CFP Semifinal: Texas vs Washington - 7:45pm on ESPN

[VirginiaLonghorn 4781]

… until they coach “look back for the ball” out of him.

[Bobby Layne 270]

12 hours ago, Make em eat Taco Bell said:

the fade to AD worked for a TD earlier tonight. 

That’s why they were ready for it. Break tendencies. Go shirt to pylon. DB has to go through Adonai. Can’t break it up without PI. We win. It would be cool if the line could/would protect and give Ewers time. 

[UTexasFight 9528]

My problem, which I screamed live, was with the decision on 2nd down.

ewers thinking he had something with AD double covered and throwing it out of the back of the end zone instead of taking 5 yards to JT to the 8 or 9

 

[Surly Bevo 25153]

8 minutes ago, UTexasFight said:

My problem, which I screamed live, was with the decision on 2nd down.

ewers thinking he had something with AD double covered and throwing it out of the back of the end zone instead of taking 5 yards to JT to the 8 or 9

 

This is a great example of what Troph has been talking about.  Quinn has to make a minimum 22-yard pass here to get the ball to the end zone, BUT at the same time because it is the end zone the defense can use the back line as an extra defender.  A play from the 5-7 (to your point about picking up a few yards) makes things a lot easier as passes don't have to be mid-range to long to get the ball there.  The area between the 10-15 yard line is some of the hardest space in football to operate in.

Edited January 2 by Surly Bevo

[Longhornlove 4885]

13 minutes ago, jw4381 said:

Mukuba will hopefully bring our secondary up to a higher standard. 

I doubt it if they have him at nickel replacing a NFL bound Barron as most believe. If at safety, sure but I'm pretty sure Safety will have many more athletic options next year. I'm more concerned about replacing Sweat and Murphy.

[OU Sucks 8916]

21 minutes ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

Because the first two reads were covered up based on defensive alignment.

So the play call was to fake the toss to Blue, only look at Blue the whole time based on the D's alignment, and then throw it to him while under virtually no pressure, while JWhitt was open near the 4, near the sideline?  We had 4 receivers plus Blue on that play.

Edited January 2 by OU Sucks

[Helobious 9464]

 Remember the end of Friday Night Lights? He did get stopped at the 1 but Mike Winchell scrambles and breaks like 8 tackles and carries a pile of defenders on the last play. Why didn’t Ewers do that?

[Bobby Layne 270]

12 hours ago, hobbes2702 said:

We should have been running the ball and controlling the clock. Help your defense out some and keep them off the field. Especially when you’re getting 9 a touch. 
The defense was terrible but Sark absolutely shit the bed for two full quarters.

Last sentence. Stop after “defense was terrible”. 300 passing yards in 1st half isn’t on Sark. That’s poor defense. DBs cost us ou game and this game. They’re just not good. Easy interceptions this year was fools gold. Penix picked us apart. Quick release killed any hope of rush. When we DID get pressure, he easily outran us and then completed quality throws. He had career day.  We fumble away good drives and still had chance to win. Good season assholes. Experience your anger and grief as I am, but have some perspective. We’re good. Not great. Yet. Hire some DBs with speed and stick and we would have been undefeated THIS year. We went to war with the army we had. Almost pulled it off. Hook em. 

[FunkSoulBrother 931]

1 minute ago, Helobious said:

 Remember the end of Friday Night Lights? He did get stopped at the 1 but Mike Winchell scrambles and breaks like 8 tackles and carries a pile of defenders on the last play. Why didn’t Ewers do that?

Permian still lost

[troph 24910]

10 minutes ago, UTexasFight said:

My problem, which I screamed live, was with the decision on 2nd down.

ewers thinking he had something with AD double covered and throwing it out of the back of the end zone instead of taking 5 yards to JT to the 8 or 9

 

 

2 minutes ago, Surly Bevo said:

This is a great example of what Troph has been talking about.  Quinn has to make a minimum 22-yard pass here to get the ball to the end zone, BUT at the same time because it is the end zone the defense can use the back line as an extra defender.  A play from the 5-7 (to your point about picking up a few yards) makes things a lot easier as passes don't have to be mid-range to long to get the ball there.  The area between the 10-15 yard line is some of the hardest space in football to operate in.

I didn't take a look at 2nd down, Sanders at the 9 hurts. he gets to the 5-6 and even if only one play man that's an easier throw.  I'd gladly trade 2 shots from the 12 for 1 from the 6. ugh. fucking game of inches.

[Schulz2.0 29011]

3 minutes ago, OU Sucks said:

So the play call was to fake the toss to Blue, only look at Blue the whole time, and then throw it to him while under virtually no pressure, while JWhitt was open near the 4, near the sideline?  We had 4 receivers plus Blue on that play.

We had 15 seconds to run the 4 plays. You can't sit back with your thumb up your ass taking 8-9 seconds on a play.

[dcar00 14367]

4 minutes ago, OU Sucks said:

So the play call was to fake the toss to Blue, only look at Blue the whole time based on the D's alignment, and then throw it to him while under virtually no pressure, while JWhitt was open near the 4, near the sideline?  We had 4 receivers plus Blue on that play.

shit if the alignment means the only play is to Blue then just pitch him the ball and have him run outside, especially to the short side

[OU Sucks 8916]

6 minutes ago, Schulz2.0 said:

We had 15 seconds to run the 4 plays. You can't sit back with your thumb up your ass taking 8-9 seconds on a play.

JWhitt was wide open beyond Blue at the same time he threw it to Blue.  It wouldn't have taken any longer than it took to throw it to Blue (maybe one extra second), plus JWhitt could've stepped out of bounds if he was worried about getting tackled inbounds.

Edited January 2 by OU Sucks

[Longhornlove 4885]

2 minutes ago, Bobby Layne said:

DBs cost us ou game and this game.

I don't see it that way. Penix and those receivers repeatedly beat good coverage. We didn't put enough pressure on the QB and when we did he turned into Joe Burrow. When we didn't, he turned into Joe Burrow. We got soundly beat by a great QB, O-line and 3 NFL receivers.

[MNLonghornFUKM 8822]

https://www.instagram.com/p/C1m1P0WO9Z_/?igsh=YmcxdDgxZGtmM282

NSIAP.

lol. My man was ready to exchange jabs

[dcar00 14367]

2 minutes ago, Schulz2.0 said:

We had 15 seconds to run the 4 plays. You can't sit back with your thumb up your ass taking 8-9 seconds on a play.

yep.  if we had 15 more seconds the run would have been available to get a first and we likely score.

[Gucci_Suit 2656]

8 minutes ago, Helobious said:

 Remember the end of Friday Night Lights? He did get stopped at the 1 but Mike Winchell scrambles and breaks like 8 tackles and carries a pile of defenders on the last play. Why didn’t Ewers do that?

I thought we should have thrown it to tweeder and let him hook and ladder it to Billy Bob. 

[Dahobbs 17682]

3 minutes ago, OU Sucks said:

JWhitt was wide open behind Blue at the same time he threw it to Blue.  It wouldn't have taken any longer than it took to throw it to Blue, plus JWhitt could've stepped out of bounds if he was worried about getting tackled inbounds.

No one is saying that Quinn made the best read there. Only that the play wasn't designed to have Blue as the primary target. 

[MirrOlure 14844]

I'm still hungover.....

I haven’t even made it to the hangover stage yet…

[dcar00 14367]

1 minute ago, Gucci_Suit said:

I thought we should have thrown it to tweeder and let him hook and ladder it to Billy Bob. 

"hook and ladder" is my second favorite to "shuffle pass"

[dcar00 14367]

21 minutes ago, UTexasFight said:

My problem, which I screamed live, was with the decision on 2nd down.

ewers thinking he had something with AD double covered and throwing it out of the back of the end zone instead of taking 5 yards to JT to the 8 or 9

 

what is nuts about that pic is we are 10 yards deep from the LOS throwing the ball.  

[OU Sucks 8916]

7 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

No one is saying that Quinn made the best read there. Only that the play wasn't designed to have Blue as the primary target. 

And that's my point.  Blue was literally the only read Quinn made, if you look at the replay.  I could understand not looking at the left side of the field due to the alignment, but he didn't even scan for JT or JWhitt on the right side (JT was pretty much triple-covered and if he saw JWhitt open, we would have been set up around the 3-4 yard line or better).

Edited January 2 by OU Sucks

[Dahobbs 17682]

1 minute ago, OU Sucks said:

And that's my point.  Blue was literally the only read Quinn made, if you look at the replay.  I could understand not looking at the left side of the field due to the alignment, but he didn't even scan for JT or JWhitt on the right side (JT was pretty much triple-covered and if he saw JWhitt open, we would have been set up around the 3-4 yard line or better).

I'm pretty sure Sark covered this. It wasn't designed for Blue. I don't know why Quinn did what he did, but Blue wasn't the primary design of the play. 

[OU Sucks 8916]

3 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

I'm pretty sure Sark covered this. It wasn't designed for Blue. I don't know why Quinn did what he did, but Blue wasn't the primary design of the play. 

I never said Blue was the primary target.  I'm questioning "why did Quinn only lock into Blue and not see that JWhitt was wide open?  Especially when Blue wasn't the primary target."

Edited January 2 by OU Sucks

[Surly Bevo 25153]

16 minutes ago, OU Sucks said:

JWhitt was wide open beyond Blue at the same time he threw it to Blue.  It wouldn't have taken any longer than it took to throw it to Blue (maybe one extra second), plus JWhitt could've stepped out of bounds if he was worried about getting tackled inbounds.

Screenshot with the ball already in the air isn't the best example.  Grab one before the ball is released and let's see where 5 is and then we can talk.

[jw4381 3095]

3 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

I'm pretty sure Sark covered this. It wasn't designed for Blue. I don't know why Quinn did what he did, but Blue wasn't the primary design of the play. 

I was wondering if he was concussed on that hit from trice. Maybe he wasn’t completely coherent?

[Dahobbs 17682]

1 minute ago, OU Sucks said:

I never said Blue was the primary target.  I'm questioning "why did Quinn only lock into Blue and not see that JWhitt was wide open?  Especially when Blue wasn't the primary target."

It seemed to me that is what you were arguing. If not, cool beans. 

[jw4381 3095]

6 minutes ago, Surly Bevo said:

Screenshot with the ball already in the air isn't the best example.  Grab one before the ball is released and let's see where 5 is and then we can talk.

Also, are you sure there’s no defender out of the picture upfield of Whitt? If so a back shoulder throw to him could get him out of bounds inside the 5…

Edited January 2 by jw4381

[Hagbard Celine 10923]

1 hour ago, Irish Wrist Watch said:

Texas didn't bring their A game, but they did everything necessary to win. The D held when it needed to. The O got the ball to the 15. That's where the loss occurred. Sark got us to the desert tray, but didn't let the big dog eat. Terrible play calls. We should have scored and it would have been one of the greatest comebacks in UT history - maybe even in all of college football. Sark went blind when the chips were down. He needs an OC, or at least someone to bounce plays off of or discuss strategy, especially in situations like that.

He had a great year and hopefully learned a thing or two going forward. I will probably get over this loss in next year or so. 

Afterthought - How long was VYs scramble to the end zone against USC. If we'd been on the left hash mark last night and Quinn had rolled right, and if the receivers had cleared a path for him...

my take is the game was lost:

1 - because of penalties (all legit)

2 - negation of our #1 strength - our rotationfresh(?) D box could not get home - give penix the extra half second and he's deadly

3 - refusal to go off the opening script when it was clear we could gash for 8+ yards off tackle

4 - secondary went back to last year - they did not watch the ball and failed to contest 5 or 6 of penix's "dimes"

[The Dude 1246]

56 minutes ago, troph said:

I'm about ready to quit this place again at least for a few weeks until the coulda, woulda, shoulda talk dies down.  reminds me of my mom last night, we had my inlaws over and she turned to me after they left (half time of the Rose Bowl) and said about my BIL, "he doesn't know much about Texas football, does he?" I said, "no mom, not everyone reads surly."

It really is a beating

[troph 24910]

23 minutes ago, OU Sucks said:

JWhitt was wide open beyond Blue at the same time he threw it to Blue.  It wouldn't have taken any longer than it took to throw it to Blue (maybe one extra second), plus JWhitt could've stepped out of bounds if he was worried about getting tackled inbounds.

this doesn't show JW open, it shows 5 moving toward blue easily a second maybe two after Ewers made the move to Blue. it also doesn't show what JW was running into. the ball is already half way there in this shot. and if you notice, blue has one on one with 5 and has some shake. 

[OU Sucks 8916]

12 minutes ago, Surly Bevo said:

Screenshot with the ball already in the air isn't the best example.  Grab one before the ball is released and let's see where 5 is and then we can talk.

3 minutes ago, troph said:

this doesn't show JW open, it shows 5 moving toward blue easily a second maybe two after Ewers made the move to Blue. it also doesn't show what JW was running into. the ball is already half way there in this shot. and if you notice, blue has one on one with 5 and has some shake. 

The DB at the 2 yard line aligned with JWhitt is bailing and in the end zone by the next frame, with all momentum backwards, which is why you can't see what JWhitt is running into (he's a good 5+ yards off).  JWhitt also turns his head in preparation for a pass the same way Blue is in the next frame.

Edited January 2 by OU Sucks

[troph 24910]

1 minute ago, OU Sucks said:

The DB at the 2 yard aligned with JWhitt is bailing and in the end zone by the next frame.  JWhitt also turns his head in preparation for a pass the same way Blue is in the next frame.

 and 5 has an INT on a throw to JW.  no one is open on that play, all 11 are on screen. sucks but the check down was right unless you throw it away. at least throwing to blue gives a shot at a missed tackle.

Edited January 2 by troph

[Fico 1791]

29 minutes ago, troph said:

 

 I'd gladly trade 2 shots from the 12 for 1 from the 6. ugh. fucking game of inches.

This one I don’t agree with. The field is even more compressed and trafficked at the 6. 
 

Maybe there could be an argument made in normal game situations where you could theoretically have the threat of running the ball…. But in a must pass situation I would take more “space” (within reason of course) every time. 
 

I do think we should have stressed the middle/wide side a play or to - use QE’s arm strength and force them to defend the entire field.

[Not a cat 5704]

2 minutes ago, troph said:

this doesn't show JW open, it shows 5 moving toward blue easily a second maybe two after Ewers made the move to Blue. it also doesn't show what JW was running into. the ball is already half way there in this shot. and if you notice, blue has one on one with 5 and has some shake. 

Blue has shake but that's not helpful against any DB with a brain when you're on the sidelines and if you are tackled in bounds game is over.  I like that call with a minute left, hate it with 15 seconds.

[OU Sucks 8916]

1 minute ago, troph said:

 and 5 has an INT on a throw to JW.  no one is open on that play, all 11 are on screen. sucks but the check down was right unless you throw it away. at least throwing to blue gives a shot at a missed tackle.

No he doesn't.  He's running full steam towards Blue, who he sees is open.  He's not going to stop on a dime and jump up at a ball thrown behind him.

[Dahobbs 17682]

Just now, OU Sucks said:

No he doesn't.  He's running full steam towards Blue, who he sees is open.  He's not going to stop on a dime and jump up at a ball thrown behind him.

He is running towards blue because Quinn has already started the throw. 

[Surly Bevo 25153]

2 minutes ago, troph said:

 and 5 has an INT on a throw to JW. 

Correct, even in that screen shot 5 is on the move toward Blue because he is reading Ewers eyes and where he is going with the ball.  Now sure you could argue that maybe Ewers comes off Blue AND back to JWhitt once he has made 5 commit to Blue in that manner BUT that is way easier said than done in a situation where Ewers knows the 2 things he cannot do are 1. take a lot of time and FAR MORE IMPORTANTLY 2. cannot take a sack.

Ewers knowing he can't take a sack is a little underrated in this whole conversation.  It's easy to screenshot and QB after the fact but at the moment it's a very real thought/pressure.  As much as that ending sucked it would have sucked the rancid grundle of a 80-year-old hooker's taint to end the game on a sack where somebody like AD didn't even get a chance to make a play.  

[Wilcox Cummingtonite 3036]

43 minutes ago, FunkSoulBrother said:

Permian still lost

And it wasn’t even the state championship 

[troph 24910]

9 minutes ago, OU Sucks said:

No he doesn't.  He's running full steam towards Blue, who he sees is open.  He's not going to stop on a dime and jump up at a ball thrown behind him.

the point he's making a play on JW is 1-2 seconds before this frame.

[troph 24910]

16 minutes ago, Fico said:

This one I don’t agree with. The field is even more compressed and trafficked at the 6. 
 

Maybe there could be an argument made in normal game situations where you could theoretically have the threat of running the ball…. But in a must pass situation I would take more “space” (within reason of course) every time. 
 

I do think we should have stressed the middle/wide side a play or to - use QE’s arm strength and force them to defend the entire field.

you do have the threat of running the ball - you could toss sweep to the short side and instruct the back to get to the side line and turn it up. I mean I wouldn't call that, but it's enough of a threat the D has to at least account for it. you have shorter passes so less issue with pressure, less time for a back to make a play on the ball while it's in the air, you have short aggressive slants, easier out routes. flares to the RB could score. there's way more options from the 5 than the 12.

Edited January 2 by troph

[OU Sucks 8916]

10 minutes ago, troph said:

the point he's making a play on JW is 1-2 seconds before this frame.

2 seconds before the frame, the ball wasn't even snapped.  And he never came close to covering JWhitt because JT ran between them.  Anyway, my entire point was that it didn't seem like there was any other read made.  Maybe Quinn glanced at JWhitt, but if he did, the whole outside of the field was open, with JWhitt already past #5 when the ball was thrown and the DB up top was bailing into the end zone.

Edited January 2 by OU Sucks

[troph 24910]

10 minutes ago, OU Sucks said:

2 seconds before the frame, the ball wasn't even snapped.  And he never came close to covering JWhitt because JT ran between them.  Anyway, my entire point was that it didn't seem like there was any other read made.  Maybe Quinn glanced at JWhitt, but if he did, the whole outside of the field was open, with JWhitt already past #5 when the ball was thrown and the DB up top was bailing into the end zone.

1 second, whatever, #5 was in a different spot a second ago.

Edited January 2 by troph

[NashLonghorn 272]

1 hour ago, troph said:

shit he times it a tad different he might make it. get the DPI call and it's an untimed down from the 2. game of inches. tons coulda been done differently but a chance from the 12 with 1 second. I mean that's as close as it gets.

Not a fucking chance in hell DPI would be called on the D in the end zone unless the receiver was tackled and even that would be questionable considering the lack of penalties called on Washington with this crew

[MonkeyDoughnut 10357]

15 minutes ago, OU Sucks said:

2 seconds before the frame, the ball wasn't even snapped.  And he never came close to covering JWhitt because JT ran between them.  Anyway, my entire point was that it didn't seem like there was any other read made.  Maybe Quinn glanced at JWhitt, but if he did, the whole outside of the field was open, with JWhitt already past #5 when the ball was thrown and the DB up top was bailing into the end zone.

The play was supposed to go to either JWhitt or Sanders, but when they lined up Washington had 4 DBs boxed on them. Both were double teamed. Check down to Blue and closest DB breaks off to make play. Neither JWhitt or Sanders is going to be open for a quick throw based solely on alignment.

[Bodowned 763]

I just listened to Todd McShay say that Penix’s performance yesterday (as a pocket passer) was maybe the most impressive QB performance he’s ever seen at the college level. I just watched a highlight tape of his throws from last night (hadn’t seen many of them since I was in the stadium) and I find it hard to disagree. That was 2019 LSU stuff; the fact that we had a shot at the end with Penix throwing 40+ yard dots on every drive is incredible. Just really bad luck we ran into a guy that dialed in because the defense had no margin for error.

[OU Sucks 8916]

12 minutes ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

The play was supposed to go to either JWhitt or Sanders, but when they lined up Washington had 4 DBs boxed on them. Both were double teamed. Check down to Blue and closest DB breaks off to make play. Neither JWhitt or Sanders is going to be open for a quick throw based solely on alignment.

But JWhitt was open.  #5 passed him off to the DB at the 2, who bailed into the end zone while JWhitt was around the 5.  If Quinn held onto the ball for a split second longer (which he could afford to do) or noticed #5 standing still while JWhitt ran past him, he would've seen it.

Edited January 2 by OU Sucks

[troph 24910]

16 minutes ago, NashLonghorn said:

Not a fucking chance in hell DPI would be called on the D in the end zone unless the receiver was tackled and even that would be questionable considering the lack of penalties called on Washington with this crew

I never said it was going to be called.

[NashLonghorn 272]

4 minutes ago, troph said:

I never said it was going to be called.

Oh, I never meant that you say that, I’m talking in general on the last few plays. 

[tbone_ 14164]

I just listened to Todd McShay say that Penix’s performance yesterday (as a pocket passer) was maybe the most impressive QB performance he’s ever seen at the college level.

I was saying this the whole game. I think he’s going to fuck Michigan up.