Forbes: The GOP has been playing us for suckers

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20,342]

Those leftist pinkos at Forbes are slamming the President and the GOP with their Fake News again:

By Stan Collender

To say we're all being played by House and Senate Republicans and the Trump administration when it comes to the deficit is my polite way of saying that the GOP is operating the federal equivalent of a huge budget bunco game.

Think of it as three-card monte with you betting billions on which card is the queen of hearts and you'll get the idea.

Still not sure what I mean? Start here.

The Congressional Budget Office last Monday released a report that for the first time officially projected the federal deficit rising to almost $1 trillion in 2019 and then staying at or well above that previously unfathomable level every year through 2028.

 

As I first pointed out in this post, these projections almost certainly underestimate the actual deficit that will occur because CBO assumes that current law will be followed. In this case, that means assuming that the individual cuts put in place by last year's tax bill that are set to phase out will, in fact, expire as scheduled. As Catherine Rampell noted in the Washington Post last Friday, if, as seems likely, the cuts are extended, the budget deficit will be an additional $2.6 trillion higher than what CBO estimated.

Just a few months after the tax bill was signed, the GOP-controlled Congress agreed to increase federal spending and the budget deficit by another $130 billion or so.

Think about this. The same congressional Republicans who over the previous eight years wanted everyone to believe they were fiscal conservatives hell-bent on balancing the budget and not increasing the national debt, sponsored, passed and then danced around the fire because of legislation that will result in a permanent $1 trillion deficit and a debt that will soar to close to 100 percent of GDP by 2028.

 

And...House and Senate Republicans were enabled by a GOP president who during his campaign said he would eliminate the deficit and completely pay off the debt.

But it's not just that congressional Republicans and Trump faked far right and then actually went far left with these two bills that makes what they're doing a federal budget confidence game. They also:

1. Hid the real cost of the tax cut with the phaseouts so they could claim they were being fiscally judicious while they were actually being economically reckless.

2. First insisted the tax cuts would pay for themselves and then admitted in the president's fiscal 2019 budget released several months later that they would actually increase the deficit, big-time.

3. Viciously attacked the nonpartisan and very credible Congressional Budget Office for not producing cost estimates that made it easier for them to do what they wanted.

4. Enacted a huge tax cut that skyrocketed the deficit and a $1.3 trillion fiscal 2019 omnibus appropriation that increased it further and then insisted that the real problem is Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid.

5. Continually complained about mandatory spending but, even though they had the majority in both houses of Congress and control of the White House, didn't seriously try to do anything about it.

6. Refused to do a fiscal 2019 budget resolution because, after first enacting the tax and spending legislation that blasted the annual federal budget deficit to over $1 trillion, didn't want GOP members to have go on record in favor of those same deficits.

7. Kept saying that the deficit problem was because the congressional budget process is broken when, in fact, the process has actually enabled the GOP House and Senate Republican majorities to do exactly what they've wanted to do and hasn't forced them to do anything they've wanted to avoid.

8. First enacted legislation that created the permanent trillion-dollar deficits and then had the unmitigated temerity to demand that the House vote on an amendment to the U.S. Constitution that would make it illegal for the federal government to run deficits.

9. Implied that the tax cuts and military spending increases they support (and the growing interest payments on the debt caused by those tax cuts and military spending increases) don't have an impact on the deficit.

10. Made it clear that, at the same time they want to reduce revenues and increase funds for the Pentagon, only the domestic part of the budget should be cut.

Just like winning a game of three-card monte played on a cardboard box on a street corner, none of what we're being told about the budget by congressional Republicans and the Trump White House is real. But based on how they've operated so far, they obviously think they can keep running this game successfully.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/stancollender/2018/04/15/on-the-deficit-gop-has-been-playing-us-all-for-suckers/#639bccc94694

[F250 28,680]

[David Dennison 18,652]

Democrats always have to clean up a fiscal mess left by Republicans.

[SubliminalHorn 6,673]

But I thought cutting taxes was the epitome of increasing civil liberties and has caused our prosperity?

oh wait, they’re actually putting us on track for a fiscal bomb and possible depression? Well, um, Gorsuch!

Edited July 1, 2018 by SubliminalHorn

[Ragnarok 103]

The deficit is a huge problem. It is slowly devastating the young,  poor and middle class.   Stealth inflation (the government basically just lies about it) is eroding buying power and wages aren't keeping up.   Welcome to the new normal. I've been outraged about it since the government under Obama quit having market interest rates and started having one branch of the government buy debt from another.  It is ludicrous to think one side or the other has any moral high ground here. It is the "establishment", republicans and democrats, doing this to taxpayers.   All of Washington has been complicit in this.  Unfortunately, this is the only area Trump has joined the establishment.

[DaysOff 7,851]

Democrats always have to clean up a fiscal mess left by Republicans.

Both parties are huge pieces of shit when it comes to spending. One is just more upfront about it.

[David Dennison 18,652]

1 minute ago, Ragnarok said:

The deficit is a huge problem. It is slowly devastating the young,  poor and middle class.   Stealth inflation (the government basically just lies about it) is eroding buying power and wages aren't keeping up.   Welcome to the new normal. I've been outraged about it since the government under Obama quit having market interest rates and started having one branch of the government buy debt from another.  It is ludicrous to think one side or the other has any moral high ground here. It is the "establishment", republicans and democrats, doing this to taxpayers.   All of Washington has been complicit in this.  Unfortunately, this is the only area Trump has joined the establishment.

There is no stealth inflation. It's just that wages are not keeping up even with historically low levels of inflation.

Also, the Fed was buying treasuries long before Obama got there.

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20,342]

3 minutes ago, Ragnarok said:

 All of Washington has been complicit in this.  

 

Only one side has the power to do anything about it. The side that controls both houses of Congress and the Presidency. And only one side voted for the massive tax cut and the massive spending increase that is taking our debt-to-GDP ratio to over 100%

TLDR: Screw  you. 

[Pods 7,526]

This both sides shit has jumped the shark and y'all need to stop with it. It was historically true, but the bullshit the GOP has rammed through in the past 2 years has been unprecedented. They deliberately bankrupted the country so they can slash entitlement programs. It's obvious. Call a spade a spade. 

[Lucid 3]

Don't worry about it folks just be sure to get out and vote democrat in november so we can do the things that really matter like abolish ICE

[hobbes2702 12,799]

8 minutes ago, DaysOff said:

22 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Democrats always have to clean up a fiscal mess left by Republicans.

Both parties are huge pieces of shit when it comes to spending. One is just more upfront about it.

Yea and one tries to fund spending by increasing revenue. The other spends and cuts revenue at the same time.

[David Dennison 18,652]

Just now, Pods said:

This both sides shit has jumped the shark and y'all need to stop with it. It was historically true, but the bullshit the GOP has rammed through in the past 2 years has been unprecedented. They deliberately bankrupted the country so they can slash entitlement programs. It's obvious. Call a spade a spade. 

This is what they do.

Democrats have to clean it up by raising taxes because cutting benefits is politically impossible. Republicans know this, which is why they never cut benefits. They just cut taxes. Then when they are out of power, Republicans use the tax increases as a campaign issue.

It never ends.

 

[The People’s Elbow 707]

12 minutes ago, Ragnarok said:

...this is the only area Trump has joined the establishment.

Really...?

[hobbes2702 12,799]

2 minutes ago, Pods said:

This both sides shit has jumped the shark and y'all need to stop with it. It was historically true, but the bullshit the GOP has rammed through in the past 2 years has been unprecedented. They deliberately bankrupted the country so they can slash entitlement programs. It's obvious. Call a spade a spade. 

This is exactly right. This is their plan. Now they can say “well there’s no money for entitlements. Gotta get rid of those.”

[retread 2,951]

Ds pass healthcare legislation. Rs shit the bed and try to destabilize ACA. Rinse and repeat.

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13,546]

Except for a brief time during the first Bush administration, the GOP has done this to one extent or another since the Reagan Revolution. They've gotten away with it for so long that there's really no reason to expend that much energy trying to hide it. There's no reason not to be sloppy. There's a chunk of the country that will reliably reward them no matter what.

[dOUblewide 101]

“Starve the Beast” might actually work out for the pubs.  Assuming: 1) our debt problem will not be addressed until forced upon us and 2) a 1 for 1 exchange of tax increases and spending cuts will likely be required to pass anything significant….along with some currency debasement to inflate the problem away.

It’s better to have your anchor set far to the right before this happens.   

That's a theory anyway. 

[JimmyJames 12,271]

35 minutes ago, Pods said:

This both sides shit has jumped the shark and y'all need to stop with it. It was historically true, but the bullshit the GOP has rammed through in the past 2 years has been unprecedented. They deliberately bankrupted the country so they can slash entitlement programs. It's obvious. Call a spade a spade. 

That is 100 percent without a doubt exactly what they are doing. 

[JimmyJames 12,271]

I propose that we completely all eliminate social security payments and Medicare for the next 20 years. That will eliminate all debt. 

Then in 20 years when I turn 65 we reinstate 100 percent all social security payments and Medicare.

Think that’s selfish? Well that’s exactly what the olds are doing right now. When the country is bankrupt they will be dead and will finally have stopped fucking up this country.  And in 20 years the social security and Medicare payments that they spent won’t be around anymore because the government won’t have enough money to pay it.

Quite the legacy baby boomers. 

[Ragnarok 103]

40 minutes ago, Pods said:

This both sides shit has jumped the shark and y'all need to stop with it. It was historically true, but the bullshit the GOP has rammed through in the past 2 years has been unprecedented. They deliberately bankrupted the country so they can slash entitlement programs. It's obvious. Call a spade a spade. 

There may be some valid reasons to vote for democrats.  I can't personally think of any. But vote for democrats so we can return to fiscal sanity isn't one of them. Call a spade a spade.

[Ragnarok 103]

2 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

I propose that we completely all eliminate social security payments and Medicare for the next 20 years. That will eliminate all debt. 

Then in 20 years when I turn 65 we reinstate 100 percent all social security payments and Medicare.

Think that’s selfish? Well that’s exactly what the olds are doing right now. When the country is bankrupt they will be dead and will finally have stopped fucking up this country.  And in 20 years the social security and Medicare payments that they spent won’t be around anymore because the government won’t have enough money to pay it.

Quite the legacy baby boomers. 

It was bipartisanship that put SS and medicare funds in general revenue, and IOUs in the SS trust fund.

[Ragnarok 103]

49 minutes ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

 

Only one side has the power to do anything about it. The side that controls both houses of Congress and the Presidency. And only one side voted for the massive tax cut and the massive spending increase that is taking our debt-to-GDP ratio to over 100%

TLDR: Screw  you. 

You can't pass a budget without 60 votes in the Senate. The democrats are doing the same thing to you that the republican senate did to us during the Obama years. Grow up. You guys didn't do a damn thing about the deficit except run trillion dollar deficits when you had all 3 branches and 60 votes in the Senate.

[TwiceHorn 31,264]

Yes, the republicans have enaged in unprecedented financial fuckery.  But

1 hour ago, DaysOff said:

1 hour ago, David Dennison said:

Democrats always have to clean up a fiscal mess left by Republicans.

Both parties are huge pieces of shit when it comes to spending. One is just more upfront about it.

Well one party doesn't talk about spending at all, and one lies through it's fucking teeth.

[LongestHorn 759]

48 minutes ago, Ragnarok said:

You can't pass a budget without 60 votes in the Senate. The democrats are doing the same thing to you that the republican senate did to us during the Obama years. Grow up. You guys didn't do a damn thing about the deficit except run trillion dollar deficits when you had all 3 branches and 60 votes in the Senate.

I remember a little financial crisis that cost 8 million jobs and trillions of dollars, but I see your point.

[Mole 4,320]

1 hour ago, The People’s Elbow said:

Really...?

If fiscal irresponsibility is an establishment position, then I'd say it's a fair assessment in this case.

[SideSlip 35]

The GOP must’ve really stepped in it if they’ve flipped Stan Collender against them.

[Huckleberry 32,694]

So that only took them a few decades too many to figure out.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, LongestHorn said:

I remember a little financial crisis that cost 8 million jobs and trillions of dollars, but I see your point.

What exactly is your point?

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20,342]

14 minutes ago, Rex Kramer said:

What exactly is your point?

Let me take a stab at it.  Keynes said that the time for government to deficit spend/prime the pump was when the populace was hurting economically and needed jobs.  But he also said that, when recovery was achieved, that's when we need to repay the debt that we incurred during the financial crisis.  I'm more of a monetarist than a Keynesian and Paul Volcker is one of my idols, but Keynes was right about that this, generally speaking. Instead what we have now is financial recovery and a government that is borrowing like drunken sailors ----- all thanks to the party of fiscal discipline.

 

[relapse98 634]

16 hours ago, Lucid said:

so we can do the things that really matter like abolish ICE

Oh I concur on that. Its as silly as 'drain the swamp' and 'get rid of the existing two parties' - you have to have a replacement plan and none of those silly slogans ever have a solid "and then..." plan.

[sidis 9,732]

13 hours ago, Rex Kramer said:

What exactly is your point?

that it may have had something to do with fiscal and monetary policy for the period from 2009 to 2010?

[Fozzz 152]

Reagan was a crypto-Keynesian.

Quote

If government spending following the Great Recession’s end tracked spending that followed the recession of the early 1980s for the first 27 quarters, governments in 2015 would have been spending an additional trillion dollars in that year alone, translating into several years of full employment even had the Federal Reserve raised interest rates. In short, the failure to respond to the Great Recession the way we responded to the other postwar recession of similar magnitude entirely explains why the U.S. economy is not fully recovered seven years after the Great Recession ended.

https://www.epi.org/publication/why-is-recovery-taking-so-long-and-who-is-to-blame/

[SimonBolivar 10,911]

Where the hell is Emory?

[F250 28,680]

3 hours ago, relapse98 said:

Oh I concur on that. Its as silly as 'drain the swamp' and 'get rid of the existing two parties' - you have to have a replacement plan and none of those silly slogans ever have a solid "and then..." plan.

Abolish ICE isn't a silly idea like drain the swamp. ICE is a recent organization that can and should be dissolved. All of the custom and immigration responsibilities can be restored back to the previous organization's that existed before shit got out of hand. Let's be honest, DHS and ICE were just knee jerk reactions to 9/11. The existence of ICE is just a fart in the wind, we managed to survive through a majority of our nation's history without it.

 

[Js1 85,095]

1 minute ago, F250 said:

Abolish ICE isn't a silly idea like drain the swamp. ICE is a recent organization that can and should be dissolved. All of the custom and immigration responsibilities can be restored back to the previous organization's that existed before shit got out of hand. Let's be honest, DHS and ICE were just knee jerk reactions to 9/11. The existence of ICE is just a fart in the wind, we managed to survive through a majority of our nation's history without it.

 

Yeah it's cute. This country survived for 227 years without it. 

[Fozzz 152]

Repeal the Patriot Act while we're at it. 

[Blotto 23,428]

TSA can get fucked as well.

[Anastasis 23,393]

Cut the military bigly, means test SS, transform medicare into a universal catastrophic coverage plan. ICE and EPA and TSA and whatever don't amount to a mouse fart unless you are willing to touch those three. 

[TwiceHorn 31,264]

1 hour ago, F250 said:

Abolish ICE isn't a silly idea like drain the swamp. ICE is a recent organization that can and should be dissolved. All of the custom and immigration responsibilities can be restored back to the previous organization's that existed before shit got out of hand. Let's be honest, DHS and ICE were just knee jerk reactions to 9/11. The existence of ICE is just a fart in the wind, we managed to survive through a majority of our nation's history without it.

 

Yes, it's recent, but it essentially replaced the INS. It wasn't made from the whole cloth.  I am probably missing something, but the argument to abolish ICE seems rather farcical as it has existed in one form or another since the 30s.

Edited July 2, 2018 by TwiceHorn

[F250 28,680]

28 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Yes, it's recent, but it essentially replaced the INS. It wasn't made from the whole cloth.  I am probably missing something, but the argument to abolish ICE seems rather farcical as it has existed in one form or another since the 30s.

It's a merger of two former agencies which were INS and Customs. The idea isn't to throw out immigration and customs but to reestablish them as separate agencies like they used to be before the creation of ICE.

[David Dennison 18,652]

While we're at it, let's abolish Homeland Security.

[F250 28,680]

1 hour ago, Fozzz said:

Repeal the Patriot Act while we're at it. 

 

1 hour ago, Blotto said:

TSA can get fucked as well.

 

15 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

While we're at it, let's abolish Homeland Security.

[TwiceHorn 31,264]

28 minutes ago, F250 said:

It's a merger of two former agencies which were INS and Customs. The idea isn't to throw out immigration and customs but to reestablish them as separate agencies like they used to be before the creation of ICE.

Actually, its only part of customs, the enforcement part.  CBP still exists as a separate entity and handles the more clerical customs stuff.  If people mean create a different agency, that's what they should say, not "abolish ICE," because all it really ever was was shuffling deck chairs and alphabet soup.  It won't change anything about immigration.

[F250 28,680]

10 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Actually, its only part of customs, the enforcement part.  CBP still exists as a separate entity and handles the more clerical customs stuff.  If people mean create a different agency, that's what they should say, not "abolish ICE," because all it really ever was was shuffling deck chairs and alphabet soup.  It won't change anything about immigration.

It's a catchy phrase, Breakup ICE doesn't have a nice ring to it. Although they probably should pivot to something like "Immigration Reform" that includes breaking up ICE.

[Anastasis 23,393]

Time to put ICE on ICE. 

[Anastasis 23,393]

No DICE ICE

[Anastasis 23,393]

Time to break the ICE

[Anastasis 23,393]

I feel like its a steep cliff. 

[Anastasis 23,393]

[Js1 85,095]

8 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Time to put ICE on ICE. 

I like this one. Make up the bumper stickers, you might end up rich.