American "Passport Bro" culture (because they can't get significant others here in America)

[Nice Guy Eddie 13528]

Just now, Brothahorn said:

 

 

Who the hell doesn't pay for the first date? Especially if you asked.

 

You would be surprised. Many guys, especially younger, believe in split checks. 

[SydneyCarton 48203]

2 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

 

 

Who the hell doesn't pay for the first date? Especially if you asked. Now that is lower shit.

 

Guess you didn't watch the video in the first post, lol. Men paying for dinner is going way out of style, apparently. 

[Js1 85602]

2 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

You would be surprised. Many guys, especially younger, believe in split checks. 

Going Dutch is popular among the younger generation.

[SydneyCarton 48203]

1 minute ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

You would be surprised. Many guys, especially younger, believe in split checks. 

As abhorrent as I find the idea of going Dutch, but to be completely fair, lots of women these days like split checks as well. Because now that things are more equal, they have their own money, and their own shit to do, and split checks mean there isn't an overhanging "expectation" that a lot of men used to love to pull on women for sex. "But I bought you this great dinner, etc." Lots of women are "fuck that shit."

[Nice Guy Eddie 13528]

Just now, Js1 said:

Going Dutch is popular among the younger generation.

I would adjust that by saying that it's popular with young men, especially ones that are falling behind financially in relation to women. 

[Aqua Buddha 14624]

16 minutes ago, Bateshorn said:

I don't know about all this "Women being un-realistic, thus horny incells are leaving the country" stuff, but on the upper eastern seaboard, every staright dude I know, even the tools, it's like shooting fish in a barrel.   The ratio of single professional women to men is outrageous.  Basically, have a full set of teeth, be able to put together a few sentences, and a have a job, and never sleep alone.  Essentially the multi decadal demographic shift in college to being much more female than male has finally shown up in the dating scene on the east coast. 

Ding, ding, ding.

[Js1 85602]

Just now, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I would adjust that by saying that it's popular with young men, especially ones that are falling behind financially in relation to women. 

I know a lot of younger women who prefer it too. They don’t feel obligated to say yes to a second date or anything post-dinner just bc the dude paid for dinner. 

[Brisketexan 105438]

2 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

As abhorrent as I find the idea of going Dutch, but to be completely fair, lots of women these days like split checks as well. Because now that things are more equal, they have their own money, and their own shit to do, and split checks mean there isn't an overhanging "expectation" that a lot of men used to love to pull on women for sex. "But I bought you this great dinner, etc." Lots of women are "fuck that shit."

I still remember when my wife and I were early in our dating life, but getting serious, she asked me out to dinner.  As in she said "let's go out to dinner tomorrow night, I'm paying."  We were both poor college students, paying for fancy dates out wasn't our thing.  But we'd been going out for a bit, and I'd been paying.  She wanted to send the signal that she wanted our relationship to be a partnership, so she can pay sometimes too.  We went to North China on the drag.  I ordered the kung pao chicken.  The whole meal for two (30+ years ago) was probably $15.  But it made an impression on me -- she wasn't just a princess looking to be swept off her feet by a prince who would take care of her in every respect.  She was a capable woman who was interested in a partnership.

Understand that when you are dating, you are telling people about who you are, and how things with you will be.  And trust me on this fellas, you don't want the princess who you serve.  You want the Queen who stands and fights beside you, because at some time(s) in your life, it's gonna be y'all against the world and you want a partner who can help you raise the black flag and start slitting throats.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13528]

7 minutes ago, Js1 said:

I know a lot of younger women who prefer it too. They don’t feel obligated to say yes to a second date or anything post-dinner just bc the dude paid for dinner. 

Yes so the women expects the guy, they want to see again, to pay for the date. For the guy that they can't wait to get away from, they're maybe ok paying their share.

If a guy wants a better chance at a second date or continuation of the night, he has to pay. And I get that people say otherwise but they're wrong on average. And it doesn't matter if the woman has a higher income; the guy should pay for the date. Not too mention that paying helps clarify it's a date and not hanging out.

And to @Brisketexan story above, the woman paying for dinner or a date as you continue to date is absolutely expected. In some situations a woman reciprocates by cooking dinner, or taking her guy to a party where's he just a guest. But on an early date, the guy should pay.

Edited June 8, 2023 by Nice Guy Eddie

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4977]

35 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

44 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

And by American, we mean the western world. 

Are English, French and German women as crazy as Americans?

Depends on how you feel about getting shat on.

[Brothahorn 10087]

You would be surprised. Many guys, especially younger, believe in split checks. 

Guess you didn't watch the video in the first post, lol. Men paying for dinner is going way out of style, apparently. 

I hope my daughter isn't entertaining clowns like that.

If you ask a woman out, you pay. Period. Now if she brings it up, that's fine. Other than that it's on you. Don't go somewhere you can't afford.

[Pancho 45062]

6 minutes ago, Js1 said:

I know a lot of younger women who prefer it too. They don’t feel obligated to say yes to a second date or anything post-dinner just bc the dude paid for dinner. 

Yup and when I was teaching college, women were more likely to say that when they asked to split checks on the first date, men were likely to get weird/odd/paranoid/douchey because they felt it was their right of obligation as a man to pay (social constructs and whatnot).

The men in the classes confirmed it’s was their “duty” to pay. My response was always “why tho?” And their responses….whew buddy.

[Schulz2.0 29012]

27 minutes ago, Bateshorn said:

Basically, have a full set of teeth, be able to put together a few sentences, and a have a job

[Bozo_Casanova 26579]

This thread has a strong Jordan Peterson/Andrew Tate undercurrent. 

[Schulz2.0 29012]

10 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

I still remember when my wife and I were early in our dating life, but getting serious, she asked me out to dinner.  As in she said "let's go out to dinner tomorrow night, I'm paying."  We were both poor college students, paying for fancy dates out wasn't our thing.  But we'd been going out for a bit, and I'd been paying.  She wanted to send the signal that she wanted our relationship to be a partnership, so she can pay sometimes too.  We went to North China on the drag.  I ordered the kung pao chicken.  The whole meal for two (30+ years ago) was probably $15.  But it made an impression on me -- she wasn't just a princess looking to be swept off her feet by a prince who would take care of her in every respect.  She was a capable woman who was interested in a partnership.

Understand that when you are dating, you are telling people about who you are, and how things with you will be.  And trust me on this fellas, you don't want the princess who you serve.  You want the Queen who stands and fights beside you, because at some time(s) in your life, it's gonna be y'all against the world and you want a partner who can help you raise the black flag and start slitting throats.

But you put out, right?

[Helobious 9467]

2 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

This thread has a strong Jordan Peterson/Andrew Tate undercurrent. 

@CHIEF’s sexist tirade on page 1 brought out the roaches. Thread wasn’t too bad before that

[Bozo_Casanova 26579]

1 minute ago, Schulz2.0 said:

But you put out, right?

kinda had to

[Eastwood 4394]

21 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

 

 

Who the hell doesn't pay for the first date? Especially if you asked. Now that is lower shit.

 

I dated a girl who insisted on splitting everything 50/50. She was a keeper, but it didn’t work out. Nobody’s fault, but young people need to make the best decisions for their future and our decisions led us down different paths. We’re still friends and we both are doing just fine. 
 

People get too hung up on the transactional nature of relationships. It’s always there to some degree, but couples who make it the centerpiece of their relationship are doomed to fail. Things go a lot smoother when the expectations are low. Be with someone you would enjoy going to dinner with even if sex wasn’t in the cards after. Respect should be the centerpiece and only expectation. If you start out on that concept with every prospective partner you have, you’ll be fine. 

[Brisketexan 105438]

6 minutes ago, Schulz2.0 said:

But you put out, right?

 

5 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

kinda had to

I mean....I've always been easy.

Hell, the summer before the year I started dating my wife, one of the older waitresses at a place I worked took me home for a good time.  At some point, I asked "why me?" (there were other young single guys on staff)....zero hesitation as she answered with a smile "I knew you were easy."

 

Learned a lot from her, by the way.  Served me well later in my dating life.

[HornPhD 1368]

If she pays, she lays?

[Brisketexan 105438]

Just now, Eastwood said:

Be with someone you would enjoy going to dinner with even if sex wasn’t in the cards after. Respect should be the centerpiece and only expectation. If you start out on that concept with every prospective partner you have, you’ll be fine. 

Also good advice for business networking, BTW.  Develop relationships with lots of people, even people who you can't imagine ever being able to help you out.  When you can help someone, do a favor, refer person X to person Y, do it, with no expectations of anything in return.

Do that, and dominoes start to fall your way.

[Brisketexan 105438]

6 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Also good advice for business networking, BTW.  Develop relationships with lots of people, even people who you can't imagine ever being able to help you out.  When you can help someone, do a favor, refer person X to person Y, do it, with no expectations of anything in return.

Do that, and dominoes start to fall your way.

Meant to edit:

The TLDR version, for both dating and business: be a dude, not a dick/douche.

[BBQ2Bayou 807]

1 hour ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

who will accept his 60K salary and limited future upside.

This is my jam. 

[Samson's Wig 3194]

11 hours ago, rage-a-holic said:

Are you in Austin? Wait a few years till your mid 40s and try to find a serious relationship online (and not a fucking hookup) with an Austin woman who:

• Isn't religious or "spiritual/horoscope/astrology" fixated
• Doesn't have any kids and/or isn't constantly fighting with their ex over some bullshit
• Isn't 100% batshit crazy....you want 50% crazy or less

They may exist in Austin, but they're approaching unicorn status. I have friends in Austin who are late 40's - early 50s still searching and they're hating life.

I lucked out meeting a young latina in Mexico who hates religion and has no kids or ex husbands. She's probably 75% crazy, but you can't have everything.

Someone in that position should consider moving to a town that actually has a sizeable population of people over 35.  Austin might be the worst city in America if you're over thirty-five and single  (assuming you're looking for a partner).  If you just want to sleep around with younger women, Austin is not a shabby spot at all.  This is a young city and the single olds here tend to be used up divorcees with limited options.

[Bateshorn 9942]

38 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Meant to edit:

The TLDR version, for both dating and business: be a solid dude, not a dick/douche.

Edited for clarity.

[Aqua Buddha 14624]

1 hour ago, Brothahorn said:

 

 

Who the hell doesn't pay for the first date? Especially if you asked. Now that is lower shit.

 

I'm Get X and used to work with a guy 10 years ago who was Millennial.  One day he asked me and a female coworker (also Gen X) what he did on our first dates in HS and with our current spouses.  We have the standard answer of dinner and a movie or something.  He then asked who did the asking.  We both said the guy did, which was standard practice.

He went on to say his dad told about the "Three P's."  Those would be Plan, Paired, and Paid For.  "Would you like to go out with me to dinner on Friday night?"  He said with millennials and their group dates or "hanging out," no one did that anymore except him and he was a god among men.  Said he dated way out of his league including his wife.  (True.  He out kicked his coverage on her and even stole her from another guy.)

I add this to @Bateshorn's point.  If you're just presentable and can talk to a woman, just ask her out and you're a god among men.

[Brisketexan 105438]

1 minute ago, Aqua Buddha said:

I add this to @Bateshorn's point.  If you're just presentable and can talk to a woman, just ask her out and you're a god among men.

A more direct way to say it: act like you have actual balls, and you are more likely to get a chance to actually use them.

[C-Man 27285]

20 hours ago, Pancho said:

How many Surly bros do this? 

From the article:

Quote

Mike Pickupalpha and David Bond, two North American “dating coaches,” are being investigated by Brazilian authorities after the influencers and their group Millionaire Social Circle, a dating coach and networking program, were accused of sexually exploiting Brazilian women. According to The Intercept Brasil, women who had attended a party thrown by the group in São Paulo said they were unaware of the true intentions behind the event and were treated as “guinea pigs” for new Millionaire Social Circle recruits. 

 

[Nice Guy Eddie 13528]

6 minutes ago, C-Man said:

From the article:

 

Quote

Mike Pickupalpha and David Bond, two North American “dating coaches,” are being investigated by Brazilian authorities after the influencers and their group Millionaire Social Circle, a dating coach and networking program, were accused of sexually exploiting Brazilian women. According to The Intercept Brasil, women who had attended a party thrown by the group in São Paulo said they were unaware of the true intentions behind the event and were treated as “guinea pigs” for new Millionaire Social Circle recruits. 

With a name like that, he was bound to become a cool dating coach. Seriously I would have a hard time not laughing at meeting someone that gave themselves that name.

[Aqua Buddha 14624]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

I still remember when my wife and I were early in our dating life, but getting serious, she asked me out to dinner.  As in she said "let's go out to dinner tomorrow night, I'm paying."  We were both poor college students, paying for fancy dates out wasn't our thing.  But we'd been going out for a bit, and I'd been paying.  She wanted to send the signal that she wanted our relationship to be a partnership, so she can pay sometimes too.  We went to North China on the drag.  I ordered the kung pao chicken.  The whole meal for two (30+ years ago) was probably $15.  But it made an impression on me -- she wasn't just a princess looking to be swept off her feet by a prince who would take care of her in every respect.  She was a capable woman who was interested in a partnership.

Understand that when you are dating, you are telling people about who you are, and how things with you will be.  And trust me on this fellas, you don't want the princess who you serve.  You want the Queen who stands and fights beside you, because at some time(s) in your life, it's gonna be y'all against the world and you want a partner who can help you raise the black flag and start slitting throats.

That's some solid ass advice right there.  Pass on the ones that need saving because they need saving for a reason.

One my core dealbreakers always if a woman has her shit together.  It's more than money.  If she's a hot mess, that will never change.  Pull a FICO score.

[wildcat09 29420]

The (thankfully few) misogynist guys in this thread give off the same vibes as this guy:

[Brisketexan 105438]

Just now, Nice Guy Eddie said:

With a name like that, he was bound to become a cool dating coach. Seriously I would have a hard time not laughing at meeting someone that gave themselves that name.

[Brisket, doublechecking to make sure that nobody on Surly can doxx his chosen name of "Steve Chickstotallydigme."]

[Parliament 14334]

42 minutes ago, Samson's Wig said:

...the single olds here tend to be used up divorcees with limited options.

This is my jam.

[mchookem 16408]

1 hour ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

This thread has a strong Jordan Peterson/Andrew Tate undercurrent. 

1 hour ago, Helobious said:

@CHIEF’s sexist tirade on page 1 brought out the roaches. Thread wasn’t too bad before that

i mean it's kinda hard not to juxtapose this thread with this one...

https://www.surlyhorns.com/board/topic/31266-are-you-and-your-buddies-close-enough-to-do-this/#comment-5297789

 

 

but also...

9 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

 

if women can control the climate and lightening strikes then i can understand men being intimated.

[Brisketexan 105438]

4 minutes ago, mchookem said:

 

but also...

if women can control the climate and lightening strikes then i can understand men being intimated.

[Pam Cummings 9684]

29 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

The (thankfully few) misogynist guys in this thread give off the same vibes as this guy:

Capitalizing RANDOM words for emphasis is a very childish way to write. It really does seem written by a child. It shows a gigantic lack of vocabulary or creativity.

[mycox 582]

1 hour ago, SydneyCarton said:

As abhorrent as I find the idea of going Dutch, but to be completely fair, lots of women these days like split checks as well. Because now that things are more equal, they have their own money, and their own shit to do, and split checks mean there isn't an overhanging "expectation" that a lot of men used to love to pull on women for sex. "But I bought you this great dinner, etc." Lots of women are "fuck that shit."

The correct approach is to offer to pay for the check on the first date. If they want to go dutch, just say something like "I've got this if you don't mind. You have the next round wherever we go after this".

You will know right then if she is into you or not.

[F250 28826]

2 hours ago, Js1 said:

Going Dutch is popular among the younger generation.

It's pretty common with the 35+ crowd too. It's a bit of a pain, I don't even like splitting the bill when having dinner and drinks with a buddy. I'll pay it or he will pay it, and it evens out over time. Unless you have that one friend that somehow never gets the tab.

 

 

[Armybrat 40920]

2 hours ago, Js1 said:

Going Dutch is popular among the younger generation.

Fuck the Dutch.

[ChickenSandwich 9853]

15 minutes ago, longhornmatt said:

I’ve never seen the 80/20 thing substantiated, either, although obviously it stands to reason the most desirable males have more sex than less desirable.

What studies have shown is that - despite the prevalence of apps and everything else that makes it easier to connect with people for dates, “hookup culture”, etc. - people are actually having less sex now than they used to in recent generations.  

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/people-have-been-having-less-sex-whether-theyre-teenagers-or-40-somethings/?amp=true

I think the main theory as to why is basically that Wall E is coming true and most people just fucking stare at screens all day in reality.   Plus, you have porn and even the dating apps where people can get their rocks off virtually without actually doing the real deed.

It’s kind of ironic, actually.  We have this current era where everyone broadcasts all their sexual shit to the world and there are a million hookup apps, so everyone thinks it’s the most sexually active culture imaginable.  But in terms of actual fucking in real life, the prior generations who weren’t so open about sex were way more active.  Especially the boomers who tell you they were Boy Scouts and nuns but who were actually fucking like insane rabbits from the late 60s until the AIDS epidemic.  

 

Findings

In this survey study of US adults from 2000 to 2018, sexual inactivity increased among men aged 18 to 24 years and 25 to 34 years and women aged 25 to 34 years during the study period, with the increase among men mainly occurring among unmarried individuals. Men with lower income and with part-time or no employment were more likely to be sexually inactive, as were men and women who were students.

Trends in Frequency of Sexual Activity and Number of Sexual Partners Among Adults Aged 18 to 44 Years in the US, 2000-2018 - PMC (nih.gov)

[CleverNickname 1321]

3 hours ago, Auto Driller said:

But honestly, what makes me hesitant to marry an American are the divorce statistics. Some crazy high percentage of divorces are initiated by women and all of the divorce laws favor the women. Unless your wife is a currently incarcerated meth addiction, they’re taking the children. I think we’ve built a system where divorce is practically rewarded. I don’t necessarily blame guys for looking for something better overseas.

Huh. Every dude I know that wanted 50-50 got it. Women want their ex to have partial custody - that's how they have time to date! What I see is dudes not willing to do kid errands (endless practices, birthday crap, etc) or fun stuff, and then wonder why their kids would rather be at moms house. Then when kid hits 14, they tell pops to fuck off. Kids take work. Wives divorce dudes that don't contribute to home chores, because kicking the dude out is literally less work for them. Because soooo many dudes want bang maids. That only works if you got a big enough paycheck to have a nanny and housekeeper (so they ain't a maid).

[G650 14278]

3 hours ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

This thread has a strong Jordan Peterson/Andrew Tate undercurrent. 

I feel like I need to take a shower after reading some of that shit.

[Homercles 10206]

57 minutes ago, ChickenSandwich said:

 

Findings

In this survey study of US adults from 2000 to 2018, sexual inactivity increased among men aged 18 to 24 years and 25 to 34 years and women aged 25 to 34 years during the study period, with the increase among men mainly occurring among unmarried individuals. Men with lower income and with part-time or no employment were more likely to be sexually inactive, as were men and women who were students.

Trends in Frequency of Sexual Activity and Number of Sexual Partners Among Adults Aged 18 to 44 Years in the US, 2000-2018 - PMC (nih.gov)

I blame these guys, who are in their late 20’s now

 

[52-80 19263]

I only date women who can venmo me their half of the bill. 
 

If they use Cash App, its game over. 

[66BUFF 2565]

4 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Some advice for guys struggling. Stop watching videos telling you that it's not your fault. Instead watch videos from women telling you how to approach them and how to act on a first date. You might have to search for them since tiktok isn't serving it up to you.

You might not fully agree with their advice, like paying for the first date, but they're handing you a script for success.  And I don't mean listening to pickup artist coaches but regular women complaining about bad dates. Will you still get rejected by some women? Of course as it always has been.

And don't be boring. Never text, "what's up?" Have something worth sharing or don't say shit.

 

[usmc0331horn 967]

14 hours ago, rage-a-holic said:

Are you in Austin? Wait a few years till your mid 40s and try to find a serious relationship online (and not a fucking hookup) with an Austin woman who:

• Isn't religious or "spiritual/horoscope/astrology" fixated
• Doesn't have any kids and/or isn't constantly fighting with their ex over some bullshit
• Isn't 100% batshit crazy....you want 50% crazy or less

They may exist in Austin, but they're approaching unicorn status. I have friends in Austin who are late 40's - early 50s still searching and they're hating life.

I lucked out meeting a young latina in Mexico who hates religion and has no kids or ex husbands. She's probably 75% crazy, but you can't have everything.

I got divorced at 43 and have met so many women in various occupations and ages who were interested in settling down with me all over the Austin area. I ended up meeting this amazing Latina woman 9 years younger than me in the school I work at but also had a 31 year old hot lawyer wanting to be in a relationship, a 35 year old hot medical salesperson, another super rich lawyer, a freaking judge, etc all without kids or ex-husbands. Again, dudes get out of divorce in their 40s and 50s and a. have no game, b. peaked in high school/college, c. haven't worked on themselves to become dateable, d. aren't interesting at all. Like, stop blaming the dating pool and fucking become dateable jfc.

[MissingInAction 25204]

22 hours ago, Bevo said:

I just received an email: !!SecretChat!!mHOTMHorny#RussianWomen should I not respond?

Oops! That was meant for @Brisketexan

[DaysOff 7976]

"Men with lower income and with part-time or no employment were more likely to be sexually inactive, as were men and women who were students."

Huh? It once rained all day in Austin in 1987. My bored girlfriend and I had sex 5 times that day. She got pregnant; we went Dutch on the abortion.

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

Looking at who repped Chief’s post is pretty interesting from a post content and world view/political spectrum perspective.

[Brothahorn 10087]

I got divorced at 43 and have met so many women in various occupations and ages who were interested in settling down with me all over the Austin area. I ended up meeting this amazing Latina woman 9 years younger than me in the school I work at but also had a 31 year old hot lawyer wanting to be in a relationship, a 35 year old hot medical salesperson, another super rich lawyer, a freaking judge, etc all without kids or ex-husbands. Again, dudes get out of divorce in their 40s and 50s and a. have no game, b. peaked in high school/college, c. haven't worked on themselves to become dateable, d. aren't interesting at all. Like, stop blaming the dating pool and fucking become dateable jfc.

Got a couple of buddies(48 & 50) who decided to just 'date' after divorce. As you said, as long as they have some game, decent shape, and some stability, you can have a whole lot of success.