Well Written Content Twilight In T-Town: The End of the Nick Saban Era

[InkaUtexas 25,426]

I laughed. 

 

[TexArcher 37,455]

1 hour ago, Js1 said:

With that OL? We might have had 10 sacks on a less mobile QB. 

And 20 if holding had been a penalty.

I'd like to think that says more about our front 7 than about their O line, but it's almost certainly both.

[52-80 19,066]

I look forward to bumping this thread in november

[closetojumping 62,132]

2 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

I look forward to bumping this thread in november

Well, that's part of the fun. If I'm wrong, the mockery is always entertaining. That said, if they're anything less than 10-2 when you come back with the pot shots, you didn't really read anything I wrote. I'm not predicting a losing season or an immediate cliff fall for the program. 

[HtownHorn 14,446]

Any other QB besides Milroe is probably knocked out of the game. The pass rush was intense and the hits were stacking up in the 2nd half. Milroe's athleticism alone accounted for 4 or 5 missed sack opportunities that their other QBs would have been taken to the ground. If anything a drop back QB would have resulted in a worse loss for Alabama, even with their OL holding on literally every play.

[Duane Moore 5,236]

1 hour ago, Mother mopar said:

I noticed a few times where Bama was making stupid mistakes and Saban was upset but not like the years before. He would literally give out free colonoscopies to coaches and players for jumping offsides. He's not the same guy now.

 

1 hour ago, FloridaHorn said:

Before Saturday, I would have swore that Saban had sold his soul to the devil and would coach until he was 120 years old. During the game Saturday I noticed on several occasions that Saban had the look of a beat down old man. His comments after the game did nothing to change my mind. In years past, Saban would have publicly castrated his players for making multiple stupid mistakes and penalties, yet on Saturday he just shook his head and moved on. As we age, we all reach a point where we realize that we are not as good as we once were, and that day has come for both Bama and their beloved head coach. 

I’m not ready to shovel dirt on the Alabama program just yet, and they may make a 12 team playoff a few times if he sticks around, but these comments I quoted above track with something I noticed as well on Saturday. Compare his demeanor on the sideline as we made big plays against them, or when they had TD’s wiped out by penalties, or gave us the first down jumping offsides to ice the game, to his reaction just last year when they were having a tough time with Tennessee:

 

I think he knows the end is near for him  

 

[HtownHorn 14,446]

9 minutes ago, TexArcher said:

And 20 if holding had been a penalty.

I'd like to think that says more about our front 7 than about their O line, but it's almost certainly both.

I think it says a lot about our DL and the coaching staffs desire to attack the freshmen LT, which they told Solomon Williams to watch what we do to their freshman LT.

[Brothahorn 10,085]

1 hour ago, closetojumping said:

 

Heading into the 2001 season, Florida State had finished each of the prior 14 seasons in the AP top 5. That's a feat above what Alabama has accomplished over a similar period. FSU won 2 titles during that run, which is obviously eclipsed by Bama's 6. 

If you had a time machine and could go back to the beginning of the 2001 season and argue online with other fans that Florida State would never finish in the top 5 again during Bowden's tenure, and they'd lose 4 games that season, 3 by double digits including once at home, and finish the season ranked a measly #15, people would have pointed at you and laughed. 

"Florida State just reloads, closetojumping." "It's Bobby Bowden. They'll be fine. He's showing no signs of slowing down." "I'm not betting against FSU and Bobby Bowden."

And few folks did bet against FSU and Bobby Bowden. FSU opened the 2001 season ranked #6 in the country. 

"Only #6, CTJ?" 

Well, yes. But numerous magazines and pundits had them playing for it all because ... Bobby Bowden. 

In reality, there were cracks starting to turn into fissures in the foundation of Bowden's program at FSU and they were about to start truly showing for all to see. 

FSU had to replace a Heisman-winning QB, multiple skill and OL talents taken in the NFL draft, and the majority of their top defensive talent, also taken in the draft the prior spring. Bowden saw long-time OC, Mark Richt, take a prized job at Georgia earlier that year. Instead of going out and finding a talented up and comer to replace the OC, as Bowden had done most of the time when losing an assistant, he did something different this time. He hired his son, Jeff Bowden, because, "hey, he's Bobby Bowden." 

The talent that FSU needed to simply "reload" didn't appear in the same ways as it previously did. Turns out, while they certainly still had plenty of talent, the recruiting services were bumping recruits regularly by then in FSU's favor because they were giving Bowden the benefit of the doubt. Whoops. All of those recent top 5 classes being stacked up by FSU turned out to produce more like top 20-ish classes, which is how those teams wound up finishing in the AP, if at all, over those final 9 years of Bowden. 

Bobby Bowden turned 71 during that 2001 season. 

closetojumping, what does any of that have to do with Alabama and Nick Saban?

Well, there is literally zero link between the two regimes. I'm not claiming there is. I'm merely pointing out that the similarities are eerie. 

Nick Saban enters the 2023 season 71 years old. 

Alabama this year opened the season in the top 4 of the polls. Many pundits have picked them to win or play for the national title. "Nick Saban and Alabama just reload. " "I'm not betting against Nick Saban. " "It's Nick Saban. He's showing no signs of slowing down."

Alabama entered the 2023 season having to replace 16 starters. 10 of those players were drafted in the prior spring's NFL draft. One of those starters in need of replacing was a Heisman-winning QB. Another was the best defensive player in the country. 

On top of that, Saban had to replace both of his coordinators. While he didn't hire one of his children, he did make two comfort hires. He had the chance to hire Kevin Steele as his DC on two separate occasions when the role was open and Steele was on staff. Saban went in a different direction. Now he's got someone who will do what he's told.

On the offensive side, he's hired a younger guy who he's given marching orders in regard to returning the offense to a "murderball" approach in which they just crush less talented teams under the weight of their superior talent in the running game and short passing game. He thought he could do so, and was lauded for doing so by guys like Josh Pate (his murderball segment from this summer, in hindsight to those who weren't paying attention and laughing back then, will give you a laugh now) because "hey, he's Nick Saban."

But CTJ, Alabama's still stacking top 3 recruiting classes back to back for cycles on end. Last year's class was #1 in the country, for Christ's sake.

All of that is also true. That considered, show me the same ol'dynamic, Heisman-esque players at the skill positions on offense. Malik Becton was being lauded, laughably, as a coup of a pick-up from the juco ranks this summer. I don't even know if he caught a pass on Saturday. The TBs are all highly ranked and all look very pedestrian. If a freshman was good enough, they'd be playing. Look across the sidelines last Saturday and you can see that. Outside of Downs and McKinstry, who stood out on defense in the back 7? Hell, where was Oatis on the DL for most of the game? Tell me what Dallas Turner did that anyone should remember. 

Did any of that look like a top 5 team to you? It shouldn't, because it isn't. Alabama could very well go 10-2 in the regular season this year, mostly because the SEC looks like 13 dwarves and Georgia. Alabama could also go 8-4 because they're not just going to out-talent UTenn, LSU, or Ole Miss. 

Gravity gets even the highest flyers and, as we know, it's a shock sometimes when it happens. 

It's one season, closetojumping. Bama will load up, crush it in the transfer portal, and be right back on top next season. 

Maybe. But there are significant differences in the college football environment today than in the past, and Saban isn't handling them well. 

1) The transfer portal requires significant money. Bama isn't the wealthiest group going after the same players. 

2) Transfer players already know what they're looking for in a new team. QBs know what kind of offense they want to run, and it isn't "murderball". WRs can go anywhere. Why would one choose Bama if USC, Texas, Washington, Ohio State or Tennessee wants them? The beat goes on.

3) NIL has leveled the playing field on Saban's magical competitive advantage in high school recruiting. Bama isn't 1 of 10 bidding on the best players. Bama is 1 of 90 going after the same guys and they don't have any more money than most of those 89 other schools. SMU or TCU can outbid them for a DFW guy, let alone Texas or USC. It's harder to flourish when you can't just show up and walk over your opponent. 

Texas walked into Bryant Denny and took Alabama's soul with it on the way out with a double digit win. They did the same thing when they entered the Big 12 to Nebraska.

"You want partial qualifiers or our brand and money?" "Ok, cool, no more PQs, sorry Nebraska."

Then the #3 Cornhuskers walked into the Trans World Dome in St. Louis, threw their helmets on the field and said "give us our trophy" before Texas took their soul and beat them by double digits. That was the beginning of the end for Nebraska. Alabama fans should seek a few of those fans out and get some advice from them on how to cope with all of it, because I know it would be sad to see Bama eventually decide the best answer is to just leave the conference. 

When you let a cancerous asshole into your program, it will eventually destroy you. You will never be able to get rid of the stench.

 

[Brian Fantana 6,654]

He's washed, y'all cooked his ass. The fine young man yelling slurs at y'alls players in this video is gonna have to find another diety to worship.

 

[Sawbonz 27,375]

I think this is a Jimmys and Joes problem. And it’s going to get worse for him all other things being equal

[Brian Fantana 6,654]

Ah shit I shoulda realized someone would have posted that already, oh well

[Js1 85,056]

1 minute ago, Sawbonz said:

I think this is a Jimmys and Joes problem. And it’s going to get worse for him all other things being equal

Based on his comments after the game, was also an X and O problem. Defensively, they had no answer for Sark’s offensive play calling. Steele got embarrassed 

[Neonmoon 38,127]

If a Texas head coach won 6 football championships in a 10 year period, I wouldn't care if he didn't field a team, showed up every Saturday, walked to the middle of the field by himself and took a giant shit before passing out with his pants around his ankles for 5 years straight.

Edited September 11, 2023 by Neonmoon

[PsychMike 1,537]

[HtownHorn 14,446]

1 minute ago, Js1 said:

Based on his comments after the game, was also an X and O problem. Defensively, they had no answer for Sark’s offensive play calling. Steele got embarrassed 

Sark was probably salivating for months thinking about putting Downs and Key in conflict with RPOs and layered passing concepts.

[Sawbonz 27,375]

4 minutes ago, Js1 said:

Based on his comments after the game, was also an X and O problem. Defensively, they had no answer for Sark’s offensive play calling. Steele got embarrassed 

Scheme only comes into play when talent level is comparable. Now that we are on par I definitely think our schemes are superior in the moment. I think Saban can and will address that aspect as he has always been willing to adapt. Ire talent acquisition going forward I’m not sure he has the ability or even desire to do what is necessary on that front 

[NoName 16,271]

1 hour ago, closetojumping said:

 

Heading into the 2001 season, Florida State had finished each of the prior 14 seasons in the AP top 5. That's a feat above what Alabama has accomplished over a similar period. FSU won 2 titles during that run, which is obviously eclipsed by Bama's 6. 

If you had a time machine and could go back to the beginning of the 2001 season and argue online with other fans that Florida State would never finish in the top 5 again during Bowden's tenure, and they'd lose 4 games that season, 3 by double digits including once at home, and finish the season ranked a measly #15, people would have pointed at you and laughed. 

"Florida State just reloads, closetojumping." "It's Bobby Bowden. They'll be fine. He's showing no signs of slowing down." "I'm not betting against FSU and Bobby Bowden."

And few folks did bet against FSU and Bobby Bowden. FSU opened the 2001 season ranked #6 in the country. 

"Only #6, CTJ?" 

Well, yes. But numerous magazines and pundits had them playing for it all because ... Bobby Bowden. 

In reality, there were cracks starting to turn into fissures in the foundation of Bowden's program at FSU and they were about to start truly showing for all to see. 

FSU had to replace a Heisman-winning QB, multiple skill and OL talents taken in the NFL draft, and the majority of their top defensive talent, also taken in the draft the prior spring. Bowden saw long-time OC, Mark Richt, take a prized job at Georgia earlier that year. Instead of going out and finding a talented up and comer to replace the OC, as Bowden had done most of the time when losing an assistant, he did something different this time. He hired his son, Jeff Bowden, because, "hey, he's Bobby Bowden." 

The talent that FSU needed to simply "reload" didn't appear in the same ways as it previously did. Turns out, while they certainly still had plenty of talent, the recruiting services were bumping recruits regularly by then in FSU's favor because they were giving Bowden the benefit of the doubt. Whoops. All of those recent top 5 classes being stacked up by FSU turned out to produce more like top 20-ish classes, which is how those teams wound up finishing in the AP, if at all, over those final 9 years of Bowden. 

Bobby Bowden turned 71 during that 2001 season. 

closetojumping, what does any of that have to do with Alabama and Nick Saban?

Well, there is literally zero link between the two regimes. I'm not claiming there is. I'm merely pointing out that the similarities are eerie. 

Nick Saban enters the 2023 season 71 years old. 

Alabama this year opened the season in the top 4 of the polls. Many pundits have picked them to win or play for the national title. "Nick Saban and Alabama just reload. " "I'm not betting against Nick Saban. " "It's Nick Saban. He's showing no signs of slowing down."

Alabama entered the 2023 season having to replace 16 starters. 10 of those players were drafted in the prior spring's NFL draft. One of those starters in need of replacing was a Heisman-winning QB. Another was the best defensive player in the country. 

On top of that, Saban had to replace both of his coordinators. While he didn't hire one of his children, he did make two comfort hires. He had the chance to hire Kevin Steele as his DC on two separate occasions when the role was open and Steele was on staff. Saban went in a different direction. Now he's got someone who will do what he's told.

On the offensive side, he's hired a younger guy who he's given marching orders in regard to returning the offense to a "murderball" approach in which they just crush less talented teams under the weight of their superior talent in the running game and short passing game. He thought he could do so, and was lauded for doing so by guys like Josh Pate (his murderball segment from this summer, in hindsight to those who weren't paying attention and laughing back then, will give you a laugh now) because "hey, he's Nick Saban."

But CTJ, Alabama's still stacking top 3 recruiting classes back to back for cycles on end. Last year's class was #1 in the country, for Christ's sake.

All of that is also true. That considered, show me the same ol'dynamic, Heisman-esque players at the skill positions on offense. Malik Becton was being lauded, laughably, as a coup of a pick-up from the juco ranks this summer. I don't even know if he caught a pass on Saturday. The TBs are all highly ranked and all look very pedestrian. If a freshman was good enough, they'd be playing. Look across the sidelines last Saturday and you can see that. Outside of Downs and McKinstry, who stood out on defense in the back 7? Hell, where was Oatis on the DL for most of the game? Tell me what Dallas Turner did that anyone should remember. 

Did any of that look like a top 5 team to you? It shouldn't, because it isn't. Alabama could very well go 10-2 in the regular season this year, mostly because the SEC looks like 13 dwarves and Georgia. Alabama could also go 8-4 because they're not just going to out-talent UTenn, LSU, or Ole Miss. 

Gravity gets even the highest flyers and, as we know, it's a shock sometimes when it happens. 

It's one season, closetojumping. Bama will load up, crush it in the transfer portal, and be right back on top next season. 

Maybe. But there are significant differences in the college football environment today than in the past, and Saban isn't handling them well. 

1) The transfer portal requires significant money. Bama isn't the wealthiest group going after the same players. 

2) Transfer players already know what they're looking for in a new team. QBs know what kind of offense they want to run, and it isn't "murderball". WRs can go anywhere. Why would one choose Bama if USC, Texas, Washington, Ohio State or Tennessee wants them? The beat goes on.

3) NIL has leveled the playing field on Saban's magical competitive advantage in high school recruiting. Bama isn't 1 of 10 bidding on the best players. Bama is 1 of 90 going after the same guys and they don't have any more money than most of those 89 other schools. SMU or TCU can outbid them for a DFW guy, let alone Texas or USC. It's harder to flourish when you can't just show up and walk over your opponent. 

Texas walked into Bryant Denny and took Alabama's soul with it on the way out with a double digit win. They did the same thing when they entered the Big 12 to Nebraska.

"You want partial qualifiers or our brand and money?" "Ok, cool, no more PQs, sorry Nebraska."

Then the #3 Cornhuskers walked into the Trans World Dome in St. Louis, threw their helmets on the field and said "give us our trophy" before Texas took their soul and beat them by double digits. That was the beginning of the end for Nebraska. Alabama fans should seek a few of those fans out and get some advice from them on how to cope with all of it, because I know it would be sad to see Bama eventually decide the best answer is to just leave the conference. 

tl;dr version for those of you who can't read:

 

[Wulaw Horn 18,963]

Yeah dude- welcome to the bandwaggon- I've got a seat saved for you- knew you were going to show up eventually- I've just been driving this bus for 18 months mostly by myself.  Honestly surprised it took you so long to find your way on- you are really smart and usually have a lot of foresight into this kind of thing (and are obviously uber plugged into NIL) it's not any more complicated than they have a shit ass state and a small town in the middle of nowhere and are no longer one of only 1/2 a dozen teams seriously engaged in paying players- competing mostly against peer institutions while doing that.  

I like aggy's long term situation better than Bama's if were are telling the truth (similarly look out LSU- Nutra rat pelts aren't a valid form of currency anymore).  

I would presume that the axis of college football power going forward will be Oregon (Nike- as long as Knight is alive), USC, Texas, aggy, Ohio State, Michigan, Georgia, Florida and Domers.  I think Clemson, LSU and Bama are the biggest losers as they are backwater locales with poverty fanbases out in the middle of nowhere that no longer have the competitive advantage cheating.  We saw what happened to OU when they lost the competitive advantage of blatantly cheating and that's good not great program that needed Lincoln Rileys brilliance to prop them up.  I look for Bama post Saban to settle into something like that.  So, better than Nebraska but a lesser light than Texas in it's rise. 

Last year was probably the inflection period between the 2 teams but a Ewers injury made people not realize it until this year.  We kicked their ass in the portal, we beat them for Arch, and their #1 class saw them take 3 or 4 guys that we were like- no thanks- yall can have them.  

Life is good.  We will walk down Georgia sometime soon too.  Kirby Smart is a mouth breathing moron and all that shit about them not being the only cheaters in the game applies too.  That said- they are not as poverty a fan-base as Bama and they are closer to ATL, so they will be just fine.  

College football just became about demographics as much as anything and Texas hit the absolute jackpot.  Can't hardly wait to watch the next 20 years play out.  

 

[closetojumping 62,132]

7 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

I think this is a Jimmys and Joes problem. And it’s going to get worse for him all other things being equal

I defintely think Texas outcoached Bama on Saturday, and I think they out-prepared them as well. In that stadium, against that program, to have no false starts was impressive. Texas looked like they knew what they were in for and played with a plan. Bama looked undisciplined and had way too many penalties. It's a trend for Bama. They've always been viewed as the most disciplined team, but they've had tons of penalties against solid opponents dating to the Texas game last season.

[Wulaw Horn 18,963]

36 minutes ago, Nicole44 said:

Apart from the realignment uncertainty, I am enjoying the parity that comes with the portal and NIL. It gives schools like Colorado or an TCU a shot in the arm of adrenaline so to speak. If you’re good enough coach you can cobble together a Frankenstein-like team and make it to the CFP. If you’re a team like Bama or Georgia swimming in five stars you now have to accept that the viselike grip they have had on college football is no longer the case. Saban knows it. He has known it for a while and he saw that parity on the field last night. On a personal note a shout out and many thanks to @immamac @SquishMitten @RGBIII @Sydney Cartoon @Wulaw Horn and last but not least @closetojumping without you guys (if I am forgetting someone my apologies and thanks to all involved) for drastically helping to improve our roster and our street credentials with recruits. This doesn’t happen without y’all’s help. We are headed in the right direction. Not for a long time have I looked at our roster and thought, “shit we can beat any team we face.” The rest is up to the boys, coaches and Sark but we don’t get that W without the support of y’all and everyone who donates and puts their money and sweat equity where their burnt orange bleeding heart is. Thanks! 

I deserve none of the credit.  I was there when the idea hatched and noped my way out of it b/c I knew how hard the work was going to be. I'm in for like 3k on burnt endz and have more pledged if we ever do a TE camp but not me beyond that.  Those guys made it happen for sure. Sark is awesome. Sark is a great guy. Sark is probably the tie breaker if a bunch of schools are in on a guy out of high school or the portal, but without the cash we'd be in the same place we always were, watching a guy like Kylee Ringo come spend all of spring break in Austin before taking a bag from Georgia.  Bobby Burton, those guys for being the footsoldiers and the big alums for funding it deserve so much credit for this rise.  Now our $200 donors as Jamail used to call it need to step up and also be 200 donors to Texas One and this thing will be cooking with gas.  

[kevwun 15,595]

I was pretty confident they were screwed when Milroe was announced as the starter.  If the other 2 are so bad they couldn't beat him out, there's no hope for them.  He really screwed up letting BoB have a 2nd year. 

[animaltobacco11 107]

29 minutes ago, HtownHorn said:

Any other QB besides Milroe is probably knocked out of the game. The pass rush was intense and the hits were stacking up in the 2nd half. Milroe's athleticism alone accounted for 4 or 5 missed sack opportunities that their other QBs would have been taken to the ground. If anything a drop back QB would have resulted in a worse loss for Alabama, even with their OL holding on literally every play.

Everyone is disparaging Milroe, but dude reminded me of VY in athleticism. He just isn't the passer VY was.

[Wulaw Horn 18,963]

Just now, animaltobacco11 said:

Everyone is disparaging Milroe, but dude reminded me of VY in athleticism. He just isn't the passer VY was.

He's young.  This is equivalent to VY's 2003 year and people wanted to turn him into a WR and Chance Mock had to come bail him out of the Texas Tech game.  He has good touch on the deep ball and a good arm. IF he keeps working at it and improving he can be a really outstanding college QB I think.  

[closetojumping 62,132]

I think Milroe is a damned fine option at QB if you have one of either a dynamic TB or a 1st round caliber WR. Might need both, but Bama has had both together in the past. Milroe is a beast on the ground and he's got quality leadership skills. He needs help. 

Apparently Simpson is just an unmitigated bust. The true freshman might wind up being the guy if they move away from Milroe.

[TrashMaster G 17,379]

31 minutes ago, HtownHorn said:

Any other QB besides Milroe is probably knocked out of the game. The pass rush was intense and the hits were stacking up in the 2nd half. Milroe's athleticism alone accounted for 4 or 5 missed sack opportunities that their other QBs would have been taken to the ground. If anything a drop back QB would have resulted in a worse loss for Alabama, even with their OL holding on literally every play.

It was either our last sack or close to the last one where our guy managed to bring Milroe down despite the fact that he was in the process of being tackled by 'Bama's LT.

No flag, of course.

But they did call one TD back on a holding. That never would have happened with a B12 crew.

[Nicole44 22,023]

3 hours ago, Wulaw Horn said:

I deserve none of the credit.  I was there when the idea hatched and noped my way out of it b/c I knew how hard the work was going to be. I'm in for like 3k on burnt endz and have more pledged if we ever do a TE camp but not me beyond that.  Those guys made it happen for sure. Sark is awesome. Sark is a great guy. Sark is probably the tie breaker if a bunch of schools are in on a guy out of high school or the portal, but without the cash we'd be in the same place we always were, watching a guy like Kylee Ringo come spend all of spring break in Austin before taking a bag from Georgia.  Bobby Burton, those guys for being the footsoldiers and the big alums for funding it deserve so much credit for this rise.  Now our $200 donors as Jamail used to call it need to step up and also be 200 donors to Texas One and this thing will be cooking with gas.  

I’m cash low of late but prospects looking way up so I can regularly contribute again. I’d always get so pissed reading threads after losses and reading posters bitching about how the cupboard was bare or we didn’t have the right recruits or the rankings of the recruits we had were wrong—it’s why I wanted to be involved with Burnt Endz in the first place. So I could at least show up at tailgates when I couldn’t do much else.
 

Now that our cupboard is stocked/ loaded with goodies, the only excuses would be poor play, poor game plan/coaching or injuries. So when people bitch now, there is something more you can do to contribute to a win. even if it’s a small amount bc it pays dividends and pays it forward to attracting the next recruits. Don’t complain if the roster is not to your liking…help out. That way, if we do lose, we can pretty much point to why. It’s not a myriad of things. It’s not the cupboard. Anyway, Saban knows schools can compete. He knows. Many of the Bama fans calling for his head today may not understand, but deep down Saban knows. And if he decides to stay on and coach he knows how hard it will be to win another CFP. 

Edited September 11, 2023 by Nicole44

[tx 3 putt 76,159]

50 minutes ago, Nicole44 said:

Apart from the realignment uncertainty, I am enjoying the parity that comes with the portal and NIL. It gives schools like Colorado or an TCU a shot in the arm of adrenaline so to speak. If you’re good enough coach you can cobble together a Frankenstein-like team and make it to the CFP. If you’re a team like Bama or Georgia swimming in five stars you now have to accept that the viselike grip they have had on college football is no longer the case. Saban knows it. He has known it for a while and he saw that parity on the field last night. On a personal note a shout out and many thanks to @immamac @SquishMitten @RGBIII @Sydney Cartoon @Wulaw Horn and last but not least @closetojumping without you guys (if I am forgetting someone my apologies and thanks to all involved) for drastically helping to improve our roster and our street credentials with recruits. This doesn’t happen without y’all’s help. We are headed in the right direction. Not for a long time have I looked at our roster and thought, “shit we can beat any team we face.” The rest is up to the boys, coaches and Sark but we don’t get that W without the support of y’all and everyone who donates and puts their money and sweat equity where their burnt orange bleeding heart is. Thanks! 

NIL killed Bama’s pay to play scheme that has been in place for years 

[NoName 16,271]

1 minute ago, closetojumping said:

I think Milroe is a damned fine option at QB if you have one of either a dynamic TB or a 1st round caliber WR. Might need both, but Bama has had both together in the past. Milroe is a beast on the ground and he's got quality leadership skills. He needs help. 

Apparently Simpson is just an unmitigated bust. The true freshman might wind up being the guy if they move away from Milroe.

their offense just doesn't have the firepower like they did in years past, kind of across the board.

i know Texas has a very, very good WR room right now but how would Neyor look on that end? or AD Mitchell? even Whittington would be a massive improvement for them.

i thought there was a ton of info out there about how great Justice Haynes is/was but guess he got hurt a few weeks ago?

i think Alabama looks a lot better later in the year than they did this week, but that just isn't an explosive offense right now.

this is a complete and total side note but James Brockermeyer stayed at Alabama? lol

 

[HtownHorn 14,446]

17 minutes ago, animaltobacco11 said:

Everyone is disparaging Milroe, but dude reminded me of VY in athleticism. He just isn't the passer VY was.

The problem for Alabama, Milroe is their best QB and RB, and it took 2 years for Vince to figure out the passing game.

[Mason Ramsey 3,371]

20 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

I think Milroe is a damned fine option at QB if you have one of either a dynamic TB or a 1st round caliber WR. Might need both, but Bama has had both together in the past. Milroe is a beast on the ground and he's got quality leadership skills. He needs help. 

Apparently Simpson is just an unmitigated bust. The true freshman might wind up being the guy if they move away from Milroe.

I think they roll with Milroe or Holstein for this year, and Sayin wins the job as a true freshman next year.

[Not a cat 5,612]

1 hour ago, Nicole44 said:

Apart from the realignment uncertainty, I am enjoying the parity that comes with the portal and NIL. It gives schools like Colorado or an TCU a shot in the arm of adrenaline so to speak. If you’re good enough coach you can cobble together a Frankenstein-like team and make it to the CFP. If you’re a team like Bama or Georgia swimming in five stars you now have to accept that the viselike grip they have had on college football is no longer the case. Saban knows it. He has known it for a while and he saw that parity on the field last night. On a personal note a shout out and many thanks to @immamac @SquishMitten @RGBIII @Sydney Cartoon @Wulaw Horn and last but not least @closetojumping without you guys (if I am forgetting someone my apologies and thanks to all involved) for drastically helping to improve our roster and our street credentials with recruits. This doesn’t happen without y’all’s help. We are headed in the right direction. Not for a long time have I looked at our roster and thought, “shit we can beat any team we face.” The rest is up to the boys, coaches and Sark but we don’t get that W without the support of y’all and everyone who donates and puts their money and sweat equity where their burnt orange bleeding heart is. Thanks! 

Not sure if intentional or a freudian slip, but Sydney Cartoon made me laugh.

[Nicole44 22,023]

Speaking of Saban (felt compelled to tune into the Paul Finebaum Show today) and they had comments from Saban below:

 

[HtownHorn 14,446]

17 minutes ago, NoName said:

their offense just doesn't have the firepower like they did in years past, kind of across the board.

i know Texas has a very, very good WR room right now but how would Neyor look on that end? or AD Mitchell? even Whittington would be a massive improvement for them.

i thought there was a ton of info out there about how great Justice Haynes is/was but guess he got hurt a few weeks ago?

i think Alabama looks a lot better later in the year than they did this week, but that just isn't an explosive offense right now.

this is a complete and total side note but James Brockermeyer stayed at Alabama? lol

 

If I had to rank them it would go Worthy, Mitchell, Burton, Whittington. Burton is a beast, much better this year. That 3rd gear on the long bomb to run away from Thompson is something few WRs in college have.

[BachelorTrek 2,925]

1 hour ago, Nicole44 said:

Apart from the realignment uncertainty, I am enjoying the parity that comes with the portal and NIL. It gives schools like Colorado or an TCU a shot in the arm of adrenaline so to speak. If you’re good enough coach you can cobble together a Frankenstein-like team and make it to the CFP. If you’re a team like Bama or Georgia swimming in five stars you now have to accept that the viselike grip they have had on college football is no longer the case. Saban knows it. He has known it for a while and he saw that parity on the field last night. On a personal note a shout out and many thanks to @immamac @SquishMitten @RGBIII @Sydney Cartoon @Wulaw Horn and last but not least @closetojumping without you guys (if I am forgetting someone my apologies and thanks to all involved) for drastically helping to improve our roster and our street credentials with recruits. This doesn’t happen without y’all’s help. We are headed in the right direction. Not for a long time have I looked at our roster and thought, “shit we can beat any team we face.” The rest is up to the boys, coaches and Sark but we don’t get that W without the support of y’all and everyone who donates and puts their money and sweat equity where their burnt orange bleeding heart is. Thanks! 

SEC-bagmen get outspent and RENDERED IRRELEVANT!

BOOM!

[BachelorTrek 2,925]

13 minutes ago, Nicole44 said:

Speaking of Saban (felt compelled to tune into the Paul Finebaum Show today) and they had comments from Saban below:

 

Such sweet tears of complacent, SMUG, BAMA-JELLY Myopians ready to jump off buildings!  Lulz.

[ztejas 43,244]

2 hours ago, NoName said:

so no, you fucking clown, Alabama does not win that game if they have a QB that can actually pass.

Milroe also hit a couple nice deep balls and found some guys over the middle on big downs (and a 2 pt conversion).

Either way, Bama not having a better passing threat at QB is sort of the point. 

[RDCanecutter 26,239]

1 hour ago, Brian Fantana said:

He's washed, y'all cooked his ass. The fine young man yelling slurs at y'alls players in this video is gonna have to find another diety to worship.

 

Kinda getting a South Boston vibe from that voice and unusually precise enunciation. Local rednecks woulda just thrown a chunk of ice. Either way, The Internet will devour him.

[runthebone 7,929]

Did Saban lose a lot of hair from last year?  Made him look older, I thought, along with our defensive line.

[NashLonghorn 270]

2 hours ago, TrashMaster G said:

It was either our last sack or close to the last one where our guy managed to bring Milroe down despite the fact that he was in the process of being tackled by 'Bama's LT.

No flag, of course.

But they did call one TD back on a holding. That never would have happened with a B12 crew.

A B12 crew would have thrown a flag for NOT holding.

Edited September 11, 2023 by NashLonghorn

[Rimbo 25,752]

4 hours ago, Chili dog said:

Saban’s last great coaching staff now coaches at Texas, save for an upgrade at DC over Golding. 

 

Been thinking along these lines myself.

 

4 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

SEC Shorts - Teams think their seasons are definitely dead

 

That wasn't bad. I laughed more at the ad at the end, though.

 

4 hours ago, Pam Cummings said:

I love bringing 3 or 4 and still getting huge pressure. It's such an advantage.

 

Seeing us get a sack when only rushing 4 during the 3rd quarter... haven't seen us do that in a long time, and that's when I felt we were going to win.

 

3 hours ago, PsychMike said:

 

More like, "Thanks for all you've done for me," but whatever.

 

3 hours ago, closetojumping said:

I defintely think Texas outcoached Bama on Saturday, and I think they out-prepared them as well. In that stadium, against that program, to have no false starts was impressive. Texas looked like they knew what they were in for and played with a plan. Bama looked undisciplined and had way too many penalties. It's a trend for Bama. They've always been viewed as the most disciplined team, but they've had tons of penalties against solid opponents dating to the Texas game last season.

 

The largely mistake-free football was huge. It's almost like Sark, Flood and Banks had played in that stadium before or something. 😉

[PencilPusher 454]

@closetojumping's well written prose is a potent example of a theory that I have held to for some time that says folks in high performance roles (coaching, artistry, leadership) often have a 15 year window where they are at their peak in a role and then for whatever reason performance tails off (age, complacency, boredom, etc.). I see this with music groups. Some of my favorite groups that have had long careers have a 15-20 year run where they put out incredible albums and then begin the slow decline. Sure, they can release an occasional banger or 2 in their later iterations, but the magic is gone. I see this with actors/actresses and senior leaders of major companies. Rarely if ever have I seen a CEO that has been in the same role with a company for more than 15 years lead a transformation of a business when the winds shift. We see it with coaches. The Bowden example is a prime example. We lived it with Mack Brown. St. Darrell Royal realized it and left willingly after his 20th season, 6 years removed from his last national championship and 4 years from his last Top 5 season ending rank.

I think this is likely where Alabama and Saban stand today. Saban has been at Bama for 17 years. The game is shifting around him. His team just got whipped at home in a fashion that hasn't happened since before Saban was coach. Even the mighty Burrow led LSU Tigers didn't dominate Bama in 2019 the way Texas did Saturday night. The signs are all there. I don't expect Bama to pull a Jimbo and go 5-7 this year. Still plenty of talent on the team to do well against their schedule and Saban's left nut could outcoach Jimbo and a bunch of other SEC coaches too. 10-2 feels about right for this Bama team. However, the warning lights are flashing and declines often happen gradually...then suddenly. When we are deigned to play Alabama again as an SEC conference game, won't be surprised to be playing an 8-4 type version of Alabama as opposed to the fierce dragon of old. Whether Saban is still the coach at that time remains to be seen...I'm betting he won't be.

[naija 2,851]

surly = hot take central.

 

[troph 24,548]

If the last decade plus is the baseline and Texas comes in and does something not otherwise done in those baseline years then by definition Bama is down at least this year. Now maybe Bama can “bounce back” and run the table in which case the Texas loss is an anomaly. That’s not the odds on bet to make though. First double digit loss at home? Home win streak of multiple years snapped? OOC win streak snapped? Time will tell but expecting 1 loss in conference it’s a 10-2 team. 2 losses and wow Bama looks on the slide.  None of that takes away from Texas. It still had to be taken away from Bama, and Texas was the team to do it.

Edited September 11, 2023 by troph

[ousux 5,586]

Texas, meatchicken, USC, Notre Dame and Flarda State all undefeated and top 10. What decade is this? Feels like old times again boys, and those were good times

[GreenspointTexas 9,556]

1) fuck bama. I hope they lose out this year. Fuck them for 2009 and last year. Rooting for them is fucking dumb. Take care of business and it wont matter

 

2) id guess the short list is something along the lines of Day, Heupel, and maybe even Dabo/Leipold (if they have great seasons)

 

3) this bama team aint winning more than 9 games this year, jfc. Milroe is a trash QB and their o-line is dogshit

[hookem48 4,631]

Milroe's going to be a huge problem for teams this year, dude learned a lot Saturday night. Bama's going to be just fine.

 

[Atticus 3,919]

6 hours ago, closetojumping said:

I think Milroe is a damned fine option at QB if you have one of either a dynamic TB or a 1st round caliber WR. Might need both, but Bama has had both together in the past. Milroe is a beast on the ground and he's got quality leadership skills. He needs help. 

Apparently Simpson is just an unmitigated bust. The true freshman might wind up being the guy if they move away from Milroe.

Disagree. Milroe is a fine leader when things are going well. He looked shook for most of the game Saturday. The one shot that stood out to me was after a TD pass, he stood there in disbelief, then crossed his arms trying to give off a "yea, i'm that dude" appearance. His face still showed complete disbelief and fear.

He had the same look in his eyes and generally poor body language last year when he played extensive minutes against Arkansas and A&M.

[Not a cat 5,612]

I think you folks saying Milroe sucks don't realize how good our D played.  I thought he was going to suck and he impressed me.  He was the only reason they were even in it, IMO.

Kind of reminds me of when I saw the 2005 Ohio State linebackers and predicted VY would run for 200 (for those that don't remember them, let's just say catfid could tell them apart).  They balled that night and we had to earn it.

[lilMAC25 3,776]

8 hours ago, closetojumping said:

 

Heading into the 2001 season, Florida State had finished each of the prior 14 seasons in the AP top 5. That's a feat above what Alabama has accomplished over a similar period. FSU won 2 titles during that run, which is obviously eclipsed by Bama's 6. 

If you had a time machine and could go back to the beginning of the 2001 season and argue online with other fans that Florida State would never finish in the top 5 again during Bowden's tenure, and they'd lose 4 games that season, 3 by double digits including once at home, and finish the season ranked a measly #15, people would have pointed at you and laughed. 

"Florida State just reloads, closetojumping." "It's Bobby Bowden. They'll be fine. He's showing no signs of slowing down." "I'm not betting against FSU and Bobby Bowden."

And few folks did bet against FSU and Bobby Bowden. FSU opened the 2001 season ranked #6 in the country. 

"Only #6, CTJ?" 

Well, yes. But numerous magazines and pundits had them playing for it all because ... Bobby Bowden. 

In reality, there were cracks starting to turn into fissures in the foundation of Bowden's program at FSU and they were about to start truly showing for all to see. 

FSU had to replace a Heisman-winning QB, multiple skill and OL talents taken in the NFL draft, and the majority of their top defensive talent, also taken in the draft the prior spring. Bowden saw long-time OC, Mark Richt, take a prized job at Georgia earlier that year. Instead of going out and finding a talented up and comer to replace the OC, as Bowden had done most of the time when losing an assistant, he did something different this time. He hired his son, Jeff Bowden, because, "hey, he's Bobby Bowden." 

The talent that FSU needed to simply "reload" didn't appear in the same ways as it previously did. Turns out, while they certainly still had plenty of talent, the recruiting services were bumping recruits regularly by then in FSU's favor because they were giving Bowden the benefit of the doubt. Whoops. All of those recent top 5 classes being stacked up by FSU turned out to produce more like top 20-ish classes, which is how those teams wound up finishing in the AP, if at all, over those final 9 years of Bowden. 

Bobby Bowden turned 71 during that 2001 season. 

closetojumping, what does any of that have to do with Alabama and Nick Saban?

Well, there is literally zero link between the two regimes. I'm not claiming there is. I'm merely pointing out that the similarities are eerie. 

Nick Saban enters the 2023 season 71 years old. 

Alabama this year opened the season in the top 4 of the polls. Many pundits have picked them to win or play for the national title. "Nick Saban and Alabama just reload. " "I'm not betting against Nick Saban. " "It's Nick Saban. He's showing no signs of slowing down."

Alabama entered the 2023 season having to replace 16 starters. 10 of those players were drafted in the prior spring's NFL draft. One of those starters in need of replacing was a Heisman-winning QB. Another was the best defensive player in the country. 

On top of that, Saban had to replace both of his coordinators. While he didn't hire one of his children, he did make two comfort hires. He had the chance to hire Kevin Steele as his DC on two separate occasions when the role was open and Steele was on staff. Saban went in a different direction. Now he's got someone who will do what he's told.

On the offensive side, he's hired a younger guy who he's given marching orders in regard to returning the offense to a "murderball" approach in which they just crush less talented teams under the weight of their superior talent in the running game and short passing game. He thought he could do so, and was lauded for doing so by guys like Josh Pate (his murderball segment from this summer, in hindsight to those who weren't paying attention and laughing back then, will give you a laugh now) because "hey, he's Nick Saban."

But CTJ, Alabama's still stacking top 3 recruiting classes back to back for cycles on end. Last year's class was #1 in the country, for Christ's sake.

All of that is also true. That considered, show me the same ol'dynamic, Heisman-esque players at the skill positions on offense. Malik Becton was being lauded, laughably, as a coup of a pick-up from the juco ranks this summer. I don't even know if he caught a pass on Saturday. The TBs are all highly ranked and all look very pedestrian. If a freshman was good enough, they'd be playing. Look across the sidelines last Saturday and you can see that. Outside of Downs and McKinstry, who stood out on defense in the back 7? Hell, where was Oatis on the DL for most of the game? Tell me what Dallas Turner did that anyone should remember. 

Did any of that look like a top 5 team to you? It shouldn't, because it isn't. Alabama could very well go 10-2 in the regular season this year, mostly because the SEC looks like 13 dwarves and Georgia. Alabama could also go 8-4 because they're not just going to out-talent UTenn, LSU, or Ole Miss. 

Gravity gets even the highest flyers and, as we know, it's a shock sometimes when it happens. 

It's one season, closetojumping. Bama will load up, crush it in the transfer portal, and be right back on top next season. 

Maybe. But there are significant differences in the college football environment today than in the past, and Saban isn't handling them well. 

1) The transfer portal requires significant money. Bama isn't the wealthiest group going after the same players. 

2) Transfer players already know what they're looking for in a new team. QBs know what kind of offense they want to run, and it isn't "murderball". WRs can go anywhere. Why would one choose Bama if USC, Texas, Washington, Ohio State or Tennessee wants them? The beat goes on.

3) NIL has leveled the playing field on Saban's magical competitive advantage in high school recruiting. Bama isn't 1 of 10 bidding on the best players. Bama is 1 of 90 going after the same guys and they don't have any more money than most of those 89 other schools. SMU or TCU can outbid them for a DFW guy, let alone Texas or USC. It's harder to flourish when you can't just show up and walk over your opponent. 

Texas walked into Bryant Denny and took Alabama's soul with it on the way out with a double digit win. They did the same thing when they entered the Big 12 to Nebraska.

"You want partial qualifiers or our brand and money?" "Ok, cool, no more PQs, sorry Nebraska."

Then the #3 Cornhuskers walked into the Trans World Dome in St. Louis, threw their helmets on the field and said "give us our trophy" before Texas took their soul and beat them by double digits. That was the beginning of the end for Nebraska. Alabama fans should seek a few of those fans out and get some advice from them on how to cope with all of it, because I know it would be sad to see Bama eventually decide the best answer is to just leave the conference. 

Iirc, You posted something similar before the game and I agreed with a lot of your arguments… and then I said “but Saban”.

 

I’ll need to see the rest of the season, however I think you’re correct.

[MirrOlure 14,607]

1) fuck bama. I hope they lose out this year. Fuck them for 2009 and last year. Rooting for them is fucking dumb. Take care of business and it wont matter
 
2) id guess the short list is something along the lines of Day, Heupel, and maybe even Dabo/Leipold (if they have great seasons)
 
3) this bama team aint winning more than 9 games this year, jfc. Milroe is a trash QB and their o-line is dogshit

Sooo….


……money line ‘Bama the rest of ‘23