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Living in Santa Fe, NM

jimmyjazz

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45899

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My wife and I are slowly reaching the end of our rope in Austin.  She was born and raised here, and hasn't ever lived anywhere else.  I got here as soon as I could (1982).  Neither of us are as disilllusioned with the explosive growth and inherent change as many Austinites, but at the same time, a little less daily hassle would be nice.  With our two youngest currently in school at UT, it's time to consider a move.

We originally wanted to find a beach community for eventual retirement, but for various reasons, those we find attractive are either too expensive or too far removed from our "demographic" to be optimal.  So, we're thinking about Santa Fe.  I work remote most days, even though I live 7 miles from my office.  7 or 700 doesn't make much difference, and I can fly in when I need to.

Have any surlies lived in or near Santa Fe in recent years?  We spent part of our honeymoon there many years ago, and honestly, we really enjoyed it.  It's a small city, the food is fantastic, and although we don't really enjoy cowboy & southwestern art, it seems to be pretty vibrant, regardless.

Any firsthand thoughts on daily life there?  Weather, outdoor activities, shopping, etc.?  Are the locals friendly or are Texans less than welcome?  I appreciate any input.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45899

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1 minute ago, texastough said:

If you don't like cowboy and southwestern shit you are thinking of the wrong place. Go to Mendocino or somewhere like that

Eh, fine art is pretty far down on our list of "gotta haves".  I'm more interested in learning about the people, the outdoor life, etc.  How easy is it to go skiing, for instance?  The idea of a day trip to a ski slope without dealing with hotels, etc. is pretty attractive.

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texastough

texastough 1129

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I'm not just talking about art, its the m.o. of the whole place and there's no way you'll be able to escape it.  I love Santa Fe and its got a ton of history, but if you are really thinking about moving, I would do an airbnb for a month or something, and then go back during the shoulder seasons to see what you think.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45899

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10 minutes ago, texastough said:

I'm not just talking about art, its the m.o. of the whole place and there's no way you'll be able to escape it.  I love Santa Fe and its got a ton of history, but if you are really thinking about moving, I would do an airbnb for a month or something, and then go back during the shoulder seasons to see what you think.

Yeah, we're planning on driving out there for a week or so soon.  It might not give us the total feel but it will certainly be more informative than 2 nights 20 years ago.

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Tylerocks

Tylerocks 2553

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2 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

Eh, fine art is pretty far down on our list of "gotta haves".  I'm more interested in learning about the people, the outdoor life, etc.  How easy is it to go skiing, for instance?  The idea of a day trip to a ski slope without dealing with hotels, etc. is pretty attractive.

You'd be about 2 hours from Taos and Red River ski areas

 

 

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45899

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2 minutes ago, Bolero88 said:

You might want to rename this thread. There is already a Santa Fe thread for travel and food. Check out the contributors in there. A couple of Surly members live in Santa Fe.

Done.  I'm not looking for food recs, I'm looking for daily life information.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45899

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1 minute ago, Hank Kingsley said:

I've loved visiting Santa Fe many times, but I couldn't imagine living there. Guess it all depends on your lifestyle and what you like to do socially. 

I'd be concerned that you would be bored out of your minds after a while. 

That hits on some of my concerns.  It's one thing to bail on a 2M metro area.  Doing so for 100K population is a bit extreme.

Are there any live music venues, live theater outlets, etc.?  Good swimming holes in the summer?  Bike trails?  Other?  Obviously we'll give it a test ride before pulling the trigger but it's a bit of a leap.  I'm very adaptable, I can live anywhere, but my wife? not so much.  One thing she needs is sunshine, and Santa Fe has a ton of that.

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Hank Kingsley

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1 minute ago, jimmyjazz said:

That hits on some of my concerns.  It's one thing to bail on a 2M metro area.  Doing so for 100K population is a bit extreme.

Are there any live music venues, live theater outlets, etc.?  Good swimming holes in the summer?  Bike trails?  Other?  Obviously we'll give it a test ride before pulling the trigger but it's a bit of a leap.  I'm very adaptable, I can live anywhere, but my wife? not so much.  One thing she needs is sunshine, and Santa Fe has a ton of that.

The Santa Fe Opera House is a very cool covered outdoor venue. Saw The National there a few years ago. But then we were stuck for 2 hours after the show because there were only like 3 Uber drivers in the city. 

Others can speak more expertly than me, but from what I've see the town shuts down by 10pm. Maybe one or two bars are open. The "nightlife" in Santa Fe seems to be eating at a restaurant.

A ton of older Texans have second homes in the Santa Fe area. They come for a total of maybe 1-2 months out of the year. 

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Kyrie Eleison

Kyrie Eleison 9312

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we go to SF every chance we get and are definitely thinking of pulling the trigger on the same thing in the very near future.  my wife is headed there this week to stay with a friend, and from the times we've been we've never lacked for anything to do...hiking, fishing, skiing, camping, rafting, etc.  there's enough mountain hamlets close by to day trip visit to keep things interesting, and Albuquerque is only 60 miles and shithelldamn i commute that twice a week already going to one of my offices.  fantastic food scene, farmer's markets, festivals, theatre, etc.  we love it.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45899

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4 minutes ago, Kyrie Eleison said:

we go to SF every chance we get and are definitely thinking of pulling the trigger on the same thing in the very near future.  my wife is headed there this week to stay with a friend, and from the times we've been we've never lacked for anything to do...hiking, fishing, skiing, camping, rafting, etc.  there's enough mountain hamlets close by to day trip visit to keep things interesting, and Albuquerque is only 60 miles and shithelldamn i commute that twice a week already going to one of my offices.  fantastic food scene, farmer's markets, festivals, theatre, etc.  we love it.

Yeah, I imagine ABQ is large enough to offer some alternative "big city" options.  I do recall interviewing at Sandia after college and thinking it was a total dump, though.

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orange dream

orange dream 1247

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We were there in March of this year for the first time in probably 40 years.  It certainly has its charms.

If you go, you damn well better have a hat similar to this or buy one as soon as you get there.  I swear to God 80% of the adult males I saw walking through neighborhoods, etc. were wearing one.  Leather coat with fringe and bolo tie are optional.

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ0eCYFM7FhD3T1rAIUfuE

Ski Santa Fe would be great for day trips.  Golf (if that is appealing) probably mid-April through October or early November.  Lots of festivals, etc. but several are cowboy/southwestern adjacent.

They have an Allsups if you need your burrito fix.

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Carl Spackler

Carl Spackler 3480

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Bear in mind that you'd be at high altitude (right around 7K feet) and it does get cold there in the winter.  The average daily low in December and January is in the upper teens according to the climate data I've seen.  Santa Fe averages around 20 inches of snow per year according to that same data.  Your wife hasn't lived anywhere but Austin, so I've got to think the winter in Santa Fe, such as it is, would be a big adjustment for her.  Is she okay with that?  It's one thing to go there in the summer and hang out for a week in nice weather.  It's another to live there year round.  Maybe she'd be okay with it, but at the very least it is something that should be a topic of discussion and contemplation. 

FWIW, my situation is similar to yours, i.e., I can live in most places and be content, whereas the wife (no pics) is a lot choosier.  Given that she was born and raised in SoCal, I know she would put the kibosh on living anywhere that gets as cold in the winter as Santa Fe.

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gmr548

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My wife and I are slowly reaching the end of our rope in Austin.  She was born and raised here, and hasn't ever lived anywhere else.  I got here as soon as I could (1982).  Neither of us are as disilllusioned with the explosive growth and inherent change as many Austinites, but at the same time, a little less daily hassle would be nice.  With our two youngest currently in school at UT, it's time to consider a move.
We originally wanted to find a beach community for eventual retirement, but for various reasons, those we find attractive are either too expensive or too far removed from our "demographic" to be optimal.  So, we're thinking about Santa Fe.  I work remote most days, even though I live 7 miles from my office.  7 or 700 doesn't make much difference, and I can fly in when I need to.
Have any surlies lived in or near Santa Fe in recent years?  We spent part of our honeymoon there many years ago, and honestly, we really enjoyed it.  It's a small city, the food is fantastic, and although we don't really enjoy cowboy & southwestern art, it seems to be pretty vibrant, regardless.
Any firsthand thoughts on daily life there?  Weather, outdoor activities, shopping, etc.?  Are the locals friendly or are Texans less than welcome?  I appreciate any input.

How’s your health? Healthcare in NM is not great. For complicated issues you may have to travel to Denver or Texas.
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Carl Spackler

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2 minutes ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

My short lived career as a comedian included New Mexico.

Nobody ever longed for old Mexico.  They have Hobbs, but no Calvin. White Sands?  Sure, a Caucasian desert is just what the world needs.  Carlsbad, but the rest is worse.  
 

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Kyrie Eleison

Kyrie Eleison 9312

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8 minutes ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

My short lived career as a comedian included New Mexico.

Nobody ever longed for old Mexico.  They have Hobbs, but no Calvin. White Sands?  Sure, a Caucasian desert is just what the world needs.  Carlsbad, but the rest is worse.  
 

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nnm

nnm 36360

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3 hours ago, Butch Had Not said:

@nnm

I grew up an hour north of SF, and after undergrad in Texas, went back there for law school and practiced in SF for my first 10 years.  I haven't lived in SF for 20 years, but visit often, have family in and around the area, and still have real estate in the area.

Santa Fe is a wonderful place.  It has a wonderful climate, wonderful food, wonderful people, wonderful arts, culture, outdoor activities, and a great vibe.  The magic of a crisp autumn evening, with a bite in the air, snow on the Sangre de Cristos, and smell of roasting green chilé is something I miss terribly.  I miss the food, the climate, the people, the feel of it. 

I love New Mexico.  I just buried both of my parents at our family ranch, one in 2021 and the other two weeks ago, among 6 generations of my mom's family.  I will always go back to NM.  In fact, I'm going there tomorrow for the memorial service of one of my parents' closest friends, a second father to me--one of those guys who showed and taught me how to be a man, by living a full life of integrity, love, and adventure.  

As much as I love NM, I also can't stand living in NM.  

Santa Fe is also a terrible place.  It has terrible cultural conflicts embedded in the vaunted "tri-culture" of Hispanic, Anglo, and Native American populations.  It has terrible poverty, class division, and infrastructure.  The economy has only two sectors--government and tourism.  The professional class (doctors, professors, engineers, lawyers, etc.) are massively underpaid relative to their peers in surrounding states, so that portion of the economy remains small, with a constant brain drain.  There is a huge "expat" population of wealthy Texans, Californians, etc., with second homes there, and the balance of the population is a small remote upper class, very small middle class, and a very large segment of people on the edge.  Its local politics are laughably small town and provincial.  NM schools are perennially near the bottom of the U.S. indices (together with Mississippi, Alabama, Louisiana), and SF public schools are near the bottom of NM lists.  That may not mean much to you if you don't have school-age kids anymore or the means to send kids to private school, but it means that the youth culture is very challenging, which trickles out in unexpected ways in the service economy, in the vibe around town, in the interactions on the street.  

If you're a person of faith, you will find Santa Fe a dark place.  

Overall, my recommendation is to live part-time in NM/Santa Fe.  The politics, economy, and general malaise of the state may drive you crazy otherwise.  Keep a place in a relatively sane place like Texas, and alternate between the two.  

Edit:  I enthusiastically endorse the post from @gmr548.  The healthcare system is abysmal.  Really, really, really bad.  There are of course good individual docs in SF and ABQ, but both emergency medicine and options for treatment for serious conditions (cancer, etc.) are significantly sub-par when compared to Texas.  There's only one hospital in Santa Fe, St. Vincent's.  It has the local nickname "St. Victims" for very good reasons.  

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Judge Roybeanbag

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19 minutes ago, nnm said:

I grew up an hour north of SF, and after undergrad in Texas, went back there for law school and practiced in SF for my first 10 years.  I haven't lived in SF for 20 years, but visit often, have family in and around the area, and still have real estate in the area.

Santa Fe is a wonderful place.  It has a wonderful climate, wonderful food, wonderful people, wonderful arts, culture, outdoor activities, and a great vibe.  The magic of a crisp autumn evening, with a bite in the air, snow on the Sangre de Cristos, and smell of roasting green chilé is something I miss terribly.  I miss the food, the climate, the people, the feel of it. 

I love New Mexico.  I just buried both of my parents at our family ranch, one in 2021 and the other two weeks ago, among 6 generations of my mom's family.  I will always go back to NM.  In fact, I'm going there tomorrow for the memorial service of one of my parents' closest friends, a second father to me--one of those guys who showed and taught me how to be a man, by living a full life of integrity, love, and adventure.  

As much as I love NM, I also can't stand living in NM.  

Santa Fe is also a terrible place.  It has terrible cultural conflicts embedded in the vaunted "tri-culture" of Hispanic, Anglo, and Native American populations.  It has terrible poverty, class division, and infrastructure.  The economy has only two sectors--government and tourism.  The professional class (doctors, professors, engineers, lawyers, etc.) are massively underpaid relative to their peers in surrounding states, so that portion of the economy remains small, with a constant brain drain.  There is a huge "expat" population of wealthy Texans, Californians, etc., with second homes there, and the balance of the population is a small remote upper class, very small middle class, and a very large segment of people on the edge.  Its local politics are laughably small town and provincial.  NM schools are perennially near the bottom of the U.S. indices (together with Mississippi, Alabama, Louisiana), and SF public schools are near the bottom of NM lists.  That may not mean much to you if you don't have school-age kids anymore or the means to send kids to private school, but it means that the youth culture is very challenging, which trickles out in unexpected ways in the service economy, in the vibe around town, in the interactions on the street.  

If you're a person of faith, you will find Santa Fe a dark place.  

Overall, my recommendation is to live part-time in NM/Santa Fe.  The politics, economy, and general malaise of the state may drive you crazy otherwise.  Keep a place in a relatively sane place like Texas, and alternate between the two.  

Edit:  I enthusiastically endorse the post from @gmr548.  The healthcare system is abysmal.  Really, really, really bad.  There are of course good individual docs in SF and ABQ, but both emergency medicine and options for treatment for serious conditions (cancer, etc.) are significantly sub-par when compared to Texas.  There's only one hospital in Santa Fe, St. Vincent's.  It has the local nickname "St. Victim's" for very good reasons.  

This is why I love this board.  Unadulterated honesty from a person who’s lived it. 

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Kyrie Eleison

Kyrie Eleison 9312

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30 minutes ago, nnm said:

I grew up an hour north of SF, and after undergrad in Texas, went back there for law school and practiced in SF for my first 10 years.  I haven't lived in SF for 20 years, but visit often, have family in and around the area, and still have real estate in the area.

Santa Fe is a wonderful place.  It has a wonderful climate, wonderful food, wonderful people, wonderful arts, culture, outdoor activities, and a great vibe.  The magic of a crisp autumn evening, with a bite in the air, snow on the Sangre de Cristos, and smell of roasting green chilé is something I miss terribly.  I miss the food, the climate, the people, the feel of it. 

I love New Mexico.  I just buried both of my parents at our family ranch, one in 2021 and the other two weeks ago, among 6 generations of my mom's family.  I will always go back to NM.  In fact, I'm going there tomorrow for the memorial service of one of my parents' closest friends, a second father to me--one of those guys who showed and taught me how to be a man, by living a full life of integrity, love, and adventure.  

As much as I love NM, I also can't stand living in NM.  

Santa Fe is also a terrible place.  It has terrible cultural conflicts embedded in the vaunted "tri-culture" of Hispanic, Anglo, and Native American populations.  It has terrible poverty, class division, and infrastructure.  The economy has only two sectors--government and tourism.  The professional class (doctors, professors, engineers, lawyers, etc.) are massively underpaid relative to their peers in surrounding states, so that portion of the economy remains small, with a constant brain drain.  There is a huge "expat" population of wealthy Texans, Californians, etc., with second homes there, and the balance of the population is a small remote upper class, very small middle class, and a very large segment of people on the edge.  Its local politics are laughably small town and provincial.  NM schools are perennially near the bottom of the U.S. indices (together with Mississippi, Alabama, Louisiana), and SF public schools are near the bottom of NM lists.  That may not mean much to you if you don't have school-age kids anymore or the means to send kids to private school, but it means that the youth culture is very challenging, which trickles out in unexpected ways in the service economy, in the vibe around town, in the interactions on the street.  

If you're a person of faith, you will find Santa Fe a dark place.  

Overall, my recommendation is to live part-time in NM/Santa Fe.  The politics, economy, and general malaise of the state may drive you crazy otherwise.  Keep a place in a relatively sane place like Texas, and alternate between the two.  

Edit:  I enthusiastically endorse the post from @gmr548.  The healthcare system is abysmal.  Really, really, really bad.  There are of course good individual docs in SF and ABQ, but both emergency medicine and options for treatment for serious conditions (cancer, etc.) are significantly sub-par when compared to Texas.  There's only one hospital in Santa Fe, St. Vincent's.  It has the local nickname "St. Victim's" for very good reasons.  

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nnm

nnm 36360

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21 minutes ago, next2naus said:

please tell us more about your "Demographic"

OK.  Born in Venezuela.  Mom from NM, dad from Texas.  Bi-cultural, spoke Spanish and English in the home.  Grew up very poor, on a farm, with both parents doing public service.  Which side of me would you like to denigrate?

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105095

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OK.  Born in Venezuela.  Mom from NM, dad from Texas.  Bi-cultural, spoke Spanish and English in the home.  Grew up very poor, on a farm, with both parents doing public service.  Which side of me would you like to denigrate?

I mean….all sides. This is Surly.
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tx 3 putt

tx 3 putt 76905

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11 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

My wife and I are slowly reaching the end of our rope in Austin.  She was born and raised here, and hasn't ever lived anywhere else.  I got here as soon as I could (1982).  Neither of us are as disilllusioned with the explosive growth and inherent change as many Austinites, but at the same time, a little less daily hassle would be nice.  With our two youngest currently in school at UT, it's time to consider a move.

We originally wanted to find a beach community for eventual retirement, but for various reasons, those we find attractive are either too expensive or too far removed from our "demographic" to be optimal.  So, we're thinking about Santa Fe.  I work remote most days, even though I live 7 miles from my office.  7 or 700 doesn't make much difference, and I can fly in when I need to.

Have any surlies lived in or near Santa Fe in recent years?  We spent part of our honeymoon there many years ago, and honestly, we really enjoyed it.  It's a small city, the food is fantastic, and although we don't really enjoy cowboy & southwestern art, it seems to be pretty vibrant, regardless.

Any firsthand thoughts on daily life there?  Weather, outdoor activities, shopping, etc.?  Are the locals friendly or are Texans less than welcome?  I appreciate any input.


look at Jamica Beach

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45899

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1 hour ago, nnm said:

I grew up an hour north of SF, and after undergrad in Texas, went back there for law school and practiced in SF for my first 10 years.  I haven't lived in SF for 20 years, but visit often, have family in and around the area, and still have real estate in the area.

<snip>

Great post, thank you.

We're not gonna maintain two places, that's not in the cards, but we'll take your advice (and others) to heart.  So far our health is good, but you don't enter the "parents of college grads" years without shit eventually breaking down.

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ztejas

ztejas 43418

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2 minutes ago, nnm said:

Never watched this show, haven’t hit play on this clip. But why do Summer’s pants have a bulge?

She has a fat vagina. Duh.

I wish the clip didn't cut off, because the best part of the joke is her dad saying after "it's either code for crystal meth or a gateway to it"

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