NBA 2023-24 Off Season

[Vic Mackey 47038]

.

[ztejas 43449]

Russillo got his idol and white whale CP3 to do a live podcast in NY yesterday. Pretty cool even if you aren't a CP fan.

 

 

[fellside 1114]

Kristaps about to get traded to Boston.

[SilasCoade 2622]

If true that's a good move for both sides, I think. Good fit for KP.

=============

EDIT: Actually just read the Celtics would be giving up Brogdon to get KP. That feels like a mistake. I was assuming it was going to involve draft picks and filler rather than a contributor that helped them ride out the Tatum and Brown cold spells.

Edited June 21, 2023 by SilasCoade

[d2o 1602]

 

 

[Mitch Cumsteen 18549]

Lol Malcolm Brogdon to Clippers is completely on brand for a franchise that has had their fortunes consistently derailed by injuries going back to Bill Walton in the 70s. Great fucking idea to double down on more injury prone guys. What could go wrong?

[HookEm 2467]

51 minutes ago, SilasCoade said:

If true that's a good move for both sides, I think. Good fit for KP.

=============

EDIT: Actually just read the Celtics would be giving up Brogdon to get KP. That feels like a mistake. I was assuming it was going to involve draft picks and filler rather than a contributor that helped them ride out the Tatum and Brown cold spells.

Brogdon is going to turn 31 next year.  I wouldn't be counting on him for the long-term Boston plan.  Last year he averaged 15, 4 and 4 with decent efficiency, but it is only a matter of time before he starts slipping.

Porzingis can get buckets.  He averaged 23, 8  and 3 last year.  The Celtics will be able to use him to fill scoring droughts much more than Brogdon. Plus he is just entering his Prime and flirting with being in the 50/40/90 club. 

This is a great trade for the Celtics.

[SilasCoade 2622]

I guess. Brogdon just felt like a great fit for the Celtics in the playoffs. He doesn't have to carry a large burden on the Celtics to be valuable to them. KP's numbers are better but they're basically upgrading one position and accepting a downgrade in the second unit backcourt.

[Aqua Buddha 14596]

7 hours ago, Vic Mackey said:

.

That trade went worse faster than I thought.  Always thought it would end in OKC's favor but thought it wouldn't be until 2026 or something.

I don't think they'll trade him but if they can get the #2 or something and some players, you have to consider it.  They should trade him for Zion and pair him with The Nephew.  The one game of the season they play together will be great.  They should put Jimmy Butler on that team and make a reality show.

[d2o 1602]

 

Wow, I'm thinking they couldnt get Kristaps to opt in without getting an extension.

[ztejas 43449]

13 minutes ago, d2o said:

 

Wow, I'm thinking they couldnt get Kristaps to opt in without getting an extension.

The Clippers must have gotten Brogdon's medical records. 

[Mitch Cumsteen 18549]

5 hours ago, SilasCoade said:

I guess. Brogdon just felt like a great fit for the Celtics in the playoffs. He doesn't have to carry a large burden on the Celtics to be valuable to them. KP's numbers are better but they're basically upgrading one position and accepting a downgrade in the second unit backcourt.

Their backcourt is too crowded with Smart, White, Brogdan and Pritchard. White was arguably their second most valuable player in the Heat series and he’s on a very team friendly deal. No way they’re moving him. Smart is part of their long term core while carrying a pretty big cap figure. I think he’s difficult to trade.  Pritchard is still on a rookie deal but wants / deserves regular minutes or to be moved. Brogdan is in the last year of his contract and massively injury prone. He’s the odd man out. 

[ztejas 43449]

He also wasn't actually good in the playoffs. So there's that. 

[Mitch Cumsteen 18549]

The Celtics are also going to lose Robert Williams in free agency and need to bolster their front court. 

[Michael Knight 12978]

The Porzingis trade made no sense for the Celtics, they dodged a bullet or I guess a wizard

Edited June 22, 2023 by Michael Knight

[Michael Knight 12978]

 

[BigOrange1 6437]

wow, celtics are including marcus smart in the deal.

[Michael Knight 12978]

 

[ztejas 43449]

So it's Smart to MEM, Tyus Jones to WAS, KP to BOS. 

Wow.

Also this:

Anyone that makes fun of people for following the NBA always seems a little racist to me.

[Michael Knight 12978]

 

[ztejas 43449]

Just now, Michael Knight said:

 

Someone else sorting reddit.com/r/nba/new I see. 

[Michael Knight 12978]

2 minutes ago, Michael Knight said:

 

 

[shadow_operative 15932]

 

[Fastbreak 3985]

What about Brogden now? Lol

[Fastbreak 3985]

Wait… the Celtics are getting 2 first round picks and Porzingas for Smart?

Washington is seeming like a much worse front office version of OKC. They’ve gotten rid of their assets with basically no 1st round picks in return.

[PittsburghTiger 6186]

6 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

 

When healthy he is a terrific player.

[HookEm 2467]

Porzingis played more games than Smart last year.  Over the last 4 years, Smart is only averaging ~5 games per year more than Porzingis. Not a lot.

[d2o 1602]

9 hours ago, d2o said:

 

Wow, I'm thinking they couldnt get Kristaps to opt in without getting an extension.

It was Brogdon needing elbow surgery.

[d2o 1602]

6 hours ago, Fastbreak said:

Wait… the Celtics are getting 2 first round picks and Porzingas for Smart?

Washington is seeming like a much worse front office version of OKC. They’ve gotten rid of their assets with basically no 1st round picks in return.

One is 25 this yr and they are giving up 35 so they are moving up 10 spots.   The 2nd pick is GSW's so it will probably be pretty late next yr too.    Still interesting to get picks along with what most would think is the best player in the trade.

[aggie08 21504]

I get the feeling that Memphis will expect Smart to take on the Andre Iguodala role: fewer minutes, less shots, mentor a young team, maybe even come off the bench. 

Good luck with that.

[SilasCoade 2622]

Giving up Smart stings more than giving up Brogdon, but getting those draft picks helps. Memphis upgrading and now really have no need to bring back Brooks.

[Vic Mackey 47038]

1 hour ago, PittsburghTiger said:

When healthy he is a terrific player.

Also when not playing with Luka, he is a terrific player. 

Edited June 22, 2023 by Vic Mackey

[ztejas 43449]

10 hours ago, ztejas said:

The Clippers must have gotten Brogdon's medical records. 

What do I win. 

 

 

[Underdog 28637]

 

[Mitch Cumsteen 18549]

So the Bullets turned Hachimura, Beal, Porzingis and Kuzma into a grand total of zero first round draft picks? I guess they may be able to get some draft capital out of CP3 and Jones, and I know their hands were tied with Beal's no trade clause and the player options for Kuzma and Porzingis, but holy shit that seems like a terrible return. Did their new front office learn nothing from working for Sam Presti? The rebuild is off to an outstanding start. Can't wait for them to botch pick #8 tonight. They will probably outsmart themselves and reach for that chucker from Baylor or the big guy from Duke who "looked great shooting the ball in workouts" but played like shit in the actual games.

And while the numbers for Porzingis look fantastic, he's been terrible in the locker room in both Dallas and New York. That's not even getting into his injury history. The Celtics swapping out Smart for him on a team that has had culture issues is certainly a move. Then again, when you trade the heart and soul of a team that played with no heart and no soul, what have you really given up? I guess they won the trade, but that offense was stagnant as hell and they just got rid of the only guy who consistently moved the ball for them. I'm sure second row Joe will have that offense humming.

Smart should be a great fit for Memphis. He's everything good that Dillon Brooks did sans the dumbass antics. He really fills a need for them and can slide over when Ja gets back. I think it's a fantastic move for the Grizzlies. That's exactly what that franchise needed. 

[MNLonghornFUKM 8817]

Wizards might have the worst assembled roster ever after Beal and zinger depart.

I don’t see how they win 10 games next year. They’ll take 2 Vs Minnesota but I don’t see where the other 8 will come from

[Mittens 8283]

11 hours ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

The Celtics are also going to lose Robert Williams in free agency and need to bolster their front court. 

Glass legs is under contract through the 25/26 season.  Regardless, they needed help up front because Williams is a 2 trick pony and doesn't see the court near as much as he needs to be effective.

[Mitch Cumsteen 18549]

1 minute ago, Mittens said:

Glass legs is under contract through the 25/26 season.  Regardless, they needed help up front because Williams is a 2 trick pony and doesn't see the court near as much as he needs to be effective.

Thank you. I confused him with the other Williams that they're likely going to lose in free agency, especially now that they have Porzingis. I actually like Grant Williams game some. Solid three point shooter. Does a little bit of everything. Undersized but he'd be a good fit for somebody like the Mavs if they could figure out their cap. 

[BurntOrange&White 39933]

I was thinking about it this morning but I wish NBA would do a better job of not letting the picks be spoiled on Twitter.  Some are obvious choices but the picks being spoiled before the announcements on TV kind of ruins the viewing experience of the NBA draft.

Edited June 22, 2023 by BurntOrange&White

[Fastbreak 3985]

I just don’t see how the wiz didn’t at least get that warriors pick.

[Dutchrudder 11139]

It's so weird that Boston pivoted from Brogdon for KP to Smart for KP.  If they found a way to swap Brogdon, Gallinari and Muscala for KP, even for 1-2 FRPs to Washington, they would be in much better position. Losing Smart is going to hurt the team, as he was their best defender and instigator. His offense leaves a lot to be desired, but you would think that he would get fewer shots with KP. I'm guessing this moves Brogdon to starting PG, and the team defense will rely more on Tatum and Brown to play D. 

Brogdon's injury issues will likely continue, and they will be paying him 22.5m the next 2 years for about 50 games a season. It's going to be even worse if he's recovering from elbow surgery this offseason.  That risk is a huge gamble over Smart who has missed some games, but seems to be more reliable over his career.  

I do think Memphis made out well here. Getting Smart to replace Tyus Jones as the backup PG is pretty good. He has more years of control at a reasonable rate, and he could easily slot into the starting lineup over Bane or when they want to go small.  He will add more toughness to their defense, and help with countering some of the offense focused teams like Phoenix. I think the issue with Memphis right now is, who replaces Dillon Brooks at SF?  They are over the cap with the current roster at 144m, so I guess they need an MLE guy to fill that gap. 

[Mitch Cumsteen 18549]

11 minutes ago, Dutchrudder said:

It's so weird that Boston pivoted from Brogdon for KP to Smart for KP.  If they found a way to swap Brogdon, Gallinari and Muscala for KP, even for 1-2 FRPs to Washington, they would be in much better position. Losing Smart is going to hurt the team, as he was their best defender and instigator. His offense leaves a lot to be desired, but you would think that he would get fewer shots with KP. I'm guessing this moves Brogdon to starting PG, and the team defense will rely more on Tatum and Brown to play D. 

Maybe not so weird:

 

[Fastbreak 3985]

How about:

Mavericks get:
Monte Morris
Gafford
#42
#59

Wiz get:
Bertans
#10

Mavericks get 2 rotation players and get off Bertans at the cost of #10 (who Kidd isn’t going to play).

[ztejas 43449]

Just now, Mitch Cumsteen said:

Maybe not so weird:

 

He's gay?

[HookEm 2467]

12 minutes ago, Dutchrudder said:

I'm guessing this moves Brogdon to starting PG, and the team defense will rely more on Tatum and Brown to play D. 

I'm betting Derrick White will be the starting point guard and they roll with something like:

• PG - Derrick White
• SG - Jaylen Brown
• SF - Jayson Tatum
• PF - Grant Williams
• C - Kristaps Porzingis 

Then they can further reduce Al Horford's minutes given that he is going to be 37 this year.  

[Dutchrudder 11139]

5 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

Maybe not so weird:

 

Right, there are medical issues which can be waived by the team taking him if they choose. So if you're Boston, why not send 2 first rounders to Washington to take on that deal and get KP in the process?  A lineup of Smart-Brown-Tatum-KP-Horford is pretty good, certainly better than White-Brown-Tatum-KP-Horford. 

Edit: Yeah, I guess they move White into the starting lineup, swap Horford for Williams depending on matchup and fill out the bench with whatever. I still think Smart for 18m/19m/20m the next 3 years is great deal for a guy like that. Anyways, I hate Boston, so I hope they all miss a bunch of games and miss the playoffs. 

Edited June 22, 2023 by Dutchrudder

[Fastbreak 3985]

He had a torn ligament that he just had surgery on. Should be back for the season, but could have a Kawai/Simmons recovery period too. Who knows?

[d2o 1602]

1 hour ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

Wizards might have the worst assembled roster ever after Beal and zinger depart.

I don’t see how they win 10 games next year. They’ll take 2 Vs Minnesota but I don’t see where the other 8 will come from

Then mission accomplished.   This is a full on tank job

[HookEm 2467]

1 hour ago, Dutchrudder said:

A lineup of Smart-Brown-Tatum-KP-Horford is pretty good, certainly better than White-Brown-Tatum-KP-Horford. 

Last year:

• Marcus Smart - 11.5 points on 0.511 eFG% and 0.746 FT%, 2.3 TOV, 12.1 PER, 0.092 WS/48, 0.5 VORP - Not on All-Defense team
• Derrick White - 12.4 points on 0.560 eFG%, 0.875 FT%, 1.2 TOV, 15.4 PER, 0.154 WS/48, 2.6 VORP - 2nd Team All-Defense

And this year in the playoffs:

• Marcus Smart - 14.9 points on 0.552 eFG% and 0.800 FT%, 2.3 TOV, 15.4 PER, 0.112 WS/48, 0.5 VORP 
• Derrick White - 13.4 points on 0.641 eFG%, 0.912 FT%, 0.9 TOV, 16.2 PER, 0.151 WS/48, 0.8 VORP 

Derrick White is better in just about every category.  He is a much more efficient player - and getting rid of Smart will force Tatum and Brown to stop up and lead the team.  

I wish I had Smart's stats in the last 10 minutes of a game.  He invariably tries to take over and he isn't that guy.   

[HookEm 2467]

Thinking a little more about Phoenix next year.  Found a new part of Basketball Reference that shows the percent of time a player has played at various positions.  Over the last 4 years:

• Devon Booker - 2% PG, 81% SG, 17% SF
• Bradley Beal - 8% PG, 79% SG, 13% SF
• Kevin Durant - 9% SF, 73% PF, 18% C  (Side note: LOL at Seattle playing him 94% at SG. WTF)

I'm guessing that they will start Cameron Payne at PG and then have Booker and Beal play interchangeable wings. They are really thin at point guard though. Maybe they will have either Beal or Booker run point for stretches?