2024 Presidential Election Thread - Let's keep the party going.

[Bateshorn 9859]

47 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

 

When people get their shit together and realize that nuclear power plants are fucking awesome and can solve a lot of fucking problems we have for energy, we'll be way better off. If that ever happens, who the fuck knows. 

[Ted Lange 15978]

"I can't believe that the race is this close and that people would vote for Donald Trump!"

[Biff Tannen 45457]

1 hour ago, Dahobbs said:

For the most part, we actually can. And that is what is actually happening. 80% of new generation last year and this year will be renewable. What we can't do is shut off all the gas plants overnight (or even in 15 years). They are still needed, but at a much smaller percentage of the overall grid. 

What’s going to be wild is when we are at like 75% renewable generation and battery storage and people are still screaming that it can’t be done and we are going to have to bring back coal or some shit. Reality matters not to these people. 

[Red Five 40590]

That is incredibly depressing. 

 

[SydneyCarton 47809]

16 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

I had dinner over the weekend with my previously referenced "source close to the campaign," and a few nuggets are worth sharing here:

Arizona: They're very confident about Arizona.  I mean, they're so confident about Arizona that I was somewhat shocked.  I mean, I feel good about Arizona.  But what I heard was "we're going to win Arizona by 1-2 points."

Georgia: They're maybe a little less confident about Georgia.  But that was couched in terms of "we really like where we stand right now."  

Michigan: We're fine.

Nevada: They're unequivocal on Nevada: "we're going to win Nevada by 2-2.5 points."

North Carolina: This one is really harder to tell, because they don't have any information from after the whole Mark Robinson flame-out.  It's pretty clear to them that the likes of Kari Lake and Mark Robinson are a bit of a drag on Trump.  And they're really trying to target people who have decided they're not going to vote for Lake/Robinson but who are still planning to vote for Trump.  Who are those people?  I don't exactly know, but it's obviously a focus of the Harris campaign's data people.

Texas: I think the term "extreme skepticism" is the only way to describe their feelings with respect to Texas.  My friend conceded that there are some numbers that look good-ish for Allred.  But damn--we've all been through this drill before.  There's just an extreme unwillingness to divert resources at any level to Texas, no matter what any poll is currently saying.

Pennsylvania: I take this one out of alphabetical order because that's where the game is.  My friend gamely tried to obfuscate on the point, but quickly conceded that Pennsylvania is the tipping-point state.  And they're feeling ok about Pennsylvania, but they have a big problem with Black men.  How big a problem I can't exactly say.  But it's causing some serious concern.  

I asked about whence the problem derives, and he said two things: 1) Kamala's perceived record as a prosecutor (and alleged prosecutions of small-time marijuana offenses) and 2) misogyny (and particularly as against a Black woman).  On the upside, the campaign has identified the issue and is doing a whole lot to address it.  That State Commonwealth is being absolutely blanketed with campaign surrogates talking directly to that community to shore up those numbers.

And I'm going to observe here--and this was my observation, and not my friend's (though it was an observation with which he agreed)--that this is where the Harris campaign's superiority in resources shows.  They have something like twice as many field offices as the Trump campaign and RNC have.  We spent a good deal of time just laughing at how Lara Trump is siphoning off money from the RNC and killing their organizing and down-ballot support.  So the Trump campaign isn't really able to go out and play offense and try to exploit the problems Harris is having with that (or any other) demographic.  So from that standpoint, it's kind of the opposite of 2016.

The harris campaign having a problem with black men as opposed to white men in PA wasn't on my immediate bingo card...

[Doc Sam Beckett 5781]

16 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

I had dinner over the weekend with my previously referenced "source close to the campaign," and a few nuggets are worth sharing here:

Arizona: They're very confident about Arizona.  I mean, they're so confident about Arizona that I was somewhat shocked.  I mean, I feel good about Arizona.  But what I heard was "we're going to win Arizona by 1-2 points."

Georgia: They're maybe a little less confident about Georgia.  But that was couched in terms of "we really like where we stand right now."  

Michigan: We're fine.

Nevada: They're unequivocal on Nevada: "we're going to win Nevada by 2-2.5 points."

North Carolina: This one is really harder to tell, because they don't have any information from after the whole Mark Robinson flame-out.  It's pretty clear to them that the likes of Kari Lake and Mark Robinson are a bit of a drag on Trump.  And they're really trying to target people who have decided they're not going to vote for Lake/Robinson but who are still planning to vote for Trump.  Who are those people?  I don't exactly know, but it's obviously a focus of the Harris campaign's data people.

Texas: I think the term "extreme skepticism" is the only way to describe their feelings with respect to Texas.  My friend conceded that there are some numbers that look good-ish for Allred.  But damn--we've all been through this drill before.  There's just an extreme unwillingness to divert resources at any level to Texas, no matter what any poll is currently saying.

Pennsylvania: I take this one out of alphabetical order because that's where the game is.  My friend gamely tried to obfuscate on the point, but quickly conceded that Pennsylvania is the tipping-point state.  And they're feeling ok about Pennsylvania, but they have a big problem with Black men.  How big a problem I can't exactly say.  But it's causing some serious concern.  

I asked about whence the problem derives, and he said two things: 1) Kamala's perceived record as a prosecutor (and alleged prosecutions of small-time marijuana offenses) and 2) misogyny (and particularly as against a Black woman).  On the upside, the campaign has identified the issue and is doing a whole lot to address it.  That State Commonwealth is being absolutely blanketed with campaign surrogates talking directly to that community to shore up those numbers.

And I'm going to observe here--and this was my observation, and not my friend's (though it was an observation with which he agreed)--that this is where the Harris campaign's superiority in resources shows.  They have something like twice as many field offices as the Trump campaign and RNC have.  We spent a good deal of time just laughing at how Lara Trump is siphoning off money from the RNC and killing their organizing and down-ballot support.  So the Trump campaign isn't really able to go out and play offense and try to exploit the problems Harris is having with that (or any other) demographic.  So from that standpoint, it's kind of the opposite of 2016.

No Florida talk? 

[Foosters 17688]

not in polite company, no.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13389]

18 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

 

Texas: I think the term "extreme skepticism" is the only way to describe their feelings with respect to Texas.  My friend conceded that there are some numbers that look good-ish for Allred.  But damn--we've all been through this drill before.  There's just an extreme unwillingness to divert resources at any level to Texas, no matter what any poll is currently saying.

There just isn't enough votes in the urban centers to win. National Dems just can't get any messaging to stick in the rural areas and the extreme red suburban (think Montgomery County) counties. And there is effectively no state Dems at least in the eyes of these voters.

The only way to win is to find the potential moderates in this areas to convince them to not vote GOP. If someone can solve that problem, they can earn a pretty penny from the DNC.

[Ghost of LL 15345]

4 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

The harris campaign having a problem with black men as opposed to white men in PA wasn't on my immediate bingo card...

Well, it's all relative, right?  I mean, if Harris is getting 40% among white men in Pennsylvania--which may well be pretty close to where she is--then she's doing pretty phenomenally.  But if she's getting anything less than 85% among Black men, then that's pretty lousy.

I didn't get into specific numbers with my friend.  But I don't suspect the "problem" with Black men in Pennsylvania means that she is behind among that demographic (or even close to it).  It's just that her margin isn't nearly as high as it needs to be to make up for her weakness among other demographics (e.g., white men).

[Ghost of LL 15345]

9 minutes ago, Doc Sam Beckett said:

No Florida talk? 

I guess the lack of talk is kind of telling, isn't it?

[SydneyCarton 47809]

2 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

Well, it's all relative, right?  I mean, if Harris is getting 40% among white men in Pennsylvania--which may well be pretty close to where she is--then she's doing pretty phenomenally.  But if she's getting anything less than 85% among Black men, then that's pretty lousy.

I didn't get into specific numbers with my friend.  But I don't suspect the "problem" with Black men in Pennsylvania means that she is behind among that demographic (or even close to it).  It's just that her margin isn't nearly as high as it needs to be to make up for her weakness among other demographics (e.g., white men).

Fucking PA. 

[The Original Greaser Bob 2781]

1 hour ago, SydneyCarton said:

 

When people get their shit together and realize that nuclear power plants are fucking awesome and can solve a lot of fucking problems we have for energy, we'll be way better off. If that ever happens, who the fuck knows. 

Wish Harris and Walz were in this camp.  They'd lock down victory if they pronounced it "nucular".

[Biff Tannen 45457]

26 minutes ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

This commercial is fucking gold.
 

 

 

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20341]

I have a hard time believing Pennsylvania is in play when Dems have won seven out of the last eight elections. Nobody who voted for Biden last time is going to vote for Trump this time.
 

2 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

Sam's use of the word "fucking"  was what seals the deal.

Edited September 23 by Horn Under a Bad Sign

[SydneyCarton 47809]

1 minute ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

I have a hard time believing Pennsylvania is in play when Dems have won eight elections in a row --- all the way back to 1988.  Nobody who voted for Biden last time is going to vote for Trump this time.

 

They just need less people to show up and vote for Harris that voted for Biden. 

[Js1 85039]

2 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

I guess the lack of talk is kind of telling, isn't it?

Wisconsin or  didn't bring it up?  MI, WI, AZ, NV + one of PA/GA/NC wins the elections for her. 

[Biff Tannen 45457]

18 minutes ago, Ted Lange said:

"I can't believe that the race is this close and that people would vote for Donald Trump!"

I’m choosing to not believe this because of this is true, we should just self nuke right now. There is no reason to keep it going. We will be dead within two decades anyway. 

[Chuckie Finster 22581]

30 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

Pennsylvania: I take this one out of alphabetical order because that's where the game is.  My friend gamely tried to obfuscate on the point, but quickly conceded that Pennsylvania is the tipping-point state.  And they're feeling ok about Pennsylvania, but they have a big problem with Black men.  How big a problem I can't exactly say.  But it's causing some serious concern.  

I asked about whence the problem derives, and he said two things: 1) Kamala's perceived record as a prosecutor (and alleged prosecutions of small-time marijuana offenses) and 2) misogyny (and particularly as against a Black woman).  On the upside, the campaign has identified the issue and is doing a whole lot to address it.  That State Commonwealth is being absolutely blanketed with campaign surrogates talking directly to that community to shore up those numbers.

And I'm going to observe here--and this was my observation, and not my friend's (though it was an observation with which he agreed)--that this is where the Harris campaign's superiority in resources shows.  They have something like twice as many field offices as the Trump campaign and RNC have.  We spent a good deal of time just laughing at how Lara Trump is siphoning off money from the RNC and killing their organizing and down-ballot support.  So the Trump campaign isn't really able to go out and play offense and try to exploit the problems Harris is having with that (or any other) demographic.  So from that standpoint, it's kind of the opposite of 2016.

They're gonna be able to create entire college curriculums studying the VP selection process if Kamala loses Pennsylvania.

[Horn Dog 9609]

57 minutes ago, Tuco said:

Nuke builds on a much slower pace than data centers. It’s faster when there is an existing site and license, but getting 3 Mile Island Unit 1 (not unit 2) back up by 2028 seems optimistic to me.

The answer is obvious.  Deregulate nukes!  Besides I am pretty sure that any laws regulating nuc power is unconstitutional since there were no nuc regulations in place in 1776.

[tx 3 putt 76050]

biden is the second best o/g president ever ….

 

[Huckleberry 32679]

1 hour ago, Js1 said:

State senator from Omaha - fuck you, no

 

 

Maine needs to change theirs as soon as possible because this won't be the last time they try this shit. 

[Aqua Buddha 14483]

36 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

I had dinner over the weekend with my previously referenced "source close to the campaign," and a few nuggets are worth sharing here:

Arizona: They're very confident about Arizona.  I mean, they're so confident about Arizona that I was somewhat shocked.  I mean, I feel good about Arizona.  But what I heard was "we're going to win Arizona by 1-2 points."

Georgia: They're maybe a little less confident about Georgia.  But that was couched in terms of "we really like where we stand right now."  

Michigan: We're fine.

Nevada: They're unequivocal on Nevada: "we're going to win Nevada by 2-2.5 points."

North Carolina: This one is really harder to tell, because they don't have any information from after the whole Mark Robinson flame-out.  It's pretty clear to them that the likes of Kari Lake and Mark Robinson are a bit of a drag on Trump.  And they're really trying to target people who have decided they're not going to vote for Lake/Robinson but who are still planning to vote for Trump.  Who are those people?  I don't exactly know, but it's obviously a focus of the Harris campaign's data people.

Texas: I think the term "extreme skepticism" is the only way to describe their feelings with respect to Texas.  My friend conceded that there are some numbers that look good-ish for Allred.  But damn--we've all been through this drill before.  There's just an extreme unwillingness to divert resources at any level to Texas, no matter what any poll is currently saying.

Pennsylvania: I take this one out of alphabetical order because that's where the game is.  My friend gamely tried to obfuscate on the point, but quickly conceded that Pennsylvania is the tipping-point state.  And they're feeling ok about Pennsylvania, but they have a big problem with Black men.  How big a problem I can't exactly say.  But it's causing some serious concern.  

I asked about whence the problem derives, and he said two things: 1) Kamala's perceived record as a prosecutor (and alleged prosecutions of small-time marijuana offenses) and 2) misogyny (and particularly as against a Black woman).  On the upside, the campaign has identified the issue and is doing a whole lot to address it.  That State Commonwealth is being absolutely blanketed with campaign surrogates talking directly to that community to shore up those numbers.

And I'm going to observe here--and this was my observation, and not my friend's (though it was an observation with which he agreed)--that this is where the Harris campaign's superiority in resources shows.  They have something like twice as many field offices as the Trump campaign and RNC have.  We spent a good deal of time just laughing at how Lara Trump is siphoning off money from the RNC and killing their organizing and down-ballot support.  So the Trump campaign isn't really able to go out and play offense and try to exploit the problems Harris is having with that (or any other) demographic.  So from that standpoint, it's kind of the opposite of 2016.

On Arizona, FWIW, we jus spent a week in Scottsdale/Sedona and Dem ads and signs outnumbered R's at least 5 to 1.  Harris and Gallego were everywhere with some very well done ads.  Very little Trump/Lake presence.  

I still think she wins PA but if she wins everything else on that list, she can lose PA and NC and still win, assuming she wins GA.

[Js1 85039]

4 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

Maine needs to change theirs as soon as possible because this won't be the last time they try this shit. 

They def need to pass a trigger law that says if Nebraska goes to winner-take-all, then Maine automatically goes to winner-take-all, regardless of timing. 

[Satchel 6908]

50 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

This man is a GOP hero for standing up to Trump and those who want to put their fingers on the scale to help Trump secure a victory. I agree that it's Nebraska's choice to make but not in the weeks leading up to the election.

I imagine the death threats are already being made to his office.

He is certain to become the next mayor of Omaha. Dems will see to it.

[BehoId, The Underminer! 11667]

2 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

On Arizona, FWIW, we jus spent a week in Scottsdale/Sedona and Dem ads and signs outnumbered R's at least 5 to 1.  Harris and Gallego were everywhere with some very well done ads.  Very little Trump/Lake presence.  

I still think she wins PA but if she wins everything else on that list, she can lose PA and NC and still win, assuming she wins GA.

I just looked at AZ 2020 and they have a crazy right wing county up near Las Vegas that completely undoes-and-then-some the Maricopa county D advantage.  So it ends up being Tucson/Pima versus the rest of the state.

[Satchel 6908]

25 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

There just isn't enough votes in the urban centers to win. National Dems just can't get any messaging to stick in the rural areas and the extreme red suburban (think Montgomery County) counties. And there is effectively no state Dems at least in the eyes of these voters.

The only way to win is to find the potential moderates in this areas to convince them to not vote GOP. If someone can solve that problem, they can earn a pretty penny from the DNC.

60% of us live in just 6 counties. If turnout is good, we can win.

[Js1 85039]

2 minutes ago, BehoId, The Underminer! said:

I just looked at AZ 2020 and they have a crazy right wing county up near Las Vegas that completely undoes-and-then-some the Maricopa county D advantage.  So it ends up being Tucson/Pima versus the rest of the state.

If you are talking about Mohave, 102k people voted there in 2020. 2.1 million people voted in Maricopa and 600k in Pima in 2020. 

The combined vote in the non-Maricopa/Pima counties was like 550-600k total votes between Biden/Trump.  Pima equals the state - Maricopa by itself. 

[Aqua Buddha 14483]

5 minutes ago, BehoId, The Underminer! said:

I just looked at AZ 2020 and they have a crazy right wing county up near Las Vegas that completely undoes-and-then-some the Maricopa county D advantage.  So it ends up being Tucson/Pima versus the rest of the state.

You're right.  I thought Phoenix had a bigger total vote advantage.  They had 2M votes in 2020 with a population of almost 5M.  Jeez.

I do know they've had a ton of move ins since 2020 with most of them being somewhat left leaning so there's that.

[chainsaw 9828]

1 minute ago, Js1 said:

If you are talking about Mohave, 102k people voted there in 2020. 2.1 million people voted in Maricopa and 600k in Pima in 2020. 

The combined vote in the non-Maricopa/Pima counties was like 550-600k total votes between Biden/Trump.  Pima equals the state - Maricopa by itself. 

I like the strategy of trying to pick off a few Mormon votes here and a couple Evangelical votes there. It could be the difference.

[chainsaw 9828]

2 minutes ago, Js1 said:

If you are talking about Mohave, 102k people voted there in 2020. 2.1 million people voted in Maricopa and 600k in Pima in 2020. 

The combined vote in the non-Maricopa/Pima counties was like 550-600k total votes between Biden/Trump.  Pima equals the state - Maricopa by itself. 

I think their point is that Maricopa is 2.1M with a total margin of 45k good guys, but MAGAland is 100k with a margin of 50k for the bad guys. That's why running up the score in Pima matters

[Js1 85039]

3 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

You're right.  I thought Phoenix had a bigger total vote advantage.  They had 2M votes in 2020 with a population of almost 5M.  Jeez.

I do know they've had a ton of move ins since 2020 with most of them being somewhat left leaning so there's that.

Arizona typically has good turnout - 80% in 2020 and has been 74-77% every presidential elections since 2004. 

 

1 minute ago, chainsaw said:

I think their point is that Maricopa is 2.1M with a total margin of 45k good guys, but MAGAland is 100k with a margin of 50k for the bad guys. That's why running up the score in Pima matters

Maricopa is also getting bluer.  Biden flipped it in 2020, Hobbs won it by 37k (and still won) and Mark Kelly won it by 100k votes.

[locodos 5328]

55 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Fuck Silicone Valley, fuck AI, fuck tech bros. 

I hope everything they are "building" for profit right now fails spectacularly. 

Assuming we can end the Trump era, the next focus needs to be bringing down these AI assholes. 

 

It's worse than you think, I think? Yeah probably.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cwyl171lyewo

Spoiler

Do you look at the possibility of political turbulence ahead of November’s US presidential election and think: democracy could be in trouble? So does a group of tech entrepreneurs backed by big Silicon Valley money. And they love it.

Imagine if you could choose your citizenship the same way you choose your gym membership. That’s a vision of the not-too-distant future put forward by Balaji Srinivasan. Balaji – who, like Madonna, is mostly just known by his first name – is a rockstar in the world of crypto. A serial tech entrepreneur and venture capitalist who believes that pretty much everything governments currently do, tech can do better.

I watched Balaji outline his idea last autumn, at a vast conference hall on the outskirts of Amsterdam. “We start new companies like Google; we start new communities like Facebook; we start new currencies like Bitcoin and Ethereum; can we start new countries?” he asked, as he ambled on stage, dressed in a slightly baggy grey suit and loose tie. He looked less like a rockstar, more like a middle manager in a corporate accounts department. But don’t be fooled. Balaji is a former partner at the giant Silicon Valley venture capital firm Andreessen Horowitz. He has backers with deep pockets.

 

Getty Images/Steve Jennings

 

Tech entrepreneur Balaji Srinivasan published his book The Network State: How to Start a Country in 2022

Silicon Valley loves “disruption”. Tech startups have been disrupting traditional media for years; now they are making inroads into other areas too: education, finance, space travel. “Imagine a thousand different startups, each of them replacing a different legacy institution,” Balaji told the audience. “They exist alongside the establishment in parallel, they’re pulling away users, they’re gaining strength, until they become the new thing.”

If startups could replace all these different institutions, Balaji reasoned, they could replace countries too. He calls his idea the “network state”: startup nations. Here’s how it would work: communities form – on the internet initially – around a set of shared interests or values. Then they acquire land, becoming physical “countries” with their own laws. These would exist alongside existing nation states, and eventually, replace them altogether.

You would choose your nationality like you choose your broadband provider. You would become a citizen of the franchised cyber statelet of your choice.

There is nothing new about corporations having undue influence in the affairs of nation states. The term "banana republic" derives from the fact that a US company, United Fruit, effectively ruled Guatemala for decades beginning in the 1930s. Apart from owning the majority of the land, they ran the railways, the postal service, the telegraph. When the Guatemalan government tried to push back, the CIA helped United Fruit out by instigating a coup.

But the network state movement appears to have greater ambitions still. It doesn’t just want pliant existing governments so that companies can run their own affairs. It wants to replace governments with companies.

 

The Coming Storm

 

As the US heads into a presidential election, Gabriel Gatehouse dives back into the labyrinthine rabbit warren of American conspiracy culture. Whilst liberals across the world worry about a possible return of Donald Trump, millions of Americans are convinced that their democracy has already been hijacked – by a sinister Deep State cabal. How did this happen? And who is behind it? That's the story that Gabriel Gatehouse is investigating in this series of The Coming Storm.

 

There are those who view the network state idea as a neo-colonial project that would replace elected leaders with corporate dictators acting in the interests of their shareholders. But others think it's a way of cutting through what they see as the regulation-infested state of Western democracies today. Sounds like a tech bro fantasy? Elements of the network state already exist.

The conference in Amsterdam included tech entrepreneurs showcasing some of these “startup societies”. There was Cabin, a “network city of modern villages” that has branches in the US, Portugal and elsewhere; and Culdesac, an Arizona-based community designed for remote working.

Balaji’s concept of the network state builds on the idea of “charter cities”, urban areas that constitute a special economic zone, similar to free ports. There are several such projects under construction around the world, including in Nigeria and Zambia. At a recent rally in Las Vegas, Donald Trump promised that, if elected in November, he would free up federal land in Nevada to “create special new zones with ultra-low taxes and ultra-low regulation”, to attract new industries, build affordable housing and create jobs. The plan would, he said, revive “the frontier spirit and the American dream”.

Culdesac and Cabin look more like online communities that have established territorial bases. Próspera is different. Located on an island off the coast of Honduras, it describes itself as a “private city” catering to entrepreneurs. It promotes longevity science – offering unregulated experimental gene therapies to slow the ageing process.

Run by a for-profit company based in Delaware in the United States, Próspera was granted special status under a previous Honduran government to make its own laws. The current president, Xiomara Castro, wants it gone, and has begun stripping it of some of the special privileges it was granted. Próspera is suing the government of Honduras for $10.8 billion.

 

Pitching a free-market cryptocity

At some point during the day-long pitching session in Amsterdam, a young man in a grey hoodie slouched on stage. His name was Dryden Brown. He said he wanted to build a new city-state, somewhere on the Mediterranean coast. It would be governed not by a giant state bureaucracy, but on the blockchain, the technology underlying cryptocurrency. Its founding principles would be ideas of “vitality” and “heroic virtue”. He called it Praxis, the Ancient Greek word for “action”. The first citizens of this new nation, he said, would be able to move in in 2026.

He was a little hazy on the details. Move in where exactly? Who would build the infrastructure? Who would run it? Dryden Brown fumbled with a remote and pulled up a slide, suggesting Praxis was backed by funds with access to hundreds of billions of dollars of capital.

For now, though, the “Praxis community” exists mainly on the internet. There is a website where you can apply for citizenship. Who, exactly, these citizens are, is unclear. Dryden flashed up another slide with his remote. It was a Pepe meme: the sad-looking cartoon frog that became an “alt-right” mascot during the Trump campaign in 2016.

In this niche world of startup nations, Praxis had a reputation for edginess. They hosted legendary parties: people spoke of candle-lit soirees in giant Manhattan loft spaces, where awkward computer coders mixed with hipster models and figures from the “Dark Enlightenment” – people like the blogger Curtis Yarvin, who advocates a totalitarian future in which the world is ruled by corporate “monarchs”. His ideas are sometimes described as fascist, something he denies. Attendees would be made to sign an NDA. Journalists were generally not welcome.

After his presentation, I went to talk to Dryden Brown. He seemed suspicious and a little cold, but he gave me his phone number. I messaged him a few times, trying to engage him in conversation. To no avail.

But then, about six months later, I spotted an intriguing notice on X. “Praxis magazine launch. Tomorrow night. Photocopy your favourite pages.” There was no time given, no location. Just a link where you could apply to attend. I applied. No answer. So, next morning, I texted Dryden Brown again. And to my surprise, he replied right away: “Ella Funt at 10pm.”

 

 

 

Ella Funt turned out to be a bar and nightclub in Manhattan. Formerly known as Club 82, it had once been a legendary spot on the New York gay scene; in the 1950s, writers and artists would go there to drink cocktails served by women in tuxedos and watch drag acts in the basement. Now it was hosting an exclusive party for people who wanted to start a new country. And I had somehow got myself an invite. But I was 2000 miles away in Utah. If I was going to make it in time, I had to get on a flight right away.

I was actually one of the first to arrive. The place was almost empty, with a few Praxis people laying out copies of their magazine around the bar. I flicked through it: expensive, heavy paper; lots of advertisements for seemingly random things: perfume; 3D-printed guns; one for just… milk. Like Pepe the Frog, milk is an internet meme. In “alt-right” circles, posting an icon of a white milk bottle signals white supremacy.

The magazine urged readers to “photocopy pages and paste them around your town” – a kind of analogue memetics. A Xerox machine had been wheeled into the bar for that very purpose.

A group of young men walked in, some wearing cowboy boots. They didn’t look like outdoor types though. I got talking to one of them. He introduced himself as Zac, a “crypto cowboy” from Milton Keynes (he was wearing a leather Stetson.)

“I kind of represent the American Wild West,” he said. “I feel as though we are at the frontier.”

Plenty of people associate cryptocurrencies with scams: highly volatile internet money, the value of which could disappear overnight. But in the world of the “network state”, they love crypto. They see it as the future of money – money that governments cannot control.

Getty Images

 

According to the network state concept, online communities can crowdfund territories and eventually gain diplomatic recognition from pre-existing states

 

The next person I got talking to called himself Azi. I asked for his surname. “Mandias,” he replied with a smile. It was a reference to a sonnet by Percy Bysse Shelley: Ozymandias, King of Kings. Anonymity is an important part of the crypto ethos. I got the feeling no one at this party was giving me their real names.

Mr Mandias was from Bangladesh originally, but had grown up in Queens, New York. He was the founder of a tech startup. He believed that, just as the printing press had contributed to the collapse of the feudal order in Europe 500 years ago, today new tech – crypto, the blockchain, AI – would bring about the collapse of the democratic nation state.

“Obviously, democracy is great,” he said. “But the best ruler is a moral dictator. Some people call [that] the philosopher king.”

The rise of the corporate king?

Azi said he was excited to be “on the precipice of what I think is the next renaissance”. But before this renaissance, he predicted a “Luddite movement” against new technology that would destroy millions of jobs and monopolise the global economy. The Luddites would fail, Azi said. Yet he predicted that the transition period to what he called the “next stage” of human societal evolution – the “network state” stage – would be violent and “Darwinistic”.

Far from being perturbed by this prospect, Azi seemed excited at the thought that out of the smouldering ashes of democracy, new kings would emerge: corporate dictators ruling over their networked empires.

I wandered over to the bar and got myself a drink. There I got talking to two young women who did not look like they were part of the crypto crowd. Ezra was the manager of another nightclub nearby, her friend Dylan was a student. It looked like they’d been invited to add a bit of glamour to what was – essentially – a party of crypto-bros and computer geeks. But they had some thoughts about the whole network state idea.

“What happens if you don't have enough employees in the hospital or at the school for the kids?” Dylan asked. “It is unrealistic to start an entire city without any government.” To Ezra, the whole idea seemed dystopian. “We wanted to see what a ‘real’ cult meeting was like,” she said, I think in jest.

Just then, Dryden Brown appeared, the co-founder of Praxis. When he went outside for a cigarette, I followed him. The Praxis Magazine was a way to showcase the new culture he was hoping to build, he told me. Praxis, he said, was about “the pursuit of the frontier” and of “heroic virtue”.

I doubted Dryden would last very long in a covered wagon out on the prairie. He looked exhausted by it all. I wanted to ask him some pointed questions about the network state project: who would be the citizens of this brave new world? Who would govern it? What was with all the alt-right memes? And – Dylan’s question – who was going to staff the hospitals?

But we kept getting interrupted by more guests arriving. Dryden Brown invited me to visit the “Praxis Embassy” the following day. We said our see-you-tomorrows and went inside. The party was getting wilder. Ezra and Dylan and some friends who looked like models were climbing up on top of the Xerox machine. They were busy photocopying – not pages from the magazine, but bits of their bodies. I grabbed a copy of the magazine and left.

Back at my tiny Airbnb above a Chinese supermarket, I leafed through it. Alongside the white supremacist memes and ads for guns, there was a QR code. It linked to a short film: a 20-minute polemic against the emptiness of modern life, a lament for a vanished world of hierarchies and heroism.

 

Between the lines

“You are entertained and satiated,” the narrator intones, “you are seemingly productive. But you are not great.” The voice talks about the “algorithms making you hate yourself and your own civilisation”.

At this point in the film, the screen shows an animated figure pointing a pistol straight at the viewer.

“Contemporary media proclaims that having any ideals is fascist,” the voice continues. “Everything of conviction is fascist.”

Was it an invitation to embrace the label of fascism? This movement seemed to yearn for a specific conception of Western culture - a Nietzschean world in which the fittest survive, where disruption and chaos give birth to greatness.

The next day, I stopped by the “Praxis Embassy” – a giant loft space on Broadway. The bookshelves were indeed filled with copies of Nietzsche, biographies of Napoleon and a volume entitled The Dictator’s Handbook. I hung around for a bit, but Dryden Brown never turned up.

I left wondering what exactly it was I had witnessed the previous night: was it a glimpse of the future, in which countries like the United States and the UK would collapse into a spider’s web of corporate societies, a world in which you could choose to become a citizen of a cyber statelet? Or were Dryden Brown and his friends just “trolling”, a bunch of tech bros roleplaying as alt-right revolutionaries in order to have a laugh at the expense of the establishment, and enjoy a good party?

Might Dryden Brown one day become a CEO-king, ruler of an alt-right franchised empire with outposts dotted around the Mediterranean? I doubt it. But there are moves to promote more autonomous zones, free ports and charter cities. And if democracy is in trouble, the network state movement looks like it is waiting in the wings.

 

[wood 11098]

3 hours ago, TexEx15 said:

 

Wow. Absolutelyfucking amazing. Highly recommended watch, for any of you who haven't already done so.

[Dahobbs 17415]

1 hour ago, kevwun said:

Yeah, I hope someone who is part of her team knows that AI is a scam and helps shape her policy about it.

AI isn't a scam. Misunderstood, yes. But, unlike crypto, there is actually quite a bit of potential for modern LLMs and similar models. 

[kevwun 15580]

Then they can wait for someone to realize that potential instead of wasting money now on something that doesn't do anything useful.

[Chuckie Finster 22581]

26 minutes ago, locodos said:

It's worse than you think, I think? Yeah probably.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cwyl171lyewo

  Hide contents

Do you look at the possibility of political turbulence ahead of November’s US presidential election and think: democracy could be in trouble? So does a group of tech entrepreneurs backed by big Silicon Valley money. And they love it.

Imagine if you could choose your citizenship the same way you choose your gym membership. That’s a vision of the not-too-distant future put forward by Balaji Srinivasan. Balaji – who, like Madonna, is mostly just known by his first name – is a rockstar in the world of crypto. A serial tech entrepreneur and venture capitalist who believes that pretty much everything governments currently do, tech can do better.

I watched Balaji outline his idea last autumn, at a vast conference hall on the outskirts of Amsterdam. “We start new companies like Google; we start new communities like Facebook; we start new currencies like Bitcoin and Ethereum; can we start new countries?” he asked, as he ambled on stage, dressed in a slightly baggy grey suit and loose tie. He looked less like a rockstar, more like a middle manager in a corporate accounts department. But don’t be fooled. Balaji is a former partner at the giant Silicon Valley venture capital firm Andreessen Horowitz. He has backers with deep pockets.

 

Getty Images/Steve Jennings

 

Tech entrepreneur Balaji Srinivasan published his book The Network State: How to Start a Country in 2022

Silicon Valley loves “disruption”. Tech startups have been disrupting traditional media for years; now they are making inroads into other areas too: education, finance, space travel. “Imagine a thousand different startups, each of them replacing a different legacy institution,” Balaji told the audience. “They exist alongside the establishment in parallel, they’re pulling away users, they’re gaining strength, until they become the new thing.”

If startups could replace all these different institutions, Balaji reasoned, they could replace countries too. He calls his idea the “network state”: startup nations. Here’s how it would work: communities form – on the internet initially – around a set of shared interests or values. Then they acquire land, becoming physical “countries” with their own laws. These would exist alongside existing nation states, and eventually, replace them altogether.

You would choose your nationality like you choose your broadband provider. You would become a citizen of the franchised cyber statelet of your choice.

There is nothing new about corporations having undue influence in the affairs of nation states. The term "banana republic" derives from the fact that a US company, United Fruit, effectively ruled Guatemala for decades beginning in the 1930s. Apart from owning the majority of the land, they ran the railways, the postal service, the telegraph. When the Guatemalan government tried to push back, the CIA helped United Fruit out by instigating a coup.

But the network state movement appears to have greater ambitions still. It doesn’t just want pliant existing governments so that companies can run their own affairs. It wants to replace governments with companies.

 

The Coming Storm

 

As the US heads into a presidential election, Gabriel Gatehouse dives back into the labyrinthine rabbit warren of American conspiracy culture. Whilst liberals across the world worry about a possible return of Donald Trump, millions of Americans are convinced that their democracy has already been hijacked – by a sinister Deep State cabal. How did this happen? And who is behind it? That's the story that Gabriel Gatehouse is investigating in this series of The Coming Storm.

 

There are those who view the network state idea as a neo-colonial project that would replace elected leaders with corporate dictators acting in the interests of their shareholders. But others think it's a way of cutting through what they see as the regulation-infested state of Western democracies today. Sounds like a tech bro fantasy? Elements of the network state already exist.

The conference in Amsterdam included tech entrepreneurs showcasing some of these “startup societies”. There was Cabin, a “network city of modern villages” that has branches in the US, Portugal and elsewhere; and Culdesac, an Arizona-based community designed for remote working.

Balaji’s concept of the network state builds on the idea of “charter cities”, urban areas that constitute a special economic zone, similar to free ports. There are several such projects under construction around the world, including in Nigeria and Zambia. At a recent rally in Las Vegas, Donald Trump promised that, if elected in November, he would free up federal land in Nevada to “create special new zones with ultra-low taxes and ultra-low regulation”, to attract new industries, build affordable housing and create jobs. The plan would, he said, revive “the frontier spirit and the American dream”.

Culdesac and Cabin look more like online communities that have established territorial bases. Próspera is different. Located on an island off the coast of Honduras, it describes itself as a “private city” catering to entrepreneurs. It promotes longevity science – offering unregulated experimental gene therapies to slow the ageing process.

Run by a for-profit company based in Delaware in the United States, Próspera was granted special status under a previous Honduran government to make its own laws. The current president, Xiomara Castro, wants it gone, and has begun stripping it of some of the special privileges it was granted. Próspera is suing the government of Honduras for $10.8 billion.

 

Pitching a free-market cryptocity

At some point during the day-long pitching session in Amsterdam, a young man in a grey hoodie slouched on stage. His name was Dryden Brown. He said he wanted to build a new city-state, somewhere on the Mediterranean coast. It would be governed not by a giant state bureaucracy, but on the blockchain, the technology underlying cryptocurrency. Its founding principles would be ideas of “vitality” and “heroic virtue”. He called it Praxis, the Ancient Greek word for “action”. The first citizens of this new nation, he said, would be able to move in in 2026.

He was a little hazy on the details. Move in where exactly? Who would build the infrastructure? Who would run it? Dryden Brown fumbled with a remote and pulled up a slide, suggesting Praxis was backed by funds with access to hundreds of billions of dollars of capital.

For now, though, the “Praxis community” exists mainly on the internet. There is a website where you can apply for citizenship. Who, exactly, these citizens are, is unclear. Dryden flashed up another slide with his remote. It was a Pepe meme: the sad-looking cartoon frog that became an “alt-right” mascot during the Trump campaign in 2016.

In this niche world of startup nations, Praxis had a reputation for edginess. They hosted legendary parties: people spoke of candle-lit soirees in giant Manhattan loft spaces, where awkward computer coders mixed with hipster models and figures from the “Dark Enlightenment” – people like the blogger Curtis Yarvin, who advocates a totalitarian future in which the world is ruled by corporate “monarchs”. His ideas are sometimes described as fascist, something he denies. Attendees would be made to sign an NDA. Journalists were generally not welcome.

After his presentation, I went to talk to Dryden Brown. He seemed suspicious and a little cold, but he gave me his phone number. I messaged him a few times, trying to engage him in conversation. To no avail.

But then, about six months later, I spotted an intriguing notice on X. “Praxis magazine launch. Tomorrow night. Photocopy your favourite pages.” There was no time given, no location. Just a link where you could apply to attend. I applied. No answer. So, next morning, I texted Dryden Brown again. And to my surprise, he replied right away: “Ella Funt at 10pm.”

 

 

 

Ella Funt turned out to be a bar and nightclub in Manhattan. Formerly known as Club 82, it had once been a legendary spot on the New York gay scene; in the 1950s, writers and artists would go there to drink cocktails served by women in tuxedos and watch drag acts in the basement. Now it was hosting an exclusive party for people who wanted to start a new country. And I had somehow got myself an invite. But I was 2000 miles away in Utah. If I was going to make it in time, I had to get on a flight right away.

I was actually one of the first to arrive. The place was almost empty, with a few Praxis people laying out copies of their magazine around the bar. I flicked through it: expensive, heavy paper; lots of advertisements for seemingly random things: perfume; 3D-printed guns; one for just… milk. Like Pepe the Frog, milk is an internet meme. In “alt-right” circles, posting an icon of a white milk bottle signals white supremacy.

The magazine urged readers to “photocopy pages and paste them around your town” – a kind of analogue memetics. A Xerox machine had been wheeled into the bar for that very purpose.

A group of young men walked in, some wearing cowboy boots. They didn’t look like outdoor types though. I got talking to one of them. He introduced himself as Zac, a “crypto cowboy” from Milton Keynes (he was wearing a leather Stetson.)

“I kind of represent the American Wild West,” he said. “I feel as though we are at the frontier.”

Plenty of people associate cryptocurrencies with scams: highly volatile internet money, the value of which could disappear overnight. But in the world of the “network state”, they love crypto. They see it as the future of money – money that governments cannot control.

Getty Images

 

According to the network state concept, online communities can crowdfund territories and eventually gain diplomatic recognition from pre-existing states

 

The next person I got talking to called himself Azi. I asked for his surname. “Mandias,” he replied with a smile. It was a reference to a sonnet by Percy Bysse Shelley: Ozymandias, King of Kings. Anonymity is an important part of the crypto ethos. I got the feeling no one at this party was giving me their real names.

Mr Mandias was from Bangladesh originally, but had grown up in Queens, New York. He was the founder of a tech startup. He believed that, just as the printing press had contributed to the collapse of the feudal order in Europe 500 years ago, today new tech – crypto, the blockchain, AI – would bring about the collapse of the democratic nation state.

“Obviously, democracy is great,” he said. “But the best ruler is a moral dictator. Some people call [that] the philosopher king.”

The rise of the corporate king?

Azi said he was excited to be “on the precipice of what I think is the next renaissance”. But before this renaissance, he predicted a “Luddite movement” against new technology that would destroy millions of jobs and monopolise the global economy. The Luddites would fail, Azi said. Yet he predicted that the transition period to what he called the “next stage” of human societal evolution – the “network state” stage – would be violent and “Darwinistic”.

Far from being perturbed by this prospect, Azi seemed excited at the thought that out of the smouldering ashes of democracy, new kings would emerge: corporate dictators ruling over their networked empires.

I wandered over to the bar and got myself a drink. There I got talking to two young women who did not look like they were part of the crypto crowd. Ezra was the manager of another nightclub nearby, her friend Dylan was a student. It looked like they’d been invited to add a bit of glamour to what was – essentially – a party of crypto-bros and computer geeks. But they had some thoughts about the whole network state idea.

“What happens if you don't have enough employees in the hospital or at the school for the kids?” Dylan asked. “It is unrealistic to start an entire city without any government.” To Ezra, the whole idea seemed dystopian. “We wanted to see what a ‘real’ cult meeting was like,” she said, I think in jest.

Just then, Dryden Brown appeared, the co-founder of Praxis. When he went outside for a cigarette, I followed him. The Praxis Magazine was a way to showcase the new culture he was hoping to build, he told me. Praxis, he said, was about “the pursuit of the frontier” and of “heroic virtue”.

I doubted Dryden would last very long in a covered wagon out on the prairie. He looked exhausted by it all. I wanted to ask him some pointed questions about the network state project: who would be the citizens of this brave new world? Who would govern it? What was with all the alt-right memes? And – Dylan’s question – who was going to staff the hospitals?

But we kept getting interrupted by more guests arriving. Dryden Brown invited me to visit the “Praxis Embassy” the following day. We said our see-you-tomorrows and went inside. The party was getting wilder. Ezra and Dylan and some friends who looked like models were climbing up on top of the Xerox machine. They were busy photocopying – not pages from the magazine, but bits of their bodies. I grabbed a copy of the magazine and left.

Back at my tiny Airbnb above a Chinese supermarket, I leafed through it. Alongside the white supremacist memes and ads for guns, there was a QR code. It linked to a short film: a 20-minute polemic against the emptiness of modern life, a lament for a vanished world of hierarchies and heroism.

 

Between the lines

“You are entertained and satiated,” the narrator intones, “you are seemingly productive. But you are not great.” The voice talks about the “algorithms making you hate yourself and your own civilisation”.

At this point in the film, the screen shows an animated figure pointing a pistol straight at the viewer.

“Contemporary media proclaims that having any ideals is fascist,” the voice continues. “Everything of conviction is fascist.”

Was it an invitation to embrace the label of fascism? This movement seemed to yearn for a specific conception of Western culture - a Nietzschean world in which the fittest survive, where disruption and chaos give birth to greatness.

The next day, I stopped by the “Praxis Embassy” – a giant loft space on Broadway. The bookshelves were indeed filled with copies of Nietzsche, biographies of Napoleon and a volume entitled The Dictator’s Handbook. I hung around for a bit, but Dryden Brown never turned up.

I left wondering what exactly it was I had witnessed the previous night: was it a glimpse of the future, in which countries like the United States and the UK would collapse into a spider’s web of corporate societies, a world in which you could choose to become a citizen of a cyber statelet? Or were Dryden Brown and his friends just “trolling”, a bunch of tech bros roleplaying as alt-right revolutionaries in order to have a laugh at the expense of the establishment, and enjoy a good party?

Might Dryden Brown one day become a CEO-king, ruler of an alt-right franchised empire with outposts dotted around the Mediterranean? I doubt it. But there are moves to promote more autonomous zones, free ports and charter cities. And if democracy is in trouble, the network state movement looks like it is waiting in the wings.

 

[Firemans4Horn 17789]

1 hour ago, Biff Tannen said:

What’s going to be wild is when we are at like 75% renewable generation and battery storage and people are still screaming that it can’t be done and we are going to have to bring back coal or some shit. Reality matters not to these people. 

The entire elected leadership of Texas spouts this shit on a daily basis. 

[Firemans4Horn 17789]

1 hour ago, Chuckie Finster said:

They're gonna be able to create entire college curriculums studying the VP selection process if Kamala loses Pennsylvania.

Shapiro ran against a Mark Robinson type R candidate. I think it’s simplistic to say he was going to bring some kind of blowout in PA to the ticket. 

[Chuckie Finster 22581]

1 minute ago, Firemans4Horn said:

Shapiro ran against a Mark Robinson type R candidate. I think it’s simplistic to say he was going to bring some kind of blowout in PA to the ticket. 

I'm not saying it would have made an ounce of difference, but you can bet a lot of people who get paid by the word will!

[Biff Tannen 45457]

31 minutes ago, wood said:

Wow. Absolutelyfucking amazing. Highly recommended watch, for any of you who haven't already done so.

Fucking infuriating. But yes. 

[wood 11098]

1 hour ago, SydneyCarton said:

The harris campaign having a problem with black men as opposed to white men in PA wasn't on my immediate bingo card...

Yep. A rich, white, racist man at that.

Just bizarre.

[tbone_ 14020]

Maricopa is also getting bluer.  Biden flipped it in 2020, Hobbs won it by 37k (and still won) and Mark Kelly won it by 100k votes.

The question I hear from local political folks is whether the CA in migration is bring their politics or escaping CA politics.

[Born to Run 6443]

14 minutes ago, Firemans4Horn said:

The entire elected leadership of Texas spouts this shit on a daily basis. 

Only because one orange asshole didn't like them interfering with his golf course view.  Otherwise those assholes would all be bragging about us being an energy leader and bringing in good jobs.

[Firemans4Horn 17789]

Predictit isn’t moving the wrong way on these NYT/Siena polls

 

[Horndog 2195]

2 hours ago, Js1 said:

State senator from Omaha - fuck you, no

 

 

[Js1 85039]

 

 

[Chuckie Finster 22581]

3 minutes ago, Js1 said:

 

 

Was genuinely floored at the thoroughness of the CNN piece.  There is absolutely no doubt that this dude is guilty of every single thing in that article.

[honolulu horn 6156]

5 minutes ago, Js1 said:

 

 

"I'm going to eat that ass and then smear it behind their ear!"

[wood 11098]

1 hour ago, tx 3 putt said:

biden is the second best o/g president ever ….

Suscribed.

Wow. This guy is a fucking gold mine.

 

Edited September 23 by wood

[Nice Guy Eddie 13389]

1 hour ago, Chuckie Finster said:

They're gonna be able to create entire college curriculums studying the VP selection process if Kamala loses Pennsylvania.

When Trump loses, much of the blame will be on him alone. However there should be attention that the failure to nominate Nikki Haley as the VP spot is also a reason. Put Haley in the VP role, and Trump would be up several points right now and potentially cruising to a victory.