being offended

[Brothahorn 10087]

I had never heard of "ofay."  And then one night, my best friend and I looked it up and now it's what we call each other.

TIL

[Dbeasy 15068]

3 minutes ago, 'stache said:

Nah, I’m good. OPs question was answered within the first dozen or so responses.  Say retard all you want, but don’t be surprised if people think you’re an asshole. It works if you don’t really care, but OP super duper cared, so much so he started a whole new thread. If you think I’m a hypocrite or an asshole for mocking Abbott and not Duckworth, your opinion of me means literally nothing. The fact that you’re “both sides”ing this makes me care even less. 

I’ve never advocated the use of retard so yet again you’re wrong. There is no both sides argument here. It’s all wrong. To knowingly be a hypocrite on this topic tells everyone exactly who you are as a person.

['stache 21819]

2 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

I’ve never advocated the use of retard so yet again you’re wrong. There is no both sides argument here. It’s all wrong. To knowingly be a hypocrite on this topic tells everyone exactly who you are as a person.

[Beau Vine 54253]

5 hours ago, South Austin said:

My poor mom is denigrated on an hourly basis on this forum.  I'm the last guy here who is offended.

To be fair, this forum is not the only place where your mom is denigrated on an hourly basis.

[crash_davis 23113]

6 pages....

 

Everyday I'm pretty sure that there's shit on this site which offends at least one person. Usually nothing is done in malice. It's one of the reasons why this is such a great site. 

Don't take shit too seriously and you probably won't get offended. If you do, it's prob your own damn fault.

[Celery Man 20966]

btw we're slipping if this hasn't been linked

 

[closetohumping 17449]

4 minutes ago, Celery Man said:

btw we're slipping if this hasn't been linked

 

What does this guy know?

[royiv 9325]

14 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

not only have none of you said a single thing about this, this post actually has pos rep. the absolute gall to pretend to have morals and to proselytize to others about said morals when it concerns something you care about (mentally disabled people) while in the very same thread completely ignoring/advocating this is astounding. 

you all objectively do not have the moral superiority you claim to have, you just don't like people saying the word "retard" because it affects you personally. what an absolute joke. 

Yo, both @troph and I said it was a bad post. Anyone who pos reps it is a moron. It's been ignored by pretty much everyone because it was a bad post.

[troph 24851]

31 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

not only have none of you said a single thing about this, this post actually has pos rep. the absolute gall to pretend to have morals and to proselytize to others about said morals when it concerns something you care about (mentally disabled people) while in the very same thread completely ignoring/advocating this is astounding. 

you all objectively do not have the moral superiority you claim to have, you just don't like people saying the word "retard" because it affects you personally. what an absolute joke. 

Yo.

And by the way, your post is about as close to a definition of being offended as you can get without actually saying “I’m offended.” And I think you have every right to be pissed about that post.

Edited July 18, 2023 by troph

[Pancho 44856]

23 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

yeah well you and i are just going to have to disagree that retard and the n word are even in the same ballpark. there's a reason that one of those words has been typed out repeatedly in this thread and the other hasn't been typed out once. one word is not at all uncommon in that is was once not used as an insult and then later on did start being used as an insult. the other word was born out of such a deep hatred for a certain type of person that it was invented as a means of enhancing real life cruelty, enslavement, and genocide. like i said, those words are not even in the same ballpark.

also, i almost passed out from the sheer weight of the irony of you (and so many others) sitting here lecturing me about how i don't understand the power of these words. a dude earlier in this thread talked shit to me about my mental illness and my medication and nobody here batted an eye. yet you all sit here and lecture to me from your fake ass high horse when in reality, as @Dbeasy has been saying all along, this is nothing more than selective moral outrage.

you have a loved one who has mental disabilities so you pretend to "stand up for what's right/what you believe in/what society has decided is acceptable" whenever you hear the word "retarded", but you have absolutely zero problem with someone taking pot shots at me about my mental illness. so many of you are so  completely and transparently full of shit, only you can't see it because you're too busy preaching to others and praising yourselves for "standing up for what's right." congrats on your fake morals and your high horse i guess. 

That's because the word nigga is a reclaiming word. Retarded is not. Reclaiming words are words that have been used on an oppressed group and that group has decided to "reclaim" the word to lessen it's power. Scholars (am I a scholar since this is my field?) agree the top reclaiming words are nigga. bitch/cunt, and faggot/queer. There are a few problems though. For example, with the word nigga, I (a Black man) have heard more Latinos use this word over the last 7-8 years than I have Black people. Should I have said something? 

The word retarded hasn't been invented to mean something rather it's just been assigned another definition by certain members of that group or society to maintain an informal social atmosphere. While I've always hated that word being used on this website, some people feel it's "okay" to use it here because this is an informal social atmosphere. The metamessage being sent by using that word is "I feel comfortable with you/this group to use this word in your presence without some form of consequence." When using this word, the question is what causes some people to think of the word denotatively and others connotatively. In addition, our connotative definitions and very vast and are built to a host of things, mostly to do with our personal experience, culture, etc. I think someone on this thread said they had no issues using the word retarded to mean stupid/dumb and would continue to use it this way. My question is are you holding true to that conviction and would use it in job interviews or just around your informal social group?

Words are symbolic and (mostly) arbitrary. I have a handicapped cousin, so when I hear or see the word, I think of him. That's why I dislike it because to me, that is what it symbolizes. Some people don't have that frame of reference, and that's fine. That's the power of words though is that we can pretty much assign any symbol we want to a word. One semester, I had a class make up a word and assign a meaning to it and then start using it on conversation on campus, at work, at home, etc. By the end of the semester, students found others in their community were using this word but it had a different definition depending on the part of Houston you lived in. (That's one of my favorite class exercises.)

I'm not sure I helped or not here. My lecture on Verbal Communication for my Comm classes lasts about a week or a week and a half, depending on the class. 

[Dahobbs 17625]

37 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

not only have none of you said a single thing about this, this post actually has pos rep. the absolute gall to pretend to have morals and to proselytize to others about said morals when it concerns something you care about (mentally disabled people) while in the very same thread completely ignoring/advocating this is astounding. 

you all objectively do not have the moral superiority you claim to have, you just don't like people saying the word "retard" because it affects you personally. what an absolute joke. 

So you do get offended? Also, you realize surly isn't a unitary body, right?

[BabaYaga 15301]

6 minutes ago, Pancho said:

One semester, I had a class make up a word and assign a meaning to it and then start using it on conversation on campus, at work, at home, etc. By the end of the semester, students found others in their community were using this word but it had a different definition depending on the part of Houston you lived in. (That's one of my favorite class exercises.)

[ztejas 43475]

3 minutes ago, Pancho said:

That's because the word nigga is a reclaiming word. Retarded is not. Reclaiming words are words that have been used on an oppressed group and that group has decided to "reclaim" the word to lessen it's power. Scholars (am I a scholar since this is my field?) agree the top reclaiming words are nigga. bitch/cunt, and faggot/queer. There are a few problems though. For example, with the word nigga, I (a Black man) have heard more Latinos use this word over the last 7-8 years than I have Black people. Should I have said something? 

The word retarded hasn't been invented to mean something rather it's just been assigned another definition by certain members of that group or society to maintain an informal social atmosphere. While I've always hated that word being used on this website, some people feel it's "okay" to use it here because this is an informal social atmosphere. The metamessage being sent by using that word is "I feel comfortable with you/this group to use this word in your presence without some form of consequence." When using this word, the question is what causes some people to think of the word denotatively and others connotatively. In addition, our connotative definitions and very vast and are built to a host of things, mostly to do with our personal experience, culture, etc. I think someone on this thread said they had no issues using the word retarded to mean stupid/dumb and would continue to use it this way. My question is are you holding true to that conviction and would use it in job interviews or just around your informal social group?

Words are symbolic and (mostly) arbitrary. I have a handicapped cousin, so when I hear or see the word, I think of him. That's why I dislike it because to me, that is what it symbolizes. Some people don't have that frame of reference, and that's fine. That's the power of words though is that we can pretty much assign any symbol we want to a word. One semester, I had a class make up a word and assign a meaning to it and then start using it on conversation on campus, at work, at home, etc. By the end of the semester, students found others in their community were using this word but it had a different definition depending on the part of Houston you lived in. (That's one of my favorite class exercises.)

I'm not sure I helped or not here. My lecture on Verbal Communication for my Comm classes lasts about a week or a week and a half, depending on the class. 

I'm of the mind that -er and -a are almost two different words entirely at this point. Only thing I'd add.

e.g. - those Latinos would probably be caught dead using the former version in public or among black people - whether or not it's inoffensive to throw the latter around. 

[troph 24851]

Queer is an amazing example of reclaiming. The conversation to add Q to LGBT within HRC nomenclature was highly emotional precisely because queer was a slur for most of the leadership, but the young people have taken it back in less than a generation or two. It has been so successful the term is now available to allies to use as well. It can still be a slur but it’s fast becoming anything but that. Fascinating to me. 

Edited July 18, 2023 by troph

[Lurch 5931]

Queer is an amazing example of reclaiming. The conversation to add Q to LGBT within HRC nomenclature was highly emotional precisely because queer was a slur for most of the leadership, but the young people have taken it back in less than a generation or two. It has been so successful the term is now available to allies to use as well. It can still be a slur but it’s fast becoming anything but that. Fascinating to me. 

What has been the conversation around LGBTQIA2S+, because I gotta tell you as an ally it’s becoming a bit difficult to store in memory

[Js1 85407]

Also, unless I missed it from someone on ignore:

[Gatorubet 30246]

At this point, I just have to say that it cannot be overstated that we are all communicating in the context of Shaggy/Surly.  I often say certain things and take a certain tone when responding to posts because this is like Mos Eisley - a wretched hive of scum and villainy. 

This place is not for everybody, and you cannot expect posters on Surly to act like they are in some church chat forum.   I don’t have to wonder if I would talk like this at a job interview, because I am talking on Surly.  If we all talked like we were at a job interview, there would be no Surly - or essence of Surly, as we know it.   

Do you want to live in a world without Thujone dick pics or South Austin’s mom repartee?   I don’t. 

No, we don’t want homophobic or racist or other unwanted communication.   But a little Blazing Saddles-ish leeway is fine.  So fuck Hot Wheels. 

 

[closetohumping 17449]

32 minutes ago, ztejas said:

I'm of the mind that -er and -a are almost two different words entirely at this point. Only thing I'd add.

e.g. - those Latinos would probably be caught dead using the former version in public or among black people - whether or not it's inoffensive to throw the latter around. 

I don't think I can use either form, the er or the a.  

[Michael Knight 12988]

The OP is being a real derka, which is a slur and I hope hes offended by it.

[jimmyjazz 45975]

I always miss the kool kid parties.

['stache 21819]

7 minutes ago, Michael Knight said:

The OP is being a real derka, which is a slur and I hope hes offended by it.

[Mole 4333]

Since both hypocrisy and Norm have been mentioned, who can forget this gem:

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4976]

Quote

It was previously used as a medical term. The verb "to retard" means to delay or hold back, and so "retard" became known as a medical term in the late 19th and early 20th centuries to describe children with intellectual disabilities, or retarded mental development.[5] Until the 1960s, the terms moron, idiot, cretin, and imbecile were all genuine, non-offensive terms used, including by psychiatrists, to refer to people with mental intellectual disabilities and low intelligence. These words were discontinued in that form when concerns arose that they had developed negative meanings, with "retard" and "retarded" replacing them.[6][7] After that, the terms "handicapped" (United States) and "disabled" (United Kingdom) replaced "retard" and "retarded". Disabled is now considered a more polite term than handicapped in the United States as well.

So, if you want to use the word retard, you might be able to just wait a few years, as words like idiot, moron, and imbecile aren't really considered particularly offensive anymore. Just be careful using the words handicapped and disabled, as they are clearly on borrowed time.

[Dahobbs 17625]

11 minutes ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

So, if you want to use the word retard, you might be able to just wait a few years, as words like idiot, moron, and imbecile aren't really considered particularly offensive anymore. Just be careful using the words handicapped and disabled, as they are clearly on borrowed time.

Idiot, moron, and imbecile are all insults and thus offensive to whomever they are directed. What the OP and really this whole thread is circling around is that some terms are offensive in ways that make their use, even as an insult, unacceptable. Bigoted words and phrases are in that category because that not only demean the person they are directed at, but are more broadly demeaning to whole groups and predicated on the innate, not chosen, aspects of the group. 

[YChang 3453]

DBeasy and Horn of Gabriel has made me see the light. No longer will I use HW for our lovely governor. Their purity of heart has shamed me. From now on it’s piece of shit worst governor ever Abbott.

[troph 24851]

1 hour ago, Lurch said:

What has been the conversation around LGBTQIA2S+, because I gotta tell you as an ally it’s becoming a bit difficult to store in memory

as one in a group that was partially excluded for several decades after Stonewall, I don't feel its appropriate for me to exclude. LGBTQ, to me, covers all of it. LGBTQ+ does as well, though many use LGBTQIA with Q being the true umbrella but recognizing intersex people are not Queer and asexual people also belong.  Some go further to say LGBTQIA+ and you know, ok.  for me I use LGBTQ which is the most common used alphabet soup and  I mean errybody.

Just now, YChang said:

DBeasy and Horn of Gabriel has made me see the light. No longer will I use HW for our lovely governor. Their purity of heart has shamed me. From now on it’s piece of shit worst governor ever Abbott.

I agree with that approach.

[Underdog 28711]

5 hours ago, BabaYaga said:

This thread makes me want to go back and rewatch Blazing Saddles for the 1,000th time

Few years ago had a young co-worker that had watched BS and he comes in shaking his head about how wild the 70s had to be. 

[Underdog 28711]

4 hours ago, Deej said:

They used to be partners. 

Dick Chop/Les Wang

 

[Elvis 3371]

Is tarded ok?  Seams to take the sting out of it. As in, “ this thread is tarded”.

 

I only get offended if it’s an insult directly made to me to intentionally mean disrespect. 
 

For example, someone called me a Yankee in another thread. Thems fightin words. 

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4976]

26 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

Idiot, moron, and imbecile are all insults and thus offensive to whomever they are directed. What the OP and really this whole thread is circling around is that some terms are offensive in ways that make their use, even as an insult, unacceptable. Bigoted words and phrases are in that category because that not only demean the person they are directed at, but are more broadly demeaning to whole groups and predicated on the innate, not chosen, aspects of the group. 

I think you missed the part where they are all used the way retarded is now, and retarded was meant to be a non-offensive way to refer to those people. Now thise words are no longer associated with mentally disabled people and are just insults. If the word retarded follows that same path, it will lose the current connotations it has, and we will have to explain to our kids that special didn't always mean that.

[Dbeasy 15068]

32 minutes ago, YChang said:

DBeasy and Horn of Gabriel has made me see the light. No longer will I use HW for our lovely governor. Their purity of heart has shamed me. From now on it’s piece of shit worst governor ever Abbott.

It just rolls off the tongue doesn’t it? Welcome. 
 

[Macanudo 12989]

If someone other than Derka had started this thread, would it have died early on?

[Gatorubet 30246]

1 hour ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

Just be careful using the words handicapped and disabled, as they are clearly on borrowed time.

Up on Cripple Creek, she sends me….

[Dahobbs 17625]

1 hour ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

I think you missed the part where they are all used the way retarded is now, and retarded was meant to be a non-offensive way to refer to those people. Now thise words are no longer associated with mentally disabled people and are just insults. If the word retarded follows that same path, it will lose the current connotations it has, and we will have to explain to our kids that special didn't always mean that.

I didn't miss that. Those terms are still insults, so they are offensive. They have just lost all connection to the general group suffering from mental handicaps, so are no longer in that unacceptable category.  

My point is that the thing we as a society are opposed to isn't really offensive words. Rather, we are opposed to particular kinds of offensive words. 

Edited July 18, 2023 by Dahobbs

[Kennythetiger 9389]

2 hours ago, Elvis said:

For example, someone called me a Yankee in another thread. Thems fightin words. 

Hopefully he said it with the same accent that they use in Last of the Mohicans. 

[closetohumping 17449]

28 minutes ago, Kennythetiger said:

Hopefully he said it with the same accent that they use in Last of the Mohicans. 

And I’m Cindy lauper 

[troph 24851]

30 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

And I’m Cindy lauper 

[Gatorubet 30246]

1 hour ago, Kennythetiger said:

Hopefully he said it with the same accent that they use in Last of the Mohicans. 

“The Yonk-key can go.  His woman now belongs to <checks notes> all tribe…”

[Earl Haffler 597]

Is "goofy bastard" a non offensive way for meaning retarded?

[mchookem 16336]

[Orale 1087]

Queer is an amazing example of reclaiming. The conversation to add Q to LGBT within HRC nomenclature was highly emotional precisely because queer was a slur for most of the leadership, but the young people have taken it back in less than a generation or two. It has been so successful the term is now available to allies to use as well. It can still be a slur but it’s fast becoming anything but that. Fascinating to me. 

Totally. I'm a relatively young homo and love the word and use it freely. I honestly didn't know it had been a slur in the past.

[Texzilla58 4738]

The differences between when I entered the workforce in the late 70’s and now that is pretty found.

The pendulum has swung a bit too far. A few years ago I was a merchant for a large international retailer and was making a presentation discussing the differences in the TV business between the US and Mexico. I made a number of references to the “Mexican” market, the demographics of our “Mexican” customers, and performance of our “Mexican” stores. A hand went up, and a young woman from marketing stated “I’m sure I’m not the only one here who would appreciate it if you would stop using a racial slur in your presentation?” Excuse me? “Mexican isn’t an acceptable term!” This girl had a degree from Princeton. Before I could gather a response that wasn’t going to be a slur about her ignorant yankee moronic ass her boss shut her down and she then left the meeting.

Oriental is also a word that remains a good word though it’s now demonized. I wouldn’t use it for people but I also avoid general words like Asian. But the Orient simply means east. I don’t know any of my Japanese, Chinese. Thai, Vietnamese, Indian or Korean friends colleagues or family that like the term Asian, whether Americans or foreign nationals, that use the term. They identify as Japanese or Koreans or whatever and generally hate all the others.

[fattyflattie 4639]

7 hours ago, BabaYaga said:

That’s what I’m thinking. 

[safe sex 11735]

  

20 minutes ago, Orale said:

5 hours ago, troph said:

Queer is an amazing example of reclaiming. The conversation to add Q to LGBT within HRC nomenclature was highly emotional precisely because queer was a slur for most of the leadership, but the young people have taken it back in less than a generation or two. It has been so successful the term is now available to allies to use as well. It can still be a slur but it’s fast becoming anything but that. Fascinating to me. 

Totally. I'm a relatively young homo and love the word and use it freely. I honestly didn't know it had been a slur in the past.

 

90% of posters on this board played a game of "Smear the Queer" at least once while growing up.

Edited July 19, 2023 by safe sex

[closetohumping 17449]

3 minutes ago, safe sex said:

  

 

90% of posters on this board played a game of "Smear the Queer" at least once while growing up.

Yes.  I was a prejudice fuck at 9

[Deej 76830]

1 hour ago, troph said:

Not well. She's always in advertisements for drugs that help her chronic psoriasis. 

[HornOnTheBayou 8931]

1 hour ago, Orale said:

Totally. I'm a relatively young homo and love the word and use it freely. I honestly didn't know it had been a slur in the past.

 

1 hour ago, safe sex said:

 90% of posters on this board played a game of "Smear the Queer" at least once while growing up.

@Orale, not to threadjack, but how old are you? Because I'm a young Gen X-er and we played "Smear the Queer" a lot in school. Mainly I'm asking because 1) I'm interested in how the word changed, 2) I'm fascinated and excited that the connotation changed so quickly, 3) I'm a high school teacher and I love how LGBTQ+ students are much more accepted by their peers than they were when I was in school, and 4) I just want to get a gauge on how old I actually am.

[YGIFS 19452]

nmnm

 

Edited July 19, 2023 by YGIFS

[Orale 1087]

3 minutes ago, HornOnTheBayou said:

 

@Orale, not to threadjack, but how old are you? Because I'm a young Gen X-er and we played "Smear the Queer" a lot in school. Mainly I'm asking because 1) I'm interested in how the word changed, 2) I'm fascinated and excited that the connotation changed so quickly, 3) I'm a high school teacher and I love how LGBTQ+ students are much more accepted by their peers than they were when I was in school, and 4) I just want to get a gauge on how old I actually am.

We played smear the queer when I was a kid too. I completely forgot about that. I feel like faggot was the more common slur when I was growing up and queer was just a strange word that wasn't used much in any context. At least not among my peers. 

[Helobious 9462]

1 hour ago, Texzilla58 said:

The differences between when I entered the workforce in the late 70’s and now that is pretty found.

The pendulum has swung a bit too far. A few years ago I was a merchant for a large international retailer and was making a presentation discussing the differences in the TV business between the US and Mexico. I made a number of references to the “Mexican” market, the demographics of our “Mexican” customers, and performance of our “Mexican” stores. A hand went up, and a young woman from marketing stated “I’m sure I’m not the only one here who would appreciate it if you would stop using a racial slur in your presentation?” Excuse me? “Mexican isn’t an acceptable term!” This girl had a degree from Princeton. Before I could gather a response that wasn’t going to be a slur about her ignorant yankee moronic ass her boss shut her down and she then left the meeting.
 

I find that story hard to believe. If it’s true it’s about one weird person and not a “pendulum swinging” in society.