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2020 Democratic Nominee

used2b

By used2b
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Huckleberry
Huckleberry

No it doesn't, this is absurd selfishness on a grand scale. Nobody is getting punished. My wife and I paid off our student loans, and you know what I think about younger people or even those in our ge

henrygandorf
henrygandorf

i’ve really enjoyed the 900 posts from bt explaining how bernie people aren’t aggressive, obsessive, and very-online.  truly a learning experience. 

Bill Clinton
Bill Clinton

3rd or 4th thread but whos counting.  Name recognition and ability to collect money is most important to the Democratic Party. They aren't trying to win 2020, they are trying to rebuild and colle

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23367

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, BradInATX said:

lol. I don't think you understand what the word "monopoly" means.

I know monopoly is the end goal of every capitalist.  However, once that point is reached, capitalism creeps towards fascism.  

It is my view unregulated capitalism will alway lead to fascism because the monopolist with all the wealth will leverage that to buy government power in order to subjugate the population and maximize profits.  We’re very close to that reality now. 

If the tech oligarchs aren’t brought to heel, we’re going to get more crazy leaders like Trump or a violent revolution.  Neither are desirable. 

Edited by Hugo Stiglitz
Heel not heal
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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23367

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24 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

FYI, this doesn't look like a big deal. But Warren has taken a lot of purity test homerun trots, and she's ripe for criticism if she makes a false step. 

 

Typical misleading tweet (because the actual headline says "DNC voter database") and I wonder who the two unnamed "Democratic operatives with knowledge of the agreement" were? (sneaky sneaky)   The DNC also makes Warren do some private fundraiser appearances for access to their files.  I'm sure the DNC establishment will use that against her as well in due time. 

From the article:

The so-called national “voter file,” a pool of data about millions of people that presidential campaigns use as a foundation for their own private data as they identify and track support over time, is managed by the Democratic National Committee (DNC) and costs campaigns a total of $175,000, according to the DNC’s voter file contract.

The DNC term sheet outlines two ways campaigns may pay for the voter file: by transferring funds directly to the DNC, or raising that money “to” the DNC through donors.

Jurvetson, who contributed about $7 million to Democratic causes during the 2018 election, gave a total of $100,000 to the DNC in April 2019, Federal Election Commission filings show. The donations, according to two Democratic operatives with knowledge of the agreement, helped Warren pay for the voter file.

In a statement, a Warren campaign official said that the candidate herself did not make any calls to Jurvetson in order to facilitate the contribution, nor did the campaign solicit the money at a fundraising event. The official said Warren has remained consistent with the standard she set earlier this year in her pledge: not trading access for money.

The donations to the DNC appear in two batches to comply with federal contribution limits: one for $35,500, for “general operations,” and another for $64,500, marked for the DNC’s “legal fund.” (Under Federal Election Commission rules, an individual may contribute a total of $355,000 to the Democratic Party, including $35,500 for its general operations fund, $106,500 for its legal fund, $106,500 for its convention fund, and $106,500 for a headquarters fund that sustains cost related to its Washington offices.)

Other top-tier candidates have also paid for the DNC voter file through outside donors. Jurvetson also helped cover the costs for one of Warren’s competitors, California Sen. Kamala Harris, the Democratic sources said. A Harris spokesperson declined to comment on Monday.

 

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Hank Kingsley

Hank Kingsley 21770

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I don't disagree, Hugo. But again, when you constantly promote your purity with fundraising, you're begging for people to find a chink in the armor. 

I love Warren, but honestly it kind of pisses me off that she's already admitted that she will "be all in" with fundraising strategy in the general election, yet constantly harps on her strictly grassroots in the D primary.  Run one type of campaign, not two. 

 

 

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23367

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Why should she have to use her grassroots money to fund the fucking DNC? which is basically extorting her for voter files.  As a grassroots donor, I’m glad my money is going to pay for her boots on the ground instead of the DNC.

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FondrenRoad

FondrenRoad 4378

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2 hours ago, BradInATX said:

 

So it's her belief that because Amazon is the dominant retailer in the online space, they should not be able to give their own products (which are generally white-labeled anyway) favorable placement over other products?

Isn't that what HEB does with HCF and HEB brands?

BREAK UP BIG GROCERY!!

She needs to get off of the whole break up big tech thing. Beyond wrongheaded. Find another way to appeal to the idiot technophobes in the rust belt that isn't an actual stupid idea in practice.

Y'all are both missing the forest for the trees.  Pushing their own products over others isn't the problem.  The problem is that they sell both of those products at a loss.  People need to stop thinking of them as "just a retailer."  What they really do is use their massively profitable cloud service provider unit to subsidize their retail unit.  No retailer, either online or brick and mortar, can compete with that because other retailers have to actually make a profit selling products.

This isn't "big grocery".  Its like Verizon running a grocery store right next to HEB and not giving a fuck about whether that store is profitable or not because Verizon makes its money selling cellular service.

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23367

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

Y'all are both missing the forest for the trees.  Pushing their own products over others isn't the problem.  The problem is that they sell both of those products at a loss.  People need to stop thinking of them as "just a retailer."  What they really do is use their massively profitable cloud service provider unit to subsidize their retail unit.  No retailer, either online or brick and mortar, can compete with that because other retailers have to actually make a profit selling products.

This isn't "big grocery".  Its like Verizon running a grocery store right next to HEB and not giving a fuck about whether that store is profitable or not because Verizon makes its money selling cellular service.

Great point, their business model of operating at a loss to capture obscene market share on a global scale should not fly in a fair marketplace. 

Edited by Hugo Stiglitz
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Js1

Js1 87178

Posted
Posted
22 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Any predictions on Beto Q2 numbers? They can't be THAT bad. I'd guess around $9-10 million. 

 

He would not have held back a $9-10 million number.  No way. Sure it's not a Pete/Bernie/Biden/Warren/Harris number but it would be top 6 when he's polling at 1-2%.  That would be huge news. 

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Hank Kingsley

Hank Kingsley 21770

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2 minutes ago, Js1 said:

He would not have held back a $9-10 million number.  No way. Sure it's not a Pete/Bernie/Biden/Warren/Harris number but it would be top 6 when he's polling at 1-2%.  That would be huge news. 

He needs some huge news. What better way to post a decent number than waiting until people have fully lowered their expectations? 

 

 

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23367

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2 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

He needs some huge news. What better way to post a decent number than waiting until people have fully lowered their expectations? 

Buttigieg clearly shoplifted his support, mainly because he’s a better candidate that resonates the same way as Beto.

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Biff Tannen

Biff Tannen 46163

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12 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Buttigieg clearly shoplifted his support, mainly because he’s a better candidate that resonates the same way as Beto.

This is where I'm at.  I love Beto, but after a couple of Mayor Pete interviews, it was an easy switch to make.

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23367

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15 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

This is where I'm at.  I love Beto, but after a couple of Mayor Pete interviews, it was an easy switch to make.

It’s funny because Pete and Beto have very different campaign styles.  Pete goes with an intimate conversation approach while Beto rolls with a rally the troops with passionate stump speeches.  Yet, they’re drawing from the same well. 

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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29225

Posted
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20 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

It’s funny because Pete and Beto have very different campaign styles.  Pete goes with an intimate conversation approach while Beto rolls with a rally the troops with passionate stump speeches.  Yet, they’re drawing from the same well. 

if you take a step back and take a broader look - rewind to feb/march - your two frontrunners are white men in their 70's with 100% name recognition.  i think it's normal for many to take a look at who some of the newer, younger candidates are and to listen to what they have to say.  at that point, pete had stronger pull with his messaging and media coverage.  i think beto's decision to not hit the media circuit as hard probably didn't help either.

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, FondrenRoad said:

Y'all are both missing the forest for the trees.  Pushing their own products over others isn't the problem.  The problem is that they sell both of those products at a loss.  People need to stop thinking of them as "just a retailer."  What they really do is use their massively profitable cloud service provider unit to subsidize their retail unit.  No retailer, either online or brick and mortar, can compete with that because other retailers have to actually make a profit selling products.

This isn't "big grocery".  Its like Verizon running a grocery store right next to HEB and not giving a fuck about whether that store is profitable or not because Verizon makes its money selling cellular service.

Businesses operate one business unit at a loss, subsidized by others all the time. 

There is not a legit anti-competitive argument against Amazon. All I hear is:

- Poor treatment of workers - fine, but that's not anti-trust, that's other legislation that I agree needs to happen

- They sell things at a loss - so what? Companies do this all the time. 

- They're not profitable - again, so what? What's the difference between a company like Uber or Lyft who are unprofitable, but are subsidized by outside investors, and Amazon? If anything, at least Amazon is using their own cash. Your contention is that we should break up any company that is unprofitable because they sell goods cheaply?

Essentially ya'll are saying they are mean and shitty and you don't like them. 

And LOL at Google, Facebook, or Apple. All of them are losing market share and none outside of Google in search have any sort of commanding market position. The only reason she's going after these vs. Wal Mart (who is far, far worse than Amazon) is because it plays better to her base and to the Rust Belt. She knows going after Walmart would kill her in rural areas so she's not going to do it. It's nothing but political BS. A crusade against the nameless faceless big bad tech companies (who happen to employ hundreds of thousands, with millions in their orbit) is a much easier position to take than one against Wal Mart who employs cousin Joe Bob and sells the Obama->Trump voters their cheap goods. It's a spineless way to half-assedly play populist.

 

The funny part is that none of you are actually making the argument that Warren makes in her proposals, but I'll let you guys figure that stuff out on your own. Her arguments are actually better than the ones above, but still not good.

Also for the record I like Warren and will consider voting for her in the primary, because I know some of her half-baked ideas like this one won't ever get passed, even if the Democrats have majorities. You think the house members from California are going to vote for that terrible idea? Or the ones from Georgia, where UPS is? It's pandering and she knows it. And that's fine.

Edited by BradInATX
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Larry T. Spider

Larry T. Spider 1747

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He’s throwing a lot out there trying to get something to stick and nothing is working. Building a following in Texas was easy because Democrats have been so hungry for a quality candidate. He was running against one of the worst humans on the planet, which also helped. 

Hopefully he’s learned some lessons about running for national office. You have to use the media to your advantage, the country is just too big for retail politics only. You also need to come in with some really solid ideas in a deep primary where candidates are similar in a lot of ways. It’s easy to build a cult following when you’re running against Ted but primary voters are a completely different animal. 

I actually hope he sticks it out for a while longer as he will make more connections outside of Texas and learn a lot along the way. Being a congressman from Texas would be a good look for now and he will have enough experience to give it a go again in the future if he wants.

Edited by Larry T. Spider
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Hank Kingsley

Hank Kingsley 21770

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Beto raised $6 million in 24 hours and then just another $7 million over the next 3+ months. He probably could have raised more money literally sleeping in a cave for the entire Q2. 

What a complete failure by Beto and his campaign staff so far. Whatever their strategy has been, they should do the opposite moving forward. He should hit every TV show and podcast and do as many interviews as possible. Maybe it's too late, but go out swinging. 

 

 

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Biff Tannen

Biff Tannen 46163

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1 hour ago, Larry T. Spider said:

He’s throwing a lot out there trying to get something to stick and nothing is working. Building a following in Texas was easy because Democrats have been so hungry for a quality candidate. He was running against one of the worst humans on the planet, which also helped. 

Hopefully he’s learned some lessons about running for national office. You have to use the media to your advantage, the country is just too big for retail politics only. You also need to come in with some really solid ideas in a deep primary where candidates are similar in a lot of ways. It’s easy to build a cult following when you’re running against Ted but primary voters are a completely different animal. 

I actually hope he sticks it out for a while longer as he will make more connections outside of Texas and learn a lot along the way. Being a congressman from Texas would be a good look for now and he will have enough experience to give it a go again in the future if he wants.

I still think the Dems can benefit from his enthusiasm and charisma. Hope he sticks around at least through the fall on some level. Perhaps pick up a cabinet position if the country isn't burnt to a shell after the election. 

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Larry T. Spider

Larry T. Spider 1747

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2 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Fuck giving out powerful positions in government as participation trophies. These vanity projects need to end.

I agree with this. I can see why it would be tempting from a political standpoint but it does damage in two respects. First this is how you get people like rick perry running the department of energy. The standard should be that you have a world of experts to pick from so you go for the absolute best, not political hacks. Secondly, it encourages people to run for president that have no chance. The field turns into a cluttered mess of cabinet hopefuls.

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Party_Taco

Party_Taco 3889

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Beto raised $6 million in 24 hours and then just another $7 million over the next 3+ months. He probably could have raised more money literally sleeping in a cave for the entire Q2. 
What a complete failure by Beto and his campaign staff so far. Whatever their strategy has been, they should do the opposite moving forward. He should hit every TV show and podcast and do as many interviews as possible. Maybe it's too late, but go out swinging. 
 
 

It’s funny, I donated more to Beto’s senate run than to all other political campaigns combined, but I haven’t given a cent to his presidential bid.

Couple things weighed heavy for me:

1) We need him more in Texas
2) I had no misconceptions about his chances of winning in this field
3) I felt that his campaign misspent (or failed to spend) the funds he was allocated in his previous run
4) Good politicians know when to attack and, especially in this environment, the “we can do better” shtick doesn’t gain ground. He should have pounded Cruz in the last month on obvious points, but instead took the high road and lost.
5) He doesn’t seem to have learned or grown in any measurable way.

I love his sentiment, but he badly needs experience and he can get that back home in Texas.
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Bozo_Casanova

Bozo_Casanova 26846

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He’s throwing a lot out there trying to get something to stick and nothing is working. Building a following in Texas was easy because Democrats have been so hungry for a quality candidate. He was running against one of the worst humans on the planet, which also helped. 
Hopefully he’s learned some lessons about running for national office. You have to use the media to your advantage, the country is just too big for retail politics only. You also need to come in with some really solid ideas in a deep primary where candidates are similar in a lot of ways. It’s easy to build a cult following when you’re running against Ted but primary voters are a completely different animal. 
I actually hope he sticks it out for a while longer as he will make more connections outside of Texas and learn a lot along the way. Being a congressman from Texas would be a good look for now and he will have enough experience to give it a go again in the future if he wants.

I think Beto got bad advice but none of this is new. When your signature win is a loss, that never bodes well. Beto has some gifts as a politician (gifts that badly need polish and work) but he should have gone back to congress for a while to get back into the W column before taking on an even higher office.
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