2024 Presidential Election Thread - Let's keep the party going.

[wildcat09 28540]

54 minutes ago, Chuckie Finster said:

If we got that Joe last night, this election would be over.

A lot of yall keep saying this because yall have apparently gone insane.

[drt 636]

2 hours ago, Ghost of LL said:

I agree 100% with everything you just typed.  Joe Biden is undoubtedly the best president of my lifetime.  And to be honest, it isn't even particularly close.  There are things I would wish had been done better.  But the list of accomplishments in 3.5 years is pretty remarkable.

And now it's time for him to do one more thing for his country--stand down.  Give a gracious speech from the Oval about how it's time to pass the torch to a new generation.  Channel JFK's First Inaugural, except instead of being the torch-recipient, speak as the torch-passer.  It would breathe new life into the campaign.  It would give the Democratic candidate an unbelievable advantage of not just being not old, but also of being the basis for excitement for the future.  It would defeat Trump.

It would save the Republic.

I’m a few beers deep, but this is the type of thinking that has typified democratic policy my whole life. I hope he gets up at the next debate and tells trump to fuck off.  Don’t be scared. 
 

besides that, if he steps aside the dems lose. Who else beats trump? The best president of the last 50 years or an unknown.  For a smart guy I don’t fucking get this take at all. 

[linux 1380]

3 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

They're not legally bound.  They're bound under the Rules of the Convention.  Guess what a majority of the Convention can do--change the fucking rules.

But that's not ideal.  Far from it.  That's why it would be far better for Biden to step down.  But to do that, he needs to have people like Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer in his ear telling him it's time to do that.  And that doesn't seem to be happening right now.  But were it to happen, I suspect he might agree.

So no--there is currently no Plan B.  But that just means we need to start figuring out a Plan B right fucking pronto.

Lets pretend he croaks tomorrow and they are released what is your plan?

[LCHorn 2559]

1 minute ago, Ghost of LL said:

Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer

Or he needs Harris to tell him she won’t seek the nomination.  If Harris is willing to be VP on any of the speculated nominees tickets the whole thing would be so much easier.

That said, and this sounds silly but it would settle some of the Kamala problem, get Oprah on board as VP for whoever.  

[closetohumping 17299]

7 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

A lot of yall keep saying this because yall have apparently gone insane.

Yes.  We got this. Joe is in control.  

[Ghost of LL 15255]

7 minutes ago, linux said:

Lets pretend he croaks tomorrow and they are released what is your plan?

If he croaks tomorrow, then Harris is POTUS and would presumably be the nominee.

[Goredho 17178]

25 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

It wasn't in 2020.

Voters didn’t see last night’s Biden in 2020.

[closetohumping 17299]

Just now, Goredho said:

Voters didn’t see last night’s Biden in 2020.

There are clips out there though. Some dems in here are being willfully ignorant.   But hey Joe has done right where he wants him.  

[linux 1380]

1 minute ago, Ghost of LL said:

If he croaks tomorrow, then Harris is POTUS and would presumably be the nominee.

I mean that is the same as Biden right now but lets follow through.

What happens to the voters that prefer Newsom? Or Whitmer? or Bernie?

How do you convince them that a person that has never won a primary that she will beat Trump in an election? Gavin does not have a victory either in a primary so it boils down if wining the senate in Cali is more relevant than governorship, then you have Bernie that at least won a primary.

At the end of the day the primaries are of a tool of "shut the fuck up" ore than they are a smart means to pick a candidate. The winer tells the loser that he does not have the votes. And the loser side shuts the fuck up.

What we would get is a backroom deal that fraction of the voter base will reject.

In short I hope biden survives until it is too late to pretend there is an option to change, and if he dies in Oct we ride Harris cause that is what the convention said.

Nightmare fuel is the democratic civil war.

[MrBig 5182]

2 hours ago, linux said:

Democrats have won every single election since Roe v Wade, and only lost one legit competitive election since Jan 6 (Va gov), people panicking are doing Trump a favor.

What elections are you referring to? 

[wildcat09 28540]

There is absolutely no scenario where any back room deal to replace Biden doesn’t blow up the fucking campaign. He cost himself 1% support with the worst debate performance imaginable. You pussies need to calm the fuck down and stop pretending this is an episode of the west wing.

[Michael Knight 12718]

Trump is 3 years younger than Biden and is insane

[linux 1380]

Just now, MrBig said:

What elections are you referring to? 

Warnock Ossof in 2021

Senate elections during midterms to keep the senate

Competitive Governorship for the rest. 

Again only really lost Va.

 

Of course deeply unbalanced races don't reall count I am neither counting the Newsom Recall or Abbott or Desantis winning, real close races are what matter. What used to be called bellweather counties before the Trump reorganization.

[Ghost of LL 15255]

4 minutes ago, linux said:

I mean that is the same as Biden right now but lets follow through.

What happens to the voters that prefer Newsom? Or Whitmer? or Bernie?

How do you convince them that a person that has never won a primary that she will beat Trump in an election? Gavin does not have a victory either in a primary so it boils down if wining the senate in Cali is more relevant than governorship, then you have Bernie that at least won a primary.

At the end of the day the primaries are of a tool of "shut the fuck up" ore than they are a smart means to pick a candidate. The winer tells the loser that he does not have the votes. And the loser side shuts the fuck up.

What we would get is a backroom deal that fraction of the voter base will reject.

In short I hope biden survives until it is too late to pretend there is an option to change, and if he dies in Oct we ride Harris cause that is what the convention said.

Nightmare fuel is the democratic civil war.

But you have the Democratic Civil War you fear right now. 

Most of the party is in an uproar that this guy can't be our nominee.  He's only our nominee because nobody runs against a sitting president.  

But he's the sitting president because he was elected in 2020 as a guy who is vastly different from the guy that exists today.  And frankly, we weren't aware of the guy who exists today until last night.  But now that we see the switch now that we've swallowed the bait, quite a lot of the party isn't fucking happy.  So sitting here and saying "we can't ditch Biden because we'll have a civil war" strikes me as akin to if Lincoln had said after Fort Sumter "we can't send federal troops into Virginia because we'll have a Civil War."  Sorry, Abe--Civil War already dun got declared.  The only question is whether we're going to resolve it before November.

[Bozo_Casanova 25874]

27 minutes ago, drt said:

if he steps aside the dems lose

This is called “begging the question”

[UpperWestside 6026]

If Biden is alive on Election Day he gets my vote. He has quietly been exceptionally effective as president for all the reasons already noted. 
 

If he stands down and is replaced by anyone, literally anyone, that has a D next to their name I will vote for them. Anyone that ensures TFG is not back in the Oval Office is okay by me.

[linux 1380]

Just now, Ghost of LL said:

But you have the Democratic Civil War you fear right now. 

Most of the party is in an uproar that this guy can't be our nominee.  He's only our nominee because nobody runs against a sitting president.  

But he's the sitting president because he was elected in 2020 as a guy who is vastly different from the guy that exists today.  And frankly, we weren't aware of the guy who exists today until last night.  But now that we see the switch now that we've swallowed the bait, quite a lot of the party isn't fucking happy.  So sitting here and saying "we can't ditch Biden because we'll have a civil war" strikes me as akin to if Lincoln had said after Fort Sumter "we can't send federal troops into Virginia because we'll have a Civil War."  Sorry, Abe--Civil War already dun got declared.  The only question is whether we're going to resolve it before November.

There is an uproar but Biden won the primaries and 2020, Harris does not have that, Newsom does not have that, Bernie does not have that. Only Biden does and it is not even close.

At the end of the day there is no option, build a time machine if you want options, go back in time and show the nation this debate (to tell you the truth they would probably scoff and say yeah that is Biden.) At least the panic would have been more subdued last night.

[Ghost of LL 15255]

1 minute ago, linux said:

There is an uproar but Biden won the primaries and 2020, Harris does not have that, Newsom does not have that, Bernie does not have that. Only Biden does and it is not even close.

At the end of the day there is no option, build a time machine if you want options, go back in time and show the nation this debate (to tell you the truth they would probably scoff and say yeah that is Biden.) At least the panic would have been more subdued last night.

There is an option.  There are always options.  The question is whether the Democratic Party wants to explore an option that would enable it to win in November.  Or whether it would prefer the option of least resistance, which will result in MAGA winning the White House, the House, and the Senate, which will confine women to second-class citizenry (if they're lucky), which will destroy our economy and standing in the world, and which will doom the Republic.

[David Dennison 17797]

6 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

But you have the Democratic Civil War you fear right now. 

Which Democrats have suggested Joe Biden should step aside?

[linux 1380]

Just now, Ghost of LL said:

There is an option.  There are always options.  The question is whether the Democratic Party wants to explore an option that would enable it to win in November.  Or whether it would prefer the option of least resistance, which will result in MAGA winning the White House, the House, and the Senate, which will confine women to second-class citizenry (if they're lucky), which will destroy our economy and standing in the world, and which will doom the Republic.

It has been universally accepted in this country, at least since the Perot candidacy that a divided house is a house that is routed you don't even need a REAL third candidate see Hillary and how she lost. If you think there is division over Biden or even Hillary, imagine with candidates that have never beaten Trump or at the very least won multiple primaries (Bernie only really won a few and he would never be taken seriously due to age and politics).

You referenced the real Civil War, you ride with the army you have not the one you want. Its too late to procure it is too late for primaries.

 

 

[linux 1380]

That said I do pray secularly that there is a secret informal primary plan tucked away as an emergency meassure inside the DNC. It is not binding and all on the same day, but it would give the winner legitimacy if the worst really happened.

[wildcat09 28540]

16 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

There is an option.  There are always options.  The question is whether the Democratic Party wants to explore an option that would enable it to win in November.  Or whether it would prefer the option of least resistance, which will result in MAGA winning the White House, the House, and the Senate, which will confine women to second-class citizenry (if they're lucky), which will destroy our economy and standing in the world, and which will doom the Republic.

The only remotely realistic option is Harris. Do you seriously think that five days from now you’ll want Harris to be the nominee over Biden?

[Biff Tannen 45151]

3 hours ago, Ghost of LL said:

And now it's time for him to do one more thing for his country--stand down.  Give a gracious speech from the Oval about how it's time to pass the torch to a new generation.  Channel JFK's First Inaugural, except instead of being the torch-recipient, speak as the torch-passer.  It would breathe new life into the campaign.  It would give the Democratic candidate an unbelievable advantage of not just being not old, but also of being the basis for excitement for the future.  It would defeat Trump.

It would save the Republic.

Purely from a strategic point of view, I feel this is accurate.  It would be like a shot of adrenaline for not only Dems, but a fuck ton of independents and non-voters.

[Js1 83352]

3 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

The only remotely realistic option is Harris. Do you seriously think that five days from now you’ll want Harris to be the nominee over Biden?

BIDEN HAS TO STEP ASIDE SO WE CAN VOTE FOR SOMEONE ELSE

*Harris is named nominee*

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13483]

Posters who think Biden should step aside-

DO SOMETHING!!!

[Pancho 42838]

It was a decent dap for uncle Joe 

 

[Pancho 42838]

 

[Hornius Emeritus 12332]

The past is prologue. The muppets knew!
 

 

[troph 24024]

26 minutes ago, Pancho said:

It was a decent dap for uncle Joe 

 

More of this please uncle Joe!!

 

16 minutes ago, Pancho said:

 

I think there is a lot more of this out there this time, Trump has never won other than the year he was sort of a blank slate.

the debate was bad, real bad, this is going to blow over though.  
 

when was the last time Biden LOST an election, I’m serious? He’s probably 42-2 all time election record.

Edited June 29 by troph

[mchookem 15539]

1 hour ago, UpperWestside said:

If Biden is alive on Election Day he gets my vote. He has quietly been exceptionally effective as president for all the reasons already noted. 
 

If he stands down and is replaced by anyone, literally anyone, that has a D next to their name I will vote for them. Anyone that ensures TFG is not back in the Oval Office is okay by me.

i mean...yeah. that's basically it. all of it.

[elfenix 34109]

 

"and i know my bed time is at 8 pm after the wheel comes on"

[linux 1380]

i honestly do not understand why he can't be like that 24/7 inject him with whatever if you have to and fire the policy wonks, rallies like that work. It gets people excited, it eliminates the negative nancies and it drives out the vote.

Instead they wanted him to memorize stupid shit.

[The Original Greaser Bob 2701]

3 hours ago, Michael Knight said:

Trump is 3 years younger than Biden and is insane

The voting public is much younger than that on average and almost 50% is as insane.

[Francisco 2.0 32175]

 

 

 

[TexEx15 17253]

1 hour ago, elfenix said:

 

"and i know my bed time is at 8 pm after the wheel comes on"

Humility is a good look. It draws a stark contrast to the other guy who is…

[David Dennison 17797]

He should run an Uncle Leo campaign: "I'm an old man. I'm confused! I thought I paid for it. What's my name? Could you take me home?"

[Fastbreak 3890]

Biden has done a really good job and mostly restored America’s place in the world. But he simply can’t run this time. If he wins, he would be 86 years old at the end of the term. There is no possible way an 86 year old can do the duties he is required. This is just the nature of the human condition.

Not one of here would want an 80+ year old boss. And Harris isn’t the answer. 99% of America (and the world) couldn’t pick her out of a lineup.

The fate of democracy is at stake. I hope Joe will do the right thing…

[GW Hayduke 1943]

1 hour ago, Fastbreak said:

If he wins, he would be 86 years old at the end of the term. There is no possible way an 86 year old can do the duties he is required.

Joe isn't the only one in the administration.

[Bama Llama 1436]

I’’ve voted in every presidential election beginning in 1972.  I have yet to vote for a Republican and I’m not about to vote for the Enemy of Enlightenment, Mr. Trump. All this angst and whining is like Chicken Little flapping her wings about the sky falling. Outside of maybe drafting Katt Williams, Chris Rock and Dave Chappelle to warm up the rallies, Joe should just keep on keeping on and not give a fuck what’s trending on social media.  I mean, did we quit when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? (Hat tip to Senator Blutarsky)

[WhatTheBuck 28613]

2 hours ago, Fastbreak said:

Biden has done a really good job and mostly restored America’s place in the world. But he simply can’t run this time. If he wins, he would be 86 years old at the end of the term. There is no possible way an 86 year old can do the duties he is required. This is just the nature of the human condition.

Not one of here would want an 80+ year old boss. And Harris isn’t the answer. 99% of America (and the world) couldn’t pick her out of a lineup.

The fate of democracy is at stake. I hope Joe will do the right thing…

Rupert Murdoch just retired. He’s 93. He’s getting remarried. 

[Fastbreak 3890]

Rupert Murdoch just retired. He’s 93. He’s getting remarried. 

My step father is 6 months younger than Biden and has had his iPad missing for the past 3 months because he forgot where he hid it so the cleaning lady’s kids wouldn’t steal it (note, the cleaning lady hasn’t brought her kids in more than 20 years). Before the iPad it was his wallet which was hidden in the tool chest in the garage.

He also tells me the same story almost every time I talk to him, “did you know your brother in law died?”

He also sleeps about 20 hours a day.

[Js1 83352]

I don’t understand anymore. You’re voting for the party at this point, not the person. It’s like committing to a school versus a coach. The coach (president) could leave (die) but the school (party) remains the same.

At the end of the day, you’re not voting Biden or Trump. You’re voting Dem or GOP and the GOP will suck regardless of who is the candidate. If Biden dies, Harris will continue the exact same policies. Because it’s the party’s policies.

This country has to get past voting for personalities. They’re figureheads for the party. Vote for which party’s policies you most believe in. Not Biden or Trump

Edited June 29 by Js1

[TwiceHorn 30850]

On 6/27/2024 at 3:55 PM, HendersonHorns said:

One a 30+ time convicted felon. 
Rapist. Liar. Prick  

one is elderly with a poor memory not fit for trial. 
 

What a shit sandwich we have to eat. 

Let's make something clear here.

A sitting US President will not be indicted or tried. PERIOD.  PARAGRAPH.

Because of this, Mueller declined to make any explicit conclusions about Trump's guilt, or indictability, because it is unfair to insinuate a crime if you cannot be tried and defend yourself.

Hur could not indict Biden, either, or try him.  Thus, his conclusions that Biden was "unfit for trial" (not something he actually said anyway), was entirely, completely gratuitous.  What he did say was that regardless of the strength of charges against him, Biden could credibly claim a lack of memory as to events occurring at the time he left office in 2016-17.  Which is true of just about anyone.

This is the difference between a dedicated, fair public servant (Mueller) and a political hack cunt (Hur).

None of this is to say that Biden is ideal.  But Trump's criminal convictions are the tip of the iceberg as to his personal unfitness to hold public office in the US, or really anywhere for that matter.

So, yeah, it's a shit sandwich, but one of the shit sandwiches is much larger and shittier than the other one.

Edited June 29 by TwiceHorn

[DDD Dad 14062]

On 6/27/2024 at 3:41 PM, YGIFS said:

Yeah, I know we've discussed this ad nauseam.  Plenty of people who know who they voted for and why and live with the justification of why they did it.  Millions of Americans can justify crimes, adultery, procrastination, misdemeanors, substance abuse, and self-harm each and every day.  We're hard-wired for it.  But at some point, we all keep doing shit wrong and realize as we look in the mirror and think "You can't keep doing this, you're better than this.  have some dignity."  Of course, most of the time...we stay on the wrong path but at least have some modicum of inflection.  We have these massive, though woefully underused brains, inside of our skull.  So large that we have to come out early due to our cranial size so as not to kill the mother.  There is willful ignorance and then there's where we are right now---tens of millions of people that simply don't know what the fuck they're doing.  There's many doing it for selfish reasons, I get it---just as natural a human behavior as denial.  But it's biologically impossible that there are this many people among us who can contain and worship two completely opposite thoughts and move seamlessly between them at the drop of a hat, depending on the venue and convenience.  

Every competent adult I know can speak to a child or an operator and a waiter or a cashier in an appropriate fashion.  They will then pause for a nano-second, and speak to their spouse or a co-worker or friend in altogether different fashion.  It's in our DNA.  We know not to tell the child there is no Easter Bunny, to tell our spouse they're looking older, or the cashier that their service sucks.  We can bounce back and forth with ease, for the sake of civilization.  But there are now tens of millions of Americans who can look at Joe Biden and Donald Trump and are incapable of volleying the ball across the table?  The guy who thinks Nikki Haley was to blame for January 6th because she was on drugs from Ronny Johnson and accidentally released too many sharks to attack electric boats in the Swamp and the other guy is a senile coke addict who can't find Delaware on a map but somehow manages a cartel? 

How in the wide wide world of fucking fucks?  

Jesus that’s a wall of words. Are you just posting shit from Chat GPT?

[WhatTheBuck 28613]

17 minutes ago, Js1 said:

I don’t understand anymore. You’re voting for the party at this point, not the person. It’s like committing to a school versus a coach. The coach (president) could leave (die) but the school (party) remains the same.

At the end of the day, you’re not voting Biden or Trump. You’re voting Dem or GOP and the GOP will suck regardless of who is the candidate. If Biden dies, Harris will continue the exact same policies. Because it’s the party’s policies.

This country has to get past voting for personalities. They’re figureheads for the party. Vote for which party’s policies you most believe in. Not Biden or Trump

Except in Trump’s case he is the party. If you’re voting for Trump then you’re voting for the (wretched) personality and the cult that comes along with it. The Republican Party of yesteryear is gone. I don’t know what they’ll look like after Trump is gone but he has to be kept out of office no matter what. I’d vote for Joe Biden’s corpse over him. 

[immamac 41718]

14 hours ago, Chuckie Finster said:

If we got that Joe last night, this election would be over.

This is my frustration 

[Js1 83352]

31 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

Except in Trump’s case he is the party. If you’re voting for Trump then you’re voting for the (wretched) personality and the cult that comes along with it. The Republican Party of yesteryear is gone. I don’t know what they’ll look like after Trump is gone but he has to be kept out of office no matter what. I’d vote for Joe Biden’s corpse over him. 

Yes that’s my point. Trumpism IS the party. It’s the Democrats versus Trumpism. It’s not Bidenisn versus Trumpism. Bidenism isn’t a thing - any mainstream Dem like Newsom,Whitmer, Harris, Pete, etc will be running the same platform with minor differences.

So it should be an easy choice. 

[berlinerbaer 670]

14 hours ago, Chuckie Finster said:

If we got that Joe last night, this election would be over.

There is no silver bullet that will take down Trump. It wasn’t Jan 6, it wasn’t getting impeached twice, it wasn’t losing in 2020, and it wasn’t 34 felony convictions. It sure as hell wouldn’t have been a good debate performance by Biden.

Thankfully, I believe the flip side is also true in this single case. A bad debate performance won’t sink Biden. He’ll be good enough in September that this won’t matter.

 

[TwiceHorn 30850]

11 hours ago, elfenix said:

 

"and i know my bed time is at 8 pm after the wheel comes on"

Humility and humor.  Who knew?

I have seen some allusions that he had a cold during the debate.   Even pretty mild sickness of any kind can be really hard on the elderly in a way younger folks don't experience.  For those with actual dementia, it can make them completely non-functional when they normally are much more functional (I'm not saying Joe has dementia, it is just an example I have personally observed).

Edited June 29 by TwiceHorn

[Sawbonz 26871]

11 hours ago, elfenix said:

 

"and i know my bed time is at 8 pm after the wheel comes on"

Where tf was this Joe Thursday night?

 

His debate team needs to be launched into the sun. He should have been traveling all last week hammering trump in public like this and firing up crowds instead of whatever he was doing at Camp David

Edited June 29 by Sawbonz