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What kind of lawyer do I need?

harpercollins
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harpercollins

harpercollins 394

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I’m an employer wanting to transition one of my best employees from part-time to full-time. He is profoundly disabled (I suspect cerebral palsy though he’s never actually said).

 

How can I do this without bankrupting him? He’s in a special class where he cannot make more than $24k annually nor can he ever have more than $2k in assets at any time. He has Medicaid, disability benefits, and home health.

 

He is maybe 35 and lives with his grandmom who is 90 and likely not long for this world.

 

I’m thinking some type of trust is in order? I feel kind of shocked that his grandparents don’t seem to have discussed this very much.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31686

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1 hour ago, harpercollins said:

 

I’m an employer wanting to transition one of my best employees from part-time to full-time. He is profoundly disabled (I suspect cerebral palsy though he’s never actually said).

 

How can I do this without bankrupting him? He’s in a special class where he cannot make more than $24k annually nor can he ever have more than $2k in assets at any time. He has Medicaid, disability benefits, and home health.

 

He is maybe 35 and lives with his grandmom who is 90 and likely not long for this world.

 

I’m thinking some type of trust is in order? I feel kind of shocked that his grandparents don’t seem to have discussed this very much.

Dumb question, but what's the point of full time?  Health benefits?

Those numbers you mention are the medicaid cutoffs in Texas, and most other places.

There are ways to give a person more money, but divert the amounts in excess of medicaid limits to something called a Miller trust.  And, to be honest, I don't know where a Miller trust goes, but I think it's to the state, not to the paid party or his/her heirs.

On the one hand, private health insurance may deliver better actual medical care, may.  On the other hand, it does nothing to help with home care, assisted living, or nursing.

Your employee may be better off, net-net, as is.

You probably want to talk to an eldercare attorney about this.  Although the employee apparently is not elderly, it is this kind of attorney that knows this thing best.

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Bevo

Bevo 13637

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19 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Dumb question, but what's the point of full time?  Health benefits?

Those numbers you mention are the medicaid cutoffs in Texas, and most other places.

There are ways to give a person more money, but divert the amounts in excess of medicaid limits to something called a Miller trust.  And, to be honest, I don't know where a Miller trust goes, but I think it's to the state, not to the paid party or his/her heirs.

On the one hand, private health insurance may deliver better actual medical care, may.  On the other hand, it does nothing to help with home care, assisted living, or nursing.

Your employee may be better off, net-net, as is.

You probably want to talk to an eldercare attorney about this.  Although the employee apparently is not elderly, it is this kind of attorney that knows this thing best.

I think for a lot of these things that you need to think outside the box - things like free corporate housing, free live-in nursing assistance, transportation assistance, food assistance...

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Dahobbs

Dahobbs 17812

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2 hours ago, harpercollins said:

 

I’m an employer wanting to transition one of my best employees from part-time to full-time. He is profoundly disabled (I suspect cerebral palsy though he’s never actually said).

 

How can I do this without bankrupting him? He’s in a special class where he cannot make more than $24k annually nor can he ever have more than $2k in assets at any time. He has Medicaid, disability benefits, and home health.

 

He is maybe 35 and lives with his grandmom who is 90 and likely not long for this world.

 

I’m thinking some type of trust is in order? I feel kind of shocked that his grandparents don’t seem to have discussed this very much.

You probably need an estates attorney that knows about special needs trusts and disability. Whether you can accomplish what you want to do, I cannot say. 

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troph

troph 24929

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you need a disability lawyer first then a lawyer that can do what the disability lawyer says is permissible within the bounds of what you are willing to do.  a trust sounds good but it may not fly under some asset test, i don't know.  disability lawyer and then likely a trust and estates lawyer if a trust is permissible. I'm a corporate lawyer so M&A, securities offerings, c-suite comp/stock compensation, partnerships/LLCs, negotiable bank loans, business contracts, governance issues, etc.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31686

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N.B. that there are disability lawyers that specialize in obtaining SSI Disability for their clients.  They may or may not be conversant in other things like medicaid qualification, etc.

I have a little bit of an impression that SSI Disability lawyers, like Chapter 13 bankruptcy lawyers, have to absolutely fill their pipeline with SSI cases in order to make money and may not have time to do much else.

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Dahobbs

Dahobbs 17812

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2 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

N.B. that there are disability lawyers that specialize in obtaining SSI Disability for their clients.  They may or may not be conversant in other things like medicaid qualification, etc.

I have a little bit of an impression that SSI Disability lawyers, like Chapter 13 bankruptcy lawyers, have to absolutely fill their pipeline with SSI cases in order to make money and may not have time to do much else.

Yeah, you'll really want an estate attorney that does SSI disability work. You're not necessarily wanting the person that handles the paperwork to get someone SSI. You want the person that knows how to structure assets to the extent legally permissible to still qualify for SSI. Generally, this is handled through a special needs trust. I would expect it to cost $2k-5k to get something setup assuming there is a way to do it. I only encounter this when dealing with PI settlements. Putting employment income in a special needs trust is trickier I believe.  

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31686

Posted
Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, harpercollins said:

Is there any consequence to me footing the bill for the attorney? Is that considered taxable income?

Technically, I suppose it is, but law firms don't usually issue 1099s, so that's probably not something to deal with.

Also, although, as I mentioned, things can be structured so that additional income doesn't jeopardize current benefits, it also means there's almost no way for the employee to benefit from the extra income.  I was right that the corpus of a Miller Trust goes to the State on death, and you can only spend it on medical expenses.

So, it kind of appears that the upshot is your guy will be working more for no benefit that he can really realize.  It's quite a Catch 22.

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troph

troph 24929

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Posted
4 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

N.B. that there are disability lawyers that specialize in obtaining SSI Disability for their clients.  They may or may not be conversant in other things like medicaid qualification, etc.

I have a little bit of an impression that SSI Disability lawyers, like Chapter 13 bankruptcy lawyers, have to absolutely fill their pipeline with SSI cases in order to make money and may not have time to do much else.

 

1 hour ago, Dahobbs said:

Yeah, you'll really want an estate attorney that does SSI disability work. You're not necessarily wanting the person that handles the paperwork to get someone SSI. You want the person that knows how to structure assets to the extent legally permissible to still qualify for SSI. Generally, this is handled through a special needs trust. I would expect it to cost $2k-5k to get something setup assuming there is a way to do it. I only encounter this when dealing with PI settlements. Putting employment income in a special needs trust is trickier I believe.  

these are good posts.

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Gil Bang

Gil Bang 26100

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5 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

N.B. that there are disability lawyers that specialize in obtaining SSI Disability for their clients.  They may or may not be conversant in other things like medicaid qualification, etc.

I have a little bit of an impression that SSI Disability lawyers, like Chapter 13 bankruptcy lawyers, have to absolutely fill their pipeline with SSI cases in order to make money and may not have time to do much else.

I believe that they are so busy advertising on billboards and daytime TV that they don't have any time left for the actual practice of law.

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DalTxHornFan

DalTxHornFan 3122

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17 minutes ago, Gil Bang said:

I believe that they are so busy advertising on billboards and daytime TV that they don't have any time left for the actual practice of law.

Paper mills.  Very seldom does the attorney actually interact with the client in these kinds of places.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31686

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29 minutes ago, Gil Bang said:

I believe that they are so busy advertising on billboards and daytime TV that they don't have any time left for the actual practice of law.

Well, in their defense, they get paid a fraction of the benefits, if awarded, by the government.  And so to make a go of it in that area, they have to have thousands of cases pending at any given time.  So they have to keep the pipleline full.

And the nature of SSI disability is of a paper shuffle, but like a CPA or tax pro, you gotta know how to fill stuff out properly and use the magic words.

It's certainly no worse than injury lawyers that advertise to fill up their coffers with cases to refer out to to place in a class in a class action.

I'm still a bit of a stick in the mud about lawyer advertising, but I recognize its value and probably necessity.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31686

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21 minutes ago, DalTxHornFan said:

Paper mills.  Very seldom does the attorney actually interact with the client in these kinds of places.

Is true, and unfortunate, but similar in that regard to consumer/Ch13 bankruptcy practice. The presumptive fee for a Chapter 13 in ND Tex is 3800 bucks, for a process that takes six months plus, even if the work isn't that intense.  You gotta load up your docket so you spend all day in court on certain BK docket days or you'll go broke.  And, if your client doesn't get a plan confirmed, you don't get that full 3800 bucks, either.

It's a shitshow.  Makes it available to people, but its a shitshow.

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Sawbonz

Sawbonz 27781

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I don’t think Medicaid pays for around the clock care outside of a nursing home. Seems like if you can get him up to 75k a year with health insurance included he would be way better off than with what he’s getting now. Unless you’re just talking about getting him up to 35k or so. 

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31686

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1 hour ago, Sawbonz said:

I don’t think Medicaid pays for around the clock care outside of a nursing home. Seems like if you can get him up to 75k a year with health insurance included he would be way better off than with what he’s getting now. Unless you’re just talking about getting him up to 35k or so. 

Fairly sure that's true for the elderly, but they do help to some degree with home health, and the rules might be different for the disabled.

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DalTxHornFan

DalTxHornFan 3122

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On 4/26/2023 at 9:00 AM, harpercollins said:

 

I’m an employer wanting to transition one of my best employees from part-time to full-time. He is profoundly disabled (I suspect cerebral palsy though he’s never actually said).

 

How can I do this without bankrupting him? He’s in a special class where he cannot make more than $24k annually nor can he ever have more than $2k in assets at any time. He has Medicaid, disability benefits, and home health.

 

He is maybe 35 and lives with his grandmom who is 90 and likely not long for this world.

 

I’m thinking some type of trust is in order? I feel kind of shocked that his grandparents don’t seem to have discussed this very much.

This might be a useful resource:  https://www.texasable.org/

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  • 2 weeks later...
Sandman

Sandman 3420

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On 4/26/2023 at 9:25 PM, DalTxHornFan said:

Truth be told, the billboard guys like TJH, The Texas Hammer, and whoever else is buying a billboard this month are just the same.  Paper mills.

Are you telling me that The Wolf Pack doesn't have my best interests at heart????

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