx 3 putt said:

is Trump even still employing her?

[dcbc 14404]

34 minutes ago, tx 3 putt said:

She is a turnip. 

[Gatorubet 30083]

34 minutes ago, Rimbo said:

is Trump even still employing her?

Since you did not state in what capacity, I tend to say, “yes”!

[BamaATL 16592]

14 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

Since you did not state in what capacity, I tend to say, “yes”!

I'm guessing she can move her arm like the claymation in a Tool video.  

[aggie08 21424]

56 minutes ago, Rimbo said:

is Trump even still employing her?

If employment implies compensation, was he ever?

[dcbc 14404]

3 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

If employment implies compensation, was he ever?

Didn't she get paid in advance?  I think he's paid her firm nearly $3.5M.  That alone should be a red flag for being in charge of a country, but you know, here we are.

Edited February 26 by dcbc

[Gatorubet 30083]

53 minutes ago, tx 3 putt said:

Has anyone reminded her that Trump refused to take the stand in his defense?  Does she forget that the judge walked back the part of his granting of summary judgment that was the most difficult to sustain? In the what-do-you-owe phase Habba Dabba Do and Trump kept trying to explain the great disclaimer and why Mar-a-Lago was worth more than the combined real estate of several states.  One of the reasons the judge kept getting pissed was that the morons kept interjecting liability crap into the damages trial.

She may have been too busy shopping and getting mani-pedis to focus on that law stuff.  Folks paying closer attention than me can remind me, but I thought that the appellate review standard was ‘clearly erroneous’.   There is a mountain of documentary evidence supporting the fact that they lied and greatly inflated their assets in some remarkable ways.

They insist on saying because he paid the loans back, there was no crime. I keep hearing that his not defaulting makes no difference because the purpose of the law is to stop people lying to lenders, as getting a lower rate because you lied is not victimless.  

This may not be a perfect analogy, but if you were caught with a firearm with a serial number erased you’re going to get convicted snd maybe sent to federal prison.   It makes no difference if you scratched off the serial number.  It makes no difference if you knew the serial number had been scratched off…or that you bought it in a legitimate purchase from a neighbor and it was sitting in the back of your truck for a month before you had even looked in the box.  Possession of the weapon with the altered serial number means you are guilty.    

Which is all to say, there are crimes on the books where your intent or even the lack of anything resembling a victim is entirely immaterial.  If this is truly one of those statutes, they are Uber fucked.

[atomheartbevo 89409]

15 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

This may not be a perfect analogy, but if you were caught with a firearm with a serial number erased you’re going to get convicted snd maybe sent to federal prison.   It makes no difference if you scratched off the serial number.  It makes no difference if you knew the serial number had been scratched off…or that you bought it in a legitimate purchase from a neighbor and it was sitting in the back of your truck for a month before you had even looked in the box.  Possession of the weapon with the altered serial number means you are guilty.

[tx 3 putt 76315]

😂😂😂😂

 

[High Plains Drifter 10971]

On 2/23/2024 at 4:10 PM, The Dog said:

and IIRC that number keeps going up until he puts up the money or the bond during appeal. 

 

it could go up to infinity and beyond. He'll never pay a cent. 

 

[High Plains Drifter 10971]

11 hours ago, dcbc said:

Didn't she get paid in advance?  I think he's paid her firm nearly $3.5M.  That alone should be a red flag for being in charge of a country, but you know, here we are.

 

She is employed by an actual law firm? 

Fleece, Tick, and Cheatem?

 

[Gatorubet 30083]

 
it could go up to infinity and beyond. He'll never pay a cent. 
 

He won’t. But his cult and /or the RNC will.   I think to get through to the highest appellate court in New York from a trial verdict is normally about 18 months.  

[Constant 6722]

11 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

[BamaATL 16592]

So he has filed an appeal on the Engoron NY State stuff, but apparently is also attempting to appeal his need to bond around that pesky half billion dollars.  A bold strategy to be sure.  

[speed817 19108]

1 hour ago, tx 3 putt said:

😂😂😂😂

 

Wasn't the presidential records act written because of what happened with Nixon???  So they could avoid that situation again???

[The Dog 43794]

 

[Red Five 40633]

8 minutes ago, speed817 said:

Wasn't the presidential records act written because of what happened with Nixon???  So they could avoid that situation again???

Of course Dotard's takeaway from the presidential records act is "I can take whatever I want and do whatever I want with it!". 

[Gatorubet 30083]

16 minutes ago, BamaATL said:

So he has filed an appeal on the Engoron NY State stuff, but apparently is also attempting to appeal his need to bond around that pesky half billion dollars.  A bold strategy to be sure.  

He said he had almost $500,000,000 just sitting around the house - what’s the problem?  Check under the cushions.

- “He says his brand is so strong he doesn’t need to put down money..”

- “What? He’ll pay me when Texas Tech wins the BCS Championship…and the BCS is kaput!!”

 

[BamaATL 16592]

3 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

He said he had almost $500,000,000 just sitting around the house - what’s the problem?  Check under the cushions.

- “He says his brand is so strong he doesn’t need to put down money..”

- “What? He’ll pay me when Texas Tech wins the BCS Championship…and the BCS is kaput!!”

 

I'm gonna go get some doughnuts.  

[Underdog 28446]

 

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20342]

On 2/23/2024 at 6:34 PM, TwiceHorn said:

Post judgment interest continues to accrue, supersedeas bond or not. That is why they are usually 120% or so of the face amount of the judgment (which usually includes prejudgment interest, as it seems to here). 

This guy says he didn't need a bond. He appears to be on top of this. He's a good twitter follow. 
 

od 

[The Dog 43794]

45 minutes ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

This guy says he didn't need a bond. He appears to be on top of this. He's a good twitter follow. 
 

od 

 

[Doc Sam Beckett 5782]

49 minutes ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

This guy says he didn't need a bond. He appears to be on top of this. He's a good twitter follow. 
 

od 

Pretty sure @TwiceHorn has been saying that multiple times for awhile now. Unfortunately 

[Brisketexan 104561]

50 minutes ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

This guy says he didn't need a bond. He appears to be on top of this. He's a good twitter follow. 
 

od 

Correct.

Bond: NOT needed in order to appeal a judgment.  You can appeal without posting a bond.

Bond: YES needed in order to stay the execution of the underlying judgment while the appeal is ongoing.  The bond is called a "supersedeas bond," because posting it supersedes the effectiveness of the underlying judgment.

There's risks both ways: 1) the winner executes on the judgment, but LOSES the appeal.  Now, they have to make the now-winning party whole.  So, don't go burning up that money you collect.  You may need to pay it back to the former loser, but now winner, of the case.  And 2) there's a risk in not posting bond (your shit could get collected on), but there's also a risk in posting a bond if you're anywhere close to bankrupt because of the judgment.  If you lose the appeal, then that bond pays off the winner.  They don't have to go through any collection effort, and you can't later claim bankruptcy and try to reduce the amount you already paid into the bond.

[Zonahorn 8079]

So Trump either posts the bond to execute a stay or appeals without a bond and gets his assets seized. 

[dieucla98 2934]

21 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Correct.

Bond: NOT needed in order to appeal a judgment.  You can appeal without posting a bond.

Bond: YES needed in order to stay the execution of the underlying judgment while the appeal is ongoing.  The bond is called a "supersedeas bond," because posting it supersedes the effectiveness of the underlying judgment.

There's risks both ways: 1) the winner executes on the judgment, but LOSES the appeal.  Now, they have to make the now-winning party whole.  So, don't go burning up that money you collect.  You may need to pay it back to the former loser, but now winner, of the case.  And 2) there's a risk in not posting bond (your shit could get collected on), but there's also a risk in posting a bond if you're anywhere close to bankrupt because of the judgment.  If you lose the appeal, then that bond pays off the winner.  They don't have to go through any collection effort, and you can't later claim bankruptcy and try to reduce the amount you already paid into the bond.

So in what scenario would you want to post a bond and stay the execution of the judgement - you're afraid the other party is going to spend your money or otherwise make it more difficult to recover?

The more I learn about the law, the more I want to ensure I never have to deal with it beyond reasonable.

[Brisketexan 104561]

1 minute ago, dieucla98 said:

So in what scenario would you want to post a bond and stay the execution of the judgement - you're afraid the other party is going to spend your money or otherwise make it more difficult to recover?

The more I learn about the law, the more I want to ensure I never have to deal with it beyond reasonable.

You post bond because you don't want the other party seizing your shit (usually, you don't have cash sitting around that they can go execute on -- they can seize assets, which messes with your business/life).  It functionally gives you a measure of control.  That said, in an ordinary collection situation, with a solvent defendant, the plaintiff's lawyer is going to make a call and say "you wanna pay up the easy way, or the hard way?", so you do have an option to avoid having assets seized.

That said, the bottom line is that you post the bond to have some control.  If you're gonna have to pay the judgment eventually (because your appeal is a loser), then it's generally no harm, no foul, so long as you are actually solvent.  If you got a $1,000 judgment against me, and I appealed, I would absolutely put $1,000 into the registry of the court to avoid you messing with my assets and such, or even letting you have the money, which maybe you blow and I can't recover because you're insolvent by then.  If I win, I get my $1k back.  If I lose, I'm out the $1k that I was going to be out anyway.

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

Holy shit Cheese bro

https://www.cnn.com/2024/02/26/politics/kenneth-chesebro-secret-twitter-account-kfile/index.html

was running the coup anonymously on Twitter but failed to report this to investigators 

OPPS! 

[Gatorubet 30083]

OK.  I sunk a double old-fashioned at lunch today already, so I’m asserting my stupid defense:

What if that agreement Trump signed in 1993 saying that Mar-a-Lago is not his residence - but a club - is still enforceable?   If that is true, then the Florida exemption on your residence that deprives creditors of that asset would no longer be viable.

Just for fun E. Jean’s attorneys should try to seize Mar-a-Lago if Trump owns ‘the club’.  I mean, for the laughs and whining….

 

[locodos 5333]

4 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

OK.  I sunk a double old-fashioned at lunch today already, so I’m asserting my stupid defense:

What if that agreement Trump signed in 1993 saying that Mar-a-Lago is not his residence - but a club - is still enforceable?   If that is true, then the Florida exemption on your residence that deprives creditors of that asset would no longer be viable.

Just for fun E. Jean’s attorneys should try to seize Mar-a-Lago if Trump owns ‘the club’.  I mean, for the laughs and whining….

 

According to Palm Beach County Property Appraiser.  No Homestead exemption (or any exemption)

MAR A LAGO CLUB INC

PROPERTY DETAIL

LOCATION	1100 S OCEAN BLVD
MUNICIPALITY	PALM BEACH
PARCEL NO.	50-43-43-35-00-002-0390
SUBDIVISION
BOOK/PAGE	/
SALE DATE
MAILING ADDRESS	DIRECTOR OF FINANCE C/O 1100 S OCEAN BLVD PALM BEACH FL 33480 5004
USE TYPE	7700 - CLB/LDG/UN HALL
TOTAL SQUARE FEET	76821

SALES INFORMATION

SALES DATE	PRICE
MAR-1995	$12,000,000
DEC-1985	$5,000,000
MAR-1981	$100

APPRAISALS

TAX YEAR	2023
IMPROVEMENT VALUE	$0
LAND VALUE	$0
TOTAL MARKET VALUE	$37,000,000
All values are as of January 1st each year

ASSESSED/TAXABLE VALUES

TAX YEAR	2023
ASSESSED VALUE	$33,396,000
EXEMPTION AMOUNT	$0
TAXABLE VALUE	$33,396,000

TAXES

TAX YEAR	2023
AD VALOREM	$524,632
NON AD VALOREM	$74,602
TOTAL TAX	$599,234

[TwiceHorn 31265]

14 minutes ago, locodos said:

According to Palm Beach County Property Appraiser.  No Homestead exemption (or any exemption)

MAR A LAGO CLUB INC

PROPERTY DETAIL

LOCATION	1100 S OCEAN BLVD
MUNICIPALITY	PALM BEACH
PARCEL NO.	50-43-43-35-00-002-0390
SUBDIVISION
BOOK/PAGE	/
SALE DATE
MAILING ADDRESS	DIRECTOR OF FINANCE C/O 1100 S OCEAN BLVD PALM BEACH FL 33480 5004
USE TYPE	7700 - CLB/LDG/UN HALL
TOTAL SQUARE FEET	76821

SALES INFORMATION

SALES DATE	PRICE
MAR-1995	$12,000,000
DEC-1985	$5,000,000
MAR-1981	$100

APPRAISALS

TAX YEAR	2023
IMPROVEMENT VALUE	$0
LAND VALUE	$0
TOTAL MARKET VALUE	$37,000,000
All values are as of January 1st each year

ASSESSED/TAXABLE VALUES

TAX YEAR	2023
ASSESSED VALUE	$33,396,000
EXEMPTION AMOUNT	$0
TAXABLE VALUE	$33,396,000

TAXES

TAX YEAR	2023
AD VALOREM	$524,632
NON AD VALOREM	$74,602
TOTAL TAX	$599,234

Yeah see the problem there is that it's owned by MAL Inc., not Donald personally or any of the defendant entities in the NY case. 

Via execution, you can only seize assets in the name of /titled to one of the defendants liable under the judgment. 

If assets were placed in entities in the ordinary course of business (as opposed to moved around after the liability arose in a fraudulent transfer manner) there is very little you can do to get to them.  About the best you can do is get at income or payments they throw off. 

[locodos 5333]

1 minute ago, TwiceHorn said:

Yeah see the problem there is that it's owned by MAL Inc., not Donald personally or any of the defendant entities in the NY case. 

Via execution, you can only seize assets in the name of /titled to one of the defendants liable under the judgment. 

If assets were placed in entities in the ordinary course of business (as opposed to moved around after the liability arose in a fraudulent transfer manner) there is very little you can do to get to them.  About the best you can do is get at income or payments they throw off. 

Didn't think about that.  I just assumed since that property was used to commit fraud that there may be some recourse.  But I didn't have a double Old Fashion at lunch, so what am I even doing?

[dcbc 14404]

2 hours ago, Gatorubet said:

He said he had almost $500,000,000 just sitting around the house - what’s the problem?  

[Heisenberg 162]

34 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

FOR REAL Just for fun E. Jean’s attorneys should try to seize Mar-a-Lago if Trump owns ‘the club’.  I mean, for the laughs and whining….

 

fixed it for you

[Gap03 3278]

14 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Yeah see the problem there is that it's owned by MAL Inc., not Donald personally or any of the defendant entities in the NY case. 

Via execution, you can only seize assets in the name of /titled to one of the defendants liable under the judgment. 

If assets were placed in entities in the ordinary course of business (as opposed to moved around after the liability arose in a fraudulent transfer manner) there is very little you can do to get to them.  About the best you can do is get at income or payments they throw off. 

How many layers of ownership do you think they'd need to dig through to find Dotard owning something that owns/controls MAL?  And is that equity ownership subject to offsetting debt?  It would be worth the shits and giggles to try to figure out if Donald actually owns MAL (given all his bluster about its value), and if he does ultimately own indirectly all or substantially all of MAL, couldn't they seek recourse against that equity?   

[locodos 5333]

1 minute ago, Gap03 said:

How many layers of ownership do you think they'd need to dig through to find Dotard owning something that owns/controls MAL?  And is that equity ownership subject to offsetting debt?  It would be worth the shits and giggles to try to figure out if Donald actually owns MAL (given all his bluster about its value), and if he does ultimately own indirectly all or substantially all of MAL, couldn't they seek recourse against that equity?   

This,

I am just a bit confused how MAL was used to secure massive loans for Trump or Trump co. if they have no ownership or control.  His legal team has been claiming that it's his asset and was properly valued.    

[hornmpa96 2598]

31 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Yeah see the problem there is that it's owned by MAL Inc., not Donald personally or any of the defendant entities in the NY case. 

Via execution, you can only seize assets in the name of /titled to one of the defendants liable under the judgment. 

If assets were placed in entities in the ordinary course of business (as opposed to moved around after the liability arose in a fraudulent transfer manner) there is very little you can do to get to them.  About the best you can do is get at income or payments they throw off. 

Can they not seize the LLC interests held by the defendant directly? 

[Neonmoon 38127]

2 minutes ago, hornmpa96 said:

Can they not seize the LLC interests held by the defendant directly? 

Limited Liability Company 

It limits the liability 

[hornmpa96 2598]

Just now, Neonmoon said:

Limited Liability Company 

It limits the liability 

I may be missing the sarcasm. 

It limits the liability for the activities of the entity. However, the LLC interests are still the assets of the owner of the LLC and have their own value. Additionally, the ownership of the interests likely convey voting rights which allow the owner to liquidate the property held by the LLC.

If Donald held $400 million of NVDA, I would assume that could be seized to settle the judgement. These LLC interests are no different.