being offended

[Horn of Gabriel 1616]

Also

 

[Helobious 9462]

7 minutes ago, Horn of Gabriel said:

Again, making fun of someone's physical disability or shortcomings is perfectly acceptable if they are a "bad person."  It's not enough to simply call out the actions they take which we don't like, or their stances on issues - we can poke fun at their disability because they're a bully.

Do you know how piss poor this is and just not care?  Or do you justify it because "the other side does it too," and "I really don't like the Mean Governor?"

You have to admit he’s a unique case though. His disability netted him a lifetime of wealth, which helped him build a platform and eventually a way to influence the lives of millions. Hardly anyone has that chance, disabled or not. If people want to call him a silly name I don’t feel sorry for him about that. I can’t imagine he does either. 

[immamac 42865]

9 minutes ago, ztejas said:

What if I call Greg Abbott a retard?

I actually laughed out loud pretty hard. 

[Horn of Gabriel 1616]

1 minute ago, Helobious said:

You have to admit he’s a unique case though. His disability netted him a lifetime of wealth, which helped him build a platform and eventually a way to influence the lives of millions. Hardly anyone has that chance, disabled or not. If people want to call him a silly name I don’t feel sorry for him about that. I can’t imagine he does either. 

So...America isn't equitable in outcomes and some people end up better than others?  Agreed!

Disagree however that calling him a "silly name," in reference to his disability is OK...

[Pam Cummings 9645]

1 hour ago, Js1 said:

All I recall from the original thread was the use of the word followed a bunch of bitching about the WNBA. 

It was all very childish "yelling at clouds' bullshit. 

A woman did a cool sports thing and drew comparisons to what guys had done. You know how that goes.

[South Austin 52519]

Can I still laugh at this gif when someone posts it in the Greg Abbott thread?

[Pam Cummings 9645]

7 minutes ago, Horn of Gabriel said:

So...America isn't equitable in outcomes and some people end up better than others?  Agreed!

Disagree however that calling him a "silly name," in reference to his disability is OK...

I agree that it is disparaging. My mom hates Greg Abbott and would never make fun of his disability because her mom was in an accident that left her paralyzed.

 

But, i simply don't care if anyone disparages him. He has used his influence to make things worse for people like him. So be it.

[Bottlecap 1523]

5 hours ago, Orale said:

I rarely get offended by anything. But I feel protective of those in society who are vulnerable. When I hear someone use cruel language that has historically been used to oppress and demean a vulnerable group, I'm not going to get in their face (assuming they're not actually using it towards someone in that group directly), but I sure as hell will think that person is a piece of shit and think much less of their character. I'm far from perfect and I think people can change and improve, so I try not to shame others or even judge them too harshly in my mind. But I think it's fair and healthy to be offended by certain language and behavior if its motive is to be cruel.

 

5 hours ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Here’s my actual thoughts about this one. Not many people are actually, literally offended and clutching their pearls and most of us flung this one around at some point. But as it’s been explained by people with special needs and their advocates— when you use the word “retarded” as a synonym for something that’s really dumb or broken or not cool or FUBAR, then by extension you’re saying that so are people with intellectual disabilities. And that’s a deeply hurtful way to think or talk about real people, even if you don’t mean it that way. 
 

So people telling you “maybe don’t” are not hyperventilating or pearl clinchers. They’re offering you a chance to be just a little bit cooler and kinder yourself by choosing better and more creative insults. You can take it or not.  But if you don’t, then you don’t get to argue with the rest of the world about how they look at you. They’re going to think you’re super un-cool and unkind. 

 

4 hours ago, troph said:

You’re retarded or that’s retarded (referring to what someone says) absolutely is an insult of the recipient and by extension an insult to anyone who has a developmental or cognitive impairment. It doesn’t matter if that doesn’t offend (read upset) you.  It doesn’t matter if it doesn’t upset me. It’s not cool to talk that way. 

I've only read the first page and i don't have the stomach to keep reading to its likely demise by the 4th page, but I just wanted to say that I'm so happy that I share an online community with people who feel this way.

I've worked with intellectually disabled children and adults for 22 years and its a shit paying job and sometimes thankless, but apart from the communicative development of between kids and their families is the realization of many in the general community that the r-word is so old fashioned and generally disgusting. I was generally ok with the word being unintentionally amended and surly-memed to "regarded" but now I'm seeing the old word pop up much more and even varied to "autistic". Really? I spoke up once about it, then was summarily shamed for showing consternation about it. Its surly, so ok, whatever. 

I think Orale summed it up perfectly, quoted above: "I feel protective of those in society who are vulnerable. When I hear someone use cruel language that has historically been used to oppress and demean a vulnerable group, I'm not going to get in their face (assuming they're not actually using it towards someone in that group directly), but I sure as hell will think that person is a piece of shit and think much less of their character."

[ultimaton 2981]

1 hour ago, shadow_operative said:

retarded isn't a slur, it's a medical diagnosis, and simply an updated version of words like idiot, moron, and imbecile. people can use it as a slur, but the word in and of itself is not a slur, which the n word is.

Coming out of high school (2000) I worked at group home for the developmentally disabled and even back then the use of retarded even in a clinical setting had largely been phased out. So I'm not sure that's as strong an argument as you seem to think it is. 

[Sandman 3403]

My dogs are annoying assholes and I use every insult and slur I know against them, almost every day. They take it like a champ.

[Deej 76830]

49 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

It’s amazing to see people try to defend their “hot wheels” slur and unconscionable behavior by trying to couch it in terms like “context”. Racists everywhere would be proud of the pretzel bending logic. 

I think I understand the rules now, and have developed a handy useful guide for those of you blissfully unaware of the proper conditions for disparaging those with a disability, or really anyone with an affliction of some sort.

The Politically Opinionated Person’s Guide to Disparagement and Slurs

1. Does the person have something about them physically or ethnically or race related you can make fun of? Fat? Minority? Disability? Yes! Check. Go to next step  

2. Is there a strong historical significance to the slur or disparagement? No. Great, check. Go to next step.  

3. Is it a person you disagree with or believe is a bad person? Yes! Check. Go to next step.

4. Is the slur witty? Yes! Check. 

You may use “hot wheels” and other compliant slurs, AND continue to fight for justice for all the other people with afflictions other than what you chose to disparage. 
 

I’m so glad we were able to clear that up. 

I'm good with using "hot wheels" to describe a guy who is using his power to disenfranchise every single minority group that he can. 

[BabaYaga 15301]

So just to recap, we can use slurs on political opponents, but not everyday citizens?  

[shadow_operative 15932]

6 minutes ago, ultimaton said:

Coming out of high school (2000) I worked at group home for the developmentally disabled and even back then the use of retarded even in a clinical setting had largely been phased out. So I'm not sure that's as strong an argument as you seem to think it is. 

the argument is simply that the word itself was not invented solely for the purpose of being used as a slur, which differentiates it from the n word. so yeah, that's a pretty strong argument.

[Horn of Gabriel 1616]

4 minutes ago, Pam Cummings said:

I agree that it is disparaging. My mom hates Greg Abbott and would never make fun of his disability because her mom was in an accident that left her paralyzed.

 

But, i simply don't care if anyone disparages him. He has used his influence to make things worse for people like him. So be it.

Thank you for the honest response.  It's disparaging, it's a slur, and I don't care because I don't like him.

With that freedom in mind, if we support people in this thought process, are we cool with applying this standard to Senator Tammy Duckworth D-IL?  I assume that she takes political positions that the right disagrees with around protection of unborn life, etc etc etc.  I'm also sure that as passionate as you are about Gov. Greg Abbott's politics, there are probably also people who feel equally passionate about Sen. Duckworth's positions.  We cool if people on the the other side are calling her "ole' stumpy" or "hot wheels?"

I hope the answer is "no" and that no is driven from a place of respect for disabled humans' dignity instead of "Yes because I agree with her policies and not his."

FTR I'm against name calling or slurring either of them...

[ztejas 43476]

1 minute ago, Horn of Gabriel said:

"ole' stumpy"

[troph 24854]

4 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

i mean, we all celebrate norm macdonald still today, and he used that word all of the time. the dedicated thread to him is full of clips of him using the word. so for me, this place (surly) can't both be a place that celebrates norm macdonald but then also turns around and says that there is *never* an excuse for using the r word. intent and context mean everything, and i find that taking a hard line one something just completely removes both of those factors.

you can think someone is funny but now understand that word doesn't work anymore. I often don't watch old clips, old movies, etc. for these very reasons. these older clips are marginally forgivable based on historical context re language, its a problem when it's current comedians, etc. 

[troph 24854]

2 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

i await the moral outrage aimed at this despicable post. 

 that's a POS post from him imo.

[Pam Cummings 9645]

6 minutes ago, Horn of Gabriel said:

Thank you for the honest response.  It's disparaging, it's a slur, and I don't care because I don't like him.

With that freedom in mind, if we support people in this thought process, are we cool with applying this standard to Senator Tammy Duckworth D-IL?  I assume that she takes political positions that the right disagrees with around protection of unborn life, etc etc etc.  I'm also sure that as passionate as you are about Gov. Greg Abbott's politics, there are probably also people who feel equally passionate about Sen. Duckworth's positions.  We cool if people on the the other side are calling her "ole' stumpy" or "hot wheels?"

I hope the answer is "no" and that no is driven from a place of respect for disabled humans' dignity instead of "Yes because I agree with her policies and not his."

FTR I'm against name calling or slurring either of them...

I'm definitely not for it. But i think what a lot of this discussion tends to ignore is the basic human psychology of "if you tell me not to do something, it makes me want to do it more". People tend to want to do the thing they are not supposed to do. So it becomes a task of differentiating between those types and the people who are just complete dickheads who want to put others down to make themselves feel better.

Edited July 18, 2023 by Pam Cummings

[Da Fino 2783]

51 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

I see the offenders just continue to dig a deeper and deeper hole, rather than just admit, for once in their life, that they are wrong and pledge to do better. 

Greg Abbott is a terrible person, but when you use that slur, you disparage all of those in wheel chairs, just like fatty, n word, slant eyed, etc. It is the continued use of the term that reinforces the use of it. 

We can't say "fatty" now?

[BabaYaga 15301]

Just now, Da Fino said:

We can't say "fatty" now?

[troph 24854]

the idea that anyone who is not in the class of people described by the potential slur can say the term is not a slur is preposterous.

 

 

[Da Fino 2783]

4 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Take it easy, it's probably just your meds causing it. 

[South Austin 52519]

13 minutes ago, Horn of Gabriel said:

We cool if people on the the other side are calling her "ole' stumpy"

You apparently have a knack for this.

[troph 24854]

as for Abbott - I'd prefer if I stayed with Michelle Obama's approach of when he goes low I go high, but fuck that asshole and his brigade of trans and gay hating fuckwads. those assholes are driving me and my people out of Texas and turning Texas into a larger version of Bakersfield, California. so fuck them straight to hell.

[Gatorubet 30246]

57 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

I see the offenders just continue to dig a deeper and deeper hole, rather than just admit, for once in their life, that they are wrong and pledge to do better. 

Greg Abbott is a terrible person, but when you use that slur, you disparage all of those in wheel chairs, just like fatty, n word, slant eyed, etc. It is the continued use of the term that reinforces the use of it. 

What if his wheels are, in fact, hot?

Using your rule would be lying.

[Brothahorn 10087]

1 hour ago, closetohumping said:

Semantics.  I think you know better and you're just being argumentative.  The word "negro" is in Webster's dictionary but there would be a lot of issues if I call every black person I met that.  Depending on context and tone especially.  

 

1 hour ago, Macanudo said:

And then try and use Negroid.  Some words just need to not be said.   Webster's defintions.

Negro

noun

Ne·gro ˈnē-(ˌ)grō 

 

pluralNegroes

1

dated, often offensive : a person of Black African ancestry

 

2

dated, often offensive : a member of a group of people formerly considered to constitute a race (see RACE entry 1 sense 1a) of humans having African ancestry and classified according to physical traits (such as dark skin pigmentation)

 

Negro adjective dated, often offensive

Negroid 

ˈnē-ˌgrȯid 

 adjective or noun

 or less commonly negroid

dated, often offensive

Negroness 

ˈnē-grō-nəs 

 noun dated, often offensive

 

Man, if you called me a negro, I would know that you are retarded. Because that would be one of the dumbest attempts at an insult I have ever heard. 

[mchookem 16336]

still funny as hell (well, until the latter started becoming a documentary). 

could either be made today? doubtful. 

 

[Paul Wesley 3278]

13 minutes ago, Da Fino said:

We can't say "fatty" now?

Person of mass

[ultimaton 2981]

2 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

the argument is simply that the word itself was not invented solely for the purpose of being used as a slur, which differentiates it from the n word. so yeah, that's a pretty strong argument.

Nope, and I'm embarrassed for you that you seem to think so. The english language is filled with words that used to have one meaning or context and now they have another, and retard is one of those words. There are people on this board and in this thread who have explained several times over the years as to why they find the use of that word in that context harmful, not because they want to be part of polite society but because they have a loved one directly impacted by its use. It really isn't that difficult of a concept to grasp and if you allowed yourself to calm down and think rationally for once instead of letting your offense at others being offended drive you, I think you're probably capable of understanding that. 

[Deej 76830]

23 minutes ago, Horn of Gabriel said:

Thank you for the honest response.  It's disparaging, it's a slur, and I don't care because I don't like him.

With that freedom in mind, if we support people in this thought process, are we cool with applying this standard to Senator Tammy Duckworth D-IL?  I assume that she takes political positions that the right disagrees with around protection of unborn life, etc etc etc.  I'm also sure that as passionate as you are about Gov. Greg Abbott's politics, there are probably also people who feel equally passionate about Sen. Duckworth's positions.  We cool if people on the the other side are calling her "ole' stumpy" or "hot wheels?"

I hope the answer is "no" and that no is driven from a place of respect for disabled humans' dignity instead of "Yes because I agree with her policies and not his."

FTR I'm against name calling or slurring either of them...

Did she go out of her way to make sure others couldn't cash in like Abbott did?

Edited July 18, 2023 by Deej

[Beau Vine 54254]

2 minutes ago, ultimaton said:

Nope, and I'm embarrassed for you that you seem to think so. The english language is filled with words that used to have one meaning or context and now they have another, and retard is one of those words. There are people on this board and in this thread who have explained several times over the years as to why they find the use of that word in that context harmful, not because they want to be part of polite society but because they have a loved one directly impacted by its use. It really isn't that difficult of a concept to grasp and if you allowed yourself to calm down and think rationally for once instead of letting your offense at others being offended drive you, I think you're probably capable of understanding that. 

[closetohumping 17449]

5 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

 

 

Man, if you called me a negro, I would know that you are retarded. Because that would be one of the dumbest attempts at an insult I have ever heard. 

I have far too much class and dignity to use a word like that.  I also happen to be an avid practitioner of juijitsu and a third dan black belt in Kenpo.  Take it easy amigo.  I mean buddy.  

[BabaYaga 15301]

4 minutes ago, Paul Wesley said:

Person of mass

[Macanudo 12989]

3 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

I have far too much class and dignity to use a word like that.  I also happen to be an avid practitioner of juijitsu and a third dan black belt in Kenpo.  Take it easy amigo.  I mean buddy.  

Who you calling buddy, pal?    You feel me, Poindexter?

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4976]

3 hours ago, Guadaloopy said:

It's not so much that language has evolved so much as previously unheard people are finally finding a voice to express how labels and language have hurt them.  When you use a certain word as a defining characteristic of an individual, and then use that same word to casually express negativity towards other things, that transfers back to the individual whether intended or not.  It's not hard to understand unless you just don't want to.

Which is also why we can still call people dumb.

[Newdoc 3448]

You know those threads where you think “I’m going to regret clicking this?” 

[Gatorubet 30246]

29 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

So just to recap, we can use slurs on political opponents, but not everyday citizens?  

WWOSD?

 

[Lurch 5931]

You know those threads where you think “I’m going to regret clicking this?” 

Whatever you do, DONT REPLY as that will just add it to your Participating/Following list.

[Gatorubet 30246]

44 minutes ago, Horn of Gabriel said:

We cool if people on the the other side are calling her "ole' stumpy" 

That would be ageist. 

[Dbeasy 15068]

53 minutes ago, Sandman said:

My dogs are annoying assholes and I use every insult and slur I know against them, almost every day. They take it like a champ.

[Post Oak 20245]

1 hour ago, BehoId, The Underminer! said:

Well, Post Oak, I'm sure Abbott thinks of you particularly as a bully.

 

[Wally Pryor 5261]

1 hour ago, Dbeasy said:

Greg Abbott is a terrible person, but when you use that slur, you disparage all of those in wheel chairs, just like slant eyed, etc. 

Yes, sum ting wong with that. 

['stache 21819]

1 hour ago, Dbeasy said:

I see the offenders just continue to dig a deeper and deeper hole, rather than just admit, for once in their life, that they are wrong and pledge to do better. 

Greg Abbott is a terrible person, but when you use that slur, you disparage all of those in wheel chairs, just like fatty, n word, slant eyed, etc. It is the continued use of the term that reinforces the use of it. 

Nah, I’m good. OPs question was answered within the first dozen or so responses.  Say retard all you want, but don’t be surprised if people think you’re an asshole. It works if you don’t really care, but OP super duper cared, so much so he started a whole new thread. If you think I’m a hypocrite or an asshole for mocking Abbott and not Duckworth, your opinion of me means literally nothing. The fact that you’re “both sides”ing this makes me care even less. 

[Beau Vine 54254]

3 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

no, y'all wrecked the thread because you absolutely could not handle hearing any criticism of the show. exactly the same as the rick and morty thread. i mean look at your own words that i'm quoting here- you and everyone else wanted me to leave the thread simply because i didn't blindly fellate the show. that's not me wrecking the thread, that's a whole gang of y'all being childish and hypersensitive.

You sound offended.  Are you offended?

[shadow_operative 15932]

23 minutes ago, ultimaton said:

Nope, and I'm embarrassed for you that you seem to think so. The english language is filled with words that used to have one meaning or context and now they have another, and retard is one of those words. There are people on this board and in this thread who have explained several times over the years as to why they find the use of that word in that context harmful, not because they want to be part of polite society but because they have a loved one directly impacted by its use. It really isn't that difficult of a concept to grasp and if you allowed yourself to calm down and think rationally for once instead of letting your offense at others being offended drive you, I think you're probably capable of understanding that. 

yeah well you and i are just going to have to disagree that retard and the n word are even in the same ballpark. there's a reason that one of those words has been typed out repeatedly in this thread and the other hasn't been typed out once. one word is not at all uncommon in that is was once not used as an insult and then later on did start being used as an insult. the other word was born out of such a deep hatred for a certain type of person that it was invented as a means of enhancing real life cruelty, enslavement, and genocide. like i said, those words are not even in the same ballpark.

also, i almost passed out from the sheer weight of the irony of you (and so many others) sitting here lecturing me about how i don't understand the power of these words. a dude earlier in this thread talked shit to me about my mental illness and my medication and nobody here batted an eye. yet you all sit here and lecture to me from your fake ass high horse when in reality, as @Dbeasy has been saying all along, this is nothing more than selective moral outrage.

you have a loved one who has mental disabilities so you pretend to "stand up for what's right/what you believe in/what society has decided is acceptable" whenever you hear the word "retarded", but you have absolutely zero problem with someone taking pot shots at me about my mental illness. so many of you are so  completely and transparently full of shit, only you can't see it because you're too busy preaching to others and praising yourselves for "standing up for what's right." congrats on your fake morals and your high horse i guess. 

[Beau Vine 54254]

3 hours ago, Degenerate Gardner said:

Personally, I’m offended by the lack of quality average white guy slurs. Cracker, ofay, peckerwood none of it lands.

I had never heard of "ofay."  And then one night, my best friend and I looked it up and now it's what we call each other.

[Beau Vine 54254]

4 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

how many of y'all are going to engage me only to eventually announce that you refuse to read my responses? LOL. way to prove that you're the adult here. can't even handle a differing opinion. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

3 hours ago, DaysOff said:

Take your meds.

not only have none of you said a single thing about this, this post actually has pos rep. the absolute gall to pretend to have morals and to proselytize to others about said morals when it concerns something you care about (mentally disabled people) while in the very same thread completely ignoring/advocating this is astounding. 

you all objectively do not have the moral superiority you claim to have, you just don't like people saying the word "retard" because it affects you personally. what an absolute joke. 

[Brothahorn 10087]

I have far too much class and dignity to use a word like that.  I also happen to be an avid practitioner of juijitsu and a third dan black belt in Kenpo.  Take it easy amigo.  I mean buddy.  

[Celery Man 20968]

43 minutes ago, troph said:

as for Abbott - I'd prefer if I stayed with Michelle Obama's approach of when he goes low I go high