2020 Democratic Nominee

[F250 28,680]

1 hour ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

That’s fine.  Why doesn’t he work his influence magic within the party 100% of the time like AOC?  Why does he disown the (D) by his name when he’s not running for president?   Why can’t he be proud to be a democrat? 

She hasn't worked any magic. She just got elected. I expect she will be the DSA version of Justin Amash, an ideologue without any power to shift the party towards their ideology.

Bernie isn't disowning anything, he has always been an independent. Obviously he runs as a Dem Presidential candidate because it's the only way to sway the party. The primaries are supposed to be where the party collectively decides on its platform. The two major primaries are the only place "third party" types actually have influence.

Bernie, like Ron Paul played within the rules created by the Two Party system and pissed off a lot of partisans. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

 

 

[bad_teammate 13,132]

1 hour ago, Bama Chick said:

The democratic nominee in 2020 CANNOT win without women and people of color. Period.

And women and people of color won't vote for Bernie?

Sterling analysis.

2 hours ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

True, which is why they want him to pull out.  He almost won the primary.  The thought is it would be super pyrric because it would have followed with a general wipeout.  If we do that again in 2020, we get four more of Trump.

Whose thought? The people who thought Hillary, the most hated candidate in history, was going to win so they should just hand the nomination to her? The ones who thought "eh, who needs the Rust Belt?" They're worth taking seriously?

2 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Bernie wants the glory without the hard work others put in behind the scenes.

What "hard work" are you talking about? Be specific if you can.

1 hour ago, Ghost of LL said:

You don't bring Hillary up to bash her; you bring her up to set fire to a profoundly-deranged centrist strawman that you've created.

Read this thread. Look at Bama Chick's completely brain-dead criticism and Hugo's "he's not a party loyalist!" nonsense. The centrists have brain worms.

My #1 complaint with Bernie is that he's old. It's a huge problem and it really sucks.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,356]

Insurgent candidates are a red flag for me because not identifying with a party means they don’t play well with others.  Something is off.  

It’s not an insurmountable red flag but I prefer candidates that work within the system instead of trying to hijack it.

[F250 28,680]

5 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Insurgent candidates are a red flag for me because not identifying with a party means they don’t play well with others.  Something is off.  

It’s not an insurmountable red flag but I prefer candidates that work within the system instead of trying to hijack it.

That's retarded. These candidates are party outsiders specifically because they represent political ideas outside of a given party's platform. It has nothing to do with playing well with others.

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,356]

9 minutes ago, F250 said:

That's retarded. These candidates are party outsiders specifically because they represent political ideas outside of a given party's platform. It has nothing to do with playing well with others.

Nope.  Sorry, this gets disproven all the time.  Rand Paul, Trump, Lindsey Graham, and John McCain are all in the same party and considered Mavericks with no real aligning ideology. 

Trump was an insurgent candidate and it’s safe to say he subverted the entire party because he won.  Not cool.

Party outsiders are, almost by definition, radicals.

Radicals don’t play well with the mainstream.

Edited January 7, 2019 by Hugo Stiglitz

[Ghost of LL 15,477]

40 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Read this thread. Look at Bama Chick's completely brain-dead criticism and Hugo's "he's not a party loyalist!" nonsense. The centrists have brain worms.

My #1 complaint with Bernie is that he's old. It's a huge problem and it really sucks.

Absolutely none of which has to do with Hillary working for Barry Goldwater.  Maybe Bama Chick's grandmother voted for Barry Goldwater, but that's the extent to which your post has anything to do with the issues at hand.

And for the record, Bama Chick's criticisms are not "brain dead."  Bernie has a real problem with women.  You may not think he's a "sexist old fart," as Bama Chick would have it.  But that perception is out there.  And based on some of the recent revelations, I understand the basis for some of the criticism.

Bernie also has a problem with minorities.  Polling and the results of the 2016 primaries bear that out.  

Whatever you think of the candidate's positions, the candidate himself is problematic.  And the candidate's support comes off as a bunch of entitled white males who like to spout off about socialism, but have no real idea about what the working classes want or need.  "Bernie Bros" may be derogatory, but it gives a sense of the way in which they are perceived.  They come off as a latter-day Fabian Society.  And that's a problem for the candidate.

And one more thing--you decry Bama Chick's critique that Bernie is "sexist," "entitled and grumpy" as "brain-dead," but how is your #1 complaint that he's old any less brain-dead?

[F250 28,680]

15 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Nope.  Sorry, this gets disproven all the time.  Rand Paul, Trump, Lindsey Graham, and John McCain are all in the same party and considered Mavericks with no real aligning ideology.  

Trump was an insurgent candidate and it’s safe to say he subverted the entire party because he won.  Not cool.

Party outsiders are, almost by definition, radicals.

Radicals don’t play well with the mainstream.

You lost me at Rand Paul, Trump, Lindsey Graham, and John McCain. All of those are straight up party insiders.

Try again.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,356]

1 minute ago, F250 said:

You lost me at Rand Paul, Trump, Lindsey Graham, and John McCain. All of those are straight up party insiders.

Try again.

Trump? A party insider? Really? How did that happen? 

[F250 28,680]

Just now, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Trump? A party insider? Really? How did that happen? 

Well, he is the leader of the GOP and last I checked it's operating the same as it always has. Supply-Side economics, massive deficit spending, billions in farm subsidies, billions in defense spending, pro-zionist, continuation of culture war, continued Islamaphobia, continued drug war, anti-prison reform, etc...

Sure, he is an ugly representation of the party but it is still the same party which is why he continues to receive its support.

The GOP hasn't changed under Trump.

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,356]

7 minutes ago, F250 said:

Well, he is the leader of the GOP and last I checked it's operating the same as it always has. Supply-Side economics, massive deficit spending, billions in farm subsidies, billions in defense spending, pro-zionist, continuation of culture war, continued Islamaphobia, continued drug war, anti-prison reform, etc...

Sure, he is an ugly representation of the party but it is still the same party which is why he continues to receive its support.

The GOP hasn't changed under Trump.

 

Yeah they have.  You’re just seeing what you want to see.  The party of personal responsibility  and law and order has become an FBI hating and Russian loving cult of a Moron.

That is new.

Edited January 7, 2019 by Hugo Stiglitz

[F250 28,680]

4 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Yeah they have.  You’re just seeing what you want to see.  The party of personal responsibility  and law and order has become an FBI hating and Russian loving cult of a Moron.

That is new.

Regarding governance, they haven't changed a bit.

You're just seeing what you want to see. Like Jeff Flake being the Republican that will stand up to Trump. What you fail to see is the Republicans will continue to support Trump because it's business as usual.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,356]

So, does the GOP normally shut down the government over a mythical border wall, ban Muslims, put kids in cages, fall in love with North Korea, and help coverup a murder of a journalist?

Or are those the actions of a radical insurgent candidate?

[Bozo_Casanova 26,277]

Yeah, I misunderstood your statement.  I took it as the primaries made the candidates and campaigns better.  
 

oh, I see. I didn’t mean they make campaigns better. I mean they make campaigns stronger.

[bad_teammate 13,132]

28 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

It’s not an insurmountable red flag but I prefer candidates that work within the system instead of trying to hijack it.

Bernie Sanders played fully within the system. The Democratic Party is intended to be a Big Tent party that invites participation from swaths of local parties.

3 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

Absolutely none of which has to do with Hillary working for Barry Goldwater.

Hillary's conservatism is extremely relevant to a discussion of the Democratic Party's positions. A lot.

Quote

And for the record, Bama Chick's criticisms are not "brain dead."  Bernie has a real problem with women.  You may not think he's a "sexist old fart," as Bama Chick would have it.  But that perception is out there.  And based on some of the recent revelations, I understand the basis for some of the criticism.

Be specific. What are you talking about? Specifically. What does "problems with women" mean? Specifically.

You can find pictures of Joe Biden groping teenage girls onstage. "problems with women" my ass

Quote

Bernie also has a problem with minorities.  Polling and the results of the 2016 primaries bear that out.  

The fact that minorities voted for Hillary more than Bernie doesn't show that he has a problem with minorities. It shows that minorities liked Hillary more. Blacks are going to vote for Trump instead of a man who literally was arrested protesting in their favor? You're very smart.

It's interesting that you take Bernie's 2016 primary defeat as a sign that he was/is a weak candidate. Joe Biden got 1% of the Iowa caucus vote in 2008 and the centrists can't stop jerking themselves off about him because people made Epic Memes about him during Obama's presidency. Bernie, a man with basically zero name recognition and zero personal charisma, took one of the most popular and well-known Democratic figures to the late rounds. Yet he's weak, right? 

A woman, by the way, who had also lost a presidential primary herself to a guy with very little experience.

Quote

"Bernie Bros" may be derogatory, but it gives a sense of the way in which they are perceived. 

Perceived... by whom? Specifically. This is such vague bullshit.

Quote

And one more thing--you decry Bama Chick's critique that Bernie is "sexist," "entitled and grumpy" as "brain-dead," but how is your #1 complaint that he's old any less brain-dead?

It is a scientific fact that human brains begin to deteriorate in old age. It's science. Sorry, I guess.

[Bama Chick 28,596]

Blacks are going to vote for Trump instead of a man who literally was arrested protesting in their favor?

No, they won’t vote for Trump.

They won’t vote for anyone if the choice is Sanders or Trump.

Motivating the black vote is going to be a a huge part of defeating Trump.

It’s what tipped the scales for Doug Jones. Specifically black women.

Big brain lefty counting on crusty ass Bernie to get black women to get crunk for MC Bernie

[Ghost of LL 15,477]

3 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Hillary's conservatism is extremely relevant to a discussion of the Democratic Party's positions. A lot.

Hillary is a never-was when it comes to presidential politics.  What relevance does the position of the 2016 nominee during the 1968 presidential election have on the 2020 primaries?  

None--you set that up as a strawman.  That's all it is.

 

Quote

Be specific. What are you talking about? Specifically. What does "problems with women" mean? Specifically.

You can find pictures of Joe Biden groping teenage girls onstage. "problems with women" my ass

Biden has real, real serious problems with women.  Going back to the Anita Hill hearings.  It's one of my many misgivings about Biden.

And acknowledging one does not diminish the other.  That Biden has problems doesn't mean that Bernie doesn't.  And Bernie does--the revelations about harassment and unequal pay during his 2016 campaign (and his professed apathetic ignorance of both) are just the most recent and obvious incarnations of that problem.

Quote

The fact that minorities voted for Hillary more than Bernie doesn't show that he has a problem with minorities. It shows that minorities liked Hillary more. Blacks are going to vote for Trump instead of a man who literally was arrested protesting in their favor? You're very smart.

 

Minorities didn't just like Hillary more.  They didn't show up for Bernie at all.  

Yeah--if nominated, Bernie would win 90% of the Black vote.  But it's not just the percentage that vote for him that matters; it's also the percentage who show up.  And absolutely nothing indicates that Bernie would be able to motivate minority voters.

A grainy 50-year old photograph is not going to be some sort of motivator to any community.

 

 

And by the way--why does everything have to be so fucking personal with you?  Can you post anything without making a personal attack?  It's really very unattractive.

Quote

It's interesting that you take Bernie's 2016 primary defeat as a sign that he was/is a weak candidate. Joe Biden got 1% of the Iowa caucus vote in 2008 and the centrists can't stop jerking themselves off about him because people made Epic Memes about him during Obama's presidency. Bernie, a man with basically zero name recognition and zero personal charisma, took one of the most popular and well-known Democratic figures to the late rounds. Yet he's weak, right? 

A woman, by the way, who had also lost a presidential primary herself to a guy with very little experience.

He is a weak candidate.  That's reflected in the current polls.  He has 100% name recognition in Iowa.  He has spent years campaigning there.  He nearly won the caucus in 2016.  And today, he's polling a distant second.  

That's not a strong candidate.  

It's also not a candidate that demonstrates a high approval of his own candidacy.  His polling today reflects that much of his "support" was actually a vote against Hillary.  But without Hillary, and with a number of other competent candidates, Bernie's support shrinks to a very small number.

That is a weak candidate.

Quote

Perceived... by whom? Specifically. This is such vague bullshit.

Just google that shit.  A simple search will reveal that the perception has been discussed widely.  And while I understand you may think the perception is false, it is nonetheless a perception.

[F250 28,680]

15 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

So, does the GOP normally shut down the government over a mythical border wall, ban Muslims, put kids in cages, fall in love with North Korea, and help coverup a murder of a journalist?

Or are those the actions of a radical insurgent candidate?

Shutting down government is a standard Republican tactic. The GOP didn't suddenly become anti-immigrant and anti-Muslim in 2016 none of this came out of the blue. The rest is hyperbole.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,356]

Does anyone besides BT believe Bernie would make a great president?   I guess this is another hang up of mine. 

Bernie is a proven good candidate with imaginative ideas.  He draws the crowds and excites the base but is he really up to the task of leadership on the world stage? 

I like Bernie and I hope he remains influential among democrats but I’ll take Warren at the helm during a national emergency or calling the parents of fallen soldiers. 

[GSU&UT 1,798]

Bernie sure seems to really be doing poorly with non-whites holding *checks notes* a 64% favorability compared to *checks notes again* 49% favorability with whites.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/243539/americans-maintain-positive-view-bernie-sanders.aspx

 

Here is one of the most famous Atlanta rappers stumping for him for goodness sake,

https://www.ajc.com/blog/buzz/killer-mike-says-bernie-sanders-can-beat-trump-2020-talks-georgia-politics/vJq4lUUL2IX8E1jhN5rKzK/

 

Damn, he really just can't get that likability up.

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/12/18/bernie-sanders-straw-poll-2020-elections-1067867

 

 

It's fine to talk about what he's doing is more harmful than good to the Democratic party, but some of y'all really seem to not understand how much the DNC really wanted the rest of the country to hate him.

Edited January 8, 2019 by GSU&UT

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,356]

2 minutes ago, GSU&UT said:

Here is one of the most famous Atlanta rappers stumping for him for goodness sake,

https://www.ajc.com/blog/buzz/killer-mike-says-bernie-sanders-can-beat-trump-2020-talks-georgia-politics/vJq4lUUL2IX8E1jhN5rKzK/

Doesn’t Killer Mike also pimp for the NRA? 

[GSU&UT 1,798]

Just now, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Doesn’t Killer Mike also pimp for the NRA? 

He did at least and took a lot of shit for it since he's a passionate gun owner, he's also not some unknown person in Atlanta, he has done a tremendous amount of work with black businesses and banks in the city. 

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

19 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Does anyone besides BT believe Bernie would make a great president?   I guess this is another hang up of mine. 

Bernie is a proven good candidate with imaginative ideas.  He draws the crowds and excites the base but is he really up to the task of leadership on the world stage? 

I like Bernie and I hope he remains influential among democrats but I’ll take Warren at the helm during a national emergency or calling the parents of fallen soldiers. 

He's awful old to keep that pace for 4 years. I think he's an honorable guy, and would be a statesmanlike president.  I agree with few of his plans because the cost , unless subsidized by other budget cuts would be damned expensive.

 

Age is always thrown around, and he'd be the poster child embodiment of Methuselah in the 2020.

He's not going to appeal to a broad base of voters (his sweet spot is far left and youngish correct ?) and I think the Democrats want that. 

[RayDog 682]

Bernie is a victim of his own success. His policies are now mainstream and people who are more charismatic are carrying his message forward. He should stay in the Senate.

 

[JimmyJames 12,271]

If trump is the Republican nominee, then Sun Tzu says that Biden should be the dem nominee. Its a matter of the map and winning. What is the best chance of winning. You focus on other things and get lost in the haze to your ultimate detriment. God forbid we suffer another four years of this shit. 

I don’t agree with everything Biden has voted for or done, but that’s the reality. I would actualy prefer warren to Biden, but its too much of a risk.

If trump isn’t the nominee then all bets are off. 

[bad_teammate 13,132]

54 minutes ago, Bama Chick said:

They won’t vote for anyone if the choice is Sanders or Trump.

 

lol Jesus Christ

Simply because you can make a statement with confidence doesn't mean it makes any fucking sense. Bernie had/has a 70+% approval rating with black voters. Sanders beat Clinton among black millenials. Older black women, who are powerful and reliable voting bases, know Hillary and have liked her for years. Yes, she beat him among blacks and among women. Neither of those results is surprising nor is either result indicative of anything going forward.

Quote

Motivating the black vote is going to be a a huge part of defeating Trump.

It’s what tipped the scales for Doug Jones. Specifically black women.

OK, all right, this is getting sad.

Please tell me what Doug Jones did, said, or believed that motivated the black vote. Jesus

Quote

Big brain lefty counting on crusty ass Bernie to get black women to get crunk for MC Bernie

 

Black women to "get crunk"? Holy shit listen to yourself, Alabama.

38 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

Hillary is a never-was when it comes to presidential politics.

She won the popular vote. Are you serious? You people hate Bernie so much it has put holes in your brains. 

Quote

And acknowledging one does not diminish the other.  That Biden has problems doesn't mean that Bernie doesn't.  And Bernie does--the revelations about harassment and unequal pay during his 2016 campaign (and his professed apathetic ignorance of both) are just the most recent and obvious incarnations of that problem.

Biden has actual, obvious, and specific problems that have to do with his personal actions and statements. The Bernie shit is either unconnected to him personally or vague. There is zero credible belief that Bernie himself has ever been inappropriate with women or even believes negative things about women. The worst you people can come up with is that other people are mean to women and Bernie isn't responsive enough. And you're all bonered up to vote for a guy who gets constantly handsy with teen girls.

I'm not arguing that Bernie is perfect with women (whatever the fuck that would mean), I'm calling out all this absolutely pathetic concern trolling.

Quote

He is a weak candidate.  That's reflected in the current polls.  He has 100% name recognition in Iowa.  He has spent years campaigning there.  He nearly won the caucus in 2016.  And today, he's polling a distant second.  

That's not a strong candidate.  

It's also not a candidate that demonstrates a high approval of his own candidacy.  His polling today reflects that much of his "support" was actually a vote against Hillary.  But without Hillary, and with a number of other competent candidates, Bernie's support shrinks to a very small number.

That is a weak candidate.

Cite your shit.

Bernie leading in progressive straw poll.

Bernie a clear 2nd in Iowa poll.

He's not a clear front-runner or anything, but he's right in there and it's instructive that the centrists and temporarily-not-Republicans are already firing as much ammo as they can at him.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,356]

6 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

If trump is the Republican nominee, then Sun Tzu says that Biden should be the dem nominee. Its a matter of the map and winning. What is the best chance of winning. You focus on other things and get lost in the haze to your ultimate detriment. God forbid we suffer another four years of this shit. 

I don’t agree with everything Biden has voted for or done, but that’s the reality. I would actualy prefer warren to Biden, but its too much of a risk.

If trump isn’t the nominee then all bets are off. 

Playing not to lose is the strategy of bitches.  

[JimmyJames 12,271]

2 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Playing not to lose is the strategy of bitches.  

Wrong my friend. I’m only playing to win. If you think Warren has a better chance to beat trump than Biden then you’re being foolish IMO. 

Also. That’s just like your opinion man. 

Edited January 8, 2019 by JimmyJames

[bad_teammate 13,132]

41 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Doesn’t Killer Mike also pimp for the NRA? 

Go fuck yourself.

 

[bad_teammate 13,132]

People who promote Biden because they think he has a better chance of winning (1) shouldn't be so confident in their ability to prognosticate and (2) apparently don't have actual beliefs they want to see carried forward.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,356]

Dems shouldn’t factor in Trump.  That’s just letting the GOP work the refs as usual. Moreover, I don’t even think Trump runs. 

Nominate the candidate that will make the best president.

Anyone can beat Trump and anyone can lose to Trump so fuck the inside baseball. 

[David Dennison 18,652]

2 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

People who promote Biden because they think he has a better chance of winning (1) shouldn't be so confident in their ability to prognosticate and (2) apparently don't have actual beliefs they want to see carried forward.

Or they understand that some > none.

[bad_teammate 13,132]

5 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Or they understand that some > none.

You guys really invest a lot in super early single state polling, don'tcha?

[JimmyJames 12,271]

13 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

People who promote Biden because they think he has a better chance of winning (1) shouldn't be so confident in their ability to prognosticate and (2) apparently don't have actual beliefs they want to see carried forward.

(1) I’m looking at favorability ratings among independents, I guess you think we should just ignore that like the dems did with Hillary and nominate who the true dems like the most, definitely securing the old black woman vote in Alabama, the true test of winning (2) so falling on a sword and watching trump win again = no actual beliefs. Ok. 

Good luck with that shit. 

[JimmyJames 12,271]

19 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Dems shouldn’t factor in Trump.  That’s just letting the GOP work the refs as usual. Moreover, I don’t even think Trump runs. 

Nominate the candidate that will make the best president.

Anyone can beat Trump and anyone can lose to Trump so fuck the inside baseball. 

Don’t factor in trump? If he’s the republicans nominee I think factoring him in should be kind of important.

Again if he’s not running then everything can be recalibrated. That’s not the current state of affairs though. We shall see. 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,356]

Biden has a bad record in Presidential elections, offers little of substance, lots of voting record baggage, and the only thing going for him is Obama coattails.

[Pancho 44,455]

Did dems get rid of superdelegates?

[JimmyJames 12,271]

5 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Biden has a bad record in Presidential elections, offers little of substance, lots of voting record baggage, and the only thing going for him is Obama coattails.

And the highest favorability rating among all democratic candidates among dems, republicans and independents. So other than that.

Look if you want to win the popular vote again while losing the electoral college and the presidency,  by all means nominate Warren or Harris. Then we can all bitch about the electoral college some more while trump spends the next 4 years destroying the country. 

Again if trump isn’t running again because he’s in jail or whatever, nominate whomever you want. 

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,356]

Just now, JimmyJames said:

And the highest favorability rating among all democratic candidates among dems, republicans and independents. So other than that.

Means jack shit right now.  What were the GOP numbers at this time in 2015? 

We have a nomination process for a reason 

[JimmyJames 12,271]

Just now, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Means jack shit right now.  What were the GOP numbers at this time in 2015? 

We have a nomination process for a reason 

Ok fine. If the numbers change on that then fine with me. Not sure they will but time will tell. But remember what states it’s important that changes for. You’d think the dems would have figured that out by now after losing while winning the popular vote twice in the last 16 years. 

[lemonlime 5,503]

The dems do not need to be nominating someone old enough to be on Social Security.  They need a contrast to trump's old white man in beginning (?) stages of dementia who's not physically capable of walking across the street to a funeral, down a flight of stairs, or using an umbrella.

[bad_teammate 13,132]

35 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

(1) I’m looking at favorability ratings among independents, I guess you think we should just ignore that like the dems did with Hillary and nominate who the true dems like the most, definitely securing the old black woman vote in Alabama, the true test of winning 

He's been under constant attack from the center and right for two years at this point and is still consistent and strong in his favorability.

On the other hand, Biden has been doing absolutely nothing except having memes made about him for the last decade after a magnificent failure as a presidential candidate in 2008. He's the beneficiary of Backup QB Syndrome where the team forgets why the guy was a backup in the first place. Once he opens his mouth consistently people will realize there is no Obama involved and he will flame out again, and the centrists and Temporarily-Not-Republicans will have already invested themselves into burning Sanders and, to a lesser extent, Warren alive.

He is the moon reflecting Obama's sunshine and many of you think he's actually there on his own.

1% in Iowa and then withdrawing from the race. A true winner. Awe-inspiring, really.

Quote

(2) so falling on a sword and watching trump win again = no actual beliefs. Ok. 

Far too confident in your prognostication.

Quote

But remember what states it’s important that changes for.

Bernie beat Hillary in Wisconsin and Michigan. But, you know... uh... no one likes him in the blue wall states lol

[JimmyJames 12,271]

4 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

He's been under constant attack from the center and right for two years at this point and is still consistent and strong in his favorability.

On the other hand, Biden has been doing absolutely nothing except having memes made about him for the last decade after a magnificent failure as a presidential candidate in 2008. He's the beneficiary of Backup QB Syndrome where the team forgets why the guy was a backup in the first place. Once he opens his mouth consistently people will realize there is no Obama involved and he will flame out again, and the centrists and Temporarily-Not-Republicans will have already invested themselves into burning Sanders and, to a lesser extent, Warren alive.

He is the moon reflecting Obama's sunshine and many of you think he's actually there on his own.

1% in Iowa and then withdrawing from the race. A true winner. Awe-inspiring, really.

Far too confident in your prognostication.

Bernie beat Hillary in Wisconsin and Michigan. But, you know... uh... no one likes him in the blue wall states lol

I think Bernie would have beaten trump in 2016 and would also in 2020. I just don’t see the dems nominating him. 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,356]

I think there are plenty of good candidates to choose from and dem voters are much more informed and engaged this cycle.  They know what is at stake and will make the most of the primary season.  Trust the process and keep an eye on what Russia is doing for 2020 because I can guarantee they’ll be back.

Edited January 8, 2019 by Hugo Stiglitz

[Ghost of LL 15,477]

10 hours ago, OatmealRaisinCookie said:

Such a mysgonist calling BamaChic’s Cosmo-inspired thoughts on Bernie brain dead. 

Actually, I don't think you have to be a troll to detect more than a touch of misogyny in BT's behavior toward Bama Chick.

[Ghost of LL 15,477]

2 minutes ago, OatmealRaisinCookie said:

I agree. Bama Chick obviously isn't some intellectual powerhouse or great political thinker of our day, but she never claimed to be so it's unfair to insult and deride her as brain dead or otherwise.

And I'm not going to dismiss her so flippantly.  She brings a different perspective--a perspective, by the way, that is probably far more in tune with the majority of voters than any of the elitist pseudo-academicians on this board--that I think is valuable and worth considering.

Nor am I willing to dismiss BT's conduct toward her as part of his being an equal-opportunity asshole.  I mean, he is an asshole.  But he seems to be more of an asshole to women.  Except when he's white-knighting them; then he's just patronizing to them.

[Anastasis 23,393]

2020 democratic nominee thread getting in touch with it's sensitive side. 

[Anastasis 23,393]

12 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Trust the process...

[Anastasis 23,393]

Just now, OatmealRaisinCookie said:

Just two big brains calmly discussing matters and trying to make sense of bad_teammates pathology.

This gonna be a long thread. 

[bad_teammate 13,132]

I think it's pretty simple: I'm a self-righteous know-it-all who loves to spar.

Arguing with Bama Chick isn't sexist, you idiots. Watching you guys pretend to be woke is like watching a fawn walk on a frozen pond.

Sanders and Warren would be huge improvements over Trump. I prefer Sanders because he's a lifer and a true believer. He is absolutely nothing but substance. I like that. I also like Warren. I became a huge fan of her in the late-aughts as she spoke truth to power regarding the bailouts.

Some of you seem incapable of understanding the difference between a MAGA CHUD saying, "HEH POCAHONTAS!" and a leftist saying, "I prefer Bernie."

And some of you can't just prefer Warren, you have to parrot some complete bullshit about why Sanders is terrible. And I think it's because you're not actually in it for ideas and beliefs, you're in it for personality and horse race. Which I find pathetic.

[EuroHorn 3,204]

12 hours ago, OatmealRaisinCookie said:

I guess I haven’t been posting enough about my centrist positions to feed bad teammates ravishing hunger to insult people who calmly state beliefs, because he’s turning on his own again with his purity politics and big brain new age left progressive criticisms of the establishment, et al.

Such a mysgonist calling BamaChic’s Cosmo-inspired thoughts on Bernie brain dead. 

It’s fun watching the cloak room eat their own...