Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty Guilty

[Red Five 40,654]

3 minutes ago, The Dog said:

You left out a few things:

E. Jean Carroll Judgment #1 on appeal and cannot collect because he put up $5.3 million to prevent judgment

E. Jean Carroll Judgment #2 on appeal and CAN collect because he can't afford the bond

NY AG Civil Judgment on appeal and can collect because he can't afford the bond

Business partners in TRUTH are suing him because he's trying to screw them - so now he can't get that windfall until that is settled

Trump PACs are running out of money to pay his legal bills 

SCOTUS ruled that civil cases against Trump as president can proceed and he is not immune from them

Not legal but Trump trying to completely take over GOP to steal the money for his legal bills.

That dude should definitely run for President of the United States.

[conVINCEd 21,468]

Just now, Red Five said:

That dude should definitely run for President of the United States.

It’s his only out.

[Red Five 40,654]

A Trumper yesterday, on all of his legal issues: "Eh, they're just coming after him now". Just waived all of it away.

"All of it? The rape stuff, the coup, stealing classified documents, hush money to a porn star, fraud.... all of it?"

"Yep."

[Guest]

Just talked to my dad, who was watching the Fani Willis stuff. Talked a moment about Trump.

"He's got the best lawyers in the world."

"Eh, I don't know about that."

"Well, he's not in jail is he?"

...kinda hard to argue that point, even though I don't think it's due to his lawyers.

[Red Five 40,654]

Lulz, we should start a "Things Dotard's people say to us in real life" thread.

[SydneyCarton 47,874]

4 minutes ago, FirstTimeCaller said:

Just talked to my dad, who was watching the Fani Willis stuff. Talked a moment about Trump.

"He's got the best lawyers in the world."

"Eh, I don't know about that."

"Well, he's not in jail is he?"

...kinda hard to argue that point, even though I don't think it's due to his lawyers.

You should have said "So if he's got the best lawyers in the world, and he's still convicted, does that mean you believe he was guilty?"

I'm sure he'll say No, but on the off chance you says yes you can also remind him he's a convicted Rapist. 

[Rimbo 25,778]

Now seems a good time to mention that Rick Beato has, at this point, interviewed each member of The Police.

1 hour ago, Red Five said:

A Trumper yesterday, on all of his legal issues: "Eh, they're just coming after him now". Just waived all of it away.

"All of it? The rape stuff, the coup, stealing classified documents, hush money to a porn star, fraud.... all of it?"

"Yep."

It's like trying to point out to the "nothing will happen to him" crowd that things have happened and continue to happen. In the sense that both are being very selective in which facts they believe, to the point where they're no longer engaged with reality.

that's right, fuckers, I'm talking trash about you

[Francisco 2.0 32,323]

4 minutes ago, Rimbo said:

Now seems a good time to mention that Rick Beato has, at this point, interviewed each member of The Police.

It's like trying to point out to the "nothing will happen to him" crowd that things have happened and continue to happen. In the sense that both are being very selective in which facts they believe, to the point where they're no longer engaged with reality.

that's right, fuckers, I'm talking trash about you

 

But until he actually pays a dime or gets a property seized or is remanded for house arrest or something...he hasn't paid.  That's the thing that MAGA keeps clinging to; that for everything they believe is "drummed up" on Trump, he hasn't spent a day in jail or whatever.  They see him still doing rallies, on Fox, hanging out at the border, whatever.  He's a free man.

 

 

 

 

 

[Red Five 40,654]

9 minutes ago, Rimbo said:

Now seems a good time to mention that Rick Beato has, at this point, interviewed each member of The Police.

It's like trying to point out to the "nothing will happen to him" crowd that things have happened and continue to happen. In the sense that both are being very selective in which facts they believe, to the point where they're no longer engaged with reality.

that's right, fuckers, I'm talking trash about you

Me: "He owes over half a billion in fines. With a B. Half a billion dollars." 

"Eh" (waives it away with his hand, as if that is just something that happens from time to time)

I was treated a lot of "Biden is senile" though, so that was nice.

[Slacks 6,791]

Trump is definitely not suspicious.

[aggie08 21,432]

12 minutes ago, Rimbo said:

Now seems a good time to mention that Rick Beato has, at this point, interviewed each member of The Police.

It's like trying to point out to the "nothing will happen to him" crowd that things have happened and continue to happen. In the sense that both are being very selective in which facts they believe, to the point where they're no longer engaged with reality.

that's right, fuckers, I'm talking trash about you

Honest question that I'm sure you've answered elsewhere: what do you think happens to all of this stuff is he his elected President?

I don't think he will, and I want desperately to share your optimism of "real" (not just financial) punishment coming his way. But what if he wins this shit again?

[conVINCEd 21,468]

1 minute ago, aggie08 said:

Honest question that I'm sure you've answered elsewhere: what do you think happens to all of this stuff is he his elected President?

I don't think he will, and I want desperately to share your optimism of "real" (not just financial) punishment coming his way. But what if he wins this shit again?

The great experiment is over.

[Red Five 40,654]

Dotard's attorney today (I'm honestly not sure which trial this was in reference to, as I'm not Rain Man and can't keep track of them all): "There's no reason this trial can't start in late November."

No reason huh. Just can't think of any possible reason. 

[YGIFS 19,449]

9 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Honest question that I'm sure you've answered elsewhere: what do you think happens to all of this stuff is he his elected President?

I don't think he will, and I want desperately to share your optimism of "real" (not just financial) punishment coming his way. But what if he wins this shit again?

Then we all will  be declared enemies of the Reich.  I will have this website scrubbed under some kinda bullshit trademark report to UT and the servers burned to the ground .  We will all donate $37 to his PAC and smile while doing it.  I’ll revert to using my real name in public life and start attending GOP rallies.  When he dies, we will forget every stupid thing his worshippers ever said.  But if he stays alive and wins, I assure you they won’t forget about us.  
 

we’re lucky though. We can blend in and assimilate.  Many of our fellow humans won’t be as fortunate.  I can bug out with my family to Portugal or Costa Rica in one business week.  But millions will be left behind to suffer his wrath.  Even if he loses or dies, 25mm of his cult won’t accept it.  We have to fix it so they think they’re each other to blame and kill one another.  That’s where we come in. 

[atomheartbevo 89,416]

56 minutes ago, Rimbo said:

Now seems a good time to mention that Rick Beato has, at this point, interviewed each member of The Police.

39 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Honest question that I'm sure you've answered elsewhere: what do you think happens to all of this stuff is he his elected President?

Maybe he can get The Police to reunite?

[Rimbo 25,778]

1 hour ago, aggie08 said:

Honest question that I'm sure you've answered elsewhere: what do you think happens to all of this stuff is he his elected President?

I don't think he will, and I want desperately to share your optimism of "real" (not just financial) punishment coming his way. But what if he wins this shit again?

I dunno about you, but I'm moving to Australia.

[Rimbo 25,778]

46 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Maybe he can get The Police to reunite?

he's not cool or smart enough to like The Police

he probably thinks "every breath you take" is a love song

[Rimbo 25,778]

1 hour ago, aggie08 said:

Honest question that I'm sure you've answered elsewhere: what do you think happens to all of this stuff is he his elected President?

I don't think he will, and I want desperately to share your optimism of "real" (not just financial) punishment coming his way. But what if he wins this shit again?

Actually, to expand on my previous answer, I think we're fucked if the Republican party gains control of ANYTHING at the federal level. Even if, say, Nikki Haley wins. Because they'll just pardon and then hand-deliver to Putin's lapdog everything he wants.

Even if we fine him into the poor house now and throw him in jail, Republican victory means he gets back in business and out of jail.

Maybe that's why I'm not worried about the cases being delayed. It's the election that matters.

And it's the election, above all, that I'm bullish about. I don't WANT Haley to get the nomination; that gives the Republicans a chance. Trump, on the other hand, sinks the GOP. Permanently. They can't get rid of his strench any more. He's bankrupting them financially, morally, and politically.

I'd feel bad about it if my politics hadn't slowly slid left over the past three decades.

[RomaVicta 29,781]

3 hours ago, Macanudo said:

Trumperos

Trumprubles

[TexasEd 8,064]

5 minutes ago, Rimbo said:

Actually, to expand on my previous answer, I think we're fucked if the Republican party gains control of ANYTHING at the federal level. Even if, say, Nikki Haley wins. Because they'll just pardon and then hand-deliver to Putin's lapdog everything he wants.

Even if we fine him into the poor house now and throw him in jail, Republican victory means he gets back in business and out of jail.

Maybe that's why I'm not worried about the cases being delayed. It's the election that matters.

And it's the election, above all, that I'm bullish about. I don't WANT Haley to get the nomination; that gives the Republicans a chance. Trump, on the other hand, sinks the GOP. Permanently. They can't get rid of his strench any more. He's bankrupting them financially, morally, and politically.

I'd feel bad about it if my politics hadn't slowly slid left over the past three decades.

He's going to get the nomination but Haley staying in the race and getting 30-45% of the votes along the way will weigh on his ego.  The true weakness of a sociopathic narcissist personality disorder

[Rimbo 25,778]

45 minutes ago, TexasEd said:

He's going to get the nomination but Haley staying in the race and getting 30-45% of the votes along the way will weigh on his ego.  The true weakness of a sociopathic narcissist personality disorder

Oh yeah. Haley's going to steal some of the vote away, and her attacks on him weaken him. Nobody's won the presidency with a meaningful challenger in the primary, and she's meaningful enough.

[tx 3 putt 76,353]

 

[YGIFS 19,449]

That has to be an awkward conversation with the Mar-a-Lago concierge for Victor's translator, "Um, Mr. Orban would like to inquire as to the Forint-to-Dollar cash situation is here at the property...Kthanxbai."

[Neonmoon 38,127]

On 3/1/2024 at 2:19 PM, The Dog said:

You left out a few things:

E. Jean Carroll Judgment #1 on appeal and cannot collect because he put up $5.3 million to prevent judgment

E. Jean Carroll Judgment #2 on appeal and CAN collect because he can't afford the bond

NY AG Civil Judgment on appeal and can collect because he can't afford the bond

Business partners in TRUTH are suing him because he's trying to screw them - so now he can't get that windfall until that is settled

Trump PACs are running out of money to pay his legal bills 

SCOTUS ruled that civil cases against Trump as president can proceed and he is not immune from them

Not legal but Trump trying to completely take over GOP to steal the money for his legal bills.

Should we take bets on when Russia/Saudi/Turkey pay his debts?

[Red Five 40,654]

Yeah um we got any laws on the books about electing a president who is hundreds of millions of dollars in debt to some of the world's worst people? 

[BamaATL 16,592]

8 minutes ago, Red Five said:

Yeah um we got any laws on the books about electing a president who is hundreds of millions of dollars in debt to some of the world's worst people? 

I didn't know he owed the NFL owners money as well.  

[atomheartbevo 89,416]

1 hour ago, BamaATL said:

I didn't know he owed the NFL owners money as well.  

Need to make sure Bud Adam’s is still dead. 

[Nice Guy Eddie 13,411]

Trump Org CFO, Weisselberg, pleading guilty (again) to a crime today. Instead of fraud like last time, it’s perjury from the civil trial case.

hopefully the judge gives him a maximum sentence because obviously 4 months in Rikers Island didn’t teach him to not break the law.

[jimmyjazz 45,554]

17 hours ago, Neonmoon said:

Should we take bets on when Russia/Saudi/Turkey pay his debts?

Well, Saudi handed over $1B to Jared because he's an investment guru, so . . .

 

Edited March 4 by jimmyjazz

[RomaVicta 29,781]

16 hours ago, Red Five said:

Yeah um we got any laws on the books about electing a president who is hundreds of millions of dollars in debt to some of the world's worst people? 

Too obvious. 

[TwiceHorn 31,269]

1 minute ago, RomaVicta said:

Too obvious. 

And previously unneeded. 

[RomaVicta 29,781]

24 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

And previously unneeded. 

True. It's so obviously foul that nobody anticipated it. It's obvious, as you surely know, that he should be barred from office. To me, it's obvious that he should be incarcerated awaiting trial due to the profoundly dangerous crimes he's accused of which we either watched live on TV (Jan. 6), saw videotapes (Trump's chandeliered bathroom storage facility for highly classified documents), or audio tape (coercing a Georgia state official in hopes of altering legal election results).

Obvious counts for nothing in the face of the most odious internal threats to the US. I don't know if anybody's noticed, but our legal system is working a little slow considering what we know. 

Again, I'm not writing anything you don't know. I just remain agog and jabber about it.

[jw4381 3,063]

Does the name Nicolae Ceaușescu ring anyone’s bells?

[Captainant 27,447]

53 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

And previously unneeded. 

Ah well I guess that means we just lay back and enjoy it as trumpco grabs lady justice by the pussy? Trumps entire gambit (and of pretty much every demagogue fascist) is to do things so beyond the pale that it stuns his opposition into inaction. There's more squabbling over the right way to respond than there is actually dealing with the motherfucking goddamn fascists in our government. 

Our lack of imagination combined with the lack of will to punish a member of our oligarch class is how we end up with our mess. The courts have completely been mangled by republican fuckery and our highest court is making overt moves to delay any type of trial until after the election. Where he can of course do the exact same shit as last time because there have BEEN ZERO MEANINGFUL FUCKING CONSEQUENCES FOR HIM!

Motherfucker is about to start getting classified briefings again, it's just stupid at this point. 

[TwiceHorn 31,269]

Well previously, a candidate for any significant office would have been raked over the coals for owing debt to foreign nations and similar entanglements and likely distrusted and not elected. 

But here we are on the fact free time line where trump crimes are made up and biden crimes are real. 

[Brisketexan 104,596]

4 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Ah well I guess that means we just lay back and enjoy it as trumpco grabs lady justice by the pussy? Trumps entire gambit (and of pretty much every demagogue fascist) is to do things so beyond the pale that it stuns his opposition into inaction. There's more squabbling over the right way to respond than there is actually dealing with the motherfucking goddamn fascists in our government. 

Our lack of imagination combined with the lack of will to punish a member of our oligarch class is how we end up with our mess. The courts have completely been mangled by republican fuckery and our highest court is making overt moves to delay any type of trial until after the election. Where he can of course do the exact same shit as last time because there have BEEN ZERO MEANINGFUL FUCKING CONSEQUENCES FOR HIM!

Motherfucker is about to start getting classified briefings again, it's just stupid at this point. 

What everyone is skipping is that societies and cultures have LONG had a script for how to handle people who would upend the system by opting out of/doing an end-around on the rule of law.  It's a very simple script.  It has been written in blood, time and time again.

The rule of law is, ultimately, ill-equipped to handle bad actors with sufficient power who simply say "naaah, don't think I'm gonna buy into that 'follow the law' shit."  That means that the players have opted out of the rule of law, and the solutions it can impose.  That's okay.  That opt-out simply means an opt-in to the alternative system.

Here is how THAT system works:

That simple, binary choice: if you opt out of the rule of law, then you have necessarily opted in to rule of the gun, is the very fucking thing that many of us (ledge dwellers) have been sounding the alarm about for pushing 10 years now.  That's the entire point.  We're busy arguing whether the penalty should be clipping or unsportsmanlike conduct on the dude who just pulled a gun on the field and shot the opposing RB.  The system of rules and yellow flags and 15 yard penalties is not equipped to handle a LB who pulls a gun and shoots opposing players.  The only system that is equipped to handle that is a system of "meet lawlessness with lawlessness."  Which is, again, why much of our alarmist shouting has been at the fucking GQP voters who are CHOOSING this.  "Please don't choose this path, this is how it fucking ends, every fucking time!" has fallen on deaf ears.  We apparently are intent on fully FA, so we can fully FO.

[Red Five 40,654]

5 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

We're busy arguing whether the penalty should be clipping or unsportsmanlike conduct on the dude who just pulled a gun on the field and shot the opposing RB.  The system of rules and yellow flags and 15 yard penalties is not equipped to handle a LB who pulls a gun and shoots opposing players. 

"After the trophy presentation, we're going to be taking a long hard look at what happened on the field today. Ideally, we will have a punishment to dole out approximately four years from now."

[RomaVicta 29,781]

9 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Well previously, a candidate for any significant office would have been raked over the coals for owing debt to foreign nations and similar entanglements and likely distrusted and not elected. 

But here we are on the fact free time line where trump crimes are made up and biden crimes are real. 

Thanks for the reminder. Seriously.

It's the electorate. There is nothing secret about Trump's character or his vile actions.

[WhatTheBuck 28,710]

8 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Here is how THAT system works:

Should’ve happened long ago. 

[Brisketexan 104,596]

2 minutes ago, Red Five said:

"After the trophy presentation, we're going to be taking a long hard look at what happened on the field today. Ideally, we will have a punishment to dole out approximately four years from now."

Correct.

That's why the optimum strategy when subjected to violence outside/above the law is to respond with immediate and brutal counter-violence.

We should have mowed down insurrectionists with belt-fed .50 cals, and had law enforcement storm the White House to shut his ass down.  But humans are loathe to think creatively, and to do what is oh-so-distasteful.  Because the truth is that once one side puts you in a position where the only rational response is counter-violence, then everyone has already lost.  All it takes is for one side to shit in the punch bowl, then the punch is turned into shit punch for everyone.

[RDCanecutter 26,252]

21 hours ago, tx 3 putt said:

 

Orban's thugs no doubt hauling heavy suitcases full of gold-plated tungsten "ingots" while a James Bond slap-bass plays sassily in the background.

[Pato del Muerto 52,342]

Why aren’t they mad that his debt isn’t to the worst Americans?  That’s not America first.  Then again, they are slaves to an Australian family’s propaganda channel and many have Austrian pistols concealed on their personages, so maybe that whole America first rally cry is farcical anyhow. 

[WhatTheBuck 28,710]

39 minutes ago, RDCanecutter said:

while a James Bond slap-bass plays sassily in the background.

<SeinfeldTheme.wav>

[Macanudo 12,926]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

What everyone is skipping is that societies and cultures have LONG had a script for how to handle people who would upend the system by opting out of/doing an end-around on the rule of law.  It's a very simple script.  It has been written in blood, time and time again.

The rule of law is, ultimately, ill-equipped to handle bad actors with sufficient power who simply say "naaah, don't think I'm gonna buy into that 'follow the law' shit."  That means that the players have opted out of the rule of law, and the solutions it can impose.  That's okay.  That opt-out simply means an opt-in to the alternative system.

Here is how THAT system works:

That simple, binary choice: if you opt out of the rule of law, then you have necessarily opted in to rule of the gun, is the very fucking thing that many of us (ledge dwellers) have been sounding the alarm about for pushing 10 years now.  That's the entire point.  We're busy arguing whether the penalty should be clipping or unsportsmanlike conduct on the dude who just pulled a gun on the field and shot the opposing RB.  The system of rules and yellow flags and 15 yard penalties is not equipped to handle a LB who pulls a gun and shoots opposing players.  The only system that is equipped to handle that is a system of "meet lawlessness with lawlessness."  Which is, again, why much of our alarmist shouting has been at the fucking GQP voters who are CHOOSING this.  "Please don't choose this path, this is how it fucking ends, every fucking time!" has fallen on deaf ears.  We apparently are intent on fully FA, so we can fully FO.

You and your Esso station fascination.    

 

Hey, that would make a great band name...    Esso Station Fascination.    Can't decide if it should be an emo goth punk band or an edm dark wave rave DJ.

[Chewbacca 7,730]

21 hours ago, Neonmoon said:

Should we take bets on when Russia/Saudi/Turkey pay his debts?

Elon was in Trump's neck of the woods this weekend.  I still think he's the one that will put up the money.

[Brisketexan 104,596]

27 minutes ago, Macanudo said:

You and your Esso station fascination.   

You know me, I'm one for the classics and sticking with what works.

[bolverk 29,399]

New names and details of the coup plot. Wisconsin Republicans are diabolical bastards.

 

Newly Released Messages Detail Roots of the ‘Fake Electors’ Scheme
Emails and texts unearthed in a lawsuit show how key figures intended their plan to create a “cloud of confusion” to help keep Donald Trump in office after his 2020 election loss.

Just five days after Election Day in 2020, a conservative lawyer named Kenneth Chesebro emailed a former judge who was working for the Trump campaign in Wisconsin, James R. Troupis, pitching an idea for how to overturn the results.

Through litigation, Mr. Chesebro said, the Trump campaign could allege “various systemic abuses” and, with court proceedings pending, encourage legislatures to appoint “alternative” pro-Trump electors that could be certified instead of the Biden electors chosen by the voters.

“At minimum, with such a cloud of confusion, no votes from WI (and perhaps also MI and PA) should be counted, perhaps enough to throw the election to the House,” Mr. Chesebro wrote to Mr. Troupis, referring to the swing states of Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania.

Mr. Troupis quickly brought Mr. Chesebro into the Trump legal team, directed him to lay out the plans in a series of memos now central to the indictment of Mr. Trump and a month later — with the help of Reince Priebus, the former White House chief of staff — secured a meeting with Mr. Trump at the White House.

The email is the earliest known evidence of Mr. Chesebro’s involvement in what would become known as the false elector plot. It was released Monday along with a trove of more than 1,400 pages of text messages and emails belonging to Mr. Troupis and Mr. Chesebro as they settled a lawsuit against them filed in Wisconsin.

Taken together, the documents show in new detail how the Trump campaign’s litigation strategy was not designed to win in court as much as it was designed to give cover for their political efforts. And they underscore the central role that Mr. Troupis — previously a little-known figure in the effort to overturn the election — played in furthering the plans.

The messages also detail how Mr. Chesebro worked to get the false-electors documents into the hands of members of Congress, and how Mr. Chesebro — who has since pleaded guilty in Georgia to a felony conspiracy charge related to the scheme — celebrated the crowd that was gathering in Washington on Jan. 6, 2021, before a violent mob stormed the Capitol.

“Enjoy the history you have made possible today,” Mr. Troupis wrote in a text message to Mr. Chesebro at 11:04 a.m. that day.

The new details come from the settlement of a lawsuit filed by the progressive law firm Law Forward and Georgetown University Law Center’s Institute for Constitutional Advocacy and Protection against Mr. Chesebro, Mr. Troupis and the so-called fake electors in Wisconsin.

The suit was filed on behalf of legitimate Wisconsin presidential electors and voters.

The purported electors have already settled their portion of the suit, admitting that President Biden won the 2020 election.

Mr. Troupis and Mr. Chesebro agreed not to engage in similar work in the future, including not participating in a scheme to advance slates of false electors.

The settlement also included a payment to the plaintiffs of an undisclosed amount.

“As these documents show, the fraudulent electors plot originated in Wisconsin, with Trump campaign attorney James Troupis and legal adviser Ken Chesebro concocting the scheme that ultimately provided the false narrative used by the rioters to justify the attack on the Capitol,” said Mary McCord, the director of Georgetown’s Institute for Constitutional Advocacy and Protection.

Mr. Chesebro’s memos were central to the federal indictment of Mr. Trump on charges of seeking to overturn the 2020 election. They are featured as evidence of how the Trump campaign’s plans shifted from legal challenges to what prosecutors describe as a criminal plot to engineer “a fake controversy that would derail the proper certification of Biden as president-elect.”

The memos also became the basis for a strategy put forward by the conservative lawyer John Eastman and Mr. Trump that a federal judge referred to as a “coup in search of a legal theory.”

In a Nov. 19, 2020, email to Mr. Troupis, Mr. Chesebro wrote that the Trump lawyers should “pursue a shot at having two bites at the apple — ligate, hoping to ultimately win by January 6, but also use delay in litigation to try to win in the state legislature on December 8.”

Several of the documents refer to a Dec. 15, 2020, meeting of Mr. Troupis and Mr. Chesebro with Mr. Trump in the Oval Office.

“Pretty clear national people realize this wouldn’t be happening if you and reince and others hadn’t pushed it!” Mr. Chesebro wrote to Mr. Troupis two days before the White House visit.

They were told to keep the meeting secret and not bring anything for Mr. Trump to sign, the messages show.

“Reince was very explicit in his admonition that nothing about our meeting with the President can be shared with anyone,” Mr. Troupis wrote to Mr. Chesebro after.

Mr. Chesebro gave his account of the meeting to state prosecutors in Michigan investigating the fake electors plot. He said Mr. Priebus had told the men not to get Mr. Trump’s hopes up about his chances for victory, but Mr. Chesebro acknowledged he had not listened to that advice.

“We had until Jan. 6 to win,” Mr. Chesebro recalled of what he told Mr. Trump in the meeting, according to audio obtained by CNN, adding: “That got me in real trouble afterwards.”

A lawyer for Mr. Troupis did not immediately respond to a request for comment. Mr. Chesebro did not respond to a request for comment.

Mr. Preibus declined to comment. A person familiar with his actions said that he had recommended Mr. Troupis as a lawyer in Wisconsin, his home state, to the Trump campaign, but was not involved in the day-to-day of the legal efforts.

The person said that he had merely arranged a “photo op” for the men at Mr. Troupis’s request and had not met Mr. Chesebro or known who he was until that day. The person offered a similar account of the meeting as Mr. Chesebro, who said Mr. Preibus did not want them encouraging the president to fight the election results.

Even so, after the meeting, both Mr. Troupis and Mr. Chesebro appeared to feel they had some special knowledge of Mr. Trump’s plans.

After Mr. Trump posted on Twitter that he would be holding a rally in Washington on Jan. 6 — “Be there, will be wild!” he urged his followers in a message that served as a crucial call to action for far-right groups — Mr. Chesebro wrote to Mr. Troupis: “Wow. Based on 3 days ago, I think we have unique understanding of this.”

Although the plans originated in Wisconsin, the messages show the men saw Georgia as key to furthering their goals.

“If Georgia is pending before the Supreme Court on January 6, a fairly boss move would be for Pence, when he gets to Georgia, to simply decline to open any of the Georgia envelopes,” Mr. Chesebro wrote on Dec. 26, 2020. He was referring to Vice President Mike Pence’s ceremonial role in the certification by Congress of the Electoral College results.

On the morning of Jan. 6, Mr. Chesebro said he had worked with Michael Roman, the director of the Trump campaign’s Election Day operations, and given documents for the false slates of electors a day earlier to an aide to Representative Mike Kelly, Republican of Pennsylvania. That aide took them to the Senate parliamentarian, he said.

“Excellent,” Mr. Troupis replied. “Tomorrow let’s talk about SCOTUS strategy going forward. Enjoy the history you have made possible today.”

Mr. Chesebro later sent a photo of himself with the crowd at 12:26 p.m. on Jan. 6.

Mr. Troupis responded with an emoji of hands clapping.

 

[Red Five 40,654]

18 minutes ago, bolverk said:

“Enjoy the history you have made possible today,” Mr. Troupis wrote in a text message to Mr. Chesebro at 11:04 a.m. that day.

Oops. "You will go down in history as the man responsible for 1/6! Mr. January Sixth is what I bet they'll call you in the history books!" 

[Captainant 27,447]

22 minutes ago, bolverk said:

New names and details of the coup plot. Wisconsin Republicans are diabolical bastards.

 

Newly Released Messages Detail Roots of the ‘Fake Electors’ Scheme
Emails and texts unearthed in a lawsuit show how key figures intended their plan to create a “cloud of confusion” to help keep Donald Trump in office after his 2020 election loss.

Just five days after Election Day in 2020, a conservative lawyer named Kenneth Chesebro emailed a former judge who was working for the Trump campaign in Wisconsin, James R. Troupis, pitching an idea for how to overturn the results.

Through litigation, Mr. Chesebro said, the Trump campaign could allege “various systemic abuses” and, with court proceedings pending, encourage legislatures to appoint “alternative” pro-Trump electors that could be certified instead of the Biden electors chosen by the voters.

“At minimum, with such a cloud of confusion, no votes from WI (and perhaps also MI and PA) should be counted, perhaps enough to throw the election to the House,” Mr. Chesebro wrote to Mr. Troupis, referring to the swing states of Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania.

Mr. Troupis quickly brought Mr. Chesebro into the Trump legal team, directed him to lay out the plans in a series of memos now central to the indictment of Mr. Trump and a month later — with the help of Reince Priebus, the former White House chief of staff — secured a meeting with Mr. Trump at the White House.

The email is the earliest known evidence of Mr. Chesebro’s involvement in what would become known as the false elector plot. It was released Monday along with a trove of more than 1,400 pages of text messages and emails belonging to Mr. Troupis and Mr. Chesebro as they settled a lawsuit against them filed in Wisconsin.

Taken together, the documents show in new detail how the Trump campaign’s litigation strategy was not designed to win in court as much as it was designed to give cover for their political efforts. And they underscore the central role that Mr. Troupis — previously a little-known figure in the effort to overturn the election — played in furthering the plans.

The messages also detail how Mr. Chesebro worked to get the false-electors documents into the hands of members of Congress, and how Mr. Chesebro — who has since pleaded guilty in Georgia to a felony conspiracy charge related to the scheme — celebrated the crowd that was gathering in Washington on Jan. 6, 2021, before a violent mob stormed the Capitol.

“Enjoy the history you have made possible today,” Mr. Troupis wrote in a text message to Mr. Chesebro at 11:04 a.m. that day.

The new details come from the settlement of a lawsuit filed by the progressive law firm Law Forward and Georgetown University Law Center’s Institute for Constitutional Advocacy and Protection against Mr. Chesebro, Mr. Troupis and the so-called fake electors in Wisconsin.

The suit was filed on behalf of legitimate Wisconsin presidential electors and voters.

The purported electors have already settled their portion of the suit, admitting that President Biden won the 2020 election.

Mr. Troupis and Mr. Chesebro agreed not to engage in similar work in the future, including not participating in a scheme to advance slates of false electors.

The settlement also included a payment to the plaintiffs of an undisclosed amount.

“As these documents show, the fraudulent electors plot originated in Wisconsin, with Trump campaign attorney James Troupis and legal adviser Ken Chesebro concocting the scheme that ultimately provided the false narrative used by the rioters to justify the attack on the Capitol,” said Mary McCord, the director of Georgetown’s Institute for Constitutional Advocacy and Protection.

Mr. Chesebro’s memos were central to the federal indictment of Mr. Trump on charges of seeking to overturn the 2020 election. They are featured as evidence of how the Trump campaign’s plans shifted from legal challenges to what prosecutors describe as a criminal plot to engineer “a fake controversy that would derail the proper certification of Biden as president-elect.”

The memos also became the basis for a strategy put forward by the conservative lawyer John Eastman and Mr. Trump that a federal judge referred to as a “coup in search of a legal theory.”

In a Nov. 19, 2020, email to Mr. Troupis, Mr. Chesebro wrote that the Trump lawyers should “pursue a shot at having two bites at the apple — ligate, hoping to ultimately win by January 6, but also use delay in litigation to try to win in the state legislature on December 8.”

Several of the documents refer to a Dec. 15, 2020, meeting of Mr. Troupis and Mr. Chesebro with Mr. Trump in the Oval Office.

“Pretty clear national people realize this wouldn’t be happening if you and reince and others hadn’t pushed it!” Mr. Chesebro wrote to Mr. Troupis two days before the White House visit.

They were told to keep the meeting secret and not bring anything for Mr. Trump to sign, the messages show.

“Reince was very explicit in his admonition that nothing about our meeting with the President can be shared with anyone,” Mr. Troupis wrote to Mr. Chesebro after.

Mr. Chesebro gave his account of the meeting to state prosecutors in Michigan investigating the fake electors plot. He said Mr. Priebus had told the men not to get Mr. Trump’s hopes up about his chances for victory, but Mr. Chesebro acknowledged he had not listened to that advice.

“We had until Jan. 6 to win,” Mr. Chesebro recalled of what he told Mr. Trump in the meeting, according to audio obtained by CNN, adding: “That got me in real trouble afterwards.”

A lawyer for Mr. Troupis did not immediately respond to a request for comment. Mr. Chesebro did not respond to a request for comment.

Mr. Preibus declined to comment. A person familiar with his actions said that he had recommended Mr. Troupis as a lawyer in Wisconsin, his home state, to the Trump campaign, but was not involved in the day-to-day of the legal efforts.

The person said that he had merely arranged a “photo op” for the men at Mr. Troupis’s request and had not met Mr. Chesebro or known who he was until that day. The person offered a similar account of the meeting as Mr. Chesebro, who said Mr. Preibus did not want them encouraging the president to fight the election results.

Even so, after the meeting, both Mr. Troupis and Mr. Chesebro appeared to feel they had some special knowledge of Mr. Trump’s plans.

After Mr. Trump posted on Twitter that he would be holding a rally in Washington on Jan. 6 — “Be there, will be wild!” he urged his followers in a message that served as a crucial call to action for far-right groups — Mr. Chesebro wrote to Mr. Troupis: “Wow. Based on 3 days ago, I think we have unique understanding of this.”

Although the plans originated in Wisconsin, the messages show the men saw Georgia as key to furthering their goals.

“If Georgia is pending before the Supreme Court on January 6, a fairly boss move would be for Pence, when he gets to Georgia, to simply decline to open any of the Georgia envelopes,” Mr. Chesebro wrote on Dec. 26, 2020. He was referring to Vice President Mike Pence’s ceremonial role in the certification by Congress of the Electoral College results.

On the morning of Jan. 6, Mr. Chesebro said he had worked with Michael Roman, the director of the Trump campaign’s Election Day operations, and given documents for the false slates of electors a day earlier to an aide to Representative Mike Kelly, Republican of Pennsylvania. That aide took them to the Senate parliamentarian, he said.

“Excellent,” Mr. Troupis replied. “Tomorrow let’s talk about SCOTUS strategy going forward. Enjoy the history you have made possible today.”

Mr. Chesebro later sent a photo of himself with the crowd at 12:26 p.m. on Jan. 6.

Mr. Troupis responded with an emoji of hands clapping.

 

its outragous that we've waited THREE FUCKING YEARS to start shaking the tree on this. What the absolute fuck. I mean we all could plainly see it with our fucking eyes as it was happening, but to have receipts just brings that rage back

[Red Five 40,654]

8 minutes ago, Captainant said:

its outragous that we've waited THREE FUCKING YEARS to start shaking the tree on this. What the absolute fuck. I mean we all could plainly see it with our fucking eyes as it was happening, but to have receipts just brings that rage back

It just makes me so angry at Antifa.