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Formula 1 2024

Anton Chigurh

By Anton Chigurh
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Anton Chigurh

Anton Chigurh 3319

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Max drives (late breaks) through a corner and forces people wide all the time. He’s known for it and then bitches when they drive wide.

This. He races to the apex only and brakes much later than you would on any normal racing lap, just so he can “be ahead” at the apex. He then doesn’t even make the corner, yet the stewards award him by penalizing the other car (or doing nothing if he stays ahead).
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wood

wood 11225

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1 hour ago, Goofyboy said:


Max drives (late breaks) through a corner and forces people wide all the time. He’s known for it and then bitches when they drive wide.

I'm not saying I like it, because I absolutely do not, but it's quite common and started gaining traction in F1 long before Max got there. The way they have defined the overtaking 'rules' and enforce/don't enforce them has made it extremely difficult on anyone trying to overtake on the outside, not just guys trying to overtake Max. We saw several incidents like Max & Lando's at that turn just this weekend, and iirc only one or maybe two resulted in a penalty for forcing the other driver off. I'm not even sure what was so different about that one, either. There is very little black and white now in the driving standards. Mostly a lot of gray, which seems to be what they want.

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NoName

NoName 16352

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Can we officially say it? Lando is absolutely fucking blowing it in the fastest car. 

Also, I'm all in on Leclerc and am dangerously close to calling myself a Ferrari fan.

Also also I want a Manning-cast over f1 with former f1 drivers. 

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wood

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10 minutes ago, NoName said:

Can we officially say it? Lando is absolutely fucking blowing it in the fastest car. 

Also, I'm all in on Leclerc and am dangerously close to calling myself a Ferrari fan.

Also also I want a Manning-cast over f1 with former f1 drivers. 

Hell, just have Peyton & Eli do it. 

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utee94

utee94 15823

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5 hours ago, Anton Chigurh said:


This. He races to the apex only and brakes much later than you would on any normal racing lap, just so he can “be ahead” at the apex. He then doesn’t even make the corner, yet the stewards award him by penalizing the other car (or doing nothing if he stays ahead).

It is definitely some kind of bullshit.

Regardless, Forza Ferrari!  What a race for SF.  Closing up the gap for the constructors', nice.

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Burt Macklin

Burt Macklin 19024

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2 hours ago, NoName said:

Can we officially say it? Lando is absolutely fucking blowing it in the fastest car. 

Also, I'm all in on Leclerc and am dangerously close to calling myself a Ferrari fan.

Also also I want a Manning-cast over f1 with former f1 drivers. 

Welcome, fellow masochist. 

29 minutes ago, utee94 said:

It is definitely some kind of bullshit.

Regardless, Forza Ferrari!  What a race for SF.  Closing up the gap for the constructors', nice.

Great race for Ferrari. Definitely the strongest car. I’m not sure either Carlos or Charles could have won if they didn’t get ahead at Turn 1, but good job by Charles taking advantage of it. 
 

It’s crazy to think how close Ferrari would be to winning the WCC if Carlos doesn’t crash in Baku and crash in Singapore qualifying (which screwed up his and Leclerc’s qualifying). That was about a 30 point swing with those two incidents. 

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utee94

utee94 15823

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5 minutes ago, Burt Macklin said:

Welcome, fellow masochist. 

Great race for Ferrari. Definitely the strongest car. I’m not sure either Carlos or Charles could have won if they didn’t get ahead at Turn 1, but good job by Charles taking advantage of it. 
 

It’s crazy to think how close Ferrari would be to winning the WCC if Carlos doesn’t crash in Baku and crash in Singapore qualifying (which screwed up his and Leclerc’s qualifying). That was about a 30 point swing with those two incidents. 

I have to say I loved the delicious irony of Max being so focused on abandoning good racecraft and simply forcing Lando off at Turn 1, that he let Leclerc slip by (and almost Sainz too).  I quietly laughed at Max the entire remainder of the race.  It made today even better knowing that his assholery cost him at least one spot.

 

 

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wood

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10 hours ago, Chewbacca said:

What a clown show.

Seriously. They couldn't be much more similar. Take someone else's product and change it slightly to look more like Mickey Mouse. What could possibly go wrong?

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aggie08

aggie08 21504

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Seeing the replay, Max came closer to keeping his tires within the white line than I thought. But he still didn't. I just don't get it. If someone drives themselves off the track defending, forcing you off the track in the process, you have to jam on the brakes to let them recover in front of you or immediately give them their place back once you're both back on the track? What a terrible precedent. If you drive yourself off the track, other racers should be free to pass wherever it is safe to do so.

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Goofyboy

Goofyboy 3293

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Seeing the replay, Max came closer to keeping his tires within the white line than I thought. But he still didn't. I just don't get it. If someone drives themselves off the track defending, forcing you off the track in the process, you have to jam on the brakes to let them recover in front of you or immediately give them their place back once you're both back on the track? What a terrible precedent. If you drive yourself off the track, other racers should be free to pass wherever it is safe to do so.

Look for the replay of Max v Carlos where Carlos drives Max off the track and Max gains an advantage - no penalty. The lack of consistency is irritating.
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Chewbacca

Chewbacca 7779

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3 hours ago, aggie08 said:

Seeing the replay, Max came closer to keeping his tires within the white line than I thought. But he still didn't. I just don't get it. If someone drives themselves off the track defending, forcing you off the track in the process, you have to jam on the brakes to let them recover in front of you or immediately give them their place back once you're both back on the track? What a terrible precedent. If you drive yourself off the track, other racers should be free to pass wherever it is safe to do so.

Lando was not ahead at the apex.  That's the crux of the issue, IMO.  All he had to do was immediately give the place back and then get back after Max.  He would have passed him eventually.

2 hours ago, Goofyboy said:


Look for the replay of Max v Carlos where Carlos drives Max off the track and Max gains an advantage - no penalty. The lack of consistency is irritating.

I also agree with this.  Lack of consistency was maddening.

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dieucla98

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Another aspect of this is Lando wasn't initially penalized for that incident - he was penalized for track limits first. Which is also kind of bullshit. How are you supposed to keep it within track limits when you're being run off the road by a charging Red Bull fighting for the apex vs. fighting for the turn?

If you force a car off the track and can't keep yourself on the track, then there is no advantage for anyone - put on your big boy pants and race on. Also, they shouldn't count that against track limits for the car being forced off but 100% should for the car who way overshot the braking zone.

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kevwun

kevwun 15789

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I don't think the penalty was ever for track limits.  Red Bull told Max over the radio that Norris had done it 4 times and was probably going to get a penalty for it and I think that caused confusion during the broadcast.  The broadcast crew doesn't have a way to keep track of track limits violations for some reason which seems silly.

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Chewbacca

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14 minutes ago, kevwun said:

I don't think the penalty was ever for track limits.  Red Bull told Max over the radio that Norris had done it 4 times and was probably going to get a penalty for it and I think that caused confusion during the broadcast.  The broadcast crew doesn't have a way to keep track of track limits violations for some reason which seems silly.

The penalty was 100% for gaining an advantage leaving the track.  

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Mr. Drummond

Mr. Drummond 2199

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That penalty gets called all the time.    Mclaren should have told lando to give the place back, he still would have had 5-6 laps to pass    It wasn't that he just left, he accelerated "off the track" to get in front of Max.     Mclaren maybe thought he could get 5 seconds in front, and he almost did. 

I'm no huge Max fan, but any other driver Lando gets around him within a couple laps.   Max is in Lando's head.

#teamleclerc 

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Goofyboy

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That penalty gets called all the time.    Mclaren should have told lando to give the place back, he still would have had 5-6 laps to pass    It wasn't that he just left, he accelerated "off the track" to get in front of Max.     Mclaren maybe thought he could get 5 seconds in front, and he almost did. 
I'm no huge Max fan, but any other driver Lando gets around him within a couple laps.   Max is in Lando's head.
#teamleclerc 

Lando expects Max to torpedo him anytime he goes for a pass. Max has nothing to lose. He’d be in most people’s head.
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aggie08

aggie08 21504

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5 hours ago, Goofyboy said:


Look for the replay of Max v Carlos where Carlos drives Max off the track and Max gains an advantage - no penalty. The lack of consistency is irritating.

I suppose the argument there would be that Max was defending his position when Carlos ran Max and himself off the track, and Max was defending when Max ran he and Morris off the track, so the "proper" thing to do is just reset the order to what it was before the attempted overtake. 

I don't agree, but I can at least see that being their logical train of thought. 

I just don't understand rewarding a driver who can't stay on the track to avoid being passed by a faster car. Once you leave the track--and you've forced someone out with you--they shouldn't then also force the other car to slow down and let you back in in front of them. As long as it's safe to pass off the track, tough luck.

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aggie08

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3 hours ago, Chewbacca said:

Lando was not ahead at the apex.  That's the crux of the issue, IMO.  All he had to do was immediately give the place back and then get back after Max.  He would have passed him eventually.

And if Max had kept 1/16" of his tire on the white line, I'd 100% agree with you. Keep your dive bombing within track limits, even if you're not following a "racing line", and I'm usually perfectly fine with aggressive moves. But he didn't. Once you leave the track by your own "error" (or desperate attempt to defend), it should be fair game to keep my pace right around you.

 

Max dive bombed Lando to pass him on Turn 1 at the start of the race almost identically--except he stayed on the track. Lando complained, but Zak Brown basically told the broadcast team, "Yeah, he dive-bombed us, but he stayed on the track...what are ya gonna do?"

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Chewbacca

Chewbacca 7779

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13 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

And if Max had kept 1/16" of his tire on the white line, I'd 100% agree with you. Keep your dive bombing within track limits, even if you're not following a "racing line", and I'm usually perfectly fine with aggressive moves. But he didn't. Once you leave the track by your own "error" (or desperate attempt to defend), it should be fair game to keep my pace right around you.

 

Max dive bombed Lando to pass him on Turn 1 at the start of the race almost identically--except he stayed on the track. Lando complained, but Zak Brown basically told the broadcast team, "Yeah, he dive-bombed us, but he stayed on the track...what are ya gonna do?"

You don't get to pass someone off track.  Full stop.  

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