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How do you investigate a REALLY NEW idea without search engines stealing your idea?


Elvis

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16 minutes ago, Elvis said:

I'm skeptical that AI and search engines are going to steal my idea as soon as I start to search it.  I realize that I might sound like Nikola Tesla.

 

Thoughts?

  1. nobody gives a shit about your stupid idea
  2. there's this thing called a "library" that is full of information, and nobody records what you look for there
  3. nobody gives a shit about your stupid idea
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People have been searching patents using public search engines like Google Patents etc. for as long as there's been an internet without any massive "theft of ideas."

While it would be theoretically possible and theoretically a "great heist" to mine patent search engine data for ideas, there's just too much data flowing  and it would be difficult to impossible to sort it for anything meaningful/useful.

And there's the problem of "the patentee is his own lexicographer": your "gizmo" is someone else's "gimcrack" is someone else's "thingamajig."  That "feature" of patent databases has made text-based searching without other sorting criteria (inventor, owner, patent classification), a fool's errand for as long as there's been text searching.

Plus what Rimbo said.

Also, I'm here from the government and I'm here to help. https://www.uspto.gov/patents/search#heading-2

Edited by TwiceHorn
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You're safe, I asked ChatGPT:

As an AI language model, I do not have the ability to steal your ideas. I do not have independent agency or access to your personal information, so I cannot use or share any information that you provide to me. Additionally, my purpose is to assist you and provide information to you, not to engage in unethical behavior like stealing ideas. You can trust that any conversations you have with me are private and secure.

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4 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

People have been searching patents using public search engines like Google Patents etc. for as long as there's been an internet without any massive "theft of ideas."

While it would be theoretically possible and theoretically a "great heist" to mine patent search engine data for ideas, there's just too much data flowing  and it would be difficult to impossible to sort it for anything meaningful/useful.

And there's the problem of "the patentee is his own lexicographer": your "gizmo" is someone else's "gimcrack" is someone else's "thingamajig."  That "feature" of patent databases has made text-based searching without other sorting criteria (inventor, owner, patent classification), a fool's errand for as long as there's been text searching.

Plus what Rimbo said.

Also, I'm here from the government and I'm here to help. https://www.uspto.gov/patents/search#heading-2

 

LinkedIn is basically littered all over the place with dipshits who think they have a great idea and just need to pay a guy like me, who actually knows how to build things, $0 (BuT yOu'Ll GeT eQuItY) to get rich.

None of these ideas are nearly as great or unique as they think they are.

None of these idea men have any ability to execute on making the idea happen.

None of these mosquitoes have any experience making a successful, profitable business.

Even if you actually did have a great idea, the ability to network, execute, and position your idea into a good position in the market will determine if you'll succeed or not. Market positioning is what makes companies successful, and nothing else: You have to have something actually available to sell (shipping now), that people are aware of, want to buy, at a price point that makes sense for them. Ideas are worth NOTHING.

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So, back in the day, I paid for patent research and development services from those tv adds.  

 

The first step was to write down a good version of your idea, then mail it to yourself.  Don't open it.  The post mark date showed that you wrote it before anyone else knew about it. 

I applied for several patents, but I kept finding that Sprint and Verizon had already thought of it.  Womp. Womp.

 

I guess that put the fear of patent theft into my mind. 

After aerospace, I took the LSAT with the intention of studying and lawyering in intellectual property.  I scored high.  I even had a judge sponsor me for law school.  However, I was making good money.  So, I did not pursue it due to cost to value ratio.  

 

Any IP lawyers up in here?

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Not an IP lawyer, but I have heard that things have changed a lot in the patent space that both make patents less valuable than they used to be AND harder to get than they were in the early 2000s. Personally think both changes made the world a better place; patent trolls have been more or less euthanized. Also means that if your startup business fails, there's nobody there to catch you by buying off your patent portfolio; you need to have some actual business worth selling off of your business.

All of this post and my previous one are just filling out the details for my first response: Nobody cares about your idea. Really. Share it here, share it there, share it everywhere; nobody gives a shit.

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3 hours ago, Elvis said:

Any IP lawyers up in here?

\/

8 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

People have been searching patents using public search engines like Google Patents etc. for as long as there's been an internet without any massive "theft of ideas."

While it would be theoretically possible and theoretically a "great heist" to mine patent search engine data for ideas, there's just too much data flowing  and it would be difficult to impossible to sort it for anything meaningful/useful.

And there's the problem of "the patentee is his own lexicographer": your "gizmo" is someone else's "gimcrack" is someone else's "thingamajig."  That "feature" of patent databases has made text-based searching without other sorting criteria (inventor, owner, patent classification), a fool's errand for as long as there's been text searching.

Plus what Rimbo said.

Also, I'm here from the government and I'm here to help. https://www.uspto.gov/patents/search#heading-2

 

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10 hours ago, ClubWhatever said:

That’s the idea part.  If My Pillow hurts your head,  all the fucking marketing in the world isn’t going to make that guy rich. 

I didn't say, "marketing." I said "market positioning." And every bit of that is important: You can have the greatest pillow in the world, but I'm not going to buy it if I'm happy with the pillow I have, if it is expensive, if it is hard to obtain, if you cannot manufacture it quickly enough, if it costs you more to make than you can sell it for.

All of this, and more, defines where in the market your product is positioned. Including, but not limited to, how good of a product it is.

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8 minutes ago, Rimbo said:

I didn't say, "marketing." I said "market positioning." And every bit of that is important: You can have the greatest pillow in the world, but I'm not going to buy it if I'm happy with the pillow I have, if it is expensive, if it is hard to obtain, if you cannot manufacture it quickly enough, if it costs you more to make than you can sell it for.

All of this, and more, defines where in the market your product is positioned. Including, but not limited to, how good of a product it is.

90% of the business consulting I do for tech companies involves re-doing the market positioning and messaging for the company and its products.

It’s amazing to me how many companies vomit out a bingo card of jargon to describe their business. I’m an ex programmer and engineer and would say I can’t figure out what 70% of the saas companies do after studying their websites for thirty minutes. It’s ridiculous. 

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1 minute ago, Dbeasy said:

It’s amazing to me how many companies vomit out a bingo card of jargon to describe their business. I’m an ex programmer and engineer and would say I can’t figure out what 70% of the saas companies do after studying their websites for thirty minutes. It’s ridiculous. 

Good Lord, this. My position has vendors courting me all day, every day... with terms that have no bearing on what I do and the problems I need to solve.

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On 4/27/2023 at 11:59 AM, Rimbo said:

 

LinkedIn is basically littered all over the place with dipshits who think they have a great idea and just need to pay a guy like me, who actually knows how to build things, $0 (BuT yOu'Ll GeT eQuItY) to get rich.

None of these ideas are nearly as great or unique as they think they are.

None of these idea men have any ability to execute on making the idea happen.

None of these mosquitoes have any experience making a successful, profitable business.

Even if you actually did have a great idea, the ability to network, execute, and position your idea into a good position in the market will determine if you'll succeed or not. Market positioning is what makes companies successful, and nothing else: You have to have something actually available to sell (shipping now), that people are aware of, want to buy, at a price point that makes sense for them. Ideas are worth NOTHING.

I have been around ideas and patents for 30 years and I don't know anyone who knows the secret sauce for bringing an invention to profitable fruition.

I've seen some ideas that some of the smartest people in their fields thought were game changers that didn't amount to diddly squat, and I've seen some ideas that were laughed at, including by their inventors, that turned out to be pretty substantial commercial successes.

One thing I have observed is this:  if you are inventing something, do your damndest to build a prototype; paper ideas just don't sell, between companies and certainly not to end-users.  Your best case as a little guy is to bring something to market at whatever scale you can afford and if it takes off to any degree, it will attract competition and that means, ultimately, buyers.

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I've had a couple winner ideas but as has been said ideas are almost the easy part.  I actually had an idea years ago from memories of the grackle battles at UT decades ago, to deter roosting.  Seems that the folks in the market that were the most likely consumers were commercial buildings and car lot owners.  Folks most willing to pay (or already paying) to deal with bird shit.

Technology was not available in small enough and affordable to execute the idea.  But maybe I spend a couple hundred and see if I can prove my concept via some prototypes.  How much value is there is getting rid of roosting birds to an individual? I have no idea.  But car dealers already contract to have their cars cleaned.  

I can't imagine trying to sell anything, to anyone, that I didn't have a working prototype for.  That's sort of the first step of execution necessary to an ideas success isn't it?  Otherwise you are just another genius with a cleaner presentation than the original cocktail napkin.  You know the guys who invented the Power Pole for boats knew they had something as soon as their prototype began to work properly.  power pole inventor

https://www.bassmaster.com/news/power-pole-a-story-of-success/

 

Edited by horn4life
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