2024 Texas Baseball

[Valmy77 13273]

17 hours ago, Kyrie Eleison said:

this is part of the reason why…a legit 10k plus in The Box to celebrate no. 7 this evening.  kids want this…

Well good for them. 

[BurntOrange&White 40044]

2 hours ago, Biff Tannen said:

This was unexpected. Has to be something beyond performance. 

Pierce is getting tougher and tougher to work for 

[Hookem2147 21365]

I think the 3rd assistant rule officially going into place July 1st played a role in this too. Longley is a plus recruiter, Rodriguez has some California connections but Williams brought very little to the table in terms of recruiting. 

[HenryJames 66188]

Four pitching coaches in five years.

[Horn80 6134]

Put me in the camp of glad to see him go.  

[txhorns 2413]

35 minutes ago, Valmy77 said:

That sucks about Woody Williams, I was looking forward to seeing how this coaching staff would do in the coming season. I didn't see that coming. Last year wasn't a great season by any means but it was a decent one. Not bad for your first year on the job.

Unless they have some legend waiting in the wings, that doesn't make any sense.

They were 10th nationally in ERA, that’s pretty damn good.

[Fletch 5800]

42 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

Pierce is getting tougher and tougher to work for 

Based on? Haig was a comfort hire and Pierce eventually let him go. Allen should’ve taken a head coaching job when he got the chance. Huston and Tulo are rich as fuck so working around the clock wasn’t exactly enticing to them. Apparently Woody didn’t know what he signed up for

All that being said, I sure miss the days of Tommy Harmon being our 3rd base coach for 30 years or however long it was 

Edited June 29, 2023 by Fletch

[chase25 2048]

1 hour ago, Hookem2147 said:

I think the 3rd assistant rule officially going into place July 1st played a role in this too. Longley is a plus recruiter, Rodriguez has some California connections but Williams brought very little to the table in terms of recruiting. 

Are 4 full time assistants allowed to recruit on the road beginning July 1st or is it still 3?

[Hookem2147 21365]

1 minute ago, chase25 said:

Are 4 full time assistants allowed to recruit on the road beginning July 1st or is it still 3?

3 full time assistants + the head coach starting July 1

Edited June 29, 2023 by Hookem2147

[chase25 2048]

1 minute ago, Hookem2147 said:

3 full time assistants + the head coach starting July 1

Wonder where Tulo stands on coming back? Promote Chris Gordon and see if Troy wants to come back in a paid player development role on campus.

[Hookem2147 21365]

1 minute ago, chase25 said:

Wonder where Tulo stands on coming back? Promote Chris Gordon and see if Troy wants to come back in a paid player development role on campus.

I just don’t see what Tulo stands to gain by taking another assistant/off-field job when he’s getting interviews for P5 head coaching jobs. But maybe he misses being around the game.

[shadow_operative2.0 16033]

All I know about Hardge is he was the less-than-stellar commentator on our early season Flo games. 

 

[closetojumping 62883]

38 minutes ago, Fletch said:

Based on? Haig was a comfort hire and Pierce eventually let him go. Allen should’ve taken a head coaching job when he got the chance. Huston and Tulo are rich as fuck so working around the clock wasn’t exactly enticing to them. Apparently Woody didn’t know what he signed up for

All that being said, I sure miss the days of Tommy Harmon being our 3rd base coach for 30 years or however long it was 

I can't speak for BO&W, thank God, but I can tell you that folks  close to the program said this to a few of us today: "Rodriguez was also being pushed out but for his 2 year term and the buyout. All of these coaches coming and going, one common problem. "

There's some fatigue regarding Pierce inside Bellmont.

On NIL--

Regarding NIL, since that's always coming up on the baseball board in particular, the update is that things are the same as they ever were - LSU has one big sugar daddy. There are 1-2 other teams, including Arkansas, with a few big sugar daddies. Texas is next and top 5. Texas' approach is different in that all players on the roster are winning in NIL and that amount for each player is growing year over year. 

The issue is that Texas does not have a primary benefactor yet. If anyone knows someone with UT baseball love and a charity that they love and sponsor, marrying the players to that charity is a virtuous cycle for the benefactor and program. Some help is coming using this logic from one of our most famous alums, but if you guys want to win against LSU in the portal, more help is needed. The gap between Texas and everyone behind them is wide and growing. The gap between LSU and Texas, in baseball and women's basketball, would make the Grand Canyon blush.

Also, to confirm from the earlier discussion, 100% of money donated to TOF and earmarked for baseball is going to either the players for their charity work or to the putting on of an event, and the event side of the spend is low. 

Regarding building bigger, better, faster for UT Baseball, here's a link, as always: https://gift.idonate.com/texas-one/texasonegeneral

In the dropdown where it says "Select a team to support", choose "Baseball".

On Marucci--

One thing being bantered about, albeit wistfully at this point, with Marucci is excluding them from the program. Sounds like a bunch of programs are suddenly discussing that same thing. Or maybe some of the more key programs to Marucci start getting a taste on the NIL side as well.

Whatever happens here, there are potentially very real ramifications for a corporation that allegedly functions as a neutral entity providing key products to a market suddenly deciding that they're going to divert budgeted marketing dollars to one program, giving that program a competitive advantage. Nike is grappling with some of the same pressure across the landscape. 

 

[chase25 2048]

4 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

I just don’t see what Tulo stands to gain by taking another assistant/off-field job when he’s getting interviews for P5 head coaching jobs. But maybe he misses being around the game.

I know he has grander aspirations but while he waits for the right opportunity I think it’s worth it even if it is only for a year. Assuming he even wants to do it, would allow him to still spend more time with his family for the time being not having to recruit on the road while still being involved with the game.

[tx 3 putt 77535]

 

marucci makes the best bats around, damn good gloves too. Not sure about banning them from any program 

[Fletch 5800]

3 minutes ago, chase25 said:

I know he has grander aspirations but while he waits for the right opportunity I think it’s worth it even if it is only for a year. Assuming he even wants to do it, would allow him to still spend more time with his family for the time being not having to recruit on the road while still being involved with the game.

Fuck what he wants, he needs to be our next Tommy Harmon. For our sake 

[tx 3 putt 77535]

There’s a hs head coach in sinton that’s been pretty good with pitchers. He’d look great in a Texas uni, again 

[chase25 2048]

4 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

I can't speak for BO&W, thank God, but I can tell you that folks  close to the program said this to a few of us today: "Rodriguez was also being pushed out but for his 2 year term and the buyout. All of these coaches coming and going, one common problem. "

There's some fatigue regarding Pierce inside Bellmont.

 

Is there any insight on the fatigue regarding Pierce? Genuine ass hole that’s hard to work for or just a HC heading into season 8 and feeling the pressure to win big?

[Fletch 5800]

Just now, tx 3 putt said:

There’s a hs head coach in sinton that’s been pretty good with pitchers. He’d look great in a Texas uni, again 

Should’ve hired him last offseason. Dammit 

[closetojumping 62883]

1 minute ago, chase25 said:

Is there any insight on the fatigue regarding Pierce? Genuine ass hole that’s hard to work for or just a HC heading into season 8 and feeling the pressure to win big?

Sounds like he's a bit of a difficult fella, but I've never met the man and have only some limited anecdotes. I'll ask for more color next time, but that will likely be a little bit down the road.

[BurntOrange&White 40044]

10 minutes ago, chase25 said:

Is there any insight on the fatigue regarding Pierce? Genuine ass hole that’s hard to work for or just a HC heading into season 8 and feeling the pressure to win big?

He's the head guy and it's his way or the highway

Edited June 29, 2023 by BurntOrange&White

[Hookem2147 21365]

I’ve stuck up for Pierce in a lot of different areas because I see people on this board defend coaches in baseball and other sports who don’t have 1/8th of the success Pierce does year over year.

But something I heard from the day he was hired and remains true is he rides his coaches and players hard. It is his way and you need to buy into it or you are not long for this program. But if you do it his way, he will go to bat for you and has your back. He’s not uncommon in that regard. Schlossnagle is a known asshole. Jay Johnson is a very tough guy to work for, his assistant just happen to usually find landing spots as head coaches after a year or two.

The best recruiter on the staff is Caleb Longley who I would guess is going to be the 3rd assistant when that rule goes into effect in a few days. That will need to change. You need at least 2 plus recruiters in baseball.

tldr: Pierce has made things harder on himself than it needs to be, which ironically makes the results he is getting look more impressive considering the self-imposed headwinds. He has to get some staff stability heading into the SEC.

[UnhappilyMarried 821]

19 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

I’ve stuck up for Pierce in a lot of different areas because I see people on this board defend coaches in baseball and other sports who don’t have 1/8th of the success Pierce does year over year.

But something I heard from the day he was hired and remains true is he rides his coaches and players hard. It is his way and you need to buy into it or you are not long for this program. But if you do it his way, he will go to bat for you and has your back. He’s not uncommon in that regard. Schlossnagle is a known asshole. Jay Johnson is a very tough guy to work for, his assistant just happen to usually find landing spots as head coaches after a year or two.

The best recruiter on the staff is Caleb Longley who I would guess is going to be the 3rd assistant when that rule goes into effect in a few days. That will need to change. You need at least 2 plus recruiters in baseball.

tldr: Pierce has made things harder on himself than it needs to be, which ironically makes the results he is getting look more impressive considering the self-imposed headwinds. He has to get some staff stability heading into the SEC.

Sounds like Beard in that he was impossible to work for for longer than a couple years. I don’t get the feeling from Pierce that he’s sleeping in the office like Beard was. Or that he’s demanding a staff of the quality that Beard was. 
 

Who’s left that isn’t a CDC hire? Baseball, S&D, golf, soccer, rowing? Most of those will be replaced in a few years from old age or performance (soccer). 

[chase25 2048]

18 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

I’ve stuck up for Pierce in a lot of different areas because I see people on this board defend coaches in baseball and other sports who don’t have 1/8th of the success Pierce does year over year.

But something I heard from the day he was hired and remains true is he rides his coaches and players hard. It is his way and you need to buy into it or you are not long for this program. But if you do it his way, he will go to bat for you and has your back. He’s not uncommon in that regard. Schlossnagle is a known asshole. Jay Johnson is a very tough guy to work for, his assistant just happen to usually find landing spots as head coaches after a year or two.

The best recruiter on the staff is Caleb Longley who I would guess is going to be the 3rd assistant when that rule goes into effect in a few days. That will need to change. You need at least 2 plus recruiters in baseball.

tldr: Pierce has made things harder on himself than it needs to be, which ironically makes the results he is getting look more impressive considering the self-imposed headwinds. He has to get some staff stability heading into the SEC.

Him being hard to work for isn’t an issue as much as the revolving door of the pitching coach position which some would say go hand and hand.

Being a pitching coach his whole career it seems as though he is having trouble releasing the reins to someone else and taking a step back. 

My stance has always been there are very few prospective upgrades and even fewer that would leave their current situation. Want it to work out because I think he is a great HC but the next 2-3 years are going to speak for themselves and at some point during that time his long term future will likely be decided

[Hookem2147 21365]

4 minutes ago, chase25 said:

Him being hard to work for isn’t an issue as much as the revolving door of the pitching coach position which some would say go hand and hand.

Being a pitching coach his whole career it seems as though he is having trouble releasing the reins to someone else and taking a step back. 

My stance has always been there are very few prospective upgrades and even fewer that would leave their current situation. Want it to work out because I think he is a great HC but the next 2-3 years are going to speak for themselves and at some point during that time his long term future will likely be decided

It might be best that he just becomes his own pitching coach and fills the spot that Woody left with another hitting guy or recruiter.

[NeverMarryAStripper 21943]

If that gets it off of 3rd base that might be a net win

[Hookem2147 21365]

42 minutes ago, UnhappilyMarried said:

Sounds like Beard in that he was impossible to work for for longer than a couple years. I don’t get the feeling from Pierce that he’s sleeping in the office like Beard was. Or that he’s demanding a staff of the quality that Beard was. 

I'm not gonna pretend to know the dudes daily schedule, but he lives and breathes baseball. Losing eats him alive which I think makes him ride his staff even harder and strains relationships at times.

This probably all goes back to the original decision to bring the entire staff from Tulane with him back in 2016. That obviously was not a SEC quality staff and now he is having to try to rectify that by patching holes and putting out fires.

[HenryJames 66188]

[troph 24912]

9 hours ago, closetojumping said:

There’s no accounting for simple idiocy. Baseball is, and will continue to be, behind basketball and football. Rightfully so, as the same kind of jack isn’t needed for baseball. Anyone offering up a different view about NIL levels for non-revenue sports is flatly incorrect and I can say that with certainty. People need to get a fucking grip. 

I think the rumor is baseball isn’t #3 behind football and men’s basketball but that it’s #10 on campus. I don’t know what the rumor is I think that was the concern, no one expects baseball to be higher than #3 in this or any alternative universe. 

[WBT 20672]

Damn, I thought Woody did a pretty good job, especially considering that we entered the year with one established starter.

Edited June 29, 2023 by WBT

[troph 24912]

1 hour ago, chase25 said:

Him being hard to work for isn’t an issue as much as the revolving door of the pitching coach position which some would say go hand and hand.

Being a pitching coach his whole career it seems as though he is having trouble releasing the reins to someone else and taking a step back. 

My stance has always been there are very few prospective upgrades and even fewer that would leave their current situation. Want it to work out because I think he is a great HC but the next 2-3 years are going to speak for themselves and at some point during that time his long term future will likely be decided

He out performs his roster and has success that most clubs would blush over but that’s maybe the point if you out perform your roster at Texas you should be winning titles. It begs the question whether the talent is there - and we all know the answer - it’s not quite there. So if he doesn’t win a title in the next 5 years then even with his success it’s hard to argue with anyone - as absurd as >.500 CWS appearances suggest otherwise - who says Texas baseball is underperforming with him at the helm.  The last thing we want is to be like A&M the next worst is like FSU under what’s his name. We ain’t no fucking bridesmaid dammit we want the fantastic fuck AND the ring.

[RGBIII 22840]

2 hours ago, shadow_operative2.0 said:

All I know about Hardge is he was the less-than-stellar commentator on our early season Flo games. 

 

Tulo isn’t coming back with Pierce still around

2 hours ago, chase25 said:

Is there any insight on the fatigue regarding Pierce? Genuine ass hole that’s hard to work for or just a HC heading into season 8 and feeling the pressure to win big?

 

2 hours ago, closetojumping said:

Sounds like he's a bit of a difficult fella, but I've never met the man and have only some limited anecdotes. I'll ask for more color next time, but that will likely be a little bit down the road.

Ya people despise working for him. Giant asshole from day 1 and not the “wait till you get to know him” type. Just look at staff turnover really

[Had Enough 2088]

Tulo coming back sounds like a perfect hedge for DP. And staff turnover. If it doesn’t work out for DP………

[cochamps 1879]

14 minutes ago, Had Enough said:

Tulo coming back sounds like a perfect hedge for DP. And staff turnover. If it doesn’t work out for DP………

The post just above yours says Tulo is not coming back under Pierce.

And for crying out loud, the issue from Woody appears to be recruiting not coaching.   Read the fucking thread people.

 

[shadow_operative2.0 16033]

To be fair, RGB is known for margaritas a lot more than baseball. 

[Had Enough 2088]

The post just above yours says Tulo is not coming back under Pierce.
And for crying out loud, the issue from Woody appears to be recruiting not coaching.   Read the fucking thread people.
 

Dearest Bro

While not 100% sarcasm, there was a fair amount of it. I don’t know Hardge but don’t trust Hardge. As not a casual Longhorn baseball fan, I like Tulo so I’d like him involved in the program. He might make a damn good head guy. Maybe even soon. Probably not us since we’re too good to take such a risk.

As to Woody, we don’t need to cycle thru pitching coaches every year. We don’t need to sign guys for one year to see whether they can or will recruit. There’s also enough in this thread to indicate that maybe it was more than just recruiting. If after one year the head guy wants the pc gone, that is not good. If the pc doesn’t care to return after one year, that is not good. I do find it unlikely that is solely attributable to recruiting given Woody had limited experience in that capacity.

Lastly the post above was not posted when I worked up my post.

[cochamps 1879]

10 minutes ago, Had Enough said:

Dearest Bro

While not 100% sarcasm, there was a fair amount of it. I don’t know Hardge but don’t trust Hardge. As not a casual Longhorn baseball fan, I like Tulo so I’d like him involved in the program. He might make a damn good head guy. Maybe even soon. Probably not us since we’re too good to take such a risk.

As to Woody, we don’t need to cycle thru pitching coaches every year. We don’t need to sign guys for one year to see whether they can or will recruit. There’s also enough in this thread to indicate that maybe it was more than just recruiting. If after one year the head guy wants the pc gone, that is not good. If the pc doesn’t care to return after one year, that is not good. I do find it unlikely that is solely attributable to recruiting given Woody had limited experience in that capacity.

Lastly the post above was not posted when I worked up my post.

The PC issue wasn’t directed at you, but at the litany of posters who continue to cite Woody’s record when recruiting was the issue.  And I agree that both Pierce & Woody should’ve been more aware of the recruiting aspect - really poor form to change after one year.

I should’ve considered the timing on your Tulo post, sorry about that chief.

[NeverMarryAStripper 21943]

I’ve been a solid supporter of Pierce, but we are going to need some staff continuity if we are going to maintain our excellence in baseball.  I’m sure Augie wasn’t all touchey feeling to work for, but we don’t need to be cycling through assistants every year.

[WBT 20672]

9 minutes ago, cochamps said:

The PC issue wasn’t directed at you, but at the litany of posters who continue to cite Woody’s record when recruiting was the issue.  

Well the previous pitching coach couldn't coach so maybe we should have given this more than a 1 year run.

[chase25 2048]

1 hour ago, RGBIII said:

Tulo isn’t coming back with Pierce still around

 

Ya people despise working for him. Giant asshole from day 1 and not the “wait till you get to know him” type. Just look at staff turnover really

It’s not so much a staff issue as it is a pitching coach issue. He seems to have a standard no one will ever live up to when it comes to that position. Philip Miller is still here. Haig was a little to in over his head at Texas. Sean Allen and Woody Williams are the only two that leave any question marks as far as turnover goes. 

With Woody they had to have seen the recruiting issues coming giving his age and little to no experience at the college level. 

Sean is the one that’s more interesting. 2021 hitting coach and D1 Baseball assistant of the year. Moved to pitching coach and the pitching staff took a pretty significant step back. Some reasons out of his control but still concerning. The weirdest thing with Allen is given how good a recruiter he was, why did he have to seek refuge at Ohio State? 

[WBT 20672]

Where did Allen get this rep as a master recruiter anyway?  I don't follow baseball recruiting but just from watching the teams on the field, the recruiting has never seemed to be quite up to traditional Texas standards since Pierce has been here.  Hence the need to overachieve to get to Omaha.

[TwiceHorn 31554]

Well, I think we first have to acknowledge that some of the luster had come off Texas as a destination in the latter Garrido years.  I think Skip has enough cachet that maybe some pitchers still wanted to come under his wing.

And Pierce wasn't the kind of hire to immediately rekindle interest in Texas, like Garrido was after Gus (and even he had some problems).

So, some of the sub-par talent was probably inevitable in the early going, but now that we're reaching steady-state (except for that damned assistant thing) recruiting should pick up, or should have already, really.

[BurntOrange&White 40044]

7 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Well, I think we first have to acknowledge that some of the luster had come off Texas as a destination in the latter Garrido years.  I think Skip has enough cachet that maybe some pitchers still wanted to come under his wing.

And Pierce wasn't the kind of hire to immediately rekindle interest in Texas, like Garrido was after Gus (and even he had some problems).

So, some of the sub-par talent was probably inevitable in the early going, but now that we're reaching steady-state (except for that damned assistant thing) recruiting should pick up, or should have already, really.

Hasn’t that been said for years? Staff continuity only helps with recruiting.

[chase25 2048]

1 hour ago, WBT said:

Where did Allen get this rep as a master recruiter anyway?  I don't follow baseball recruiting but just from watching the teams on the field, the recruiting has never seemed to be quite up to traditional Texas standards since Pierce has been here.  Hence the need to overachieve to get to Omaha.

2018 was the only year they had to “overachieve” and most of those guys were still leftovers from Augie.

2020, 2021, and 2022 were all legitimate contenders. Obviously we will never know with the 2020 team but I’d say a 14-3 start with Elder, Madden, and Hansen was shaping up to be a pretty damn good year. Allen was an integral part in getting a lot of the guys like Faltine, Hodo, Witt, Nixon, Southard, Ardoin, Campbell, Thomas, etc… Not the only reason but certainly a big reason

LSU has only been to Omaha 4 times post 2009. Now they just won a National Title, but the point being not every team you put on the field is going to be a contender. People take getting to Omaha for granted.

Edited June 30, 2023 by chase25

[Hookem2147 21365]

30 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

Hasn’t that been said for years? Staff continuity only helps with recruiting.

It’s a lot more black and white in baseball. A lot more individualized. You are either a good recruiter or you aren’t.

Texas has a lot of self-selling features that help, but when kids hold leverage, especially in portal recruitments, you have to be a good recruiter to press the right buttons. Not the same as getting a 16 year old to come to a camp and taking him into the locker room to show him the ping pong tables.

[Hookem2147 21365]

12 minutes ago, chase25 said:

2020, 2021, and 2022 were all legitimate contenders. Obviously we will never know with the 2020 team but I’d say a 14-3 start with Elder, Madden, and Hansen was shaping up to be a pretty damn good year. Allen was an integral part in getting a lot of the guys like Faltine, Hodo, Witt, Nixon, Southard, Ardoin, Campbell, Thomas, etc… Not the only reason but certainly a big reason

Which goes back to a lot of the points I make about baseball recruiting rankings and those who bitch about where Texas ranks.

The Texas 2019 class ranked 23rd in the country and dudes like Hodo, Ardoin, Powell and Hansen were outside the top 400 nationally. That class also had Faltine, Southard and Duplantier.

Pierce and his staff have done a really good job of developing lower ranked dudes who they knew were going to make it to campus. You have to have a handful of those every year. What they haven’t been able to do is get as many of the borderline draft pick guys on campus, but when they do it turns out really, really well (Witt, Faltine, Madden, Jared Thomas, David Hamilton).

I won’t turn this into a novel bitching about how perfect game does their rankings but there are many flaws and a lot more to the story then a ranking next to a team. The recruiting piece in baseball is very complex.

Edited June 30, 2023 by Hookem2147

[TornACL 7724]

I can't pretend to know the inner workings of the Texas program or any other program. But one thing I can tell you is that I have no problem with the head coach of fucking Texas Baseball having high expectations and being "tough" or "hard to work for".

Winning isn't easy. The last thing we need is to turn the east side of I35 into a motherfucking country club.

[BurntOrange&White 40044]

8 hours ago, TornACL said:

I can't pretend to know the inner workings of the Texas program or any other program. But one thing I can tell you is that I have no problem with the head coach of fucking Texas Baseball having high expectations and being "tough" or "hard to work for".

Winning isn't easy. The last thing we need is to turn the east side of I35 into a motherfucking country club.

There is a fine line you walk when you are that type of guy....he's too far across that line. There has to be give and take especially in this NIL era....

[shadow_operative2.0 16033]

We are not important in NIL. No kid born in this century thinks UT is badass.

Let’s stop pretending we’re top shelf. 

[BurntOrange&White 40044]

Just now, shadow_operative2.0 said:

We are not important in NIL. No kid born in this century thinks UT is badass.

Let’s stop pretending we’re top shelf. 

Yes but when you're coach is a his way or the highway borderline asshole sometimes the money aint it and they can portal elsewhere and get similar money.