2023 Fall Camp Thread of Dominance

[Hornlover 8830]

9 minutes ago, Codaxx said:

Sweat is not a question mark. He was 3rd team All Big 12 by PFF last year. Starting DT is in line with starting WR on the lists of worries for 2023. Collins is a fair criticism. 

 

3 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

This is kind of important.

 

2 minutes ago, SarkAfterDark said:

When did Sweat become a jag? Could have swore we were all hoping he returned instead of taking his shot at the NFL.

Don't get me wrong. I like Sweat, and hope he has a great year. I think he can be effective. He wasn't better than Ojomo or Coburn last year, and I'd like to see a little more disruption in the backfield, but you're right - he's not as big of a question mark as some of the others. 

[BurntOrange&White 39933]

5 minutes ago, Hornlover said:

 

 

Don't get me wrong. I like Sweat, and hope he has a great year. I think he can be effective. He wasn't better than Ojomo or Coburn last year, and I'd like to see a little more disruption in the backfield, but you're right - he's not as big of a question mark as some of the others. 

I'd say he's not really a question mark at all.

 

Both Sweat and Murphy have 3rd-5th round grades. 

Edited August 21, 2023 by BurntOrange&White

[Hookem2147 21283]

37 minutes ago, 6th Street said:

There is enough talent to beat down the likes of TCU, Baylor, etc. Just need better second half coaching from Sark when the other teams make halftime adjustments. 

I already know that the halftime adjustment thing is going to be the most overused bit of the season along with where the corners line up on 3rd and 4th down. If we are down by 1 to Bama at half and come back and win it's because we made halftime adjustments! If we are ahead by 1 at the half and lose on a field goal at the buzzer it is because we didn't make halftime adjustments!

How much face time do you think coaches get with each other and the players in a 20-minute halftime once everyone files into the locker room, coaches get down from the press box, everyone takes a piss and players get any treatment needed from the training staff? The actual time spent in front of a whiteboard in the locker room is maybe maybe 6-7 minutes at most. The notion that you can just sit down and review what a team showed in the first half and draw up plays to counter it in the second half is a major stretch. You can make a few minor tweaks to your original gameplan, give the team a rah-rah speech and it's back out on the field. 

If you think second halves need to be better than that's a preparation thing that needs to be fixed on Sunday through Friday and not during a brief intermission in the middle of the game. 

Edited August 21, 2023 by Hookem2147

[trythisathome 971]

3 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

I already know that the halftime adjustment thing is going to be the most overused cliche of the season along with where the corners line up on 3rd and 4th down. If we are down by 1 to Bama at half and come back and win it's because we made halftime adjustments! If we are ahead by 1 at the half and lose on a field goal at the buzzer it is because we didn't make halftime adjustments!

How much face time do you think coaches get with each other and the players in a 20-minute halftime once everyone files into the locker room, coaches get down from the press box, everyone takes a piss and players get any treatment needed from the training staff? The actual time spent in front of a whiteboard in the locker room is maybe maybe 6-7 minutes at most. The notion that you can just sit down and review what a team showed in the first half and draw up plays to counter it in the second half is a major stretch. You can make a few minor tweaks to your original gameplan, give the team a rah-rah speech and it's back out on the field. 

If you think second halves need to be better than that's a preparation thing that needs to be fixed on Sunday through Friday and not during a brief intermission in the middle of the game. 

Last season Peyton Manning said the same thing on one of his MNF broadcasts. He said that the significance of halftime adjustments is way overblown and that most of halftime is basically spent waiting for the coaches to get down from the box to the locker room. 

[Hookem2147 21283]

"Our sources feel that Arch has moved ahead of Maalik Murphy this month"- IT

[Hookem2147 21283]

1 minute ago, trythisathome said:

Last season Peyton Manning said the same thing on one of his MNF broadcasts. He said that the significance of halftime adjustments is way overblown and that most of halftime is basically spent waiting for the coaches to get down from the box to the locker room. 

It's even more true in the NFL where I think halftimes are only 12 or 13 minutes.

[bejezuz 329]

1 minute ago, Hornlover said:

And two of them are Collins - a fourth year senior who has never shown anything resembling consistency or high effort, and Sweat - a fifth year senior that has trouble shedding blocks and whose main contribution seems to be just being big and clogging up the middle.  You're hoping these guys are Gaskamp candidates that turn into this years' version of Ojomo and Coburn, but like @closetojumping likes to say - I'm from Missouri.

Sweat staying back for another year was a huge win for the defense.  Collins hasn't lived up to the hype, but I'm glad to have him in the rotation.  To write off either is foolish, particularly when they'll have as much or more help at NT and EDGE to support them than we've seen in previous years. 

The defensive line will be anchored by Sorrell and Murphy anyway, and the rest just need to be competent to match last year.  Throw in an improved pass rush with second year Burke and Finkley and the raw talent of Colton Vasek and Anthony Hill, and hopefully all those QB pressures start to result in more sacks.   This seems to be the plan, and I don't see how it won't result in similar results on run defense with a chance to improve our pass defense up front.  ILB will be the same or better with Ford at Mike and your-guess-is-as-good-as-mine at Will (same as it ever was). 

 You can nitpick individual players, but I think there's plenty of room for optimism for the defense as a whole.    You either believe that PK, Davis, and Choate can coach this combo of talent into a serviceable front 6 or 7 or you don't.  I choose to believe they can.  Combine that with what appears to be the most talented secondary we've had in recent memory, and I see a defense that has a floor that we can win the Big12 with. 

  

[gmr548 16580]

This Is just comical. Your questions on offense boil down to "Some of the players on O had poor results last season". Then, you proceed to say "All of these defensive players, that couldn't even start last year, are likely to be better than the person they're replacing". 
You listed 8 defensive players, only two of which (Ford and Sorrell) were starters last year. The rest were all backups. Yes, they played, but they are mostly unproven. That's why there are so many question marks. 
The offense returns 9 starters (10 if you want to count Cain). Yes, we lose the best RB in the country, but that's also usually one of the easiest positions for a freshman to play, and we have 4 or 5 excellent choices including the #1 RB recruit in the country. Otherwise, the only question surrounding the offense is basically "Will all of the players from last year be better this year?" Much of that hinges on Ewers, but even that's not some big question mark. 
Versus the defense, where we don't have any clue if either Edge can generate pressure consistently or hold the edge against the run. How will a new DT stand up in the middle with starters' snaps? (Murphy has enough track record to not be unproven).  Will Collins or Vasek or Tapp or Finkley or Walton contribute meaningfully? Who's going to play next to Ford? Gbenda, Bush, Blackwell, and all the freshman have questions surrounding them.
The starters in the secondary are likely solid, but we're also expecting lots of contributions from young unproven players. Especially if Catalon gets hurt again. 

Starter has been a pretty arbitrary term on the DL the past two years - to a point of being detrimental at times, Broughton being a consistent feature in the rotation after it was proven he was not as good as the guys in front of him and should have been used more situationally, if at all, is a good example of that. And yet it’s already been proven that a front with those guys collectively playing a bunch of snaps can produce a good defensive unit, which is my point. To act like Sweat, Murphy, or Finkley are “new” because they happened to send someone out on the first play last year is silly because they played a bunch of snaps. There’s a lot of experience in the front.

[Had Enough 2081]

EGAT just did a breakdown of the LB position. Waddlington and Boyd are bullish on Gbenda while acknowledging his shortcomings. Scipio saw improvement from '21 to '22 and made the case that the trend should continue, especially in coverage. He noted that Gbenda may still be playing "wait and see" against the run (rather than being proactive), but that is still better than his strategy of "run around randomly" from 2021. 
Remember, Ford wasn't shit until he was.  

I’m on the Gbenda hype train. One - cause I like to go against the grain. Two - cause I see the positives when others focus on the negatives (I actually flip that based on general perceptions). Three - he’s a ball of thunder. Four - he will play hard and be active.

I watched the UW game again. The long TD run was right at him. Unfortunately the DT was pushed back into this lap. The defender to his left - unblocked and concerned with the fake/qb. I think he read it fine, but the line play (one player) caused the problem.

He only logged 71 snaps in 2022, about a third of 2021. He needs reps to get consistency. I’m not sure he’ll be a 3 down guy so coverage may not be a huge issue. Last year he didn’t play enough to draw any definitive conclusions but PFF graded him well, and there were some positives from his limited snaps. I’d say throw 2021 out the window for a number of reasons.

[Sock Monkey 722]

It feels like every offseason I get sucked into the hype of believing that an upperclassman will finally break out. This year it is Collins, and I think it actually make rational sense. This is his “contract year” and the coaches seem to really believe in him/have specific plans for him. I’d love to see it.

[Hookem2147 21283]

2 minutes ago, Sock Monkey said:

It feels like every offseason I get sucked into the hype of believing that an upperclassman will finally break out. This year it is Collins, and I think it actually make rational sense. This is his “contract year” and the coaches seem to really believe in him/have specific plans for him. I’d love to see it.

It’s a lot more believable for someone like Collins than Naashon Hughes and other ones who have been hyped up in previous years.

[BurntOrange&White 39933]

5 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

It’s a lot more believable for someone like Collins than Naashon Hughes and other ones who have been hyped up in previous years.

I think it's more believable because this staff has shown in such a short time they can develop players. That hasn't been true with proper development in 10-15 years. 

[Jersey Man10 3530]

[thepop 4409]

1 hour ago, Hookem2147 said:

"Our sources feel that Arch has moved ahead of Maalik Murphy this month"- IT

Sure, but I’d still be surprised it Malik isn’t #2 on the depth chart. Don’t want him to transfer at first opportunity. They probably want him and Arch to battle it out for #1 next year before he transfers.

[6th Street 6403]

1 hour ago, Hookem2147 said:

I already know that the halftime adjustment thing is going to be the most overused bit of the season along with where the corners line up on 3rd and 4th down. If we are down by 1 to Bama at half and come back and win it's because we made halftime adjustments! If we are ahead by 1 at the half and lose on a field goal at the buzzer it is because we didn't make halftime adjustments!

How much face time do you think coaches get with each other and the players in a 20-minute halftime once everyone files into the locker room, coaches get down from the press box, everyone takes a piss and players get any treatment needed from the training staff? The actual time spent in front of a whiteboard in the locker room is maybe maybe 6-7 minutes at most. The notion that you can just sit down and review what a team showed in the first half and draw up plays to counter it in the second half is a major stretch. You can make a few minor tweaks to your original gameplan, give the team a rah-rah speech and it's back out on the field. 

If you think second halves need to be better than that's a preparation thing that needs to be fixed on Sunday through Friday and not during a brief intermission in the middle of the game

Fair, let's just say general in game adjustments is an area where Sark needs to improve. He does well on the first couple of drives which are scripted. Then when opposing defenses have had time to adjust he tends to struggle. 

[Catdaddyhorn 3444]

6 minutes ago, thepop said:

Sure, but I’d still be surprised it Malik isn’t #2 on the depth chart. Don’t want him to transfer at first opportunity. They probably want him and Arch to battle it out for #1 next year before he transfers.

For this exact reason I don't expect Sark to name a starter next year until some time after fall camp.  Maybe not even going into our first game next season.  

[Hookem2147 21283]

1 minute ago, 6th Street said:

Fair, let's just say general in game adjustments is an area where Sark needs to improve. He does well on the first couple of drives which are scripted. Then when opposing defenses have had time to adjust he tends to struggle. 

Our 3rd quarter offense was actually fairly decent last year, so it appears to be more of a 4th quarter thing than a "halftime adjustment" thing. We did a better job last year of finishing games in the 4th quarter than 2021. Now we need to take another step on that front. 

[cmontexas 3271]

Collins is an much a defensive end as Malcom Roach was a middle linebacker

[Had Enough 2081]

If Levon Kirkland can play MLB at 280, everybody ought to be able to do it.

[Tex Long 4398]

Ultimately, the name of the game is Scoreboard. We averaged 35 points a game, and lost 5 games. Of those losses, 3 were because the O didn't get to the average and 2 were because the D couldn't hold the opponents under 35. If we'd scored 35 every game, we'd have been 11-2 instead of 8-5. The bowl game is not really pertinent, other than showing a lack of urgency from all concerned, so I'ma ignore that. None of the losses were blowouts – in fact, they were all basically single scores. What the record shows is that improvement on either side of the ball, with no dropoff on the other side, should be enough to get to 10 wins in the first 12 games.

Of course, one of the losses was a combination of losing our starting QB and a couple of bad zebra calls, and that can certainly happen again, and under the greater circumstances seems more likely than not. Still, all else being more or less equal, I'm feeling pretty good.

Let's ride.

[Hornlover 8830]

1 hour ago, bejezuz said:

Sweat staying back for another year was a huge win for the defense.  Collins hasn't lived up to the hype, but I'm glad to have him in the rotation.  To write off either is foolish, particularly when they'll have as much or more help at NT and EDGE to support them than we've seen in previous years. 

I'm not writing off either. I'm just pointing out that there are lots more questions surrounding our DL and LBs than there are on offense. 

[PTINS 3468]

34 minutes ago, Had Enough said:

I’m on the Gbenda hype train. ... he’s a ball of thunder and he will play hard and be active.

I watched the UW game again. The long TD run was right at him. Unfortunately the DT was pushed back into this lap. The defender to his left - unblocked and concerned with the fake/qb. I think he read it fine, but the line play (one player) caused the problem.

Last year he didn’t play enough to draw any definitive conclusions but PFF graded him well, and there were some positives from his limited snaps. I’d say throw 2021 out the window for a number of reasons.

1 hour ago, Park Gothic said:

EGAT just did a breakdown of the LB position. Waddlington and Boyd are bullish on Gbenda while acknowledging his shortcomings. Scipio saw improvement from '21 to '22 and made the case that the trend should continue, especially in coverage. He noted that Gbenda may still be playing "wait and see" against the run (rather than being proactive), but that is still better than his strategy of "run around randomly" from 2021. 

Remember, Ford wasn't shit until he was.  

1 hour ago, CastHorn said:

Gbenda’s Cinco Ranch tape is some of the best ILB tape you’ll find at the HS level. 

I would offer that Gbenda's results reflect his coaching and the players around him, good and bad. 

A LB in the middle is impacted by other players more so than most others.

Hiring the position coaches before the Defensive Coordinator is not conducive to having a consistent defensive philosophy, which we are all painfully aware of.

Blitzing from centerfield or sitting on your heals and waiting and then "running around randomly" is more symptomatic of braindead coaching rather than player execution.

Hager's style of "setting the edge" and consistently taking himself our of the play puts a lot of pressure on LB. Having your DL thrown into your lap while an unblocked teammate watches doesn't help.

Gbenda's a 5th year player who will benefit from better coaching and athletes around him, and I look froward to him delivering the goods. 

[Codaxx 5739]

8 minutes ago, Hornlover said:

I'm not writing off either. I'm just pointing out that there are lots more questions surrounding our DL and LBs than there are on offense. 

I think both have 2 questions with the starting group..  OL- the 2 guards

DL- Buck and LB next to Ford.. I dont think Ovie is tough to replace. He was solid vs the run and offered 0 pass rush. That is should not be tough to replace, if PK wants a similar profile. The LB spot will regress some. Lot will depend on HIll's development/usage. 

 

 

Edited August 21, 2023 by Codaxx

[SuperSport 1333]

1 hour ago, Hookem2147 said:

I already know that the halftime adjustment thing is going to be the most overused bit of the season along with where the corners line up on 3rd and 4th down. If we are down by 1 to Bama at half and come back and win it's because we made halftime adjustments! If we are ahead by 1 at the half and lose on a field goal at the buzzer it is because we didn't make halftime adjustments!

How much face time do you think coaches get with each other and the players in a 20-minute halftime once everyone files into the locker room, coaches get down from the press box, everyone takes a piss and players get any treatment needed from the training staff? The actual time spent in front of a whiteboard in the locker room is maybe maybe 6-7 minutes at most. The notion that you can just sit down and review what a team showed in the first half and draw up plays to counter it in the second half is a major stretch. You can make a few minor tweaks to your original gameplan, give the team a rah-rah speech and it's back out on the field. 

If you think second halves need to be better than that's a preparation thing that needs to be fixed on Sunday through Friday and not during a brief intermission in the middle of the game. 

Counterpoint:

[BurntOrange&White 39933]

6 minutes ago, SuperSport said:

Counterpoint:

I think we were dominating that game 

[theorangeblood 23]

2 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

I think we were dominating that game 

But we clearly weren't doing our job.

[SuperSport 1333]

I think you mean dominanting.

[Post Oak 20213]

12 minutes ago, SuperSport said:

Counterpoint:

I love that psycho.

 

[HenryJames 66052]

34 minutes ago, Had Enough said:

If Levon Kirkland can play MLB at 280, everybody on Surly ought to be able to do it.

 

[Park Gothic 5038]

1 hour ago, Had Enough said:

I’m on the Gbenda hype train. One - cause I like to go against the grain. Two - cause I see the positives when others focus on the negatives (I actually flip that based on general perceptions). Three - he’s a ball of thunder. Four - he will play hard and be active.

I watched the UW game again. The long TD run was right at him. Unfortunately the DT was pushed back into this lap. The defender to his left - unblocked and concerned with the fake/qb. I think he read it fine, but the line play (one player) caused the problem.

He only logged 71 snaps in 2022, about a third of 2021. He needs reps to get consistency. I’m not sure he’ll be a 3 down guy so coverage may not be a huge issue. Last year he didn’t play enough to draw any definitive conclusions but PFF graded him well, and there were some positives from his limited snaps. I’d say throw 2021 out the window for a number of reasons.

You're exactly right about the UW game. I just rewatched that play and Broughton is double teamed right into Gbenda's lap. Ford was supposed to cover the inside lane and took himself out of position. Not on Gbenda.

For reference (at 2:48): 

 

That doesn't mean he'll be world beater. More than anything it confirms my belief that Broughton is a liability whose ass should be firmly glued to the pine. 

[BurntOrange&White 39933]

 

[UTEE97 3521]

IT hyping up Arch over Maalik makes me wonder if they have an NIL deal or lining one up with Arch. Didn't they do the same thing with Card?

[kevwun 15788]

I don't think they can afford to to sign a deal with Arch.

[Pig Bellmont 8718]

4 minutes ago, UTEE97 said:

IT hyping up Arch over Maalik makes me wonder if they have an NIL deal or lining one up with Arch. Didn't they do the same thing with Card?

You’re right to be suspicious but I think Arch over Malik on the depth chart isn’t surprising 

[perfectchaos007 6642]

Didn’t Sark keep depth charts internal last year? I doubt that changes this year 

[Hook1997 5354]

14 minutes ago, UTEE97 said:

IT hyping up Arch over Maalik makes me wonder if they have an NIL deal or lining one up with Arch. Didn't they do the same thing with Card?

Arch has stated he won’t be taking any NIL money until he’s a starter.  

[Park Gothic 5038]

6 minutes ago, perfectchaos007 said:

Didn’t Sark keep depth charts internal last year? I doubt that changes this year 

I'm not sure if you mean during the preseason or just in general, but the team definitely released depth charts before games. 

[Hookem2147 21283]

7 minutes ago, perfectchaos007 said:

Didn’t Sark keep depth charts internal last year? I doubt that changes this year 

They didn’t release one to the media until an hour or so before kickoff of game 1.

[Bevo14 8311]

18 minutes ago, SuperSport said:

I think you mean dominanting.

[Longhornlove 4829]

1 hour ago, cmontexas said:

Collins is an much a defensive end as Malcom Roach was a middle linebacker

You should feel embarrassed for posting this. There are articles declaring him the best DE in Texas High school. By all accounts he plays much better on the edge than up the middle.

[Sir Ulrich 5187]

1 hour ago, thepop said:

Sure, but I’d still be surprised it Malik isn’t #2 on the depth chart. Don’t want him to transfer at first opportunity. They probably want him and Arch to battle it out for #1 next year before he transfers.

We will have 2 opportunities in the first 3 weeks to have backups play the 4th. Sark isn't going to waste reps on Murphy if Arch has already supplanted him. Also if Murphy is already falling behind he will want a fresh start in the spring at whatever school takes him. There will be a equal or better option than Murphy in the portal that can push Arch and give some insurance behind him

[gmr548 16580]

I don't think they can afford to to sign a deal with Arch.

They owe on Card’s NIL deal through 2031 like a bad NBA contract

[texifornia 56961]

 

[Codaxx 5739]

41 minutes ago, Park Gothic said:

You're exactly right about the UW game. I just rewatched that play and Broughton is double teamed right into Gbenda's lap. Ford was supposed to cover the inside lane and took himself out of position. Not on Gbenda.

For reference (at 2:48): 

 

That doesn't mean he'll be world beater. More than anything it confirms my belief that Broughton is a liability whose ass should be firmly glued to the pine. 

This.. Broughton plays DT on roller skates. If anyone enjoys watching Broughton play, it is @Burt Macklin

Edited August 21, 2023 by Codaxx

[futureman 22462]

3 hours ago, 6th Street said:

There is enough talent to beat down the likes of TCU, Baylor, etc.

[Yesh 915]

5 minutes ago, Sir Ulrich said:

We will have 2 opportunities in the first 3 weeks to have backups play the 4th. Sark isn't going to waste reps on Murphy if Arch has already supplanted him. Also if Murphy is already falling behind he will want a fresh start in the spring at whatever school takes him. There will be a equal or better option than Murphy in the portal that can push Arch and give some insurance behind him

I disagree.  I think even if Arch is ahead of Murphy, even if Sark knows right now that Arch will be the starter next year, Murphy will take garbage time reps first all year.  If Quinn had a major injury that would be different.

[Had Enough 2081]

That doesn't mean he'll be world beater. More than anything it confirms my belief that Broughton is a liability whose ass should be firmly glued to the pine. 

The UW is a good game to watch for this year. They’re well coached with good talent including a capable QB. They missed some throws on us, but we battled and didn’t make the throws easy. They coach to their advantage so they identify some of our disadvantages.

There are good examples of how we need to be more physical and sometimes sacrifice yourself to allow someone else to finish.

[Ghost of Shag 2608]

1 hour ago, SuperSport said:

Counterpoint:

I love that man.

[Bevo 13577]

22 minutes ago, Codaxx said:

This.. Broughton plays DT on roller skates. If anyone enjoys watching Broughton play, it is @Burt Macklin

Roller skates you say:

[Codaxx 5739]

3 minutes ago, Bevo said:

Roller skates you say:

+1.. I didnt see that one coming