2024 Poker : GTO or GTFO

[blacklab 11887]

Headed back to TCH for the plo tournament, end up chopping when we got to 4, made $150. Cashed 4 of last 6 weeks. 
 

Sat down at hold em with bomb pots. First hand is a bomb pot and I scoop with boat/boat. Piss off over a hundred playing hold em and we get to another bomb pot. Boards are AQ7 and 885. I look at my hand and the first two cards are AA, don’t even look at the other two and pot it, get 5 callers. Turns come Q and 4, I pot, get repotted and 4 of us are all in. Rivers are bricks and I turn over my hand and announce ace high boat on top, don’t look at my other 2 cards, dealer announces he has Aces and queens boat on top, eights and fives boat on bottom. Oops. Didn’t matter, would not have played out any different. Another player had 85 so I only got 3/4. Two hands later I get called up to the bomb pot only table so once again hit and run the shit out of the hold em table. 
 

Get to the bomb pot table and first hand I get Ks6sTh5h. Flop has 2 spades on top and JT6 on bottom. Guy to my right had potted blind before the board was shown, I call his $40, folds around to crazy Asian I’ve known for a long time, he jams, saying I don’t have shit but it’s better than some random blind hand, guy to my right re-pots. I figure fuck it, I bought in with winnings from other table, call, Asian calls. Spade comes on top board, 8 on bottom, bricks on river. Asian has Qs9s, other guy has Q9. My K high flush wins the top, they chop the bottom. 8 doesn’t come I scoop. 

[Lurch 5921]

1/2 PLO
$5 open and one caller. I call in SB with
Ad Qh Jc 3d

BB makes it $20 and we all call. $80 pot

Kd Td 6s

Ever flop it so good you can TASTE it?!

Chk. BB makes it $25. One caller. I chk raise to $125. Only BB comes along. $365

4c wasn’t the card I was looking for, but figure I could push BB off his hand with a pot bet. Nope he shoves his last $100 over top. I call and he shows KKxx. Oops?

$1300 pot going to the river

Js completes my broadway nuts and BB storms off

That was a bit of a roller coaster

[AUS-97HORN 11731]

i just keep running so fucking stupid bad in big spots its just not funny.  Now, for the record over the last 4 sessions I am up something like $75 total... which pretty much means I lost since Ive had to play close to 15 hours in those sessions.   but I guess beggers cant be choosers.

 

1st big confrontation. playing a very loose table with lots of raises, i get 8c8x as SB, utg made it 10, MP made it 20, 1 caller, I have $650 behind and make it $110. 

all call.  flop is 9c7c6c.

I check, UTG bets $100, no one else calls, I jam for all 540 behind, hes got me covered.  hems haws for a while and finally calls with A9 no clubs. we agree to run it 3 times. 60% to win 1 time.... I brick all 6 fucking cards. 

2nd one, different night, lots of goof balls playing like shit, roll my $300 up to ~$850,  I am SB again,  live $10 straddle, gets raised to $35 by a wild asian kid, 3 fucking callers before I act, I look down at KdKc..... pause, make it $175 because I am out of position and several of these guys will call with a naked ace at that level, as they all are playing bigger than $600.  Asian kid (who has me covered) snap calls when its his turn, everyone else leaves. 

flop is 8c9c8x.   I bet out $250, he calls, turn is the 2c.  I jam for the rest.  He takes forever and finally calls with TcTx.  asks if we want to run it more than once, I decline.

so 95% to win over $1800... we all know what card hits the river, because I can literally never win the massive fucking pots. 

just now, bought in for $200 got it up to $530. 

button. with KdTh.   UTG has an absolutely massive stack been playing for 9 hours, easily $3k in front and just keeps leading with absolutely ass hands.  He leads out for $17, folds to me, I raise to $50.   He calls.

Flop is Td 7d 3d. He bets out $35, I raise to $75 he calls. turn is the Kh.  top 2. with the K flush draw.  He checks, i bet $75,  he takes foreve and jams and I snap call because hes got ass most of the time here.

this time hes got 24dd.  we run the last card twice... of course, this is the first time of the 3 where I am mathmatically behind, but hey 25% twice right... brick brick, good night. 

all 3 hands were $1k or more.  like I said several times I rebought in and net amount is slightly positive, but I absolutely cannot fucking win hands worth more than $1k, no matter how ahead or behind I am. 

Edited March 5 by AUS-97HORN

[Gatorubet 30165]

[Lurch 5921]

$1/2 PLO.  UTG straddles to $5, MP makes it $15, BTN calls, I call in SB w Ac Kh Jd 6c, BB calls and UTG quickly calls.  $75 pot

Ad 6h 6s.  Check to UTG who donks out $60.  MP folds (the only one likely to have AA) as does BTN.  I call, BB folds.  $195 pot

9c.  I check, UTG quickly pots it.  I have $525 behind and jam (he has me covered) ...

**this is where it gets interesting**

The dealer flips the All-In card at me.  As I'm pushing out my chips, I see the Call card get flipped to UTG.  I had my airpods in so I didnt hear what was said and was looking at my chips so I didnt see what (if anything) UTG did either.  Regardless, I did see the Call card get tossed out, and I showed the A6.  UTG fairly quickly claims he did not in fact call, I believe after he saw my A6.  Dealer (a good one) takes full responsibility and says it was his mistake throwing the call card out.  Dealer apologizes profusely and offers to call the floor, but I know they're going to say it wasn't a call and I shouldn't have shown my cards.  I yield and UTG folds his hand.  

It was already getting late and I knew I'd tilt if I kept playing so I racked up and left.

On the ride home I start to convince myself that he wasn't calling anyway.  Is there any hand you would play as UTG did that would pot then call my all in other than AAXX, A9XX or another A6XX?  Super slim chance K6XX does, but I'm holding a K to reduce those odds.

Do I NOT jam there?!  Is my best play on turn to just call and hope he fires a third barrel and hope he doesnt out boat me?

Edited March 8 by Lurch

[AUS-97HORN 11731]

For him to have to call just another $10  pre, Its not bonkers for UTG to have 9876 or some variation of that. maybe double suited? and once he saw your hand he knew he only had 2 outs and folded. 

 

Edited March 8 by AUS-97HORN

[Lurch 5921]

Yeah, good point. 96XX is certainly possible. He might have called my jam w that I suppose

[BillyGoatHill 4312]

Before seeing his response (Aus-97) I was thinking what could he have had and I came up with the same scenario, he had 96XX and maybe (?) changed his mind on his call once seeing your hand.

I don't ever play with earpods (don't even own any), but I do look at my phone sometimes while playing. Once heads up though (if not before), I make sure it is facedown on the rail or in my pocket just to be sure I don't miss anything similar to your scenario.

[Lurch 5921]

Booked July 3 - 10 in hopes of playing another Main Event.  Should allow me to take 2-3 shots at satellites.

Park MGM is dirt cheap that week if anyone is looking.  With comp days etc I'm paying like $200 for the whole week and get $150 in food comps to offset most of that.   

[Native Horn 3495]

Was in Vegas over the weekend.  Went to Circa to check out some NCAA games.  Played some 3 Card Poker for awhile.  Ante $15, $5 on Pair Plus bet, $5 on Six Card bet.  Dealer gives me Ace, Two Three suited diamonds.  She then flips her cards - Four, Five, Six of diamonds.  Boom - six card straight flush and paid out over $1,200 on that hand.  

I know it wasn't POKER poker, but still a nice hit.

[October sky 61]

Made my second live stream final table. I have played a total of 10 hands combined on both. Poker blows. 

[shadow_operative2.0 15881]

Supposedly Osterman & husband opened a room in New Braunfels. Anyone been? 

[Lurch 5921]

Made my second live stream final table. I have played a total of 10 hands combined on both. Poker blows. 

In the money, at least?

[BillyGoatHill 4312]

17 hours ago, shadow_operative2.0 said:

Supposedly Osterman & husband opened a room in New Braunfels. Anyone been? 

If you're referring to the Comal Card Haus, I'm pretty sure that room hasn't opened yet.

They have a page on FB and not showing an update as of now about any news of an opening. On Poker Atlas, while showing hrs (most days 4p-1a) they are looking for help/employees still.

[TonyTexas 10493]

Poker rooms have a hard enough time making it in major cities. No way one can work in New Braunfels with a population of 100K. 

[blacklab 11887]

In a small town all you need are 1-2 tables that run from noon to midnight and a table or two extra that run 7pm to midnight and you''ll have a nice little cash cow.

table 1 - runs 12 noon to midnight = 12 hours * average of 8 players at $10/hour = $960 

table 2 runs 7pm to midnight = 5 hours * 8 * $10/hr = $400

$1360/day * 30 days = $40k a month. Rent in a small town is probably less than $2k/month, figure $20k a month in salaries and you're looking at taking home $10k-$20k a month.

[shadow_operative2.0 15881]

And I don’t have the first damn clue who the husband is, but I’m willing to bet Cat’s name is pretty well-known in those parts. 

[October sky 61]

On 3/27/2024 at 8:39 AM, Lurch said:

In the money, at least?

Yeah it was the final table of the TCH 250k. First place was 56k and 9th was just over 5k. 

[Blotto 23462]

21 hours ago, shadow_operative2.0 said:

And I don’t have the first damn clue who the husband is, but I’m willing to bet Cat’s name is pretty well-known in those parts. 

Her twitter banner would indicate its this dude

[shadow_operative2.0 15881]

Wonder how many of her teammates from back then are realtors now? Know Megan was at one time too. 

[shadow_operative2.0 15881]

Cross-post, shoot me a PM if any of you care. Not my kid.

 

[Lurch 5921]

$2/5, $25 double board bomb pot.  All 8 play, so $200 pot to the flop

I have As7s on the BTN

Ks 5c 2d

Jh 4s 3d

Checks completely around

Ks 5c 2d 8s

Jh 4s 3d Ts

I go from complete air to 2 nut flush draws.

SB leads out $100 and is called by UTG.  Both have $1k and have my $600 covered.  Everyone else folds to me.

A) Fold

B) Call $100

C) Raise to $300

D) Jam $600

[blacklab 11887]

had a similar hand in the lodge's plo bomb pot tournament a few months ago. In addition to nut flush on both boards I also had top 2 pair on one board and a open ended strait draw on the other. Jammed on the turn, got rejammed on, called and both rivers paired the board, giving the other guy boat boat. 

In your situation I probably just call. You hit on 1 on the river you can jam and people with a set are going to have a hard time calling as a strait becomes a possibility with any card 9 or below on the top board and any card on the lower board.

 

any good poker in the orlando area? going to be there in a few weeks for a few days and will have some free time.

[TXSooner518 2432]

B for sure.

[bigup2dahorns 3343]

 
any good poker in the orlando area? going to be there in a few weeks for a few days and will have some free time.

You have two choices. One is called Orange City racing and card room. It’s maybe 45 mins from downtown and a decent card room with plenty of tables and action and usually a few PLO cash games going with lower and middle stakes. It shares space with horse betting room and some other card games. It’s in a strip mall and offers pretty much bare bones amenities of food and drink.

The other option is the Hard Rock casino which is in Tampa (east side closer to Orlando) and probably about an hour from the Disney area and 1 hour 20 mins from downtown Orlando. Very nice room with lots of action and all the amenities of decent food options inside the casino. The traffic can be awful at times so keep that in mind.

Both places are on the Bravo app

[Lurch 5921]

I went with B) Call, but I think A) Fold was proper in retrospect.

I’m paying $50 to win $225 on each board, so need to win 22% of the time for that to be +ev. Assuming I have 10 outs, that’s only 20%, and any hit on one board dilutes the other.

[TXSooner518 2432]

$50 to win $250 and also those river bets yo.

[Lurch 5921]

Oh, shit, yeah. Still, pretty questionable call imo. I can’t imagine getting much value on river

[TXSooner518 2432]

13 hours ago, Lurch said:

Oh, shit, yeah. Still, pretty questionable call imo. I can’t imagine getting much value on river

A dude led $100 into 7 people and another called $100 with 5 left to act on the turn, they are likely to have hands that will payoff. Also possible that they both have strong hands on the board you don't hit on, and all 3 players put stacks in on river, and you and whoever wins the other board chop the 3rd guy's money up. Also you are closing the action. I'd say much more reasonable fold if you are, say, UTG+1, and may be forced to call off stack on turn with no implied odds helping your equity. 

[Lurch 5921]

Good points. If someone had a set in the board I hit my flush on they might still pay in hopes that I was betting the river because of something that happened on the other board. Irony there is that if I hit BOTH boards I might not get any action at all!

[TXSooner518 2432]

True! Or one or both of them might also have a flush draw, likely with a pair or two pair or a straight draw, which could decrease our outs but guarantee full pay.

[blacklab 11887]

2 hours into plo tournament at TCH. $1-$2k blinds, I have $150k, 2 seat has $180k, everyone else less than $30k. 
I get 2c3c5s6c couple limpers, I limp, guy to my left makes it $14k, 2 callers including 2 seat, so I call. 
Flop is A45 rainbow with ace of clubs. I’m trying to figure out what to bet and it goes all in, all in, call. I repot and we’re all all in. Small stacks are AAxx and AkJT, no flush draws, big stack has Qc9c4s2s. Awesome, just need to avoid a board pair and runner runner clubs. Small stacks have 1 club each, I have 3, big stack 2 so only 5 left. 
and of course it comes KcJc. 
Fuck me. 

[TXSooner518 2432]

JFC LOL at big stack getting in multiway there with that hand. 

[TXSooner518 2432]

BTW, I'm using a Discord server to share tourney action, rather than Twitter now, thanks to Elon nerfing Circles. Anyone who wants an invite, holler. Playing one this Friday at The Lodge. LGLG

[BillyGoatHill 4312]

On 3/27/2024 at 10:06 AM, TonyTexas said:

Poker rooms have a hard enough time making it in major cities. No way one can work in New Braunfels with a population of 100K. 

Not sure you understand the appeal of not having to drive for an hr (or more) to play cards...when they eventually get all the red tape done and it gets to open, that room will most likely do well. 

The room in Flint (outside Tyler) was in business for 5 years before being shut down in March '22 by Smith County. They most likely were shut down due to a "promotional rake" the room was taking for high hands or bad-beat jackpots. None were charged with felonies, owners plea bargained down to $500 misdemeanor charges, but the room is still closed.

It's too bad cuz there needs to be a legal place to play in that part of the state. You have to drive to Dallas or worse, go to the shithole casinos in Shreveport.

Edited May 2 by BillyGoatHill

[Blotto 23462]

Anyone here play at Legends in Houston?

https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/29/news-views-gossip/dealer-has-been-accused-rigging-deck-legends-poker-room-houston-1837091/

[deech 2251]

15 hours ago, Blotto said:

Anyone here play at Legends in Houston?

https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/29/news-views-gossip/dealer-has-been-accused-rigging-deck-legends-poker-room-houston-1837091/

I did when they opened.  I clocked quite a few hours with some of their early promotions, but then I noticed a stink.   First, the owner of the place left California for a myriad of reasons including losing his gaming license.  Not a great start.  Then, when you play there it seemed pretty obvious there were multiple house players.  Several instances of what appeared to be pretty soft play with people they all seemed to know. They also repeatedly let tables get short so that they can have Poker Atlas show a large number of tables.  In other words, keep six tables of six players instead of breaking one or two of those tables.  Finally, the location is quite possibly one of the worst amongst Houston poker rooms from a security stand point and that was before the armed robbery attempts there.  

So yeah, decided after my hours ran that I was never going back and haven't regretted it since.  

Also, if you have a dealer like that in your game, he's throwing the good cards to a particular player so it should be easy to figure out who he is rigging the deck to benefit.  No follow up with the player and the house's prior issues makes me think it's a house player.

[blacklab 11887]

 

[MagicSoccerSpray 1732]

I've been very wary of Houston poker for a while. Many of the rooms rake, much of the management have questionable histories, and security and clientele are a problem at many of the clubs. I fear these clubs will ruin it for everyone. We're lucky in Austin relative to them.

[Bookman 4626]

I played a hand last night that has me thinking this morning. I'll try to keep this short. 

$1/$2 NLH home game while watching the fight. Villain is effective stack with $210. 9-handed.

This is a group I've played with for years, and I know the villain to be a LAG who likes to bluff, but he almost never overbets.

Anyway, UTG+1 open limps, I raise to $8 UTG+2 with two black Queens, and Villain in cutoff raises to $25. I call.

Flop is J-7-5 two diamonds (with J of diamonds). Check, Bet $45, Call.

Turn is 7, no backdoor draw. Check, Bet $60, Call.

River is J, no flush available. Check, Bet $80 (all-in), and I basically snap call. 

Villain turns over A-K offsuit, no diamond, and QQ is good.  

This was a pretty easy decision for me, given my opponent and our history. But is this a good call against a rock? Am I ever folding this hand to anyone? I need roughly 30% equity on the flop, 25% equity on the turn, and 20% equity on the river.

A harder decision would have been if he shoved the turn. It is extremely rare for this villain to make a pot-sized bet after the flop. 

I guess my question is, with 100 BB effective stacks, is QQ always calling? Do I partially fold QQ if I have a diamond?

[BillyGoatHill 4312]

On 5/4/2024 at 7:36 AM, MagicSoccerSpray said:

I've been very wary of Houston poker for a while. Many of the rooms rake, much of the management have questionable histories, and security and clientele are a problem at many of the clubs. I fear these clubs will ruin it for everyone. We're lucky in Austin relative to them.

Pretty sure this is what killed the room just outside of Tyler. They were doing it for a promotional/bad beat but most likely some of that or more was going to the owners. Just DUMB. 

There is a new room in SA (off 281 outside of Loop 1604) that is advertising the same thing. You're right these stupid tactics (greed) could cause added scrutiny for those that are at least following/skirting the gray areas of Texas law. 😡

[deech 2251]

On 5/4/2024 at 7:36 AM, MagicSoccerSpray said:

I've been very wary of Houston poker for a while. Many of the rooms rake, much of the management have questionable histories, and security and clientele are a problem at many of the clubs. I fear these clubs will ruin it for everyone. We're lucky in Austin relative to them.

You are not wrong IMHO.  About 2/3 of the rooms in town seem to rake nowadays.  As a result, I only play in rooms that do not rake (TCH - Spring and Spades - Webster primarily)  I think they all feel its ok following the Post Oak/Prime debacle of a raid by the DA's office, but I think that is dumb as fuck as a lawyer.  And I say that as someone more nitty who likely benefits from a rake format as opposed to an hourly fee.

[Bookman 4626]

1 hour ago, BillyGoatHill said:

There is a new room in SA (off 281 outside of Loop 1604) that is advertising the same thing. You're right these stupid tactics (greed) could cause added scrutiny for those that are at least following/skirting the gray areas of Texas law. 😡

The "gray area" is pretend. All of these rooms are illegal, as the statutes are currently written.

[Lurch 5921]

I played a hand last night that has me thinking this morning. I'll try to keep this short. 
$1/$2 NLH home game while watching the fight. Villain is effective stack with $210. 9-handed.
This is a group I've played with for years, and I know the villain to be a LAG who likes to bluff, but he almost never overbets.
Anyway, UTG+1 open limps, I raise to $8 UTG+2 with two black Queens, and Villain in cutoff raises to $25. I call.
Flop is J-7-5 two diamonds (with J of diamonds). Check, Bet $45, Call.
Turn is 7, no backdoor draw. Check, Bet $60, Call.
River is J, no flush available. Check, Bet $80 (all-in), and I basically snap call. 
Villain turns over A-K offsuit, no diamond, and QQ is good.  
This was a pretty easy decision for me, given my opponent and our history. But is this a good call against a rock? Am I ever folding this hand to anyone? I need roughly 30% equity on the flop, 25% equity on the turn, and 20% equity on the river.
A harder decision would have been if he shoved the turn. It is extremely rare for this villain to make a pot-sized bet after the flop. 
I guess my question is, with 100 BB effective stacks, is QQ always calling? Do I partially fold QQ if I have a diamond?

I can’t find a fold anywhere here

[TXSooner518 2432]

I can’t find a fold anywhere here

Def not against described opponent. There are definitely a lot of 1/2 guys who are just never ever firing river with worse. Nice fade!

[Bookman 4626]

9 hours ago, TXSooner518 said:

Def not against described opponent. There are definitely a lot of 1/2 guys who are just never ever firing river with worse. Nice fade!

Yeah it's just a bluff catcher. I've never had much success calling pre-flop 3-bets out of position with pocket queens. 

[deech 2251]

Need to bounce this hand off someone else and this is as good a place as any.  Double Board Bomb Pot $5 in a deep stacked $1-$1 game.  I have something like $1200 in front of me.

 

My hand - 3-5-6-j garbage

Board 1 - A-10-7 (heart flush draw)

Board 2 - 3-3-5 (rainbow)

First player to act who has legitimately played five hands in three hours pots it ($40 I believe).  I call.  Then we only get 4 other callers.   I believe pot was $280.

 

Board 1- A-10-7-K (heart and diamond flush draw)

Board 2 - 3-3-5-7

First player to act pots it at $280 again.  I think a bit and call.  Then three other players call.  

 

River

Board 1 - A-10-7-K-4 (no flushes get there)

Board 2 - 3-3-5-7-9

 

First player to act checks.  I check.  Guy to my immediate left who is a somewhat tight goes all in for about $700.  Guy to his left calls (has another $1500 or so behind - the deepest stack).  Next guy folds.  Guy who was first to act and potted it on flop and turn calls $700 and has $300 or so behind.  

What do you do?  Do you call $700 of your roughly $900 remaining here?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[AUS-97HORN 11731]

unless I am misreading it, you literally have zero on top, not even a pair.

on the bottom you have the lowest possible boat. 

yeah, you have the 5 blocker, and there is a 7 on the other board.  so both of those help vs 55 and 77 but that river 9 is the biggest worry.    

Because 998x  99Jx  especially if they have a flush draw would almost always call the $40 on the flop.  Even more so if they had 99A (ESPECIALLY if they had 99 with the nut heart draw). since you didnt mention which card on board 1 was the non-heart.

and that doesnt even get into someone having the other 3 with maybe an Ace and either a 7 or 9 with some combo hit for that top board like 78/ 89/ 7T/ J9 for their other cards to call the flop.  I believe there are 10 possible hand combinations that beat you on the bottom board and 2 more that tie you.

 

If you know 2 of the guys are literally idiots who will always call with JUST a 3, or a straight on that board, then maybe its worth calling.

 

However, playing double bomb pots where you have literally zero on 1 board and dont have close to the nuts on the other board, and you have had 3 other guys call flop/turn full pot bets and then get almost all of it in before you even act is a massive red flag.

yeah theres like a 25% chance you win the bottom (because its still fucking hard to make a boat), which means you risk $700 to win something like $2240 plus (the 2 card combo chance of you chopping the bottom board and calling $700 to "only" win $1120). 

Heads up thats probably a call. unless the guy is as super tight as you imply.

But going 4 ways to showdown here. I fold. Yeah, its called gambling, not playing, but I would have to think you have better spots down the road to win that $700 easier than here

 

 

[blacklab 11887]

I fold. Someone’s got a bigger boat. 

[blacklab 11887]

TCH typically has a plo double board bomb pot only game going. When I want to gamble it up I go play it. At most there will be one other white boy at the table, with Asians being the biggest group represented followed by Indians and African Americans.

I know the most money I've lost is when I hit a boat and someone gets a bigger one. I had 8432 on time, flop was 882 and I remember distinctly that I should fold when someone potted after the flop. I stupidly stuck around and a T and J came out and I lost to 8T.

The only way I might call with your hand is if I had at least 2 pair on the other board so it would be an emergency hand in case someone had a bigger boat.