Pussies Vs. Wack Jobs - Getting Our Govt Under Control

[Dbeasy 14970]

As I strolled down Lamar Blvd and saw endless graffiti and homeless people sleeping on sidewalks, with Clay Travis and Buck Sexton spewing ridiculous propaganda in the background, I realized we had all better do something or anything pretty soon, or this country is going to be in even deeper shit.

I scanned through the entire cloak room and noticed that in a forum of some of the most politically engaged people in this state/country, no one was talking about any action politically. The whole forum is a giant bitchfest and little else. I'm to the point where I need to do something or anything. My problem is that I do not like either political party or most of the politicians of those parties.

I ran across this organization called represent.us. It seems to support some good ideas about reducing corruption in politics.  However, when you look at some of the things they support, of course the GOP is against them. So this org will get cast as a left-wing propaganda organization. There has to be some way to participate politically to help solve the root problem of politics, which is corruption.  What can we all do? I mean really do. I'm finally fed up.

Edited May 2, 2023 by Dbeasy

[atomheartbevo 89449]

So when can I vote for Terry Crews for President?

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

Try to remove special interest. At this point it seems the toothpaste isn’t going back in the tube.

Separate church and state.

End the war on drugs and prison industrial complex.

Elect politicians who promote community. The stance on the right is about inclusion/exclusion. If you are part of the in group, you are not bound by the laws. If you part of the outsiders, you are bound by the law.

Sounds like pinko talk, but that is a fundamental problem.

[Homercles 10205]

32 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

So when can I vote for Terry Crews for President?

His character in Idiocracy was awesome actually…realized he wasn’t an expert in the problem, brought in outside help, and actually followed his directive.  No Fauci-esque bullshit

[Guest]

36 minutes ago, Homercles said:

His character in Idiocracy was awesome actually…realized he wasn’t an expert in the problem, brought in outside help, and actually followed his directive.  No Fauci-esque bullshit

[Bullneck 18987]

4 hours ago, Dbeasy said:

As I strolled down Lamar Blvd and saw endless graffiti and homeless people sleeping on sidewalks, with Clay Travis and Buck Sexton spewing ridiculous propaganda in the background, I realized we had all better do something or anything pretty soon, or this country is going to be in even deeper shit.

I scanned through the entire cloak room and noticed that in a forum of some of the most politically engaged people in this state/country, no one was talking about any action politically. The whole forum is a giant bitchfest and little else. I'm to the point where I need to do something or anything. My problem is that I do not like either political party or most of the politicians of those parties.

I ran across this organization called represent.us. It seems to support some good ideas about reducing corruption in politics.  However, when you look at some of the things they support, of course the GOP is against them. So this org will get cast as a left-wing propaganda organization. There has to be some way to participate politically to help solve the root problem of politics, which is corruption.  What can we all do? I mean really do. I'm finally fed up.

Graffiti - local enforcement issue.  No paint for teens is a start.  Repaint immediately to remove motive

Homelessness - needs a large scale plan for addiction, mental health, and housing affordability

GOP - Vote for them and you're a stooge

Democrats - Come in all varieties, not a monolithic voting bloc.  

[Chuckie Finster 22600]

95% of the country’s current political climate problems would go away instantly if we 1) eliminated gerrymandering and 2) reversed the Citizens United decision.

I know that doesn’t really answer what YOU can do, but these are the areas causing our issues, if you feel like brainstorming.

[Dbeasy 14970]

The spirit of this thread is asking all of us what specifically are we going to do to help fix the serious problems this country faces. For example, I've considered joining represent.us and volunteering. I'm a bit concerned it seems to be a left-leaning organization and that will make it less effective. But when you have one political party utilizing propaganda, lies, and gaslighting more aggressively than the other, it can be difficult to find an organization with a pure purpose that doesn't have some sort of political party bias. Anyway, that is someething I'm considering doing.

What specifically are you going to do, or are already doing?

[Foosters 17734]

I read twitter comments then take out my anger on my immediate family

[Dbeasy 14970]

6 minutes ago, Foosters said:

I read twitter comments then take out my anger on my immediate family

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

I thought posting on surly was already considered political activism. Or dissent. Can’t remember.

[atomheartbevo 89449]

2 hours ago, Dbeasy said:

What specifically are you going to do, or are already doing?

I already told you, I'm voting for Terry Crews.

But in addition to that, I chip away at family members/friends/acquaintances on social media (mainly Facebook) who post stupid shit or defend stupid people, and how the people they defend don't actually give a shit about them, and/or their actions run counter to everything the family/friends/etc. claim to believe in.  Doesn't seem like much, but unless they block me, I'm not going to let them have an echo chamber where they can try and sway other family members/etc. over to batshit views.

Edited April 4, 2023 by atomheartbevo

[Macanudo 12928]

2 hours ago, Patricio Swayze said:

I thought posting on surly was already considered political activism. Or dissent. Can’t remember.

It's definitely mental masturbation.

[atomheartbevo 89449]

58 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

, I'm not going to let them have an echo chamber where they can try and sway other family members/etc. over to batshit views.

As an example of this, the in-law who was into Qanon - every time she tried to post or email stuff out about some bullshit Q stuff, I'd make sure that everybody was reminded that the Qanons believed that JFK/JFK Jr was still alive, that they believed that Oprah Winfrey and Tom Hanks were trafficking in children to drain their fluids to stay young looking, that Trump would personally arrest Hillary and would execute his enemies on the steps of the Capitol, etc.

Basically "the woman who believes this also believes all of this other really weird shit is happening with Trump" and put her on the defense - the Qanons are more than happy to push this shit when surrounded by like-minded people, but when she's trying to sell non-believers on the more minor aspects of Q bullshit, I would make her defend the other Q bullshit, which she did not want to do.

These mentally ill types were always around, we just didn't build political movements around them and have one of our two major parties embrace them.

And it's not just the Qanon batshittery, it's the MAGA stuff to - I am more than happy to make relatives admit that part of the NYC stuff is related to porn star payments.  Well, they won't directly admit it, but like I said, I jump in and remind everybody that it's about a porn star.

Does it change votes or make people stay home?  Probably not, but at least it stops them from pushing this bullshit onto other family members.

[YGIFS 19449]

True story---Terry Crews (President Camacho) visited Midland-Odessa a few years back to give my friend a JBS award for his work in philanthropy/E&P.  And Dr. Beeper/Rex Kramer was there.  And we all had a fine time.  

[Dbeasy 14970]

Disappointed to see that no one is actually willing to do some sort of formal political action, like getting involved with a campaign, non-profit, or other more formal activity. Bitching at relatives is interesting, but not very impactful as compared to something requiring greater commitment and focus. As for me, I'm still trying to find the right type of organization to get involved with, but it's tough because of the partisan agendas of most.

Let me ask the question differently. Let's say there was an organization whose mission and focus was to improve the quality and decision-making of our elected political representatives. It would do this by bringing better visibility to disinformation and corrupt politician behavior, and by helping political candidates (of either party) with high integrity get elected. Would you consider either contributing to this type of organization or volunteering?

[Biff Tannen 45499]

1 hour ago, Dbeasy said:

Let's say there was an organization whose mission and focus was to improve the quality and decision-making of our elected political representatives. It would do this by bringing better visibility to disinformation and corrupt politician behavior, and by helping political candidates (of either party) with high integrity get elected. Would you consider either contributing to this type of organization or volunteering?

I would, but I'm highly skeptical whether that would work at all.  People on the right WANT to be lied to.  I don't know if bringing visibility to disinformation would make a damn bit of difference.

[HamsterHookah 112]

27 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

Disappointed to see that no one is actually willing to do some sort of formal political action, like getting involved with a campaign, non-profit, or other more formal activity. Bitching at relatives is interesting, but not very impactful as compared to something requiring greater commitment and focus. As for me, I'm still trying to find the right type of organization to get involved with, but it's tough because of the partisan agendas of most.

Let me ask the question differently. Let's say there was an organization whose mission and focus was to improve the quality and decision-making of our elected political representatives. It would do this by bringing better visibility to disinformation and corrupt politician behavior, and by helping political candidates (of either party) with high integrity get elected. Would you consider either contributing to this type of organization or volunteering?

The thread title sucks and isn’t informative of what you are trying to discuss, so if anyone else is like me, they haven’t clicked on it until today because it’s a slow news day this AM on the ole cloak.

[HamsterHookah 112]

23 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

I would, but I'm highly skeptical whether that would work at all.  People on the right WANT to be lied to.  I don't know if bringing visibility to disinformation would make a damn bit of difference.

I don’t necessarily agree with this, but I think you are ultimately right that it won’t make a bit of difference. I read somewhere and I’ll try and find and post it later, about how via advanced technology, we are in a post-truth society where “truth” and what is “true” is multifaceted. It’s post-modernism on crack.

[Macanudo 12928]

53 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

Disappointed to see that no one is actually willing to do some sort of formal political action, like getting involved with a campaign, non-profit, or other more formal activity. Bitching at relatives is interesting, but not very impactful as compared to something requiring greater commitment and focus. As for me, I'm still trying to find the right type of organization to get involved with, but it's tough because of the partisan agendas of most.

Let me ask the question differently. Let's say there was an organization whose mission and focus was to improve the quality and decision-making of our elected political representatives. It would do this by bringing better visibility to disinformation and corrupt politician behavior, and by helping political candidates (of either party) with high integrity get elected. Would you consider either contributing to this type of organization or volunteering?

Here's the problem....  None of us non-1%ers matter.   We've never really controlled elections and since Citizen's United, we have even less.   If you're not a high dolloar donor, you don't matter.   

[DDD Dad 14252]

On 4/4/2023 at 6:08 PM, YGIFS said:

True story---Terry Crews (President Camacho) visited Midland-Odessa a few years back to give my friend a JBS award for his work in philanthropy/E&P.  And Dr. Beeper/Rex Kramer was there.  And we all had a fine time.  

Was Porterhouse there too?

[atomheartbevo 89449]

1 hour ago, HamsterHookah said:

The thread title sucks and isn’t informative of what you are trying to discuss

A lot of us came in here hoping to be able to vote for Terry Crews for President.

[Dbeasy 14970]

35 minutes ago, Macanudo said:

Here's the problem....  None of us non-1%ers matter.   We've never really controlled elections and since Citizen's United, we have even less.   If you're not a high dolloar donor, you don't matter.   

It's a great question. Since the beginning of this nation the elite and wealthy have pretty much lined their own pockets, using government control to enrich themselves. However if I recall, one of the reasons Obama got elected was because he was able to pull-in massive small donations from the general public. If you could get enough people in this country to be better informed, maybe just maybe you could start impacting elections, and in turn government policy. It only takes a few high integrity politicians to gum up unethical decisions. We saw one or two senators stop bills from moving forward in the last few years. Of course, in most or all of those cases it was for personal enrichment and not public good. I want to get senators and congress men and women that are truly empowered and protected by the broader well informed public, not the wealthy elite. May not be doable, but it would be interesting to try. The internet and AI maybe makes it possible.

[TexArcher 37520]

47 minutes ago, Macanudo said:

Here's the problem....  None of us non-1%ers matter.   We've never really controlled elections and since Citizen's United, we have even less.   If you're not a high dolloar donor, you don't matter.   

Yep.  Our opinions on what the federal government should do matter about as much as our opinions on what the Longhorn football program should do.  We  might even be right a lot of the time, but no one who matters gives a shit.

I guess the difference is that the football program is showing signs of improvement while the rest of the country is circling the drain.  I just hope we can grind out one more national championship before this place goes full fascist and I have to move.

[Macanudo 12928]

43 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

If you could get enough people in this country to be better informed, maybe just maybe you could start impacting elections, and in turn government policy. 

Americans don't want to be informed.    There a reason why the "Real Housewives of..."  and the Kardashians exist.   The people want bread and circuses.    They always have.

[Dbeasy 14970]

A minor update to this topic full of very few good ideas - some very wealthy folks are seriously considering massive PAC's to start shaping political races for candidates who aren't wack jobs from the right, or pussies from the left. In other words, helping normal people who truly want to help this country and aren't worthless.  Novel concept. 

[royiv 9164]

On 4/18/2023 at 7:19 AM, Dbeasy said:

Disappointed to see that no one is actually willing to do some sort of formal political action, like getting involved with a campaign, non-profit, or other more formal activity. Bitching at relatives is interesting, but not very impactful as compared to something requiring greater commitment and focus. As for me, I'm still trying to find the right type of organization to get involved with, but it's tough because of the partisan agendas of most.

Let me ask the question differently. Let's say there was an organization whose mission and focus was to improve the quality and decision-making of our elected political representatives. It would do this by bringing better visibility to disinformation and corrupt politician behavior, and by helping political candidates (of either party) with high integrity get elected. Would you consider either contributing to this type of organization or volunteering?

What does a non-partisan agenda look like to you? We live in a two-party system where one party has completely embraced culture wars, attacks on women's rights, supporting Russia, etc. What are we supposed to support from the current platform of the republican party? 

As to what I do, I donate money and time. I have block walked, worked at polls, phone banked, text banked, etc. I talk to people to emphasize how critical it is that they vote. I actively engage with folks to make sure they're registered to vote. 

[SydneyCarton 47884]

On 4/3/2023 at 4:14 PM, Dbeasy said:

As I strolled down Lamar Blvd and saw endless graffiti and homeless people sleeping on sidewalks, with Clay Travis and Buck Sexton spewing ridiculous propaganda in the background, I realized we had all better do something or anything pretty soon, or this country is going to be in even deeper shit.

I scanned through the entire cloak room and noticed that in a forum of some of the most politically engaged people in this state/country, no one was talking about any action politically. The whole forum is a giant bitchfest and little else. I'm to the point where I need to do something or anything. My problem is that I do not like either political party or most of the politicians of those parties.

I ran across this organization called represent.us. It seems to support some good ideas about reducing corruption in politics.  However, when you look at some of the things they support, of course the GOP is against them. So this org will get cast as a left-wing propaganda organization. There has to be some way to participate politically to help solve the root problem of politics, which is corruption.  What can we all do? I mean really do. I'm finally fed up.

 

On 4/4/2023 at 2:04 PM, Dbeasy said:

The spirit of this thread is asking all of us what specifically are we going to do to help fix the serious problems this country faces. For example, I've considered joining represent.us and volunteering. I'm a bit concerned it seems to be a left-leaning organization and that will make it less effective. But when you have one political party utilizing propaganda, lies, and gaslighting more aggressively than the other, it can be difficult to find an organization with a pure purpose that doesn't have some sort of political party bias. Anyway, that is someething I'm considering doing.

What specifically are you going to do, or are already doing?

 

On 4/18/2023 at 7:19 AM, Dbeasy said:

Disappointed to see that no one is actually willing to do some sort of formal political action, like getting involved with a campaign, non-profit, or other more formal activity. Bitching at relatives is interesting, but not very impactful as compared to something requiring greater commitment and focus. As for me, I'm still trying to find the right type of organization to get involved with, but it's tough because of the partisan agendas of most.

Let me ask the question differently. Let's say there was an organization whose mission and focus was to improve the quality and decision-making of our elected political representatives. It would do this by bringing better visibility to disinformation and corrupt politician behavior, and by helping political candidates (of either party) with high integrity get elected. Would you consider either contributing to this type of organization or volunteering?

I see that since I started reading this thread, Royiv has already touched on some of my thoughts.

You keep saying you're worried an organization will be considered left-leaning, but what are you going to do? Start a new organization, and then when the GOP doesn't like your policies they say they're against you, and congratulations, you're seen as left leaning. You can't get around the fact that media and perception have shaped how you will be perceived before you even start. If you're doing ANYTHING against one bloc, you're a leftist. The only thing you can do is join organizations that are pursuing things that you believe in, and work your best to get those things implemented. 

That being said, at this point, the whole "fear of being seen as left" looks to me like a vestige of how you viewed yourself previously in life versus the thoughts and ideas you have now, detesting politicians aside. Get over it, and pick a team, because we all know that the two party system is all we have for now, and you'll need some major legislative accomplishments that to me look impossible before you could even get to a mutli-party system. If you disagree, @immamac will happily pitch you on the merits of the Bull Moose Party...which has a lot to recommend it.

As for me, I donate my money, and I'm considering donating my time with my son being past 5 this upcoming election cycle as well. He needs to learn about service.

As for your friends who may be looking for good candidates, the fastest way to fix our political system and hopefully start making changes and common sense legislation that is widely supported by all Americans would be to implement Rank Choice voting anywhere possible. It all starts there, and it will funnel out the crazies and systemic pieces of shit that prey on all sides of our political spectrum. 

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20345]

In moments like this I ask myself: What would Willie do?  Because Willie is 90 years old and he's lived on both sides of the fence, having picked cotton under the hot Texas sun and having also smoked a doobie on the roof of the White House.  And then it dawns on me that Willie would smile, smoke a doobie, and pick up his guitar.  So that's what I do. 

You can never go wrong following Willie. 

[Dbeasy 14970]

I'm not a Democrat or a Republican, and never have belonged to either party. I would like to align with one, but there are too many stupid ideas coming out of each party right now. I look at the political world thru a pretty simple lens. Individual responsibility vs. the government ensuring a fair opportunity. If either of those two get too far out of balance, you have a system that ultimately doesn't work very well (reference UT Nobel Prize winning Economist).

I want people in office who are level-headed, smart, and can make decisions that are fair for Americans, rather than just blindly bowing to their party's radical agendas, and focusing solely on personal enrichment and getting re-elected, which is what we have today. There are obviously exceptions, but not enough to fix what's wrong.

You can look at most issues and see that both parties are doing a poor job of solving problems. Democrats and Republicans both blame each other. I have some personal views about who's worse right now, but there's no point in focusing on that because I don't like the agendas of either party. I want sensible legislation, and we aren't getting it.

These PACs would actually tap into both small and large donations, so it wouldn't just be an agenda for the rich elite. There are actually some rich folks out there who don't have an agenda to personally benefit politically. It will be interesting if they get any traction within the next year.

[Hornius Emeritus 12420]

Just now, Dbeasy said:

You can look at most issues and see that both parties are doing a poor job of solving problems.

What if the problems are actually not solvable? Or what if the government envisioned by the framers of the Constitution is not, in its current incarnation, capable of solving them?

[Foosters 17734]

4 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

I'm not a Democrat or a Republican, and never have belonged to either party. I would like to align with one, but there are too many stupid ideas coming out of each party right now. I look at the political world thru a pretty simple lens. Individual responsibility vs. the government ensuring a fair opportunity. If either of those two get too far out of balance, you have a system that ultimately doesn't work very well (reference UT Nobel Prize winning Economist).

I want people in office who are level-headed, smart, and can make decisions that are fair for Americans, rather than just blindly bowing to their party's radical agendas, and focusing solely on personal enrichment and getting re-elected, which is what we have today. There are obviously exceptions, but not enough to fix what's wrong.

You can look at most issues and see that both parties are doing a poor job of solving problems. Democrats and Republicans both blame each other. I have some personal views about who's worse right now, but there's no point in focusing on that because I don't like the agendas of either party. I want sensible legislation, and we aren't getting it.

These PACs would actually tap into both small and large donations, so it wouldn't just be an agenda for the rich elite. There are actually some rich folks out there who don't have an agenda to personally benefit politically. It will be interesting if they get any traction within the next year.

Probably going to be difficult to find much consensus given your equal disdain for all ideas currently coming from both political parties. How about this, is there anything coming from either party that you can get behind?

[wildcat09 29258]

I don't really think "both parties have crazy people so I can't align myself with either" is really a great way to look at things when one party is 10% crazy people and the other party is 90% crazy people. Your choices are clear.

[royiv 9164]

11 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

I'm not a Democrat or a Republican, and never have belonged to either party. I would like to align with one, but there are too many stupid ideas coming out of each party right now. I look at the political world thru a pretty simple lens. Individual responsibility vs. the government ensuring a fair opportunity. If either of those two get too far out of balance, you have a system that ultimately doesn't work very well (reference UT Nobel Prize winning Economist).

I want people in office who are level-headed, smart, and can make decisions that are fair for Americans, rather than just blindly bowing to their party's radical agendas, and focusing solely on personal enrichment and getting re-elected, which is what we have today. There are obviously exceptions, but not enough to fix what's wrong.

You can look at most issues and see that both parties are doing a poor job of solving problems. Democrats and Republicans both blame each other. I have some personal views about who's worse right now, but there's no point in focusing on that because I don't like the agendas of either party. I want sensible legislation, and we aren't getting it.

These PACs would actually tap into both small and large donations, so it wouldn't just be an agenda for the rich elite. There are actually some rich folks out there who don't have an agenda to personally benefit politically. It will be interesting if they get any traction within the next year.

Please articulate each party's radical agendas. To be honest, what you're describing sounds like a great opportunity to grift off of both sides-ism.

[NameAlreadyInUse 5106]

On 4/18/2023 at 7:24 AM, Biff Tannen said:

I would, but I'm highly skeptical whether that would work at all.  People on the right WANT to be lied to.  I don't know if bringing visibility to disinformation would make a damn bit of difference.

Yep.  I used to be included in FWD FWD FWD chains from my mom.  When I started pointing out the inaccuracies in those FWD FWD FWD chains, she didn't change her mind, she just stopped including me in them.  This sums up my experience with trying to change the minds of 99% of the people on the right.  They don't care about truth, they care about narrative.  If you can tell a good enough story, you can be completely fact free and will be considered a truth teller.  

1 hour ago, Dbeasy said:

A minor update to this topic full of very few good ideas - some very wealthy folks are seriously considering massive PAC's to start shaping political races for candidates who aren't wack jobs from the right, or pussies from the left. In other words, helping normal people who truly want to help this country and aren't worthless.  Novel concept. 

Is the PAC hiring security for these super smart people? Because we're seeing more and more people like you describe leave politics because they are tired of fielding the threats of violence against them and their families.  

[Dbeasy 14970]

There is little value to sharing my personal views here of specific policies I don’t like from each party, because I won’t change any minds. We’ve all learned that lesson.

I do believe one party on the whole is far more reasonable right now than the other, but no point in getting into it. The purpose of the PACs is to get people in government who are less influenced by the money donors with clear agendas, and not on any specific issue. I will/would contribute to that type of PAC. 

[Foosters 17734]

2 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

There is little value to sharing my personal views here of specific policies I don’t like from each party, because I won’t change any minds. We’ve all learned that lesson.

I do believe one party on the whole is far more reasonable right now than the other, but no point in getting into it. The purpose of the PACs is to get people in government who are less influenced by the money donors with clear agendas, and not on any specific issue. I will/would contribute to that type of PAC. 

I hear ya. And it seems like a worthwhile proposition. Going to be hard to encourage people to join your movement without SOME articulated ideology, however. 

[troph 24563]

2 minutes ago, Foosters said:

I hear ya. And it seems like a worthwhile proposition. Going to be hard to encourage people to join your movement without SOME articulated ideology, however. 

Quote

The Know Nothing party was a nativist political party and movement in the United States in the mid-1850s. The party was officially known as the "Native American Party" prior to 1855 and thereafter, it was simply known as the "American Party".^[a] Members of the movement were required to say "I know nothing" whenever they were asked about its specifics by outsiders, providing the group with its colloquial name.^[2]

it's BACK!!!

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Know_Nothing

Edited May 2, 2023 by troph

[SydneyCarton 47884]

6 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

There is little value to sharing my personal views here of specific policies I don’t like from each party, because I won’t change any minds. We’ve all learned that lesson.

I do believe one party on the whole is far more reasonable right now than the other, but no point in getting into it. The purpose of the PACs is to get people in government who are less influenced by the money donors with clear agendas, and not on any specific issue. I will/would contribute to that type of PAC. 

You've chastised folks on this thread, your thread, several times for a lack of involvement or engagement or willing to articulate the things they're willing to do to bring about change. Additionally, saying you don't see any value in sharing your personal views on policies here because you won't change any minds doesn't really stand up to scrutiny. It sounds more like you don't want to post your thoughts here because you're not interested in anyone trying to change YOUR mind. 

As Foosters said, it sounds great, but asking people to support something new when you won't even discuss what you find right and wrong about what currently exists seems a bit hypocritical. And if I'm being really cynical, and I will state I don't think this is what you're intentionally doing, but giving little hints like "one is more reasonable to me currently than the other" while continually playing the BothSides game sounds more like you're looking to peel off support from the "reasonable" folks here regardless. Like a reverse Kanye West "walking for president" nonsense. 

If you want people to engage, you're going to have to put yourself out there. 

[NameAlreadyInUse 5106]

11 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

There is little value to sharing my personal views here of specific policies I don’t like from each party, because I won’t change any minds. We’ve all learned that lesson.

I do believe one party on the whole is far more reasonable right now than the other, but no point in getting into it. The purpose of the PACs is to get people in government who are less influenced by the money donors with clear agendas, and not on any specific issue. I will/would contribute to that type of PAC. 

I'm not giving a single dollar to someone who can't get more descript in what they stand for than "Smart people with common sense."  What would this PAC stand for explicitly?

[Willfully Horn 7916]

20 minutes ago, royiv said:

Please articulate each party's radical agendas. To be honest, what you're describing sounds like a great opportunity to grift off of both sides-ism.

 

2 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

If you want people to engage, you're going to have to put yourself out there. 

I agree.

My politics are left of center. I view our parties as right of center and wingnut right.

So, I am curious which Dem legislation is broadly viewed as radical. I can think of one, the college debt relief program. What are some others?

[wildcat09 29258]

All of the various "centrist" PACs and third party groups end up being terrified to promote any specific policy beliefs and generally end up helping Republicans win elections by convincing moderates that the Dems are just as crazy as the GOP.

I'm not saying that one couldn't be a positive influence, but you're suggesting/trying something many have tried before and they've always gone very badly. 

[HamsterHookah 112]

34 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

I don't really think "both parties have crazy people so I can't align myself with either" is really a great way to look at things when one party is 10% crazy people and the other party is 90% crazy people. Your choices are clear.

It is clear: a rational, sane 3rd party.

But alas, we will never be anything but a two-party state, hoisted by our own petard.

edit to add: My man Yang is at least trying.

Edited May 2, 2023 by HamsterHookah

[MissingInAction 24824]

On 4/4/2023 at 2:28 PM, Patricio Swayze said:

I thought posting on surly was already considered political activism. Or dissent. Can’t remember.

Masturbation.

[wildcat09 29258]

I wouldn't call what Yang is doing "trying." "Grifting," maybe.

American history has shown that the only chance any new party has at being electorally viable on the national stage comes from supporting a big, specific policy or cause that a lot of people support but that is not being substantially represented by either of the two major parties. Not this Forward Party "we welcome everyone, we're just for 'sanity' but won't define what that means, and we don't want to alienate anybody by taking a stand against the worst, most harmful anti-abortion laws being enacted right now!" shit.

The Republican party didn't gain prominence by welcoming slaveholders. It didn't win because it carved out some mythical center position between two extremes. It won because the existing parties refused to provide the growing anti-slavery movement with any political representation. 

[troph 24563]

I’d love to deal with the following in Texas:

- foster care funding and reform 

- eliminate for profit prisons and make prisons humane 

- criminal justice reform 

- water infrastructure 

- public school finance reform 

- property tax reform 

- environmental initiatives focused on micro issues on specific sites, climate change related items, and preserving wild and open spaces. 

- accepting expanded Medicaid dollars 

- grid reliability and dampening the profit motive in energy supply (re-regulate)

- reasonable gun laws

I’m sure there are plenty that agree but first we gotta make sure the trannies are proper fucked on healthcare and run out of the state, we post the 10 commandments on all school walls, and we punish by death woman who want an abortion. I promise once those are done we can really govern. 

 

Edited May 2, 2023 by troph

[royiv 9164]

Dbeasy, my man, you're doing nothing to convince me that this isn't a grift attempt. I won't give a penny to or spend a minute of my time on a political organization that can't articulate the views that they promote and those that they condemn.

As others have pointed out, you started this thread asking what individuals are doing to bring about change. Some folks have responded saying what their doing in an attempt to start a discussion. Your response is to quash any discussion about positions and go with "trust me, there are smart people who want to put their money up, but we won't tell you what they stand for and what candidates they support."

[royiv 9164]

2 minutes ago, troph said:

I’d love to deal with the following in Texas:

- foster care funding and reform 

- eliminate for profit prisons and make prisons humane 

- criminal justice reform 

- water infrastructure 

- public school finance reform 

- property tax reform 

- environmental initiatives focused on micro issues on specific sites and climate change related items 

- accepting expanded Medicaid dollars 

- grid reliability and dampening the profit motive in energy supply (re-regulate)

- reasonable gun laws

I’m sure there are plenty that agree but first we gotta make sure the trannies are proper fucked on healthcare and run out of the state, we post the 10 commandments on all school walls, and we punish by death woman who want an abortion. I promise once those are done we can really govern. 

 

Agree with all of this and would add legalizing marijuana and ending the pointless prosecution and incarceration of people accused of nothing else than possession. Let's give our DAs, judges and juries more capacity for trials of real criminals.

[nbmishoid 941]

1 hour ago, Dbeasy said:

I'm not a Democrat or a Republican, and never have belonged to either party. I would like to align with one, but there are too many stupid ideas coming out of each party right now. I look at the political world thru a pretty simple lens. Individual responsibility vs. the government ensuring a fair opportunity. If either of those two get too far out of balance, you have a system that ultimately doesn't work very well (reference UT Nobel Prize winning Economist).

I want people in office who are level-headed, smart, and can make decisions that are fair for Americans, rather than just blindly bowing to their party's radical agendas, and focusing solely on personal enrichment and getting re-elected, which is what we have today. There are obviously exceptions, but not enough to fix what's wrong.

You can look at most issues and see that both parties are doing a poor job of solving problems. Democrats and Republicans both blame each other. I have some personal views about who's worse right now, but there's no point in focusing on that because I don't like the agendas of either party. I want sensible legislation, and we aren't getting it.

These PACs would actually tap into both small and large donations, so it wouldn't just be an agenda for the rich elite. There are actually some rich folks out there who don't have an agenda to personally benefit politically. It will be interesting if they get any traction within the next year.

My wants for office holders are simple:  nice folks, proceed.  Mean folks, fuck off.  It has worked my whole life for personal relationships, and it maps pretty neatly on the existing 2 party system.  I don’t care how smart, skilled, or talented the mean candidate is, I can not have those skills put in the service of meanness.  When we are rid of meanness we can return to worshiping looks, brains, and shit.

[Steamboat1874 4032]

Two words.....

 

TERM LIMITS 

 

No one serves more than 8 years ever in a branch of Government, including Supreme Court justices.