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Texas Tech player a bit rapey

BurntOrange&White

By BurntOrange&White
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a post on the Tech board:

So the details seem to be:

1. Pop (20 at the time), had sex with Steffe’s sister, who was 17 at the time - while in the Bahamas for the team trip.

2. 17 is the age of legal consent in Bahamas and Texas so no legal underage issue.

3. Steffe’s dad filed a civil lawsuit seeking $1M from Pop because he says a booster provided them with alcohol and got them too drunk consent. If there was a forced assault, there would be a criminal complaint as age of consent wouldn’t matter - but that was not pursued .

4. Consensus (on social media, FWIW) seems to be that it was actually Steffe’s DAD who was the booster who bought/served them the alcohol.

5. Steffe was comfortable enough after the incident to stay on the team for nearly two months after the alleged incident.

This situation is incredibly strange…the fact pattern that just isn’t adding up. I always start by giving the female the benefit of the doubt but this situation and the dad’s actions are very odd. If there was forced assault, this should be a criminal matter handled by authorities - yet it’s not.

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Brian Fantana

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1 hour ago, shadow_operative said:

wait. so steffe’s dad provided the alcohol to the point where the girl was beyond her ability to consent, and then he sued for $1M based on the fact that…he provided the alcohol to the point where the girl was beyond her ability to consent? did i read that right?

He always struck me as the worst kind of helicopter dad. Weird considering his kid isn't even good.

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Hermanator

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12 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

wait. so steffe’s dad provided the alcohol to the point where the girl was beyond her ability to consent, and then he sued for $1M based on the fact that…he provided the alcohol to the point where the girl was beyond her ability to consent? did i read that right?

The ramblings on a tech board about their own team having a guy getting rapey with a 17 year old aren't going to make sense. They're going to go with a Goebbels level propaganda and smear campaign to protect their own player. 

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Gatorubet

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2 hours ago, Braff Zacklin said:

Don't know the details and suppose no one does at this point, but if this is merely a case of a 20-year-old having consensual sex with a 17-year-old, it's a big nothingburger to me.

As long as none of the calculations involve “sheep years.”

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Brian Fantana

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3 hours ago, Braff Zacklin said:

Don't know the details and suppose no one does at this point, but if this is merely a case of a 20-year-old having consensual sex with a 17-year-old, it's a big nothingburger to me.

From the details I've been able to track down, this is something close to the current consensus:

  • Drew Steffe's family came to the Bahamas with the team
  • A group of players and other people, including Isaacs/Drew and said family were getting drunk at the hotel
  • Drinking age is 18 in the Bahamas, but I would assume they would serve minors if accompanied by a parent, or not who the fuck knows
  • Booze was being bought for them by a booster
  • That booster was Drew Steffe's father, Matt Steffe
  • At some point, a group of players and a couple of girls went to a hotel room
  • At some point, Isaacs and Drew Steffe's sister left to go have sex
  • ????
  • Civil lawsuit

Details are murky. Matt Steffe is an extremely weird person. I'm generally always on the "believe women" side, but not a lot of what he is claiming in the suit makes sense, especially considering he's the one that got everyone drunk allegedly.

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jimmyjazz

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I have two kids at UT right now.  I cannot imagine, under any circumstance, buying them or their friends enough alcohol for them to get drunk.  That's Bad Parenting 101.

Not that I believe or disbelieve any aspect of the story currently being told, because it's all coming from Tech fans (and it's hearsay at best, regardless), but the stink permeates all aspects of this situation.

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Brian Fantana

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3 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

I have two kids at UT right now.  I cannot imagine, under any circumstance, buying them or their friends enough alcohol for them to get drunk.  That's Bad Parenting 101.

Not that I believe or disbelieve any aspect of the story currently being told, because it's all coming from Tech fans (and it's hearsay at best, regardless), but the stink permeates all aspects of this situation.

I think the better move would have been to suspend him, unless the known facts that aren't currently public are just beyond a shadow of a doubt.

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jimmyjazz

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Just now, Brian Fantana said:

I think the better move would have been to suspend him, unless the known facts that aren't currently public are just beyond a shadow of a doubt.

Of course that would have been the better move.  We're not talking about a court of law.  It's perfectly reasonable to go with "whether you are actually guilty of the crime you are accused of, you used poor judgment and your ass is sitting for the time being".

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Let's gently refresh some memories for the high horse/ righteous indignation crowd, about a guy who suited up for Texas in 38 games in 22-23 and played 444 minutes-

Morris was originally charged with a Class A misdemeanor on allegations he assaulted an ex-girlfriend in the Dallas area in June 2022, shortly before he enrolled at the University of Texas. Morris transferred to Kansas after the 2022-2023 season.

 

  and there's a lot less smoke around the Isaacs situation, other than a pissed off/ unhinged dad, who actually contributed to the situation.  But yeah, to be safe, let's suspend the player who is not facing any criminal charges, in order to ease the right minded consciences of a few  fucking Texas fans.

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hobbes2702

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5 hours ago, slorch said:

Let's gently refresh some memories for the high horse/ righteous indignation crowd, about a guy who suited up for Texas in 38 games in 22-23 and played 444 minutes-

Morris was originally charged with a Class A misdemeanor on allegations he assaulted an ex-girlfriend in the Dallas area in June 2022, shortly before he enrolled at the University of Texas. Morris transferred to Kansas after the 2022-2023 season.

 

  and there's a lot less smoke around the Isaacs situation, other than a pissed off/ unhinged dad, who actually contributed to the situation.  But yeah, to be safe, let's suspend the player who is not facing any criminal charges, in order to ease the right minded consciences of a few  fucking Texas fans.

You would look good in Baylor green

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13 minutes ago, hobbes2702 said:

You would look good in Baylor green

Lol. While in college, probably a minimum 33% of us engaged in the behavior exhibited by Pop Isaacs in the Bahamas. If you think that is remotely approaching what happened in Waco, welp, keep on being willfully disingenuous. 
 

The sensationalism and gotcha one liners are much fun. 

Edited by slorch
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hobbes2702

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16 minutes ago, slorch said:

Lol. While in college, probably a minimum 33% of us engaged in the behavior exhibited by Pop Isaacs in the Bahamas. If you think that is remotely approaching what happened in Waco, welp, keep on being willfully disingenuous. 
 

The sensationalism and gotcha one liners are much fun. 

You had sex with 17 year olds in college? Gross dude. Just because the law says it’s ok doesn’t mean it’s not gross, creepy, possibly more than that.

I think you putting on your white knight costume to defend someone accused of rape is weird and something they do at Baylor. You can say “not enough details” and leave it at that, but you feel the need to go beyond that.

Edited by hobbes2702
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Brian Fantana

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55 minutes ago, hobbes2702 said:

You had sex with 17 year olds in college? Gross dude. Just because the law says it’s ok doesn’t mean it’s not gross, creepy, possibly more than that.

I think you putting on your white knight costume to defend someone accused of rape is weird and something they do at Baylor. You can say “not enough details” and leave it at that, but you feel the need to go beyond that.

In a vacuum, there's not a god damn thing wrong with a 20 year old and a 17 year old fucking. You are straight up delusional if you think that doesn't happen everywhere, all the time. If they were partying in someone's hotel room and decided to go off somewhere else and fuck, which is what it sounds like, I couldn't give two shits about it, period.

It becomes problematic if she was too drunk to consent and/or she was raped. If that's the case, then I hope Pop and the university get buried for it, and her dad too for feeding her alcohol and letting her go off who knows where with a bunch of strange dudes. Given what I personally know about the Tech Title IX office, I sincerely doubt he would be playing right now if that was a real concern for them.

That being said, I always lean toward suspend first, figure it out later. It's the same thing I said about the Arterio Morris sitch, since slorch decided to bring it up, and I stand by that.

Additionally, Pop's body language after the game raised my eyebrows, at least. The team was naturally celebrating the win in the locker room, but he was off by himself in the corner with his head in his hands. To me, that suggests he's still very much concerned about how this is going to play out. It could mean he actually did do something wrong, or it could just mean he is a kid having trouble dealing with his name being in the national news for the wrong reasons. Who knows, that's just my personal conjecture.

I won't yet go so far as to say Matt Steffe is just trying to squeeze a payday out of the university because he's pissed off that his son isn't good enough to play, but given what is known, I lean more in that direction than in the direction of Pop being a rapist. We'll see how it plays out.

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hobbes2702

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13 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

In a vacuum, there's not a god damn thing wrong with a 20 year old and a 17 year old fucking. You are straight up delusional if you think that doesn't happen everywhere, all the time. If they were partying in someone's hotel room and decided to go off somewhere else and fuck, which is what it sounds like, I couldn't give two shits about it, period.

It becomes problematic if she was too drunk to consent and/or she was raped. If that's the case, then I hope Pop and the university get buried for it, and her dad too for feeding her alcohol and letting her go off who knows where with a bunch of strange dudes. Given what I personally know about the Tech Title IX office, I sincerely doubt he would be playing right now if that was a real concern for them.

That being said, I always lean toward suspend first, figure it out later. It's the same thing I said about the Arterio Morris sitch, since slorch decided to bring it up, and I stand by that.

Additionally, Pop's body language after the game raised my eyebrows, at least. The team was naturally celebrating the win in the locker room, but he was off by himself in the corner with his head in his hands. To me, that suggests he's still very much concerned about how this is going to play out. It could mean he actually did do something wrong, or it could just mean he is a kid having trouble dealing with his name being in the national news for the wrong reasons. Who knows, that's just my personal conjecture.

I won't yet go so far as to say Matt Steffe is just trying to squeeze a payday out of the university because he's pissed off that his son isn't good enough to play, but given what is known, I lean more in that direction than in the direction of Pop being a rapist. We'll see how it plays out.

I’m sure it does happen all the time. That doesn’t mean it’s not gross for a college student to have sex with a high schooler. It also illegal in some parts of this country. I personally didn’t and don’t think it’s appropriate. In California, Arizona, etc. it would be a crime

To the larger point, you’re correct. Which is why it’s strange that slorch is here white knighting and what-abouting. Suspend them and figure it out.

Notice that you haven’t been comped to Baylor, because you aren’t doing what he is.

Edited by hobbes2702
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jimmyjazz

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I went to undergrad in the same town as I grew up, and my HS girlfriend was one year younger than me.  It felt creepy as hell dating her my freshman year in college, which was a far cry from a 3-year age difference.  We broke up.

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hobbes2702

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Just now, jimmyjazz said:

I went to undergrad in the same town as I grew up, and my HS girlfriend was one year younger than me.  It felt creepy as hell dating her my freshman year in college, which was a far cry from a 3-year age difference.  We broke up.

I get the high school sweethearts thing for sure. That’s obviously a bit different.
Again I’m not saying he should be in jail for consensual sex with a 17 year old, despite the laws in some places in this country. But for me personally, it’s creepy and weird. 

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jimmyjazz

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1 minute ago, hobbes2702 said:

Again I’m not saying he should be in jail for consensual sex with a 17 year old, despite the laws in some places in this country. But for me personally, it’s creepy and weird. 

Agreed 100%.  But, Tech.

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Samson's Wig

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The timeline on this one is one is weird. 

  1. The Steffe son doesn't get any playing time and is told in no uncertain terms that he will redshirt and the program will help him find a transfer landing spot if he wants.
  2.  The Bahamas tourney happens, and whatever goes down between Isaacs and his Steffe's sister happens, with the parents and the brother of this girl directly on site and involved in the partying.  Both parties are of legal age so as long as it was consensual there is nothing to see here.
  3. Fast forward around six weeks, and Isaacs is bragging about whatever happened with the sister (likely giving the brother shit because he's a spoiled little bitch and asked for it, but still shitty behavior on Isaacs' part). 
  4. Daddy gets pissed about all of it and wants his son to leave the program altogether, but attempts to shake down the program for $250k on the way out the door, and they tell him to get bent. 
  5. Magically, a civil suit is conveniently filed by Dad one day before conference play begins, with no allegations coming directly from the young lady at all.   
  6. The suit doesn't use the word rape a single time, and it absolutely would if that is what was being alleged.  The suit's language is vague and contradicts itself, but this is likely because it is Daddy filing it, not the young lady.  He's angry, or crazy, and doesn't have his story straight even to a point his attorney can draft something that makes sense.
  7. While all of this is going down, Dad is posting creepy social media pics and comments with and about his daughter, crossing even Trump/Ivanka levels of daddy/daughter creepy.

Who the fuck knows? 

If the daughter comes forward and accuses the guy of something, I'd be inclined to believe her.  Until that happens, this all smells like a douchebag (and severely creepy) father pissed off that his son had no playing time and that his princess hooked up with a college kid.  Sleeping with your teammate's sister is a shitty thing to do under any circumstances, even if said teammate is a douche and no one likes him.   It still all adds up to sour grapes from a Baker Mayfield type of family looking for a payday.  We're supposed to believe thing guy's story even though he waited months to do something about his daughter being assaulted, and never involved any authorities.  What father would handle it this way if something really happened? 

 The student section did what they should do, though, and gave Isaacs hell all game, but it didn't seem to bother him based on his performance.  Some of the chants of "pedophile" were over the top, IMO, but I know most folks are just reading headlines and don't know any details.

Ultimately, this will come down to whether or not Tech's Title IX office functions like it should or has taken on a Baylor style of coverup.  They've been draconian in the past when players have been accused, and thus far, they say their investigation has not found anything on this player.  Unless we see evidence that this office is acting like Baylor's coverup shop, and there is zero indication this is the case, I'll tend to believe them given the current information. 

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20 hours ago, hobbes2702 said:

I’m sure it does happen all the time. That doesn’t mean it’s not gross for a college student to have sex with a high schooler. It also illegal in some parts of this country. I personally didn’t and don’t think it’s appropriate. In California, Arizona, etc. it would be a crime

To the larger point, you’re correct. Which is why it’s strange that slorch is here white knighting and what-abouting. Suspend them and figure it out.

Notice that you haven’t been comped to Baylor, because you aren’t doing what he is.

LOlz.

1.  You consistently disagree with me on here, regardless of the topic.  Fuck off.

2. Maybe the people in charge already have figured it out and don't want to go down the Craig James Crazy Daddy path again.  Remember how true the allegations were?  Not only should Leach not heave even been suspended, but the Tech administrators should have laughed off the bullshit like most other schools would have.  You want a result that is illogical.

You kill the messenger.  a lot.  It's not limited to you.

Edited by slorch
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Uncle Nate

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21 hours ago, Samson's Wig said:

The timeline on this one is one is weird. 

  1. The Steffe son doesn't get any playing time and is told in no uncertain terms that he will redshirt and the program will help him find a transfer landing spot if he wants.
  2.  The Bahamas tourney happens, and whatever goes down between Isaacs and his Steffe's sister happens, with the parents and the brother of this girl directly on site and involved in the partying.  Both parties are of legal age so as long as it was consensual there is nothing to see here.
  3. Fast forward around six weeks, and Isaacs is bragging about whatever happened with the sister (likely giving the brother shit because he's a spoiled little bitch and asked for it, but still shitty behavior on Isaacs' part). 
  4. Daddy gets pissed about all of it and wants his son to leave the program altogether, but attempts to shake down the program for $250k on the way out the door, and they tell him to get bent. 
  5. Magically, a civil suit is conveniently filed by Dad one day before conference play begins, with no allegations coming directly from the young lady at all.   
  6. The suit doesn't use the word rape a single time, and it absolutely would if that is what was being alleged.  The suit's language is vague and contradicts itself, but this is likely because it is Daddy filing it, not the young lady.  He's angry, or crazy, and doesn't have his story straight even to a point his attorney can draft something that makes sense.
  7. While all of this is going down, Dad is posting creepy social media pics and comments with and about his daughter, crossing even Trump/Ivanka levels of daddy/daughter creepy.

Who the fuck knows? 

If the daughter comes forward and accuses the guy of something, I'd be inclined to believe her.  Until that happens, this all smells like a douchebag (and severely creepy) father pissed off that his son had no playing time and that his princess hooked up with a college kid.  Sleeping with your teammate's sister is a shitty thing to do under any circumstances, even if said teammate is a douche and no one likes him.   It still all adds up to sour grapes from a Baker Mayfield type of family looking for a payday.  We're supposed to believe thing guy's story even though he waited months to do something about his daughter being assaulted, and never involved any authorities.  What father would handle it this way if something really happened? 

 The student section did what they should do, though, and gave Isaacs hell all game, but it didn't seem to bother him based on his performance.  Some of the chants of "pedophile" were over the top, IMO, but I know most folks are just reading headlines and don't know any details.

Ultimately, this will come down to whether or not Tech's Title IX office functions like it should or has taken on a Baylor style of coverup.  They've been draconian in the past when players have been accused, and thus far, they say their investigation has not found anything on this player.  Unless we see evidence that this office is acting like Baylor's coverup shop, and there is zero indication this is the case, I'll tend to believe them given the current information. 

 

Yep...all weekend I was trying to remember what recent student-athlete father the Steffe's father reminded me of.  Of course CJK5H came to mind, but it was Daddy Mayfield that had been eluding my memory banks.  

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'stache

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So the dad whose suing also likely got his own daughter drunk along with the players? And that undermines the rape allegation? The dad's shadiness makes it worse, not better. I mean, it's pretty established that a person cannot consent when intoxicated. The dad should be in a ton of trouble too. But I don't see how it makes it any less likely that the player had sex with a drunk 17 year old girl which is a crime in pretty much every US jurisdiction. Is it okay if legal in the Bahamas? 

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drunk?

He sexually assaulted a minor...

( stick with the headlines, it's more juicy that way)

Edited by slorch
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Js1

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I have the same issue with Isaacs as I do with Morris (and Terrence Shannon Jr)

You're a star basketball player. You have a body most dudes would kill for.  You should be drowning in college (and appropriated aged) pussy and you go for a 17 year old high schooler that you had to get drunk first?  That is your teammate's sister? 

What the fuck?

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Brian Fantana

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28 minutes ago, Js1 said:

I have the same issue with Isaacs as I do with Morris (and Terrence Shannon Jr)

You're a star basketball player. You have a body most dudes would kill for.  You should be drowning in college (and appropriated aged) pussy and you go for a 17 year old high schooler that you had to get drunk first?  That is your teammate's sister? 

What the fuck?

Yeah I mean 3 different situations there, but yeah it's hella stupid.

I shudder to think how I would have behaved as a 20 year old getting a dump truck of NIL money in my lap.

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Uncle Nate

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2 hours ago, Js1 said:

I have the same issue with Isaacs as I do with Morris (and Terrence Shannon Jr)

You're a star basketball player. You have a body most dudes would kill for.  You should be drowning in college (and appropriated aged) pussy and you go for a 17 year old high schooler that you had to get drunk first?  That is your teammate's sister? 

What the fuck?

What if she was the aggressor/instigator?  

You're 20, your a little buzzed, athletic blonde is flirting with you, she initiates the lovin.  Hell, do we even know that he knows she's 17?  She's a volleyball player who is like 6'0".  I don't know about you all, but I didn't check ID's when I was a sophomore in college.  The girl is a senior in high school and he's in a sophomore in college.  Not a whole lot of age difference there.

As long as she didn't ever say no, push back, tried to stop, tried to get away, implied at any second that she wasn't all in on the deal, then I can't fault the guy.  I would be a hypocrite if I did because at age 20 I promise I wasn't checking ID's on girls I met at parties who at least looked old enough.

And as far as being a teammate's sister, I knew plenty of girls in high school who would hook up with a player on the team that their brother was on.  

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Posted (edited)

That’s just it.

When it comes to Tech athletics, I’ve railed against the football program, our GOB network, Tommy Tuberville before  it was cool; and generally small minded bullshit that tends to permeate some decisions on the big picture.  That being said, nothing about the Isaacs thing sounds like anything most of us avoided during that same timeframe in our lives.

This smells so much like bullshit,it’s not even funny.  Title IX is involved. No criminal charges have been filed…. But a bunch of rival fans know better.

 

M’kay…

Edited by slorch
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Brian Fantana

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On 1/7/2024 at 10:47 AM, Brian Fantana said:

I won't yet go so far as to say Matt Steffe is just trying to squeeze a payday out of the university because he's pissed off that his son isn't good enough to play, but given what is known, I lean more in that direction than in the direction of Pop being a rapist. We'll see how it plays out.

Rumor mill today is that he demanded a 250k payment and was told to get bent, hence the lawsuit. Also, this is apparently not the first time they have met and Drew Steffe was ok with them talking/potentially dating. What a weird fucking unnecessary situation to get yourself in.

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