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Elon Musk: Officially a fraud and piece of shit. Official or unofficial war criminal?

MaybeACoordinator

By MaybeACoordinator
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52-80

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2 minutes ago, Blotto said:

Yeah I cant find the article I read so I'm curious if you have one with actual figures. Is that 35% figure based on the price of TSLA when this all started, or a 35% drop vs the price now, because it has already fallen 27% from April 4th's price. 

I think there's a non-trivial chance this deal doesn't go through. If the market tanks there's no guarantee TSLA can maintain is ridiculous valuation allowing the deal to go through. And if his net worth becomes approx half of what it was a month ago, does he still have the appetite for TWTR? 

 

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He's using 20% initial margin to fund $12B, with a margin call at 35%.  So requires initial collateral $60B to start the loan, and strongly-worded letters from angry bankers if that value drops to $34B.  Basically TSLA needs to halve.  Funding is not really an issue IMO, because he still has more shares to pledge, or just cash out from his latest award.

I think the question is why he would walk away from the deal.  Because Twitter's worth less than he originally valued?  (todays earnings arrived at expectations).  I dunno... seems like this has been the shiniest toy for him in a long while

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Spottieottiedopaliscious
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Hotez is far from bulletproof.       

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Absolutely.    Would you like other guys pointing out Hotez deficiencies?   It was actually more about Hotez but whatever? Why stick around? All the constructive back and forth

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52-80

52-80 19147

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At the start of the year he had something like ~190M shares, 90M of which is already pledged to other loans (for SpaceX?).  $60B committed to Twitter still leaves a pocket left.  The new vested options is for +10M shares (dunno why i said $20B above... its 1% of TSLA outstanding shares at strike price of almost nothing)

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sidis

sidis 9823

Posted
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2 minutes ago, Blotto said:

This is a decent example of why Musk has no idea what he's getting into. immamac doesnt pay a staff to moderate content, this site is largely self moderated. So now a thread supposedly about Elon Musk is largely a pissing match between a couple of posters about something completely unrelated, that most of us dont give a shit about. If you give people the power to post anonymously online, assume they will behave as they wish, not as you may prefer as a platform administrator. If you refuse to moderate that content, it will do what it do. Take a look at the comments section on Yahoo for fucks sake. 

Twitter without content moderation would be a cesspool in no time. Musk may not like how TWTR chose to enforce their rules, but I doubt he has any idea of how to do so and keep TWTR as a forum that advertisers will pay for. And if he's paying $44 billion for the asset, it better deliver some revenue. If not, he waaaaaay overpaid. He keeps babbling about free speech and the laws as if that has anything to do with private business. Twitter admittedly sucked at monetizing its influence, but it could also disappear in a year or two if his model is worse. Tech dont give a shit, ask Myspace. 

i, for one, applaud the vision of taking over twitter and cleaning out all the horseshit like bots, etc...  i certainly think there is a certain naivete that is being experienced by musk on what will be possible as an unrestrained, unmoderated forum...kind of a parallel of the conventional easy to criticize those in power and campaign, hard to actually govern wisdom.  i think the reality of humanity online is unfortunately going to be a cold bucket of ice but i genuinely could not care less about the success or non-success of twitter as a service or as a profitable company.  that said, as a non-twitter user or consumer besides the links posted here, i would welcome a tradeoff of allowing a few more dipshits to be dipshits in exchange for rooting out non-verified users, bots, and other horseshit on the service.  i find the notion that the "right" is claiming this as some sort of bizarre political victory to be largely amusing.  elon is clearly leveraging that for his personal gain.

all that said, the thing i am not quite understanding is why he himself has apparently decided that going the route of being acting like a troll on twitter.  he's on there posting unflattering pictures of bill gates for relief of boners, talking about cocaine in coca cola, replying to every tard on there that @'s him, embracing characterizations of him being a megalomaniac...he's scattershooting like he allowed a manic teenager to post on his behalf for a week.  buzz creation, marketing, whatever it may be...i just find it bizarre.  he clearly embraced the "bro" image for marketing purposes over the last couple of years but this seems to be another level.  like some sort of switch was flipped...everything he does is clearly calculated, but this one i don't have the long-term vision for.

finally, can you idiots please stop "board discussion'ing" this thread with your constant fucking whining?

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52-80

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46 minutes ago, Cajun said:

Cajun - “I went to the Yankees game and had 3 hotdogs…”

Seven - “Cajun hates gays from New York and killed three of their dachshunds!!!”

Can’t make this shit up.  Wait, check that!  Yes, ole seven certainly can.

If this was Twitter, you could have lobbied to ban them for misinformation

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Blotto

Blotto 23488

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6 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

No one is saying there should be zero moderation. Blocking "unfavorable" news stories on the other hand...

And the slippery slope starts there. What we typically think of as "news" is almost always editorialized content these days. Very few news organizations are interested in sticking to basic facts. They stick to their interpretation of the facts. And there was some bizarre shit being posited by "news organizations" regarding Covid, outright falsehoods regarding vaccines etc... No reason a private enterprise like Twitter should be forced to disseminate that information when they rely on  advertising dollars to survive. If Musk wants to take the company private for $44 billion, and change the rules thats his right as well. 

13 minutes ago, sidis said:

i, for one, applaud the vision of taking over twitter and cleaning out all the horseshit like bots, etc...  i certainly think there is a certain naivete that is being experienced by musk on what will be possible as an unrestrained, unmoderated forum...kind of a parallel of the conventional easy to criticize those in power and campaign, hard to actually govern wisdom.  i think the reality of humanity online is unfortunately going to be a cold bucket of ice but i genuinely could not care less about the success or non-success of twitter as a service or as a profitable company.  that said, as a non-twitter user or consumer besides the links posted here, i would welcome a tradeoff of allowing a few more dipshits to be dipshits in exchange for rooting out non-verified users, bots, and other horseshit on the service.  i find the notion that the "right" is claiming this as some sort of bizarre political victory to be largely amusing.  elon is clearly leveraging that for his personal gain.

all that said, the thing i am not quite understanding is why he himself has apparently decided that going the route of being acting like a troll on twitter.  he's on there posting unflattering pictures of bill gates for relief of boners, talking about cocaine in coca cola, replying to every tard on there that @'s him, embracing characterizations of him being a megalomaniac...he's scattershooting like he allowed a manic teenager to post on his behalf for a week.  buzz creation, marketing, whatever it may be...i just find it bizarre.  he clearly embraced the "bro" image for marketing purposes over the last couple of years but this seems to be another level.  like some sort of switch was flipped...everything he does is clearly calculated, but this one i don't have the long-term vision for.

finally, can you idiots please stop "board discussion'ing" this thread with your constant fucking whining?

Count me in as someone that is personally ambivalent about the future of twitter. Musk can run it into the ground, and something else will fill the void. And there is no reason that Twitter coudnt have cleaned out all the bots, etc... except that those bots inflate traffic so it hurts them financially based on their advertising driven model. As for Musk, he really doesnt give a shit about free speech, as he has a history of trying to go after people that speak poorly about Tesla. He's a narcissist whos flexing his status as the richest person on the planet. He's acting like a troll on twitter becuase he like the attention.  

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Cheeseweasel

Cheeseweasel 26438

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3 minutes ago, Blotto said:

And the slippery slope starts there. What we typically think of as "news" is almost always editorialized content these days.

Then you lean on moderation as a last step, not a first step. 

Just look at this site, it's safe to say if the Mods were heavy handed it would be "cleaner" but would it be as fun? Watching a train wreck is exciting!

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We’reTexas

We’reTexas 1473

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1 hour ago, 52-80 said:

So far he's borrowing against some of his share interest in TSLA.  It would need to drop ~35% for that collateral to be tested.

And then he was just recently awarded another tranche of stock options (like the 11th of his 12 possible), which if monetized comes out to $20B.  Basically exercising that single award alone is enough to fund his part of the buyout commitment. 

Well, to be clear, that new option tranche has a five-year lockup. It’s not in itself a near-term source of liquidity. That said, without looking at Tesla’s policy if assume the underlying shares could be pledged, thus allowing him to pledge other shares. The margin call collateral numbers will be determined at funding, and while there will be a minimum LTV level I’d imagine something gets worked out. 

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Blotto

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Just now, Cheeseweasel said:

Then you lean on moderation as a last step, not a first step. 

Just look at this site, it's safe to say if the Mods were heavy handed it would be "cleaner" but would it be as fun? Watching a train wreck is exciting!

What does relying on moderation as a last step even mean. As soon as something is posted on social media its there for everyone to see until you moderate. If it violates your idea of what is acceptable content, you should be free to block it. Its your platform, you pay for the data center, bandwidth, engineers etc... Twitter has terms of service that Joe Public agrees to when they decide to sign up for a free service. I am sure there are separate contracts that Twitter enters into with advertisers that pay them money, and they have obligations there as well. Will that balance piss some people off? Obviously so.

But 95% of the people that are most vocal about free speech on social media, dont give one fuck about free speech. They just want to make sure that they can be heard. They would not give one fuck if opposing viewpoints were silenced. Again, Truth Social which is supposed to be the anti twitter and embrace free speech explicitly states in their agreement that they have the right to do exactly what Twitter is being criticized for:https://help.truthsocial.com/legal/terms-of-service/ 

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Who is the arbiter of what is truthful, obscene, lewd etc..... Everyone that has an online platform likely has similar language. there is a reason for it. 

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52-80

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A search of popular #BlackTwitter discussions with some arbitrary cutoffs (100+ likes, 20+ replies, up until April 1), before all the Musk noise
 

https://twitter.com/search?f=live&q=(%23BlackTwitter) min_replies%3A20 min_faves%3A100 until%3A2022-04-01&src=typed_query

It's all to do with Will Smith slapping Chris Rock, plenty of selfies (of South Asian people, weirdly), and black medical professionals celebrating their achievements

 

Like somehow all those communities and discussions are going to disappear because Twitter has a new owner.  LMAO.

 

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52-80

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35 minutes ago, We’reTexas said:

Well, to be clear, that new option tranche has a five-year lockup. It’s not in itself a near-term source of liquidity. That said, without looking at Tesla’s policy if assume the underlying shares could be pledged, thus allowing him to pledge other shares. The margin call collateral numbers will be determined at funding, and while there will be a minimum LTV level I’d imagine something gets worked out. 

Just reviewed the 2018 plan, yeah , it has a lockup, whereas his previous 2012 one did not.  Either way, still means more capital tied to his name

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Blotto

Blotto 23488

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Posted (edited)
21 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

Who determines that? 

99.9% of what counts as "news" these days, and 100% of what any politician said would be censored.

that's kind of the point. Nobody wants to host a platform that has to publish everything, and every platform has provisions to censure speech. You may disagree with how twitter did things, but show me a site that does not face similar challenges. If Musk is the first guy to figure it out, fanstastic. I think he's full of shit though. He has his own version of free speech as people that have tried to criticize Tesla and Musk publicly in the past have found out. 

EDIT - heres one example of why Musk is completely full of shit on this issue. I used to follow that guy on Seeking Alpha, and he would routinely criticize Musk/TSLA. Some of what he said he posted was 100% accurate and some if it was probably inaccurate, much like content on twitter. Elon seemed to bend his free speech passion when TSLA's stock price was concerned. 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10759919/Lawrence-Fossi-criticized-Tesla-blogs-says-Musk-called-BOSS-threatened-sue-him.html

Edited by Blotto
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Cheeseweasel

Cheeseweasel 26438

Posted
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1 minute ago, Blotto said:

that's kind of the point. Nobody wants to host a platform that has to publish everything, and every platform has provisions to censure speech. You may disagree with how twitter did things, but show me a site that does not face similar challenges. If Musk is the first guy to figure it out, fanstastic. I think he's full of shit though. He has his own version of free speech as people that have tried to criticize Tesla and Musk publicly in the past have found out. 

So end social media?

I'm in. 

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fattyflattie

fattyflattie 4639

Posted
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3 hours ago, Captainant said:

Hol up - are you calling me a liar for something I didn't post or even rep (unlike Fatty and Sack and Immortal and Vibes repping baba's neonazi shit), and for providing evidence to back my claim about baba?

And to be clear, since you would NEVER try and mislead, by "rep" you mean the FAFO, correct?  Funny, there were several other's that also "repped" that post, that you didn't mention by name.  So, care to explain or nah?

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Wulaw Horn

Wulaw Horn 19067

Posted
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3 minutes ago, longhornmatt said:

If everyone is done bringing up their petty political hot takes, can we please get back to discussing the second most powerful American born in Africa after Barack Obama?

My wife asked if he was going to be president someday. I was like he can’t. You have to be born in America. Exceptions made for Kenyans. She wasn’t amused. 

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4doorsMoreWhores

4doorsMoreWhores 107

Posted
Posted
13 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Sold my miniscule amount of Twitter shares today. Not worried about the few extra bucks to be made on waiting for the Elon takeover, and don't want to ride it down to $30 in case he changes his mind.

Wish I had dumped my Tesla stock earlier this week. 

Aww sounds like you have the sads

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52-80

52-80 19147

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So the big red candle on Tuesday was Elon selling off 4.4 million shares, which made up 10% of the traded volume that day.  He raised approx $4B cash from it.

His direct equity ownership (excluding options) went from 172M to 168M, so ~approx 17.2% of outstanding shares to 16.8%. 

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Nice Guy Eddie

Nice Guy Eddie 13508

Posted
Posted
7 hours ago, 4doorsMoreWhores said:

Aww sounds like you have the sads

Nah. Made a decent profit of Twitter and still up big on Tesla. I’ve been selling Tesla consistently on the way up so this is all house money now.

I just worry about the money and don’t really care about elon’s Twitter free speech endeavor. 

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