2024 Presidential Election Thread - Let's keep the party going.

[Red Five 40274]

Meet the Press opening: "Biden's poll numbers reach an all-time low and he is now trailing Trump by five points." 

[David Dennison 17754]

4 minutes ago, Red Five said:

Meet the Press opening: "Biden's poll numbers reach an all-time low and he is now trailing Trump by five points." 

I'll start to worry if that's the case in September.

[atomheartbevo 88913]

Just now, David Dennison said:

I'll start to worry if that's the case in September.

Or they stop polling people by telephone.  

[South Austin 51564]

The polls are rigged!

[Nice Guy Eddie 13295]

When it comes to arguing with or setting the average Trump voter straight, it’s not difficult. You only need a few talking points and facts.  The economy is the best talking point, and when they counter with inflation, mention how wage growth is outpacing inflation. If they say their wages haven’t grown as much, well then that’s their problem.

it’s ok to agree that deciding between two 80 year olds is not anyone’s first choice. When they throw out Biden’s age, always counter that Trump is effectively the same age without Trumps age being your main point. “You’re right that Biden and Trump both misspeak but I’m more interested who performed better with 4 years of their presidency. With that it’s no comparison. But I will give Trump credit that he’s better with social media.”

[BehoId, The Underminer! 11511]

He’s the best president since FDR, so it should be very easy to say why he’s the right choice.  

[gmr548 16289]

1 hour ago, BehoId, The Underminer! said:

The entire Cold War?

Uh the US had over 40k killed and 100k missing in Korea and 58k killed in Vietnam (I can't find a quick number on the wounded figure). 

But aside from that sure.

Cynically you could also say current Ukraine policy is welfare for US defense contractors and that is probably true to the degree; I just think in this case the cynical and the right moves are not mutually exclusive.

[Surly Bevo 24464]

When it comes to arguing with or setting the average Trump voter straight, it’s not difficult. You only need a few talking points and facts.  The economy is the best talking point, and when they counter with inflation, mention how wage growth is outpacing inflation. If they say their wages haven’t grown as much, well then that’s their problem.
it’s ok to agree that deciding between two 80 year olds is not anyone’s first choice. When they throw out Biden’s age, always counter that Trump is effectively the same age without Trumps age being your main point. “You’re right that Biden and Trump both misspeak but I’m more interested who performed better with 4 years of their presidency. With that it’s no comparison. But I will give Trump credit that he’s better with social media.”

To this and all the other posts about arguing or trying to persuade a Trumper.

[Red Five 40274]

Ask them if they're comfortable being a member of a cult. "You are, purposefully, wanting to put the guy who attempted a coup back in office. As a convicted felon. If he hasn't lost your vote yet, you are a member of a cult."

[atomheartbevo 88913]

18 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

When it comes to arguing with or setting the average Trump voter straight, it’s not difficult. You only need a few talking points and facts.  The economy is the best talking point, and when they counter with inflation, mention how wage growth is outpacing inflation. If they say their wages haven’t grown as much, well then that’s their problem.

A fun one is to toss out something like “Look, you can like and vote for Trump, it’s your right, but I’m an American, raised on American values and raised to be anti-communist, and I could never vote for somebody like Trump who admires and praises communist countries and their leaders such as North Korea and China, or ex-communist countries run by dictators like Russia. The Constitution protects your right to admire politicians like Trump who praise communist dictators and countries, even if I and many other American patriots disagree with you.  You were obviously raised differently than I was, so let’s find some common ground that we can both agree on.”

Thats laying it on thick, and it’s really fun if directed at a parent or boomer, or both. If they want to protest, just say “look, it’s okay for you to vote for people who admire communists, nobody is arguing that, let’s move on to something else like the economy.”  

If it’s a parent, just say “I don’t know if you are trying to test me, but you raised me to oppose communism, and I just can’t vote for somebody like Trump who admires them. You did a very good job of installing patriotic values in me.”

If it’s a Vietnam vet, bring up Trump’s views on McCain, POWs, etc. and if it’s a parent, again, hit them with the “look, you raised me to respect Vietnam vets and to especially respect POWs and I could not bring myself to vote for a draft dodger like Trump who looks down upon them.  I will not throw away that respect for Vietnam veterans and POWs.”

[tokamak 6323]

43 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

When it comes to arguing with or setting the average Trump voter straight, it’s not difficult. You only need a few talking points and facts.  The economy is the best talking point, and when they counter with inflation, mention how wage growth is outpacing inflation. If they say their wages haven’t grown as much, well then that’s their problem.

it’s ok to agree that deciding between two 80 year olds is not anyone’s first choice. When they throw out Biden’s age, always counter that Trump is effectively the same age without Trumps age being your main point. “You’re right that Biden and Trump both misspeak but I’m more interested who performed better with 4 years of their presidency. With that it’s no comparison. But I will give Trump credit that he’s better with social media.”

I like pointing out that inflation in the US has been better than the UK and Eurozone. Is Biden the president of the EU as well?

[DaysOff 7682]

100k missing in Korea? Jesus Christ is that true?

[atomheartbevo 88913]

1 minute ago, DaysOff said:

100k missing in Korea? Jesus Christ is that true?

South Korean MIA’s, yes.

 American - under 7,500.

https://dpaa-mil.sites.crmforce.mil/dpaaFamWebKorean

[Doc Sam Beckett 5712]

35 minutes ago, gmr548 said:

Cynically you could also say current Ukraine policy is welfare for US defense contractors and that is probably true to the degree; I just think in this case the cynical and the right moves are not mutually exclusive.

Why hasn't the defense contractors industry come down hard on Donald and the house GOP members? 

[Js1 82949]

2 hours ago, Red Five said:

Meet the Press opening: "Biden's poll numbers reach an all-time low and he is now trailing Trump by five points." 

The media cherry picking polls??? No way

[Nice Guy Eddie 13295]

1 hour ago, Doc Sam Beckett said:

Why hasn't the defense contractors industry come down hard on Donald and the house GOP members? 

Silence can be deafening at times. And it doesn’t mean that they’re not telling House members to get the money flowing. It’s impossible to think that the defense industry doesn’t love it when major countries are fighting. 

[Js1 82949]

4 hours ago, Red Five said:

Meet the Press opening: "Biden's poll numbers reach an all-time low and he is now trailing Trump by five points." 

Just saw the poll. It was NBC, so of course MTP was pumping it. Trump 50/50 with young voters, 27% of the AA vote and 42% of the Hispanic vote

None of that is happening 

[berlinerbaer 663]

Lulz

 

[gmr548 16289]

5 hours ago, DaysOff said:

100k missing in Korea? Jesus Christ is that true?

I mistyped, meant to say 45k killed/missing and 100k wounded. My bad.

[BamaATL 16009]

1 hour ago, berlinerbaer said:

Lulz

 

I'd kind of even forgotten who Marianne Williams was and had to do a refresh on her last night.  I'd forgotten what a kook she is.  

[Js1 82949]

32 minutes ago, BamaATL said:

I'd kind of even forgotten who Marianne Williams was and had to do a refresh on her last night.  I'd forgotten what a kook she is.  

Dean Phillips’ vanity campaign of grift is just Gabbard level of narcissism. He could have probably ended up a successor for one of the MN senate seats or governor, but the threw it all away 

[Satchel 6901]

6 hours ago, Red Five said:

Ask them if they're comfortable being a member of a cult. "You are, purposefully, wanting to put the guy who attempted a coup back in office. As a convicted felon. If he hasn't lost your vote yet, you are a member of a cult."

Unless you’ve actually engaged a Trump cultist in an attempt to reason with them, you have no idea just how beyond redemption most of them are. It is one of the most befuddling experiences in my life.

[Voldemort86 2236]

On 2/4/2024 at 4:10 PM, Satchel said:

Unless you’ve actually engaged a Trump cultist in an attempt to reason with them, you have no idea just how beyond redemption most of them are. It is one of the most befuddling experiences in my life.

It resembles what a man in Germany did in the 1940’s.

[bolverk 29036]

I'm posting this here because there's no other thread for it, but I suspect that it could be included here under a subheading of "general shenanigans" that we'll experience in this campaign. I'm including links in case any of you DFW cats have knowledge of them.

 

Texas Company Was Behind Voter Robocalls That Impersonated Biden, N.H. Says
The state attorney general said the calls, which used a voice that sounded like President Biden’s to discourage voting, originated with a company called Life Corporation.

The New Hampshire attorney general said on Tuesday that his office, alongside federal officials and other state attorneys general, had identified the company behind robocalls last month that used an impersonation of President Biden’s voice to urge Democrats not to vote in the state’s primary.

The attorney general, John M. Formella, said that the calls had originated with Life Corporation, a Texas-based company owned by Walter Monk. Mr. Formella noted that the calls were routed through a provider called Lingo Telecom.

“We will not tolerate any action that seeks to undermine the integrity of our elections and our democratic process,” Mr. Formella said in a news conference. “The message to any person or company who would attempt to engage in these activities is clear and it’s simple: Don’t try it.”

Mr. Monk, Life Corporation and Lingo Telecom did not immediately respond to requests for comment.

According to a New York Times review of legal and campaign finance records, a subsidiary of Life Corporation called Voice Broadcasting Corp., which identifies Mr. Monk as its founder on its website, has received numerous payments from the Republican Party’s state committee in Delaware, most recently in 2022, as well as payments from congressional candidates in both parties.

Mr. Formella’s office has opened a criminal investigation, sent Life Corporation a cease-and-desist letter, and sent both Life Corporation and Lingo Telecom subpoenas and notices to preserve documents, he said. The letter, a copy of which his office provided to The New York Times, accuses Life Corporation of violating a New Hampshire law that prohibits efforts to “prevent or deter” someone from voting.

The robocalls told New Hampshire residents — using a voice that was most likely generated by artificial intelligence to sound like Mr. Biden’s — that they should not participate in the state’s primary on Jan. 23 because “your vote makes a difference in November, not this Tuesday.” Voting in a primary does not prevent anyone from casting a ballot in the general election.

The caller ID was falsified to make it look as if the calls came from Kathleen Sullivan, a former chairwoman of the New Hampshire Democratic Party, who filed a complaint with the state’s attorney general.

Mr. Formella, in the news conference, also said that the Federal Communications Commission had issued a cease-and-desist letter to Lingo Telecom, which an F.C.C. spokesman confirmed, and that the Anti-Robocall Multistate Litigation Task Force, a coalition of state attorneys general, had sent a warning letter and was “taking other steps” for potential civil litigation.

He said he wanted to “assure the public that we take this seriously and that this is one of our most important priorities,” and to “send a strong message of deterrence to any person or entity who would attempt to undermine our elections through A.I. or other means.”

A phone number listed for Life Corporation went directly to voice mail on Tuesday, and a message left there was not immediately returned. Mr. Monk did not immediately respond to attempts to reach him through email and a phone call. A message left at a number listed for Lingo Telecom also was not immediately returned, and neither was an email to the company’s main informational address.

Julie Chávez Rodríguez, Mr. Biden’s campaign manager, said the campaign was grateful for the New Hampshire attorney general’s actions. “Disinformation aimed at suppressing voting and deliberately undermining free and fair elections is an unacceptable threat,” she said.

Some disinformation experts worry that the robocalls in New Hampshire were an early example of a tactic that will become more common with the rise of artificial intelligence, which makes it increasingly easy to create fake audio or videos that convincingly imitate public figures.

Just last week, the F.C.C. chairwoman, Jessica Rosenworcel, proposed that the agency formally designate A.I.-generated voices as “artificial” under the Telephone Consumer Protection Act, which would make it illegal to use them in robocalls.

[Satchel 6901]

26 minutes ago, longhornmatt said:

Yeah, all those examples of arguments posted up thread, while amusing, leave off the actual ending where they just get mad and (a) deny the reality of everything you’ve just said and cite some batshit crazy lies from Tucker or Dinesh D’Sousa as the real facts, and/or (b) accuse Democrats of being pedophile child murderers so nothing else you say matters anyway even if you’re right (which you still aren’t, because Tucker or that crazy guy they saw on YouTube that one time is actually right).

Or when overwhelmed with indisputable facts, they’ll just say, “I don’t believe that.”

[Hookah Horns 2923]

On 2/4/2024 at 10:30 AM, Doc Sam Beckett said:

Why hasn't the defense contractors industry come down hard on Donald and the house GOP members? 

What do you mean? By doing what? 

[BamaATL 16009]

43 minutes ago, longhornmatt said:

Yeah, all those examples of arguments posted up thread, while amusing, leave off the actual ending where they just get mad and (a) deny the reality of everything you’ve just said and cite some batshit crazy lies from Tucker or Dinesh D’Sousa as the real facts, and/or (b) accuse Democrats of being pedophile child murderers so nothing else you say matters anyway even if you’re right (which you still aren’t, because Tucker or that crazy guy they saw on YouTube that one time is actually right).

The best part would be if they decide not to vote Republican but instead just write in Trump and leave the rest of the ballot blank.  I guy can hope, right? 

[atomheartbevo 88913]

29 minutes ago, Satchel said:

Or when overwhelmed with indisputable facts, they’ll just say, “I don’t believe that.”

Or “I haven’t looked into it/researched it yet, so I’m not going to discuss it.”

[Doc Sam Beckett 5712]

27 minutes ago, Hookah Horns said:

What do you mean? By doing what? 

I would expect their lobbyists to be pretty active right now. I don't know shit about fuck, but this feels like if all drugs were completely legal in some country and the GOP was preventing big pharma from exploiting it

[Hookah Horns 2923]

8 minutes ago, Doc Sam Beckett said:

I would expect their lobbyists to be pretty active right now. I don't know shit about fuck, but this feels like if all drugs were completely legal in some country and the GOP was preventing big pharma from exploiting it

I don't think we'd hear about their lobbying measures but I also sort of doubt our arms industry is all that worried about demand. Whatever doesn't end up going to Israine will just be stockpiled here. 

[Doc Sam Beckett 5712]

3 minutes ago, Hookah Horns said:

I don't think we'd hear about their lobbying measures but I also sort of doubt our arms industry is all that worried about demand. Whatever doesn't end up going to Israine will just be stockpiled here. 

That's fair, but this is a hell of an opportunity for the defense industry. I would expect to hear about their lobbying measures through the actions of congress. 

[BamaATL 16009]

Just checking in on the Nevada Primary tonight (means nothing, caucuses decide electors, so fairly pointless)

Republican Options are:

1.  Haley

2.  Pence

3.  Scott

4.  None of the above.  

Um, well ok.  

[Satchel 6901]

2 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

Or “I haven’t looked into it/researched it yet, so I’m not going to discuss it.”

I had a frat brother in Tulsa tell me recently his wife was making him get from the phone. True story.

[Biff Tannen 45013]

4 hours ago, Satchel said:

Or when overwhelmed with indisputable facts, they’ll just say, “I don’t believe that.”

This. This is why it’s impossible. I had a friend the other day tell me the radical left wants fully open borders. I told him the people on the left I know talk about work permits, hiring more judges, and a path to citizenship. 
 

His response: That’s not true. 

[BamaATL 16009]

8 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

This. This is why it’s impossible. I had a friend the other day tell me the radical left wants fully open borders. I told him the people on the left I know talk about work permits, hiring more judges, and a path to citizenship. 
 

His response: That’s not true. 

It's insane, I could walk around with blue letter D on my chest and tout these points and these people would literally look at me and tell me that isn't what I want (which is pretty much right on the nose for me, by the way).  Attempting to have a conversation with these folks, let alone debate, is like attempting to have a meaningful conversation with your dog or cat about algebra.  

[atomheartbevo 88913]

7 minutes ago, BamaATL said:

It's insane, I could walk around with blue letter D on my chest and tout these points and these people would literally look at me and tell me that isn't what I want (which is pretty much right on the nose for me, by the way).  Attempting to have a conversation with these folks, let alone debate, is like attempting to have a meaningful conversation with your dog or cat about algebra.  

They believe that antifa was behind J6 and therefore antifa wanted to overturn the election and put Trump in power.

[Voldemort86 2236]

I wish there was something we could do about this Scott presler guy.  I’m not a fan.

[Make em eat Taco Bell 1548]

On 2/4/2024 at 3:32 PM, BamaATL said:

I'd kind of even forgotten who Marianne Williams was and had to do a refresh on her last night.  I'd forgotten what a kook she is.  

from Houston

[SydneyCarton 47298]

7 hours ago, Satchel said:

I had a frat brother in Tulsa tell me recently his wife was making him get from the phone. True story.

Get what from the phone, exactly?

[South Austin 51564]

49 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

Get what from the phone, exactly?

Sex.

[YGIFS 19445]

Like a 1-900 party line, or?  Asking for a hot single friend In your area. 

[Old Freak Nasty 697]

On 2/4/2024 at 4:10 PM, Satchel said:

Unless you’ve actually engaged a Trump cultist in an attempt to reason with them, you have no idea just how beyond redemption most of them are. It is one of the most befuddling experiences in my life.

The reason I still do it is not for the person I'm speaking to necessarily, but the other people around that may be listening in silence to the conversation.  I'm desensitized enough to their drone like responses and stupidity so I'm able to keep an even keel emotionally (something I struggled with in the past) so I hope in some way I can influence someone who's around.

I will never have a one on one conversation with a Trump voter again.  That's futile and infuriating.

Edited February 7 by Old Freak Nasty

[tx 3 putt 75234]

Florida Democrats don’t know why Taylor Swift is naming an upcoming song on her new album “Florida!!!” or the reason she chose to hold three concerts in Miami less than a month before the November elections.

But their excitement around the news is less about “why?” and more about leveraging Swift’s celebrity status to fill the blank space for beleaguered voters tired of losing to Republicans.
 

[Js1 82949]

MU Law followed up Fox News’ Wisconsin poll showing it 49-49. February 2020, the MU Law poll in Wisconsin was 46-46

That looks a lot more like 2020 and not some weird Trump +3-5 environment the national polls / the media are trying to tell us

[cactusflinthead 26989]

 

[Biff Tannen 45013]

20 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

They believe that antifa was behind J6 and therefore antifa wanted to overturn the election and put Trump in power.

Not all of them do though.  The person who told me he didn't believe Dems wanted some form of immigration control voted for Hillary and Biden.  He desperately wants to vote for an R not named Trump.  But he blames Dems for everything.  It's wild.

[Mrs Whiggins 13049]

My kids are Gen Z. Trump is not ever going to be in their wheelhouse.

Ever.

They think he's a joke.

[Neonmoon 38126]

Taylor swift ain’t turning Florida blue. The Cubans are MAGA as fuck 

[YGIFS 19445]

9 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

Taylor swift ain’t turning Florida blue. The Cubans are MAGA as fuck 

True, but Cubans don't have large families in Florida.  We forget that Florida voted Blue just as recently as 2008 & 2012.  And even 2016 was within just 1%.  I don't know that Taylor can make that big a difference but this new notion is just this forgone conclusion is weird to me.  Yes DeSantis have a markedly puzzling victory margin of note in 2022 and 2020 federal elections weren't competitive.  But it's because old people vote and Florida prides itself now on being even more stupid than ever.  I wouldn't count on it in 2024 for Biden, but I think it swings back to being uber-competitive  after that.  What neither party understands is the whole key to Florida in federal elections (Senate & POTUS in particular) is the Tampa/Clearwater/Saint Pete metroplex.  Every single Floridian political jockey I know fights tooth and nail for that area but the state party and national party just ignore it for some reason.  Every other spot is pretty much locked in their position (Jacksonville, Panhandle, Miami-FTL-Palm Beach, Fort Myers-Naples, Orlando-CenFla, et. al.).  Anyway, here's to hoping the DNC doesn't piss too much away in 2024 and focuses on other states 'cause I don't think it's that competitive right now but it will be again soon as it was for decades prior.  We just forget our history.    

[Mrs Whiggins 13049]

1 minute ago, Neonmoon said:

Taylor swift ain’t turning Florida blue. The Cubans are MAGA as fuck 

They aren't the only ones. We attended a relative's funeral in south Florida and during the eulogy were "treated" with an unexpected political treatise by a non family member that covered all the talking points and then some. My spouse was fuming but kept his silence. I was rather stunned at why anyone would interject MAGA and politics into a remembrance of a life that was lived with a focus that was outside of the political realm. But Florida be like that I guess.