NBA 2023-24 Off Season

[MNLonghornFUKM 8,817]

Then don’t opt in to your player option? 

Teams lining up for his services must be off the charts

[SilasCoade 2,622]

3 hours ago, Message Board User said:

 

I'm not saying I doubt him, but what is he claiming Morey lied about? Did he get promised a max deal for taking a short term discount last time? Does he think they weren't really making a good faith effort to trade him? What's the lie?

[Dutchrudder 11,141]

2 minutes ago, SilasCoade said:

I'm not saying I doubt him, but what is he claiming Morey lied about? Did he get promised a max deal for taking a short term discount last time? Does he think they weren't really making a good faith effort to trade him? What's the lie?

I don't know if it was for a max extension, but I believe that was the understanding when he took a 10 million discount for the team to sign PJ Tucker. 

And yeah, he chose money by opting into his 35m this season over playing where he wanted to go. Really dumb move on his part, I'm sure he could have fleeced some team for a lot more than that. Very happy to see Houston passed on Harden this offseason, supposedly Ime Udoka convinced management to do so.

[ztejas 43,481]

3 minutes ago, Dutchrudder said:

I'm sure he could have fleeced some team for a lot more than that.

There is zero fucking chance anyone is giving Harden $35M. That's why he opted in. He could maybe have gotten a 2 or 3 year deal worth more in total.

[d2o 1,602]

3 hours ago, Message Board User said:

 

Pretty wild to publicly state this.   Even wilder considering how he and Morey have been over the yrs.   There is a reason you dont do "wink-wink" deals.   Shit can change and one side may back out.

And I get athletes are always gonna think they are the shit and need to make max money but reality is with his age and history/reputation thinking that someone is going to give him full max is pretty wild.   Especially coming off another pretty spectacular flameout in the playoffs.

[Pam Cummings 9,645]

Those words mean so much coming from a guy with Harden's reputation 🙄

[d2o 1,602]

Dont minimize Harden doing this in China where Morey is hated for his comments a couple yrs ago.

Morey has bent over time and time again for Harden.   As recently as May they let Harden go to Vegas in the middle of the playoffs.    He's like a spoiled child that's been given everything he has ever asked for then finally being told no.

 

Edited August 14, 2023 by d2o

[aggie08 21,505]

3 hours ago, d2o said:

Dont minimize Harden doing this in China where Morey is hated for his comments a couple yrs ago.

Morey has bent over time and time again for Harden.   As recently as May they let Harden go to Vegas in the middle of the playoffs.    He's like a spoiled child that's been given everything he has ever asked for then finally being told no.

 

Fucking this. In Houston, at every opportunity, Morey paid Harden as much as he possibly could earlier than he had to. All while directly supporting his off-the-court special treatment.

Just get him back to Houston already. I need some Wulaw in my life explaining to us how both sides wanted to get back together, and no one is settling because they're desperate. Nope, not at all.

[Mitch Cumsteen 18,550]

37 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Fucking this. In Houston, at every opportunity, Morey paid Harden as much as he possibly could earlier than he had to. All while directly supporting his off-the-court special treatment.

Just get him back to Houston already. I need some Wulaw in my life explaining to us how both sides wanted to get back together, and no one is settling because they're desperate. Nope, not at all.

This... I'm going to need @Wulaw Horn to chime in about how mistreated Harden was in Houston by Fertitta before commenting on the most recent news. 

[HookEm 2,467]

He will wind up in Washington, IMO.

[Pam Cummings 9,645]

23 hours ago, aggie08 said:

Fucking this. In Houston, at every opportunity, Morey paid Harden as much as he possibly could earlier than he had to. All while directly supporting his off-the-court special treatment.

Just get him back to Houston already. I need some Wulaw in my life explaining to us how both sides wanted to get back together, and no one is settling because they're desperate. Nope, not at all.

Harden was there too when Morey told Chris Paul that he wouldn't trade him, then turned around and traded him. He watched that go down and still decided to trust Morey's word. To hear him bitching because now it's his turn is just.....hilarious.

[Brothahorn 10,087]

I'm definitely enjoying this lover's spat. They both deserved to have their names drug through the mud.

[d2o 1,602]

15 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

I'm definitely enjoying this lover's spat. They both deserved to have their names drug through the mud.

True.   This song is playing when I think about either of them.

 

[ztejas 43,481]

 

 

[CurlyDumps 4,476]

Pretty hilarious seeing Harden turn on the guy who happily wore his jock like a Bane mask for a decade.

[Mitch Cumsteen 18,550]

So the NBA announced their in-season tournament schedule yesterday with little to no fanfare. I think I'm the only person who is even moderately interested in it. For my two cents, anything to drive up a little mid-season competition is good. I think it's going to be a success for the same reason the play-in has been successful -- you get a little dose of the NCAA win or go home flavor. It's a world cup like format with group play and then a knockout stage. 

They grouped by last season's records, but the Celtics look like they got the easiest draw. The west is so deep across the board that just about any way you slice it up the groups would be tough. West A probably will be the easiest though with Ja serving a suspension and the Blazers should be about the worst team in the league depending on what happens with Lillard. West B looks particularly rough health permitting.

The general consensus is that it will be stupid, but I think it will be pretty cool. Shit... even if it gets a few guys who usually load manage to actually show up it will be a plus for the league. 

[MNLonghornFUKM 8,817]

Gotta have an incentive. Like winner of east/west is at worst the 6th seed and avoid the play ins

I just don’t get what happens after pool play. Like the losers just go sit at home and get an extended rest?

[Herpa Derpa 6,126]

Meh, would rather have interconference pools. Mix the shit up.

[SilasCoade 2,622]

I'd like to see them go to an all-tourney format. Let every team host an 8-team one-week tourney with two 4-team round robin pools followed by a championship game. Tourney championships are first tie breaker in seeding or earn extra cash or some sort of draft compensation or something. Reduced travel stress. Reduced back to backs. Improve experience for fans of other teams. Improve revenue for stadiums of teams that suck but do good numbers when visiting stars are there. Also more efficient use of facilities.

[Mitch Cumsteen 18,550]

2 hours ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

Gotta have an incentive. Like winner of east/west is at worst the 6th seed and avoid the play ins

I just don’t get what happens after pool play. Like the losers just go sit at home and get an extended rest?

They are giving cash to incentivize the players. I don't know how much that will matter, but I do think that the competitive nature of these guys will kick in, and teams will go for it. 

Quote

The players on the winning team will each get $500,000, while the runners-up will get $200,000. The losing players of the semifinals will each get $100,000, and the losing players of the quarterfinals will each get $50,000.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/38192234/what-nba-season-tournament-format-schedule-groups
The 22 teams that fail to qualify for the knockout rounds of the in-season tournament will have their final two games scheduled -- one at home and one on the road -- on Dec. 6 and 8 against other teams eliminated in the group stage.

 

2 hours ago, Herpa Derpa said:

Meh, would rather have interconference pools. Mix the shit up.

I agree with this. It would have made it more interesting since the same teams face each other more frequently in the regular season plus the playoffs. Hell, I think they should do away with conferences altogether and have a true balanced schedule. Everybody travels private anyway. It's not like it was in the 1950s.

[Brothahorn 10,087]

So the NBA announced their in-season tournament schedule yesterday with little to no fanfare. I think I'm the only person who is even moderately interested in it. For my two cents, anything to drive up a little mid-season competition is good. I think it's going to be a success for the same reason the play-in has been successful -- you get a little dose of the NCAA win or go home flavor. It's a world cup like format with group play and then a knockout stage. 

They grouped by last season's records, but the Celtics look like they got the easiest draw. The west is so deep across the board that just about any way you slice it up the groups would be tough. West A probably will be the easiest though with Ja serving a suspension and the Blazers should be about the worst team in the league depending on what happens with Lillard. West B looks particularly rough health permitting.
The general consensus is that it will be stupid, but I think it will be pretty cool. Shit... even if it gets a few guys who usually load manage to actually show up it will be a plus for the league. 

Are these going to be regular season games? Will they count towards the playoff seedings? Are there going to be playoffs for the Mid Season Participation Trophy?

[UpperWestside 6,170]

If Harden is that worried about money why doesn’t he just do the sensible thing and open up a chain of strip clubs in cities he likes? He can save on money he is handing out to strippers while still turning a profit. Seems like a winning play for a guy that loves going to them more than the sport that has made that part of his lifestyle possible.

[Braff Zacklin 13,625]

12 minutes ago, UpperWestside said:

If Harden is that worried about money why doesn’t he just do the sensible thing and open up a chain of strip clubs in cities he likes?

They could also serve as a sanctuary of sorts for him as he bounces from metro to metro during the "journeyman" years of his career.

[Aqua Buddha 14,598]

I know it's some random gym in the off season but these are NBA guys.  Real ones.  Chet might be a player if he stays healthy over the years:

 

[MNLonghornFUKM 8,817]

Still have no idea how that body is going to sustain a full season while giving up 50 lbs, minimum. He’s being guarded by the 3rd skinniest guy in the league here not named Chet or Wemby

[ztejas 43,481]

4 minutes ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

Still have no idea how that body is going to sustain a full season while giving up 50 lbs, minimum. He’s being guarded by the 3rd skinniest guy in the league here not named Chet or Wemby

Yeah Durant is a terrible defender. Let's see him score against someone legit like '95 Hakeem. 

Not that I think KD is giving it playoff intensity out there.

[Braff Zacklin 13,625]

Don't think offense is going to be Chet's issue.

Defense, however ... 

[Mitch Cumsteen 18,550]

It's a fucking pickup run played with less intensity than the rookie game during all star weekend. I think Holmgren is gong to be a fine player, but it's ridiculous to take anything meaningful from that beyond him not having any residual leg issues.  

[SilasCoade 2,622]

Not sure if it's more accurate to say he picked up a bad habit or added to his pull up game, but on two of those jumpers (~25s and ~48s) he gathers with the left foot forward and has to twist his hips as he raises up to get the natural shooting alignment for a right hander. He kind of uses it in the pump fake up and under move he did on KD too. Don't remember seeing that from him before.

[ztejas 43,481]

23 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

It's a fucking pickup run played with less intensity than the rookie game during all star weekend. I think Holmgren is gong to be a fine player, but it's ridiculous to take anything meaningful from that beyond him not having any residual leg issues.  

Eh. You're underselling it. Durant is playing him fairly honest there and Chet is exhibiting some elite skills. 

I remember 4 or 5 years ago watching some runs and noticing that Siakam was killing dudes up and down the floor. That just happened to be right before he broke out as a borderline all-NBA level talent. 

You have a fairly high-level knowledge of the game, Mitch - you should pay attention to clips like this. Especially because people here actually listen to what you say. 

[Mitch Cumsteen 18,550]

18 minutes ago, ztejas said:

Eh. You're underselling it. Durant is playing him fairly honest there and Chet is exhibiting some elite skills. 

I remember 4 or 5 years ago watching some runs and noticing that Siakam was killing dudes up and down the floor. That just happened to be right before he broke out as a borderline all-NBA level talent. 

You have a fairly high-level knowledge of the game, Mitch - you should pay attention to clips like this. Especially because people here actually listen to what you say. 

Seriously? He got like 10 or 12 uncontested shots at the rim. You think that's happening in a real game? I watched the dude at Gonzaga and even against college players he wasn't getting shots like that. He's definitely very skilled and I think he's going to be good but again, it's a pickup game. I take next to nothing from that video. It's maybe less translatable than the Rucker league. 

[Aqua Buddha 14,598]

8 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

Seriously? He got like 10 or 12 uncontested shots at the rim. You think that's happening in a real game? I watched the dude at Gonzaga and even against college players he wasn't getting shots like that. He's definitely very skilled and I think he's going to be good but again, it's a pickup game. I take next to nothing from that video. It's maybe less translatable than the Rucker league. 

Even if Durant isn't giving a fuck, he's shooting over Durant like he's 6'4" and Durant has his hand in his face.

Chet's ball handling stuck out to me.  Also, in the summer league, he looked more athletic than I thought.  Granted, it's the summer league but he still looked good.  

Also keep in mind that the people guarding Chet are going to be other team's 5's.  Gobert is a an awful match up with both I'm and Victor.

[ztejas 43,481]

18 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

Seriously? He got like 10 or 12 uncontested shots at the rim. You think that's happening in a real game? I watched the dude at Gonzaga and even against college players he wasn't getting shots like that. He's definitely very skilled and I think he's going to be good but again, it's a pickup game. I take next to nothing from that video. It's maybe less translatable than the Rucker league. 

My only point is that you can discern a lot from runs like that. I've been high on Chet since I saw him play for Gonzaga. Playoff effort or not that's a top 25 player of all time (at worst) that he's going 1 on 1 against. Reps like that are meaningful.

[Kermit 3,156]

25 minutes ago, ztejas said:

My only point is that you can discern a lot from runs like that. I've been high on Chet since I saw him play for Gonzaga. Playoff effort or not that's a top 25 player of all time (at worst) that he's going 1 on 1 against. Reps like that are meaningful.

Meaningful? Like “nice crossover rookie” meaningful or “this is how you escape from OKC” meaningful?

[ztejas 43,481]

3 minutes ago, Kermit said:

Meaningful? Like “nice crossover rookie” meaningful or “this is how you escape from OKC” meaningful?

Meaningful like fuck em I don't give a shit we got Wemby. 

[MNLonghornFUKM 8,817]

Yeah Durant is a terrible defender. Let's see him score against someone legit like '95 Hakeem. 
Not that I think KD is giving it playoff intensity out there.

I’m not even judging the game he’s playing in, I’m just going off of an eye test and applying that to 82 games a season and being outweighed by 40-50 lbs

[closetohumping 17,452]

14 hours ago, Aqua Buddha said:

I know it's some random gym in the off season but these are NBA guys.  Real ones.  Chet might be a player if he stays healthy over the years:

 

Not saying he can't play but I put little stock in pick up or honestly one on one games.  Have heard of non-NBA guys cooking NBA guys in Fonde.

[gsoda3 3,263]

You can't completely discount this game just because it's a pickup game. Half his shots are made against KD playing with decent effort. The takeaway is he's probably going to be unguardable with length on the perimeter. He's too tall and quick. You'll need to body him up with a grant williams type.

[PittsburghTiger 6,192]

There is some serious vintage NBA stuff on NBATV today. 

Right now is Bernard King and his 60-point game on Christmas 1984. Next up is an hour show on Wilt Chamberlain’s 100-point game in 1962, then is Milwaukee v Detroit from 1969, then 1982 Philly at Boston in Game 7 of Eastern Conference finals. Then a show about Dr. J and then one called, Mr. Russell’s House, with Bill Russell. To cap it off in 1972 Game 5 Lakers v Knicks with Chamberlain leading the Lakers to first title since moving to Los Angeles.

 

DVR worthy.

[Mitch Cumsteen 18,550]

NBA news is slow right now and probably will be until training camp, but this Harden / Philly thing bears watching.

https://sports.yahoo.com/nba-reportedly-launches-inquiry-into-james-hardens-comments-about-76ers-daryl-morey-142223868.html

Quote

The NBA wants to know the exact reason for Harden's ire. Specifically, the league is looking into whether Harden and the 76ers had a handshake agreement on a future contract that would circumvent the salary cap. If the league finds evidence that was the case, and Harden is upset because the 76ers pulled that offer off the table, the team could face punishment.

Gee NBA, ya think? Really, Morey and Harden skirted the rules? Does anybody really believe a team-first winner like Harden was going to sacrifice a nickel because he actually wanted to win? It's going to turn into another Ben Simmons like shit show once camp starts, almost assuredly. The other piece to this is Embiid and the rumblings that he wants out if they can't compete for titles. Watching Jokic win the title against his former teammate Jimmy Butler while he sat on his couch with his MVP trophy had to hurt. I will laugh hysterically if the NBA docks them draft picks and Embiid begs out. They are going to have to re-process the process. 

[gofuckyourself 8,339]

2 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

I will laugh hysterically if the NBA docks them draft picks and Embiid begs out. They are going to have to re-process the process. 

Maybe not. He can stay and try to trademark the next name as well.

Trust the Implosion?

[MNLonghornFUKM 8,817]

I wonder if hardens agent is Joe smith

[d2o 1,602]

10 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

NBA news is slow right now and probably will be until training camp, but this Harden / Philly thing bears watching.

https://sports.yahoo.com/nba-reportedly-launches-inquiry-into-james-hardens-comments-about-76ers-daryl-morey-142223868.html

Gee NBA, ya think? Really, Morey and Harden skirted the rules? Does anybody really believe a team-first winner like Harden was going to sacrifice a nickel because he actually wanted to win? It's going to turn into another Ben Simmons like shit show once camp starts, almost assuredly. The other piece to this is Embiid and the rumblings that he wants out if they can't compete for titles. Watching Jokic win the title against his former teammate Jimmy Butler while he sat on his couch with his MVP trophy had to hurt. I will laugh hysterically if the NBA docks them draft picks and Embiid begs out. They are going to have to re-process the process. 

No franchise deserves this fate more than the Sixers.     Fuck the whole org

 

[MNLonghornFUKM 8,817]

City, org, fans…. All acceptable

[d2o 1,602]

 

 

[Pam Cummings 9,645]

2 hours ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

NBA news is slow right now and probably will be until training camp, but this Harden / Philly thing bears watching.

https://sports.yahoo.com/nba-reportedly-launches-inquiry-into-james-hardens-comments-about-76ers-daryl-morey-142223868.html

Gee NBA, ya think? Really, Morey and Harden skirted the rules? Does anybody really believe a team-first winner like Harden was going to sacrifice a nickel because he actually wanted to win? It's going to turn into another Ben Simmons like shit show once camp starts, almost assuredly. The other piece to this is Embiid and the rumblings that he wants out if they can't compete for titles. Watching Jokic win the title against his former teammate Jimmy Butler while he sat on his couch with his MVP trophy had to hurt. I will laugh hysterically if the NBA docks them draft picks and Embiid begs out. They are going to have to re-process the process. 

I'm probably a bit over zealous with this take, but i think the window for Philly was not open for long and has now closed. Losing in 7 to the Raptors when Kawhi made the weirdest game winner ever was their best chance, imo. I think the process is over and they need a new one. If i were them i'd trade everyone, Embiid included, and start over.

 

I also love feasting on Philly sports misery. So, whatever happens, it will be popcorn and entertainment for me.

Edited August 21, 2023 by Pam Cummings

[Mitch Cumsteen 18,550]

1 hour ago, d2o said:

 

 

I actually like the Sixers franchise. I've never actively rooted against them. I absolutely adored Dr. J and always pulled for them against the Celtics. Andrew Toney, Darryl Dawkins, Mo Cheeks, etc. Those teams were epic. Charles Barkley was absolutely one of my favorite players of all time -- he played with such a ferocity, I couldn't help be a fan. I loved watching Iverson play -- tough as nails and gave everything he had to the game. And I really like Embiid. He's a fantastic player and he seems like a good, funny dude. That's a great, historic franchise. One of the most storied in the league.

But the Process was a horrible afront to basketball and to sports in general. I certainly get going through a rebuilding job and not being competitive for a year or two, but they deserve every last bit of karmic blow back that they get. Fuck them for trying to game the system and what they tried to do to the competitive landscape of the league. It was reprehensible what they did to their fans. I hope it serves as a cautionary tale for any other franchise that tries to pull that lame bullshit.

[d2o 1,602]

1 hour ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

I actually like the Sixers franchise. I've never actively rooted against them. I absolutely adored Dr. J and always pulled for them against the Celtics. Andrew Toney, Darryl Dawkins, Mo Cheeks, etc. Those teams were epic. Charles Barkley was absolutely one of my favorite players of all time -- he played with such a ferocity, I couldn't help be a fan. I loved watching Iverson play -- tough as nails and gave everything he had to the game. And I really like Embiid. He's a fantastic player and he seems like a good, funny dude. That's a great, historic franchise. One of the most storied in the league.

But the Process was a horrible afront to basketball and to sports in general. I certainly get going through a rebuilding job and not being competitive for a year or two, but they deserve every last bit of karmic blow back that they get. Fuck them for trying to game the system and what they tried to do to the competitive landscape of the league. It was reprehensible what they did to their fans. I hope it serves as a cautionary tale for any other franchise that tries to pull that lame bullshit.

Oh yeah the Sixers history has been incredible.  Doc, Moses, Barkley and on to Iverson lives completely separate for me.   

 

Since Hinkie started "the Process" I've rooted for nothing but their complete failure.   I've always HATED tanking so the tanking on steroids bullshit was horrible for the NBA.    As bad as it was from a competition standpoint, the overall embrace as the best way to build a team by so many respected talking heads made it even worse.

Further, I'm generally extremely "anti-hater" but over these last few yrs Embiid's unparalleled bitchassness has made me enjoy their failure more than any team I've ever known.  I hate them for making me a hater LOL

[Bartles 769]

The Process DID work, they just fucked up some of the picks, and had the misfortune of two overall No 1's who for whatever reason completely lost their will to play the sport. Even with all that, the Jimmy Butler team was right there with the Kawhi Raptors and were good enough to win the trophy. A couple other teams, including last year, were maybe Finals worthy but wouldn't have won it.

Some fans here in Philly complained at the time, but they actually built a very loyal following both for "Process guys" like Covington and McConnell, along with the new draft picks (even Fultz and Ben). The fans feel more fucked over by the NBA for forcing Hinkie out and sticking us with Colangelo.

By now, be it karma or whatever, the wheels are off and there is no competent leadership. The owners have been distracted by Fanatics, crypto/NFT/metaverse, the Redskins and now trying to build a new arena. Embiid remains a great player and hilarious troll. But he and the team are headed for some down years.

Edited August 22, 2023 by Bartles
Josh Harris "Redskins fan"

[Blotto 23,559]

Saw this story earlier, and didnt know much about the guy, so I checked Wiki to see if/where he played pro ball. Apparently he was a grad assistant under Shaka in Austin for our dismal 11-22 season in '17, so fuck him. 

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/38235601/knicks-sue-former-employee-raptors-cite-disclosure-proprietary-information

Quote

The New York Knicks on Monday sued the Toronto Raptors, members of the Raptors organization and a former Knicks employee whom they alleged "illegally procured and then disclosed proprietary information" to their Atlantic Division rival.

According to a copy of the lawsuit, which was filed in the U.S. District Court in Manhattan and was obtained by ESPN, the Knicks state that Ikechukwu Azotam, who worked for the Knicks from 2020 to 2023, sent the Raptors thousands of confidential files -- including play frequency reports, a prep book for the 2022-23 season, video scouting files, opposition research and more -- after the team began recruiting him to join their organization in summer 2023.

The Knicks accused Azotam -- who worked for the Knicks as an assistant video coordinator, then as a director of video/analytics/player development assistant -- of violating a confidentiality clause in an employment agreement and alleged that members of the Raptors "directed Azotam's actions and/or knowingly benefited from Azotam's wrongful acts."