Shogun

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

16 hours ago, locodos said:

This guy is killing it.  Steals every scene he's in.

Is he the gun salesman from Tokyo Vice too?

[kingkoopa6 8347]

3 hours ago, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

Is he the gun salesman from Tokyo Vice too?

Nah.  That was a bigger fatter man 

[52-80 19147]

7 hours ago, Speedtrucker said:

Jeesh episode 8 hurt…


 

  Hide contents

My wife was super pissed at the Hiromatsu scene… I just kept saying that’s going too far to convince a spy that you are submitting…. Heartbreaking scene

We were both saying damn that badass cold-blooded during the tea scene.
 

 

This show has been amazing

Does your wife remember what happened to his great-grandson?

[Post Oak 20209]

During the tea scene I was like goddamn. She fucking hates Buntaro.

I love a good grudge.

 

[hookem2010 2624]

14 hours ago, mdmost said:

 

That is an epic cross-racial doppelganger.

[Jerry Callo 8699]

Spoiler

Great episode!

I just don't want anyone who hasn't seen it yet to know.

 

[Speedtrucker 2071]

Does your wife remember what happened to his great-grandson?

Hah yes,

she just really liked his character in the show.

As did I, he was old school badass and had been some good comedy. “Lord Toronaga resigns… for personal reasons.” And the 9 whacks line when Toronaga was attempting to 2nd his adversary…

The grandson-in-law, great grandson part was impactful but so early we didn’t have emotional ties to them. That made Fuji’s pain and suffering and service tough.

 

[Post Oak 20209]

 

 

[WBT 20561]

That was a good scene with the mama-san wading out in the muck imagining the world's first red light district.  And then the portuguese showing up to find out the land for their new church is right next door.

[huge 3793]

Spoiler

I hope the showrunners are deviating from the novel to create a more climatic ending. The last 20% of the book are a slog. Toranga delays and plots , and everyone wonders what the hell he's thinking. Blackthorne is basically lost mentally, recovers some, and has one last verbal showdown. It picks up in the last couple chapters, but the book's climax occurs at the 75-80% mark. It's an odd way to construct a book, but Easter isn't the ending of The Bible. I'm sure Clavell's editors begged him to change/lengthen the ending, but he was a notorious prick. He probably told them to fuck off and publish it. I guess it worked out for everybody. 

 

[NoRagrets 1125]

Episode 9 - mama mia 

[kingkoopa6 8347]

Bruh. I was thinking that was gonna be Ned stark. Someone saving day  

 

and then damn, didn’t matter….Hodor got exploded 

[Stringer 1438]

Mariko killed it that episode.  Council scene was fantastic.

Pretty awesome episode, even without Toranaga.

Needs more Fuji though.

[kingkoopa6 8347]

Yea I miss Fuji. 
 

but I suspect she coming guns a blazing 

[F250 28764]

The Yabushige character is very perplexing. Throughout the entire series my views of him keep changing. He fluctuates between a total dick, bad ass, goofball, traitorous, a fun cool dude, but remains very likeable the entire time no matter what he does.

The kind of guy you want to party with but he's likely to leave you with the bill and then have you jumped in the parking lot afterwards.

[Post Oak 20209]

22 minutes ago, kingkoopa6 said:

Yea I miss Fuji. 
 

but I suspect she coming guns a blazing 

Toranaga is keeping her in the pen until he needs her the most.  Then

 

[HornOnTheBayou 8919]

Fuck! Fuck! Fuck! Fuck!

What the fuck was that?!?

Edited April 17 by HornOnTheBayou

[F250 28764]

35 minutes ago, HornOnTheBayou said:

Fuck! Fuck! Fuck! Fuck!

What the fuck was that?!?

[Speedtrucker 2071]

Fuck man…

That whole episode was dusty in my house

[F250 28764]

Toranaga has been moving his people around like chess pieces. Now every time someone even farts, I assume Toranaga set it in motion.

[billfromlaketravis 11448]

Terrific episode. The ninja attack was a little rushed, but no complaints. 
 

Spoiler

Mariko is a better fighter in the book than depicted on the show. She takes down a bunch of grays (Ishido’s men)when she attempts to leave Osaka. Exhaustion finally gets her to yield.

I know the show has budget constraints, but the ninja attack is a pretty long sequence in the book. The Browns (Toranga’s men) fight valiantly, but the ninjas are extremely skilled fighters and they got the drop on them. Blackthorne and Mariko are able to hold out for hours in the Toranaga panic room until they blow up the door and Mariko. The attack ends near dawn and all of Osaka knows about it in the morning. Using ninja is the most shameful thing a samurai can do, so Ishido is fucked politically. 

It might be too late in the show to address, but there are many questions about the heirs true parentage throughout the book. I’ll leave it there in hopes they get to it next week. 

 

 

[bolverk 29656]

12 minutes ago, billfromlaketravis said:

Terrific episode. The ninja attack was a little rushed, but no complaints. 
 

  Reveal hidden contents

Mariko is a better fighter in the book than depicted on the show. She takes down a bunch of grays (Ishido’s men)when she attempts to leave Osaka. Exhaustion finally gets her to yield.

I know the show has budget constraints, but the ninja attack is a pretty long sequence in the book. The Browns (Toranga’s men) fight valiantly, but the ninjas are extremely skilled fighters and they got the drop on them. Blackthorne and Mariko are able to hold out for hours in the Toranaga panic room until they blow up the door and Mariko. The attack ends near dawn and all of Osaka knows about it in the morning. Using ninja is the most shameful thing a samurai can do, so Ishido is fucked politically. 

It might be too late in the show to address, but there are many questions about the heirs true parentage throughout the book. I’ll leave it there in hopes they get to it next week. 

 

 

I haven't read the book, but I rewatched the 1980 one from when I was a kid (and hadn't seen it since) in the week before this premiered. The older adaptation treated the scene similarly to this newer one. Thanks for the additional background.

[mdmost 43001]

Me on Ishido after what happened tonight

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4975]

Blackthorne with the legendary reloading speed  on that pistol of his. It probably takes a couple minutes to reload one of those. And where does he keep his powder and accoutrements?

Edited April 17 by NotActuallyALonghorn

[F250 28764]

19 minutes ago, mdmost said:

Me on Ishido after what happened tonight

Wtf is happening here? 65 year old Garth getting a beej?

[billfromlaketravis 11448]

Peak Kim Basinger is seducing Garth into killing her husband if memory serves me correctly. 

[F250 28764]

As an 80's kid, anytime there is ninja action in these serious Japanese flicks like The Last Samurai, I get excited.

[F250 28764]

2 minutes ago, billfromlaketravis said:

Peak Kim Basinger is seducing Garth into killing her husband if memory serves me correctly. 

I did not know until now that there was a Wayne's World 2.

 

[billfromlaketravis 11448]

Another hope for next week. 
 

Spoiler

I hope there are a couple flashbacks in the finale. In the book prior to the Taiko’s death, a Chinese soothsayer visits Osaka and tells the key players their fortunes. Let’s just say her accuracy is up there with Maggy the Frog. 

The payoff is awesome in the book’s final pages. Probably the lone highlight of the Clavell’s ending. 

 

Edited April 17 by billfromlaketravis

[tbone_ 14113]

How many episodes are there?

[tbone_ 14113]

How many episodes are there?

[kingkoopa6 8347]

Ju

[Zepol87 9185]

Intense

[gsoda3 3251]

Terrific episode. The ninja attack was a little rushed, but no complaints. 
 
Spoiler

Mariko is a better fighter in the book than depicted on the show. She takes down a bunch of grays (Ishido’s men)when she attempts to leave Osaka. Exhaustion finally gets her to yield.
I know the show has budget constraints, but the ninja attack is a pretty long sequence in the book. The Browns (Toranga’s men) fight valiantly, but the ninjas are extremely skilled fighters and they got the drop on them. Blackthorne and Mariko are able to hold out for hours in the Toranaga panic room until they blow up the door and Mariko. The attack ends near dawn and all of Osaka knows about it in the morning. Using ninja is the most shameful thing a samurai can do, so Ishido is fucked politically. 
It might be too late in the show to address, but there are many questions about the heirs true parentage throughout the book. I’ll leave it there in hopes they get to it next week. 
 

 

No, the book plays out almost exactly like the show. She doesn't take down any grays. She picks up a sword and attacks but the samurai keeps parrying until she gets tired and quits.

[gsoda3 3251]

 

I was dreading this episode, holding out hope the story runners changed Mariko's ending. Of all the things to stay faithful to the script...

I wish they'd had the time and desire to flesh out anjin and Mariko's relationship. They completely skipped the journey from Anjiro to Osaka. They didn't have any of the intimate conversations held in Latin only for their ears. There's a significant layer missing in the story without that context.

The treatment (obliteration) of Dell'Aqua's storyline is odd to me. They might as well not have put him in the show and used the time devoted to the black ship instead on making the romance more believable.

 

[52-80 19147]

I always thought ninjas were a Chinese thing, not a Japanese thing.  Just me?

[billfromlaketravis 11448]

3 hours ago, gsoda3 said:

 

  Hide contents

I was dreading this episode, holding out hope the story runners changed Mariko's ending. Of all the things to stay faithful to the script...

I wish they'd had the time and desire to flesh out anjin and Mariko's relationship. They completely skipped the journey from Anjiro to Osaka. They didn't have any of the intimate conversations held in Latin only for their ears. There's a significant layer missing in the story without that context.

The treatment (obliteration) of Dell'Aqua's storyline is odd to me. They might as well not have put him in the show and used the time devoted to the black ship instead on making the romance more believable.

 

Regarding the second paragraph, this. But they’d have to film an additional episode most likely.

I think the showrunners wanted to keep it very succinct at 10 episodes. More likely they were given a 10 episode budget. 

[52-80 19147]

Quote

Leaving for where, Mariko?

[Mariko] To meet our liege lord in Edo.

He has requested I escort them myself.

He…

Toranaga will be here in a few weeks, as you said.

It’s been months since the Lady Shizu has seen Lord Toranaga.

And my lord hasn’t yet seen his newest son.

they never covered this son of toranaga, did they?

[Speedtrucker 2071]

I always thought ninjas were a Chinese thing, not a Japanese thing.  Just me?

Shinobi were Japanese.

Considered the dishonorable way by samurai since their roles was usually covert and mercenary in nature. Also their whole premise was to work in secrecy

[kingkoopa6 8347]

what was the tapping on the shoulders? 
 

seal team ninja code talk ?

[locodos 5387]

Just now, kingkoopa6 said:

what was the tapping on the shoulders? 
 

seal team ninja code talk ?

IDK I thought it was a form of keeping track of timing of the mission.  I wondered about that too

[billfromlaketravis 11448]

3 minutes ago, locodos said:

IDK I thought it was a form of keeping track of timing of the mission.  I wondered about that too

Yes he was counting and timing out the attack. 

[billfromlaketravis 11448]

1 hour ago, 52-80 said:

they never covered this son of toranaga, did they?

As Ishido stated on the show, Toranaga has other sons. Naga was his fourth son in the books.

I believe the newborn boy is actually Toranaga’s first grandchild in the books. 

Toranga’s eldest son is his carbon copy and heir. He’s barely in the book and only appears in the final couple chapters. I don’t expect him to be on the show. 

[huge 3793]

1 minute ago, locodos said:

IDK I thought it was a form of keeping track of timing of the mission.  I wondered about that too

My thought was timing as well.

[mdmost 43001]

The shinobi came in multiple waves based on the tapping.

[gsoda3 3251]

1 hour ago, 52-80 said:

they never covered this son of toranaga, did they?

did mariko say son or grandson? ochiba's sister was giving birth to a baby at the beginning of the show and ochiba was visiting her, which is why ishido feared ochiba was being held hostage in edo. ochiba's sister is married to toranaga's oldest son.  

[52-80 19147]

19 minutes ago, gsoda3 said:

did mariko say son or grandson? ochiba's sister was giving birth to a baby at the beginning of the show and ochiba was visiting her, which is why ishido feared ochiba was being held hostage in edo. ochiba's sister is married to toranaga's oldest son.  

I thought they said son, and the camera panned to Ochiba making the surprised face, so I thought it was some weird suggestion of tryst (weird because she hates his guts), or otherwise some provocation towards her

It was difficult to sort out who's who from the first few episodes because she show seemed to not want to waste screentime pandering to slowfolk like me. 

[gsoda3 3251]

1 minute ago, 52-80 said:

I thought they said son, and the camera panned to Ochiba making the surprised face, so I thought it was some weird suggestion of tryst (weird because she hates his guts), or otherwise some provocation towards her

It was difficult to sort out who's who from the first few episodes because she show seemed to not want to waste screentime pandering to slowfolk like me. 

i'll have to go back and rewatch it.  i assumed she said son.  

 

i still have trouble telling them apart.  especially ishido, i can never tell if it's him or someone else. 

[Mac8111 2106]

So i has the confuse in regards to the last scene.  

 

Yabushi kills guard.  Sees the grapple hooks.  Opens door and ninjas appear and do not kill him.  He kills other guard.  Ninjas are everywhere at this point.   Then he runs into rooms alerting everyone.  Then he runs off with Mariko and crew.   

I assumed he was in on the attack if he is killing guards and not getting killed by ninjas, but why run off with the targets? 

[billfromlaketravis 11448]

5 minutes ago, Mac8111 said:

So i has the confuse in regards to the last scene.  

 

Yabushi kills guard.  Sees the grapple hooks.  Opens door and ninjas appear and do not kill him.  He kills other guard.  Ninjas are everywhere at this point.   Then he runs into rooms alerting everyone.  Then he runs off with Mariko and crew.   

I assumed he was in on the attack if he is killing guards and not getting killed by ninjas, but why run off with the targets? 

Gotta make it look good to Toranaga’s surviving men because of course they’re going to report back to him.