Maui is on fire

[Hpara759 1778]

1 hour ago, SuperSport said:

Ok, I have to ask a dumb question. Obviously desalination isn't economical at present for our general water shortage issues, but is seawater an option for firefighting and/or de-risking areas of extreme wildfire danger? Just seems crazy that a spot literally on the coast could go up so quickly.

 

[Fudge Nuggets 19190]

37 minutes ago, FartingMonk said:

It's used all the time.  We practiced with it with industrial fire fighting.  

Yep, when an offshore O&G facility goes boom those boats alongside spraying thousands of gallons of water ain't bringing it with them.

[Wally Pryor 5261]

6 to 7 hours in the ocean beat the alternative. 

https://weather.com/news/weather/video/teen-evades-approaching-maui-fire-hours-pass-in-ocean

[Hank_Hill 18807]

7 hours ago, SuperSport said:

Ok, I have to ask a dumb question. Obviously desalination isn't economical at present for our general water shortage issues, but is seawater an option for firefighting and/or de-risking areas of extreme wildfire danger? Just seems crazy that a spot literally on the coast could go up so quickly.

Chinooks have been here dropping ocean water for 2 days, it just wasn’t possible at the time.

[Hank_Hill 18807]

From what I’ve heard providing care at the hospital and shelters, whatever the official reported death count is isn’t close. 

[Hank_Hill 18807]

14 hours ago, honolulu horn said:

I want to quote this -- this is the best place to donate. HCF will give 100% of all funds directly to victims and restoration. They will not take anything for operating or admin costs. My wife works closely with HCF and with many families in Maui, and she knows firsthand that HCF will do right by any money donated. Please give what you can. 

@Baboontyme

[InkaUtexas 25941]

FYI. Put this on the baseball thread. I know how the nation came to support Bastrop so anything I can do for Maui I will. 

BTW, damn nice shirts. 

 

[Trey3216 15346]

3 hours ago, InkaUtexas said:

FYI. Put this on the baseball thread. I know how the nation came to support Bastrop so anything I can do for Maui I will. 

BTW, damn nice shirts. 

 

Is that Negan’s bat ‘Lucille’? 

[InkaUtexas 25941]

No idea. Son sent me the link. Cool company that does a lot of good. Either way, I look forward to my shirt being stolen. All my shirts from them have been snagged by the missus. 

[Hank_Hill 18807]

Government ineptitude is making things very frustrating. They closed all non official access to Lāhainā so all of the supplies that weren’t fema official that people have bought and collected independently (a fuck ton) were not being allowed through. People obviously used boats to get around that issue via beach drops. They then opened the roads allowing people from Lāhainā to go grab supplies in town and then promptly shut them down again leaving said people stuck in Kahului. Madness. 

[Underdog 28633]

On 8/9/2023 at 11:24 PM, Beau Vine said:

So sad.  Went to a couple of Maui Classics when I lived in Honolulu, and those games were epic.

Would be the only reason for me to ever visit over there. 

[BrazilHorn 6606]

Just so fucked up. What a terrible way to go. Some of the survival stories are just crazy. 

[Herbie Hancock 7348]

Ok, I have to ask a dumb question. Obviously desalination isn't economical at present for our general water shortage issues, but is seawater an option for firefighting and/or de-risking areas of extreme wildfire danger? Just seems crazy that a spot literally on the coast could go up so quickly.

The answer to your question is complex and not short. The shirt is no, it's not feasible for a fire truck to do this.

[Trey3216 15346]

3 hours ago, Hank_Hill said:

Government ineptitude is making things very frustrating. They closed all non official access to Lāhainā so all of the supplies that weren’t fema official that people have bought and collected independently (a fuck ton) were not being allowed through. People obviously used boats to get around that issue via beach drops. They then opened the roads allowing people from Lāhainā to go grab supplies in town and then promptly shut them down again leaving said people stuck in Kahului. Madness. 

They tried to do that during Harvey and all of us that were down there told them to go fuck their own faces.   

[RPM 26321]

Modern fire trucks may not do this, but older engines used the hydrant water to cool the engine so they wouldn't overheat in heavy use. Not sure you'd want salt water in your engine.

[Smax 3800]

4 hours ago, Hank_Hill said:

Government ineptitude is making things very frustrating. They closed all non official access to Lāhainā so all of the supplies that weren’t fema official that people have bought and collected independently (a fuck ton) were not being allowed through. People obviously used boats to get around that issue via beach drops. They then opened the roads allowing people from Lāhainā to go grab supplies in town and then promptly shut them down again leaving said people stuck in Kahului. Madness. 

 

 

No non essential personal need to be in Lāhainā right now, its an active disaster zone filled with toxic materials. I know residents want to get back and inspect the damage but there is nothing they can do and its not going anywhere. I'm seeing videos of people sifting through debris without PPE, IDIOTS, that stuff is toxic. No one was wearing gloves let alone respirators, hello asbestos and countless other carcinogens, not to mention there are downed powerlines, nails and screws everywhere.

Edited August 12, 2023 by Smax

[Baboontyme 2812]

I understand why they shut it back down. When I drove through there were a bunch of people parked on the side of the bypass overlooking town taking pictures and videos and some even venturing down below into the blast zone. 

[FartingMonk 3606]

2 hours ago, RPM said:

Modern fire trucks may not do this, but older engines used the hydrant water to cool the engine so they wouldn't overheat in heavy use. Not sure you'd want salt water in your engine.

I think during the ITC fire.  They threw a 5 inch hose into the channel and has it hooked into a pump that had a ton of 3 inch splitters so people were dragging hand lines into the flames until the on scene said WTF are you weekend warriors trying to kill yourself for.  Let the fucker burn.  Pull the fuck back.

[Hank_Hill 18807]

4 hours ago, Smax said:

 

 

No non essential personal need to be in Lāhainā right now, its an active disaster zone filled with toxic materials. I know residents want to get back and inspect the damage but there is nothing they can do and its not going anywhere. I'm seeing videos of people sifting through debris without PPE, IDIOTS, that stuff is toxic. No one was wearing gloves let alone respirators, hello asbestos and countless other carcinogens, not to mention there are downed powerlines, nails and screws everywhere.

There’s literal tons of supplies sitting over here doing nothing. They could open the bypass to get to the thousands of people camping in Kaanapali, Napili, Kahana while closing access to the lower roads to Lahaina proper. And they sure as shit shouldn’t have opened it allowing people to make supply runs to Kahului for their families and then trapping them on this side

[Hank_Hill 18807]

5 hours ago, Trey3216 said:

They tried to do that during Harvey and all of us that were down there told them to go fuck their own faces.   

Yea Kai Lenny and the Slater bros are leading an aquatic charge the last 2 days

[Wally Pryor 5261]

89 dead, and counting. 

Dear lord.

Quote

Maui Police Chief John Pelletier said two of the 89 victims have been identified so far, adding that identifying the dead is extremely challenging because “we pick up the remains and they fall apart.”

https://apnews.com/article/maui-hawaii-fires-lahaina-destruction-evacuation-38ec0d6a5c610035a0a72b804fcdffe0

[Hank_Hill 18807]

Every first responder I’ve talked to at the hospital and shelter basically says quadruple that.

[FartingMonk 3606]

Are the stories true of haoles snorkeling and diving right off the coast of Lahaina ?

[Hank_Hill 18807]

I’m sure some of those that stayed in Kaanapali are still livin it up. Fuck faces were out there golfing in front of evacuee camps the next day. That said by and large the tourist community has been very respectful and helpful.

[Hank_Hill 18807]

A concerning amount of people here are pumping the DEW theory as the cause. Maybe I’m just a sheep.

[GhostOfTomJoad 9324]

1 hour ago, Hank_Hill said:

A concerning amount of people here are pumping the DEW theory as the cause. Maybe I’m just a sheep.

Is this a sneak peek into Joe Rogan's leadoff topic on Monday?

[FartingMonk 3606]

I saw something about the DEW thing.  The green lights over Hawaii a few months ago.  It wasn't done by a government though.  It was actually done buy an evil land developer backed by Black Rock.  High rises and condos are going to be rebuilt for rich haoles to retire.  Rent is going to choke expensive for us locals brah.

[Surly Bevo 24908]

"People" have a real hard time with Occam's Razor.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13512]

I don’t pretend to know the details but it’s a balancing act with disasters and normal economic activity. 100% you should be respectful of areas in recovery mode especially when they’re actively searching for people but work activity brings needed money into the communities. Turning that off can have impacts that last years.

add to the fact that there is a very vocal group in Hawaii who already call for the halt of tourism even before this disaster. Those voices are amplified now because they see any tourist as disrespectful just by their presence. This horrific tragedy is going to add to their emotions about tourists.

but all issues aside I can’t imagine being in a wildfire much less one that gives you no where to run. Something failed in their emergency response or recognition.

[Wally Pryor 5261]

8 hours ago, Hank_Hill said:

Every first responder I’ve talked to at the hospital and shelter basically says quadruple that.

The Maui police chief was quoted late yesterday that only a tiny piece (3%) of the search area had been covered by cadaver dogs.

So yeah, unfortunately, that could be the case. 

 

[Beau Vine 54230]

On 8/10/2023 at 11:02 AM, HiggyBaby said:

Thanks for the link. My family and I are trying to figure out how to help the local community as best we can with a direct route of funding. A friend of ours runs a tourist business down there and her van and home have been obliterated.

I learned first-hand from the Wimberley floods to never ever ever give money to the Red Cross.

[Baboontyme 2812]

3 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I don’t pretend to know the details but it’s a balancing act with disasters and normal economic activity. 100% you should be respectful of areas in recovery mode especially when they’re actively searching for people but work activity brings needed money into the communities. Turning that off can have impacts that last years.

add to the fact that there is a very vocal group in Hawaii who already call for the halt of tourism even before this disaster. Those voices are amplified now because they see any tourist as disrespectful just by their presence. This horrific tragedy is going to add to their emotions about tourists.

but all issues aside I can’t imagine being in a wildfire much less one that gives you no where to run. Something failed in their emergency response or recognition.

Just want to say that I was expecting a certain amount of hostility from the locals, even before the disaster. I know the history of the islands and had heard that tourists were not well thought of. What I experienced was the opposite. Of course it helps if you are respectful, empathetic, charitable and courteous but the people I encountered were as sympathetic to us for our travel plights as they were to other locals. I'm like I slept in a mall man, these people lost homes, it isn't the same. But the genuine feelings of concern and safety were real and very humbling. It makes me very much want to go back and pump money into the economy when the time is right. Of course I don't have much money left after this ordeal but that is a separate issue. 

[AUS-97HORN 11762]

unfortunately, confirmed total up to 93 and expected to climb much higher.

supposedly over 1,000 still marked as missing -although we know from previous disasters like this, the missing persons number almost always has people double counted, or someone is forgotten to be marked as safe, so lets hope there are a fuckload of triple counted folks on the list.  

Still, that leaves 300-500 folks who havent been able to checkmark as ok.   which unfortunately kinda matches up with Hank Hill's 1st responder estimates. 

[Wally Pryor 5261]

That toll was from early this morning so I'm sure we'll see a revision pretty soon, unfortunately. 

[ClubWhatever 12144]

So what's the preferred charity?

[MrBig 5398]

8 hours ago, Hank_Hill said:

A concerning amount of people here are pumping the DEW theory as the cause. Maybe I’m just a sheep.

I’m with the power lines starting a fire theory. PG&E started many wildfires in California so it’s not like it’s a crackpot conspiracy. 

[InkaUtexas 25941]

2 minutes ago, MrBig said:

I’m with the power lines starting a fire theory. PG&E started many wildfires in California so it’s not like it’s a crackpot conspiracy. 

And the first Bastrop fire. Transmission line fell when we were real dry. 

[Wally Pryor 5261]

15 minutes ago, ClubWhatever said:

So what's the preferred charity?

Anyone but the Red Cross.

We know a lady / artist that sells shirts outside our timeshare so at least we know directly where the money is going. Like so many others, she lost it all.

 

Edited August 13, 2023 by Wally Pryor

[Wally Fairway 5550]

9 minutes ago, MrBig said:

I’m with the power lines starting a fire theory. PG&E started many wildfires in California so it’s not like it’s a crackpot conspiracy. 

Combined with the 60+ mph winds related to the hurricane

[Hank_Hill 18807]

24 minutes ago, MrBig said:

I’m with the power lines starting a fire theory. PG&E started many wildfires in California so it’s not like it’s a crackpot conspiracy. 

Yea, conspiracy theorists have a way of making simple things complicated. Do I believe evil developers and corporations are 100% licking their chops strategizing how they can use this to acquire land? 1000%. I don’t think this was some planned event though.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13512]

Power lines are probably the most likely scenario but you never know if a person did it on purpose especially not anticipating the outcome. Remember when a naval shipyard worker stared a fire on the USS Miami submarine while it was in dry dock. He was out of PTO and needed a break. Half a billion $ in damages later, the submarine was scrapped and he was sentenced to 17 years in prison. 

[Zepol87 9186]

6 hours ago, Beau Vine said:

I learned first-hand from the Wimberley floods to never ever ever give money to the Red Cross.

I learned that from here, I had no idea about the bullshit most charities pull. 

[InkaUtexas 25941]

1 minute ago, Zepol87 said:

I learned that from here, I had no idea about the bullshit most charities pull. 

It is ridiculous. I see that shit everyday. And churches are just as bad as 501's. 

In Bastrop they took in donations, sat on it, and then went around buying land. Now all tax exempt. Buddy worked for one and had storage units full of diapers and baby products. Very little went to those impacted. 

Oh well...... 

[Hook1997 5354]

45 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Power lines are probably the most likely scenario but you never know if a person did it on purpose especially not anticipating the outcome. Remember when a naval shipyard worker stared a fire on the USS Miami submarine while it was in dry dock. He was out of PTO and needed a break. Half a billion $ in damages later, the submarine was scrapped and he was sentenced to 17 years in prison. 

It was a power line, people have a video of it starting behind their house.  They were interviewed on the Hawaii news like yesterday or something.  

[Hank_Hill 18807]

Power line knocked over by directed energy, maybe also by the vaccine. Not 85mph winds though.

[Wally Fairway 5550]

1 hour ago, Hank_Hill said:

Power line knocked over by directed energy, maybe also by the vaccine. Not 85mph winds though.

There is truth in this; also well known that 5G cell service and the vaccine chips make targeting the energy beams much more accurate.

[FartingMonk 3606]

Yeah, there is actually a forestry guy who was a PHD candidate that wrote his dissertation on Maui and especially that area on how severe the risk of wildfires are in that area.  They kinda shrugged it off.  Now a bunch of big news outlets are seeing all those warnings and are going to start asking why more wasn't done.  Apparently 80 of the warning sirens did not go off either.

[Gourmand 7774]

8 hours ago, MrBig said:

I’m with the power lines starting a fire theory. PG&E started many wildfires in California so it’s not like it’s a crackpot conspiracy. 

Yep. My in-laws lived in Paradise CA and lost everything in that monster fire and are signed on to the class action suit against PG&E. My father-in-law was driving kids to school that morning and barely made it out. His burned out school bus was all over the news. I can't even talk to them about this horrific Maui fire because I don't think they have fully processed what they went through. 

Wildfires suck.

 

[Hank_Hill 18807]

This kinda shit still being said by multiple people over there 72 hours in is fucking infuriating.

[Brisketexan 105139]

7 hours ago, Hank_Hill said:

This kinda shit still being said by multiple people over there 72 hours in is fucking infuriating.

Shit like this happened in the wake of Katrina as well.  My truck and trailer was the first sign of relief supplies, workers, relief ANYTHING, to reach Slidell, 3 days after the floodwaters subsided.

As a country, we are not well-equipped to respond to large-scale disasters, and I really don't know why.  Hawaii has a huge military presence.  Why they aren't tasked with some logistics has always baffled me.  They are THE gov't organization that knows how to hop to it and be on the ground somewhere in 24 hours.  "FEMA" my ass.  FEMA does fine on a smaller scale, and a slower scale.  But for acute emergency response on a massive scale, this is one of the reasons you have a military.