Israel-Hamas war thread

[Nice Guy Eddie 13509]

Seems crazy to me to think that rules, competency and morals are to be followed in a war, especially now that we can kill people in a way where the operator is more detached than they if they were playing a video game.

I imagine that there is a small percentage of the heroes in Arlington Cemetery that were killed accidentally by fellow Americans. And in the same wars, innocent civilians are killed at a higher rate.

I'm very much a pacifist but also a realist when it comes to how war operates. What is occurring in Gaza has been occurring for centuries or thousands of years.

[InkaUtexas 25877]

Just now, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Seems crazy to me to think that rules, competency and morals are to be followed in a war, especially now that we can kill people in a way where the operator is more detached than they if they were playing a video game.

I imagine that there is a small percentage of the heroes in Arlington Cemetery that were killed accidentally by fellow Americans. And in the same wars, innocent civilians are killed at a higher rate.

I'm very much a pacifist but also a realist when it comes to how war operates. What is occurring in Gaza has been occurring for centuries or thousands of years.

Agree, but I still have hope we can get better as a race. I mean kill the leaders, and yes civilians are at risk, but this? Full blockade? What does that accomplish other than punishing the civilians? This is doubly true is Israel is to be believed that Hamas has all the food and medicine it needs hidden somewhere.

[956 Worldwide 34705]

9 minutes ago, Hagbard Celine said:

i don't think it's where "anyone is at" but conversely occam's razor: this is trending towards the simplest explanation

this isn't the gulf war with infrared green-screen nightvision from 20 miles away

the level of technology that israel has makes "excuses" implausible explanations

the bibby batphone doesn't just "go down for 3 minutes"

We need to talk about the munitions, too.  Per Bellingcat and all the photos, there is lots of evidence pointing to an inert or low-yield missile. Which is what you use for precision strikes normally on high-value targets. That suggests a lot of coordination and planning for this. 
 

Sorry, Israel has to have a better explanation than “our bad.”  So far they haven’t got one.  If you fuck up and triple tap WCK and make sure they are all dead you need to say who the fuck you THOUGHT you were after. 
 

I don’t think we will get one.  This one fucking stinks and it sure as shit seems like they want Gazans going hungry and all the aid workers out so they have a free-fire zone. 

[Brisketexan 105084]

We need to talk about the munitions, too.  Per Bellingcat and all the photos, there is lots of evidence pointing to an inert or low-yield missile. Which is what you use for precision strikes normally on high-value targets. That suggests a lot of coordination and planning for this. 
 
Sorry, Israel has to have a better explanation than “our bad.”  So far they haven’t got one.  If you fuck up and triple tap WCK and make sure they are all dead you need to say who the fuck you THOUGHT you were after. 
 
I don’t think we will get one.  This one fucking stinks and it sure as shit seems like they want Gazans going hungry and all the aid workers out so they have a free-fire zone. 

This.

Here’s the problem. Israel is saying “whoops it was a mistake.” The problem is…I don’t believe them. I believe that they are lying.

“It was an accident. I was cleaning my gun and it went off…three times.” I don’t believe stupid lies. And you shouldn’t either.

[FartingMonk 3606]

They are practicing never again and their never again means a dead Hamas and whoever is in their way

[Brian Fantana 6683]

2 hours ago, Skipper said:

That's a stretch.  I know you are prone to emotional posting lately

On 10/28/2023 at 1:49 PM, Skipper said:

If you are pro "cease fire" you are supporting Hamas.  Full stop.   

Hot damn I love keeping receipts

[Hagbard Celine 10852]

i understand why the idf has to keep going, in to the last corner of the last cave, including areas they haven't been in yet

but like jules for brad, i had been trying REAL HARD to have tolerance for how they are going about it, and my tolerance broke yesterday

[Skipper 6130]

1 hour ago, Brian Fantana said:

Hot damn I love keeping receipts

A post from 10/28?  Really? Wasn't that around the time of start of the Israeli invasion?  At some point Israel crossed a line but it certainly wasn't in October by my view.   But we're venturing out of current news territory bringing up old posts so I'll leave it at that.

[Brian Fantana 6683]

21 minutes ago, Skipper said:

A post from 10/28?  Really? Wasn't that around the time of start of the Israeli invasion?  At some point Israel crossed a line but it certainly wasn't in October by my view.   But we're venturing out of current news territory bringing up old posts so I'll leave it at that.

I'm just messing with you. Emotions were high from everyone in that month.

[Brian Fantana 6683]

Anyone else find it weird that the OSINT nerds that constantly post in here salivating about and dissecting IDF operations have been dead ass quiet since this incident went down?

[Harrison Stafford 3335]

Between Hamas and the IDF, the Palestinian people don’t have a prayer.

[Brisketexan 105084]

56 minutes ago, Hagbard Celine said:

i understand why the idf has to keep going, in to the last corner of the last cave, including areas they haven't been in yet

but like jules for brad, i had been trying REAL HARD to have tolerance for how they are going about it, and my tolerance broke yesterday

This.

Israel has a right to defend itself.

Israel had and has the right to go after Hamas as a military force to destroy it, and to take all reasonable measures to free the hostages.

In any military action of any consequence, there will be collateral damage and deaths.  The level of carelessness can vary, and culpability along with it, but even the best-conducted modern military operation will lead to some civilian casualties.  It is a price of war (and a really good reason to fucking avoid starting an armed conflict).

Nobody -- not Israel, or anyone else -- has the right to commit genocide.

The statements of multiple senior Israeli officials, including several directly connected to high-level military decision making, express plainly genocidal goals (drive all Gazans out of Gaza.  That is flat-out genocide).

The purposeful actions of the IDF have furthered not just the goals of "going after Hamas," but also the goals of "drive all Gazans from Gaza."  When you tie the plain statements made by Israeli leadership (Brisket rule: when people tell you what they are, and what they intend to do, FUCKING BELIEVE THEM) with the actions of the IDF, culminating in THREE strikes against WCK vehicles that were identifiable and indeed pre-cleared to travel....fuck that shit.  Israel gets no more benefit of the doubt.

[Thetexashammer 1062]

2 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

This.

Here’s the problem. Israel is saying “whoops it was a mistake.” The problem is…I don’t believe them. I believe that they are lying.

“It was an accident. I was cleaning my gun and it went off…three times.” I don’t believe stupid lies. And you shouldn’t either.

In this post, you state the following:

Quote

It is indisputable that Israel is purposefully targeting civilians and civilian resources/structures.  Numerous high-ranking Israeli officials have said so, plainly. 

You are, to be kind, experiencing hallucinations. Israel said no such thing.

If Israel is targeting civilians, I will advocate for the US to withdraw its support and for a war crimes tribunal to be established, similar to Nuremburg. As we did with Milosevic and his ilk, and we should do to Putin and his cronies and his whole fucking country, they should be tried and executed for war crimes.

The issue is, Israel doesn't target civilians. You stated they "plainly" confessed to the crime. No they didn't. The end. It's not worth discussing.

 It's no different than you stating that Israel has made a strategic decision to starve them out. But they are working with Egypt, the US, and many NGO to bring tens of thousands of tons of food into Gaza. Your argument make no sense. If they do that, I will condemn them. But they are not doing that.

There are literally teenagers fighting for their lives, I absolutely get that they shoot first and pick up the pieces later. No soldier is a philosopher king, possessed of perfect knowledge and able to execute the morally perfect tactical maneuver. It's not a movie or a video game.

I am going to donate $500 to WCK, they deserve it.

LOL you just repeated you hallucinatory claim. Do you have a link to their confession?

[Brisketexan 105084]

1 minute ago, Harrison Stafford said:

Between Hamas and the IDF, the Palestinian people don’t have a prayer.

And maybe they never did.

The Palestinian/Israeli conflict was always headed for genocide, I guess.  Everyone loses, because your choices are 1) end up being the party genocided, or 2) end up being the party that becomes a global pariah because you committed genocide.

Enough people on each side wanted and insisted on a final battle of extermination of their enemies.  They got what they wanted.  It's fucking stupid and evil, but they got what they wanted.

[Thetexashammer 1062]

5 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

And maybe they never did.

The Palestinian/Israeli conflict was always headed for genocide, I guess.  Everyone loses, because your choices are 1) end up being the party genocided, or 2) end up being the party that becomes a global pariah because you committed genocide.

Enough people on each side wanted and insisted on a final battle of extermination of their enemies.  They got what they wanted.  It's fucking stupid and evil, but they got what they wanted.

When your population doubles in 20 years, it's hard to understand a claim of genocide. 

As for you statement that all of Israel want them gone, of course. So do I. So should you. The only actual solution to the problem is to put physical distance between the two groups. Meaning, Israel need to be outside of Hamas missile range.  A desire for peace does not equal genocide.

Get back to me when Israel shuts down food shipments and you will have my 100% support.

Edited April 3 by Thetexashammer

[Hagbard Celine 10852]

if vlad wasn't busy fucking his cousins this would be done and dusted and an UN occupation force would already be on the ground

as it stands we can't do deals right now so benny has a free hand that hamas didn't game out

everyone should donate a jackson to WCK - if there are any dependents left behind they should never want for need

[Hagbard Celine 10852]

9 minutes ago, Harrison Stafford said:

Between Hamas and the IDF, the Palestinian people don’t have a prayer.

okay - you bring up my big beef - where the fuck is the rest of the arab world on this?

it's like they are more than happy to have palestine be israel's proxy punching bag so they don't have to get their hands dirty

if syria and the sauds wanted helsinki and a 2-state hamas would have never got to 2007

[956 Worldwide 34705]

4 minutes ago, Thetexashammer said:

In this post, you state the following:

You are, to be kind, experiencing hallucinations. Israel said no such thing.

If Israel is targeting civilians, I will advocate for the US to withdraw its support and for a war crimes tribunal to be established, similar to Nuremburg. As we did with Milosevic and his ilk, and we should do to Putin and his cronies and his whole fucking country, they should be tried and executed for war crimes.

The issue is, Israel doesn't target civilians. You stated they "plainly" confessed to the crime. No they didn't. The end. It's not worth discussing.

 It's no different than you stating that Israel has made a strategic decision to starve them out. But they are working with Egypt, the US, and many NGO to bring tens of thousands of tons of food into Gaza. Your argument make no sense. If they do that, I will condemn them. But they are not doing that.

There are literally teenagers fighting for their lives, I absolutely get that they shoot first and pick up the pieces later. No soldier is a philosopher king, possessed of perfect knowledge and able to execute the morally perfect tactical maneuver. It's not a movie or a video game.

I am going to donate $500 to WCK, they deserve it.

LOL you just repeated you hallucinatory claim. Do you have a link to their confession?

I gotta be real man, and I’ve supported Israel’s right to defend itself aggressively- they haven’t been working very fucking hard to let aid in.  It’s been pulling teeth to get them to do anything. 
 

The take from the administration is correct, if you break a place you own it and if they aren’t going to do relief work as you invaded then at a bare minimum you need to dedicate IDF forces to protect aid workers.  When we’ve gone in heavy it’s always been with a plan to secure civilian essentials.

[Brisketexan 105084]

1 minute ago, Thetexashammer said:

Do you have a link to their confession?

Israeli finance minister:

Quote

The comments underscore fears in much of the Arab world that Israel wants to drive Palestinians out of land where they want to build a future state, repeating the mass dispossession of Palestinians when Israel was created in 1948.

"I welcome the initiative of the voluntary emigration of Gaza Arabs to countries around the world," Smotrich said in a statement. "This is the right humanitarian solution for the residents of Gaza and the entire region after 75 years of refugees, poverty and danger."

He said an area as small as the Gaza Strip without natural resources could not survive alone, and added: "The State of Israel will no longer be able to accept the existence of an independent entity in Gaza".

Official intelligence ministry proposal:

Quote

Israel acknowledged Monday that one of its ministries drafted a wartime proposal to transfer the Gaza Strip’s 2.3 million people to Egypt’s Sinai peninsula, drawing condemnation from the Palestinians and worsening tensions with Cairo.

Israeli troops on the ground in Gaza:

Quote

The Israeli soldiers stand rifles in hand, arm over shoulder, speaking to the camera. Behind them is the shell of a Gazan building.

“We are here adding light after the black sabbath that the people of Israel had,” one of the men says in the video, circulating on Telegram. “We are occupying, deporting, and settling. Occupying, deporting, and settling. Did you hear that Bibi? Occupying, deporting, and settling.”

National Security minister proposing his "solution" to the Gaza problem (side note: Jesus tapdancing Christ, the ironic word choice alone - I presume he means a "final solution" to the problem):

Quote

“We must promote a solution to encourage the emigration of the residents of Gaza,” far-right National Security Minister Itamar Ben-Gvir said on January 1.

It is a plainly stated goal to remove Gazans from Gaza.  Driving an entire people out of their home is bullseye-genocide.

Enough.  Israel has abused the latitude that they had and deserved.  They have decided to become the monster.  Enough.

[Thetexashammer 1062]

3 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

I gotta be real man, and I’ve supported Israel’s right to defend itself aggressively- they haven’t been working very fucking hard to let aid in.  It’s been pulling teeth to get them to do anything. 
 

The take from the administration is correct, if you break a place you own it and if they aren’t going to do relief work as you invaded then at a bare minimum you need to dedicate IDF forces to protect aid workers.  When we’ve gone in heavy it’s always been with a plan to secure civilian essentials.

I have almost zero situational awareness of what's happening on the ground. I welcome more information on all of that. To be fair, it's a war zone, it's a little tense.

[Thetexashammer 1062]

4 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Israeli finance minister:

Official intelligence ministry proposal:

Israeli troops on the ground in Gaza:

National Security minister proposing his "solution" to the Gaza problem (side note: Jesus tapdancing Christ, the ironic word choice alone - I presume he means a "final solution" to the problem):

It is a plainly stated goal to remove Gazans from Gaza.  Driving an entire people out of their home is bullseye-genocide.

Enough.  Israel has abused the latitude that they had and deserved.  They have decided to become the monster.  Enough.

Again, the permanent solution is to remove the Palestinians to outside of missile range of the Israelis. We all want that, even you I hope.

[Brisketexan 105084]

8 minutes ago, Thetexashammer said:

As for you statement that all of Israel want them gone, of course. So do I. So should you. The only actual solution to the problem is to put physical distance between the two groups. Meaning, Israel need to be outside of Hamas missile range.  A desire for peace does not equal genocide.

Actually, the solution you just proposed - driving the ENTIRE population out of Gaza - is literally textbook genocide.  Drive out Hamas?   No.  Drive out EVERYONE.  That's the stated Israeli goal.  Which is a confession of genocide.

Quote

Get back to me when Israel shuts down food shipments and you will have my 100% support.

They just.  Fucking.  Did.  They did it by blowing up three separate vehicles of the most recognized, most impeccable food distribution NGO on this planet.  Israel imposed the policy by killing WCK workers as a warning.  It fucking worked.  The ships full of food?  They all turned back.  That's EXACTLY how you shut down food shipments.  It's the guaranteed, time-honored way to shut down aid: kill the aid workers.

Yet you still support Israel's actions.

A country and people can be wronged, and can be justified in responding.....yet can ALSO respond in a way that is an independent wrong.  If I cheat you out of your delivery of widgets, you are wronged, and you are justified in taking action (sue me for breach of contract).  You are NOT justified in responding by slaughtering my entire family, including members who have nothing to do with my business, burning our house down, and claiming a desire to drive us out of Texas altogether.

Israel was wronged.  It could and should respond and defend itself.

It cannot commit genocide. 

[Brisketexan 105084]

1 minute ago, Thetexashammer said:

Again, the permanent solution is to remove the Palestinians to outside of missile range of the Israelis. We all want that, even you I hope.

AKA, "Ethnic cleansing."  Cleanse Gaza of Palestinians.

Jesus Fucking Christ on a goddamned popsicle stick, credit to you for having the guts to openly advocate ethnic cleansing.  At least we can't claim that you were trying to hide your evil.

[Thetexashammer 1062]

3 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Actually, the solution you just proposed - driving the ENTIRE population out of Gaza - is literally textbook genocide.  Drive out Hamas?   No.  Drive out EVERYONE.  That's the stated Israeli goal.  Which is a confession of genocide.

They just.  Fucking.  Did.  They did it by blowing up three separate vehicles of the most recognized, most impeccable food distribution NGO on this planet.  Israel imposed the policy by killing WCK workers as a warning.  It fucking worked.  The ships full of food?  They all turned back.  That's EXACTLY how you shut down food shipments.  It's the guaranteed, time-honored way to shut down aid: kill the aid workers.

Yet you still support Israel's actions.

A country and people can be wronged, and can be justified in responding.....yet can ALSO respond in a way that is an independent wrong.  If I cheat you out of your delivery of widgets, you are wronged, and you are justified in taking action (sue me for breach of contract).  You are NOT justified in responding by slaughtering my entire family, including members who have nothing to do with my business, burning our house down, and claiming a desire to drive us out of Texas altogether.

Israel was wronged.  It could and should respond and defend itself.

It cannot commit genocide. 

I can live with a "genocide" that doesn't involve killing anyone. In fact, it involves a whole lot less killing and war. Peace, you even might call it. But you hate that LOL.

The palestinians are human beings. They need to move to a place where they can be citizens and get on with their lives. Being dominated by Hamas, living in Gaza, it offers them nothing.

[Brian Fantana 6683]

9 minutes ago, Thetexashammer said:

Again, the permanent solution is to remove the Palestinians to outside of missile range of the Israelis. We all want that, even you I hope.

Imagine just flat out admitting you love genocide.

[Brisketexan 105084]

7 minutes ago, Thetexashammer said:

I can live with a "genocide" that doesn't involve killing anyone. In fact, it involves a whole lot less killing and war. Peace, you even might call it. But you hate that LOL.

The palestinians are human beings. They need to move to a place where they can be citizens and get on with their lives. Being dominated by Hamas, living in Gaza, it offers them nothing.

Ethnic.

Cleansing.

And to top it all off, ethnic cleansing accomplished by destroying most every place they could live, and starving them out.

Quote

The official United Nations definition of ethnic cleansing is "rendering an area ethnically homogeneous by using force or intimidation to remove from a given area persons of another ethnic or religious group."

......

Ethnic cleansing in the broad sense—the forcible deportation of a population—is defined as a crime against humanity under the statutes of both the International Criminal Court (ICC) and the International Criminal Tribunal for the Former Yugoslavia (ICTY).

If Hamas was doing the same to Israelis, you'd be shrieking from the highest mountaintops about crimes against humanity.  

And for your stupid-ass solution....."being dominated by Hamas." If that is the case for Gazans, and is their destiny....how would that be any different if they were shoved into the Sinai (oh, and maybe ask the sovereign state of Egypt whether it's cool with letting Israel functionally seize Egyptian land to create a pseudo-Palestinian state).  For fuck's sake, man....this is fucking sick shit.

Edited April 3 by Brisketexan

[statsman 5456]

Israel’s problem isn’t solved by pushing Palestinians away. They are Iran’s proxies. Hamas has missiles because Iran supplies them (and to Hezbollah). 
 
Since we’re talking about Senitics here, can I ask about semantics? If driving a people away is “genocide”, can we then say that Germany (and most of Europe, and the Arab world of the mid 20th century) were successful in their genocide? Since they drove almost all of the Jews away?

Edited April 3 by statsman

[Brisketexan 105084]

3 minutes ago, statsman said:

can we then say that Germany (and most of Europe) were successful in their genocide? Since they drove almost all of the Jews away?

Ummmmm....yeah.  They were pretty damned successful in their ethnic cleansing: they killed 6 million jews, and made it so inhospitable that even after the war, remaining jews wanted to GTFO.  That's why....and follow me here....campaigns intended to drive out a people, using all manner of techniques but definitely including brutal violence, are fucking criminal.

[royiv 9275]

35 minutes ago, Thetexashammer said:

I have almost zero situational awareness of what's happening on the ground. I welcome more information on all of that. To be fair, it's a war zone, it's a little tense.

Well, at the very basic level, we have video and photographic evidence along with verbal confirmation that IDF targeted three WCK vehicles and killed seven aid workers within the last 36 hours. Subsequently, vessels containing many thousands of tons of food relief turned around and returned to their origin due to Israel’s inability to safely allow the flow of relief into Gaza. Let’s just start there.

[Hagbard Celine 10852]

it doesn't look like it's going to survive the news cycle with the taiwan quake taking over as the international story du jour

[Brian Fantana 6683]

47 minutes ago, statsman said:

Israel’s problem isn’t solved by pushing Palestinians away. They are Iran’s proxies. Hamas has missiles because Iran supplies them (and to Hezbollah). 
 
Since we’re talking about Senitics here, can I ask about semantics? If driving a people away is “genocide”, can we then say that Germany (and most of Europe, and the Arab world of the mid 20th century) were successful in their genocide? Since they drove almost all of the Jews away?

Absolutely. Who would deny this besides groypers on the internet?

[statsman 5456]

54 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Ummmmm....yeah.  They were pretty damned successful in their ethnic cleansing: they killed 6 million jews, and made it so inhospitable that even after the war, remaining jews wanted to GTFO.  That's why....and follow me here....campaigns intended to drive out a people, using all manner of techniques but definitely including brutal violence, are fucking criminal.

Ok. I’ve just seen it, all my life, described as “attempted genocide” of the Jews. 

[Harrison Stafford 3335]

17 minutes ago, Hagbard Celine said:

okay - you bring up my big beef - where the fuck is the rest of the arab world on this?

it's like they are more than happy to have palestine be israel's proxy punching bag so they don't have to get their hands dirty

if syria and the sauds wanted helsinki and a 2-state hamas would have never got to 2007

I could give a long-winded answer involving power, money, social/religious views, etc. in the Arab world, but will make it brief.  The powers that be are indifferent to the Palestinian cause.  In fact, some Middle East regimes have treated their people almost as badly as Israel has treated the Palestinians. Many have spoken for Palestinian rights only because that has given them a semblance of legitimacy in the eyes of their people, but few are ready or capable of walking their talk.  Those with the means to influence events do not mean what they say, and a few who mean what they say, lack the means to follow through.
 

[InkaUtexas 25877]

31 minutes ago, Harrison Stafford said:

I could give a long-winded answer involving power, money, social/religious views, etc. in the Arab world, but will make it brief.  The powers that be are indifferent to the Palestinian cause.  In fact, some Middle East regimes have treated their people almost as badly as Israel has treated the Palestinians. Many have spoken for Palestinian rights only because that has given them a semblance of legitimacy in the eyes of their people, but few are ready or capable of walking their talk.  Those with the means to influence events do not mean what they say, and a few who mean what they say, lack the means to follow through.
 

Fuck it, I will elaborate. There are a few things. 1- It is easier for a Haitian to get US citizenship than a Palestinian in any Gulf State. They will always remember Black September and how the PLO supported Saddam in Kuwait. 2- Though educated, they are not given the professional jobs they deserve. 3- They are seen as a tool for internal controls. If the people in the Gulf are pissed at Israel then they are not pissed internally. 4- They keep pressure from the international world, allowing for the Arab states to position themselves. 5- They are seen as siding with Iran. 6- They allow the leadership to operate, but give very little care about the average person. 7- They don't have $$$$ to go to professional soccer games, except for the leaders, and there are not a lot of them.

Happy to add to this, just don't want to get into CR areas.

[Captainant 27641]

1 hour ago, statsman said:

Ok. I’ve just seen it, all my life, described as “attempted genocide” of the Jews. 

JFC this thread is about to go off the rails

[Anastasis 23464]

 

[Captainant 27641]

Reuters reporting on that interview too

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/chef-jose-andres-says-israel-targeted-his-aid-workers-systematically-car-by-car-2024-04-03/

"This was not just a bad luck situation where ‘oops’ we dropped the bomb in the wrong place," Andres said.

"This was over a 1.5, 1.8 kilometers, with a very defined humanitarian convoy that had signs in the top, in the roof, a very colorful logo that we are obviously very proud of," he said. It's “very clear who we are and what we do.”

...

"They were targeting us in a deconflicting zone, in an area controlled by IDF. They knowing that it was our teams moving on that road ... with three cars," he said.

[Anastasis 23464]

It's absolutely amazing to me that this particular event is what it took to realize a breaking point for some people, but thank god they finally arrived. 

[Schulz2.0 28951]

Ian Bremmer video on Israel/Netanyahu.

[gmr548 16576]

3 hours ago, Thetexashammer said:

Get back to me when Israel shuts down food shipments and you will have my 100% support.

What is three precision strikes on an aid convoy?

Negged again, you piece of shit.

[Da Fino 2777]

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

It's absolutely amazing to me that this particular event is what it took to realize a breaking point for some people, but thank god they finally arrived. 

Have you ever considered that people just don’t want to align with someone like you and would rather be on the really, really, really wrong side of history? 

[956 Worldwide 34705]

1 hour ago, Captainant said:

Reuters reporting on that interview too

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/chef-jose-andres-says-israel-targeted-his-aid-workers-systematically-car-by-car-2024-04-03/

"This was not just a bad luck situation where ‘oops’ we dropped the bomb in the wrong place," Andres said.

"This was over a 1.5, 1.8 kilometers, with a very defined humanitarian convoy that had signs in the top, in the roof, a very colorful logo that we are obviously very proud of," he said. It's “very clear who we are and what we do.”

...

"They were targeting us in a deconflicting zone, in an area controlled by IDF. They knowing that it was our teams moving on that road ... with three cars," he said.

Andres came out strong in on the side of Israel’s right to defend itself. He’s not a contrarian or loon. I remain pro-Israel as a concept but Netanyahu has lost the plot. 

[956 Worldwide 34705]

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

It's absolutely amazing to me that this particular event is what it took to realize a breaking point for some people, but thank god they finally arrived. 

Have you considered that adjusting thinking in reaction to reality is more intelligent than knee-jerk dogmatism.  Just a possibility for you to mull.

[Brian Fantana 6683]

People had to open their eyes at some point. Most Americans just don't really know shit about this conflict. It's fine, I mean it's not, but we all knew it would take some awful tragedy to get it started. It was just a matter of when and how bad.

I'd rather it be this than an invasion/carpet bombing of Rafah. Not that it still can't happen, but yeah.

[Anastasis 23464]

22 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Have you considered that adjusting thinking in reaction to reality is more intelligent than knee-jerk dogmatism.  Just a possibility for you to mull.

A hit dog hollers. 

The reality of what is taking place has been clear for some time. The story arch didn't start Oct 2023. But yes, I applaud your intelligence for breaking when the situation involves a bunch of white people getting blown up instead of the disposable browns that have been stacking by the tens of thousands. 

[Anastasis 23464]

To keep it news-thread-worthy, chart of aid work deaths worldwide over time. If you squint hard enough, you can clearly understand the intelligence behind why the events from this week were the tipping point for some. 

 

 

 

[Anastasis 23464]

33 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

I'd rather it be this than an invasion/carpet bombing of Rafah. Not that it still can't happen, but yeah.

What you got going on next Thursday?

Edited April 4 by Anastasis

[InkaUtexas 25877]

Close the thread. same voices, no news. Move it all to the CR @immamac 

 

[Anastasis 23464]

6 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

no news.

Biggest news week on this thread. NYT told me so yesterday. 

Gaza has been the deadliest place for aid workers since the Oct. 7 attacks. According to the Aid Worker Security Database, a compilation of data on attacks funded by the United States Agency for International Development, 203 aid workers have been killed in Gaza since the war started. All were Palestinian, except for six of the World Central Kitchen workers most recently killed, who were citizens of Australia, the United States, Canada, Poland and Britain. 

 

[Hagbard Celine 10852]

2 hours ago, Anastasis said:

A hit dog hollers. 

The reality of what is taking place has been clear for some time. The story arch didn't start Oct 2023. But yes, I applaud your intelligence for breaking when the situation involves a bunch of white people getting blown up instead of the disposable browns that have been stacking by the tens of thousands. 

this wasn't a reply to me but i'll reply anyway

this is not about white/brown

taking out pre-identified NGO is just pure evil

it's fascist

it's nazi

i can't recall any US takeout of Red Crescent or Red Cross that mirrors what bibby did monday night

i've always felt we were the worst when it came to innocent civilians

this a step beyond that

the next level is IDF package bombs in manhattan.....   wait; wut?