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2020 Democratic Nominee

used2b

By used2b
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Huckleberry
Huckleberry

No it doesn't, this is absurd selfishness on a grand scale. Nobody is getting punished. My wife and I paid off our student loans, and you know what I think about younger people or even those in our ge

henrygandorf
henrygandorf

i’ve really enjoyed the 900 posts from bt explaining how bernie people aren’t aggressive, obsessive, and very-online.  truly a learning experience. 

Bill Clinton
Bill Clinton

3rd or 4th thread but whos counting.  Name recognition and ability to collect money is most important to the Democratic Party. They aren't trying to win 2020, they are trying to rebuild and colle

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23356

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Biden is a terrible candidate by almost every metric.  He makes Hillary look like JFK.   Of course he’s light years better than Trump and most everyone knows it.  That’s why he has the lead.

Biden’s entire candidacy is defined by Obama and Trump.  There’s nothing more to him except an old white guy lining up to get steamrolled by the GOP and the 0.01% if elected to office.  I remember people hating on Hillary because she was Bill’s wife and she wouldn’t have a political career if not for him.  Those same folks easily overlook the fact that Biden would be DOA in this race without Obama or Trump. 

/rant

(will support Biden if nominated).

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

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1 hour ago, Message Board User said:

 

The 1994 crime bill was wrong at the time as legislative overkill, and is easily wrong in hindsight, but either people weren’t around, too young, or have forgotten, how out of control crime had gotten all the way up to 1991. That was the zenith, maybe as high as ever in American history, and it went down after that to where nowadays its not that much of an issue. But it was a major problem back in the late 80’s and early 90’s. We can all theorize as to why it was so high then and why its gone done now but it was a huge issue back then, probably even the biggest. 

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Message Board User

Message Board User 12389

Posted
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48 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

The 1994 crime bill was wrong at the time as legislative overkill, and is easily wrong in hindsight, but either people weren’t around, too young, or have forgotten, how out of control crime had gotten all the way up to 1991. That was the zenith, maybe as high as ever in American history, and it went down after that to where nowadays its not that much of an issue. But it was a major problem back in the late 80’s and early 90’s. We can all theorize as to why it was so high then and why its gone done now but it was a huge issue back then, probably even the biggest. 

It's also important to note that times change (duh) and, given that people are often a product of their times, people can change and views often "evolve."

Obama opposed same-sex marriage in 2008.

 

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Guest Lobo

Guest Lobo

Posted
Posted
52 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

The 1994 crime bill was wrong at the time as legislative overkill, and is easily wrong in hindsight, but either people weren’t around, too young, or have forgotten, how out of control crime had gotten all the way up to 1991. That was the zenith, maybe as high as ever in American history, and it went down after that to where nowadays its not that much of an issue. But it was a major problem back in the late 80’s and early 90’s. We can all theorize as to why it was so high then and why its gone done now but it was a huge issue back then, probably even the biggest. 

You've been reading "Freakonomics" again, haven't you?  

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Message Board User

Message Board User 12389

Posted
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2 hours ago, BradInATX said:

Had dinner with three guys from a client company up in Ohio this past week, and it went to politics for a brief bit. Was pretty interesting. They're all probably your traditional "fiscal conservative social liberal" types. One voted Trump and two abstained or wrote someone else in last time. All three are actively rooting for Biden. They think he's great, smart, and "safe". And the electability thing came up over and over. They're scared that someone like Bernie/Warren would lose to Trump. And that seems to be the thing that terrifies them most - they have midwestern sensibilities and Trump offends the hell out of those sensibilities. They hate him. One of them said he literally thinks 4 more years of Trump will ruin our country permanently. These are all smart guys who pay attention, though probably not as heavily as any of us here. They're also financially comfortable white guys.

It's interesting when you get out of the "very online" bubble. There are a lot of people rooting for him. It's a bit disheartening. Because while I'm a "shitlib" to some, I want to see an end to: 1) Corporate controlled politics and 2) Baby boomers running a world that they are losing touch with. And BIden represents both of those.

The only positive takeaway from the conversation was that I'm now almost positive that Biden will beat Trump. These guys are a reasonably proxy for the votes we need to get him out, particularly in the Midwest. And they're rock solid for him. I still think Biden is a lock to win the general, for better or worse.

Similarly, I was at a family reunion last week in Colorado, so was offline for a week (it was glorious - I highly recommend it).

One of my close family members hates Trump and watches Rachel Maddow nightly.  But in discussing the current Democratic frontrunners, she was very tepid in her support and characterized Warren, Bernie, and Harris as "shrill" and made a point that she is satisfied with her insurance and why should she be forced to switch?

Biden undoubtedly has flaws (age being the biggest one - though he's about the same age as Bernie and Warren), but a Biden-Abrams ticket gets 350 electoral votes, IMO.

Warren, Bernie, and Harris are huge rolls of the dice for the general, especially considering RBG is unlikely to make it to 2025.

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, Lobo said:

You've been reading "Freakonomics" again, haven't you?  

Nope. But I assume you’re referring to their theory that abortion, which started legally in 1973 and therefore 18 year olds who would have been eventually reached their peak crime rate after 1991, reduced crime eventually, having never been born in the first place.

I suppose that could have played a part. As could have the banning of lead paint, the rise of the internet (think what would be on the net if 100s of kids had gone missing in Houston like they did in the 70’s due to the candyman), broken windows policing, tougher crime laws, etc. etc. etc.

The truth is we will never really know what caused its great spike and even greater decline. Its hard to imagine in this day of everyone fearing routine mass shootings, but overall crime has really never been much lower than it is today. Its a conundrum. 

Edited by JimmyJames
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406W30th

406W30th 1111

Posted
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18 minutes ago, Message Board User said:

Similarly, I was at a family reunion last week in Colorado, so was offline for a week (it was glorious - I highly recommend it).

One of my close family members hates Trump and watches Rachel Maddow nightly.  But in discussing the current Democratic frontrunners, she was very tepid in her support and characterized Warren, Bernie, and Harris as "shrill" and made a point that she is satisfied with her insurance and why should she be forced to switch?

Biden undoubtedly has flaws (age being the biggest one - though he's about the same age as Bernie and Warren), but a Biden-Abrams ticket gets 350 electoral votes, IMO.

Warren, Bernie, and Harris are huge rolls of the dice for the general, especially considering RBG is unlikely to make it to 2025.

I just don't buy that your Maddow-watching family member would abstain from voting if Warren or Bernie were the candidate.

 

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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29176

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1 hour ago, Message Board User said:

Similarly, I was at a family reunion last week in Colorado, so was offline for a week (it was glorious - I highly recommend it).

One of my close family members hates Trump and watches Rachel Maddow nightly.  But in discussing the current Democratic frontrunners, she was very tepid in her support and characterized Warren, Bernie, and Harris as "shrill" and made a point that she is satisfied with her insurance and why should she be forced to switch?

Biden undoubtedly has flaws (age being the biggest one - though he's about the same age as Bernie and Warren), but a Biden-Abrams ticket gets 350 electoral votes, IMO.

Warren, Bernie, and Harris are huge rolls of the dice for the general, especially considering RBG is unlikely to make it to 2025.

i'm starting to sound like a broken record here, but this is, in fact, a problem, and it needs cleaning up.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13132

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, henrygandorf said:

wtf are you even talking about?

The Republican thinks that a small group of upper-middle/upper-class white guys is more representative of the American population than the Twitter userbase because he identifies with the white guys.

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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29176

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Posted

you said the hallmark of centrism is believing you're at the center of it all.  that makes no sense, unless you're talking in terms of being in the "center" of the political spectrum, but that's not how you meant it at all.

you could say that a narcissistic centrist thinks that he's right and surrounds himself with people exactly like him to help him confirm he's right.

i have no problem with anecdotal evidence.  all politics is local.

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

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"The Republican thinks he's the center of it all. How arrogant. Also anyone who doesn't believe in my exact political beliefs is an idiot. I am right on every issue with no room for error, negotiation, or good faith discussion. The two candidates I like are the only valid ones."

- a totally sane intellectual who is a great champion for his candidate to the 10% of users that don't have him on ignore.

 

 

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Js1

Js1 85109

Posted
Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

 

I'm supposed to believe THE Joe Biden, our greatest and most bestest 2020 hope to defeat Trump, only ties him in Texas but Beto, Warren, Sanders and Harris do better IN TEXAS?

And Pete....woof. 

Edited by Js1
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Zavala

Zavala 1384

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

Harris, Booker, and Warren are failing to maintain "best practices"  when it comes to the email security of those who register at their websites, putting supporters privacy at risk. 

https://protegopress.com/how-three-presidential-campaigns-are-putting-supporters-privacy-at-risk/

But her e-mails!

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EMAWesome

EMAWesome 101

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Looks like Tulsi has ran afoul of the DNC for going after their golden child Harris.  They've sicked their media attack dogs on her.  Let me know if you have heard this one before---Russia, Russia, Russia.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-election/russia-s-propaganda-machine-discovers-2020-democratic-candidate-tulsi-gabbard-n964261

http://790-b497-11e9-8949-5f36ff92706e_story.html?norewww.washingtonpost.com/opinions/global-opinions/tulsi-gabbards-syria-record-shows-why-she-cant-be-president/2019/08/01/f804cdirect=on&utm_term=.2741f0be61d0

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RollLeft

RollLeft 5040

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Tier 1

Bernie Sanders, Liz Warren, Kamala Harris, Booker, O’Rourke

 

Tier 2

Biden- Dude looks and acts old, fumbles his words and can't even hear the questions.  He can't beat Trump.  

Klobuchar, Ryan, Castro, Bennet, Gilibrand, Gabbard, Buttigieg

 

No Chance or a Nut*

Hickenlooper, Messam, Sestak, Steyer, Moulton, Inslee, Bullock, DeLaney, de Blasio, Williamson*, Yang*

 

Best shot at VP

Kamala Harris, Liz Warren, Booker, O’Rourke, Ryan, Gillibrand or Castro

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Mojo Hand

Mojo Hand 4580

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1 hour ago, Message Board User said:

Exactamundo.

 

Republicans have dominated elections for years while opposing the top 5 extremely popular major items on that list and more, and you think liberal Dems are doomed to lose because of two minor issues on the other end?  Please.

Dems went moderate in the early 90s and what do we have to show for it in the years since?   Donald Fucking Trump.   Mitch McConnell.   Gorsuch, Kavanaugh, Alito, and Roberts joining Thomas as the GOP continues its decades-long stranglehold on the Court.    A bunch of Clinton-era centrist policies that caused lasting damage.   A health insurance system that is being dismantled by Republicans elected on the promise to dismantle it, as like 30 million Americans remain uninsured. 

What is even the fucking point of 4 years of Biden followed by Republicans retaking the House and some asshole like Josh Hawley becoming Trump 2.0, only smart enough to do worse damage?  And that's assuming that old man Biden stays healthy and actually wins and doesn't go down like fellow inevitable moderate Hillary Clinton. 

The popularity of reparations or, more likely, a commission to study reparations, is pretty much irrelevant.   It would only matter to the extent that it's so unpopular that it would actually cause a liberal Dem nominee to lose the election notwithstanding all of the other issues in their favor.  That poll doesn't support that notion.   It's an unproven and likely false assumption that should not be the basis for returning to a continually losing electoral strategy. 

Do I want a Dem candidate who will make reparations the centerpiece of her campaign?  Of course not.  But I'm not remotely worried about a candidate who happens to support it along with 100 other policies that will actually make the difference in 2020 and beyond. 

Edited by Mojo Hand
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Mojo Hand

Mojo Hand 4580

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And I'll add:  the moderate Republicans and right-wing independents who keep trying to convince the Dems to nominate a moderate aren't acting in the interests of the Democratic party or the people it represents.    They want our help to solve their problem without giving up anything.  They would love nothing more than 4 years of Biden with McConnell controlling his judicial appointments, followed by President Hawley as Trump without the tweets, and they're trying to scare us into giving it to them. 

Dems have never needed them to win.  And if they really are never-Trumpers who believe in party over country, they'll vote for someone like Warren anyway and accept the extremely remote possibility that reparations could actually become law.

Trump's extreme unpopularity is an opportunity for Dems to actually get something done.   It's worth the risk to seize it. 

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NowThis

NowThis 931

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Posted

best to cut the military by $200 billion and channel that into healthcare and other social services. Easy.  Offer the current Medicare to everyone and include (thanks Bernie) dental/dentures, eye care (cataracts are already covered under Medicare) and hearing aids.  The elderly have to pay a ton for dentures, so this would be a huge relief. Easy.

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

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Posted
best to cut the military by $200 billion and channel that into healthcare and other social services. Easy.  Offer the current Medicare to everyone and include (thanks Bernie) dental/dentures, eye care (cataracts are already covered under Medicare) and hearing aids.  The elderly have to pay a ton for dentures, so this would be a huge relief. Easy.
Or just tax the ultra wealthy, which has like 75% support amongst all voters.

Dems should take the every man champion trophy back from Trump. They should go hard af on the messaging "yeah, we're going to tax the hell out of the 1% with no apologies".

Then when some chump asks how they're going to pay for (insert healthcare plan of your choice), it's an easy answer. "_We_ aren't going to. Bezos and the Kochs and the Waltons are, motherfucker".

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NowThis

NowThis 931

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Posted
25 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

Or just tax the ultra wealthy, which has like 75% support amongst all voters.

Dems should take the every man champion trophy back from Trump. They should go hard af on the messaging "yeah, we're going to tax the hell out of the 1% with no apologies".

Then when some chump asks how they're going to pay for (insert healthcare plan of your choice), it's an easy answer. "_We_ aren't going to. Bezos and the Kochs and the Waltons are, motherfucker".
 

a wealth tax is a good idea , however i worry that lots of assets will fly away to Swiss bank accounts, real estate will be sold ASAP, everything will be liquidated and sent out of the country. The ultra rich have sneaky ways to avoid taxes.  Reducing the militrary by $200 billion will produce more than taxing the 1%; even Warren wants a 2% tax on 'wealth' above $50 million in assets . That's not going to produce $200billion by slashing useless army bases, reducing staff, cutting off greedy contractors etc. You know civilian truck driver in Iraq made $200k/yr++.  Why even have civilian contractors in war zones? It's stupid beyond belief and no one questions it. 

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