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[freyguy 4284]

Wonderful waste of effort.  Either a big pussy move, or never had much against him in the first place.  What a world...

[Frank Drebin 5652]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

Name a criminal law you think he's broken on connection with the prosecution.  Go head.  Just one.

Don't know.  But RICO is as broad as hell when the feds decide they want it to be and use their full powers to investigate.  So is wire fraud.  So is mail fraud.  I have seen some estimates that the average person commits three felonies a day.

Edited 2 hours ago by Frank Drebin

[Satchel 6941]

This whole sad saga has me thinking about why preservers of the status quo are unalterably opposed to what might be learned from an examination of CRT. The scholarly framework holds that racism goes far beyond just individually held prejudices, and that it is in fact a systemic race and class phenomenon woven into the laws and institutions of this nation. Those who craft the laws and define the parameters in which institutions exist and operate, do so to ensure that results redound to their benefit. 
No poor or minority person in this country could ever get away with what Trump is on the verge of getting away with, and that’s because laws and institutions generally don’t exist to help them.

Edited 2 hours ago by Satchel

[Brisketexan 105213]

23 minutes ago, freyguy said:

Wonderful waste of effort.  Either a big pussy move, or never had much against him in the first place.  What a world...

He had to drop it.  DOJ policy is no prosecutions against sitting presidents, and in two months, Trump will be a sitting president.

[Chad Fuck 17726]

Just think of all the state secrets that fucking guy is going to unclassify and walk out with on his way out the door this time.  If he ever walks out the door.  He'll probalby just declassify them, and start selling them to the highest bidder from theWhite House lawn, like foreclosure day down at the county courthouse.  Becuase SCOTUS says immunity.  

What a piece of shit.  

And the drebins of the world are right there in the sewer with him, because team over country!

Gallows are too merciful for such people.  

OH well, hope we beat aggy.  

[Foosters 17869]

23 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

Don't know.  But RICO is as broad as hell when the feds decide they want it to be and use their full powers to investigate.  So is wire fraud.  So is mail fraud.  I have seen some estimates that the average person commits three felonies a day.

yeah, we all know that the republicans had to adopt the "Everyone is always committing multiple felonies every day!" position once their God-King was indicted. 

go sell that shit somewhere else, Johnny.

[Frank Drebin 5652]

Democrats would have been way better off had they just stuck with a more reasonable message regarding the 2020 election drama and other Trump stuff. If they’d have kept it to simply re-iterating that Trump is claiming fraud with no tangible proof…and showing how that fits his unpredictable and narcissistic personality, it would resonated with more people. Instead, like democrats these days do, they went off the deep-end with the hysterics about “democracy is at stake!” , “Trump will be a dictator!”, “He wants to overthrow the government!” , “Reeeeeee!!!”

Normal, reasonable people just roll their eyes at that stuff.  But this board is full of reeeeeeeeeee!!

[miguelito 11272]

So everyone commits felonies, but Smith had nothing on Trump.

[Foosters 17869]

26 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

 “He wants to overthrow the government!” , “Reeeeeee!!!”

Normal, reasonable people just roll their eyes at that stuff.  But this board is full of reeeeeeeeeee!!

Interesting. Not sure how anyone can view the actions of Trump and his admin between 11/6/20 - 1/6/21 and NOT come to the conclusion that he was trying to illegally install himself as the president, but you've had 4 years to rationalize that one, so whatever you gotta do, I guess.

[Frank Drebin 5652]

 

If it really was such a slam dunk case, why didn’t they file it years ago?

It’s almost like they wanted this trial to occur as close to the election as possible. Maybe, just maybe it was all about optics pre-election and never about an actual conviction.

[Biff Tannen 45702]

5 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

 

If it really was such a slam dunk case, why didn’t they file it years ago?

It’s almost like they wanted this trial to occur as close to the election as possible. Maybe, just maybe it was all about optics pre-election and never about an actual conviction.

Or maybe you’re a boot licking simp. 

[Chad Fuck 17726]

1 minute ago, Biff Tannen said:

Or maybe you’re a boot licking simp. 

[Nice Guy Eddie 13519]

Curious as to whether Jack Smith or Garland could decide to release all of the records to the public or at least the House and Senate so that their evidence is available for historic purposes. Or they can leave them behind for Pam Bondi to shred.

With the charges dropped does the presiding judge still have control of the case? If Smith/Garland released the evidence, would they be breaking any laws? I'm assuming they would redact any classified info.

[wildcat09 29366]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

He had to drop it.  DOJ policy is no prosecutions against sitting presidents, and in two months, Trump will be a sitting president.

He doesn't have to drop it. Trump isn't president today. He should've kept prosecuting and made Trump fire him and order the prosecutions to be shut down once he took office. 

[4th&Five 41579]

 

[Brisketexan 105213]

Just now, wildcat09 said:

He should've kept prosecuting and made Trump fire him and order the prosecutions to be shut down once he took office. 

No.  He has followed DOJ policy.  He is obligated to keep doing so.  The policy is that sitting presidents are not prosecuted.  And as an officer of the court, he has an obligation to the court and its docket to treat cases in an orderly fashion.

[Foosters 17869]

28 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

 

If it really was such a slam dunk case, why didn’t they file it years ago?

It’s almost like they wanted this trial to occur as close to the election as possible. Maybe, just maybe it was all about optics pre-election and never about an actual conviction.

Imagine Obama and Holder pulling the below in 2012 had Romney eked out a win. You'd have been calling for the public hanging of all involved. You know it. I know it. Everyone here knows it.

Quote

Dr. Eastman claims that the 2020 presidential election was “one of the most controversial in American history.” Despite the lack of evidence of election tampering, “a significant portion of the population came to believe the election was tainted by fraud, disregard of state election law, misconduct by election officials and other factors.” In the months after the election, President Trump and Dr. Eastman helped foster those public beliefs and encouraged state legislators to question the election results.

Dr. Eastman testified before and met with “state legislators[] to advise them of their constitutional authority . . . to direct the ‘manner’ of choosing presidential electors.” Relying on public interviews with attendees, the Select Committee states that on January 2, 2021, President Trump and Dr. Eastman hosted a briefing urging several hundred state legislators from states won by President Biden to “decertify” electors. President Trump also made personal appeals to state officials. On January 2, he called Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger to discuss allegations of election fraud. During the call, President Trump repeatedly claimed it was impossible for him to have lost the popular vote in Georgia, and repeatedly mentioned his “current margin [of] only 11,779” votes. He explained to Secretary Raffensperger that he did not care about specific fraud numbers as long as he won, “because what’s the difference between winning the election by two votes and winning it by half a million votes[?]”  When Secretary Raffensperger pushed back against these requests, the President warned of public anger and threatened criminal consequences. The President interspersed the conversation with specific fraud claims—dead people voting, absentee ballot forgeries, trucks ferrying illegal ballots, and machines stuffed with “unvoted” ballots. Mr. Raffensperger debunked the allegations “point by point” and explained that “the data you have is wrong;” however, President Trump still told him, “I just want to find 11,780 votes.”

The next day, President Trump attempted to elevate Jeffrey Clark to Acting Attorney General, based on Mr. Clark’s statements that he would write a letter to contested states saying that the election may have been stolen and urging them to decertify electors. The White House Counsel described Mr. Clark’s proposed letter as a “murder-suicide pact” that would “damage everyone who touches it” and commented “we should have nothing to do with that letter.” President Trump eventually did not promote Mr. Clark after multiple high-ranking members of the Department of Justice threatened mass resignations that would leave the Department a “graveyard.”

In the months following the election, numerous credible sources–from the President’s inner circle to agency leadership to statisticians–informed President Trump and Dr. Eastman that there was no evidence of election fraud. One week after the election, the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency declared “[t]he November 3rd election [] the most secure in American history” and found “no evidence that any voting system deleted or lost votes, changed votes, or was in any way compromised.” An internal Trump Campaign memo concluded in November that fraud claims related to Dominion voting machines were baseless. In early December, Attorney General Barr publicly stated there was no evidence of fraud, and on December 27, Deputy Attorney General Donoghue privately told President Trump that after “dozens of investigations, hundreds of interviews,” the Department of Justice had concluded that “the major allegations [of election fraud] are not supported by the evidence developed.”

Still, President Trump repeatedly urged that “the Department [of Justice] should publicly say that the election is corrupt or suspect or not reliable.” By early January, more than sixty court cases alleging fraud had been dismissed for lack of evidence or lack of standing.

2. Plan to disrupt electoral count

In response to alleged fraud, Dr. Eastman researched and planned a strategy for President Trump to win the election. Just after Christmas, Dr. Eastman wrote a now-public two page memo proposing that Vice President Pence refuse to count certified electoral votes from states contested by the Trump campaign: Arizona, Georgia, Michigan, Nevada, New Mexico, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin. The memo outlines the two ways in which Dr. Eastman’s plan ensures “President Trump is re-elected.” If Vice President Pence refused to count electoral votes from all seven contested states, President Trump would win 232 votes to 222. Alternatively, if Congress claimed that a candidate could not win without reaching 270 votes, Vice President Pence could send the election to the Republican-majority House of Representatives, which would then elect President Trump. The memo emphasizes that “[t]he main thing here is that Pence should do this without asking for permission – either from a vote of the joint session or from the Court.” On January 3, 2021, Dr. Eastman drafted a six-page memo expanding on his plan and analysis, which he later disclosed to the media. This memo “war gam[ed]” four potential scenarios for January 6, only some of which would lead to President Trump winning reelection. Claiming that “[t]he stakes could not be higher,” Dr. Eastman concludes his memo stating that his plan is “BOLD, Certainly. But this Election was Stolen by a strategic Democrat plan to systematically flout existing election laws for partisan advantage; we’re no longer playing by Queensbury Rules.”

On January 4, President Trump and Dr. Eastman invited Vice President Pence, the Vice President’s counsel Greg Jacob, and the Vice President’s Chief of Staff Marc Short to the Oval Office to discuss Dr. Eastman’s memo. Dr. Eastman presented only two courses of action for the Vice President on January 6: to reject electors or delay the count. During that meeting, Vice President Pence consistently held that he did not possess the authority to carry out Dr. Eastman’s proposal. The Vice President’s counsel and chief of staff were then directed to meet separately with Dr. Eastman the next day to review materials in support of his plan. Dr. Eastman opened the meeting on January 5 bluntly: “I’m here asking you to reject the electors.” Vice President’s counsel Greg Jacob and Dr. Eastman spent the majority of the meeting in a Socratic debate on the merits of the memo’s legal arguments. Over the course of their discussion, Dr. Eastman’s focus pivoted from requesting Vice President Pence reject the electors to asking him to delay the count, which he presented as more “palatable.” Ultimately, Dr. Eastman conceded that his argument was contrary to consistent historical practice, would likely be unanimously rejected by the Supreme Court, and violated the Electoral Count Act on four separate grounds. Despite receiving pushback, President Trump and Dr. Eastman continued to urge Vice President Pence to carry out the plan.

At 1:00 am on January 6, President Trump tweeted, “If Vice President @Mike_Pence comes through for us, we will win the Presidency . . . Mike can send it back!” At 8:17 a.m., the President tweeted again, “States want to correct their votes . . . All Mike Pence has to do is send them back to the States, AND WE WIN. Do it Mike, this is a time for extreme courage!” Following his tweets, President Trump placed two calls to Vice President Pence directly. After not being able to connect with the Vice President around 9:00 am, they spoke at approximately 11:20 am. Vice President Pence’s National Security Advisor, General Keith Kellogg, Jr., was present and described President Trump as berating the Vice President for “not [being] tough enough to make the call” to delay or reject electoral votes.

 3. Attack on the Capitol

On January 6, 2021, tens of thousands of people gathered outside the White House to protest the lawful transition of power from President Trump to President Joseph Biden. Both Dr. Eastman and President Trump gave speeches to relay the plan not just to the thousands gathered at the Ellipse but also to those watching at home. President Trump’s personal attorney, Rudy Giuliani, introduced Dr. Eastman before he spoke as the “professor” who would “explain . . . what happened last night, how they cheated, and how it was exactly the same as what they did on November 3.” Dr. Eastman declared to the crowd: And all we are demanding of Vice President Pence is this afternoon at 1:00 he let the legislators of the state look into this so we get to the bottom of it, and the American people know whether we have control of the direction of our government, or not. We no longer live in a self-governing republic if we can’t get the answer to this question. This is bigger than President Trump. It is a very essence of our republican form of government, and it has to be done. And anybody that is not willing to stand up to do it, does not deserve to be in the office. It is that simple." 

President Trump then took the podium. He began with praise for Dr. Eastman and his plan to have Vice President Pence disrupt the count: Thank you very much, John. . . . John is one of the most brilliant lawyers in the country, and he looked at this and he said, “What an absolute disgrace that this can be happening to our Constitution.” . . . Because if Mike Pence does the right thing, we win the election. All he has to do, all this is, this is from the number one, or certainly one of the top, Constitutional lawyers in our country. He has the absolute right to do it. Before the Joint Session of Congress began, Vice President Pence publicly rejected President Trump and Dr. Eastman’s plan: “It is my considered judgment that my oath to support and defend the Constitution constrains me from claiming unilateral authority to determine which electoral votes should be counted and which should not.” At 1:00 pm, members of Congress began the Joint Session as required by the Twelfth Amendment and the Electoral Count Act. Soon after, President Trump finished his speech by urging his supporters to walk with him to the Capitol:

"Now, it is up to Congress to confront this egregious assault on our democracy. And after this, we’re going to walk down, and I’ll be there with you, we’re going to walk down, we’re going to walk down. . . . [W]e’re going to try and give our Republicans, the weak ones because the strong ones don’t need any of our help. We’re going to try and give them the kind of pride and boldness that they need to take back our country. So let’s walk down Pennsylvania Avenue."

After President Trump’s speech, several hundred protesters left the rally and stormed the Capitol building. As the D.C. Circuit described it: Shortly after the speech, a large crowd of President Trump’s supporters—including some armed with weapons and wearing full tactical gear—marched to the Capitol and violently broke into the building to try and prevent Congress’s certification of the election results. The mob quickly overwhelmed law enforcement and scaled walls, smashed through barricades, and shattered windows to gain access to the interior of the Capitol. Police officers were attacked with chemical agents, beaten with flag poles and frozen water bottles, and crushed between doors and throngs of rioters.

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.cacd.841840/gov.uscourts.cacd.841840.260.0.pdf

You either think the election was stolen and are too stupid to continue engaging with, or you approve of the above "lawfare" because it helps your side, and can be dismissed as a partisan troll. 

Edited 47 minutes ago by Foosters

[wildcat09 29366]

It sure seems like a poster posting some 8chan school-shooter "REEEEEEEEEEE" shit should be grounds for a ban.  

[GenXer 2913]

14 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Curious as to whether Jack Smith or Garland could decide to release all of the records to the public or at least the House and Senate so that their evidence is available for historic purposes. Or they can leave them behind for Pam Bondi to shred.

With the charges dropped does the presiding judge still have control of the case? If Smith/Garland released the evidence, would they be breaking any laws? I'm assuming they would redact any classified info.

Biden can declassify. He’s above the law for 2 months.

[Chad Fuck 17726]

14 minutes ago, Foosters said:

Imagine Obama and Holder pulling the below in 2012 had Romney eked out a win. You'd have been calling for the public hanging of all involved. You know it. I know it. Everyone here knows it.

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.cacd.841840/gov.uscourts.cacd.841840.260.0.pdf

You either think the election was stolen and are too stupid to continue engaging with, or you approve of the above "lawfare" because it helps your side, and can be dismissed as a partisan troll. 

Pretty sure the first couple boxes have been checked and we can jump right to this.

[Red Five 40880]

22 minutes ago, 4th&Five said:

 

Four years. Just not enough time.

[Party_Taco 3760]

No.  He has followed DOJ policy.  He is obligated to keep doing so.  The policy is that sitting presidents are not prosecuted.  And as an officer of the court, he has an obligation to the court and its docket to treat cases in an orderly fashion.

Today I learned that a president-elect is considered “sitting” based on a memo…