Grill upgrade help

[Gene Parmesan 4008]

Looking into a new grill to take my meat consumption to the next level.  I've got a gas grill and it's fine but I want to get more into smoky flavors, but know nothing about it other than how to eat it.  A full on smoker seems to daunting and not sure if I would use that much.  So I'm considering pellet grills/smoker and ceramic egg grills/smokers.  Their pros seem to be versatility and cons seem to be costs.  I think being able to use them for more everyday cooking justifies the purchase more for me, but I don't really know much about either.  Is one hands down better, or one better suited for a beginner?

[lonestarsooner 121]

You will get a metric shit-ton of varying opinions on this subject. I’ll start it by saying that I have 2 Kamado Joe’s, a Joe Jr and a Big Joe. I absolutely love both of them and have moved completely away from my gas grill for everything. I fire up Jr for burgers, dogs, hot links, everyday stuff. And I can’t imahine not having the Big Joe for all my smoking cooks. I can get a full packet brisket from Costco on it and have room for ribs, chicken, sides, whatever else I want to smoke at the same time. I know a lot of guys like true offset smokers or pellet grills/smokers but I’ll take the egg type every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Can’t go wrong with one of those. 

[Gene Parmesan 4008]

From what I understand of pellet grills is they are more smoker than grill as in they don't really get hot enough to sear.  What's the degree of difficulty for a beginner to work an egg style cooker not having much experience outside of gas grill?

[baboso 6056]

The answer to your question is a Weber Smokey Mountain.  Brand new 18 inch is $299 and the 22 inch is $399.  Check your local Craigslist and you can find a used one for $100 periodically.  I've had mine for 15 years now and regularly smoke and grill on it.

[Mack Tripper 696]

For a beginner, you can't go wrong with a Weber kettle. 

[Chewbacca 7780]

8 minutes ago, Mack Tripper said:

For a beginner, you can't go wrong with a Weber kettle. 

I actually disagree.  A kettle is not going to be good for smoking, which is what he wants.  Depending on the OP's budget, I would go for a Weber Smoky Mountain or a BGE.  BGE will be more expnsive but also more versatile.  I've had a BGE for several years now (have 2 Larges) and it can do everything I want it to do.  Cold smoking is about the only thing it can't do.

[tokamak 6431]

30 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

From what I understand of pellet grills is they are more smoker than grill as in they don't really get hot enough to sear.  What's the degree of difficulty for a beginner to work an egg style cooker not having much experience outside of gas grill?

My experience (I have a Broil King Keg) is that it's one of those easy-to-learn-but-hard-to-master things. There are tons of resources online. Ultimately, they're not complicated devices. But for me, 95% of the work is getting things just right and keeping them there (talking about smoking...grilling is easy). I assume that varies a lot based on what brand and model of kamado you have.

 

My advice to you coming from a gas grill, however, is to be honest with yourself about what you actually want, how much time you're willing to spend, etc. Mine ends up sitting unused for months at a time because I just don't have the time to use it. Nothing is ever going to match the "just turn it on and go" convenience of a gas grill. I've actually been considering selling what I have and getting a pellet smoker just for the "set it and walk away" factor.

[Mack Tripper 696]

8 minutes ago, Chewbacca said:

I actually disagree.  A kettle is not going to be good for smoking, which is what he wants.  Depending on the OP's budget, I would go for a Weber Smoky Mountain or a BGE.  BGE will be more expnsive but also more versatile.  I've had a BGE for several years now (have 2 Larges) and it can do everything I want it to do.  Cold smoking is about the only thing it can't do.

Well he did say a full on smoker is daunting, and a kettle is certainly smokier than a gas grill. 

[mapplewhite132 309]

1 hour ago, lonestarsooner said:

You will get a metric shit-ton of varying opinions on this subject. 

^^ Yep. I have a LyfeTyme offset smoker that I got from HEB for around $1K. I actually find it very easy to use and much more versatile than people assume. I can smoke bbq low and slow, or grill over the coals directly. My only real complaint is I use a ton of charcoal every time I cook. 

[Gene Parmesan 4008]

My budget is around 1,000 but I don't want to spend a grand only to realize that a $300 would do everything just as good.  Ignorance is bliss you know.  A traditional offset smoker seems daunting just from the aspect of all the nuance involved in traditional smoking, but I am guessing a lot nuances are present with any smoker.  Eggs and pellet grills just seam like the hot thing now so just trying to get schooled on what I would be getting into outside of just the talking points on the brochures.

[lonestarsooner 121]

1 hour ago, Gene Parmesan said:

From what I understand of pellet grills is they are more smoker than grill as in they don't really get hot enough to sear.  What's the degree of difficulty for a beginner to work an egg style cooker not having much experience outside of gas grill?

I've never worked with a pellet grill so can't speak to that piece.  What I do know is that I can run my Joe up to 750 - 800 degrees if needed.  I rarely do.  I will sear both sides of our steaks over the open fire at 650 or so then move them to indirect heat (Joe's come with heat deflectors, believe BGEs do too) and finish there until they're a perfect medium rare.  Wife and I don't go out for steaks any longer because they're never as good as I can make at home with prime cuts from Costco and my egg.  Only exception is the chateaubriand at Perry's, lol.  I didn't have any difficulty picking up the nuances of my egg when I started using it.  I had the classic size then sold it and bought the Jr and Big Joe.  I smoked a brisket for 18 hours a couple of weeks ago on the Big Joe.  Stabilized the temp at 225 at about 9pm the night before.  It was still at 225 when I woke up at 7am the next morning.  Stayed at 225 until I pulled the brisket off at 3pm that afternoon.  Never had to touch it.

[Chewbacca 7780]

39 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

My budget is around 1,000 but I don't want to spend a grand only to realize that a $300 would do everything just as good.  Ignorance is bliss you know.  A traditional offset smoker seems daunting just from the aspect of all the nuance involved in traditional smoking, but I am guessing a lot nuances are present with any smoker.  Eggs and pellet grills just seam like the hot thing now so just trying to get schooled on what I would be getting into outside of just the talking points on the brochures.

Just go ahead and get a BGE or Primo and you'll be happy.  I've never known someone to buy one and regret it.  

 

Nothing for $300 will do all the same things these can do.  It can go low & slow for BBQ and 700+ degrees for pizza and steaks.  And everywhere in between.  I started with a WSM, then went to a Vision Kamado and then to the BGE.  If you have the budget, skip the interim steps.

[El Diablo 4232]

Had an offset, had a WSM. The WSM was less "work". All smokers take some tinkering to learn. I've never heard of anyone not liking their BGE.

[Jameslaw121 4448]

Get a Webber Kettle for grilling

Get an electric smoker for smoking. 

Total cost is about $350 for both. It will get you a nice introduction after about a year, you'll wan to buy the BGE or an off set. 

[Jameslaw121 4448]

2 hours ago, lonestarsooner said:

I've never worked with a pellet grill so can't speak to that piece.  What I do know is that I can run my Joe up to 750 - 800 degrees if needed.  I rarely do.  I will sear both sides of our steaks over the open fire at 650 or so then move them to indirect heat (Joe's come with heat deflectors, believe BGEs do too) and finish there until they're a perfect medium rare.  Wife and I don't go out for steaks any longer because they're never as good as I can make at home with prime cuts from Costco and my egg.  Only exception is the chateaubriand at Perry's, lol.  I didn't have any difficulty picking up the nuances of my egg when I started using it.  I had the classic size then sold it and bought the Jr and Big Joe.  I smoked a brisket for 18 hours a couple of weeks ago on the Big Joe.  Stabilized the temp at 225 at about 9pm the night before.  It was still at 225 when I woke up at 7am the next morning.  Stayed at 225 until I pulled the brisket off at 3pm that afternoon.  Never had to touch it.

This is the truth. My wife was raised vegetarian. Although she kinda eats meat (mostly fish and chicken, occasionally pork almost never beef). We went somewhere reasonably nice after we had been dating a few months, nothing real expensive but nicer than like a Texas Roadhouse. I ordered a ribeye that was about $35 and she tried some of it and liked it. Next weekend I got some okay ones from Kroger, reverse seared them and she said they were way way better than the restaurant. 

[Jameslaw121 4448]

This is the electric smoker I bought. It's no Green Egg or anything, but it'll get your feet wet. You won't have to worry about temp, you can just concentrate on the meat. Once you have that down, then you'll know what you need to take the next step.

 

http://express.google.com/product/13311824572350436672_13868995323261731535_1699011?mall=WashingtonDC&directCheckout=1&utm_source=google_shopping&utm_medium=product_ads&utm_campaign=gsx&utm_content=test_90_MAX

[solamente73 1132]

OP, with a $1K budget and the description of what you want to do, go with a ceramic cooker like the large BGE.  I’ve had mine for 8 years and have never looked back.  Lights quickly and is very efficient with fuel.  Smoke a brisket, grill steaks, bake pizzas…  I think that the ability to roast meats is often overlooked – it’s one of its greatest benefits.  Easy to maintain temp, and with a computer (e.g. a DigiQ), you can literally set it and forget it on long cooks (though it's a moral imperative that you master your pit before turning it over to a computer).  Learning curve is not steep - YouTube and the thread linked below are your friends.

Join us over here:  http://www.surlyhorns.com/board/index.php?/topic/1302-big-green-egg-other-ceramic-grills-all-encompassing-thread/

22 hours ago, lonestarsooner said:

I will sear both sides of our steaks over the open fire at 650 or so then move them to indirect heat (Joe's come with heat deflectors, believe BGEs do too) and finish there until they're a perfect medium rare.  Wife and I don't go out for steaks any longer because they're never as good as I can make at home with prime cuts from Costco and my egg.  Only exception is the chateaubriand at Perry's, lol.

This. Right. Here.  You can sous vide and sear in a cast iron skillet all you want, but if you like the taste that only fire and smoke can give a steak, this is what you do.  And a serious second on that Chateaubriand - had it for the first time a couple of weeks ago and it was the best piece of steak we've had at a high-end steak house in DFW.

[mapplewhite132 309]

22 hours ago, lonestarsooner said:

Wife and I don't go out for steaks any longer because they're never as good as I can make at home with prime cuts from Costco and my egg.  

sidebar: I love me some Costco, but I do not buy steaks there because they blade tenderize their steaks. This is only an issue if you are buying pre-sliced steaks. 

[Chewbacca 7780]

32 minutes ago, solamente73 said:

OP, with a $1K budget and the description of what you want to do, go with a ceramic cooker like the large BGE.  I’ve had mine for 8 years and have never looked back.  Lights quickly and is very efficient with fuel.  Smoke a brisket, grill steaks, bake pizzas…  I think that the ability to roast meats is often overlooked – it’s one of its greatest benefits.  Easy to maintain temp, and with a computer (e.g. a DigiQ), you can literally set it and forget it on long cooks (though it's a moral imperative that you master your pit before turning it over to a computer).  Learning curve is not steep - YouTube and the thread linked below are your friends.

Join us over here:  http://www.surlyhorns.com/board/index.php?/topic/1302-big-green-egg-other-ceramic-grills-all-encompassing-thread/

This. Right. Here.  You can sous vide and sear in a cast iron skillet all you want, but if you like the taste that only fire and smoke can give a steak, this is what you do.  And a serious second on that Chateaubriand - had it for the first time a couple of weeks ago and it was the best piece of steak we've had at a high-end steak house in DFW.

RE: the bolded, I left that out but agree 100%.  I roast a lot of meats in the BGE with the plate setter (heat deflector) in place.  Beer can chicken and roasts turn out fantastic on the Egg.

[Gene Parmesan 4008]

Yeah I think I am leaning on getting a ceramic grill.  Was looking at some pellet smokers and while I am sure they cooked great it seemed kind of flimsy and I figured I would need it would need extra care from the elements for being electric.  It was kind of an apples and oranges thing though since the pellet grill wasn't really high end. 

Looking at the Kamado Joe classic.  Seems to get the best reviews and is a little over 1k but it seems to be pretty popular as for the reviews.  Not sure what a Large BGE would cost me with everything needed though.

[Chewbacca 7780]

1 hour ago, Gene Parmesan said:

Yeah I think I am leaning on getting a ceramic grill.  Was looking at some pellet smokers and while I am sure they cooked great it seemed kind of flimsy and I figured I would need it would need extra care from the elements for being electric.  It was kind of an apples and oranges thing though since the pellet grill wasn't really high end. 

Looking at the Kamado Joe classic.  Seems to get the best reviews and is a little over 1k but it seems to be pretty popular as for the reviews.  Not sure what a Large BGE would cost me with everything needed though.

Large BGE retails around $900.  Add a nest (or table) and plate setter and you're good to go.  Might cost you $1000-1100.

[BNB 100]

The ceramic sounds like the best idea to me.  I am on the cheap, so I have a Weber smoker and charcoal grill.    Unless you want the convenience of a gass grill.  

[Gene Parmesan 4008]

I already have a gas grill.  I'll keep it for hot dogs and such.

[El Diablo 4232]

I have a couple of issues with the pellet smokers, one is HOW they produce smoke. I think most of them just heat wood to the point that it smolders, there's not really the combustion that you get with stick or charcoal. Also, some of them (most?) are electromechanical. There are moving parts that will gum up and eventually fail. They need extensive cleanings to be kept operational. For folks who want smoked meats and can't for whatever reason do fire they're adequate but jmho, they're not even in the ballpark in comparison to wood/charcoal burners.

[Wally Fairway 5562]

I will sell the OP a broken in, cured, reliable 18" WSM with a complete kit of accessories. The kit includes a chimney, dual probe remote thermometer,  2 pair of tongs, rib rack, 1 pair welding gloves, 1 pair silicone gloves,  2 almost new rolls of foil (wide and normal width), 2 silicone basting brushes, 4-6 partially used bags of wood chunks (oak, mesquite, cherry, apple, ???), 1 set bear paw shredding tools, a propane torch with a new tank, and any other stuff that I have laying around.

Price is $900, but since you have $1,000 to spend I'll throw in a $40 roll-up aluminum folding cooking/camping table and call it an even $grand.
Smoker works fine, not problems at all - not used since Sunday 7/8/18.

This will save you the trouble of having to assemble your new smoker and the hassle of having at least 1 or 2 break-in cooks.

(then I will buy a 22" WSM, different accessories and some meats)

Edited July 13, 2018 by Wally Fairway

[Red Six 131]

On 7/11/2018 at 1:17 PM, Chewbacca said:

I actually disagree.  A kettle is not going to be good for smoking, which is what he wants.  Depending on the OP's budget, I would go for a Weber Smoky Mountain or a BGE.  BGE will be more expnsive but also more versatile.  I've had a BGE for several years now (have 2 Larges) and it can do everything I want it to do.  Cold smoking is about the only thing it can't do.

And I disagree that you cannot smoke with a Weber kettle.

A 22-inch one gives you plenty of space to create distinct direct and indirect zones that simulate (though don't entirely reproduce) the effect of an offset smoker. I do pork butts, chicken, and brisket on mine and am able to maintain necessary temperatures using the bottom vent. I give it about a 20 degree range, e.g. 195-215, and usually go several hours before readjusting it. I just put a pile of briquettes on one side, along with smoke wood, and then put four or five lit ones on it. That is usually good for 8 to 10 hours.

And, of course, a kettle can do all the usual grilling stuff -- steaks, burgers, fish, whatever. I don't know how hot mine can get because I don't keep the thermometer in when I'm not slow-cooking, but it can put a solid sear on a steak.

At $150, a kettle is the best bang for the buck for the all-around category. If he wants something dedicated for smoking, then the WSM would be better. A ceramic grill isn't bad choices either, especially if cost isn't a consideration. However, none of these provide the capacity of an offset smoker (though the WSM is going to have a lot more than a kettle or ceramic grill).

The issue for all three is that it does take a while to get them set up. I liken preparing the grill to an addict's ritual -- pulling out the charcoal, the chimney, and the grilling tools; then filling the chimney and lighting it; then sitting there with a beer while my wife thinks I'm doing something; then maybe opening another beer because I'm sitting outside while my wife thinks I'm doing something; then pouring out the coals, and finally getting the food going.

A gas grill has the benefit of push-button simplicity. This may be heresy, but if he wants to "smoke" his food, he can do an offset setup in the gas grill, then do the wood-chip-in-foil-on-a-burner thing. But then he doesn't get to drink as much beer or play with fire.

Edited July 13, 2018 by Red Six

[Chewbacca 7780]

A Weber kettle is not going to smoke as well as a WSM or BGE or offset.  It just isn't because it isn't designed to.  It sure as hell is not going to hold temp for 20 hours to do a pork butt.  A gas grill isn't going to be a good choice for smoking, either.

Capacity has never been an issue for me on my Large BGE.  I can do 4 pork butts at the same time, or 4-6 racks of ribs.   I'm rarely feeding more than 8-10 people and the BGE does this very well.  If you feed more than that, I would look at an XL or an offset.

[dcbc 14487]

22" Weber Smokey Mountain and a 22" Weber Kettle.   Grill on the kettle.  Smoke on the WSM.  Kettle can do some overflow smoking if necessary.  Best bang for the buck there is.  With both of those, you're still under the price of a ceramic grill/smoker.  And unless you're looking to get temps of a bazillion degrees, the Kettle will more than handle your grilling needs.  And the WSM is a low effort powerhouse of a smoker.

Edited July 14, 2018 by dcbc

[Sbbruin 21861]

I have this Masterbuilt electric smoker and it is super easy and works great.

 

[Baboontyme 2814]

I've had my Primo for about a week and I really like it. Disclaimer, I have 2 18.5 WSMs and I've long sung their praises for smoking. I also have a 24 x 48 offset. And of course a large gas propane grill.

I'd say it depends on what you think you want to do on it. If you plan on grilling 99% of the time, lean kettle or Performer or something like that. If you plan on smoking 99% of the time, I'd go WSM. If you think you will do a lot of grilling, some smoking, maybe some pizza making, get a Ceramic. The round Primo (same as BGE large, the one I got) can be had for about $850. I think the BGE is about $100 more. Not sure what the Kamado Joe costs. 

Above all else, make sure you buy something that will give you a good smoke ring. 

[lonestarsooner 121]

Cross posted to the food thread. For all my north Houston brothers, just heard from a buddy that the Kamado Joe roadshow is back at the Costco in The Woodlands this weekend. Great deals on grills and lump. Good timing for me. I’m just running out of all the lump I stocked up on at the roadshow last year.