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wc semi 2 :: spear! O clouds, unfold!

Hagbard Celine

By Hagbard Celine
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David Dennison
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HenryJames
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Is that good?

Huckleberry
Huckleberry

What Sterling is doing so far in this match should be part of the strategy for the USA. Absurd athletes threatening the defensive line immediately upon possession changing. Croatia's back line can't e

hayden_horn

hayden_horn 11365

Posted
Posted
Just now, AUS-97HORN said:

the Kane double shot was nixed by the (totally bullshit) offside call by the ref that came AFTER he kicked the 2nd shot... but he counted it like the first shot was offside.

and I guess the deflected header save was missed?

yeah, but the replay would have showed him clearly onside, so i'm counting those shots. that's 4 shots on goal, by my count. croatia is still scored at 7 SOG, which is clearly superior, but england did have their chances

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Fudge Nuggets

Fudge Nuggets 19225

Posted
Posted
18 minutes ago, achooloco said:

So who everyone going for? I’d think Americans root for the underdog (refs not withstanding) but seems like this thread is all about The Surrenders

I’m pulling for France, but I won’t mind one bit if Croatia wins.  I just want a well-played competitive match.

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AUS-97HORN

AUS-97HORN 11824

Posted
Posted (edited)

@hayden_horn  you can count them, but fifa doesnt. the moment the offside flag went up everything that happened was considered to have not happened.

 

and btw that deflected 2nd kick is actually a 4th missed corner-  i forgot about that one.   he wasnt off, and it should have been another corner

 

the 3 missed corners that were obvious were

The ball kicked over the end line right in front of the sideref. 

The header deflected in the 2nd OT, and the Croatia kick that happened I believe early in the 2nd half where their defender kicked the ball away 25 yards from the endline, over the endline.

 

Edited by AUS-97HORN
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hayden_horn

hayden_horn 11365

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, AUS-97HORN said:

@hayden_horn  you can count them, but fifa doesnt. the moment the offside flag went up everything that happened was considered to have not happened.

 

and btw that deflected 2nd kick is actually a 4th missed corner-  i forgot about that one.   he wasnt off, and it should have been another corner

 

the 3 missed corners that were obvious were

The ball kicked over the end line right in front of the sideref. 

The header deflected in the 2nd OT, and the Croatia kick that happened I believe early in the 2nd half where their defender kicked the ball away 25 yards from the endline, over the endline.

 

i'm counting them because the replay would have counted the goal. he was clearly onside. i'm not arguing that fifa should; i understand they won't. but england had more than one chance, which is what poster after poster is saying. it's not true. the far linesman cost england at least three possessions that i counted, out of sheer incompetence.

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Fudge Nuggets

Fudge Nuggets 19225

Posted
Posted
18 minutes ago, AUS-97HORN said:

@hayden_horn  you can count them, but fifa doesnt. the moment the offside flag went up everything that happened was considered to have not happened.

 

and btw that deflected 2nd kick is actually a 4th missed corner-  i forgot about that one.   he wasnt off, and it should have been another corner

 

the 3 missed corners that were obvious were

The ball kicked over the end line right in front of the sideref. 

The header deflected in the 2nd OT, and the Croatia kick that happened I believe early in the 2nd half where their defender kicked the ball away 25 yards from the endline, over the endline.

 

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah

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MaybeACoordinator

MaybeACoordinator 8349

Posted
Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

how did scotland do in the world cup? 

More proof of their aggyness. I have Dutch and German friends on FB too and they are talking about how England choked as well. 

 

EDIT: My friends are actually talking about German and Dutch TV critics are criticizing England, and they know full well that it's stupid for them to do so, given that the Dutch didn't even make it and the Germans flamed out. 

Edited by MaybeACoordinator
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youdunnf'dup

youdunnf'dup 2147

Posted
Posted
55 minutes ago, achooloco said:

So who everyone going for? I’d think Americans root for the underdog (refs not withstanding) but seems like this thread is all about The Surrenders

 

40 minutes ago, JimmyHoffa said:

Croatia population- 4.2 million

US population- 325. 7 million

 

 

Croatia might be the best story of this World Cup. France is France. Definitely rooting for Croatia. Plus, they have the best looking kits in the tournament.

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MoJames

MoJames 8254

Posted
Posted
28 minutes ago, DanTheHorn said:

Croatia is a good story. Experience vs Youth is the story for the next game.

Nah, it will be a story of corruption.

Quote

If you were able to watch the Russia vs Croatia game live, there is little to no chance you managed to miss the appearance of Croatian president Kolinda Grabar-Kitarovic. 

Wearing a bright red suit with the Croatian national team jersey underneath, Grabar-Kitarovic was caught passionately cheering in front of amused Russian PM Dmitri Medvedev as well as Fifa president Gianni Infantino. A couple of days before, after the win over Denmark, she made her way into Croatia’s dressing room making sure to hug every player, some of which weren’t even fully dressed. With one year ahead of presidential elections that move has been interpreted by some as a populist and quite tasteless one, although it’s not as rare to see her on the terraces when the national team plays. 

When it comes to Croatia, politics and football always go hand in hand. And as you would imagine, that isn’t necessarily a good thing. 

Seen next to Grabar-Kitarovic at the Russia game was Damir Vrbanovic, a former Dinamo Zagreb executive and current executive director of the Croatian FA. He is still able to keep his position and travel to Russia alongside the president even though he was sentenced to three years in prison earlier in June, on a set of football-related charges in what is known as perhaps the most publicised trial in Croatian history. In a country that saw their former PM facing jail time that really has to be considered as a real feat. 

But the most prominent figure in that trial is certainly Zdravko Mamic, the former Dinamo executive as well as the man who single handedly controls basically every aspect of Croatian football. Mamic received six-and-half years in jail while his brother Zoran, the former Dinamo manager and a background member of the 1998 Croatia squad, faces four years and 11 months. The verdict confirmed that they claimed illegal profits on the transfers of Dinamo Zagreb players, with Luka Modric and Dejan Lovren being the most renowned faces involved. An investigation showed and trial confirmed that Lovren and Modric unlawfully got half of the transfer fees that Dinamo received from Tottenham Hotspur and Lyon respectively. They then forwarded most of that money to the Mamic family who managed to avoid paying taxes as well.

Zdravko Mamic, who fled to Bosnia and Herzegovina just before the verdict in order to avoid imprisonment, is also a close friend of the president, Grabar-Kitarovic. However, their friendship goes really far. In an interview she gave to Nova TV back in November 2017 Grabar-Kitarovic admitted Mamic organised various events for her, including dinners and – according to some – even birthday parties. Mamic also financially backed her presidential election, resulting with him being a guest of honour during her inauguration ceremony. Although she now denounces the severity of their relationship, Grabar-Kitarovic is still very reserved when talking about it. That’s only the tip of the iceberg known as Mamic’s deep web of connections that range from members of the media all the way up towards politicians and even court officials.

You might say that the football in Croatia is largely used as a cloak in an attempt to cover all the bad things surrounding not only the sport itself but society in general. Ever since Franjo Tudman, the autocratic first Croatian president – who also had an extremely soft spot for using footballers as a unifying element of the society – brought the idea of athletes as “the country’s best ambassadors” to life, politicians opted to use the power of football to impose control over the rising feeling of dissatisfaction. However, with time that mutated to a level where footballers, as well as the officials, are basically claiming a god-like status, and every attempt to question their dubious moves is often seen as ‘unpatriotic’ or even downright dissident behaviour. 

For instance, when asked about the great run of the national team at this World Cup, Vrbanovic rushed to say that people back home “should forget about his trial” as well as “the stories regarding Zdravko Mamic”, but should instead only focus on enjoying this fantastic result. A lot of people are taking that stance, claiming that both Mamic and the players should be given a ‘free pass’ for those serious crimes just because they were involved in this success. However, with Modric and Lovren even giving false testimonies – for which they’ll face trial themselves – to save Mamic from receiving jail time, a lot of people in Croatia wonder if they really want to have them as their representatives in front of the whole world. To some there is no doubt at all, renouncing them with a sense of bitter betrayal. 

That moral stance on supporting this national team created a widespread divide inside this football crazed nation, but also what seems to be an unprecedented situation in world football. There is a real possibility of a scenario in which Croatia, a small country with a population just slightly over 4 million people, could sensationally lift the World Cup and still have a substantial amount of fans denouncing the players and their achievement. That would really give the ‘football crazed’ term a whole new meaning.  

Fuck Croatia in my opinion.

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JNip

JNip 132

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, MoJames said:

Nah give it to Cristiano, best player in the world imo.

I wouldn’t be upset at all if this happens. They both deserve it. Probably the most interesting ballon d’or in a long time. 

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Kringelbert Fishtybuns

Kringelbert Fishtybuns 944

Posted
Posted
43 minutes ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

My friends are actually talking about German and Dutch TV critics are criticizing England, and they know full well that it's stupid for them to do so, given that the Dutch didn't even make it and the Germans flamed out. 

Their boogeyman went out in the first round.  They lost their last game to get on the easy side of the bracket.  They got to play Colombia without James and a wretched Sweden in the quarters.  Their opponent in the semis had to play to penalties twice.  They were up early and running rampant.  Their captain and Lingard had easy chances to put it away in the first half.

Every card fell their way until 68 minutes into the semi, including the Colombian penalty that hit the upright.

They pretty much deserve every bit of criticism coming their way.

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achooloco

achooloco 1086

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1 hour ago, Fudge Nuggets said:

I’m pulling for France, but I won’t mind one bit if Croatia wins.  I just want a well-played competitive match.

agreed on the well played match. been a helluva tournament so far, would suck for it to be a dud final.

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Napoleon

Napoleon 8700

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, achooloco said:

So who everyone going for? I’d think Americans root for the underdog (refs not withstanding) but seems like this thread is all about The Surrenders

What century are you from?

For a few decades now, Americans have rooted for the bully. A majority of the population are bandwagon jumpers.

-'83 Grenada invasion
-'89 Panama invasion
-'90 Bulls
-'90s Cowboys
-'90s->'00s Yankees
-'99->'05 Lance Armstrong
-'00s Lakers
-'03 Iraq
-Patriots
-Alabama
-Ohio State

Pulling for the underdog turned into meaning that you were a loser by association.

Most of the U.S. will pull for France because they are familiar with the Eiffel Tower, wine, and croissants. They will have forgotten Freedom Fries & Freedom Toast and they will have no clue where Croatia is, nor how to pronounce their players' names.


Personally, I have a fair amount of friends who are French (though not as many as English friends), but I don't know if I personally know one person from Croatia, nor even of Croatian descent.

Mainly I'd like to see a good game with lots of shots, some beautiful goals, some beautiful saves, and very little time rolling on the ground faking an injury. A late goal and no shootout would be ideal.

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Napoleon

Napoleon 8700

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, sidis said:

go back and watch the argentina game again from the moment argentina took the lead.


I left that game feeling that Argentina got crushed, because Mbappe made so many players look like they were playing in cement boots.

The late Agüero goal felt meaningless, because France had put on a clinic after going down 2-1, however...

The last cross of the game was a perfect ball for the player BEHIND Meza to have an easy goal. If Meza pulls up, or drops down to leave the ball through to the trailer, as ugly as Argentina looked in that game, they could have tied it and sent it to OT. I think that France fell asleep after going up 4-2, but they did give up 3 goals in one match and were lucky not to give up a forth.

I expect France to win though, because they have the midfield to matchup with Croatia + an extra day's rest, but Griezmann & Mbappe will be the difference. They are too quick and too crafty and will find a way to break through.

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achooloco

achooloco 1086

Posted
Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, Napoleon said:

What century are you from?

For a few decades now, Americans have rooted for the bully. A majority of the population are bandwagon jumpers.

-'83 Grenada invasion
-'89 Panama invasion
-'90 Bulls
-'90s Cowboys
-'90s->'00s Yankees
-'99->'05 Lance Armstrong
-'00s Lakers
-'03 Iraq
-Patriots
-Alabama
-Ohio State

Pulling for the underdog turned into meaning that you were a loser by association.

Most of the U.S. will pull for France because they are familiar with the Eiffel Tower, wine, and croissants. They will have forgotten Freedom Fries & Freedom Toast and they will have no clue where Croatia is, nor how to pronounce their players' names.


Personally, I have a fair amount of friends who are French (though not as many as English friends), but I don't know if I personally know one person from Croatia, nor even of Croatian descent.

Mainly I'd like to see a good game with lots of shots, some beautiful goals, some beautiful saves, and very little time rolling on the ground faking an injury. A late goal and no shootout would be ideal.

i'm not sure you know what a bully means. not to mention the bulls were only the bulls cause they shat the bed against the pistons for so many years. did you just start watching american sports since the aughts? 

Edited by achooloco
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Knoxtnhorn

Knoxtnhorn 6066

Posted
Posted

I just finished watching the game as I was at the doc this afternoon.

I don't know enough about England to offer a fix, but the coaching/tactics today were absolutely horrible.  You had a team coming off two extra times games + travel, this game goes to extra time, and you have ONE shot on goal?  Not only that, but have a world class player in Kane and, supposedly, top-end speed in Sterling and you can't pull off a shot during the run of play?  That's amazing.  

Hell, the US got off 11 shots against Belgium in 2014 with players like Wondolowski, Zusi, Jermaine Jones, and Julian Green.

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Firemans4Horn

Firemans4Horn 18123

Posted
Posted

England really needed an oxlade chamberlain or god forbid Jack wilshire to link up midfield and attack and run at defenders to cause chaos.  Lingard/Alli were redundant all tournament long (could probably add sterling in there) and Kane added very little the last few games.    

 

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PittsburghTiger

PittsburghTiger 6197

Posted
Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

Somewhere I posted on here about how Scotland was the real aggy of Europe. A Scots friend passed this along to me.

 

36965861_2317970901551938_19100272585301

One of my brother's good friends living over in Taiwan is a guy from England. This fellow grew up about a mile from Hadrian's Wall. He likes to say that on one side is civilization, England, and on the other side are savages, Scotland.

Of course, to be Jagoffs, we call him: Scottish Bob.

Edited by PittsburghTiger
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Hagbard Celine

Hagbard Celine 10923

Posted
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Posted

selected comments from the bbc morgue....

Tbh England relied on set pieces throughout and ultimately got found out...I never saw any fluidity in this team...Rashford vs mbappe? Same age look at the difference...this team lacked a genuine world class player in the irk of Owen 17, rooney 18, shearer, etc. Harry kane is over rated...sterling has nothing but pace...overall this team got lucky with an easy passage!

+

Should've been out of sight by half-time, that was the problem.

+

The biggest problem with English football is that we draw our players from an exclusively unemployed/working class background. Not only are they generally uneducated and physically stunted from poor nutrition, but they also lose all motivation once they get their first Bentley in the garage. We need to cast the net further to succeed in tournament football.

+

Kane should have scored .He had a very easy chance. Also where was Dele Alli? There is a reason why spurs players are called bottlers .

+

Harry kane went missing when the going got tough. Delle was never fit.. lingard basically just maintained his mediocre level. Walker is not a rcb. Ashley young over a fresher younger rose how? ... I think Southgate f**kd up everybody is hypnotized by the media hype.

+

Enough with the tiresome Southgate love-in. It's nauseating.

He's taken England to the semifinals of a major tournament. Whoop de doo.

The last British manager who did that got a new job shortly after at a one-time established Premier League team, and took them from the Championship down to League 1.

History tends to repeat itself. Stoke, Swansea and West Brom - you have been warned.

+

Talk of overachieving is based on us getting used to underperforming for decades. We beat teams we should beat on paper, and were not good enough against similar or better sides.

Southgate needs to become more flexible tactically. We had one formation and he seems too nice/loyal to players when they’re having a bad game. Opportunity missed, but learn and come back stronger.

+

We struggled the whole tournament to make chances in open play suggesting the formation doesn't really work. It should be 1 or maximum 2 from Dele, Lingard and Sterling.

Hopefully players like Sessegnon, Foden, Cook and Sancho will come in to strengthen the squad and balance the team up.

Great to see the pride restored in the england team, unfortunately came up short this time.

+

Every england team never gets to play without it getting changed every game and never gets use to playing together unlike the u21,s u19,s who do and why successful. Senior never will ruined by the monies backing premier league circus. 2 shots on target won’t win world cups. No playmaker no continuity equals no success.

+

France have faced and beaten Argentina, Uruguay and Belgium in just the KO stages to get where they are. That's 3 big teams in one tournament, while we've still only beaten 2 big teams at any stage of a tournament in 20 years.

+

Scraped through against Tunisia due to defender taking ball over corner line with seconds to go. Beat Panama who shouldn't even be there. Lost to Belgium.

Beat Colombia, without their star player, by missing 1 less penalty. Beat mediocre Sweden.

Lost to an overworked Croatia without looking like scoring a second. Well done on reaching semis in the easy side of the draw but hardly heroes.

+

Southgate picked a team that got them there, not a team to beat Croatia. It was naive at best. His midfield was run ragged and he did nothing. Vardy came on 30 mins too late and Henderson went off 45 mins too late. Never seen such route one rubbish for a long time. I wanted England to win, but they were terrible bar the first 20 mins. Couldn’t cope with high press. Shame.

+

Let's be honest Croatia bossed that second half after England didn't take advantage of their superiority in the first half. Disappointing after that first half but everyone should be proud that a semifinal has been reached, first tournament in my life at 23 years old I can remember such a buzz around the England team. It's the hope that kills you

+

For years we have been poor housebuilders. Why? because, we want a gold roof without firm foundations. We placate egos instead of (a) having a system (b) telling those egos they represent US not their clubs so buck up or get lost. Now, we have systems. Look at U17, U19, U20. Now, we have ditched egos. Sure, player quality needs improving (oh for a Gazza) but we are now a team again.

+

Well we weren't a possession-based team today. Overrun and stretched, resorted to aimless long balls. England were crying out for some/any tactical interventions. Hope the manager learns a lot from this game.

Nevertheless, plenty of positives from the tournament, individual performances, penalty hoodoo gone and grinding out some knock-out results.

+

The media had the nation drunk on ''hopium” that England could win the World Cup and too many deluded fools swallowed it. There was never a chance, even on the easiest side of the draw. Anytime England got tested by a decent side like Belgium and Croatia they got shown up. Now I can enjoy the World Cup coverage without Lineker & Co wasting half the time indulging England's World Cup fantasists.

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Pathetic Shark

Pathetic Shark 60

Posted
Posted

At least it took longer for all of the “told you so’s” to come out this time around.  Proud of my team, went further than expected, don’t give a fuck who they played against.  Southgate got his players performing at greater than the sum of their parts as opposed to previous teams filled with stars who never played as a unit and underperformed.  Can’t help thinking that Kane and Alli were injured or just not sharp enough throughout the tournament.  Rose made a difference but wasn’t fit enough for most of the tournament either so don’t blame Southgate for sticking with young.  Henderson played to the best of his ability and had a good tournament but isn’t a top level player and it showed today.  Rashford showed today why he wasn’t picked ahead of Sterling.  Vardy had a good season but isn’t the best fit for international football.  So there were few options available to Southgate to change the game.  Wilshere, shelvey, llalana or the Ox are all what if’s but none could be considered world class.  The only thing that gives me hope is that since the EPDP was put into place the country has started to produce a different type of player and this has been reflected in the success of the youth teams.  Foden, Sancho, Hudson Odoi, Lookman, McEachran, Lookman, Brewster, Gomes, Sessegnon, Dowell, Winks and co are the promising group in ages.

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