Game of Thrones Season 8 (NO BOOKSPOILERS) thread

[Pato del Muerto 52669]

Speaking of, as far as we know there’s still a lot of wildfire under the streets of kings landing right?  Minus what was used at black water bay and to blow up the sept?

[elguapo 4587]

They never explained why NK had to kill Bran himself anyway, why not just hang back and let the dead do all the heavy lifting?

It seemed like the "new dead" that NK raised when he saw Jon coming at him were super lethargic. Maybe it takes the dead a bit to get up to full speed after NK raises them? That's the only explanation I can think of for the ridiculous inconsistency of the dead army completely annihilating all of the Dothraki, entire Unsullied divisions, and everyone else they faced except for the handful of main characters who were left in the courtyard at the end.

Jamie/Brienne/Pod spent about the last 20 minutes of the battle pinned against a wall cut off and surrounded by dead, and survived. Sam spent a lot of the battle time laying on a pile of bodies crying, and survived. I'm not sure Davos even drew his sword, he himself admitted he has zero fighting ability, and he somehow survived. I'm fine with the main characters surviving but at least make an attempt to make it believable?

It's obvious the show writers have no idea what to do with Bran, what a completely worthless character. It's annoying that they had the WW leave around the spiral symbols throughout the series starting in the premiere, and didn't give us any explanation for them. I guess they were just there to be weird and creepy? I'd love to have gotten some more history on the NK and WW before wrapping up their storyline. Seems like this would have been intel that the living would be interested in gathering before going into the battle and could have been a way to make Bran less worthless, oh well.

I actually really enjoyed the episode, it was super tense and a spectacle despite being way too dark. I loved Arya getting the kill at the end. It could have been so much better though.

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4979]

The dead probably knew Sam would be useless for their purposes and were trying to leave him alone.

[Goo Punch 4275]

more hated cripple: Brandon Stark or Walter White Jr?

[MoJames 8256]

Haha

 

[Neonmoon 38130]

I think my second favorite part about this season after Arya killing the NK is Goo Punch complaining about Game of Thrones being unrealistic. 

[bolverk 29780]

29 minutes ago, elguapo said:

They never explained why NK had to kill Bran himself anyway, why not just hang back and let the dead do all the heavy lifting?

It seemed like the "new dead" that NK raised when he saw Jon coming at him were super lethargic. Maybe it takes the dead a bit to get up to full speed after NK raises them? That's the only explanation I can think of for the ridiculous inconsistency of the dead army completely annihilating all of the Dothraki, entire Unsullied divisions, and everyone else they faced except for the handful of main characters who were left in the courtyard at the end.

Jamie/Brienne/Pod spent about the last 20 minutes of the battle pinned against a wall cut off and surrounded by dead, and survived. Sam spent a lot of the battle time laying on a pile of bodies crying, and survived. I'm not sure Davos even drew his sword, he himself admitted he has zero fighting ability, and he somehow survived. I'm fine with the main characters surviving but at least make an attempt to make it believable?

It's obvious the show writers have no idea what to do with Bran, what a completely worthless character. It's annoying that they had the WW leave around the spiral symbols throughout the series starting in the premiere, and didn't give us any explanation for them. I guess they were just there to be weird and creepy? I'd love to have gotten some more history on the NK and WW before wrapping up their storyline. Seems like this would have been intel that the living would be interested in gathering before going into the battle and could have been a way to make Bran less worthless, oh well.

I actually really enjoyed the episode, it was super tense and a spectacle despite being way too dark. I loved Arya getting the kill at the end. It could have been so much better though.

There's some speculation in dork corners of the internet that the show creators are saving all the back history of the NK for a spinoff prequel so as to not ruin that fun.

[achooloco 1086]

40 minutes ago, hornimal said:

no.  they could have launched it at the wights after the dothraki charge and caused major casualties without exposing the dragons.

it is stored at king's landing, but the secret recipe is something tyrion could have bought on his visit to king's landing during the wight exhibition or varys could have acquired through his little birds.

Not positive but I’m guessing only maesters know the secret formula and even then only a select few. One who may have known got ceasered by the Newsies and the other currently works for Cersei. It’s probably akin to the info to develop nukes so any effort to get that knowledge would take valuable screen time. Not to mention the ingredients for it may also be hard to get, who knows. 

As for varys, his network is still there but it’s only really functional when people see he has access to power. When he left KL he lost a lot of his base power/$$$. Sure he can get it back and his connections but I think only if dany assumes the throne. There is no benefit to smuggling secrets to Varys if he isn’t in KL to protect you from a pissed of Cersei. 

[52-80 19275]

Don't know what was going through y'all's head, but when Jon couldn't get a 1-on-1 with NK, it was pretty obvious to me that Arya was set to take him out.
 

And even knowing that, the final kill was still wayyy too deus-ex-machina, and ultimately, unsatisfying. 

 

Her entire flip-flopping in the episode was unsatisfying....from shown as the fanciest and most skilled fighter in the entire episode, to quivering in the library, to that ninja pounce. 

 

I get they wanted to tie all the history to her actions - the syrio forel line, the running through the alleys, the sparring with brienne, etc, but it all felt too forced.

 

In the end this show I more entertaining when it does political intrigue than indulgent LOTR style battles

[Goo Punch 4275]

20 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

I think my second favorite part about this season after Arya killing the NK is Goo Punch complaining about Game of Thrones being unrealistic. 

i think my favorite part of this thread is how you guys consistently single me out for posting opinions that are being shared by tons of people, only to incessantly complain about how it's always all about me. nope, wait, that's my least favorite part of this thread. but please, carry on. 

[MoJames 8256]

5 minutes ago, Goo Punch said:

i think my favorite part of this thread is how you guys consistently single me out for posting opinions that are being shared by tons of people, only to incessantly complain about how it's always all about me. nope, wait, that's my least favorite part of this thread. but please, carry on. 

[Saint Tacky 1622]

1 hour ago, hornimal said:

it just occurred to me that during the entire time fortifying winterfell for the long night, 3 of the highest advisors -- tyrion, ser davos and varys -- were veterans of the battle of blackwater, and none of them thought to incorporate wildfire against an enemy who's biggest known weakness is fire.  tyrion's head is deeper up his ass than I thought.

"Wildfire is a flammable liquid which is created and controlled by the Alchemists' Guild, an ancient society of learned men using arcane knowledge and is now based in the city of King's Landing. Wildfire is a highly volatile material; As it ages, the wildfire becomes more potent." Wildfire

I recall that when it was first discovered and contemplated in the defense of King's Landing from Stannis Baratheon, part of the discussion was how long it had been there and how volatile it was.  They didn't have the recipe in Winterfell and Roy Scheider couldn't drive it there.

[Nolacycling 893]

I'm still hanging in there, but every once in a while I get a D&G vibe from this thread. ooky

[Mojo Hand 4580]

2 hours ago, Goo Punch said:

then i would have preferred for him to have died some other way- for him not have been slowly walking right up next to Bran surrounded by all of his top guys, painstakingly taking his time just like we've all seen in 1,000 other movies/shows. they could have taken his dragon out during battle, had him fall to earth, land next to anyone with a valyrian steel blade (probably jon snow), and had him actually fight someone and then die. Hell, they even could done what they actually did only better by having him defeat Jon in hand to hand combat, and then as he's making his move to end it, BAM, Arya comes flying out of nowhere with the dagger to kill the Night King and end the battle. 

^That would have been 1000x better and I just made it up off the top of my head right now, and i'm certainly not some highly paid writer (make that team of writers) with months to think it over.

[closetojumping 62931]

1 hour ago, 52-80 said:

Don't know what was going through y'all's head, but when Jon couldn't get a 1-on-1 with NK, it was pretty obvious to me that Arya was set to take him out.
 

And even knowing that, the final kill was still wayyy too deus-ex-machina, and ultimately, unsatisfying. 

 

I bet you’re a blast at parties. Holy shit. 

[utxmike05 1828]

Watching again (4th)...I think HBO tweaked the settings because everything seems much clearer. Or maybe it just seems that way bc I know what happens already.

Dany + Drogon save Jon when NK left him with wights. Jon yells “Bran” to Dany. She says “Go!” So can’t give him a ride? Make him run thru hell, your dragon gets attacked, Jorah dies. Women dragon drivers....

And Jon yelling at Viserion..??

I really like the Arya arc in this ep. She was whooping ass then she got knocked a few times and it basically shook her up. She was running away from wights now. This was her first battle. Then the witch had to give her guidance. She usually has had someone help her refocus to get back on track. You are the one, Neo.


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[Lat22 4046]

5 hours ago, Gene Parmesan said:

The stall was just for dramatic effect for viewers.  I'm not even sure it was much of a stall because it all appeared to be shown in slow motion.  The NK wasn't going to win, had he ran up to Bran and tried to immediately stab him Arya just jumps out a few seconds earlier, and that would have been a ridiculous scene.  It is a fucking TV show.  You've got to build in some entertainment factor.  If you are in the minority that isn't entertained by anything other than realistic battle tactics and siege defense strategies in the mythical land that contains magic, dragons, and zombies, then you shouldn't be watching this show.

How many times did James Bond find himself at the point of the bad guy’s gun or knife or bomb or something?  The bad guy ALWAYS had to make a speech instead of just shooting him and Bond always wiggled off of the hook. 

[ChickenSandwich 9856]

6 hours ago, MoJames said:

Here's a bit more about the previous battles if you want to use GRRM and his style as a barometer.

 

 

Good post. 

Theon is by far the biggest character to die in one of these huge battles. 

He was in S1E1 the first ten mins of the show and has had a story line each season to be followed. He was a damn big character getting got. 

Edited May 1, 2019 by ChickenSandwich

[MNLonghornFUKM 8835]

more hated cripple: Brandon Stark or Walter White Jr?

Question of the year.

 

WwJr for me. He needed to stay in his lane and let walt walt

 

 

Always had to get uncle hank involved

 

[MissingInAction 25245]

2 hours ago, Goo Punch said:

more hated cripple: Brandon Stark or Walter White Jr?

You.

[Augustus 3061]

I'm a little surprised by some folks feeling like there was a lack of backstory/motivation for the NK.

He was created to kill man/wipe them out, by the CotF for that purpose alone.  And that's what he's been doing ever since, for thousands of years.

He's been beaten back at least once, thus the Wall.  But that's been his only purpose, as far as I can tell--trying to complete his mission.

Who knows if the CotF knew that he'd also be able to create WW's and raise the fucking dead, but I don't think his purpose was ever ambiguous.

I also don't have a problem with his death scene.  He wasn't really stalling much--his approach was shown in slo-mo.  But I don't blame him at all for taking a second to savor his victory over the 3ER, who'd been a thorn in his side for millennia.  Always spying on his ass.  He had no reason to fear any interruption.

I just wish there'd been a way to draw his death out a bit so we could witness his realization that he was finally going down.  But that would've given him the opportunity to defend himself even more effectively.

Edited May 1, 2019 by Augustus

[Augustus 3061]

1 hour ago, ChickenSandwich said:

Good post. 

Theon is by far the biggest character to die in one of these huge battles. 

He was in S1E1 the first ten mins of the show and has had a story line each season to be followed. He was a damn big character getting got. 

Same for Jorah

[Horn of Gabriel 1857]

I'm a little surprised by some folks feeling like there was a lack of backstory/motivation for the NK.
He was created to kill man/wipe them out, by the CotF for that purpose alone.  And that's what he's been doing ever since, for thousands of years.
He's been beaten back at least once, thus the Wall.  But that's been his only purpose, as far as I can tell--trying to complete his mission.
Who knows if the CotF knew that he'd also be able to create WW's and raise the fucking dead, but I don't think his purpose was ever ambiguous.
I also don't have a problem with his death scene.  He wasn't really stalling much--his approach was shown in slo-mo.  But I don't blame him at all for taking a second to savor his victory over the 3ER, who'd been a thorn in his side for millennia.  Always spying on his ass.  He had no reason to fear any interruption.
I just wish there'd been a way to draw his death out a bit so we could witness his realization that he was finally going down.  But that would've given him the opportunity to defend himself even more effectively.

This guy gets it.

[taybo20 2887]

Question about the Azor Ahai prophecy....was that ever talked about in the show? I keep seeing people trying to figure it out and I feel liked ive  missed it

[Goo Punch 4275]

 

[Godzillatron 292]

Don't know what was going through y'all's head, but when Jon couldn't get a 1-on-1 with NK, it was pretty obvious to me that Arya was set to take him out.
 
And even knowing that, the final kill was still wayyy too deus-ex-machina, and ultimately, unsatisfying. 
 
Her entire flip-flopping in the episode was unsatisfying....from shown as the fanciest and most skilled fighter in the entire episode, to quivering in the library, to that ninja pounce. 
 
I get they wanted to tie all the history to her actions - the syrio forel line, the running through the alleys, the sparring with brienne, etc, but it all felt too forced.
 
In the end this show I more entertaining when it does political intrigue than indulgent LOTR style battles

This. As soon as Mellisandre reminded Arya about killing blue eyes you knew what was coming.


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[hornimal 80]

2 hours ago, Saint Tacky said:

I recall that when it was first discovered and contemplated in the defense of King's Landing from Stannis Baratheon, part of the discussion was how long it had been there and how volatile it was.  They didn't have the recipe in Winterfell and Roy Scheider couldn't drive it there.

I remember that scene as well.  I went back and rewatched it and near the end tyrion tells the alchemist, "you won't be making wildfire for my sister any longer, you'll be making it for me."

so at one point before the battle of blackwater tyrion was the nino brown of wildfire.  now he gets to winterfell to defend against the attack of a stronger opponent while everyone is harping about needing every man and sword they can muster, and completely forgets all about it.  

[Horn80 6172]

Thought the Unsullied were badass.  They held their ground and fought to the death even though they saw what happened to the Dathroki.  

[TexasMan 10992]

 

[MAUFRAIS 6669]

Thought the Unsullied were badass.  They held their ground and fought to the death even though they saw what happened to the Dathroki.  

Yeah that shit took balls.

[DanRydell 799]

37 minutes ago, taybo20 said:

Question about the Azor Ahai prophecy....was that ever talked about in the show? I keep seeing people trying to figure it out and I feel liked ive  missed it

There was some hinting around it during the Stannis/Melisandre stuff and references to the prince who was promised but not explicitly, no.

[Mach 1 1677]

I look forward to reading this thread after each episode, it's entertaining as hell.  People get so emotionally exercised about their opinions and reactions to their opinions.  It's a nice continuation to watching an equally entertaining show that goes balls out week after week, especially the last one where they had flying dragon fights, Arya doing ninja shit, and skeletons flying over the Unsullied like locusts.  Those DD guys are probably fucking up here and there, but the fact viewers feel so strongly about their opinions mean, IMO, they're still doing something right to keep people invested enough to complain.  Keep it up!

[Pato del Muerto 52669]

3 hours ago, Goo Punch said:

i think my favorite part of this thread is how you guys consistently single me out for posting opinions that are being shared by tons of people, only to incessantly complain about how it's always all about me. nope, wait, that's my least favorite part of this thread. but please, carry on. 

Dammit derka there you go again!

 

[tbone_ 14213]

I'm a little surprised by some folks feeling like there was a lack of backstory/motivation for the NK.
He was created to kill man/wipe them out, by the CotF for that purpose alone.  And that's what he's been doing ever since, for thousands of years.
He's been beaten back at least once, thus the Wall.  But that's been his only purpose, as far as I can tell--trying to complete his mission.
Who knows if the CotF knew that he'd also be able to create WW's and raise the fucking dead, but I don't think his purpose was ever ambiguous.
I also don't have a problem with his death scene.  He wasn't really stalling much--his approach was shown in slo-mo.  But I don't blame him at all for taking a second to savor his victory over the 3ER, who'd been a thorn in his side for millennia.  Always spying on his ass.  He had no reason to fear any interruption.
I just wish there'd been a way to draw his death out a bit so we could witness his realization that he was finally going down.  But that would've given him the opportunity to defend himself even more effectively.

CotF?

[trueut2003 73]

Children of the Forest.

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[Jerry Callo 8774]

Children of the Forest

[wild_turkey 3187]

so at one point before the battle of blackwater tyrion was the nino brown of wildfire.  now he gets to winterfell to defend against the attack of a stronger opponent while everyone is harping about needing every man and sword they can muster, and completely forgets all about it.  

I’m assuming Wildfire is not easily transported. There is no way Cersei allows it to be taken from King’s Landing, regardless of what Tyrion said in season 2. A lot has changed since then. Even if possible to smuggle it out, it’s a fairly long journey up to Winterfell.

[Mez2 4032]

Derka should've killed the night king

[Haphap 742]

 

[tbone_ 14213]

Children of the Forest

Ah, right. Thanks.

And why did they feel the need to create a magic psycho to try to kill humans for thousands of years again?

[tbone_ 14213]

Never mind. Googled it. Turns out the CotF were like the Indians and the Men were like Americans.

[billfromlaketravis 11564]

I'm rewatching the episode now. I'd argue Dany/Jon don't have an army anymore, just a host of main characters. And oh yeah, the dragons are pretty banged up. If Cersei decides to come north or send Euron north there's not much to stop them other than the dragons. 

Off the top of my head houses/groups that are unscathed could help Dany/Jon: 

- Dorne. Probably their best hope. Featured on the show some and plenty pissed at Cersei. A Dornish invasion north would be very welcome right now. They lost a lot of their royal family, but their army should be at full strength. 

- The Redwyne Fleet. Never featured or shown on the show, but the Queen of Thorns was a Redwyne before she married into House Tyrell. They also have good reason to pissed at Cersei. GRRM has said before they have the only fleet that could possibly match up with Euron's fleet. 

- House Hightower. They're Tyrell bannermen, so it's unclear if the Lannisters wiped them out while sacking Highgarden. They have a pretty good army/navy as they're entrusted with guarding The Citadel. Also probably pissed at Cersei. 

- The Second Sons. Pretty long voyage to get there in time, and they'd have to get around Euron. 

- House Reed. Fierce Stark bannermen. Briefly featured on the show. I have no idea how many men they have, but they haven't been in any of the fighting. Also, magic swamp powers. 

- Surprise army from Essos? 

- Maybe there's some Baratheons left in the Stormlands? Stannis' army is long gone though. 

I doubt the Mountain Clans, House Umber, House Karstark, House Manderly survived in great numbers after The Wall came down. 

House Tully is pretty banged up from fighting in the Riverlands. 

The Knights of the Vale lost a ton of men at Winterfell. I doubt they could provide much help. 

The rest of the Reach is out, and they've always gone with the Lannisters. Regardless there's not much left of the Reach's other major houses, Tarley and Tyrell. 

 

Edited May 1, 2019 by billfromlaketravis

[Pato del Muerto 52669]

The Glovers backed out I think after Jon came back having bowed to Dani. 

[Quasimofo 406]

Children of the Forest

2, 4.3, 4, 1

 

[tbone_ 14213]

I knew a girl from New Iberia once that had magic swamp powers.

[Burt Macklin 19054]

31 minutes ago, tbone_ said:

Ah, right. Thanks.

And why did they feel the need to create a magic psycho to try to kill humans for thousands of years again?

The humans were going to wipe them out.

[MNLonghornFUKM 8835]

I knew a girl from New Iberia once that had magic swamp powers.

Kinky... go on

[Loco 3754]

7 hours ago, Quasimofo said:

2, 4.3, 4, 1

 

4.3 ?  Oddly specific

[taybo20 2887]

7 hours ago, Pato del Muerto said:

The Glovers backed out I think after Jon came back having bowed to Dani. 

That’s right. The Knights of the vale were not around.

[Tom 2959]

Just watched for the second time and I can't believe how many people are defending the darkness of this episode.  I don't care if it's cheaper to film.  We were told the long wait and shortened season was going to lead to movie quality episodes.  If I paid $12 to sit in a theater and was only able to see half of what was happening I'd ask for a refund.  And give me a break on blaming it on the quality of TVs.  

Episode was great, at least the 30 minutes of it I was able to see.