Texas tops list of worst places to live and work in America

[Guest]

42 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Jesus fucking Christ slorch the world is more than just your narrow set of experiences and anecdotes. It's not that your experience doesn't matter, it's that it's one data point out of millions in a trend of general economic contraction for the non-executive/shareholder class.

Hooray for you that you bucked the trend, but your basic position of "there's nothing wrong because it's ok for me" is the economic equivalent of holding up a snowball to prove there's no global warming

You're right.

Texas sucks.  That's why everyone's leaving.

 

I mean there's a shitton of folks on here saying they're about to allegedly  leave.  They have about as much fight in em as 2 NBA players.  Let's work from what they have to say...

Edited August 5, 2023 by slorch

[Pato del Muerto 52321]

Man, I wish my college was paid for.  Guess i didn’t work hard enough to get good enough grades for colleges to waive tuition just for the benefit of my presence. 

[Armybrat 40678]

2 hours ago, ztejas said:

You can make as much waiting tables or bartending in Austin as like 80% of entry level jobs out of college. 

There are probably bartenders clearing 6 figs in this town.

Granted some of those people have college degrees. 

I recall the old West Texas oil bust joke about the Whataburger burger flipper job requiring a masters degree in Petroleum Engineering.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Man, I wish my college was paid for.  Guess i didn’t work hard enough to get good enough grades for colleges to waive tuition just for the benefit of my presence. 

Yeah, well, I had a partial scholarship and had a job the entire 4 years. Been working since 15. I know I’m fortunate but silver spoon I am not. 

[Homercles 10205]

What I feel like some of y’all fail to appreciate is that shit CHANGES.  

I bought my first house in ‘05 for $125k on a $40k salary…it’s now worth 3x that.  The tech support position I had at the time now pays 1.5x that.  

I graduated OSU with $10k in student debt and paid it off in five years.  My parents paid the first year, I managed the rest through student loans at ~3% APR and a part time job payin $8/hour.   Average student federal debt loa is 3x that with rates 2x.  

Wife and I built our 3500sft house for $350k in 2012 with a 3.5% rate.  It’s now worth almost $1M in Cedar Park and rates are almost double that.  

I couldn’t come out of college and repeat my experience, no matter how hard I worked.  I recognize that timing, luck and general fortune often play a huge role in addition to character, perseverance and ethics.  

Boomers do that shit all the time and it pisses me off…”well yeah grandpa, your employer gave you a pension, houses cost $20k and gas was a quarter…I’m not denying you toiled away in the acid mines with an onion tied to your belt but cost of living has outpaced income the last fifty years”

[Captainant 27310]

2 hours ago, Porterhouse said:

This. I was fortunate to be the son of a longtime Austin banker who put me through school, and quickly cut me off at the age of 21. I was extremely blessed and am grateful to have what I had growing up, but we weren’t rich. Each of my parents’ families was middle class. My dad worked really hard and always was a high earner, but we never had wealth. When he cut me off, I’ve been on my own ever since. They did give us $10k, after we’d bought our first house in 2005. That house was sold to a CEO in 2009, who bought it for his TCU graduate son and put $200k into the house and gifted it to him. Other than that, I’ve worked for every $ I made. Still, I presume I’m much more fortunate than most. But I wasn’t born on 3rd base. Probably born on 1st and my dad legged out a double. 

I graduated in 2014 with five years worth of full UT expenses (average annual cost of living was $22k as a student) as debt. My college degree debt cost more than the mortgage on the house I grew up in. You didn't have to buy the house you grew up in AND THEN actually buy the house your family lives in. 

I'm in that 95th percentile of income, my wife and I make good money. Way better than our parents in this stage during their lives. But for some reason, it just ain't going as far as it used to when the house that cost your parents $100k in the 90s (and you helped them to renovate and sell for $250k in 2017) is now selling for $450k in 2023.

Shit is fucking wack, dawg. Stop pissing on my shoe and telling me its raining. You were born on 3rd. Sorry it makes you feel like less of a big shot

[YGIFS 19449]

I am in awe of some of these life stories.  Some people had jobs in high school and then were given financial support until their early 20's, only to receive more in their later 20's.  There is a Hallmark movie in here somewhere.  Y'all have truly battled the odds particularly when you take into account the godawful armpits you were forced to grow up in/around.  The struggle is real.  If I could convince some of you to come speak about your trials and tribulations about the third generation in your family to attend top-flight schools with just one ski trip per year, we could truly transform lives.  

Edited August 6, 2023 by YGIFS

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, Captainant said:

I graduated in 2014 with five years worth of full UT expenses (average annual cost of living was $22k as a student) as debt. My college degree debt cost more than the mortgage on the house I grew up in. You didn't have to buy the house you grew up in AND THEN actually buy the house your family lives in. 

I'm in that 95th percentile of income, my wife and I make good money. Way better than our parents in this stage during their lives. But for some reason, it just ain't going as far as it used to when the house that cost your parents $100k in the 90s (and you helped them to renovate and sell for $250k in 2017) is now selling for $450k in 2023.

Shit is fucking wack, dawg. Stop pissing on my shoe and telling me its raining. You were born on 3rd. Sorry it makes you feel like less of a big shot

Nope.  Every $ I have I’ve earned, save for that gift. I don’t think some of y’all know true wealth. My family has never had it. I’m around it everywhere. 

[Helobious 9477]

2 hours ago, Porterhouse said:

This. I was fortunate to be the son of a longtime Austin banker who put me through school, and quickly cut me off at the age of 21. I was extremely blessed and am grateful to have what I had growing up, but we weren’t rich. Each of my parents’ families was middle class. My dad worked really hard and always was a high earner, but we never had wealth. When he cut me off, I’ve been on my own ever since. They did give us $10k, after we’d bought our first house in 2005. That house was sold to a CEO in 2009, who bought it for his TCU graduate son and put $200k into the house and gifted it to him. Other than that, I’ve worked for every $ I made. Still, I presume I’m much more fortunate than most. But I wasn’t born on 3rd base. Probably born on 1st and my dad legged out a double. 

Legitimate holy fuck. Forget 1st base it sounds like you were born halfway between 3rd and home. I don’t think you understand at all how much many (most?) Americans have to struggle.

[YGIFS 19449]

Dude, he had to get a job at 15 in West Lake Hills before his parents agreed to float his tuition and fee bills at the frat house even though he could have just as easily lived at home and commuted to save his poor banker family money.  God damn you for not understanding his struggle!  

Edited August 6, 2023 by YGIFS

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

Yep. My pops paid for my education. I worked throughout college, but didn’t have to if it came down to it. I absolutely was born on 3rd base. I am extremely grateful and above all, lucky. I didn’t choose which family I was born into.

[Helobious 9477]

I’m not joking, my jaw dropped reading porterhouse’s post. I had a very nice childhood but that level of privelege is alien to the world I grew up in. I had friends that would pull the screens off windows and use them to catch fish in the arroyo, to eat for actual meals. In the early 2000s. I vividly remember thinking about how lucky and rich I was that I didn’t have to do that.
 

Not saying porterhouse or his family did anything wrong or should feel bad but that’s an incredible lack of awareness to think that’s not an extremely priveleged life.

[Guest]

19 minutes ago, Helobious said:

Legitimate holy fuck. Forget 1st base it sounds like you were born halfway between 3rd and home. I don’t think you understand at all how much many (most?) Americans have to struggle.

I’m aware. I don’t think I went to school with many friends that paid for it. There were very few. 

[SydneyCarton 47809]

1 hour ago, Porterhouse said:

Yeah, well, I had a partial scholarship and had a job the entire 4 years. Been working since 15. I know I’m fortunate but silver spoon I am not. 

Lol, you have no concept of the rarified air in which you live. Or you do and don’t want to acknowledge it. 
 

Now imagine your life where working a full time job wont pay for 1/3 of a semester of just the class fees. Because the cost of a public education has outstripped inflation by 10x. You may as well be an octogenarian screaming about “in my day” with no concept that the world is different than their subsidized 100 dollars a year for college world…just Aggy level out of touch. 
 

just because you’ve worked your ass off doesn’t mean you didnt get a head start. I’ve had a head start, and my divorced mom worked 2 jobs, 7 days a week to support me versus an indifferent father. I still was out in better position than most of America. 

2 minutes ago, Porterhouse said:

I’m aware. I don’t think I went to school with many friends that paid for it. There were very few. 

Yeah. Sounds like you were basically Oliver Twist. 

[Beau Vine 53964]

4 hours ago, slorch said:

Not that you deliberately or purposefully do or say this; but there is a pervasive attitude or belief on here and in certain circles that just because someone has a lot, they always had a lot; or that they were born on 3rd base and celebrate triples all day.

Some people vow never to go back to prison. I vowed never to live in poverty again, and started making relevant life decisions in doing so very early on.  Poverty sucks and there are no two ways about it.  I don't feel guilty about what I have earned, and in all honesty, most folks would certainly not consider me wealthy- even if I have pretty much everything i ever realistically wished for.  I don't wring my hands over the stability I have built for my family.   I do know I never want to live that life again, and it drives much of my decision making.  That's not to say one lives in fear, but with a certain degree of vigilance.

It's not some miracle or accident.  That concept seems beyond many surlist's  willingness or ability to reconcile in their worldview.  Queue the bootstrap jokes and remarks; yet we cannot share that opportunity absolutely exists. I must discount my own experience, lest I disrupt the dystopian ideals.

It's frustrating AF.

I seriously cannot believe that we had to wait until the end of page 12 for this post. 

[YGIFS 19449]

^

that's a good, distinctive observation.  We do an abundantly horrific job in this country of berating people due to their upbringing and childhood when they did nothing wrong to screw anybody else over, they just took proper advantage of what was afforded them and rightfully so.  Nothing inherently unethical about at all.  It's when they high-high themselves thinking "it must have been like this for all of us" that it starts to veer into the selfish and annoying.  Again, most folks don't mean anything vitriolic by it and it's not like you have to commit yourself to public service in kindergarten because your father wore a tie and you know somebody with a swimming pool.  But just be aware.  Be cognizant.  Be open.  

I'm sure there's no shortage of rough stories coming up on here.  No sense in a futile pepsi challenge.  But alls I know is I saw some shit growing up.  And then my dad left and I really saw some shit.  And then I got a few degrees and a couple of nickels to rub together and met some people behind some people, and that afforded me to really see the shit behind the shit.  I walk in a lot of people's shadows.  Everybody had it worse than me.  I am nothing special and never overcame anything of note.  But I do know I have seen and heard some things that made me realize whatever hardships we had growing up aren't worth mentioning.  Thank the good lord, my mother did what she had to do, that people have fought in combat to protect people like me, and family and friends came to our aid when we needed it.  But I have seen the world that runs alongside, parallel to this one. And nobody should have to live in that.  Nobody.  Thankfully, I just saw it and didn't have to live in it.  But it goes a little bit further than making your greek annual dues.  We had some tough times, still do.  But we look on the bright side.  Some days I am just thankful that maybe what I saw was just a dream.  Something I imagined.  It's not about poor versus wealth.  It's when you have to accept debates about property taxes versus facing the fact that there are animals dressed up as humans wanting to play nice in a community.  Fuck me, we really shouldn't be talking about this shit.  

[gmr548 16463]

As to your first paragraph, it’s how you consider yourself and who you run around. I’m not trying to be anything, but I know where I’d fall in these studies, and I don’t feel “rich”. I’m going to start using that word as opposed to wealthy because income isn’t a direct correlator with wealth. 
A quick search showed Top 10% of households in the US make $190k, Top 5% make $290k and Top 1% make $867k. As to your third paragraph, I disagree Top 10% is rare territory. But, I just turned 45, and have 3 kids, and that is context that is crucial. Similarly, Top 5% isn’t rare at all, in any major city in Texas and some smaller cities where you will associate with other college graduates primarily (yes, [mention=3335]gmr548[/mention], I did move the goalposts). Moving from top 5% to top 2%, at my age doesn’t make you elite. That is my perspective, at my age, compared to my peers, who are all firmly at that level. Look at this chart of 1%ers:

 

This. I was fortunate to be the son of a longtime Austin banker who put me through school, and quickly cut me off at the age of 21. I was extremely blessed and am grateful to have what I had growing up, but we weren’t rich. Each of my parents’ families was middle class. My dad worked really hard and always was a high earner, but we never had wealth. When he cut me off, I’ve been on my own ever since. They did give us $10k, after we’d bought our first house in 2005. That house was sold to a CEO in 2009, who bought it for his TCU graduate son and put $200k into the house and gifted it to him. Other than that, I’ve worked for every $ I made. Still, I presume I’m much more fortunate than most. But I wasn’t born on 3rd base. Probably born on 1st and my dad legged out a double. 

You are making others’ and my point for us and you don’t even realize it.

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

Before porter or anyone else claims they are the victim of some kind of class discrimination, we all assume y’all understand you shouldn’t feel bad or guilty that you had an advantage. I certainly don’t. But if you can’t even see that you had that advantage or muster up empathy for those that didn’t, then yeah, you have your head way the fuck up your ass.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Patricio Swayze said:

Before porter or anyone else claims they are the victim of some kind of class discrimination, we all assume y’all understand you shouldn’t feel bad or guilty that you had an advantage. I certainly don’t. But if you can’t even see that you had that advantage or muster up empathy for those that didn’t, then yeah, you have your head way the fuck up your ass.

I absolutely was given tremendous advantages and don’t deny that. I said as much above and like you said I was blessed and grateful. I was responding to one post that said I was born with a silver spoon, through slorch’s post. I’m not out of touch, though I think many here would find it surprising how many kids have their parents pay for their school, fully. 

And you and I were not born on 3rd base. If you think that, you don’t know the meaning of the term. 

[immamac 42492]

1 minute ago, Porterhouse said:

I absolutely was given tremendous advantages and don’t deny that. I said as much above and like you said I was blessed and grateful. I was responding to one post that said I was born with a silver spoon, through slorch’s post. I’m not out of touch, though I think many here would find it surprising how many kids have their parents pay for their school, fully. 

And you and I were not born on 3rd base. If you think that, you don’t know the meaning of the term. 

I think you have no idea what you are talking about and you live in a fantasy land. Did your family actually have silver growing up? Do you not realize how actually uncommon that is? 

[YGIFS 19449]

Third base is 75% of the way to home/scoring a run. You were born, raised, lived, and currently exist in the 95th percentile of human existence.  95 is more than 75.  I think, but you're the fucking commodities expert on maths so you tell us.  I don't fault you for taking advantage of a nice upbringing and kickass undergraduate experience at UT-Austin which I love.  I just think some people didn't find it that compelling to claim "I had to work by 15 years old dammit!  And then after that, only 3/4 of my education was paid for with a cherry $10k on top of that afterwards!"  It's common, we get it...particularly among highly educated groups like this site.  We just never thought to dedicate a thread to it.  

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

I absolutely was given tremendous advantages and don’t deny that. I said as much above and like you said I was blessed and grateful. I was responding to one post that said I was born with a silver spoon, through slorch’s post. I’m not out of touch, though I think many here would find it surprising how many kids have their parents pay for their school, fully. 
And you and I were not born on 3rd base. If you think that, you don’t know the meaning of the term. 

Yes we were. You are the only one here arguing otherwise. It’s pretty obvious to everyone else.

You are thinking of deacon dickhead, he was born on the bench of a team that won the World Series.

[Helobious 9477]

I had a mom and an in-and-out dad, both 1st generation immigrants. It was still a stable & non-abusive home. I never worried about eviction or what was for dinner. I’d say I was born on 3rd base just for those reasons alone. So many of my peers and even people in my own family didn’t have that.

[Guest]

16 minutes ago, Patricio Swayze said:

Yes we were. You are the only one here arguing otherwise. It’s pretty obvious to everyone else.

You are thinking of deacon dickhead, he was born on the bench of a team that won the World Series.

It’s of course subjective. I won’t name any posters here. But there are many, many people I know and you surely know that were born into immense wealth. A lake house, house in Cabo, home in Colorado, home in Whitefish, and in some cases all of these. They stand to inherit a business worth millions or billions and are integrated into that. Dad generally has multiple club memberships in town, and many non-resident memberships. Many of these people are great people. Many are jackasses that fritter it away, or they try but have so much that they just cause some patriarch embarrassment. 

That’s all foreign to me except that I’ve been surrounded by people growing up, in school, and now in middle age where my ‘peers’ are buying these toys or I’ve witnessed them getting integrated in businesses they’re getting ready to take over. That’s 3rd base. 

Edited August 6, 2023 by Porterhouse

[Brisketexan 104464]

It’s of course subjective. I won’t name any posters here. But there are many, many people I know and you surely know that were born into immense wealth. A lake house, house in Cabo, home in Colorado, home in Whitefish, and in some cases all of these. They stand to inherit a business worth millions or billions and are integrated into that. Dad generally has multiple club memberships in town, and many non-resident memberships. Many of these people are great people. Many are jackasses that fritter it away, or they try but have so much that they just cause some patriarch embarrassment. 
That’s all foreign to me except that I’ve been surrounded by people growing up, in school, and now in middle age where my ‘peers’ are buying these toys or I’ve witnessed them getting integrated in businesses they’re getting ready to take over. That’s 3rd base. 

No, dude. That’s a fucking home run.
What you and I and several others here had was third base. Because you truly don’t understand the massive numbers of people born into WAY less advantageous circumstances. It’s not “some” people. It’s “the vast majority” of people. You likely don’t know that many of them. Which is, again, the point. Those are people born at the plate, or on first or second.
You really don’t understand how many people are born standing at home plate who don’t even know how to hold the bat. It’s overwhelming.

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

No, dude. That’s a fucking home run.
What you and I and several others here had was third base. Because you truly don’t understand the massive numbers of people born into WAY less advantageous circumstances. It’s not “some” people. It’s “the vast majority” of people. You likely don’t know that many of them. Which is, again, the point. Those are people born at the plate, or on first or second.
You really don’t understand how many people are born standing at home plate who don’t even know how to hold the bat. It’s overwhelming.

Fair enough. 

[immamac 42492]

11 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

No, dude. That’s a fucking home run.
What you and I and several others here had was third base. Because you truly don’t understand the massive numbers of people born into WAY less advantageous circumstances. It’s not “some” people. It’s “the vast majority” of people. You likely don’t know that many of them. Which is, again, the point. Those are people born at the plate, or on first or second.
You really don’t understand how many people are born standing at home plate who don’t even know how to hold the bat. It’s overwhelming.

 

3 minutes ago, Porterhouse said:

Fair enough. 

Id go even further and that's like sitting in the owners suite watching the plebian baseball players who you toy with. 

[fattyflattie 4636]

22 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

No, dude. That’s a fucking home run.

Call it what you want, but people accused sack of being born on third on this site for years, and his pawpaw sold out for what, 3/4 billion?   Now a solid middle class life and a one time 10k gift is 3rd base?  Wonder what that makes my kids since they’ve already got more than me and the wife ever had, despite growing up “middle class”.  

[Brew 3044]

I’m not sure which is a more interesting turn in this thread, the $250k income is average or the bootstraps piece. They both fail to realize that they are missing such a large swath of people in their versions of the world and all they see are the top percentiles where some things might look average. 

I like to tell myself I pulled myself up by the bootstraps also. I came from not much (nothing would not be a fair assessment), started working full time at 14 (my mother got her boss to hire me on), went to college as the only one out of the family (grandmother actually called in favors after I failed out of first school), and started here when I was 21 (scout master for the year I did scouts was the managing partner.) I’ve reached the top of the ladder in my field and run a firm in the top tenth of a percent in the country all because I found my bootstraps (also had some really good timing to go along with being really good at what I do.)

I talk to a lot of people coming out of school and into our offices every year. There is a serious lack of hope with them on being able to achieve the same things. My 1-2 years are moving back home, they don’t know if they will be able to buy a house or do other things that have always been expected. Combined with everything else going on, it’s a weird time out there to be on the earlier side of your career/life.

[DalTxHornFan 3084]

This argument seems to conflate being born in the USA vs. being born in some desolate hell hole elsewhere.  We all won the lottery if we were born in the USA.

Then lets talk about my advantages.

I was born into a two parent family.  Mom and Dad were actually married.  My Mom was a full-time homemaker.  We spoke English in our home.  I never lacked for food or shelter when I was growing up.

Is that first or second base?

[Homercles 10205]

Another notch in the belt for The Wire, at least to me, is how well it showed all the factors that played into a character’s ultimate outcome.  “All the pieces matter”.  Who you rolled with, what (if any) roles the adults played in your life, how lucky you were in a gun fight, etc all influenced where they were at the end of season 5. 

And not to say choice was irrelevant either.  Some had an opportunity to escape and took it (Poot, Cutty, Bubbles), others ignored it (Dukie with Prezbo), some explicitly chose that life and gave exactly that (Snoop, Omar, Prop Joe), and one pawn benefited from fortune and sheer badassery to cross the board to be a queen (Slim Charles).  

[Brew 3044]

50 minutes ago, fattyflattie said:

Call it what you want, but people accused sack of being born on third on this site for years, and his pawpaw sold out for what, 3/4 billion?   Now a solid middle class life and a one time 10k gift is 3rd base?  Wonder what that makes my kids since they’ve already got more than me and the wife ever had, despite growing up “middle class”.  

In the percentiles we are discussing, those two people are still in the top percentiles together. That’s hard to fathom because of their difference in means, but that just goes to show you how much different the other 90% or whatever live. I don’t have to worry about my credit card declining, my utilities being turned off, what I’m going to have to give up to buy groceries, how I’m going to pay for a repair, etc which is a different life than the vast, vast majority of people live.

Some of you look around and only see other versions of yourself and think that must be normal, but you are looking at very small samples of what are ultimately outliers in the world.

[RDCanecutter 26239]

Just for the record, y'all can get probably 30 silver spoons for the price of one shitty phone, and they'll pay you back right away because you can't drunk dial on them.

[We’reTexas 1467]

25 minutes ago, Homercles said:

Another notch in the belt for The Wire, at least to me, is how well it showed all the factors that played into a character’s ultimate outcome.  “All the pieces matter”.  Who you rolled with, what (if any) roles the adults played in your life, how lucky you were in a gun fight, etc all influenced where they were at the end of season 5. 

And not to say choice was irrelevant either.  Some had an opportunity to escape and took it (Poot, Cutty, Bubbles), others ignored it (Dukie with Prezbo), some explicitly chose that life and gave exactly that (Snoop, Omar, Prop Joe), and one pawn benefited from fortune and sheer badassery to cross the board to be a queen (Slim Charles).  

This whole shitshow in the past few pages can be summed up by the “Tang” argument in season 2. 

[Gatorubet 30064]

5 hours ago, Porterhouse said:

This. I was fortunate to be the son of a longtime Austin banker who put me through school, and quickly cut me off at the age of 21. I was extremely blessed and am grateful to have what I had growing up, but we weren’t rich.

Guys and gals, I think the point you are all missing is that - unlike the sons and daughters of longtime Austin bankers in the Hood who put their kids through college and cut them off at 21  - he decided not to sell drugs on the corner or jack cars.   

We are talking personal responsibility here, and focusing on goals. Some people apply themselves, others….

[UpperWestside 6104]

5 hours ago, immamac said:

 

Id go even further and that's like sitting in the owners suite watching the plebian baseball players who you toy with. 

I was going to say owner’s suite as well. Good Lord the lack of self-awareness in those posts are simply astounding.

[G650 13990]

9 hours ago, Porterhouse said:

I don’t think some of y’all know true wealth

Lol

[G650 13990]

6 hours ago, Brew said:

In the percentiles we are discussing, those two people are still in the top percentiles together. That’s hard to fathom because of their difference in means, but that just goes to show you how much different the other 90% or whatever live. I don’t have to worry about my credit card declining, my utilities being turned off, what I’m going to have to give up to buy groceries, how I’m going to pay for a repair, etc which is a different life than the vast, vast majority of people live.

Some of you look around and only see other versions of yourself and think that must be normal, but you are looking at very small samples of what are ultimately outliers in the world.

Well said

[DigglerontheHoof 21022]

7 hours ago, DalTxHornFan said:

This argument seems to conflate being born in the USA vs. being born in some desolate hell hole elsewhere.  We all won the lottery if we were born in the USA.

Then lets talk about my advantages.

I was born into a two parent family.  Mom and Dad were actually married.  My Mom was a full-time homemaker.  We spoke English in our home.  I never lacked for food or shelter when I was growing up.

Is that first or second base?

Sounds like me.  I'd say second base arrival. 

[Neonmoon 38127]

It’s scary how many people don’t know what middle class looks like. Middle class income is 25K to 75K in 2021, or up to 151K for a family of four. 

https://www.hellawealth.com/blog/money/what-is-middle-class-in-every-state/

https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2022/04/20/how-the-american-middle-class-has-changed-in-the-past-five-decades/ft_2022-04-20_middleclass_02/

If you considered yourself middle class growing up, your parents made between 20k and 60K back in the day. 

[Captainant 27310]

2 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

It’s scary how many people don’t know what middle class looks like. 

That's our surly business leader and oil baron contingent for ya. Reality is however it looks from their position, and anyone not doing as well as them must be lazy idiots who just can't use their bootstraps 

[Homercles 10205]

[Homercles 10205]

37 minutes ago, Homercles said:

Note this was in reply to spam 

[Aqua Buddha 14488]

8 hours ago, Brew said:

In the percentiles we are discussing, those two people are still in the top percentiles together. That’s hard to fathom because of their difference in means, but that just goes to show you how much different the other 90% or whatever live. I don’t have to worry about my credit card declining, my utilities being turned off, what I’m going to have to give up to buy groceries, how I’m going to pay for a repair, etc which is a different life than the vast, vast majority of people live.

Some of you look around and only see other versions of yourself and think that must be normal, but you are looking at very small samples of what are ultimately outliers in the world.

Well said.  

As someone who works in consumer retail, this is true.  90% of people live month to month.  If you have even a six month cushion, you're far better off than most.

[closetohumping 17380]

14 hours ago, slorch said:

You're right.

Texas sucks.  That's why everyone's leaving.

 

I mean there's a shitton of folks on here saying they're about to allegedly  leave.  They have about as much fight in em as 2 NBA players.  Let's work from what they have to say...

Thats right!!!  Texas ain’t got no room for quitters!!!  Love it or leave it.  
 

 

 

I did.  I left 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Captainant said:

That's our surly business leader and oil baron contingent for ya. Reality is however it looks from their position, and anyone not doing as well as them must be lazy idiots who just can't use their bootstraps 

If I am the former in your post, LO-FUCKING-L.

We start people at $55k/year and benefits.  That is STARTING pay.  We've had requisitions open literally for years.  previous experience in grocery industry preferred, but not required.  Clean driving record required.  Show the fuck up to work, required. Gotta pass a DOT physical( easy.)

You're gonna work for every penny, but it's laughable when punks like you bemoan opportunity.  It's out there.  There's a shit-ton of folks who don't think they need to do THAT, however.  and that is absolutely fine, but you don't get to say life sucks when people are not willing to fully participate. 

Edited August 6, 2023 by slorch

[G650 13990]

8 minutes ago, slorch said:

.  Clean driving record required.  Show the fuck up to work, required. Gotta pass a DOT physical( easy.)

You actually believe this. Interesting

[lemonlime 5503]

Average RN salary in Texas is around $73k, public school teacher $59k, firefighter $52k, police officer $61k.  Obv all these people are not willing to fully participate and deserve to live a lifestyle where they're earning less than half of a middle class salary ($250k).

[Captainant 27310]

6 minutes ago, slorch said:

You're gonna work for every penny, but it's laughable when punks like you bemoan opportunity.  It's out there.  There's a shit-ton of folks who don't think they need to do THAT, however.  and that is absolutely fine, but you don't get to say life sucks when people are not willing to fully participate. 

Just to be clear, you're doing that thing again where you presume anyone not successful and wealthy is just too lazy. Thanks for proving my point, slorch. 

I'm glad you're not a scumbag trying to exploit and underpay your workers, but that makes you the exception. And good on you for doing it, but that's not the norm of cutting costs wherever possible to get the fattest margins

[SydneyCarton 47809]

23 minutes ago, slorch said:

If I am the former in your post, LO-FUCKING-L.

We start people at $55k/year and benefits.  That is STARTING pay.  We've had requisitions open literally for years.  previous experience in grocery industry preferred, but not required.  Clean driving record required.  Show the fuck up to work, required.

You're gonna work for every penny, but it's laughable when punks like you bemoan opportunity.  It's out there.  There's a shit-ton of folks who don't think they need to do THAT, however.  and that is absolutely fine, but you don't get to say life sucks when people are not willing to fully participate.

What is this for? A full time stocker, or checker? 
 

Many of people don’t even know where or how to start looking for work. Yes, there is a lot of “I’m too good for that” out there. But none of that changes the fact that you don’t understand the percentages and reality of how many people are poor and have little to no shot of changing that. Which is literally the mindset that led to the French Revolution. 
 

the average cost of rent in an apt in Houston is 1300. That’s the AVERAGE, which includes all the truly bad shit holes, of which there are MANY in Houston. 55k, cut off 20% for taxes, that’s 44k. Minus 15,600 for rent that’s 27,400. Let’s assume the person owns a shit box car, so no car payment, but let’s say 100 a month for insurance, let’s say 200 a month in gas, 300 in other bills (electric, tv services, internet). Let’s say they drink tap water and eat ramen, so I’ll generously say 150 a month in groceries. That’s 9k a year, so 18,400 left. Let’s hope there’s no other expenses, no doctor visits, no car repairs, and certainly no hope of having or caring for children, because childcare is the same as rent, which would knock your remaining dollars down to 2800 a year, not including feeding and clothing. And god forbid ever buy a new used-car. 
 

I don’t know about you, but that “opportunity” looks like a job that can feed you, but has little chance of even allowing you to enjoy much of your life, definitely no chance to reasonably dream for a better one. 

A VCR salesman in the 80s could support a family, mortgage, cars and still afford to take the family on a vacation every year. Today a teacher in Texas is literally what I described above. 
 

this creates the really bad hopelessness other posters have referenced in the youth. Anecdotally, I’m here at Lost Pines with my family this weekend. It is expensive, and we aren’t skipping anything we want based on price, but the level of disregard for money here is astonishing….by the people that have it. 600 bucks last  I checked for people to rent a cabana, for 4 hours, so they can sit by the lazy river in a covered area, with a tv they aren’t watching, to play on their phones and not talk to their family. I floated by them dozens of times on Friday and Saturday. Those kids will grow up thinking that’s normal. THAT IS NOT WHAT IS NORMAL TO 98% OF THE WORLD.  And there’s 1500 people here right now. And every resort in Texas, probably. 

Edited August 6, 2023 by SydneyCarton