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Bernie Sanders 2020 Watch

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Turkleton

Turkleton 145

Posted
Posted
22 hours ago, bad_teammate said:

NATIONALIZE WAL-MART!

 

This fucking idiotic tweet by the clueless socialist is why he would get smoked by Trump in the head-to-head. And a course, your response is typical of one who sees rainbows and unicorns. 

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Hank Scorpio
Hank Scorpio

When Bernie is president only the rich children will be put in cages. 

Johnny Sack
Johnny Sack

Watching you commie fucks lose this election is going to be enjoyable. 

Longhorn_Fan68
Longhorn_Fan68

it is really, really stupid that in the richest country in the world people are dying from lack of insulin. it's unconscionable, really.

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Zonahorn

Zonahorn 8079

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, Turkleton said:

This fucking idiotic tweet by the clueless socialist is why he would get smoked by Trump in the head-to-head. And a course, your response is typical of one who sees rainbows and unicorns. 

Does it hurt to be this stupid?

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SDG

SDG 3319

Posted
Posted

College wouldn’t be so expensive if the government didn’t step into the loan game to begin with so this “legislation” is to fix a problem they introduced.  The government should provide scholarships, grants, and tax breaks leaving everything else to the market.  

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13125

Posted
Posted (edited)

Bernie: "... and they said that Bernie Sanders was an existential threat to the Democratic Party"

Amazing dude in the back: "HELL YEAH!"

*crowd fucking loves it*

imgur>

Third Way and other corporate Democrats being so open in their hostility towards him is just going to give him the "outsider" cachet again. He gets to be the underdog fighting the machine in the eyes of the voters again, which is what he is (of course), but an effective way to stifle him would be to make it seem like you support him while you work against him behind the scenes. Absorb the dissenting element to prevent its spread.

Seema Nanda and Tom Perez (heads of the DNC) better be keeping their lanyard stooges on a tight leash to avoid a repeat of 2016. I, personally, think sunlight is the best disinfectant and we need to know just how deep the rot in the Democratic Party goes, so I welcome their open and unabashed hatred.

Edited by bad_teammate
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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23356

Posted
Posted (edited)

No one knew who Third Way was until Bernie started crying about them.  He’s playing the victim again and it’s not flattering.

Bernie has accomplished more over the last four years as a campaigner than he has in his entire life as a lawmaker.  That shouldn’t get lost or squandered.  He’s galvanized a movement to force real change and real change in the Democratic Party is being made.  

The unfortunate thing in my view is he will never give up the throne of his own movement, even if a clearly better leader is available.  

If this race was a heads up between Biden and Bernie, I would be all in for Bernie.  However, I think there is a better fighter available to advocate the kind of change Bernie is trying to achieve:  a more equitable, egalitarian, and peaceful society. 

The Bernie Bros may be soon faced with a decision between sticking with Bernie out of loyalty or trying to win and making his ideas a reality with a stronger fighter.    Right now they’re attempting to do both which is fine, it’s still early and anything can happen but I’d hate to see Joe Biden nominated because the Berners couldn’t get off their high horse. 

JMO

Edited by Hugo Stiglitz
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David Dennison

David Dennison 18608

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

No one knew who Third Way was until Bernie started crying about them.  He’s playing the victim again and it’s not flattering.

Bernie has accomplished more over the last four years as a campaigner than he has in his entire life as a lawmaker.  That shouldn’t get lost or squandered.  He’s galvanized a movement to force real change and real change in the Democratic Party is being made.  

The unfortunate thing in my view is he will never give up the throne of his own movement, even if a clearly better leader is available.  

If this race was a heads up between Biden and Bernie, I would be all in for Bernie.  However, I think there is a better FIGHTER available to advocate the kind of change Bernie is trying to achieve:  a more equitable, egalitarian, and peaceful society. 

The Bernie Bros may be soon faced with a decision between sticking with Bernie out of loyalty or trying to win and making his ideas a reality with a stronger fighter.    Right now they’re attempting to do both which is fine, it’s still early and anything can happen but I’d hate to see Joe Biden nominated because the Berners couldn’t get off their high horse.  But not surprised.

JMO

Then that better fighter has to beat him. 

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13125

Posted
Posted

It's always fun when someone says "no one" when they mean "I" when it comes to not knowing things. Trump does it, too.

One would imagine that a CLEARLY SUPERIOR grassroots progressive leader would already have their own massive grassroots movement and wouldn't be relying on center-right Johnny Come Latelys to start the "It's Her Turn 2.0" chant to try and cry others into submission.

Right?

Maybe the lack of a massive, nationwide progressive army that is stocking government with amazing young leaders has to do with youthful inexperience?

Hard to say.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13125

Posted
Posted
11 hours ago, Henry Hill said:

But your mind isn’t. Terrible idea intended to pander to voters that has a 0% chance of passing.

Welcome to the politics forum!

My name is B_T and I love raising taxes on the rich, hating police and the military/intelligence complex, and providing necessary services to every single American regardless of means or ability, it's fantastic to meet you.

Tell us about yourself, Henry!

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

Posted
Posted
How is Bernie making Wall Street pay for student loan debt?
No troll, just curious how it works. 
Taxing market trades. B_t posted a link way back when. Read up on FTTs, both Bernie's and other countries who have done it. It's pretty interesting stuff.
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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13125

Posted
Posted

Fair enough.

The only way to get any progressive legislation does is to change the makeup of Congress either by bringing in entirely new people or exerting the pressure necessary on the existing legislators to get the votes you need.

You get people in the streets marching and calling out their House Reps and Senators. You get people ringing their phones off the hook. You get people flooding their offices with mail. You get people occupying their offices.

- If it's a Republican, you get people to run vigorously against them and you organize and work for their opponent.

- If it's a Democrat standing in the way, you primary them vigorously and organize and work for their opponent.

You say, "Do what the people want or the people are going to remove you from office and make your life hell. I will name your name. I will tell them who is standing in the way."

And if you have millions of active and fired-up people, you can do that.

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David Dennison

David Dennison 18608

Posted
Posted
24 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Fair enough.

The only way to get any progressive legislation does is to change the makeup of Congress either by bringing in entirely new people or exerting the pressure necessary on the existing legislators to get the votes you need.

You get people in the streets marching and calling out their House Reps and Senators. You get people ringing their phones off the hook. You get people flooding their offices with mail. You get people occupying their offices.

- If it's a Republican, you get people to run vigorously against them and you organize and work for their opponent.

- If it's a Democrat standing in the way, you primary them vigorously and organize and work for their opponent.

You say, "Do what the people want or the people are going to remove you from office and make your life hell. I will name your name. I will tell them who is standing in the way."

And if you have millions of active and fired-up people, you can do that.

When was the last time progressive legislation was passed this way?

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13125

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

A bill you support.

Dodd-Frank in 2010 jumps immediately to mind. Plenty of Dems opposed it and faced concerted pressure. Not really all that progressive, though.

The problem with saying "progressive legislation" is this: When was the last time we had a president who even wanted progressive legislation?

Clinton's welfare slashing? Obama's Republican think-tank healthcare plan? Carter's strike busting?

We have to go back pretty far, to the Great Society and New Deal, to find actual progressive leadership (such as it was).

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David Dennison

David Dennison 18608

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, bad_teammate said:

Dodd-Frank in 2010 jumps immediately to mind. Plenty of Dems opposed it and faced concerted pressure. Not really all that progressive, though.

The problem with saying "progressive legislation" is this: When was the last time we had a president who even wanted progressive legislation?

Clinton's welfare slashing? Obama's Republican think-tank healthcare plan? Carter's strike busting?

We have to go back pretty far, to the Great Society and New Deal, to find actual progressive leadership (such as it was).

I would guess Medicare.

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David Dennison

David Dennison 18608

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Depressing, but fair.

Do you think there's a more effective way to enact and pass progressive change in America?

Maybe enact progressive policies on a local level and once they work take them to Washington. They have to be popular, though.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13125

Posted
Posted
Just now, David Dennison said:

Maybe enact progressive policies on a local level and once they work take them to Washington.

What does "take them to Washington" mean? Like in a basket?

Give me an example of what you're talking about. Is this the whole states being the laboratories of democracy thing?

Quote

They have to be popular, though.

How is that measured?

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David Dennison

David Dennison 18608

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

What does "take them to Washington" mean? Like in a basket?

Give me an example of what you're talking about. Is this the whole states being the laboratories of democracy thing?

How is that measured?

It means you put forward bills that are based on progressive legislation that has already been passed in the states. The ACA isn't a progressive example, but the model of federal legislation based on a state law is there. There are other examples that I can't think of right off the top of my head. Federal civil rights legislation might have been based on state law, but I'm not sure.

As for popularity, you have to base most of it on polling and public support for candidates who support the legislation in question.

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ChiTownDoc

ChiTownDoc 21091

Posted
Posted
On 6/23/2019 at 9:32 PM, bad_teammate said:

My body is ready.
 

LOL, cancelling the entire thing?  I mean, really?  There's lot of REALLY wealthy people that have not paid off their student loans because they're around 2%.  Cancel them all?  Fucking Bernie.  I don't think he even tries anymore.  Just rahrah bullshit that isn't based in any reality at all. 

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Cheeseweasel

Cheeseweasel 26437

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, ChiTownDoc said:

LOL, cancelling the entire thing?  I mean, really?  There's lot of REALLY wealthy people that have not paid off their student loans because they're around 2%.  Cancel them all?  Fucking Bernie.  I don't think he even tries anymore.  Just rahrah bullshit that isn't based in any reality at all. 

I think the irony to this discussion is that IF (and it's a huge IF) any legit legislation comes out regarding ending student loan debt, there will be huge "carve outs" for certain groups. Does Bernie really want to forgive the debt of a Dr. who is making 200k  per year and has 50k of debt?  Once this "carve out" begins and many realize it's not THEIR debt that will be forgiven, support will likely dwindle. 

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13125

Posted
Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, David Dennison said:

It means you put forward bills that are based on progressive legislation that has already been passed in the states.

So yeah, Brandeis's laboratories of democracy thing. No, it doesn't work that way.

- States are not miniature nations. They are not sovereign and they are connected to 49 other competing entities with open borders (physically and economically).
- Most states are not accurately reflective of the economic, religious, educational, nutritional, cultural, historical, and ethnic totality of the United States.
- Most states are either 100% controlled by conservative governments or dominated by conservative legislators, making progressive initiatives impossible.

If you're interested in studying models, you should look to other sovereigns (other nations), not state programs.

Quote

As for popularity, you have to base most of it on polling and public support for candidates who support the legislation in question.

I have great news for you, New Deal-style Democratic Socialism is extremely popular in polling (universal healthcare, wealth taxes, et al).

8 hours ago, ChiTownDoc said:

LOL, cancelling the entire thing?  I mean, really?  There's lot of REALLY wealthy people that have not paid off their student loans because they're around 2%.  Cancel them all?  Fucking Bernie.  I don't think he even tries anymore.  Just rahrah bullshit that isn't based in any reality at all. 

ChiTown: "Bernie is way too mean to rich people, which shows he's a radical moron."
ALSO ChiTown: "Bernie wants to forgive the debt of rich people? WHAT AN IDIOT!"

If I didn't know better, I might think that he's a completely disingenuous troll. 

18 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

Does Bernie really want to forgive the debt of a Dr. who is making 200k  per year and has 50k of debt?

Obviously, yes.

Edited by bad_teammate
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ChiTownDoc

ChiTownDoc 21091

Posted
Posted
39 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

So yeah, Brandeis's laboratories of democracy thing. No, it doesn't work that way.

- States are not miniature nations. They are not sovereign and they are connected to 49 other competing entities with open borders (physically and economically).
- Most states are not accurately reflective of the economic, religious, educational, nutritional, cultural, historical, and ethnic totality of the United States.
- Most states are either 100% controlled by conservative governments or dominated by conservative legislators, making progressive initiatives impossible.

If you're interested in studying models, you should look to other sovereigns (other nations), not state programs.

I have great news for you, New Deal-style Democratic Socialism is extremely popular in polling (universal healthcare, wealth taxes, et al).

ChiTown: "Bernie is way too mean to rich people, which shows he's a radical moron."
ALSO ChiTown: "Bernie wants to forgive the debt of rich people? WHAT AN IDIOT!"

If I didn't know better, I might think that he's a completely disingenuous troll. 

Obviously, yes.

Lol.  Righttttt.  BT:  if one wealthy person receives any benefits from Yang’s UBI that’s one too many. Also BT: Bernie’s plan to forgive UHNW individuals of 100’s of thousands in student loan debt is cool.  Because Bernie.  LMAO

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